I'm so happy that Mushoku Tensei was finished before it became this massive success that it is now. Granted, the light novel was already one of the best selling LNs in Japanese history. But now it just feels like everything is under the microscope by everyone.
Agreed, I don't understand why it's so important to have unrealistic characters, like Andrew said it's the imperfect that makes this perfect and sometimes relatable.
This is exactly what I’m afraid of, why on earth are all these people so obsessed with the wider audience? They don’t matter, it’s the actual fans that matter, they’re the ones buying every volume of the light novel, of the manga, of the audiobook, figures of all the characters, all the merch. They’re the ones that matter, actual fans, all the other people you’ll get no money from them.
But the fans already know how to love a flawed character. Maybe author wants more people to learn to love flawed characters, so he's smoothing out the parts of the climb that are too tough for them in hopes that they'll be ready next time their is a story with flawed characters to really love them.
@@LucenProject I get the argument, but isn't it kinda too late for that with MT? I mean we're like 50eps in, most of these people are probably not watching anymore.
@@floxer I think it IS too late for that, but if the author still wants to reach for it, I can't tell them how to change or not to change their art for the message the want to convey and/or the audience they want to target. And I can see in a small way someone saying something like "I was all for Rudy sucks but is becoming a better person but then he initiated an affair when he had Sylphie, so I'm out now" seeing things differently when he's seen more explicitly as a grieving son taken advantage of. 🤷🏾♂️ (As if progress to becoming a better person is linear or somehow we end up perfect and immune to making "bad" decisions at any point in it).
@@petershury7135A lot of punches. I think they actually did an awesome job making the anime consistent with how much content was cut! 😂 Then again, Rifujin himself is in the script team.
The fact that Rifujin is so vague in what he says and that he sometimes even has spelling errors making translation difficult makes it very difficult to draw a conclusion. Personally, I think that this was a one-time thing, without giving spoilers about the future, I don't see another scene later that would require "softening" the adaptation, I think that the change of rudeus for roxy makes sense in the context of the anime's story itself, by omitting rudeus internal monologue during his talk with her it would not make sense for Rudeus to be the one who starts the relationship when he is weak and depressed but knowing that Roxy is after him since she was rescued it makes more sense that she is the initiator and forces the issue on a vulnerable Rudeus, that's how it makes sense to me at least. About the scene of Elinalise lying to Rudeus about the pregnancy I think it's a point in favor, with that scene Rudeus is basically forced to take responsibility for his "mistake" or simply take Roxy as his wife as compensation for what she did, leaving In the background his feelings for her, by eliminating that scene, Rudeus's proposal is more sincere and comes from him, instead of a feeling of guilt or obligation, all this obviously taking into account the narrative of the anime, which differs from the novel, that's why I always say that watching the anime with the novel in your head all the time is not good for the general enjoyment of the product alone, the criticisms that I have seen yesterday and today only focus on "they changed this" " they omitted the other" but no one talking about the anime itself as its own entity, it is something that can be seen in anime onlys that really enjoy the anime and it is sad that such a good anime receives so much criticism for "not being like the novel "
If you are talking about softening, there is still one character story arc by itself that most probably will have it. Being Aisha and Ars. Heck if it is hot topic from the novel's, I dont think it will past the anime check (to be honest that's good).
@@TheTruemanBoi keep it spoilers free please, Andrew is not at that point yet or at least give a spoiler warning and leave some space before writing it, that story in particular is not even canon anymore, at least for now
I agree. The missing context would’ve have really hurt how that scene came across had it been adapted 1:1. The exact way it happened physically may not have been accurate, but I think it helps the viewers better understand the situation and their perspective on Roxy and Rudy individually. Roxy even said her self that she was partly being selfish because she wanted it. She always had the intention of sleeping with him as a last resort when she went to his room. The cut context would have not made that clear and just would’ve made Rudy look worse and Roxy appear more taken advantage of than the other way around.
But only way to convert some of them is to slowly introduce them to things outside of their norm. Maybe author felt this would be too far for them and changed things so they don't go running back to their comfort zone of rejecting imperfect characters, but if it works, maybe they'll be ready for something like the original story the next time around.
@@LucenProject Eh, there is nothing in Mushoku tensei which should be shocking to westerners unless they don't hypocrite virtue-signal. In ASOIAF/GoT Daenerys Targeryan gets raped at 13 years old and then falls madly in love with her rapist. In IT by stephen King 12 year olds have an orgy.
@@LucenProject I don't want to convert them. If someone isn't interested, or flat out does not like a work of art, then that is how it is. Art should not be changed to make it more palatable to "a wider audience". Those who are uninterested or offended can find other art elsewhere that is more to their liking. Now of course, if the author wants to do that, that is his choice, but it is kind of crappy to disappoint the fans that have supported you all along in order to try and maybe win over a handful of potential new fans by altering your work.
Little does he know that by doing that, MT loses some of the things that make it the MT that we love. I don't want the characters to act out of the norm, just for the sake of appealing to broader audience. One of the reason MT is loved is how natural and realistic the story progresses, but if characters behave in unnatural way, the story feels forced and fans won't like that. Also changing the original story would be kinda disrespectful to the loyal LN and WN fans that been supporting the series for so long.
Yes lets just forget about the amount anime fans as well who wouldnt be too happy about changes. They dont matter at all. Nope. Just because you started something earlier doesnt mean you're "better".
100% the Rudy Roxy interaction, and im glad. Roxy being the initiator makes a lot more sense than Rudy and both of them share the blame for the act. The Original scene could be Misinterpreted as Rudy taking advantage or forcing himself on Roxy esp animated. Furthermore, Rudy is completely depressed having him pull Roxy seems out of character for how we have seen him act before, having Roxy be more forward lines up with how she was acting in the Dungeon.
Yea I get that, though I still think that there's Rudy's perspective on depressed self destructive behaviors that could allow that in my opinion, like he's like screw it since Paul did it too, what does it matter if I do too. Roxy being more wanting is still better, but I really think this moment should have been more of a relapse sort of moment for Rudeus, you feel me?
Exactly what I though too. The removal of Elinalise's lie about Roxy's pregnancy is also a good choice, gives more agency to Rudy and shows that he actually loves and cares for Roxy.
Rudeus is "nasty", but he was never intended to stay nasty. It's a long road of improvements with some setbacks. If that road is a little less nasty or gets less nasty a little more quickly than before, then I don't think that's a complete loss.
I also agree! I'm not a light novel (or is it web novel?) reader, though, so I don't know what the exact depiction of his exact nastiness has for story implications further down. I just can't really imagine it being THAT important, so long as you don't whitewash too hard.
Yeah it could be seen as a shortcut to the same destination... even if it just change a little. I only saw woman complaining about this episode, and it is because of the "cheating" situation and not who started it.
Yeah like I don’t see the big deal. I prefer this change over the novel because I feel like it makes Roxy more of a main character in the sense that she made her own decision with conviction. But I guess I’m in the minority 😅😅😅
All book adaptations I've read and watched had to adjust to their medium. There are so many parts that are so beautiful in the book that are glossed over or outright missing from the show or movie adaptation. Here we have the author able to actually provide input on the adaptation. We don't know what his input was only that changes did happen. Maybe his choice was to not include the missing monthly visitor part. Maybe it was the changes from the book with Roxy and Rudy as you pointed out, Andrew. An author wanting to get his products out to a wider audience is always a consideration. They have to walk that fine line between "selling out" and adjusting for ease of adaptation. Maybe Rifujin felt it would slow the place of the show too much or maybe it's something he felt they couldn't cover eloquently enough that they went with this option. How much was cut or changed from Lord of the Rings or The Expanse? I really enjoy MT, warts and all, and I'm looking forward to the next series set on this incredible world Rifujin built.
I read the LoTR books recently. Just for movie 1 they cut an entire arc which takes about 1/5th of the book. Yet I still love the movies and I'd say I love them even more than before. Cutting parts out is part of the adaptation. As long as the adaptation itself is good and the story isn't diluted then it can be a great adaptation.
True, you can't expect a novel to be adapted 1:1 to film. Harry Potter is definitely another example. There's tons of stuff cut from the movies. As for Anime, Re Zero cuts whole iterations of the loops sometimes. Konosuba cuts content as well, and it's VERY apparent. just in season 1, Wiz's introduction is done offscreen, and there's a whole arc about Kazuma adventuring with another party (he switches with the blond skinny dude) for a while as a bet. MT has a lot of worldbuilding detail and it's awesome. Huge part why I love the series. But yeah, can't expect to keep and explain everything all the time. The pacing would be awful. Although I do admit that this last stretch feels a little too time constrained; just an extra episode or two would've done wonders.
Well, as an anime-only, it's definitely a surprise to hear that Rudy was the actual aggressor in the source material. I think the changes to episode 23 were meant to retain the character development Rudy had gained so far within the anime's run time, so they weren't gonna adapt something that may potentially seem like a regression in character development and then feel the need to show even greater character development in the future to offset that regression. They just don't have that kind of time and resource, unfortunately, to fully flesh out details of the story that allows for ups and downs to a character's development, and add to the fact that an appeal to wider audiences is part of the goal of anime adaptations. They had to do something that could fit both the delivery format and the expectations of potential eyes out there, and so the changes to episode 23 were the result of these considerations. At least, that's what I think.
YES! Personally, I feel like it was SUPER inconsistent with Rudy's character growth the way it went down in the LN and really made me upset. But it turned a scene and the idea of polygamy (which I originally hated) into one one that not only makes sense, but now I feel much more okay about the idea (albeit I'm still not thrilled it's turning into a harem lol, but I don't hate the idea now with the way it's playing out).
I can see it looking like regression for Rudy, but I saw it as a reinforcement of Roxy's development from a person that thinks she has no worth to being a more confident person that can see her own worth. Not to mention she just lived her dream romantic encounter with being saved in a dungeon, so I'm kind of surprised she didn't initiate it sooner.
As another AO, i saw nothing wrong with anything so far. Ppl need to start learning that since things get cut that you need to stop comparing animes to their source as they are 2 different things. I mean no matter how hard the studios try, things will always be left out so treat the anime as its own entity. Same with the source. Having this mindset when only worsen your experience with the series. So just enjoy what does get animated. I mean its not like they've 100% altered the story now have they? They're still get the message across so alls well.
I really appreciate the series for having flawed characters and being raw. I hope they don’t make too many changes, but I’m not going to go and jump to conclusions until I see what comes. I’m going to keep a positive vibe and say I really enjoyed the series so far snd look forward to more; even knowing what changes happened in the last episode.
3:29 I side with refujin's comment about this. I get it, more adience who will accept the anime, will less likely for it to be cancelled. Although the critiques of LN Readers is being said all over my feed, i feel that we readers are still just the minority of those who watch the show. I still think that they deliver the message refujin wants albeit that they "tamed" it... I just hope that this isn't a frequent thing.
I would personally have no adaptation than a censored adaptation but that's just me. It's the same with movie remakes. You can say "yeah they cut out a bunch of build up and character development here and here, but at least the big scenes are still there so it's not THAT bad" but to that I just say "watch the originals" instead. I don't see a point of an adaptation if it's just gonna be a downgrade. That's why I started reading the LN after these last few MT episodes. I don't think S2 is a bad adaptation, but it does some things that even I as an anime only feel weird about. S1 didn't have these problems even though it covered the same amount of volumes as S2.
Making females the sexually aggressive ones seems to be a common way of making an anime softer/tamer. Apparently having men being sexually assertive is threatening or something. Similarly, far too many "quirky girls tease nerdy guys" shows these past five years. Gotta go back 14 years to Maid-Sama for the classic "Prince Charming"/Chad archetype teasing the girl. Having Roxy be dominant initially makes Rudeus seem less of a scumbag.... but the end result seems to still be polygamy anyway so not sure that was necessary.
I prefer the change about Roxy being the initiator than the one in the novel. It makes more sense as well. Rudy was depressed, he was weak due to his anorexia and besides that Roxy had already decided that she was to be the one to sleep with him. So it makes more sense that she is initiating that. Same with Elinalise's lie about Roxy's pregnancy, that makes it more so that Rudy actually loves Roxy rather than he is doing it half because he loves her and half because he wants to take responsibility. I don't believe that any writer should cater to any audience so their work can be accepted. However, if he wants to improve things from his original work during an adaptation I don't see why that is bad. As for the "changes". The people that would have an issue with this episode, would've an issue regardless of how it was approached. They can't remove their own biases and values when consuming a piece of art like Mushoku Tensei. They can't critically think and understand that morality systems differ from place to place, from world to world, from religion to religion. Generally speaking the reaction from the community gave me a big distaste after this episode. The people that can't critically think attacked the concept of polygyny (harem) and the fact that the husband stepping out of the marriage for a night(which is shown to only be unacceptable for Milis followers in that world) but those people would be under the episode complaining regardless. However, I am more disappointed with the LN readers who unironically expect that every aspect and part of the LN must be adapted. They not only sh*t on the episode but on the entire season as well.
no, they just tried to make Rudeus guilty of me. the situation with Roxy was similar to that if someone provoked a person who had been in a stressful situation for a week to strike, the bulk of the blame would still be on Roxy, but Rudeus would also be involved, now Roxy is both the provocateur and the one who strikes. in the novel she was ready to give herself to Rudeus, but she clearly did not intend to rape him. and how did it help him? in the novel he specifically poured out his emotions on Roxy, but what happens here? and the moment with Elinalise is what made it possible to share the blame between three characters at once, Rudeus just looks like an asshole, in the novel, even realizing that he loves Roxy, he still wanted to remain faithful to Sylphy to the last, but here he decides to break his promise and risk his family only because Elinalise said that Roxy would be sad. How is he going to tell Sylphy about this now? “After Paulo died, this 50 year old girl basically forced me to have sex and now I want to marry her”? And that's without taking into account all the cuts including the literally necessary parts without which the wonderful last episode and Paulo's death look like they were needed just to add Roxy to the harem. I don't want them to adapt everything 1 to 1 I just want an adaptation that doesn't make everything worse
To an extent this is something Rifujin has always done. He always toes the line of what people are okay with. He edited the webnovel when his audience thought he took things too far. He filtered out some extra bits to make it more acceptable when it got serialized as a lightnovel. So it makes sense that he's trying to make small adjustments for the anime as well.
I dont think that the adaptation is going to completely change the characters in a way that removes their flaws and the flaws of the world, if that was the case, Julie would have been freed after Rudy and Zanoba bought her and Rudy wouldnt have even touched Linia or Pursena, whichever one it was in the anime. And i think that latter point is the thing that Rifujin is talking about tweaks, in the ln, he groped both of them before deciding that its no good, but the anime only had him grope one before deciding that its no use. Similar to the Roxy thing where he had Roxy be more aggressive (which, tbh, is how i remembered the scene from the ln, its been a while and only from your last video did i remember it was different). I trust Rifujin more than most authors about understanding what to tweak in terms of adaptation without sacrificing what makes the story great.
Yeah, it is ABSOLUTELY waaay more acceptable for a Woman to be an aggressor. The only time it's not, is when it's with a minor, but even then there are people that minimize it. So while I DEFINITELY don't want them to change anything, ESPECIALLY to appeal to the whiners on Twitter who either don't even watch the show, or just complain about everything "offensive" regardless. But I am okay with this, especially if it means less whining on the Internet about Rudy. But I do wish they had played up Rudy's depression, and at LEAST said how long it had been without food, it would've made softened the blow(for some) on what she did and why. And I wish Elinalise told Rudy about that thing, became unless I'm misremembering, he was still trying to stay faithful, but the fact that she was potentially carrying, pushed him over the edge. So while what they did wasn't good, these two things would've each made what happened on both ends better, or at least slightly more justifiable to people
I'm personally VERY happy they didn't try to gaslight Rudy with the pointless scene of telling him Roxy was pregnant... That was super cringe and very unnecessary...
Honestly, the way the anime framed it just made sense with the current character dynamics. Especially with Rudeus going back to shut-in mode, it's more natural that he isn't starting the situation. Himself was framed as wanting to be left alone, and even after was already torn apart by his feelings without adding more to it with lies. There is a lot actually implied, from Elinalise unfinished "did you?.." when they exit the room to the girl talks we don't see since it's from Rudy's perspective but obviously did happen. The way she bring up religion to remind him his father also had multiple wives, instead of lying about Roxy potentially carrying, just feels more sincere. (As for the time Rudy spent not eating, his face is a very conserning visual indicator, for whoever pays attention. A lot of "show don't tell" happening there) I don't think it's a bad thing, as long as it makes sense with the story and character dynamics, that the author adjust the story. After all, any author writing on hard topics like these have this kind of worries and "I could have wrote this part better" moments on retrospect. For this episode at least it was handeled correctly. Making him the attacker, including how the group was about to leave him behind, and lies getting back at what happened? That may have felt unnecessary edgy, I can see why there's some softening. Here, it just feels like everyone in the group don't know what to do to help each others yet still care, as akward as their way to help is.
@@renookami4651 maybe, but I just watched a reactor react FURIOUSLY, and instead of seeing that Roxy did it to help him and sacrificed her virginity for it, they HATE Roxy now and wanted her off of the screen. And I feel like if they played up the depression a lot more And had the conversation where they all talked about the idea of helping Rudy this way, people would feel differently.
@@kamikaze.33 lol, Unnecessary to you, to me there is NO reason for him to take her as a second wife other than that she's sad. That isn't justification for a Man to potentially ruin his marriage, take in another women. If he loves her AND she is potentially pregnant. Also, that's what the story is, so that's what it should be here.
So you're okay with it as long as there's less whining about Rudy? I don't get that. Who cares what other people think? You give an inch, they take a mile. You can't please these people. They will just find something else to complain about,
I like a good adaptation and I think the role of one is to improve or correct flaws in the original material. The changes made in episode 23, for me, improved the story. If there are changes like this I'm happy, but I understand the concern, it's very easy to make mistakes. However, the author gave me no reason to worry. I hope it continues like this.
Honestly I feel like the changes help the story. It’s a bit weird how Roxy just talks Rudy out of his depression and into intimacy in the LN. Making her more assertive and initiating things makes more sense. Her saying she took advantage of him was more of a way to give Rudeus a clean break if he wanted to. As far as not doing the fake pregnancy shit I 100% get behind. Starting a relationship based off a lie is never a good thing. It makes it clear this is something Rudy chooses and isn’t forced into.
I realize the concern for someone changing the aspects you love of a story, but I'd argue that if a creator has something to say, it's best to say it to those that DON'T agree with it. why preach to the choir? Why court the vote of those who will vote for you no matter what? The way to change things is to get those on the edges, those who could understand from a particular perspective or a with a considered choice of words. Those who are already onboard accept that flawed characters, but those on the edges, probably can't handle as many flaws if they're used to perfect characters. If the author wants people to accept their first flawed characters and some changes are needed to his work to get his message across, I won't be upset. (I think I'd be feeling differently if the author wasn't the one making these changes or wasn't involved.) Though, to be fair, I also have the benefit of being an anime only aside from YT cut-content videos, so I haven't fallen in love with the story in the form you all know it.
Yeah, in a very negative way... It would be inconsistent with their characters and the growth Rudy has made up until this point. I'm SO happy the anime fixed that inconsistency.
@@kamikaze.33exactly my fellow pal, this change has only made the anime Adaptation even better for not letting brake the growth of Rudy and let other characters to make mistakes like he does, because they are F@cking human beings, human are known to make mistakes, that is what make us human.
This isn't something new Mushoku tensei is heavily criticized in Japan since season 1. It always aired after 12 AM and treated like +18 anime without actually anything making it +18. For example Konosuba has way more ecchi than Mushoku without any question but its last season aired at 11.30 PM earlier than Mushoku. So it isn't just about making it more acceptable for general audience rather they have political reasons to soften anime as well. Perhaps they are trying to get more favorable air time for next season. I was hopeful that they won't give in and keep anime loyal to the source, but sadly didn't happen. Most likely they will soften everything like the diary incidents etc, it will be another anime ruined by quote 'Japanese values'..
He cut out the stuff that was just sour to me. The Elinalise gaslighting that was so in your face, the overdramatics with Roxy "sacrificing her virginity and body to save Rudy". The main things that were not cut, and were laid bare in your face last episode was this: Roxy wanted to help Rudy, but was also selfish, and wanted Rudy to be hers. Rudy let it happen, he now loved Roxy as much as Sylphie, and was willing to risk his marriage over it because "He'd rather be a scumbag than have regrets". He basically gave Roxy and Rudy equal agency to be scummy dirtbags and own it together, then have other crap muddying up the waters on this situation. Roxy took advantage for some good reasons and bad. Rudy wants Roxy and says damn with it, i'll risk it all. It softened the blow for both in a way, and spared us most of the melodramatic justifications surrounding this whole part of the story. My 2 cents anyway.
The point isn't that it's too sour for some people. The point is that a story is altered because people think it's too sour, and that shouldn't happen in any story IMO. It's not about what is being cut, it's the reason for cutting things out.
I honestly think the change to Roxy pulling Rudeus to the bed was to fit more with her thoughts later on the matter. With what you read out from the LN in the skipped content vid, it seems she still says she took advantage of him while he was down. That's a hard sell if he's the one that stopped her from leaving and initiated everything. When you read those parts out, I felt like it was a bit dissonant, so they may have changed it to mesh together better rather than to make the cheating more acceptable.
She is a naive virgin girl with childish romance fantasies who got gaslighted into thinking it would cheer Rudeus based on what everyone was talking about in cut bar scene.Her pulling the guy twice her size,throwing him onto the bed and straddling him looks hillarious,weird and completely out of character Her sacrificing her first time being anything but gentle and romantic to help the person she loved was very touching and showed how even tho she is physically small she is very strong person mentally. In the anime she just looks like some harlot jumping at the chance to have her way with Rudeus, i dunno. Maybe i am somewhat biased cause this chapter was one of m y favourite and legit made me cry first time reading. They probably changed the scene to avoid angry Twitter mob. Make the women do the "bad" thing thefore you can't hate it cause its a woman
@@Denifai The only reason she could pull him, and throw him is because he wasn't fighting back. He was basically a near lifeless husk. As for why they had Roxy be the one to initiate things, I think they wanted to make clear that this wasn't an entirely selfless action on her part. Yes, helping Rudy get through this is certainly a big part of her motivation here, but that's not all there is to it. She loves him. She wants to be with him. There is a part of her deep down inside that WANTS to have this night together with him. I really enjoyed reading the novel, and I did enjoy this scene, but I do think Roxy came out of it in the novel looking a bit too pure. Having Rudy initiate things just makes it look he gave into his desires and did a bad thing, while Roxy was just selflessly sacrificing her body, and going along with what he wanted, because that was the only way to save him. Having Roxy initiate things, with Rudy getting into it more and more as they go on, I think makes it clearer that they are BOTH responsible for doing the thing. They are two adults who made a choice together, and now they have to own up to the consequences of their mutual decision, and figure out the best way to move forward.
@@DevilHunter1994 Well glad you enjoyed the episode,unfortunately that's not the case for me ( not only cause of the Roxy scene but also the cut bar scene which added more depth to Elinalise character and explained where even Roxy got the idea to sleep with him).From the same bar scene you also could feel that Roxy wanted to spend night with him when she felt bad at the thought of Elinalise making out with Rudy.Still she asked why she wouldn't help him despite how her negative feeling.Roxy being pure is literally her character.She is a wise adult who wants to be looked upon as mature woman yet still have childlike naive side to her which is clearly obvious.Her duality is what made her an interesting character.Also the parents part wasn't done as good as in LN As a standalone episode i don't think its terrible but as adaptation i feel like they missed the bar (imo)
I think changes to fit the medium are ok. For example, Douglas Adams wrote The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy as a radio play, then as a novel, then as a TV show and then as a movie. Every one of these versions of the same story are wildly different, but the essence of the story and the characters remain. I think we need to give the author and director of Mushoku Tensei the benefit of the doubt and trust him to make the changes they deem necessary.
I’ve always love mushoku tensei because the characters are so flawed and the art work was beautiful. Seeing Rudeus shoot his first intermediate water spell made me jump out of my seat and then watching Rudeus growth and everyone dealing with their own problems has made for some of the most compelling TV I’ve seen in years. It’s a masterclass in storytelling and visuals to drive the story but this whole season has had weaker visuals and a softer story. It’s concerning but I love this show so I hope they try hard to keep it as original as possible. (I also know that I’m not the same as other people. I prefer media that is dark and real and painful and compelling for it. My last girlfriend refused to watch the second episode of cyberpunk because she couldn’t handle it and I was sad because I knew how amazing the story is)
Sometimes changes are made irrespective of censorship as the video says too. It could be that on reflection, author thought Roxy initiating it fit the story better for example, since the anime Rudy emphasized his intention for loyalty multiple times in a way that might have had less % attention in written form. He is still responsible for cheating, but him initiating it could be seen as a character inconsistency. In contrast, the anime's portrayal can be seen as him keeping his earlier ideal, only to fail it...a flaw rather than an inconsistency. I would actually view the change differently depending on whether it was done out of censorship/fear vs simply making the story flow better...ultimately, the impact on the story is the same, but which thinking process got us there changes what's expected for future adaptation.
8:24 I believe this falls under a similar meaning as: _"Semantics"_ It doesn't matter how Rudeus & Roxy did it, just as long as they did do it. Rough sex, Soft sex, who leads? It's all the same to me. So as long as the sex part wasn't taken out. That's the type of censorship I'm worried about. Yes I am familiar with the concept of: _"Give an inch, they take a mile"_ but I don't think that's the case here.
That justification is what will hurt the series. By reducing their interaction to that simple concept, it removes the nuance of their characterization, and removes that greater sense of investment in their development and their relationship going forwards. It's focusing too much on the broader picture and making the characters nothing but two dimensional puppets who only do things because the plot demanded it, rather than having deeper motivations and feelings. Without that context, the significance of Rudeus and Roxy's affair is hollow and meaningless.
@@Creed-SalazarI mean that’s fair but to me I felt it still accomplished it. Only thing I wished happened was rudeus’s inner monologue on how he fucked up came into play so we knew more that he felt bad about this. I think scene accomplishes the same task and other stuff. Plus I will say it makes sense both ways wether he or Roxy initiated the sex, but that’s just my own opinion
I really think the reason why they change the startup of the night of Rudeus and Roxy is because I think it's more acceptable to have Roxy having major blame for their action She knew he was married with a son, she knew he could go to a brothel or sleep with anyone else, but she saw this as her last chance to sleep with the men she dreamed of finding her whole life just to lose him to someone else. Rudeus being rough because he was trying to forget and don't stop because he was also attracted to her makes a mutual blame more acceptable, then she was just giving him an idea and him forcing himself on her. To be honest I liked season 2 Rudeus because after he slept with Eris he stopped being such a pervert, I know that in the novel there is no imitate change but in the anime they tone it down, and I like that, makes sense a man stopping being so horny after he understands what it's like to have a partner even if the said partner left and left him broken, I think shows more growth from his part, not only he was able to go back to his feet by himself after dying and being abandoned, but he also was able to get a grip into his impulses. Some things need to be adapted. I could watch anything, but it hurts me to know people who loved the first season that are never going to watch season 2 because they dropped after seeing a 40-year-old man sleep with a 14-year-old girl, I know they are right for hating that, but I also know they are wrong for just seeing that and don't wait for context
4:00 i interpret that it's not the audienceship/popularity that he's aiming for; but the people he wishes to expand their point of views regarding stigmas in society. Or maybe he's testing the water on what he can do for the forbidden redundancy chapter. *chuckle
What worries me so much is that its directly from Rifujin. Its bad enough when producers try to say "lets make this tamer so it can reach a wider audience". But its even worse if the author pushes for it too. It pretty much insures 100% that things will be changed. This really scares me. We already have had sgins of it recently, and I'd worry about other future events now.
I personally believe that when the author themselves wants to make changes to better their own story then nothing could be more fine about it. Even greats like Oda have had editors to help push them to deliver their best work possible! Sometimes you realize after writing something, it would've been better if some things were slightly tweaked. And there's plenty of unnecessary things in the original that detract from the story. And honestly, there's plenty of actual character inconsistencies too that could stand to be corrected. So far, the anime has only improved things while not changing anything at all in any substantial way...
@@deathdoor Yes, of course, but he is saying it not in the context of "improving", its about making it more "acceptable". More acceptable doesn't = improvement, if he meant improve he'd just say improve his writing. There is a huge difference there.
@@kamikaze.33 If it was just about improving his writing I'd be okay with that, but that isn't what this is. This is about making this "acceptable". That is my issue.
@@TheAnimeKoala But think about this specific situation and story beat. Here you can see a lot of people agreeing that this change was for the better, that it makes sense for Roxy to take the lead. It's an improvement.
To be honest, I think I prefer the anime version, in my mind it does not make sense for Roxy to try and leave when she presumably had already made up her mind to see this trough, and I like to see her empowered in this way. I do acknowledge there is a double standard, in that a woman being forceful with a man is seen as more acceptable than the other way around, which I think is the primary reason why the change was made.
I don't think it was the primary reason for the change, but i agree in the sense that i like this version better. It honestly never made sense for Rudy to be the initiator here. He's depressed and emaciated yet he's still aggressively horny? And despite his unyielding loyalty to Sylphie and years of character growth/development, he's suddenly going to try and take advantage of the situation to do Roxy??? It just never made ANY sense and made me SO mad and disappointed at Rudy!
Imagine if Berserk got toned to “appeal” to wider audience no one would stand for that. So why would you stand this crappy version? What’s stopping the next change? This is a major red flag tbh.
@@captainvanisher988 I am sure that he does, which is why I specified that It is better than the west's "modern audience". I said it is only slightly better, because it is never a good thing to modify a work of art to make it more acceptable to 'normies' (for lack of a better word).
Here is an alternative view I would like to share and agree with. I don't think tweaking certain aspects of the story is objectively "bad" or "good" if it helps retain viewers like me, especially in this case. Before Mushoku Tensei (MT) became an anime and gained popularity, the author made a lot of changes, not only because he wanted to, but also due to audience feedback. While a minority of people disagreed with these changes, the majority of the fanbase believes they have improved the overall story. You might argue, "Well, it’s the core fanbase who made this manga-turned-anime happen." This is only 40% true. In the realm of anime, it’s the general audience that ultimately dictates whether we continue to watch and support MT.
IMO I think that Rifujin can "change" things acording to his new perspectives, not every change is good, but I think that people can see things differently as tge years go by. I just hope that our worse fears don't occur and the history changes abruptally
I don’t think this is going to negatively impact the series as it continues. I think they’ve been pretty consistent in how real they’ve kept the series while trying to adapt as much of the story as possible properly through the time restraints and medium change of anime. I don’t think they’ve ruined anything thus far even with this recent episode. I’m always going to wish the anime could be 1:1 with the LN and not cut anything out, but it’s fair to consider the perspective of the anime only watcher and making things clear despite the missing context. There’s been a lot of context missing, but most of it can be figured out by putting pieces together. I can’t say I love exactly how they changed Roxy and Rudy’s interaction in the bedroom, but I appreciate that it makes it pretty clear that Roxy was always there with the intention of sleeping with him if she’d had to. I don’t think the anime usually maintains enough context for viewers to understand that scene had it gone exactly the same way as the LN. Many people would’ve been much more unfairly harsh towards Rudy and make it out to be something one sided and something Roxy didn’t want which would be untrue. So I ultimately understand and appreciate the change and it’s intentions. They seem pretty keenly aware of how some missing context can affect how the story comes across in the anime and how to adapt to that so viewers can interpret things as similarly as possible to LN readers.
I liked how the anime did that situation. It was easier to understand, her taking the lead the make him feel better. But the light novel way doesn’t make scene. Rudeus is to sad to eat. Then suddenly he is willing to break is vow and violate the person he respects most ??? That makes no sense. Throughout the anime Rudeus has always been shy with new people in bed. Eris has force him the first time, The adventurer girl initiates it the first time, Selphy has to initiate the first time. So it was completely in his anime character to be shy around Roxy, especially since the entire time they kept reminding us, “I want to be faithful to Selphy” So why in the Light Novel was he the aggressor?
The reason I love this series is because its shows a raw display of human nature. Decision and consequences being one of them. Not all decisions are "good or bad" it just is. Changing to fit a modern/acceptable audience is never the way. Like many have mention we're here because we read the source material and us the fans are going to notice this changes. I hope this anime doesn't start to go from Goat adaptation to ok adaptation because of these changes. Sidenote: The Roxy change. The way I see this is diminishing Roxy impact compare to when Eris and Slyphy slept with Rudy. But I'll hold off until next episode to see if they bring it all together.(I have doubts)
..kind of like me who wants to encourage my friends to watch this series😂 Can I call myself an MT fan even though I haven't read the LN yet.. I'm planning to do so if ever ..after the anime is finished. The thing I love about MT is how it doesn't shy away from controversial topics... or taboos or wtver you call it. But at the same time I want it to gain more popularity...
You are currrently reading the LNs. These already have changed some of the stuff from the original WN. In some places Rifujin has made such significant changes to the story, that it basically was a rewrite (e.g.: the second fight against Atofe - spoiler alert, I guess - and I know the reason why he did it. It was to appeal to a broader audience. Read the original material of the thing I just mentioned and see for yourself. It is the truth) So, it seems that you are unaware, that Rifujin has always been adjusting his story IN MAJOR WAYS in order to appeal to a wider audience. He isn't "sterilizing" his story, though. You can tell from all the endless controversies! lmao (Essentially, what I'm saying is that you are wrong and your concerns are stupid!)
WN is a rough draft without an editor and publisher, just amateur writing, of course it will be slightly different from the light novel with editors, this happens to all series with WN, not just Rifujin.
@@ky8252 That's incorrect for 2 major reasons: 1) Most of the stuff in the LN was just taken over from the WN, with barely any changes. 2) On the other hand some parts of the story, especially the later parts of it were COMPLETELY rewritten(!) So, the WN was NOT the rough draft of the story. The core idea of the story, which was established in the earlier volumes (vol. 1 - 15), saw only very minor changes in the LN. (And, sure he basically added almost the entirety of vol 7, but basically everything that happens there is of no consequence for the story. It's literally filler.) And in the later volumes, Rifujin made some sweeping changes, which basically the WN was not the "draft" for, since he partially just rewrote it!
It changes the context and some detail is lost but i feel it was decent. Based on what you said was skipped the anime used roxy gettion on top to show that she came in to suduce him. It lost the context of him being rough and taking the first move but that is kind of what she wanted
Call me a hater but I think with how adement at least in the anime rudy was about not cheating on sylfee; roxy giving the final push works better it's still partially Rudy's falt but I think from a consistent character perspective rudy not being the one to initiate is just better writing ( its not about morals its a fictional story they can do what they want but being morally ambiguous for the sake of it to me isnt great writing same with rudy having a harm if its writinen well ya but if its just simply a im ok with it from sylfee ill be disappointed)
Anime only. I totally understand the fear of altering the content. However. I watched the skipped content and I don’t think it’s being portrayed poorly. The depths of rudys depression was delivered. Roxy’s desire to help was reflected. Prego was unnecessary. Sure bar scene would be nice to have. Honestly the Roxy change may be better. Cause from the book she seems very passive with the direction it goes. That doesn’t deliver as strong of a response as the anime. But I get why you would be upset. But time is limited. Really I have 0 concerns.
In the context of Rudy repeating mistakes though, the changes for the anime really don't change that message (i've read the LNs so I might be too aware of the intent). Him initiating sex or not isn't really something that he messed up with in the past... People might view his perverted behavior as a child as such mistakes, but otherwise it's not something he feels he messed up in his past life or earlier in this one. It's really only something that makes him more like Paul by making the same mistake of cheating on his wife.
i dont like the term "wider audience" in this case, it is a different audience, we cant say that people who read a novel is the same that would watch a series, there is a lot of stuff that we are more fine reading than seeing. I am one of the people who like to tuned down some aspects of the story, like rudeus removing eris pantsu, but i dont want mr perfect japanese, so i want the flaws but dont need to be that extreme, a bit of problems of most IPs is that they need to treat the person consuming it as if he never consumed anything before, that is why we have so many of those hard scenes, to pass the information, but we dont need it anymore, i highly doubt if an isekai use game logic and never bothered us to explain what HP, mana, level, gear are, we hardly would be at loss, for me it feels so patronizing when an anime with game logic just breaks the plot to explain the most common term of games to us, people playing online gaming in 2024. So i am sorry, but a lot of cut scenes i see as filler to make volumes thicker or something just to make sure the reader dont fall asleep or to maintain a quota.
Yeah. Sanitised some the content and boom, far more people would watch it because most sensitive folks are turned off by silly things, which is sad when the story progresses to be so thrilling.
To be fair, having Roxy initiating ,removing the rough sex allusion and the loli body-type comment feels better And having the mariage proposal not coming out of a pregnancy fear is overall better writing
What I love about the characters in Mushoku is that they feel like real people with real flaws just like all of us. Reality is really horrible and this kind of anime and novel shows a glimpse of reality. People are just afraid of that, reality.
"If you hate my voice". Bro, it doesn't matter to me what you sound like. I enjoy your analysis and filling in the blanks of what happens within the anime because it usually does leave holes or questions. As an anime only, thanks for covering MT the way that you do. It's been great to follow along with you every Sunday.
The only reason we care this much about the changes is paranoia inflicted because of how bad censorship has become in mainstream media nowadays, woke stories and all that jazz, back in the day most of us didn't even know about all the changes made to movies from the source material because the movies (most of the time) were still good, but I believe we can trust Rifujin and Studio Bind to not go over the line and become bad.
I have been an author for many years now and publish webnoweles, as does the author of MT. It is very difficult to write what you want and the way you want if the author's goal is to earn a living. Especially as the author learns over time, as I have learned, that some readers are very vehement about content that for others is simply part of a story. I think the author of MT is concerned with those people who like MT, but are not fully developed intellectually and socially, do not understand that the world depicted is only fiction and these people actually need care. It used to be that teachers in schools taught a critical approach to the text, but now it is the author who has to take responsibility and sometimes has to ask himself if the scene described, the choice of the character, surely will not cause harm in some less intelligent person? Because now all it takes is one person who understands something in error and complains online to destroy the author not only his career but his whole life.
It really didn't at all. She was very clearly trying to lighten Rudy's burden. Even with the cut content, this was explicitly stated by her in the episode itself.
It's definitely concerning how they sometimes skip out scenes that give context to another, which is what mostly MT is. It's simply a domino that slowly unravels every event and the consequences afterwards. Though the thing a bit disappointing for the general anime fandom is how they take the adaptation as absolute, and thankfully there are LN readers and channels that further dig into discrepancies. A general tip now is definitely to watch the episode, then reread/listen those scenes in the novel.
But what I think is if the audience could just try and at least know that this is in a fantasy setting and they’d have to put away the modern century mindset to really immerse themselves into the fantasy adventure setting. The reason I like MT was because it had realism in the episodes which may seem taboo to modern culture and the way things are done, but if you start immersing yourself in the fact that yes this is a fantasy story, yes this is an adventure world, yes this is set in a medieval age when who knows what was right or wrong. And the fact that this Light novel literally has rich storytelling and some of the most amazing MC and Side character developments I’ve ever seen in any isekai anime, not only that but the way it handles serious trauma and realism is just amazing that even it alone made a big impact in the isekai genre, so you could say in a literature aspect that this is PEAK fiction. You know for once I’d like to see an anime where they just took risks and didn’t care about what the people might think. And I hope nothing changes because, it’s so rare to have an anime so unique and to change it just so it can be the same as all the others making it lose its unique trait is just…..sad. I LIKE Mushoku Tensei… and I hope it never changes. 🙏
Granted I haven't read the source material, so I'm not attached to anything one way or another, but Roxy initiating it feels right to me and reinforces how much she has grown. She states that Rudy helped her to become more confident; after she went back to learning and became a water King. This whole time with Elinalise, she has been disgusted by the idea of sleeping with someone, then her actual dream situation happens with being saved in a dungeon. So to me, Roxy initiating it just feels right for her character to show her development starting from being this person that was self-effacing (not being worthy of praise/modest) and her disbelief in herself in being able to accomplish anything to being this person that has confidence and believes she has worth now. But then I do see what people are worried about, as the original could have been seen as "toxic masculinity" in this modern age. So I hope that this wasn't the reason. As long as the changes are made to make the story better or to just make more sense for the character, then I'm fine with it. After all, when looking back at your work from years past you can see things that you could have done better.
The wider audience or modern audience doesn't exist and its our responsibility as the actual audience, to make them aware of this. Sales are always a concern and this is where the talk of audience comes from. We need to make it clear that anyone upset was never going to spend money in the first place and changes can only scare existing customers away. It's very hard to explain this crossing a language barrier but we should at least make an attempt.
I think what hes talking about after hearing all the options is probably the bedscene with Rudeus and Roxy. Roxy initiatied and no mention is made of Rudy beeing rough with her.
I think this much is fine as it is. It's probably better than trying a 1-on-1 as it would have been hard to adapt all the context of it. If bigger changes happen, sure, but changes in adaptation happen often and in the end, it's all fairly minor to the whole story.
Cook: how could i increase the sale of my fisch? Oh i know it some people like sweets while some like sour thing so i will just put all the things in one product and so increase the sale. People who like sweet: that is disgusting. People who love to eat fisch: this is disgusting. People who love sour things: this is so disgusting. Cook: why nobody buys my fisch filled with sweets, drownen in black chocolate and with sour sweet tape ontop?
The tweaks that have been made so far has been not only very minor, they've ironed out some of the inconsistency issues of the original story and improved upon it in many ways! They've done NOTHING to change anyone in any substantial way. It's still the same base story. You can tell the light novel was written by an amateur (and I mean that I'm the best possible way). Do you know why stories like One Piece are SOOOO great??? It's because Oda had editors that pushed him to be better and made him make changes that helped improve upon his work and art... You see, sometimes having guidance by more experienced people in the craft is a GOOD thing! The original story reads like somebody who didn't have any real editor to help guide them and it feels like somebody's first ever story. There's something very special about the story but it is VERY unrefined and unpolished. The MINOR changes the anime has made feel like nothing but those polished refinements! The story is still very much intact, but it's just been polished up and made better.
As an anime only so far, this change felt so out of place even to me. The way events transpired according to your skipped content video felt so much more in character, and therefore so much more intimate in general. Roxy getting on top of him felt like the safe decision of a much more generic anime. I almost feel betrayed.
The original work is the original work, the anime is the anime, they may be related but they may not necessarily be the same. At the end of the day, as long as the characters are consistent and the broad story remains the same, I am just going to enjoy it.
So, what I think I am getting from those tweets, and I could be wrong, is that the author pushed for changes and the production staff did not stop them. Obviously, I do not know and if that did happen, I am not sure it is the production staff job to stop the changes.
I still enjoy the show. Remember the WN and LN changed dramatically in many places, and people moaned about that. So why all the fuss over these changes, I think some of the changes in the episode improve the story, like the whole pregnancy scare. It was nice that she nudged him based on the fact that she knew he loved Roxy vs guilting him in to it. If you don't like the changes, stop watching the show. It's still better than 99% of all the other stuff we watch.
The difference between wn and LN is small improvements. This is downgrading to avoid backlash from the haters. It straight up censoreship. The up coming turning point is even more controversial.
@@KhanMann66 this isn’t completely accurate, there were some pretty substantial changes and as mentioned people complained. Additionally, look at the changes between the manga and LN, many differences. I stand by the fact that it still keeps to the essence of what Rifujin was trying to get across. I’ve always felt that although they both were guilty, Roxy’s culpability was greater than Rudy’s for what occurred. I think a lot of people who are upset, are upset because that’s what Rifujin tried to get across in the LN and he was just able to clarify that in the anime. Don’t get me wrong, I love Roxy (Sylphie > All, though), but Rudy would never have dreamt of cheating if she hadn’t went to that room with the idea to sleep with him to pull him out of his death spiral.
She's no more of a homewrecker than she was in the original source material. She tried to get him to step outside and talk with her before resorting to sex, but that didn't work.Rudy was in desperate need of help, but wasn't accepting any, so Roxy had to get a bit pushy. Some details of the scene have been changed, but the intentions and feelings of the characters remain entirely the same as they were in the light novel.
I just hope nothing else changes from here on on out. Mushoku Tensei can't be as bad as things like "Rumbling Hearts" or "Saikano: This Love song on this tiny planet". Heck Kara no Kyoukai movies had some really touchy subjects. I think reaching the wider audience is a myth that's be long been proven to be false that was perpetuated by modern media corporations. What I have issue with is the new studio. Season 1's studio was perfect. Made near zero altercations. But when season 2 came out, a different studio was used and the subject matter seems a lot more tame. I think a lot of it has to do with Rifujin and the new studio. It makes me wonder if execs of the new studio have been whispering garbage in Rifujin's ear about "The wider audience". Because its' odd how Rifujin never made any tweets during season 1. I really think it's the new studio.
As far as I understand, a few years back, there was a huge blowback on a future storyline that was eventually withdrawn but still remained canon. Can still find it on the internet and IMHO pretty good - hopefully you can cover this even though its probably not gonna get officially published. That was only from Japanese readers of the LN/WN. I could see why they wouldn't want to deal with this again for an even larger global audience. So accept it and just move on.
I'm not sure why people think roxy being the agressor was a good change. This implies that Rudy would've been fine with any woman to sleep with. Meanwhile, him being forceful means he really desired roxy which supports the polygamy theme.
Had it been anyone else, Rudeus wouldn't have been into it, and the sex wouldn't have helped him at all. He also would have tried harder to resist the sex in the first place. For this whole thing to work, the person who approached him had to be someone he was close to. The reason he was able to get so enthusiastic about the sex by the end is because it was Roxy he was sleeping with, someone he already cared about, and had feelings for. Any other girl would have been pushed away, but because it was Roxy, Rudy barely put up any kind of resistance.
I've seen backlash on Roxy to the point people want her out of the show for taking advantage and intentionally being a homewrecker. I think if they kept that scene as is, and included both how broken/unresponsive Rudy was and the chat the rest of the party had about how to fix him. It would have gone over better. It would have be what...3 minutes? I think that would have accomplished what they wanted. Orginal bedroom scene definitely wouldn't have gone over well. Especially not coupled with his claims to "remain" faithful by the campfire later in the episode. That being said, I don't want him to stop considering the "broader appeal". That will cause butterflies in the plot, probably by accident. Then it's a slippery slope to fully adapt the original vision, and that will ruin what is currently shaping up to be an anime masterpiece that will stand the test of time.
I MUCH PREFER the change, it doesn’t make the characters not flawed. It just doesn’t try to logic its way out of how inconsiderate what they did was. The original light novel approach was messy from a writing and logical standpoint and I hated how it was handled
Please just keep the art true to its origins. Don’t pull a Star Wars, don’t pull a Halo cinematic universe…There are more examples but just please stay true
I believe it simply isn't possible to adapt that scene with all of the nuance, context, and character's thoughts and feelings. Had the scene gone on in the way it was supposed to, it could have been made to seem much worse than it was, and easily could have turned people away from the show. People that wouldn't be turned away if they had the full context and nuance from the LN. I was disappointed at first, but the more I thought about it, the more I realized the risks and difficulty of a faithful adaptation of that scene. So I'm okay with how it changed. I trust Rifuujin, he's yet to let me down.
Western Audience: *OMG! RUDEUS CHEATING!!!" Western Popular Romantic Movies: Titanic = cheating The Notebook = cheating Sleepless in Seatle = cheating You've got mail = cheating Scott Pilgrim = cheating Runaway Bride = cheating Enchanted = cheating The Wedding Singer = cheating and many more...
I did the translation myself and it DOES feel like RIfujin wanted changes that the staff didnt rly want and RIfujin pushed this a lot.... I don't rly like this at all....
Why protect rudy's behaviour. The part where they choose to change the story is wild. The acceptance of pedo is fine but he openly choose to cheat and f*k roxy roughly when she is a virgin is change got me thinking. They change the part of his backstory of masturbating to his niece in his old world. However, openly let the degenerate act go in the other world towards children is fine? That wasn't change but this got change? That is wild. I believe there is a wider audience that love this show due to story writing. An isekai that is different from the usual troupe of being overpowered with its slow paced approach. However, the turn off was the main character being a pedo outright. There is many way to make a flawed character facing problems. The many things is that he felt like an outsider from his new family due to him being older than the parents itself. Coming out of his shell when roxy push him out into the world, instead of worshipping the panties of a loli. He could never forget her and hope to repay her kindness. Protecting slyphy as his own sense of justice since he was bullied himself. Instead of fantasising shota, he could protect her like a father to a daughter like how his parents failed to protect him. There is no issue for slyphy to fall for him due to the misunderstanding of his age. He can simply push slyphy away cause he isn't comfortable with a childs body. During his adventure he could go to brothels with the others experiencing his first time losing his virginity. Lacking the love aspect makes him feel vulnerable and dirty. That is where he wants to find true love over sex. Many things can be an experience without being a degenerate. He should have felt a new start and becoming a better person as a redemption story. However he went full in as a degenerate pedo fulfilling his sin even more. The most shocking part is the change they made is like they have cross the most outrageous and disgusting act and now backtrack back due to wider audience. It sounds like regret knowing your story could have top the charts but due to backlash of a disgusting main character causing it not getting that traction. Rudy is already a disgusting character so why stop and backtrack now?
What you're suggesting is that Rudy basically become an entirely different person altogether, which is...impossible quite frankly. People have the compacity to change, but not completely. Rudy can only hope to become a better version of himself. He can't completely get rid of his flaws, just as we can't simply get rid of our flaws. What Rudy can do though, is manage them better. He does this by remembering that the girls he's attracted to are people first, so he learns to keep his perversions in check as best he can, and tries to treat them right. He learns to understand the value of consent, and only sleeps with women who are willing, and also only if he actually has real feelings for them. Plus, he specifically waited to become romantically involved with any of the girls until they were legally considered grown women. He marries full grown adults, not children.
@@DevilHunter1994 maybe you misinterpret it wrong. When i ask for a change in story telling it isn't about rudy to be change during isekai but even before that. He doesn't need to be a pedo to begin with. The original part of him masturbating to his niece specifically was removed. They should have push another direction that don't involve sexually assaulting children. Rudy could easily be a degenerate to older woman and it would still be able to see growth and changes to his habits. Pedo is crossing a line of crime against minor. It promotes ptsd to children everywhere and any sane parents wouldn't accept such despicable act to live in the same society. This isn't some bad habits of smoking or vaping. This is criminal. A show that glorifying a crime against minor. The story writing is great with world building and interaction between people. Everyone else in the story can be relatable even for paul. Rudy is that odd one out that is out of place unrelatable protagonist that delve into criminal disgusting act. Grooming, sexual assault on minor, making minor who knows nothing of sex to even think of it due to his perversion like eris. There is no downplaying rudy behaviour as a person rather than animal behavior that should be put off for good. Wider audience won't accept pedo let alone having them near any part of their family. Which brings down to the story itself, why promote it to wider audience? If the main protagonist should be relatable. The main protagonist can only be relatable to other real life pedo. Which brings the wild part that is the change to cater to wider audience. If the story doesn't have any element of pedo, this story writing would have easily top the charts. So many trauma can be used for rudy with being bullied and outcast. To go into pedo territory is just outright disgusting. Let alone oversexualising minor. Who was the target audience? Are they confused now? Props to the author for good story writing however now it is a conflict of interest between staying true to the original or pushing towards general public. Why pulling the brakes now and ruin the original story when they have crossed the line of bringing pedo perversion into the story. It is very contradicting.
@@frianoMontez Did you leave another reply that got reported? Because if so, I wasn't the one who reported it. This is the first reply from you that I've seen.
@@DevilHunter1994 just him ranting about how he decided the pdf bit isn't necessary, about how he can grow and change from an attraction to older ladies, that it'd be the same somehow. or in other words, a repeat that it should be about a different character with "growth" about a nonissue.
. now the chances that they make an Oshi no Ko style special episode for season 3 cour 2 expanding greatly on something the novel skipped over is slim (y'all know what I'm talking about, that part), which is such a shame because it would have made the anime adaptation surpass GREATLY the novels by a LONG shot. sadge
I refuse to think of this anime as a one time thing. Already they've censored the sex scenes and that on its own means there's room for another fully uncensored rendition of the entire series. Studio Trigger can put nudity all through Edgerunners AND Delicious in Dungeon, we need those people working on this anime.
Based on everything you said, it seems like the changes don't detract from the story in anyway. It doesn't really matter who pulled who, if anything having it this way detracts ammunition from those who might want to criticise certain characters.
honestly i can understand why they are concerned but the issue is the story is about repent and hes suposed to be haed at the start as you said, hes suposed to be a "stain" but yeah the story thrives on this concept and i wouldnt like to see stuff like this happen.
If you are willing to change your art to "suit a wider audience", you are not an artist, you are a cog in the machine. What was created was created that way for a reason. Any change post release will only mqke the art worse.
I never really cared that much about how exact the anime is adapted to the original source. My go-to is always the source material and not translated to English when possible. Any adaptations of the source material to me is just the bring in potentially more interest to the original source material.
You may want to do some digging to see how the anime is faring financially as that determines most things. From the last episode, it is clear Rudeus remains flawed. From what I've heard, the changes were made not to appease the audience but to make the characters more consistent with prior actions. The prostitute saying he needed to be with someone he trusted, the general passive nature towards his love interests given the first night with Eris and his low self-esteem, and a more realistic portrayal of how Elinalise thinks as opposed to the tricks she plays. I love that he is involved and that gives him a lot of power under Japanese copywright law, which is much stricter than in the West. He can pull the project if he believes the work loses artistic integrity but informal power in Japan is strong. My guess is more to do with Turning Point 4 and the diary sequences, which are very raw. Does he cut some of the most outrageous acts out? Other than that, we've passed the primary controversies in the story. The other question is how well is it doing in Japan? I know the LN has been selling well but are they making money on the anime? If not, it is either a choice of make changes or don't see your project to completion.
Those who “wont accept it” still wont accept Rudy at all. If anyone still watching isnt okay with Rudy as of yet, then they arent a fan, or have already left the series. No catering is needed. Personally, the changes to Roxy initiating it felt way more in line with how she was acting, and the state Rudy was in. Elina’s lie was just horrible in the first place. Sure, it could be something she would say, but it just makes it seem as though Rudy doesnt love Roxy and he was forced into marrying her only due to his “mistake”. Rudy still says it was his fault. He could have stopped her and didnt. It still showcases his flaws, just to a lesser degree. He was staying faithful until Roxy pressed forward.
I’m actually glad that they got rid of the pregnancy thing. To cliché in this scenario. Just wish they’re was more between him and Elinalise. To get some real knowledge from the “slut” turned one man woman, an opening for the the woman who seems to always be open to give some life advice from the heart. Instead of the “at a boy” we got just seemed crappy, like an easy way out for him to feel better.
11:53 that last comment you made, damn you may be right, I'll be less critical, especially about last episode. TBH I didn't care about the sex scene, I wanted more of the discussion prior to Sex scene and the reveal from Rudy to Roxy. That moment in the anime is gone now, however Rudeus and Orsted fight is still coming next season and we still have future Rudy coming soon.
The discussion is much more interesting than expected. If Rifujin actually made the change to have Roxy initiate the act, I can see how it would fit what he said about not wanting to disregard the group of people who "allow it conditionally". Base on what is mentioned from the LN, I can see how Rudy initiating and is rough with Roxy can be seen as using Roxy as a tool, especially in this context of getting through his grief. Switching the initiator around, in my opinion, turns the discussion into "Roxy forced upon Rudy with temptation and offer herself, but her intention is still largely out of kindness and care for Rudy. And is that morally wrong?" I think it is indeed morally wrong, "but not that wrong" which is probably what I think the fine line that Rifujin is aiming for. I didn't think the act is absolutely necessary, simply stay by Rudy overnight might've been enough. Emphasize the emotional importance and significance of simply having someone around during a person's lowest time is enough to bring them back from collapsing. At the same time, I can also see Rifujin is probably carefully using the act to emphasize its "potency" in bringing someone back from the brink of falling apart. And also as a plot device, having done the act would make more sense plotwise to create the situation that Rudy should marry Roxy. Had it been that Roxy just stay with Rudy without any acts, it would not have the necessity for Rudy to marry Roxy. IDK if it is boomer take, but Roxy offering herself still have some form of giving an important part of her to Rudy. There's a lot of intricacy and it is hard to fully express with words. Either way, if this is the take then I think Rifujin actually improved the plot beyond the LN. Also, a bit of a side note, I think by Rudy being rough on his first time with both Sylphy AND Roxy would mean that he didn't grow at times like this (as in emotional moments), that he did not grow in maturity to control his action regardless of his emotion. That would also contradict the overarching theme of growth for Rudy. Plus, this time, he is not drugged up with aphrodisiac nor is he mentally excited in that direction. With those two condition he is STILL being overly rough would honestly be a step down instead of growth. If it is not okay to him for being overly rough when he was overly positively excited, why would it be okay if he isn't even positively excited and is more on the side of releasing his negativity.
He’s overthinking it too much hope he doesn’t take anything major out and sticks to the story he wrote. This episode had slight changes but doesn’t really matter but if this becomes a thing who knows what might happen in the future of this animated series. Just extra info about Roxy being pregnant. No she’s not pregnant Elinalise only says that to Rudy in the LN to convince him to see her as a wife I don’t think Roxy gets told or knows that Elinalise said that lie we just find out later with Rudy getting mad that he was lied to but nothing develops with it so I see why they cut it out it’s not that important. However it does add a bit of understanding at least to me I saw it as Elinalise being in Roxy situation maybe with Paul and Elinalise decided to run away from it just how Roxy feels like running away from the relationship once they reach there destination but she’s making both of them to at least fight and see it through the end to have no regrets about it.
I'm so happy that Mushoku Tensei was finished before it became this massive success that it is now. Granted, the light novel was already one of the best selling LNs in Japanese history. But now it just feels like everything is under the microscope by everyone.
deadass
Mushoku soul is the depraved nature of the characters, like humans.
Agreed, I don't understand why it's so important to have unrealistic characters, like Andrew said it's the imperfect that makes this perfect and sometimes relatable.
its realistic regarding people and i appreciate it, warts and all
Personally think the change is better and more realistic to rudy's logic regarding to who initiated the act.
the comments under post about the anime are all about how scummy the anime is.
This is exactly what I’m afraid of, why on earth are all these people so obsessed with the wider audience? They don’t matter, it’s the actual fans that matter, they’re the ones buying every volume of the light novel, of the manga, of the audiobook, figures of all the characters, all the merch. They’re the ones that matter, actual fans, all the other people you’ll get no money from them.
But the fans already know how to love a flawed character. Maybe author wants more people to learn to love flawed characters, so he's smoothing out the parts of the climb that are too tough for them in hopes that they'll be ready next time their is a story with flawed characters to really love them.
@@LucenProject I get the argument, but isn't it kinda too late for that with MT? I mean we're like 50eps in, most of these people are probably not watching anymore.
@@floxer I think it IS too late for that, but if the author still wants to reach for it, I can't tell them how to change or not to change their art for the message the want to convey and/or the audience they want to target.
And I can see in a small way someone saying something like "I was all for Rudy sucks but is becoming a better person but then he initiated an affair when he had Sylphie, so I'm out now" seeing things differently when he's seen more explicitly as a grieving son taken advantage of. 🤷🏾♂️ (As if progress to becoming a better person is linear or somehow we end up perfect and immune to making "bad" decisions at any point in it).
Greed. That's why
Money
This series has been the most RAW anime I’ve ever seen. I really hope they don’t change it
Yea I really hope it doesn't start to pull it's punches
@@yonaguy6978 I mean it’s already pulled some punches
@@petershury7135A lot of punches. I think they actually did an awesome job making the anime consistent with how much content was cut! 😂 Then again, Rifujin himself is in the script team.
@@fcgHenden don’t get me wrong I’m loving this anime I just wish they didn’t cut so much content and characters but beggars can’t be choosers lol
They nerfed this series so much it’s hurts to watch. Many important things are left out that it changes the plot further down the road.
The fact that Rifujin is so vague in what he says and that he sometimes even has spelling errors making translation difficult makes it very difficult to draw a conclusion. Personally, I think that this was a one-time thing, without giving spoilers about the future, I don't see another scene later that would require "softening" the adaptation, I think that the change of rudeus for roxy makes sense in the context of the anime's story itself, by omitting rudeus internal monologue during his talk with her it would not make sense for Rudeus to be the one who starts the relationship when he is weak and depressed but knowing that Roxy is after him since she was rescued it makes more sense that she is the initiator and forces the issue on a vulnerable Rudeus, that's how it makes sense to me at least.
About the scene of Elinalise lying to Rudeus about the pregnancy I think it's a point in favor, with that scene Rudeus is basically forced to take responsibility for his "mistake" or simply take Roxy as his wife as compensation for what she did, leaving In the background his feelings for her, by eliminating that scene, Rudeus's proposal is more sincere and comes from him, instead of a feeling of guilt or obligation, all this obviously taking into account the narrative of the anime, which differs from the novel, that's why I always say that watching the anime with the novel in your head all the time is not good for the general enjoyment of the product alone, the criticisms that I have seen yesterday and today only focus on "they changed this" " they omitted the other" but no one talking about the anime itself as its own entity, it is something that can be seen in anime onlys that really enjoy the anime and it is sad that such a good anime receives so much criticism for "not being like the novel "
If you are talking about softening, there is still one character story arc by itself that most probably will have it. Being Aisha and Ars. Heck if it is hot topic from the novel's, I dont think it will past the anime check (to be honest that's good).
@@TheTruemanBoi keep it spoilers free please, Andrew is not at that point yet or at least give a spoiler warning and leave some space before writing it, that story in particular is not even canon anymore, at least for now
Yes! I couldn't agree more with you.
I agree. The missing context would’ve have really hurt how that scene came across had it been adapted 1:1. The exact way it happened physically may not have been accurate, but I think it helps the viewers better understand the situation and their perspective on Roxy and Rudy individually. Roxy even said her self that she was partly being selfish because she wanted it. She always had the intention of sleeping with him as a last resort when she went to his room. The cut context would have not made that clear and just would’ve made Rudy look worse and Roxy appear more taken advantage of than the other way around.
Exactly, I just hope it stays the same as is The LN to Anime adaptation.
I hate the general audience :(
We all do.
But only way to convert some of them is to slowly introduce them to things outside of their norm. Maybe author felt this would be too far for them and changed things so they don't go running back to their comfort zone of rejecting imperfect characters, but if it works, maybe they'll be ready for something like the original story the next time around.
If they remove the sniff sniff lick lick scene ima become Elon Musk rich and redo the show.
@@LucenProject Eh, there is nothing in Mushoku tensei which should be shocking to westerners unless they don't hypocrite virtue-signal.
In ASOIAF/GoT Daenerys Targeryan gets raped at 13 years old and then falls madly in love with her rapist.
In IT by stephen King 12 year olds have an orgy.
@@LucenProject I don't want to convert them. If someone isn't interested, or flat out does not like a work of art, then that is how it is. Art should not be changed to make it more palatable to "a wider audience". Those who are uninterested or offended can find other art elsewhere that is more to their liking.
Now of course, if the author wants to do that, that is his choice, but it is kind of crappy to disappoint the fans that have supported you all along in order to try and maybe win over a handful of potential new fans by altering your work.
Little does he know that by doing that, MT loses some of the things that make it the MT that we love.
I don't want the characters to act out of the norm, just for the sake of appealing to broader audience.
One of the reason MT is loved is how natural and realistic the story progresses, but if characters behave in unnatural way, the story feels forced and fans won't like that.
Also changing the original story would be kinda disrespectful to the loyal LN and WN fans that been supporting the series for so long.
Yes lets just forget about the amount anime fans as well who wouldnt be too happy about changes.
They dont matter at all. Nope.
Just because you started something earlier doesnt mean you're "better".
100% the Rudy Roxy interaction, and im glad. Roxy being the initiator makes a lot more sense than Rudy and both of them share the blame for the act. The Original scene could be Misinterpreted as Rudy taking advantage or forcing himself on Roxy esp animated. Furthermore, Rudy is completely depressed having him pull Roxy seems out of character for how we have seen him act before, having Roxy be more forward lines up with how she was acting in the Dungeon.
Plus she her self sees her as the older one
Yea I get that, though I still think that there's Rudy's perspective on depressed self destructive behaviors that could allow that in my opinion, like he's like screw it since Paul did it too, what does it matter if I do too. Roxy being more wanting is still better, but I really think this moment should have been more of a relapse sort of moment for Rudeus, you feel me?
Exactly what I though too. The removal of Elinalise's lie about Roxy's pregnancy is also a good choice, gives more agency to Rudy and shows that he actually loves and cares for Roxy.
@@captainvanisher988 The bed scene definitively made the story better, but I'm conflicted by leaving the pregnancy scare out.
💯 couldn't agree more!
Rudeus is "nasty", but he was never intended to stay nasty. It's a long road of improvements with some setbacks. If that road is a little less nasty or gets less nasty a little more quickly than before, then I don't think that's a complete loss.
I agree
I also agree! I'm not a light novel (or is it web novel?) reader, though, so I don't know what the exact depiction of his exact nastiness has for story implications further down. I just can't really imagine it being THAT important, so long as you don't whitewash too hard.
Yeah it could be seen as a shortcut to the same destination... even if it just change a little.
I only saw woman complaining about this episode, and it is because of the "cheating" situation and not who started it.
Yeah like I don’t see the big deal. I prefer this change over the novel because I feel like it makes Roxy more of a main character in the sense that she made her own decision with conviction. But I guess I’m in the minority 😅😅😅
@@FabioPCarvalho Who cares? They are fictional characters in a fantasy setting. People are so milquetoast, it's sad.
All book adaptations I've read and watched had to adjust to their medium. There are so many parts that are so beautiful in the book that are glossed over or outright missing from the show or movie adaptation. Here we have the author able to actually provide input on the adaptation. We don't know what his input was only that changes did happen. Maybe his choice was to not include the missing monthly visitor part. Maybe it was the changes from the book with Roxy and Rudy as you pointed out, Andrew.
An author wanting to get his products out to a wider audience is always a consideration. They have to walk that fine line between "selling out" and adjusting for ease of adaptation. Maybe Rifujin felt it would slow the place of the show too much or maybe it's something he felt they couldn't cover eloquently enough that they went with this option. How much was cut or changed from Lord of the Rings or The Expanse?
I really enjoy MT, warts and all, and I'm looking forward to the next series set on this incredible world Rifujin built.
I read the LoTR books recently. Just for movie 1 they cut an entire arc which takes about 1/5th of the book. Yet I still love the movies and I'd say I love them even more than before. Cutting parts out is part of the adaptation. As long as the adaptation itself is good and the story isn't diluted then it can be a great adaptation.
True, you can't expect a novel to be adapted 1:1 to film.
Harry Potter is definitely another example. There's tons of stuff cut from the movies.
As for Anime, Re Zero cuts whole iterations of the loops sometimes.
Konosuba cuts content as well, and it's VERY apparent. just in season 1, Wiz's introduction is done offscreen, and there's a whole arc about Kazuma adventuring with another party (he switches with the blond skinny dude) for a while as a bet.
MT has a lot of worldbuilding detail and it's awesome. Huge part why I love the series. But yeah, can't expect to keep and explain everything all the time. The pacing would be awful. Although I do admit that this last stretch feels a little too time constrained; just an extra episode or two would've done wonders.
Well, as an anime-only, it's definitely a surprise to hear that Rudy was the actual aggressor in the source material.
I think the changes to episode 23 were meant to retain the character development Rudy had gained so far within the anime's run time, so they weren't gonna adapt something that may potentially seem like a regression in character development and then feel the need to show even greater character development in the future to offset that regression.
They just don't have that kind of time and resource, unfortunately, to fully flesh out details of the story that allows for ups and downs to a character's development, and add to the fact that an appeal to wider audiences is part of the goal of anime adaptations.
They had to do something that could fit both the delivery format and the expectations of potential eyes out there, and so the changes to episode 23 were the result of these considerations. At least, that's what I think.
YES! Personally, I feel like it was SUPER inconsistent with Rudy's character growth the way it went down in the LN and really made me upset. But it turned a scene and the idea of polygamy (which I originally hated) into one one that not only makes sense, but now I feel much more okay about the idea (albeit I'm still not thrilled it's turning into a harem lol, but I don't hate the idea now with the way it's playing out).
That’s what I’m talking about, if more changes like this one are coming for the betterment of the story, Then I’m all for it.
I can see it looking like regression for Rudy, but I saw it as a reinforcement of Roxy's development from a person that thinks she has no worth to being a more confident person that can see her own worth.
Not to mention she just lived her dream romantic encounter with being saved in a dungeon, so I'm kind of surprised she didn't initiate it sooner.
As another AO, i saw nothing wrong with anything so far.
Ppl need to start learning that since things get cut that you need to stop comparing animes to their source as they are 2 different things.
I mean no matter how hard the studios try, things will always be left out so treat the anime as its own entity. Same with the source.
Having this mindset when only worsen your experience with the series.
So just enjoy what does get animated.
I mean its not like they've 100% altered the story now have they? They're still get the message across so alls well.
I really appreciate the series for having flawed characters and being raw. I hope they don’t make too many changes, but I’m not going to go and jump to conclusions until I see what comes. I’m going to keep a positive vibe and say I really enjoyed the series so far snd look forward to more; even knowing what changes happened in the last episode.
3:29 I side with refujin's comment about this. I get it, more adience who will accept the anime, will less likely for it to be cancelled. Although the critiques of LN Readers is being said all over my feed, i feel that we readers are still just the minority of those who watch the show.
I still think that they deliver the message refujin wants albeit that they "tamed" it...
I just hope that this isn't a frequent thing.
I would personally have no adaptation than a censored adaptation but that's just me. It's the same with movie remakes. You can say "yeah they cut out a bunch of build up and character development here and here, but at least the big scenes are still there so it's not THAT bad" but to that I just say "watch the originals" instead. I don't see a point of an adaptation if it's just gonna be a downgrade. That's why I started reading the LN after these last few MT episodes. I don't think S2 is a bad adaptation, but it does some things that even I as an anime only feel weird about. S1 didn't have these problems even though it covered the same amount of volumes as S2.
Give an inch, they take a mile. Mark my words this won’t be the last change if the anime continues.
Making females the sexually aggressive ones seems to be a common way of making an anime softer/tamer. Apparently having men being sexually assertive is threatening or something.
Similarly, far too many "quirky girls tease nerdy guys" shows these past five years. Gotta go back 14 years to Maid-Sama for the classic "Prince Charming"/Chad archetype teasing the girl.
Having Roxy be dominant initially makes Rudeus seem less of a scumbag.... but the end result seems to still be polygamy anyway so not sure that was necessary.
I prefer the change about Roxy being the initiator than the one in the novel. It makes more sense as well. Rudy was depressed, he was weak due to his anorexia and besides that Roxy had already decided that she was to be the one to sleep with him. So it makes more sense that she is initiating that. Same with Elinalise's lie about Roxy's pregnancy, that makes it more so that Rudy actually loves Roxy rather than he is doing it half because he loves her and half because he wants to take responsibility.
I don't believe that any writer should cater to any audience so their work can be accepted. However, if he wants to improve things from his original work during an adaptation I don't see why that is bad.
As for the "changes". The people that would have an issue with this episode, would've an issue regardless of how it was approached. They can't remove their own biases and values when consuming a piece of art like Mushoku Tensei. They can't critically think and understand that morality systems differ from place to place, from world to world, from religion to religion.
Generally speaking the reaction from the community gave me a big distaste after this episode. The people that can't critically think attacked the concept of polygyny (harem) and the fact that the husband stepping out of the marriage for a night(which is shown to only be unacceptable for Milis followers in that world) but those people would be under the episode complaining regardless. However, I am more disappointed with the LN readers who unironically expect that every aspect and part of the LN must be adapted. They not only sh*t on the episode but on the entire season as well.
Dude, this has been the best comment by far! Couldn't agree more with you if I tried!
This man is a true Hero, you have my support pal.
no, they just tried to make Rudeus guilty of me. the situation with Roxy was similar to that if someone provoked a person who had been in a stressful situation for a week to strike, the bulk of the blame would still be on Roxy, but Rudeus would also be involved, now Roxy is both the provocateur and the one who strikes. in the novel she was ready to give herself to Rudeus, but she clearly did not intend to rape him. and how did it help him? in the novel he specifically poured out his emotions on Roxy, but what happens here? and the moment with Elinalise is what made it possible to share the blame between three characters at once, Rudeus just looks like an asshole, in the novel, even realizing that he loves Roxy, he still wanted to remain faithful to Sylphy to the last, but here he decides to break his promise and risk his family only because Elinalise said that Roxy would be sad. How is he going to tell Sylphy about this now? “After Paulo died, this 50 year old girl basically forced me to have sex and now I want to marry her”? And that's without taking into account all the cuts including the literally necessary parts without which the wonderful last episode and Paulo's death look like they were needed just to add Roxy to the harem. I don't want them to adapt everything 1 to 1 I just want an adaptation that doesn't make everything worse
I'm an LN reader, and I hate them too...
Like dude, there is no such thing as a 1:1 adaptation, plus the changes is not even that bad.
I'm hoping for the best of the anime! Anime really does draw a lot of eyes. It's nice hearing how Rifujin is closely involved with the anime.
To an extent this is something Rifujin has always done. He always toes the line of what people are okay with.
He edited the webnovel when his audience thought he took things too far. He filtered out some extra bits to make it more acceptable when it got serialized as a lightnovel.
So it makes sense that he's trying to make small adjustments for the anime as well.
I dont think that the adaptation is going to completely change the characters in a way that removes their flaws and the flaws of the world, if that was the case, Julie would have been freed after Rudy and Zanoba bought her and Rudy wouldnt have even touched Linia or Pursena, whichever one it was in the anime. And i think that latter point is the thing that Rifujin is talking about tweaks, in the ln, he groped both of them before deciding that its no good, but the anime only had him grope one before deciding that its no use. Similar to the Roxy thing where he had Roxy be more aggressive (which, tbh, is how i remembered the scene from the ln, its been a while and only from your last video did i remember it was different). I trust Rifujin more than most authors about understanding what to tweak in terms of adaptation without sacrificing what makes the story great.
Yeah, it is ABSOLUTELY waaay more acceptable for a Woman to be an aggressor. The only time it's not, is when it's with a minor, but even then there are people that minimize it.
So while I DEFINITELY don't want them to change anything, ESPECIALLY to appeal to the whiners on Twitter who either don't even watch the show, or just complain about everything "offensive" regardless. But I am okay with this, especially if it means less whining on the Internet about Rudy. But I do wish they had played up Rudy's depression, and at LEAST said how long it had been without food, it would've made softened the blow(for some) on what she did and why. And I wish Elinalise told Rudy about that thing, became unless I'm misremembering, he was still trying to stay faithful, but the fact that she was potentially carrying, pushed him over the edge.
So while what they did wasn't good, these two things would've each made what happened on both ends better, or at least slightly more justifiable to people
I'm personally VERY happy they didn't try to gaslight Rudy with the pointless scene of telling him Roxy was pregnant... That was super cringe and very unnecessary...
Honestly, the way the anime framed it just made sense with the current character dynamics.
Especially with Rudeus going back to shut-in mode, it's more natural that he isn't starting the situation. Himself was framed as wanting to be left alone, and even after was already torn apart by his feelings without adding more to it with lies.
There is a lot actually implied, from Elinalise unfinished "did you?.." when they exit the room to the girl talks we don't see since it's from Rudy's perspective but obviously did happen.
The way she bring up religion to remind him his father also had multiple wives, instead of lying about Roxy potentially carrying, just feels more sincere.
(As for the time Rudy spent not eating, his face is a very conserning visual indicator, for whoever pays attention. A lot of "show don't tell" happening there)
I don't think it's a bad thing, as long as it makes sense with the story and character dynamics, that the author adjust the story. After all, any author writing on hard topics like these have this kind of worries and "I could have wrote this part better" moments on retrospect.
For this episode at least it was handeled correctly. Making him the attacker, including how the group was about to leave him behind, and lies getting back at what happened? That may have felt unnecessary edgy, I can see why there's some softening.
Here, it just feels like everyone in the group don't know what to do to help each others yet still care, as akward as their way to help is.
@@renookami4651 maybe, but I just watched a reactor react FURIOUSLY, and instead of seeing that Roxy did it to help him and sacrificed her virginity for it, they HATE Roxy now and wanted her off of the screen. And I feel like if they played up the depression a lot more And had the conversation where they all talked about the idea of helping Rudy this way, people would feel differently.
@@kamikaze.33 lol, Unnecessary to you, to me there is NO reason for him to take her as a second wife other than that she's sad. That isn't justification for a Man to potentially ruin his marriage, take in another women. If he loves her AND she is potentially pregnant. Also, that's what the story is, so that's what it should be here.
So you're okay with it as long as there's less whining about Rudy? I don't get that. Who cares what other people think? You give an inch, they take a mile. You can't please these people. They will just find something else to complain about,
I like a good adaptation and I think the role of one is to improve or correct flaws in the original material.
The changes made in episode 23, for me, improved the story. If there are changes like this I'm happy, but I understand the concern, it's very easy to make mistakes.
However, the author gave me no reason to worry. I hope it continues like this.
💯
Totally agree.
Nope all this does is censor the narrative to appease the raging masses. I say to hell with them.
Honestly I feel like the changes help the story. It’s a bit weird how Roxy just talks Rudy out of his depression and into intimacy in the LN. Making her more assertive and initiating things makes more sense. Her saying she took advantage of him was more of a way to give Rudeus a clean break if he wanted to.
As far as not doing the fake pregnancy shit I 100% get behind. Starting a relationship based off a lie is never a good thing. It makes it clear this is something Rudy chooses and isn’t forced into.
And that’s exactly what I’m hopefully for this Director, being this the best change he could have done.
I realize the concern for someone changing the aspects you love of a story, but I'd argue that if a creator has something to say, it's best to say it to those that DON'T agree with it. why preach to the choir? Why court the vote of those who will vote for you no matter what? The way to change things is to get those on the edges, those who could understand from a particular perspective or a with a considered choice of words. Those who are already onboard accept that flawed characters, but those on the edges, probably can't handle as many flaws if they're used to perfect characters.
If the author wants people to accept their first flawed characters and some changes are needed to his work to get his message across, I won't be upset. (I think I'd be feeling differently if the author wasn't the one making these changes or wasn't involved.) Though, to be fair, I also have the benefit of being an anime only aside from YT cut-content videos, so I haven't fallen in love with the story in the form you all know it.
Fax
Fax
Changing Rudeus on top to Roxy changes a lot of context ☠️
Yeah, in a very negative way... It would be inconsistent with their characters and the growth Rudy has made up until this point. I'm SO happy the anime fixed that inconsistency.
@@kamikaze.33exactly my fellow pal, this change has only made the anime Adaptation even better for not letting brake the growth of Rudy and let other characters to make mistakes like he does, because they are F@cking human beings, human are known to make mistakes, that is what make us human.
This isn't something new Mushoku tensei is heavily criticized in Japan since season 1. It always aired after 12 AM and treated like +18 anime without actually anything making it +18. For example Konosuba has way more ecchi than Mushoku without any question but its last season aired at 11.30 PM earlier than Mushoku. So it isn't just about making it more acceptable for general audience rather they have political reasons to soften anime as well. Perhaps they are trying to get more favorable air time for next season. I was hopeful that they won't give in and keep anime loyal to the source, but sadly didn't happen. Most likely they will soften everything like the diary incidents etc, it will be another anime ruined by quote 'Japanese values'..
He cut out the stuff that was just sour to me. The Elinalise gaslighting that was so in your face, the overdramatics with Roxy "sacrificing her virginity and body to save Rudy". The main things that were not cut, and were laid bare in your face last episode was this: Roxy wanted to help Rudy, but was also selfish, and wanted Rudy to be hers. Rudy let it happen, he now loved Roxy as much as Sylphie, and was willing to risk his marriage over it because "He'd rather be a scumbag than have regrets".
He basically gave Roxy and Rudy equal agency to be scummy dirtbags and own it together, then have other crap muddying up the waters on this situation. Roxy took advantage for some good reasons and bad. Rudy wants Roxy and says damn with it, i'll risk it all. It softened the blow for both in a way, and spared us most of the melodramatic justifications surrounding this whole part of the story.
My 2 cents anyway.
You said my thoughts was better than I was able to say it. I agree 💯!
The point isn't that it's too sour for some people. The point is that a story is altered because people think it's too sour, and that shouldn't happen in any story IMO. It's not about what is being cut, it's the reason for cutting things out.
I honestly think the change to Roxy pulling Rudeus to the bed was to fit more with her thoughts later on the matter. With what you read out from the LN in the skipped content vid, it seems she still says she took advantage of him while he was down. That's a hard sell if he's the one that stopped her from leaving and initiated everything. When you read those parts out, I felt like it was a bit dissonant, so they may have changed it to mesh together better rather than to make the cheating more acceptable.
She is a naive virgin girl with childish romance fantasies who got gaslighted into thinking it would cheer Rudeus based on what everyone was talking about in cut bar scene.Her pulling the guy twice her size,throwing him onto the bed and straddling him looks hillarious,weird and completely out of character
Her sacrificing her first time being anything but gentle and romantic to help the person she loved was very touching and showed how even tho she is physically small she is very strong person mentally. In the anime she just looks like some harlot jumping at the chance to have her way with Rudeus, i dunno. Maybe i am somewhat biased cause this chapter was one of m y favourite and legit made me cry first time reading.
They probably changed the scene to avoid angry Twitter mob. Make the women do the "bad" thing thefore you can't hate it cause its a woman
@@Denifai The only reason she could pull him, and throw him is because he wasn't fighting back. He was basically a near lifeless husk. As for why they had Roxy be the one to initiate things, I think they wanted to make clear that this wasn't an entirely selfless action on her part. Yes, helping Rudy get through this is certainly a big part of her motivation here, but that's not all there is to it. She loves him. She wants to be with him. There is a part of her deep down inside that WANTS to have this night together with him. I really enjoyed reading the novel, and I did enjoy this scene, but I do think Roxy came out of it in the novel looking a bit too pure. Having Rudy initiate things just makes it look he gave into his desires and did a bad thing, while Roxy was just selflessly sacrificing her body, and going along with what he wanted, because that was the only way to save him. Having Roxy initiate things, with Rudy getting into it more and more as they go on, I think makes it clearer that they are BOTH responsible for doing the thing. They are two adults who made a choice together, and now they have to own up to the consequences of their mutual decision, and figure out the best way to move forward.
@@DevilHunter1994 Well glad you enjoyed the episode,unfortunately that's not the case for me ( not only cause of the Roxy scene but also the cut bar scene which added more depth to Elinalise character and explained where even Roxy got the idea to sleep with him).From the same bar scene you also could feel that Roxy wanted to spend night with him when she felt bad at the thought of Elinalise making out with Rudy.Still she asked why she wouldn't help him despite how her negative feeling.Roxy being pure is literally her character.She is a wise adult who wants to be looked upon as mature woman yet still have childlike naive side to her which is clearly obvious.Her duality is what made her an interesting character.Also the parents part wasn't done as good as in LN
As a standalone episode i don't think its terrible but as adaptation i feel like they missed the bar (imo)
I think changes to fit the medium are ok. For example, Douglas Adams wrote The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy as a radio play, then as a novel, then as a TV show and then as a movie.
Every one of these versions of the same story are wildly different, but the essence of the story and the characters remain.
I think we need to give the author and director of Mushoku Tensei the benefit of the doubt and trust him to make the changes they deem necessary.
I’ve always love mushoku tensei because the characters are so flawed and the art work was beautiful. Seeing Rudeus shoot his first intermediate water spell made me jump out of my seat and then watching Rudeus growth and everyone dealing with their own problems has made for some of the most compelling TV I’ve seen in years. It’s a masterclass in storytelling and visuals to drive the story but this whole season has had weaker visuals and a softer story. It’s concerning but I love this show so I hope they try hard to keep it as original as possible. (I also know that I’m not the same as other people. I prefer media that is dark and real and painful and compelling for it. My last girlfriend refused to watch the second episode of cyberpunk because she couldn’t handle it and I was sad because I knew how amazing the story is)
Sometimes changes are made irrespective of censorship as the video says too. It could be that on reflection, author thought Roxy initiating it fit the story better for example, since the anime Rudy emphasized his intention for loyalty multiple times in a way that might have had less % attention in written form. He is still responsible for cheating, but him initiating it could be seen as a character inconsistency. In contrast, the anime's portrayal can be seen as him keeping his earlier ideal, only to fail it...a flaw rather than an inconsistency.
I would actually view the change differently depending on whether it was done out of censorship/fear vs simply making the story flow better...ultimately, the impact on the story is the same, but which thinking process got us there changes what's expected for future adaptation.
Not gonna lie i think the fact that Roxy comes onto Rudy makes more sense to me than Rudy being the one who initiates it.
True facts.
8:24
I believe this falls under a similar meaning as: _"Semantics"_
It doesn't matter how Rudeus & Roxy did it, just as long as they did do it.
Rough sex, Soft sex, who leads? It's all the same to me.
So as long as the sex part wasn't taken out.
That's the type of censorship I'm worried about.
Yes I am familiar with the concept of: _"Give an inch, they take a mile"_ but I don't think that's the case here.
That justification is what will hurt the series. By reducing their interaction to that simple concept, it removes the nuance of their characterization, and removes that greater sense of investment in their development and their relationship going forwards. It's focusing too much on the broader picture and making the characters nothing but two dimensional puppets who only do things because the plot demanded it, rather than having deeper motivations and feelings. Without that context, the significance of Rudeus and Roxy's affair is hollow and meaningless.
@@Creed-SalazarI mean that’s fair but to me I felt it still accomplished it. Only thing I wished happened was rudeus’s inner monologue on how he fucked up came into play so we knew more that he felt bad about this. I think scene accomplishes the same task and other stuff. Plus I will say it makes sense both ways wether he or Roxy initiated the sex, but that’s just my own opinion
I really think the reason why they change the startup of the night of Rudeus and Roxy is because I think it's more acceptable to have Roxy having major blame for their action
She knew he was married with a son, she knew he could go to a brothel or sleep with anyone else, but she saw this as her last chance to sleep with the men she dreamed of finding her whole life just to lose him to someone else. Rudeus being rough because he was trying to forget and don't stop because he was also attracted to her makes a mutual blame more acceptable, then she was just giving him an idea and him forcing himself on her.
To be honest I liked season 2 Rudeus because after he slept with Eris he stopped being such a pervert, I know that in the novel there is no imitate change but in the anime they tone it down, and I like that, makes sense a man stopping being so horny after he understands what it's like to have a partner even if the said partner left and left him broken, I think shows more growth from his part, not only he was able to go back to his feet by himself after dying and being abandoned, but he also was able to get a grip into his impulses.
Some things need to be adapted. I could watch anything, but it hurts me to know people who loved the first season that are never going to watch season 2 because they dropped after seeing a 40-year-old man sleep with a 14-year-old girl, I know they are right for hating that, but I also know they are wrong for just seeing that and don't wait for context
4:00 i interpret that it's not the audienceship/popularity that he's aiming for; but the people he wishes to expand their point of views regarding stigmas in society. Or maybe he's testing the water on what he can do for the forbidden redundancy chapter. *chuckle
Roxy :he was weak/needed comforting.
He wasn't blowing off anger he was disheartened
Think change was more fitting with circumstances.
Think of sylphy had aphrodisiac to rile him up. Rudy this time was more in headspace releasing pain than pushing pleasure.
What worries me so much is that its directly from Rifujin. Its bad enough when producers try to say "lets make this tamer so it can reach a wider audience". But its even worse if the author pushes for it too. It pretty much insures 100% that things will be changed. This really scares me. We already have had sgins of it recently, and I'd worry about other future events now.
He is the author, it's his story.
He already "rewrote" this story before, nothing forbids him from doing it again, keep "improving" the text.
I personally believe that when the author themselves wants to make changes to better their own story then nothing could be more fine about it. Even greats like Oda have had editors to help push them to deliver their best work possible! Sometimes you realize after writing something, it would've been better if some things were slightly tweaked. And there's plenty of unnecessary things in the original that detract from the story. And honestly, there's plenty of actual character inconsistencies too that could stand to be corrected. So far, the anime has only improved things while not changing anything at all in any substantial way...
@@deathdoor Yes, of course, but he is saying it not in the context of "improving", its about making it more "acceptable". More acceptable doesn't = improvement, if he meant improve he'd just say improve his writing. There is a huge difference there.
@@kamikaze.33 If it was just about improving his writing I'd be okay with that, but that isn't what this is. This is about making this "acceptable". That is my issue.
@@TheAnimeKoala But think about this specific situation and story beat. Here you can see a lot of people agreeing that this change was for the better, that it makes sense for Roxy to take the lead.
It's an improvement.
To be honest, I think I prefer the anime version, in my mind it does not make sense for Roxy to try and leave when she presumably had already made up her mind to see this trough, and I like to see her empowered in this way. I do acknowledge there is a double standard, in that a woman being forceful with a man is seen as more acceptable than the other way around, which I think is the primary reason why the change was made.
I don't think it was the primary reason for the change, but i agree in the sense that i like this version better. It honestly never made sense for Rudy to be the initiator here. He's depressed and emaciated yet he's still aggressively horny? And despite his unyielding loyalty to Sylphie and years of character growth/development, he's suddenly going to try and take advantage of the situation to do Roxy??? It just never made ANY sense and made me SO mad and disappointed at Rudy!
I also like this version, it more human.
Imagine if Berserk got toned to “appeal” to wider audience no one would stand for that. So why would you stand this crappy version? What’s stopping the next change? This is a major red flag tbh.
"wider audience" talk never ends well for adaptions 😢
Still better than the "modern audience" that hollyweird panders to, but not by much.
Wider audience is definitely not in the same sense that the Western cinema is talking about. He probably means the wider audience of Japan.
@@captainvanisher988 I am sure that he does, which is why I specified that It is better than the west's "modern audience".
I said it is only slightly better, because it is never a good thing to modify a work of art to make it more acceptable to 'normies' (for lack of a better word).
@@captainvanisher988wait, I think i saw you talking in the aniwave comment section
At least someone with the same pfp
@@NogardCodesmith Agreed. Modification should only happen for improvement upon the source material. Which it did in this episode in a couple points.
Here is an alternative view I would like to share and agree with. I don't think tweaking certain aspects of the story is objectively "bad" or "good" if it helps retain viewers like me, especially in this case.
Before Mushoku Tensei (MT) became an anime and gained popularity, the author made a lot of changes, not only because he wanted to, but also due to audience feedback. While a minority of people disagreed with these changes, the majority of the fanbase believes they have improved the overall story.
You might argue, "Well, it’s the core fanbase who made this manga-turned-anime happen." This is only 40% true. In the realm of anime, it’s the general audience that ultimately dictates whether we continue to watch and support MT.
IMO I think that Rifujin can "change" things acording to his new perspectives, not every change is good, but I think that people can see things differently as tge years go by. I just hope that our worse fears don't occur and the history changes abruptally
I don’t think this is going to negatively impact the series as it continues. I think they’ve been pretty consistent in how real they’ve kept the series while trying to adapt as much of the story as possible properly through the time restraints and medium change of anime. I don’t think they’ve ruined anything thus far even with this recent episode. I’m always going to wish the anime could be 1:1 with the LN and not cut anything out, but it’s fair to consider the perspective of the anime only watcher and making things clear despite the missing context. There’s been a lot of context missing, but most of it can be figured out by putting pieces together. I can’t say I love exactly how they changed Roxy and Rudy’s interaction in the bedroom, but I appreciate that it makes it pretty clear that Roxy was always there with the intention of sleeping with him if she’d had to. I don’t think the anime usually maintains enough context for viewers to understand that scene had it gone exactly the same way as the LN. Many people would’ve been much more unfairly harsh towards Rudy and make it out to be something one sided and something Roxy didn’t want which would be untrue. So I ultimately understand and appreciate the change and it’s intentions. They seem pretty keenly aware of how some missing context can affect how the story comes across in the anime and how to adapt to that so viewers can interpret things as similarly as possible to LN readers.
I liked how the anime did that situation.
It was easier to understand, her taking the lead the make him feel better.
But the light novel way doesn’t make scene. Rudeus is to sad to eat. Then suddenly he is willing to break is vow and violate the person he respects most ??? That makes no sense.
Throughout the anime Rudeus has always been shy with new people in bed. Eris has force him the first time, The adventurer girl initiates it the first time, Selphy has to initiate the first time. So it was completely in his anime character to be shy around Roxy, especially since the entire time they kept reminding us, “I want to be faithful to Selphy”
So why in the Light Novel was he the aggressor?
The reason I love this series is because its shows a raw display of human nature.
Decision and consequences being one of them. Not all decisions are "good or bad" it just is.
Changing to fit a modern/acceptable audience is never the way. Like many have mention we're here because we read the source material and us the fans are going to notice this changes.
I hope this anime doesn't start to go from Goat adaptation to ok adaptation because of these changes.
Sidenote: The Roxy change.
The way I see this is diminishing Roxy impact compare to when Eris and Slyphy slept with Rudy. But I'll hold off until next episode to see if they bring it all together.(I have doubts)
8:42 she went into the room expecting that would happened. And I say that because she locked the door when she walked in.
Catering to casuals and tourists is nothing but harmful.
And an excersize in futility
..kind of like me who wants to encourage my friends to watch this series😂
Can I call myself an MT fan even though I haven't read the LN yet.. I'm planning to do so if ever ..after the anime is finished.
The thing I love about MT is how it doesn't shy away from controversial topics... or taboos or wtver you call it. But at the same time I want it to gain more popularity...
You are currrently reading the LNs. These already have changed some of the stuff from the original WN. In some places Rifujin has made such significant changes to the story, that it basically was a rewrite (e.g.: the second fight against Atofe - spoiler alert, I guess - and I know the reason why he did it. It was to appeal to a broader audience. Read the original material of the thing I just mentioned and see for yourself. It is the truth)
So, it seems that you are unaware, that Rifujin has always been adjusting his story IN MAJOR WAYS in order to appeal to a wider audience. He isn't "sterilizing" his story, though. You can tell from all the endless controversies! lmao
(Essentially, what I'm saying is that you are wrong and your concerns are stupid!)
WN is a rough draft without an editor and publisher, just amateur writing, of course it will be slightly different from the light novel with editors, this happens to all series with WN, not just Rifujin.
@@ky8252 That's incorrect for 2 major reasons:
1) Most of the stuff in the LN was just taken over from the WN, with barely any changes.
2) On the other hand some parts of the story, especially the later parts of it were COMPLETELY rewritten(!)
So, the WN was NOT the rough draft of the story. The core idea of the story, which was established in the earlier volumes (vol. 1 - 15), saw only very minor changes in the LN. (And, sure he basically added almost the entirety of vol 7, but basically everything that happens there is of no consequence for the story. It's literally filler.)
And in the later volumes, Rifujin made some sweeping changes, which basically the WN was not the "draft" for, since he partially just rewrote it!
@@GreenSalad-qn9ou Tell that to all the novel authors on Narou
This is sanitized to appease the general public audience. Next thing you know he’ll change the whole and it’ll be a shell of its former self.
It changes the context and some detail is lost but i feel it was decent. Based on what you said was skipped the anime used roxy gettion on top to show that she came in to suduce him. It lost the context of him being rough and taking the first move but that is kind of what she wanted
Call me a hater but I think with how adement at least in the anime rudy was about not cheating on sylfee; roxy giving the final push works better it's still partially Rudy's falt but I think from a consistent character perspective rudy not being the one to initiate is just better writing ( its not about morals its a fictional story they can do what they want but being morally ambiguous for the sake of it to me isnt great writing same with rudy having a harm if its writinen well ya but if its just simply a im ok with it from sylfee ill be disappointed)
Wider audience? Fine I guess. Modern audience is where crap hits the fans.
Indeed😂
Anime only.
I totally understand the fear of altering the content.
However. I watched the skipped content and I don’t think it’s being portrayed poorly.
The depths of rudys depression was delivered. Roxy’s desire to help was reflected. Prego was unnecessary. Sure bar scene would be nice to have. Honestly the Roxy change may be better. Cause from the book she seems very passive with the direction it goes. That doesn’t deliver as strong of a response as the anime. But I get why you would be upset.
But time is limited. Really I have 0 concerns.
I’m also having 0 problems with this change.
In the context of Rudy repeating mistakes though, the changes for the anime really don't change that message (i've read the LNs so I might be too aware of the intent). Him initiating sex or not isn't really something that he messed up with in the past... People might view his perverted behavior as a child as such mistakes, but otherwise it's not something he feels he messed up in his past life or earlier in this one. It's really only something that makes him more like Paul by making the same mistake of cheating on his wife.
i dont like the term "wider audience" in this case, it is a different audience, we cant say that people who read a novel is the same that would watch a series, there is a lot of stuff that we are more fine reading than seeing.
I am one of the people who like to tuned down some aspects of the story, like rudeus removing eris pantsu, but i dont want mr perfect japanese, so i want the flaws but dont need to be that extreme, a bit of problems of most IPs is that they need to treat the person consuming it as if he never consumed anything before, that is why we have so many of those hard scenes, to pass the information, but we dont need it anymore, i highly doubt if an isekai use game logic and never bothered us to explain what HP, mana, level, gear are, we hardly would be at loss, for me it feels so patronizing when an anime with game logic just breaks the plot to explain the most common term of games to us, people playing online gaming in 2024. So i am sorry, but a lot of cut scenes i see as filler to make volumes thicker or something just to make sure the reader dont fall asleep or to maintain a quota.
Yeah. Sanitised some the content and boom, far more people would watch it because most sensitive folks are turned off by silly things, which is sad when the story progresses to be so thrilling.
To be fair, having Roxy initiating ,removing the rough sex allusion and the loli body-type comment feels better
And having the mariage proposal not coming out of a pregnancy fear is overall better writing
What I love about the characters in Mushoku is that they feel like real people with real flaws just like all of us. Reality is really horrible and this kind of anime and novel shows a glimpse of reality.
People are just afraid of that, reality.
"If you hate my voice". Bro, it doesn't matter to me what you sound like. I enjoy your analysis and filling in the blanks of what happens within the anime because it usually does leave holes or questions. As an anime only, thanks for covering MT the way that you do. It's been great to follow along with you every Sunday.
The only reason we care this much about the changes is paranoia inflicted because of how bad censorship has become in mainstream media nowadays, woke stories and all that jazz, back in the day most of us didn't even know about all the changes made to movies from the source material because the movies (most of the time) were still good, but I believe we can trust Rifujin and Studio Bind to not go over the line and become bad.
I have been an author for many years now and publish webnoweles, as does the author of MT. It is very difficult to write what you want and the way you want if the author's goal is to earn a living. Especially as the author learns over time, as I have learned, that some readers are very vehement about content that for others is simply part of a story. I think the author of MT is concerned with those people who like MT, but are not fully developed intellectually and socially, do not understand that the world depicted is only fiction and these people actually need care. It used to be that teachers in schools taught a critical approach to the text, but now it is the author who has to take responsibility and sometimes has to ask himself if the scene described, the choice of the character, surely will not cause harm in some less intelligent person? Because now all it takes is one person who understands something in error and complains online to destroy the author not only his career but his whole life.
Circumstances in MT are extremely real thats why people feel uncomfortable and i love MT for it
Damn the anime made Roxy look like a scheming homewrecker 🤦🏿♂️
It really didn't at all. She was very clearly trying to lighten Rudy's burden. Even with the cut content, this was explicitly stated by her in the episode itself.
It's definitely concerning how they sometimes skip out scenes that give context to another, which is what mostly MT is. It's simply a domino that slowly unravels every event and the consequences afterwards. Though the thing a bit disappointing for the general anime fandom is how they take the adaptation as absolute, and thankfully there are LN readers and channels that further dig into discrepancies. A general tip now is definitely to watch the episode, then reread/listen those scenes in the novel.
But what I think is if the audience could just try and at least know that this is in a fantasy setting and they’d have to put away the modern century mindset to really immerse themselves into the fantasy adventure setting. The reason I like MT was because it had realism in the episodes which may seem taboo to modern culture and the way things are done, but if you start immersing yourself in the fact that yes this is a fantasy story, yes this is an adventure world, yes this is set in a medieval age when who knows what was right or wrong. And the fact that this Light novel literally has rich storytelling and some of the most amazing MC and Side character developments I’ve ever seen in any isekai anime, not only that but the way it handles serious trauma and realism is just amazing that even it alone made a big impact in the isekai genre, so you could say in a literature aspect that this is PEAK fiction. You know for once I’d like to see an anime where they just took risks and didn’t care about what the people might think. And I hope nothing changes because, it’s so rare to have an anime so unique and to change it just so it can be the same as all the others making it lose its unique trait is just…..sad. I LIKE Mushoku Tensei… and I hope it never changes. 🙏
Granted I haven't read the source material, so I'm not attached to anything one way or another, but Roxy initiating it feels right to me and reinforces how much she has grown. She states that Rudy helped her to become more confident; after she went back to learning and became a water King. This whole time with Elinalise, she has been disgusted by the idea of sleeping with someone, then her actual dream situation happens with being saved in a dungeon. So to me, Roxy initiating it just feels right for her character to show her development starting from being this person that was self-effacing (not being worthy of praise/modest) and her disbelief in herself in being able to accomplish anything to being this person that has confidence and believes she has worth now.
But then I do see what people are worried about, as the original could have been seen as "toxic masculinity" in this modern age. So I hope that this wasn't the reason. As long as the changes are made to make the story better or to just make more sense for the character, then I'm fine with it. After all, when looking back at your work from years past you can see things that you could have done better.
The wider audience or modern audience doesn't exist and its our responsibility as the actual audience, to make them aware of this. Sales are always a concern and this is where the talk of audience comes from.
We need to make it clear that anyone upset was never going to spend money in the first place and changes can only scare existing customers away.
It's very hard to explain this crossing a language barrier but we should at least make an attempt.
I think what hes talking about after hearing all the options is probably the bedscene with Rudeus and Roxy. Roxy initiatied and no mention is made of Rudy beeing rough with her.
I think this much is fine as it is. It's probably better than trying a 1-on-1 as it would have been hard to adapt all the context of it. If bigger changes happen, sure, but changes in adaptation happen often and in the end, it's all fairly minor to the whole story.
Cook: how could i increase the sale of my fisch? Oh i know it some people like sweets while some like sour thing so i will just put all the things in one product and so increase the sale. People who like sweet: that is disgusting. People who love to eat fisch: this is disgusting. People who love sour things: this is so disgusting.
Cook: why nobody buys my fisch filled with sweets, drownen in black chocolate and with sour sweet tape ontop?
tja that happens if you try to please all people at once and the only thing you do is make a product nobody will like.
The tweaks that have been made so far has been not only very minor, they've ironed out some of the inconsistency issues of the original story and improved upon it in many ways! They've done NOTHING to change anyone in any substantial way. It's still the same base story.
You can tell the light novel was written by an amateur (and I mean that I'm the best possible way). Do you know why stories like One Piece are SOOOO great??? It's because Oda had editors that pushed him to be better and made him make changes that helped improve upon his work and art... You see, sometimes having guidance by more experienced people in the craft is a GOOD thing! The original story reads like somebody who didn't have any real editor to help guide them and it feels like somebody's first ever story. There's something very special about the story but it is VERY unrefined and unpolished. The MINOR changes the anime has made feel like nothing but those polished refinements! The story is still very much intact, but it's just been polished up and made better.
so lost but still loving the anime
As an anime only so far, this change felt so out of place even to me. The way events transpired according to your skipped content video felt so much more in character, and therefore so much more intimate in general. Roxy getting on top of him felt like the safe decision of a much more generic anime. I almost feel betrayed.
Wouldn’t be surprised if this all stems from when ANN and Twitter kept harassing him for the slavery “controversy”
The original work is the original work, the anime is the anime, they may be related but they may not necessarily be the same. At the end of the day, as long as the characters are consistent and the broad story remains the same, I am just going to enjoy it.
So, what I think I am getting from those tweets, and I could be wrong, is that the author pushed for changes and the production staff did not stop them. Obviously, I do not know and if that did happen, I am not sure it is the production staff job to stop the changes.
I still enjoy the show. Remember the WN and LN changed dramatically in many places, and people moaned about that. So why all the fuss over these changes, I think some of the changes in the episode improve the story, like the whole pregnancy scare. It was nice that she nudged him based on the fact that she knew he loved Roxy vs guilting him in to it. If you don't like the changes, stop watching the show. It's still better than 99% of all the other stuff we watch.
The difference between wn and LN is small improvements. This is downgrading to avoid backlash from the haters. It straight up censoreship. The up coming turning point is even more controversial.
@@KhanMann66 this isn’t completely accurate, there were some pretty substantial changes and as mentioned people complained. Additionally, look at the changes between the manga and LN, many differences.
I stand by the fact that it still keeps to the essence of what Rifujin was trying to get across. I’ve always felt that although they both were guilty, Roxy’s culpability was greater than Rudy’s for what occurred.
I think a lot of people who are upset, are upset because that’s what Rifujin tried to get across in the LN and he was just able to clarify that in the anime. Don’t get me wrong, I love Roxy (Sylphie > All, though), but Rudy would never have dreamt of cheating if she hadn’t went to that room with the idea to sleep with him to pull him out of his death spiral.
Rifujin turned the goddess into a homewrecker because of the twitter spergs!
She's no more of a homewrecker than she was in the original source material. She tried to get him to step outside and talk with her before resorting to sex, but that didn't work.Rudy was in desperate need of help, but wasn't accepting any, so Roxy had to get a bit pushy. Some details of the scene have been changed, but the intentions and feelings of the characters remain entirely the same as they were in the light novel.
I just hope nothing else changes from here on on out. Mushoku Tensei can't be as bad as things like "Rumbling Hearts" or "Saikano: This Love song on this tiny planet". Heck Kara no Kyoukai movies had some really touchy subjects. I think reaching the wider audience is a myth that's be long been proven to be false that was perpetuated by modern media corporations. What I have issue with is the new studio. Season 1's studio was perfect. Made near zero altercations. But when season 2 came out, a different studio was used and the subject matter seems a lot more tame. I think a lot of it has to do with Rifujin and the new studio. It makes me wonder if execs of the new studio have been whispering garbage in Rifujin's ear about "The wider audience". Because its' odd how Rifujin never made any tweets during season 1. I really think it's the new studio.
As far as I understand, a few years back, there was a huge blowback on a future storyline that was eventually withdrawn but still remained canon. Can still find it on the internet and IMHO pretty good - hopefully you can cover this even though its probably not gonna get officially published. That was only from Japanese readers of the LN/WN.
I could see why they wouldn't want to deal with this again for an even larger global audience. So accept it and just move on.
I'm not sure why people think roxy being the agressor was a good change. This implies that Rudy would've been fine with any woman to sleep with. Meanwhile, him being forceful means he really desired roxy which supports the polygamy theme.
Had it been anyone else, Rudeus wouldn't have been into it, and the sex wouldn't have helped him at all. He also would have tried harder to resist the sex in the first place. For this whole thing to work, the person who approached him had to be someone he was close to. The reason he was able to get so enthusiastic about the sex by the end is because it was Roxy he was sleeping with, someone he already cared about, and had feelings for. Any other girl would have been pushed away, but because it was Roxy, Rudy barely put up any kind of resistance.
I've seen backlash on Roxy to the point people want her out of the show for taking advantage and intentionally being a homewrecker. I think if they kept that scene as is, and included both how broken/unresponsive Rudy was and the chat the rest of the party had about how to fix him. It would have gone over better. It would have be what...3 minutes? I think that would have accomplished what they wanted.
Orginal bedroom scene definitely wouldn't have gone over well. Especially not coupled with his claims to "remain" faithful by the campfire later in the episode.
That being said, I don't want him to stop considering the "broader appeal". That will cause butterflies in the plot, probably by accident. Then it's a slippery slope to fully adapt the original vision, and that will ruin what is currently shaping up to be an anime masterpiece that will stand the test of time.
I MUCH PREFER the change, it doesn’t make the characters not flawed. It just doesn’t try to logic its way out of how inconsiderate what they did was. The original light novel approach was messy from a writing and logical standpoint and I hated how it was handled
Please just keep the art true to its origins.
Don’t pull a Star Wars, don’t pull a Halo cinematic universe…There are more examples but just please stay true
I believe it simply isn't possible to adapt that scene with all of the nuance, context, and character's thoughts and feelings. Had the scene gone on in the way it was supposed to, it could have been made to seem much worse than it was, and easily could have turned people away from the show. People that wouldn't be turned away if they had the full context and nuance from the LN. I was disappointed at first, but the more I thought about it, the more I realized the risks and difficulty of a faithful adaptation of that scene. So I'm okay with how it changed. I trust Rifuujin, he's yet to let me down.
i hope we get maybe 1 or 2 OVAs to show different character's perspectives like after season 1 with Eris.
Western Audience: *OMG! RUDEUS CHEATING!!!"
Western Popular Romantic Movies:
Titanic = cheating
The Notebook = cheating
Sleepless in Seatle = cheating
You've got mail = cheating
Scott Pilgrim = cheating
Runaway Bride = cheating
Enchanted = cheating
The Wedding Singer = cheating
and many more...
Mushoku tensei really fell off from S1 a lot in everything , story , characters , animation
I did the translation myself and it DOES feel like RIfujin wanted changes that the staff didnt rly want and RIfujin pushed this a lot.... I don't rly like this at all....
Why protect rudy's behaviour. The part where they choose to change the story is wild. The acceptance of pedo is fine but he openly choose to cheat and f*k roxy roughly when she is a virgin is change got me thinking.
They change the part of his backstory of masturbating to his niece in his old world. However, openly let the degenerate act go in the other world towards children is fine? That wasn't change but this got change? That is wild.
I believe there is a wider audience that love this show due to story writing. An isekai that is different from the usual troupe of being overpowered with its slow paced approach. However, the turn off was the main character being a pedo outright. There is many way to make a flawed character facing problems.
The many things is that he felt like an outsider from his new family due to him being older than the parents itself. Coming out of his shell when roxy push him out into the world, instead of worshipping the panties of a loli. He could never forget her and hope to repay her kindness. Protecting slyphy as his own sense of justice since he was bullied himself. Instead of fantasising shota, he could protect her like a father to a daughter like how his parents failed to protect him. There is no issue for slyphy to fall for him due to the misunderstanding of his age. He can simply push slyphy away cause he isn't comfortable with a childs body. During his adventure he could go to brothels with the others experiencing his first time losing his virginity. Lacking the love aspect makes him feel vulnerable and dirty. That is where he wants to find true love over sex.
Many things can be an experience without being a degenerate. He should have felt a new start and becoming a better person as a redemption story. However he went full in as a degenerate pedo fulfilling his sin even more.
The most shocking part is the change they made is like they have cross the most outrageous and disgusting act and now backtrack back due to wider audience. It sounds like regret knowing your story could have top the charts but due to backlash of a disgusting main character causing it not getting that traction. Rudy is already a disgusting character so why stop and backtrack now?
What you're suggesting is that Rudy basically become an entirely different person altogether, which is...impossible quite frankly. People have the compacity to change, but not completely. Rudy can only hope to become a better version of himself. He can't completely get rid of his flaws, just as we can't simply get rid of our flaws. What Rudy can do though, is manage them better. He does this by remembering that the girls he's attracted to are people first, so he learns to keep his perversions in check as best he can, and tries to treat them right. He learns to understand the value of consent, and only sleeps with women who are willing, and also only if he actually has real feelings for them. Plus, he specifically waited to become romantically involved with any of the girls until they were legally considered grown women. He marries full grown adults, not children.
@@DevilHunter1994 maybe you misinterpret it wrong. When i ask for a change in story telling it isn't about rudy to be change during isekai but even before that. He doesn't need to be a pedo to begin with. The original part of him masturbating to his niece specifically was removed. They should have push another direction that don't involve sexually assaulting children. Rudy could easily be a degenerate to older woman and it would still be able to see growth and changes to his habits. Pedo is crossing a line of crime against minor. It promotes ptsd to children everywhere and any sane parents wouldn't accept such despicable act to live in the same society. This isn't some bad habits of smoking or vaping. This is criminal. A show that glorifying a crime against minor.
The story writing is great with world building and interaction between people. Everyone else in the story can be relatable even for paul. Rudy is that odd one out that is out of place unrelatable protagonist that delve into criminal disgusting act. Grooming, sexual assault on minor, making minor who knows nothing of sex to even think of it due to his perversion like eris.
There is no downplaying rudy behaviour as a person rather than animal behavior that should be put off for good. Wider audience won't accept pedo let alone having them near any part of their family.
Which brings down to the story itself, why promote it to wider audience? If the main protagonist should be relatable. The main protagonist can only be relatable to other real life pedo. Which brings the wild part that is the change to cater to wider audience. If the story doesn't have any element of pedo, this story writing would have easily top the charts.
So many trauma can be used for rudy with being bullied and outcast. To go into pedo territory is just outright disgusting. Let alone oversexualising minor. Who was the target audience? Are they confused now? Props to the author for good story writing however now it is a conflict of interest between staying true to the original or pushing towards general public. Why pulling the brakes now and ruin the original story when they have crossed the line of bringing pedo perversion into the story. It is very contradicting.
@@DevilHunter1994 People can't take positive criticism and just report replies when they lost a point.
@@frianoMontez Did you leave another reply that got reported? Because if so, I wasn't the one who reported it. This is the first reply from you that I've seen.
@@DevilHunter1994 just him ranting about how he decided the pdf bit isn't necessary, about how he can grow and change from an attraction to older ladies, that it'd be the same somehow.
or in other words, a repeat that it should be about a different character with "growth" about a nonissue.
.
now the chances that they make an Oshi no Ko style special episode for season 3 cour 2 expanding greatly on something the novel skipped over is slim (y'all know what I'm talking about, that part), which is such a shame because it would have made the anime adaptation surpass GREATLY the novels by a LONG shot.
sadge
I refuse to think of this anime as a one time thing. Already they've censored the sex scenes and that on its own means there's room for another fully uncensored rendition of the entire series.
Studio Trigger can put nudity all through Edgerunners AND Delicious in Dungeon, we need those people working on this anime.
Based on everything you said, it seems like the changes don't detract from the story in anyway. It doesn't really matter who pulled who, if anything having it this way detracts ammunition from those who might want to criticise certain characters.
honestly i can understand why they are concerned but the issue is the story is about repent and hes suposed to be haed at the start as you said, hes suposed to be a "stain" but yeah the story thrives on this concept and i wouldnt like to see stuff like this happen.
If you are willing to change your art to "suit a wider audience", you are not an artist, you are a cog in the machine. What was created was created that way for a reason. Any change post release will only mqke the art worse.
I dont know, man. I feel like it is hypocritical to like a show about redemption while being so stuck up about not giving others a chance.
i guess now they know what the comunity wants and also what went wrong with the series. i just hoped they did something good for next season
I never really cared that much about how exact the anime is adapted to the original source. My go-to is always the source material and not translated to English when possible. Any adaptations of the source material to me is just the bring in potentially more interest to the original source material.
You may want to do some digging to see how the anime is faring financially as that determines most things. From the last episode, it is clear Rudeus remains flawed. From what I've heard, the changes were made not to appease the audience but to make the characters more consistent with prior actions. The prostitute saying he needed to be with someone he trusted, the general passive nature towards his love interests given the first night with Eris and his low self-esteem, and a more realistic portrayal of how Elinalise thinks as opposed to the tricks she plays. I love that he is involved and that gives him a lot of power under Japanese copywright law, which is much stricter than in the West. He can pull the project if he believes the work loses artistic integrity but informal power in Japan is strong. My guess is more to do with Turning Point 4 and the diary sequences, which are very raw. Does he cut some of the most outrageous acts out? Other than that, we've passed the primary controversies in the story. The other question is how well is it doing in Japan? I know the LN has been selling well but are they making money on the anime? If not, it is either a choice of make changes or don't see your project to completion.
Those who “wont accept it” still wont accept Rudy at all. If anyone still watching isnt okay with Rudy as of yet, then they arent a fan, or have already left the series. No catering is needed.
Personally, the changes to Roxy initiating it felt way more in line with how she was acting, and the state Rudy was in.
Elina’s lie was just horrible in the first place. Sure, it could be something she would say, but it just makes it seem as though Rudy doesnt love Roxy and he was forced into marrying her only due to his “mistake”.
Rudy still says it was his fault. He could have stopped her and didnt. It still showcases his flaws, just to a lesser degree. He was staying faithful until Roxy pressed forward.
I’m actually glad that they got rid of the pregnancy thing. To cliché in this scenario. Just wish they’re was more between him and Elinalise. To get some real knowledge from the “slut” turned one man woman, an opening for the the woman who seems to always be open to give some life advice from the heart. Instead of the “at a boy” we got just seemed crappy, like an easy way out for him to feel better.
11:53 that last comment you made, damn you may be right, I'll be less critical, especially about last episode. TBH I didn't care about the sex scene, I wanted more of the discussion prior to Sex scene and the reveal from Rudy to Roxy. That moment in the anime is gone now, however Rudeus and Orsted fight is still coming next season and we still have future Rudy coming soon.
The discussion is much more interesting than expected.
If Rifujin actually made the change to have Roxy initiate the act, I can see how it would fit what he said about not wanting to disregard the group of people who "allow it conditionally". Base on what is mentioned from the LN, I can see how Rudy initiating and is rough with Roxy can be seen as using Roxy as a tool, especially in this context of getting through his grief. Switching the initiator around, in my opinion, turns the discussion into "Roxy forced upon Rudy with temptation and offer herself, but her intention is still largely out of kindness and care for Rudy. And is that morally wrong?" I think it is indeed morally wrong, "but not that wrong" which is probably what I think the fine line that Rifujin is aiming for.
I didn't think the act is absolutely necessary, simply stay by Rudy overnight might've been enough. Emphasize the emotional importance and significance of simply having someone around during a person's lowest time is enough to bring them back from collapsing. At the same time, I can also see Rifujin is probably carefully using the act to emphasize its "potency" in bringing someone back from the brink of falling apart. And also as a plot device, having done the act would make more sense plotwise to create the situation that Rudy should marry Roxy. Had it been that Roxy just stay with Rudy without any acts, it would not have the necessity for Rudy to marry Roxy. IDK if it is boomer take, but Roxy offering herself still have some form of giving an important part of her to Rudy.
There's a lot of intricacy and it is hard to fully express with words. Either way, if this is the take then I think Rifujin actually improved the plot beyond the LN.
Also, a bit of a side note, I think by Rudy being rough on his first time with both Sylphy AND Roxy would mean that he didn't grow at times like this (as in emotional moments), that he did not grow in maturity to control his action regardless of his emotion. That would also contradict the overarching theme of growth for Rudy. Plus, this time, he is not drugged up with aphrodisiac nor is he mentally excited in that direction. With those two condition he is STILL being overly rough would honestly be a step down instead of growth. If it is not okay to him for being overly rough when he was overly positively excited, why would it be okay if he isn't even positively excited and is more on the side of releasing his negativity.
it happened throughout season 2 in general. i do not feel the emotions like i did in season 1 compared to season 2.
He’s overthinking it too much hope he doesn’t take anything major out and sticks to the story he wrote.
This episode had slight changes but doesn’t really matter but if this becomes a thing who knows what might happen in the future of this animated series.
Just extra info about Roxy being pregnant. No she’s not pregnant Elinalise only says that to Rudy in the LN to convince him to see her as a wife I don’t think Roxy gets told or knows that Elinalise said that lie we just find out later with Rudy getting mad that he was lied to but nothing develops with it so I see why they cut it out it’s not that important. However it does add a bit of understanding at least to me I saw it as Elinalise being in Roxy situation maybe with Paul and Elinalise decided to run away from it just how Roxy feels like running away from the relationship once they reach there destination but she’s making both of them to at least fight and see it through the end to have no regrets about it.