Thank you for your support! 😊🙏 Spotify: spfy.link/music 🎧 Music: nordstarstudio.com 🎹 Learn: mastersofmusic.net ▶ Playlists: spfy.link/playlists Music Licensing & Business: nordstarstudio.com Mikael "Mike" Baggström Composer, Musician, Artist
This was actually a pretty concise explanation. I finally learned what 0db is. Now I can I make sense of those turntable rumble figures (given in -db). I feel like you should have talked more about clipping. Obviously the loss of dynamic range is bad, especially if you have an audio system that can really take advantage of it, but it doesn't make things sound too bad. Clipping the waveforms though really seems to mess up the overall sound of things like cymbals and other drums.
+Daniel Whiting Thanks for your kind comment. I love to hear from people who appreciate my videos. :) You might want to check out my free course on compression: goo.gl/HFpCFF Cheers! :)
Thank you Reggie. Indeed, I guess many producers today were not around at the time when we had great dynamics in music productions. Myself I grew up in the 80s, so yeah, it was a different time.
The problem with loudness war is that you can't choose between dynamic range or more loudness, the decision was already taken by another person. I always prefer to turn the volune up when needed, that's why is always good to have a good headroom for your amplifiers play the loudest parts of the songs without clipping (but if the song is already clipped this wouldn't make much difference).
Thanks Mike. Can you briefly comment on how we establish "no" sound in the digital realm? Is it -96db? Another level? What establishes this lower limit and why do we denote it as such?
+Greg Neumayer good question! To be honest I haven't reflected on this. All electronics have self noice so there will always be a noise floor that you will hear. But 96 dB is as good as completely silent.
1:41 Yeah, and sometimes, I don't know how and why that happens, my meter on a channel, with some reverb-plugin on, peaks at +100dB (probably fullscale or so) in Cubase :-D Seems like I am able to fill up a glass with twice the amount of water and also heard the most awful and loudest noise I've ever heard in my life - without warning... Sometimes life's strange and really unexpected :-D
Sure if you have a few odd loud spots that are mostly insignificant (a couple loud cymbal hits or drum beats) that are way louder than every other part of the song, it's not the end of the world to clip them a little. That's an acceptable amount of clipping, especially when putting it on an analogue medium with floor noise. When you see brickwalling throughout significant portions of a song it's just stupid, and this is normal now. Strangely enough it's done more now when we're in the digital age when we don't even have to worry about floor noise anymore. For example I have an older version of Jeff Wayne's War of The Worlds with no clipping, and compared it to the trash that's on Spotify, and it's gut wrenching. The accuracy is just gone, if you sync them up and level their volumes to compare side by side, it's a huge downgrade. The cymbals at the beginning in "Eve of War" are just muddied into nothing. And unfortunately this compressed version is the one floating around everywhere that most people will hear. Many such cases. This needs to stop.
I used to era music with CD player and analog stereo integrated amplifier. At that time I have found the CDs sound great compared with vinyl LP. I think that was because of the bigger dynamic range of the CD recording. Also the loudness control of the integrated amplifier gave a great “feeling to the music. Some year ago I bought a Denon AVR 1611 5.1 channels. I have noted that in this equipment the dynamic Eq. Is replacing the function of loudness, that use to compensate the way the human ear perception of low frequencies at lower volumes. Having say that, I have noted that the way a CD sounds in the 5.1 digital audio system (using PCM digital audio signal) seems to be lower quality compared with the way I felt it with the integrated amplifier. Nevertheless playing audio from Blu-ray Disc, let say a concert, it sound grate, with good dynamic range. I wander what is the reason why there is a big difference, at least in my perception, between a CD and Blueray disc in an actual digital audio AVR. I would like to ear about other opinions. Thanks
Quality mix and mastering is not about how loud you can get a song. The game is all messed up nowadays. Of course you want loudness, but not compressed all to hell where you're loosing the beauty of the music.
and the hardest part to reach the desired loudness without torturing your song... I have sometimes war against my limiter.. I can not increase many dBs at once without "pumping"
This whole system is badly set up. Why would anyone put 0 as max reference? it should start at 0 sound and go positive. There are more elements involved than just the computer. If you crank up the sound source to above line-level, you could over-saturate the upstream circuits even before it gets inputted to the computer. Every part that gets over-saturated adds/compounds to the distortion. The term "compression" is totally misused here. The volume does not get compressed. What gets compressed, is the size of the digital info of the sound-signal. All distortion/clipping is due to exceeding the electrical capacity of the hardware/circuits, which is therefore mis-coded into digital form. Distortion/clipping can also happen in analog parts of the recording/playback circuits. All parts of the whole system should be measured in the same way to avoid confusion or misuse. And usually that means starting with a minimum volume and not exceeding/over-saturating the limit of the most restrictive part of the whole system. It has much less to do with "compression" than it does with over-saturation. This whole explanation is more distorted than any sound-signal it's trying to correct.
Thank you for your support! 😊🙏
Spotify: spfy.link/music
🎧 Music: nordstarstudio.com
🎹 Learn: mastersofmusic.net
▶ Playlists: spfy.link/playlists
Music Licensing & Business:
nordstarstudio.com
Mikael "Mike" Baggström
Composer, Musician, Artist
But my speakers go to 11.
yeah screw loudness i just wanna make the most quality music
I thought of the 0db as a pot of boiling water, actually- and if it overflows it's too hot and you burn your dinner and make a mess on the stove!
Great video and great explanations. Thanks!
This is an informative and interesting video. I have shared it, and I hope more people see it.
I'm still hoping for the loudness war to finally end (with loudness normalisation here now)
Super thorough! Well done on this video!
+DavidRussell323 Thank you! I really appreciate your support! :)
This was actually a pretty concise explanation. I finally learned what 0db is. Now I can I make sense of those turntable rumble figures (given in -db). I feel like you should have talked more about clipping. Obviously the loss of dynamic range is bad, especially if you have an audio system that can really take advantage of it, but it doesn't make things sound too bad. Clipping the waveforms though really seems to mess up the overall sound of things like cymbals and other drums.
+Daniel Whiting Thanks for your kind comment. I love to hear from people who appreciate my videos. :)
You might want to check out my free course on compression: goo.gl/HFpCFF
Cheers! :)
This was super helpful! Thank you, brother.
+Pocket Notes Thank you! Take good care of the dynamics in your music. :)
Peak Eleven yes, it's very important and is a nessesary tool to create the element of surprise :)
+Pocket Notes indeed it is! :)
Streaming services are normalizing to -9 to -14 LUFS so loudness wars are already over.
I like the glass analogy.
+Mark Arandjus Ha ha, I like using analogies. Makes me visualize things and concepts better. :)
thanks for sharing your comment! :)
Very good explanation...sooo many young bedroom producers make these mistakes.
Thank you Reggie. Indeed, I guess many producers today were not around at the time when we had great dynamics in music productions. Myself I grew up in the 80s, so yeah, it was a different time.
The problem with loudness war is that you can't choose between dynamic range or more loudness, the decision was already taken by another person. I always prefer to turn the volune up when needed, that's why is always good to have a good headroom for your amplifiers play the loudest parts of the songs without clipping (but if the song is already clipped this wouldn't make much difference).
Excellent!
Thank you! :)
This is very informative! Good work!Remember that video you done where you sang, Can you feel it, Can you feel it, CAN YOU FEEL IT!!!! Classic
+TrojanThugMusic *High Five* for You! :)
Yes, I remember. Great song from one of the greatest artists we have had in this world imho :)
Super video!, just watched this and you got instant sub!
Thanks!
+Baajte I am glad you appreciated the video. Thanks for commenting. :)
You explained this very well!
Thanks, I appreciate your kind words. :)
Thanks Mike. Can you briefly comment on how we establish "no" sound in the digital realm? Is it -96db? Another level? What establishes this lower limit and why do we denote it as such?
+Greg Neumayer good question! To be honest I haven't reflected on this. All electronics have self noice so there will always be a noise floor that you will hear. But 96 dB is as good as completely silent.
1:41 Yeah, and sometimes, I don't know how and why that happens, my meter on a channel, with some reverb-plugin on, peaks at +100dB (probably fullscale or so) in Cubase :-D
Seems like I am able to fill up a glass with twice the amount of water and also heard the most awful and loudest noise I've ever heard in my life - without warning...
Sometimes life's strange and really unexpected :-D
Yea, right….you try convincing Nigel Tufnell.
Sure if you have a few odd loud spots that are mostly insignificant (a couple loud cymbal hits or drum beats) that are way louder than every other part of the song, it's not the end of the world to clip them a little. That's an acceptable amount of clipping, especially when putting it on an analogue medium with floor noise. When you see brickwalling throughout significant portions of a song it's just stupid, and this is normal now. Strangely enough it's done more now when we're in the digital age when we don't even have to worry about floor noise anymore. For example I have an older version of Jeff Wayne's War of The Worlds with no clipping, and compared it to the trash that's on Spotify, and it's gut wrenching. The accuracy is just gone, if you sync them up and level their volumes to compare side by side, it's a huge downgrade. The cymbals at the beginning in "Eve of War" are just muddied into nothing. And unfortunately this compressed version is the one floating around everywhere that most people will hear. Many such cases. This needs to stop.
I used to era music with CD player and analog stereo integrated amplifier. At that time I have found the CDs sound great compared with vinyl LP. I think that was because of the bigger dynamic range of the CD recording. Also the loudness control of the integrated amplifier gave a great “feeling to the music. Some year ago I bought a Denon AVR 1611 5.1 channels. I have noted that in this equipment the dynamic Eq. Is replacing the function of loudness, that use to compensate the way the human ear perception of low frequencies at lower volumes. Having say that, I have noted that the way a CD sounds in the 5.1 digital audio system (using PCM digital audio signal) seems to be lower quality compared with the way I felt it with the integrated amplifier. Nevertheless playing audio from Blu-ray Disc, let say a concert, it sound grate, with good dynamic range. I wander what is the reason why there is a big difference, at least in my perception, between a CD and Blueray disc in an actual digital audio AVR. I would like to ear about other opinions. Thanks
you're the best!
+Adam Lucas Glad you appreciated the video, thx for showing it. :)
+Adam Lucas Thank you for the kind words. :)
Very good explanation of the loudness war. With classical music, dynamic range is vital. If not properly recorded, it would be horrible to listen to.
If i want my music louder i will turn my god damn volume up. Compression is CANCER.
Seems to be an inaccuracy here:
194 dB is the maximum undistorted sound pressure level that can be transmitted through sea-level atmosphere on Earth.
Where are your mixes?
Quality mix and mastering is not about how loud you can get a song. The game is all messed up nowadays. Of course you want loudness, but not compressed all to hell where you're loosing the beauty of the music.
and the hardest part to reach the desired loudness without torturing your song... I have sometimes war against my limiter.. I can not increase many dBs at once without "pumping"
+Network Unplugged True. But I am hoping for loudness normalization to some day solve the loudness war once and for all. :)
Prince William?
This whole system is badly set up. Why would anyone put 0 as max reference? it should start at 0 sound and go positive. There are more elements involved than just the computer. If you crank up the sound source to above line-level, you could over-saturate the upstream circuits even before it gets inputted to the computer. Every part that gets over-saturated adds/compounds to the distortion. The term "compression" is totally misused here. The volume does not get compressed. What gets compressed, is the size of the digital info of the sound-signal. All distortion/clipping is due to exceeding the electrical capacity of the hardware/circuits, which is therefore mis-coded into digital form. Distortion/clipping can also happen in analog parts of the recording/playback circuits. All parts of the whole system should be measured in the same way to avoid confusion or misuse. And usually that means starting with a minimum volume and not exceeding/over-saturating the limit of the most restrictive part of the whole system. It has much less to do with "compression" than it does with over-saturation. This whole explanation is more distorted than any sound-signal it's trying to correct.
/r/IAMNOTAROBOT
I LOVE THE LOUDNESS WAR !
I don't rock your friends. I've never even met them.
Could you please speak faster. Damn I had to play the video at 1.25x