Thank you for this video. As a caravan owner, with a caravan currently of 1300kg, I think electric is a long way from towing and will give real range anxiety. Will be sticking with diesel for a while yet I think.
Ioniq 5 is not a heavyweight tower, but can tow up to 1600kg braked. Rivian R1T or R1S can tow 4,800kg. Nope, they're not a long way from towing at all. Charging speed is also dropping - you can charge an Ioniq 5 at a hypercharger from 10%-80% in under 18 minutes.
@@HorribusAT the rivian was tow tested across the US by a rivian employee towing a classic Mustang, only managed 100 miles and took weeks to go coast to coast towing
I expect most trips with a caravan are going to be long oned. Try to imagine 400miles up the M6, stopping to charge up every 80miles.... 7hrs on the motorway, 3 hours charging. If you were punting this thing around the Scottish Highlands you'd also have hills to contend with, that would likely take the range down to 70miles. That would require a lot of planning. Best thing to do, leave the caravan at home!
Car weight would have a bigger impact to range during stop-start scenarios. The biggest issue with added weight is when moving up to speed from standstill. Since you started your test at a constant speed the weight would have minimal impact. I imagine over a long drive through traffic and motorway you would see a dramatic impact to range by having a large cargo load.
You are right, but maintaining highway speed is not efficient for EVs to begin with(kind of the worst way to use them). So I think it’s still a good test. I wonder tho, would the extra weight help the regen in city driving?
It's opposite, in the city EVs will have advantage, it's not about weight only it's about consumption vs power...... In gasoline it will burn alot of fuel to get moving, in EV the consumption is less to get it moving, hence EVs in City consumption same as highway driving...... Taking into account brake degeneration of course....
What people don’t seem to take into account is the fact that range anxiety sets in when there’s about 30 miles range left, if not before. It’s all very well saying a 230 mile range, but no one is going to run it down to that. They’ll always be desperate to charge when they’ve done 200 miles unless they are going home and can guarantee a charge within the remaining range.
At the very least, same principle apply: more power needed, fuel efficiency reduced, and less range. But due to fuel's higher energy density, the impact is not as much as EVs.
Edit: what I meant to say that ICE are more efficient a constant speed than in cities where they have to accelerate and brake. Compare to an EV which is more at ease in cities thanks to regen compare to high speed that’s all… I know electric motor are 3 time more efficient. I was comparing how each one was at ease in their situations I think the difference wouldn’t be as brutal given an ICE is more efficient at constant relatively high speed than an electric motor. But in cities with a caravan it would be brutal 😄 you would have to wonder why a caravan in a city in the first place first but yeah 😀
The difference will be smaller. Combustion engines have way bigger losses in general so this won't Effekt the range this much. For comparison my winter gasoline consumption is less than 10% more of the summer.
Being practical minded, this is the kind of video I like to watch. I'd really like to see a similar video comparing Tesla Model Y Long Range and perhaps several other similar EVs that offer the ability to tow.
I sincerely appreciate the tabulated results (where you asked us to pause the video). I'm a research scientist in a way, and that table was a piece of art if I say so myself. Glad someone is doing these tests, now I'm educated on the effects of variables on an EV. Thank you again, and have a wonderful day!
@@petergorton9848 just going to throw this out there, but miles are used more than km in native English speaking counties. And as this was an Englishman test, mph made more sense to more people.
I also really appreciate the test, but I felt one more thing could be testet. How about bikes on a rack behind the car? I fairly often drive and see people with bikes attached behind the car, so putting that into the mix would be nice to see.
Excellent review and shows the true impact on using the car in anything but perfect conditions. Living in the West Country and experiencing the summer caravan exodus every Saturday morning (as the sites require people to be off by midday) then there would be absolute chaos. Today it’s damn near impossible to stop at any services heading to the midlands before Bristol But in electric cars you would have to stop for a charge before Exeter! Oh and there are only a handful of charges in Devon and Cornwall altogether. Simply not viable
Cooling a car doesn't take very much energy, so summers are not much of an issue. And people keep saying things are not "viable" like this can't be solved. Obviously it can. More charging points and longer range cars designed for towing are already in the works. People sometimes act as when combustion engine cars arrived, there were petrol stations on every corner and roads everywhere. That simply wasn't the case. Early combustion engine cars had to buy petrol in a glass jar from their local pharmacy. The idea that every need and every problem will be solved upfront as EV's growth is starting to take off is obviously wildly unrealistic.
@@redbaron6805 my point is that the current practices followed by for example camp sites force this surge of traffic. Towing is recognised by all parties including the caravan club and AA to massively reduce the range too. Any holiday hot spot need to plan ahead be it the West Country or Lake District for example. Today there is no infrastructure to support the number of visitors we get every year and there are no visible plans for charging stations. I agree this are solvable but waiting until it’s an issue and then building will be too late and decimate the holiday industry in those regions. By planning ahead and getting the ev charging in place with rapid chargers will indeed resolve the issues but today those plans don’t exist and knowing how planning works in this country then we are cruising to disaster
@@antonycotterill3052 You may be correct, but in the USA camp sites usually come with 14-50 outlets that provide 240VAC at 50A. You can easily charge your EV at those over here. Not sure how this works in the UK. But cars for towing will be addressed eventually in time. The focus now is more on producing EV's for the mass market of people driving to work, school or the office. The larger vehicles that can tow are coming in the USA this year and next year, but their primary focus is on short range towing or work crews and similar work like construction. For the foreseeable future, towing will be done with existing cars or hybrids until batteries and technology catch up.
@@redbaron6805 "Early combustion engine cars had to buy petrol in a glass jar from their local pharmacy." I fail to see how a car (of any kind) can buy anything...
Just before New Year's Day, we drove a Tesla Model 3 from Calgary to Edmonton (Alberta, Canada) in -27 C weather with a wind chill of -37 C. The range was cut in less than half. Also charging at a Tesla Super Charger took over 45 minutes (as opposed to the estimated time of 30 minutes on the display/computer). So instead of over 300 km range (std battery), we got less than 150 km. The 300+ km trip took us more than 8 hours to complete with 3 charges to full and cost was about $33 in electricity. Our chase vehicle (Honda CRV) took $38 of regular fuel. Therefore, in very cold conditions like in the arctic and Canada, it is not very practical. BTW, we even turned the heat down and drove slower to save power but the range was still less than 1/2. We spoke with a brand new Tesla owner at a supercharger in Red Deer and he said around the town the range in this weather was about 55% of the indicated range. It is posted on my Facebook page on December 29 if you are interested in more details. Cheers.
The country with the highest uptake electric cars anywhere in the world is Norway - somehow they have made it work and the climate is probably similar to Canada
@@fcex558 Well Norway seems to be coping - they are a rich country and wouldn't go down a route that does not fundamentally work. Driving distances are shorter than Canada and the charing infrastructure is very advanced - with a high % of cheap renewable energy. As a rich country they can heavily subsidize the price of cars so they do not lead the world in expensive car ownership just EV ownership - 50% of all new cars sold are EVs with a goal of 100% by 2025.
THE RADICAL LEFT WONT LIKE THIS VERY LIGHT REVIEW IN REALLY HOW POOR EV CARS ARE , AND THAT A MORE DEEPER DIVE REVIEW THAT THERE MUCH WORSE , THAT FACT THEY TAKING HOURS TO DAYS TO CHARGE COMPARED TO 2 MINUTES REFUEL TIME WITH PETROL AND DIESEL WILL DRAMATICALLY SLOW YOUR LIFE DOWN AND ADD YEARS OF LOST TIME WAITING FOR CHARGING OVER A LIFE TIME , AND EVEN WORSE FAMILY EMERGENCY AMBULANCE CANT GET THERE FAST ENOUGH AND YOU HAVE NO RANGE TO GET TO NEAREST HOSPITAL YOU COULD COST YOUR DAUGHTER JUST BECAUSE YOU WANTED TO BE HIP AND OWN 1 AN EV WITHOUT DOING ANY LOGICAL RESEARCH INTO THE CONS OF OWNING 1 OF THESE AND THATS JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG !!!!
Oooo interesting experiment :D. Atm, not many EVs can really tow caravans, apart from cars like the Skoda, Tesla Model X, Polestar 2, Mercedes EQC and Audi E-Tron, which they can. On a separate note, 0:56 who knew Mat could fit in there? 😃😆👍
Been watching carwow every single day for 4 years now, went through good and bad in my life but Matt was always here to cheer me up no matter what, cant imagine my life without these videos anymore 👌👊👊
When you calculate the cost per mile for all those tests and do that with home charging and super charger rates while away from home the running costs are horrific!!! Not to mention how much coal was burned to produce all that electricity!! EV's have a way to go before they make any sense!! There is a very good argument that the best choice is still an efficient mild hybrid!
I do the maths, in my case my EV running costs are 4 times cheaper than my ex-gasoline car. But this depends your country and your usage of course. There is only 2 remaining coal power plants in mine and 56 nuclear reactors.
You can still try LPG which is available in many countries and costs half the price of petrol (0.72p in UK right now vs 1.65Ł for unleaded). Some producers sell cars with their own LPG instllations on board for few extra euros/pounds(Dacia does something like that). Efficient LPG car can be somewhere near of cost of EV with practicality of ICE car.
When you factor in a caravan can you imagine on a bank holiday at electric charging point . The bays we have now would need to be in the Truck and car and Caravan section . Otherwise , the People would need to uncouple the Caravan and then Charge then recouple and set off again . Someone setting off to do a journey from Watford to the lake district would need to do this twice , unless they did the journey like Stagecoaches did and make a couple of overnight stops on the way . Reallife range may be even worse as there may be road works traffic jams and other diversions . The practicality is not there . With that size caravan . Only retired Caravan users need apply .
I its totally ridiculous. If I was ro drive from Aberdeenshire to Dover to go away in the caravan 644miles I would take 3 days alone on charging time. 😆
@@alistairbrebner1998 You could have Parking lot Caravan Parks at the Chargers . I suspect if you were catching a boat from Dover then there would be fist fights at the chargers . I doubt the ferry companies would refund for the charger was broken and I am stuck in Sheffield . The more you think thing through the more ridiculous it is . I would love to see how much the charging costs go up and the road maintenance costs . All electric cars are heavier . And a consequence of electric cars fast acceleration , I predict that there will be an increase in Road accidents and incidents were cars trying to get to chargers are hit by others . The target of 2030 stopping the sale of ICE cars and the restrictions and incentive will cause us to go back to 1970s car ownership . And a big increase in Motorbikes .
@@lesleyriseam1282 …except that in central London now I see half the motorbike parking spaces being reallocated to e-scooter hire companies, so the motorbike option isn’t really there either, as it’s much harder to find a parking spot.
@@chrishb7074 They will push e mopeds . I live very rural so it will be very dangerous on e bikes . Big agricultural vehicles no lights , twisty roads . Lucky I am not starting out in my motoring life .
So a range of 30 miles on the way back from a cycling holiday with the caravan, if its raining? This is probably the most useful review of real world EV performance I’ve seen, thanks Matt it must have been a super boring day. Most reviewers seem to be hiding the truth about EV’s practicalities, not that I don’t think EV’s are perfect for many people, two car families and ultimately the future. I’ve an Ampera PHEV, does most daily driving in EV mode, think maybe something like the new Mercedes C class PHEV with 62 miles of pure EV range might be my next car.
Last year we got a 30kw Nissan Leaf from 2018. We it for everything. The wife's commute and day to day driving around the city and suburbs - school runs, shopping, trips to the park. We still have our 2017 Megane diesel estate but so far have only used it for family holidays and the odd weekend trip or family visits. Thought I'd use the Megane more but we're only using it a couple of times a year and I'm thinking of selling it and just renting when we need the extra range. Like how often do must people do 100 miles?
@@2157AF I think not most UK folk watch TFL because quite a few comments said “it was about time someone did this”…Or maybe they’re just not subbed…TFL did it recently to the rivian1 & Tundra.
Most of the EV "reviewers" the last decade+ have been influencers...which means 2 bit PR and advertisers....they either are hoping to be paid, or they were using glowing videos to get loaner cars to get views...or to get perks like Tesla points to obtain a free car.
Decent review. For the moment, towing our 2000kg caravan, I’ll be sticking with my Ford Ranger. 1500kg spare capacity and can be recharged to full on nearly every corner in 15mins. 😂 An important fact that was missing regarding charging an EV when towing. Charging bays are single car size. What do you do with the caravan when you are on a long trip.
Had a great laugh last night on a country trip. Watching ev owners settling in for their charge. A queue of deluded fellow ev owners waiting for their turn while we stopped at the servo, not for fuel but for coffee. We were only 160 km from sydney. We will do our 1200km round trip on the same tank of diesel we left home with, towing a small boat. Evs have a long way to go before they canbe any more than a short distance commuter. Your caravan point is hilarious.
I have an ID4 and the range numbers match pretty well with the real life numbers I'm getting. Worth mentioning that the range numbers also vary depending on weather as it'll go lower if it's cold outside. Also, after about a year of usage, I've seen my range reducing as well...
It's interesting how a lot of these suv evs fair when it comes to range, I was looking to swap the wife's car to one but their efficiency is still pretty poor went from Manchester to London and back in my m3 lr and managed 4.3 miles per kwh with fully loaded car 5 people and ac on, I do want to go back to legacy manufacturers but they're still a couple of years behind
@@aerox69x was that in the summer? My I.d3 will do that in the summer my 58kwh battery will get me 180 miles in the winter (until V3 software where I believe we will be back just over 200 miles). I swapped my 2019 plate LR AWD Model 3 for an ID3 I much prefer the VW. Yes it’s slower and the range isn’t as good but as a car it’s miles better.
@@scottwills4698 that was this weekend between 5 and 9 degrees (it's a fair bit better in the summer) I do like the id3 and think the space comfort and hatch suit family needs more. But the supercharger network for the tesla makes it much easier (until its opened up )
The thing that probably hit your "everything on" range was setting the A/C to max. I keep my A/C to 19/20°C, which is plenty warm enough - it's what my central heating at home is set to.
Another test you should try is stop start traffic jam simulation. I got stuck in a 2 hours jam on the M25 last night and there were several e-cars on the hard shoulder (luckily there a still are some places with a hard shoulder), with no lights, no hazards, nothing. And rescuing is far more effort than just finding a can of petrol
Yep, the equivalent of getting a can of petrol for an EV would be a portable generator, I imagine. But you'd need a decent generator and a couple hours of charging to charge the EV enough to make it to the next charging station. It would be quicker and easier to get a tow truck.
@@mikedoverskog But on cold or hot days the heating/aircon saps battery, and lighting does. Nobody plans to get stuck in a traffic jam so if you do get stuck when you are close to full discharge for a couple of hours, of slow shuffling forward, you are going to run out of juice
Hey Matt great review was chatting to my mum about taking a caravan from Birmingham to Cornwall and having to stop and charge it 3 times. She raised a good point, how are you going to park an suv hooked to a caravan and get to a charging point they are for cars only.
@@fingerintheair That statement is completely false. Using the A/C doesn't affect the range that much, maybe around 5% to 10% or so. It would absolutely not add 2 extra charging stops for any reason.
@@redbaron6805 Not necessarily. If your maximum range is already down to 100 miles on a full charge then aircon is knocking another maybe 5 miles off. I doubt you want to arrive at the charger with zero miles or stay for ages to get the last 5% of trickle charge so your 'effective' range is now around 80 miles. Chargers don't appear exactly every 80 miles so it could indeed add 1 or 2 more charges to some routes.
@@P-Bee You are a bit off for several reasons. Track driving EV's makes poor numbers for a simple reason, you are the only car on the track. In traffic, you would be quite surprised how much extra range traffic gets you as they break up the wind resistance. Also, on a normal highway, you don't just cruise flat out at 60Mph for the entire trip, and slowing down for traffic or congestion down to 50Mph or 40Mph at times makes the trip that much more efficient. There are many other factors involved of course also. If you were towing, you can find an EV with larger battery and better range. And in the USA, chargers are often spaced 50 miles apart or less. Not sure how that works out in the UK. We are also talking about the UK. I lived in Europe for 2 decades and never had a car with air conditioning. It isn't exactly Arizona over there, and the A/C isn't exactly working very hard to keep you cool.
@@redbaron6805 it depends where and when you go towing or whatever. ive almost never needed to slow down to that extent. also aircon isnt just for cooling, its also for drying air for demisting etc.
Good fun. My daughter just bought one of these and has problems on long journeys finding a) charging points, b) charging points in working condition (France), and c) charging points without a waiting time for someone to finish.
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Yes, other reviews will only tell you about official 300+ miles of range without even bothering to look at actual power consumption rate (which is not lying, in contrary to VW marketing team).
Mat, I feel like you missed out a critical step in this test. Me and my friends want to go on a skiing and camping holiday. 5 Blokes with a ski rack, towing a caravan. Also its dark and rainy so full lights and wipers on with some tunes going for the journey. Lets see what that puppy can do! FOR SCIENCE!
@@alllen2426 Don't know why this test wasn't done lol. I feel like carwow would end up in some legal battle for making a mockery of these electric motors.
Disagree. It's the worst of both worlds. With an EV and no gas engine, you eliminate over 2000 parts that need maintenance and can fail. A PHEV has all the complexity of a gas car plus the electronics, battery and motor of an EV. Plus you still have oil changes etc Pure EV is the way to go.
@blackvr4tt I agree that EV is the path forward but there's still progress needed on weight, capacity, charging times and infrastructure. Today (and for my profile), PHEV suits me better: EV for most of my commutes and ICE for longer trips. I do cross my fingers to go full electric in the near future though.
I think that there needs to be much more development before it would be realistic to switch from ICE to an EV vehicle, apart from the range, you also need to factor in the time it takes to recharge and also to find a vacant charging point, not to mention one that is both A/ compatible with the car system and B/ one that is actually working. With an ICE car, you can drive to the nearest garage and do a complete refuel to a full tank again and be back on the road in about 5 minutes all in, no contest as far as I'm concerned.
Agree. Also, electric cars lose charge even if parked, just like a phone loses some of the battery even if not in use. Also, if it's cold outside, the range is even worse. Let's say you're like my dad who has to drive 80 kilometers to work in another city. If it's a winter morning, you'd also likely have air con, heated seats and steering wheel enabled, which would also lower the range. In my opinion it's just too early to buy and electric car as a reliable replacement for an ICE car
Thanks, this was very informative. The only issue I have is with the "all systems on" test - it takes a lot more energy to reach a certain temperature than to maintain it. So, you had to first drive 10 laps and when reaching sauna temperatures, only then to reset and start the consumption test.
Good point. Also, who would ever put the temperature (and probably also the ventilation speed) to the maximum it can go. The test would be more realistic if it would be at max 21/22 degrees C and average fan setting.
@@HypnOlli There are many scenarios that could have been explored. But, keep in mind for heating, having 5 people in a car requires less heating than with 1 person, as each person emits body heat into the car and reduces air volume. Also, as noted, no one runs a car with the heat on max as it would be intolerable within minutes, hence that test is wildly unrealistic, running max cooling would be the same. No one is going to be driving a rolling refrigerator down the road while dressing up for the arctic inside.
@@redbaron6805 here in the cold northern hemisphere in winter (often around 4 months through November December January and February) I often put my car heat to max to clear the windows and keep myself warm
@@brianmclean8666 I think you are missing the point. You can put the heater on max to clear your windows and warm up the car, no one is disputing that. But that process lasts a few minutes. You can't take that energy number and then claim this is what the car is consuming for the next hours. Once your windows are clear and the car is warmed up, the car simply has to maintain the existing temperature. That means the heater will cycle on and off, using far less energy each hour than the surge needed to begin with. Also, many EV owners do this when the car is plugged in before they leave. The cars have a pre-conditioning time you can set, so you tell the car to start heating up and clearing the windows at 6:50 and the car will be warm and the windows clear by 7:00 when you are ready to leave. That way, there is zero impact on the cars range to heat up the car and it only has to maintain the temperature for your journey.
very interesting, thanks for spending the time. Even with your caveat at 19:30, I would still like to see this stacked against a similar ICE car (Kodiaq?), both in terms of loss of range & cost per mile with all the bits. We don't think about this stuff so much with dinosaur juice, do we? So it's good that EVs are making us think about how much we drive and how much fun we allow ourselves
Trailer aerodynamics are a major factor for efficiency even for fuel driven combos: My TDI Passat gets 47 mpg solo, my high-box trailer gets it down to 26... but when I had an old Westfalia lower profile, slightly aerodynamic trailer of the same size (weight and loading area), the combo got away with 40+ mpg. So mostly about wind resistance. Thanks for the interesting infos as always!
@@kissgergo5202 There are very few electric vans and trucks available, they are usually much heavier than a diesel version of the same vehicle, and don't have the range. For example, an e-sprinter van (Mercedes) has a WLTP of 82-95 miles (estimated real world range), BUT only has a load capacity of 731kg. Compared to my old 1999 Sprinter which did Manchester to London and back on a tank of diesel, still had fuel left, and had a carrying capacity of 1500kg.. OK, I know, more modern ones have a lower carrying capacity - and it depends on the size of the van, mine was a MWB high top, but it still shows the issues. Now, scale that up to 44t vehicles :o With my unit and 'skelly' (skeletal trailer), I had the capacity to carry just over 30t container, and my fuel range was around 700 miles. An electric HGV unit - let's take for example, a DAF FT electric (basically a 4x2 CF size unit), weighs in at 9,000kg and has a range of UPTO 137 miles.. So, your carrying capacity is lower, and your range is lower, and it's not like 'it's ok, driver needs a break' and you just nip into a services to fuel up, a 'quick charge' on the batteries is 75 mins - normally this is up to 80% charge.
Here's some real world figures from my 2.0 TdCi Mondeo. Steady 60mph gives 55-60 mpg with a range to empty of approx 550 miles. 70 mph gives 50mpg. Towing a two berth caravan between 55-60mph gives 29 - 33mpg at best, so about 50% of the best range figure which compares about equal to the test result on the EV at a little over 1mile/KWhr.
Have been considering an ev for my next car for a while now, but the more videos I watch of them and the cost of electricity going up by 54% I think I will be giving it a miss until I am forced to change.
Yep, electric cars are great for short journeys - the issue is charging the bloody things! Electric prices will only increase and fast chargers will cost a ridiculous amount as demand increases. Been looking at plug in hybrids but most of them are not great either. 20 odd miles of electric range in the real world. It would be enough for my commute though.
Wait until they introduce a per mile or km depending where you live tax to replace the money lost on fuel excise. In Australia, fuel tax is about a third the total cost per litre. So add that onto your electricity costs which will continue to skyrocket and then add the fact that evs are at least 50% more expensive than their ice equivalent…..
@@foxxster3565 These claims are obviously false. Fuel costs in Australia are $6.78 per gallon. Electricity prices are 25 cents to 40 cents per kWh. On a car with 26Mpg fuel economy the cost per mile is 26 cents per mile. Since EV's typically get 4 miles per kWh, the price per mile is 6 cents to 10 cents per mile. Elementary math would say that 6 to 10 is less than 26. Adding a few cents per mile tax on an EV still wouldn't change the math. In the USA they have done that already in some areas, but it maxes out at around USD 150 annually or around 1 cent per mile. Still doesn't change the math in favor of EV's.
@@redbaron6805 fuel excise is around 45 cents a litre or over $2 a gallon. Now add that to you equation. And given evs cost around 100% more than their equivalent ice vehicle you are not going to break even. Eg the Kona is from $28 aud for the petrol version. The electric version of exactly the same car is from $60k. You are NEVER going to recoup the $30k price difference. Apart from which there are an awful lot of people who simply cannot afford $60k for a small car, and obviously more for a decent size family vehicle.
@@foxxster3565 You are not going to add that to the equation as there is literally nowhere how this actually works. And EV's don't cost 100% more than ICE vehicles, that is utter baloney. Even current price premiums which are shrinking are 10% to 40%. A Hyundai Kona is around $23000 in the USA, the EV version is $34000. But after the $7500 for tax credit, the EV is $26500, a difference of 15%. So, you maybe looking at this from the perspective of the disastrous policies in Australia, but that is not how this works in the rest of the world.
The tests up to the caravan were very good and the test with the caravan cruising on level ground at a constant speed showed a drop in range that was shocking but just for fun, you should do the caravan test on the road where you'd be stopping and starting, and going up and down hills. Starting off and going uphill would really take it out of the battery. Yes, slowing down and running downhill puts some back but when the car is powering, it'd be sucking the battery dry.
How about producing caravans that compliment an electric car by having a battery bank onboard to attach to the car as part of the car's battery pack during towing. One thing is for sure you shouldnt run out of electicity for the caravan if you keep both car and van batteries fully charged.
Nice idea and there's also a reasonable bit of roof space on the caravan to allow for some erectable solar panels that can be optimally aligned once parked up. Charge the van battery and then you've got the option of dumping that into the car. That said, it would add a fair bit of cost and would probably cost far more than just paying for the extra public charging once in a while that would be needed.
Would appreciate Wh/km, too. I compiled a list from the video: Electrical systems off @ 96 km/h: 207 Wh/km Electrical systems off @ 112 km/h: 239 Wh/km Electrical systems on max. @ 112 km/h: 327 Wh/km +4 passengers, systems off @ 112 km/h: 248 Wh/km Ski rack @ 112 km/h: 296 Wh/km Roof box @ 112 km/h: 270 Wh/km Bike @ 112 km/h: 282 Wh/km Caravan @ 96 km/h: 478 Wh/km
im sure there are channels that use KMs that will supply this information. as the UK uses miles and KW/h for energy consumption, and its a UK based channel, that is what is used here. there are very few channels on youtube that convert to 'foreign' measurement units (as in ones not generally used in the home country)
@@petelattimer6808 The metric system is dominant in practically all countries, hence the additional five minutes required to translate the table are not a waste of time in my opinion. There is no harm in showing both units.
Can you imagine doing a trip in an EV with a caravan? You'd have to disconnect the caravan every 100mi (well less, realistically) to recharge the car. I have a Toyota LC200 with a 4.5lt twin turbo diesel. It does have an aftermarket 2nd fuel tank fitted, but towing my 1.7tonne camper I can easily go for 1400-1500km between fills. To pump the 275lt (theoretical capacity) takes about 6 minutes. It will be a long time before a car can do this, let alone a big 4wd with mud tyres, roof rack with a 270 degree awning and a bullbar running an EV system!
Would be amazingly interesting to make this test also with other EV´s. Especially with a Tesla. Maybe cut some test out for time puposes, but would be amazing to see differences at load.
Good review, I’ve been driving electric cars for just under 7 years. But I also have a diesel Motorhome. I’ve been brainstorming whether in the future I would go back to towing (with a Tesla model Y). Maybe! But Caravan technology has to change also. Good news is, there is some development ongoing (“towing assist”) which incorporates motors in the wheel hubs of caravans, (similar to E-bike technology, but on a bigger scale), which also by necessity incorporates batteries on board the caravan, effectively increasing your range, so that not all the load is concentrated on the towing vehicle. These can also act as “motor movers” when the caravan is unattached for pitching the van. It also does away with the need for gas bottles, (because all energy needs can be accommodated through an inverter from the caravan’s battery). The weight of batteries in the van is offset by not needing LPG cylinders or separate motor movers. Added benefit, is the van batteries can be trickle charged on site, from the electric hook up or solar. With regard to consulting the Caravan and Motorhome club, I’ll take that with a pinch of salt, they are far too backward thinking for my liking. The fact is we can’t keep burning fossil fuels, poisoning our children and creating global warming. I can totally understand the frustration over the lack of suitable chargepoints for towing vehicles. I made that point in a government study I was involved in 5 years ago. The other fact is that the UK government is so far behind Europe and other countries with it’s EV charger role out strategy, (it doesn’t really have a strategy, leaving it to the “market”, to the private sector is not good enough). There’s no wonder there is so much scepticism about EVs the UK.
Love the data screen at 19:22, thanks. It looks like drag is more important than weight (four blokes). I used to have a 66 reg Leaf, that got 4.4 miles/kwh in summer and 3.8 in winter, but that was all urban driving, again 15% loss due to systems on. Can you do the same test across lower speeds, I expect the lower speed (and lower drag) will make a massive difference.
2 года назад+1
Yes, drag is the killer. caravans roughly double the consumption for ICE vehicles, too, no matter the weight. I think we will need to keop our diesel Passat for quite some time to be able to do road trips with our caravan... But I so badly want to buy an EV! :)
At a steady speed, the extra weight just adds a little more rolling resistance to the tyres. If you're in a city, you need good regen otherwise you're wasting energy starting and stopping the movement of that extra mass.
I appears the 'controls' for the screen are all touch sensitive which may well be ok but it does mean you have to take your eyes off the road in order to see where the 'buttons' are located. It would be safer to have 'manual' buttons/controls which can be easily found by touch with a quick glance at the screen to check setting. Great review btw.
@@GoldenCroc the overall tire size is the same, look up plus one, or plus 2, tire rack has a good explanation. The penalty is from heavier total weight with large wheels, and more performance oriented tires.
@@allterrainrandy2587 Are you sure you arent thinking of the wheel size? Not rim size, but the entire wheel, as in a rim + tire combo. Because I have never really heard of a european manufacturer running anything else but very similar outer diameter wheels, no matter what spec/trim you buy. So to clarify, what you say in your last sentance is true, but the big thing in my mind is generally the tires are wider, as well as have a decreased sidewall with bigger rims, which means a stiffer sidewall and different tire construction that generally have a higher rolling resistance.
@@GoldenCroc the English language is a little confusing. Rim and wheel can mean the same thing, but rim+tire and wheel can also mean the same thing. I do mean the overall diameter is the same. I.E. a 245/45/19 and a 245/40/20 and a 245/35/21 are all the same overall diameter. The tire is generally a little wider and definitely higher rolling resistance. The bigger wheels are also much heavier with the same construction. The tire is also just as heavy.
One thing to consider about your setup vs the manufacturer claims of range is that you're going in a constant circle. This means you are constantly turning, and also that the effective weight is a little greater, both create extra friction.
We got caught out with our Tesla 3 when we first put a bike rack with 2 bikes on the towbar. A trip that would have got us home with plenty of juice left had us limping home at gradually reducing speeds ("slow down to 90Km/80km/70Kmper hour to reach your destination " ) and making it home with 1%. The extra wind resistance makes a huge difference to consumption at highway speeds. We love the car though, would never go back to ICE.
Brilliant video. Now can you repeat with the Skoda 2.0 TDI so show impact of attaching accesories to car has on its efficiency? Fossil cars still the way for towing unless you have $ for a Model X. Even then it doesnt have the range of an ICE car.
No such thing as a "fossil" car, you used the correct word near the end of your post; ICE. I believe using words invented as pejoratives is detrimental to progress. Just a bugbear.
We´ve got a 9 year old Skoda Superb Combi 2.0 TDI 4x4 with 170hp and a 6-speed manual. We were recently skiing and had an average consumption of 5.6l/100km on the 500km long journey with a fully occupied car fitted with a roof box.
Well done for a great review on an EV towing etc. I'm a caravan owner and currently would never consider an EV for towing at this time. Two considerations....One which you've pointed out is the rediculous range and Two the high price of EVs just to get a decent spec. But will done involving a caravan.
I have an Hyundai Kona Ultimate EV, £39k, via Motability. As at yesterday, since 14 June 2021, I've driven 615 miles. SIX HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN MILES! You read it right. Why so few? Well, I'm chronically disabled and don't go out much but the main reason is range. I wasn't told how badly cold weather affected the range, nor how few 50kwh chargers there are near me, nor was I told that, and I'll be very specific here, when the car showed I had14 miles range left, and I wanted to go 0.6 mile to a restaurant, to celebrate my daughter's 26th birthday, it would tun out of juice. That did it for me. I'm returning it to Motability next Friday and buying a used Peugeot 3008, 2013, hybrid. Half the price oer month. I've also insured the Peugeot via RAC PAYD (Pay As You Drive) and based on 4000 miles a year, for less that £50 a month. £29.01 for when it's parked and 6.2 pence per mile. If I drive more than 4k miles, I'm charged more 6.2 pences. Similarly, if I drive fewer miles, my monthly mileage charge is reduced accordingly. It's a win-win for me and I'm hoping I'll be going mire places too, now I'll be rid of the ever present range anxiety!!
It's great to have a test which shows the problems with the official economy figures for EVs. Internal combustion engine cars are at their best in these sorts of conditions, and I bet you'd easily do much better than official MPG figures at constant 60 and 70 (at least until you start adding aerodynamic blockers like things on the roof rack or that caravan). On the other hand, ICE cars are at their worst in stop-start conditions, which I imagine is precisely why official economy tests try to replicate those conditions and don't measure constant speed figures any more (go back enough years and they did this). However electric cars are the other way round - they're good in stop-start traffic because of regen, but this means the official economy figures flatter them compared to long distance driving, where the official range figures for EVs look much too optimistic. Which is rather unhelpful, because long journeys with lots of time at a constant 70 are exactly the time those range figures become most important for most people (except perhaps people like taxi drivers and delivery drivers who clock up many miles in stop-start conditions and/or short journeys).
"Internal combustion engine cars are at their best in these sorts of conditions", that statement makes very little sense. Wind resistance is wind resistance, EV's are more aerodynamic than combustion engine cars. Hence, there is no scenario where combustion engine cars would somehow magically do better than more efficient EV's at speed. Tests with EV's have confirmed many times their highway range with cars like the Tesla Model 3 and others. Ultimately, driving non stop hundreds of miles doesn't reflect real world conditions. I drive tens of thousands of miles, and every rest area I pass is packed with people taking a break, getting food and using the restrooms. And almost all of those people are driving combustion engine cars.
Not full electric my partner is thinking about the RAV4 plug in hybrid as his brother has one and never uses fuel, for me full electric makes no sense,and with to massive electric price rises totalling 80% I believe , I must say your wonderful review saved a elderly couple who were just about to purchase an electric car to tow their caravan, otherwise their retirement dream of long distance traveling towing their caravan would have been a nightmare Big Thanks on their behalf for saving their dream
Great review. People worry about range and most EVs promote the ideal range. It is good to see what they do in more realistic conditions. We need more of these. I would like to see a similar test done at low speeds with some start/stop and hill climbing/descending would be good a well. I take lots of holidays in areas with lots of ups and down. It would also be nice to see comparisons to a somewhat comparable ICE car. That should keep you busy for a few months :)
What will be interesting is to repeat these tests in the future with a 10 year old EV. An ICE vehicle with 150,000 Km on the clock at 10 years would still be near it's new performance.
@@marcellogenesi6390 Well, a thief stealing someone's caravan from their house in the dead of night would appreciate a nice quiet electric car as the perfect getaway vehicle.
batteries lose power when they discharge. Their output voltage goes down. The whole test is bananas. Your 25% charge battery will provide much less power than a full charge one. There's already a noticeable drop between 100% and 80% charge.
Pulling a heavy caravan with our Insignia 2.0CDTI 160, we used to get fuel consumption of around 30mpg, compared with around 50 without it (on a long run). So, efficiency does not drop to the same extent with a diesel engine as it does with the electric Skoda Enyaq, even taking into account that our caravan weighed around 1600kg.
Does the state of charge of the battery affect the efficiency of the battery and/or motor? Should all of these tests have been conducted on a fully charged battery?
They recommend using slow charging where possible. The majority of people will probably charge slowly and home and only fast charge on the odd longer drive.
They only wear out slightly faster. Teslas with over 300k miles that only Supercharged showed only a bit higher degradation. But most ppl charge at level 2 a majority of the time so it's a non issue for most ppl.
Whilst I can't comment on the battery chemistry in the Enyaq, I drove a Gen 1 30kWh Nissan Leaf for 2 years / 25,000m. I used my 7kW home charger for probably 99% of my charging. However, I needed to do one particular longer journey which required me to rapid charge 3 times on that day at 50kW each time. The battery State of Health percentage INCREASED after my journey...! Plus, there are significant numbers of 100,000+ mile Leaf (taxis) which are showing exceptional battery health - the common factor being that they are rapid charged 2-3 times daily. Conversely, there are 20,000 mile models that have lost 2 or 3 battery 'bars'.
@@jonathantaylor1998 Gen 1 Leaf is old tech because the battery did not have a thermal management system to regulate the battery temp. Almost all new EVs have this system which greatly extends battery life, especially in very hot climates which are the hardest on batteries.
Hi, We have a Kia Niro EV and have clocked up just on 50,000km in 2 1/2 years. Kia claim 455 km range for this model (62kwh battery). According to it's predicted range meter (which seems remarkably accurate) I usually show about 480km, and my wife has had it up to 515! But she doesn't enjoy that 200 hp as much as I do! We don't usually carry a lot of load. Most of the places we normally travel to we can get there and back on a single charge. We usually charge at home from our solar panels, at NO cost. We have topped it up at a public charge station just 14 times since we have had it. Kia have no recommended towing spex; I think I might instal a tow-bar so that I can carry moderate loads on my household trailer; an all-up load less than carrying a car full of All Blacks! (We live in NZ). But presently don't want to invalidate it's 3 year warranty. Any car that has good aerodynamics will really up it's fuel use given the changes shown, so the extra battery used is not surprising. If it has poor aerodynamics, it will scoff fuel all the time! Readers please remember that we are going to EV's to reduce climate change; ICE's have to go, sorry. But then we would not go back to petrol even if climate change was not a problem.
Of course they do. Diesel or electric, they are on the same WLTP test cycle. It doesn't matter if you put that carvan on an EV or a Diesel, the range reduction will be exactly the same on the motorway, while you will have more range in town on the EV as it can break regeneratively. But wtf does this have to do with dieselgate?
@@jojodroid31 So u mean you have half the range if you put on all systems in a diesel vehicle? Please explain 👍 The diesel gate (short version) was about VW claimed a different consumption than real life. I think that, this video shows that. Maybe it’s far-fetched for some 👍
@@Tomas-tx6lq Diesel gate was VW faking emmision tests so that diesels looks cleaner than they actually are, but hey, you do believe whatever you want.
Great informative video as always, thanks Matt. I would not buy an EV because: 1: It is too expensive 2: I live in south London with no off-road parking, so not possible to charge at home, or anywhere nearby. 3: My elderly mother lives in Southampton and I could not do the return journey on a full charge, my current petrol Peugeot 2008 will go there and back more than twice 4: I don't believe the environmental benefits; they may put out little CO2 etc at the point of use but the electricity still has to be produced and distributed 5: I believe the environmental damage caused mining the Lithium and other elements needed for the batteries is catastrophic, plus the problems of recycling. 6: The actual life of the battery and cost of replacement could mean these cars are practically a write-off before 10 years or 100,000 miles, requiring the manufacture of new vehicles. 7: I think the 'green' argument is being pushed for political reasons with no thought of the practicalities for ordinary people, and if all cars suddenly went electric we would need a few more nuclear power station as the massive drain on the power grid each evening would be astronomic.
ICE cars pollute way more than per specification in real world scenario. "Mining" for petrol is waaaaayy worse than mining for lithium which is a very small % of the battery. Petrol needs to be distributed, electricity mostly travel on existing infrastructure. Producing electricity with coal is still way cleaner than ICE. Even then electricity production should be cleaned up. The problem of producing electricity are businesses and data centers during day/ peak time. Charging a car at night is virtually free. Batteries will do 100k m happily, my leaf has 70k m already and its 3yo with retention of 90% of the battery. Battery replacement are becoming cheaper and cheaper to the point that you just need to replace the battery and not the car after 10 years if at all.
@@allfredcg When a petrol car is no longer serviceable, you can drain the fluids and you essentially have scrap metal. When an EV car is not serviceable, you essentially have a ton of hazardous material.
@@Josh-kp8si so what do u use in your laptop or your phone? It feels like most ppl are looking for an excuse for progression. Rechargeable batteries are everywhere, embrace and make sure they are good quality so that their life span is great. Ev are still in the steam engine phase, so expect major improvement in battery chemistry, maybe we will get this solid state batteries made of salt and graphite so you stop complaining about hazardous materials. If you are concerned about hazardous materials think about oil spillage from oil tankers, transmissions and gear fluid, engine oil and engine cleaning solutions, without considering air pollution an ice vehicle produce. If you are concerned about batteries, stop using single use batteries for your tech stuff like headphones, keyboard, mouse, kids toys, cameras and what not and use rechargeable batteries. Think of non rechargeable batteries waste over the course of 10 years of these devices. BTW car batteries after EV use are still good to be used in areas where space isn't a big concern like storage unit. Many car batteries are resold for other purpose.
@@allfredcg yeah, but one car is like few hundred kilograms of batteries. In just UK alone there is about 32 mil cars on the road and about 4 mil of LGV and 0.5 mil HGV, that means a lot of batteries needed to replace cars in just one country.
I like this because he gave distance in miles rather than kilometers. Britain needs more guys like this guy!!! Now all you need to do is dump that ridiculous currency of yours and switch over to the easy and superior decimal-based currency system like the U.S.. The Dollar is the basic currency. Pennys (1 cent), is 1/100th/0.01 of the basic currency. The Nickel (5 cents), is 1/50th/0.05 of the basic currency Dimes (10 cents), is 1/10th/0.1 of the basic currency. The Quarter (25 cents), is 1/4th/0.25 of the basic currency. The Half-dollar (50 cents) is 1/2/0.5 of the basic currency. Easy!!! You don't need to give out tourist guilds to understand the U.S. currency system. When you have joined the rest of the world with an intelligent decimal-based currency, we can finally get you all to start driving on the right side of the road at last.
Great info. Really shows where electric cars need some improving. going 100km/hr and only getting 370 km of range is quite low compared to a gas car. Which is really the reason I couldnt warrant a EV car yet. Makes sense for a strictly city car, but getting out of the city and driving places >200k away just doesnt work well.
It's not just the range, but the length of time required to recharge plus the nagging feeling that after a few years you'll need a new battery, at great expense.
@@czmitche OK, but when you sell after five years, what will the car be worth? I'd still be worried if I was the buyer, that the battery might fail just outside warranty, and that would make me think twice about paying big money for the car.
@@ParaBellum2024 Except that claim has already been proven to be fiction. A 4 year old Tesla Model 3 after 100,000 miles of driving had lost 2.2% of its battery capacity. The idea that EV's will require battery replacements is proven more and more to be fiction. There is a reason most EV's come with a 8 year battery warranty. The batteries will easily last 15 to 20 years or more.
Thank you CARWOW to emphasize the real problems of electric cars!!!! I really can't understand why car makers persist to say that Electric cars are more efficient than ICE cars...maybe in a laboratory an electric motor is more efficient than a diesel one but as soon as other factors come into play such as speed, weight, aerodynamic, the electric is just very bad.
You are not understaning the results properly. It just because electric cars are so effective that there is a a big loss of range with added drag. A petrol car burns more than half of its energy straight into heat and that means added drag of a caravan will be noticed less.
@@erikmolander lol…. EVs have to use way more aluminum and other composite materials which are even worse to the environment to squize the latest mile possible. Aluminum is an abundant element but an energy guzzler to produce. Same goes with the rare earths….. and guess what? They use oil to make those EVs.
@@carholic-sz3qv You are really making no sense at all. The video is about how range is affected with added drag/weight. Not about materials used to build the car. An EV converts around 90% of the stored energy in the battery to usable torque. A petrol car will almost never even reach 40% efficency. If you double the drag of the vehicle it will affect the range of the more efficent vehocle a lot more since it does not have a lot of spare energy that goes to waste. Energy used to make the vehicles is another topic. I drive a diesel for the amazing range by the way. But its less iffeicent than an EV. That is just simple math and not a discussion =D
When towing a caravan you will need to consider whether you can access a charging station with the caravan attached, or will you need to unhitch & park the caravan somewhere else. Of course you will also need to find a charger in less than 100 miles on your 400+ mile trip on holiday, & of course that was a very small & light caravan, no car lights on & no passengers & no luggage!
What this shows is just how inefficient a Skoda EV is. It would be interesting to see the results from an efficient EV say an E Niro or Tesla Model 3 (or Y). I think my E Niro is very efficient.
Can you please do a combined test. Caravan full of supplies, bikes on the roof, luggage in the boot wife in passenger seat and 2 kids in the back. Just like your setting off on holidays. I bet the range would be near single figures. 😆🤣
Brilliant review that just highlights everything I ever thought about these stress boxes. Hell would have to freeze over before I buy one and even then I wouldnt because I'd worry about using the heater !
I've had two EVs and am getting rid of the second one next week and going back to combustion. You're right, they're just a stress if you actually need to use them to travel places. Public charging points are also so expensive that per kw/mile they work out about the same as an efficient petrol hatchback in fuel costs. Things have gotten better over the 4 years I've had EVs, but the real underlying problems are related to the concept itself and infrastructure. So I think are decades away from being sorted... if at all. I have friends with Teslas and I'm convinced that they have forced themselves to love them because EVs are such a huge investment.
@@BoxFlyHaydn This. People have convinced themsleves that they are 'doing their bit for the planet' without looking at everything that is involved in the whole process. EVs are an utter joke and always will be. I once saw Elon Musk described as a man who takes existing technology and makes it worse and nothing I've ever seen about anything he is doing will change my mind. With the possible exception of SpaceX
The way the tests were carried out showed the mileage figures in a much better than real world scenario as the car was travelling at a constant speed and not having to brake or accelerate at all. This shows how limited EV vehicles actually are as regards to running out of charge, this was also shown in your test with small EV cars although even then you were driving on motorways and not really driving much around town, stopping, accelerating etc. If you add in all the emissions produced in sourcing the metals and then manufacturing the batteries, manufacturing the chargers, running far more power stations to cope with the extra demand on electricity then EV's are not really that green at all!
I have an ev. Hyundai kona ultimate. Love it, wouldn’t go back. Haven’t noticed the cost on my electric bill. I don’t do a lot of miles but mostly stop start short trips round town, with the odd long trip in summer. I can leave the ac on for the dog in summer when the car is unattended. I will never go back to an ice.
Very nice and informative review! Would be nice to also see a review with a bit more realistic driving tho, meaning one that would include these tests while combining both road and city driving. I think majority of people use their cars in various environments, so that would make the test vid even more useful.
most people would be loaded up with caravan, roof box etc to get to their holiday destination, so this would be fairly realistic. if using in mixed environments its unlikely you would have the caravan on, so range is less of an issue (but still an issue)
Approx 230 mile range from a 77kWh battery. At current energy prices of approx 33p/kWh it would cost about £25 for a full charge. £25 to travel 230 miles is equivalent to averaging 50mpg in a petrol/diesel car at current fuel prices. Using the 141 mile range with everything switched on, it's cheaper per mile to drive a petrol/diesel car as that is the equivalent of avergaing 35mpg which think most cars could do at 70mph.
Great video lots if very good information but we all know no one drives at 70 or 60 all the time on a motorway we sometime drive at 70 sometimes even 50 or sometimes ur stuck in traffic not moveing but yes we do need better range in ev cars we also need more charging points
@@jojodroid31 yes but not this much. If you compare the heating. This is only waste from the engine. On an ev the additional things are earlier visible. People even notice different rims tires or a wet road when they are driving. This constant driving consumption is for me 1000x better than these average things. Years years ago they mentioned this in car prospects. Constant consumption in different speeds.
I disagree. It depends on the vehicle and what you are towing. My f150 EcoBoost will do around 13 L/100 kms empty on the hiway. When I pull my camper it will go to around 22-25L/100kms if there is any headwind at all It will push up over 30L / 100kms. My ecodeisel would do slightly better running about 11L/100kms empty and around 18-22L/100kms towing my camper. My F450 deisel will get about 1100kms to a tank when empty and as low at 400kms when towing my big trailer but that trailer weighs 35,000lbs. So in my experience towing will cut your ice vehicle down In half on range as well but granted it would not be as bad if you were just pulling a small camper or something like that.
The amount of energy needed to tow the caravan is same no matter what car you drive. Internal combustion engine are very inefficient and that’s why your consumption doesn’t go up as much. Most of your fuel is transferred to heat instead of moving the car.
Very nice video, I second the comment on the buggy infotainment system. I have an octavia RS iV (bought new, not second hand) and within the first year I had to bring it back 5 times!! The software is soooooo crap it is unbelievable. They had to replace the steering wheel with all electrical components, a boardcomputer in the trunk and a completely new software pack. Now that I have seen the same thing happen here I highly recommend staying away from Skoda until these things are fixed.
Would you ever buy an electric car?
Second
No
Yes. A Tesla roadster
Yes
As a second car probably
Best review ever. Cant get more precise, comprehensive, or understandable than this. Thank u carwow.
You watched a 21 min video in 5 min? Impressive!
@@nilo-visuals He literally told as every thing he was going to do🤦🏼♀️
Told us*
@@adityavishwanath1676 so you can rate an entire video by just the introduction?
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No matter how bad my day is, watching Matt doing his silly things, make me smile every time 😂
Mm... I don't think this is silly.
@@kunjupulla Not a silly as the usual, pointless drag races, in fact. ;-)
@@real2gone Yup 👍
Thank you for this video. As a caravan owner, with a caravan currently of 1300kg, I think electric is a long way from towing and will give real range anxiety. Will be sticking with diesel for a while yet I think.
The new Volvo XC40 Recharged is able to pull up to 1500 kg, so progress is being made at least :)
Ioniq 5 is not a heavyweight tower, but can tow up to 1600kg braked. Rivian R1T or R1S can tow 4,800kg. Nope, they're not a long way from towing at all. Charging speed is also dropping - you can charge an Ioniq 5 at a hypercharger from 10%-80% in under 18 minutes.
@@HorribusAT the rivian was tow tested across the US by a rivian employee towing a classic Mustang, only managed 100 miles and took weeks to go coast to coast towing
EVs will never be able to tow without losing loads of range..
I expect most trips with a caravan are going to be long oned. Try to imagine 400miles up the M6, stopping to charge up every 80miles.... 7hrs on the motorway, 3 hours charging. If you were punting this thing around the Scottish Highlands you'd also have hills to contend with, that would likely take the range down to 70miles. That would require a lot of planning. Best thing to do, leave the caravan at home!
Car weight would have a bigger impact to range during stop-start scenarios. The biggest issue with added weight is when moving up to speed from standstill. Since you started your test at a constant speed the weight would have minimal impact. I imagine over a long drive through traffic and motorway you would see a dramatic impact to range by having a large cargo load.
You are right, but maintaining highway speed is not efficient for EVs to begin with(kind of the worst way to use them). So I think it’s still a good test. I wonder tho, would the extra weight help the regen in city driving?
It's opposite, in the city EVs will have advantage, it's not about weight only it's about consumption vs power...... In gasoline it will burn alot of fuel to get moving, in EV the consumption is less to get it moving, hence EVs in City consumption same as highway driving...... Taking into account brake degeneration of course....
But you could also regenerate more energy, thats a big plus point for EVs. I know its not a 100 percent efficient but still...
@@Axter6 sorta but it's also gonna consume way more energy to get moving so you'd still lose a ton of range
But you're usually only concerned about range on long drives.
I would like to see the least range you can manage by combining lots of the disadvantages.
It’s the same conditions that would make gas cars use more gas. Weight, hills, road conditions, speed…
@@aussie2uGA Yes but the effect seems to be greater in the EV? Would you use more than twice as much petrol if you tow a caravan?
0.2 🤣
@@aussie2uGA yes, but you can refill full tank in 5 min... Witht EV its 60 min driving, 40 min charging. Its sad.
About 40 miles🥵
What people don’t seem to take into account is the fact that range anxiety sets in when there’s about 30 miles range left, if not before. It’s all very well saying a 230 mile range, but no one is going to run it down to that. They’ll always be desperate to charge when they’ve done 200 miles unless they are going home and can guarantee a charge within the remaining range.
Can you do this comparison with a combustion engine? I'm curious to know if it makes such a difference as it does with the EV.
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@Damar Fadlan Just report them.
At the very least, same principle apply: more power needed, fuel efficiency reduced, and less range. But due to fuel's higher energy density, the impact is not as much as EVs.
Edit: what I meant to say that ICE are more efficient a constant speed than in cities where they have to accelerate and brake. Compare to an EV which is more at ease in cities thanks to regen compare to high speed that’s all…
I know electric motor are 3 time more efficient. I was comparing how each one was at ease in their situations
I think the difference wouldn’t be as brutal given an ICE is more efficient at constant relatively high speed than an electric motor.
But in cities with a caravan it would be brutal 😄 you would have to wonder why a caravan in a city in the first place first but yeah 😀
Not that much a difference because it's much less efficient with energy (a bit counterintuitive I know).
This is a great video idea! Would like to see this done with more cars to see which electric car is the best at towing
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The difference will be smaller. Combustion engines have way bigger losses in general so this won't Effekt the range this much.
For comparison my winter gasoline consumption is less than 10% more of the summer.
It may be the model X against the BMW IX towing duel!
@@Nordlicht05 now there is another bot with Coca Cola can.
Jeez, how many bots are there on youtube nowadays. Absolutely mental
Being practical minded, this is the kind of video I like to watch. I'd really like to see a similar video comparing Tesla Model Y Long Range and perhaps several other similar EVs that offer the ability to tow.
I sincerely appreciate the tabulated results (where you asked us to pause the video). I'm a research scientist in a way, and that table was a piece of art if I say so myself. Glad someone is doing these tests, now I'm educated on the effects of variables on an EV. Thank you again, and have a wonderful day!
Agree. If only it was in real world (ISO) units! Interesting to use Kilograms, but prehistoric 'miles'.
@@petergorton9848 just going to throw this out there, but miles are used more than km in native English speaking counties. And as this was an Englishman test, mph made more sense to more people.
I also really appreciate the test, but I felt one more thing could be testet. How about bikes on a rack behind the car? I fairly often drive and see people with bikes attached behind the car, so putting that into the mix would be nice to see.
Excellent review and shows the true impact on using the car in anything but perfect conditions. Living in the West Country and experiencing the summer caravan exodus every Saturday morning (as the sites require people to be off by midday) then there would be absolute chaos. Today it’s damn near impossible to stop at any services heading to the midlands before Bristol But in electric cars you would have to stop for a charge before Exeter! Oh and there are only a handful of charges in Devon and Cornwall altogether. Simply not viable
Cooling a car doesn't take very much energy, so summers are not much of an issue. And people keep saying things are not "viable" like this can't be solved. Obviously it can. More charging points and longer range cars designed for towing are already in the works.
People sometimes act as when combustion engine cars arrived, there were petrol stations on every corner and roads everywhere. That simply wasn't the case. Early combustion engine cars had to buy petrol in a glass jar from their local pharmacy.
The idea that every need and every problem will be solved upfront as EV's growth is starting to take off is obviously wildly unrealistic.
@@redbaron6805 my point is that the current practices followed by for example camp sites force this surge of traffic. Towing is recognised by all parties including the caravan club and AA to massively reduce the range too. Any holiday hot spot need to plan ahead be it the West Country or Lake District for example. Today there is no infrastructure to support the number of visitors we get every year and there are no visible plans for charging stations. I agree this are solvable but waiting until it’s an issue and then building will be too late and decimate the holiday industry in those regions. By planning ahead and getting the ev charging in place with rapid chargers will indeed resolve the issues but today those plans don’t exist and knowing how planning works in this country then we are cruising to disaster
@@antonycotterill3052 You may be correct, but in the USA camp sites usually come with 14-50 outlets that provide 240VAC at 50A. You can easily charge your EV at those over here.
Not sure how this works in the UK. But cars for towing will be addressed eventually in time. The focus now is more on producing EV's for the mass market of people driving to work, school or the office. The larger vehicles that can tow are coming in the USA this year and next year, but their primary focus is on short range towing or work crews and similar work like construction.
For the foreseeable future, towing will be done with existing cars or hybrids until batteries and technology catch up.
@@redbaron6805 "Early combustion engine cars had to buy petrol in a glass jar from their local pharmacy."
I fail to see how a car (of any kind) can buy anything...
@@knrdvmmlbkkn Yawn... Is that really the best you can do...?
Just before New Year's Day, we drove a Tesla Model 3 from Calgary to Edmonton (Alberta, Canada) in -27 C weather with a wind chill of -37 C. The range was cut in less than half. Also charging at a Tesla Super Charger took over 45 minutes (as opposed to the estimated time of 30 minutes on the display/computer). So instead of over 300 km range (std battery), we got less than 150 km. The 300+ km trip took us more than 8 hours to complete with 3 charges to full and cost was about $33 in electricity. Our chase vehicle (Honda CRV) took $38 of regular fuel. Therefore, in very cold conditions like in the arctic and Canada, it is not very practical. BTW, we even turned the heat down and drove slower to save power but the range was still less than 1/2. We spoke with a brand new Tesla owner at a supercharger in Red Deer and he said around the town the range in this weather was about 55% of the indicated range. It is posted on my Facebook page on December 29 if you are interested in more details. Cheers.
The country with the highest uptake electric cars anywhere in the world is Norway - somehow they have made it work and the climate is probably similar to Canada
@@fcex558 Well Norway seems to be coping - they are a rich country and wouldn't go down a route that does not fundamentally work. Driving distances are shorter than Canada and the charing infrastructure is very advanced - with a high % of cheap renewable energy. As a rich country they can heavily subsidize the price of cars so they do not lead the world in expensive car ownership just EV ownership - 50% of all new cars sold are EVs with a goal of 100% by 2025.
@@fcex558 do u know why countries are pushing to EV in the first place lol?
@@czmitche IT AINT HAPPENING EVS BIGGEST HYPE AND DISSAPOINTMENT IN MOTORING HISTORY ITS A REGRESSION TECHNOLOGY
THE RADICAL LEFT WONT LIKE THIS VERY LIGHT REVIEW IN REALLY HOW POOR EV CARS ARE , AND THAT A MORE DEEPER DIVE REVIEW THAT THERE MUCH WORSE , THAT FACT THEY TAKING HOURS TO DAYS TO CHARGE COMPARED TO 2 MINUTES REFUEL TIME WITH PETROL AND DIESEL WILL DRAMATICALLY SLOW YOUR LIFE DOWN AND ADD YEARS OF LOST TIME WAITING FOR CHARGING OVER A LIFE TIME , AND EVEN WORSE FAMILY EMERGENCY AMBULANCE CANT GET THERE FAST ENOUGH AND YOU HAVE NO RANGE TO GET TO NEAREST HOSPITAL YOU COULD COST YOUR DAUGHTER JUST BECAUSE YOU WANTED TO BE HIP AND OWN 1 AN EV WITHOUT DOING ANY LOGICAL RESEARCH INTO THE CONS OF OWNING 1 OF THESE AND THATS JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG !!!!
Oooo interesting experiment :D. Atm, not many EVs can really tow caravans, apart from cars like the Skoda, Tesla Model X, Polestar 2, Mercedes EQC and Audi E-Tron, which they can. On a separate note, 0:56 who knew Mat could fit in there? 😃😆👍
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
Kia and Hyudai new ones all have towbar as option, usually to 1600kg max though.
@Czarodziej just gone bot. You got the wrong page.
Been watching carwow every single day for 4 years now, went through good and bad in my life but Matt was always here to cheer me up no matter what, cant imagine my life without these videos anymore 👌👊👊
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html.
Hi Arturas.
When you calculate the cost per mile for all those tests and do that with home charging and super charger rates while away from home the running costs are horrific!!! Not to mention how much coal was burned to produce all that electricity!!
EV's have a way to go before they make any sense!! There is a very good argument that the best choice is still an efficient mild hybrid!
And you probably haven't even factored the rising energy costs! I totally agree with you!
I do the maths, in my case my EV running costs are 4 times cheaper than my ex-gasoline car.
But this depends your country and your usage of course.
There is only 2 remaining coal power plants in mine and 56 nuclear reactors.
you are right sir . welcome to 2011.
You can still try LPG which is available in many countries and costs half the price of petrol (0.72p in UK right now vs 1.65Ł for unleaded). Some producers sell cars with their own LPG instllations on board for few extra euros/pounds(Dacia does something like that). Efficient LPG car can be somewhere near of cost of EV with practicality of ICE car.
When you factor in a caravan can you imagine on a bank holiday at electric charging point .
The bays we have now would need to be in the Truck and car and Caravan section .
Otherwise , the People would need to uncouple the Caravan and
then Charge then recouple and set off again .
Someone setting off to do a journey from Watford to the lake district would
need to do this twice , unless they did the journey like Stagecoaches did and make a couple of overnight stops on the way .
Reallife range may be even worse as there may be road works traffic jams and other diversions .
The practicality is not there . With that size caravan . Only retired Caravan users need apply .
I its totally ridiculous. If I was ro drive from Aberdeenshire to Dover to go away in the caravan 644miles I would take 3 days alone on charging time. 😆
@@alistairbrebner1998
You could have Parking lot Caravan Parks at the Chargers .
I suspect if you were catching a boat from Dover then there would be fist fights at the chargers .
I doubt the ferry companies would
refund for the charger was broken and I am stuck in Sheffield .
The more you think thing through the more ridiculous it is .
I would love to see how much the charging costs go up and the road maintenance costs . All electric cars are heavier .
And a consequence of electric cars fast acceleration , I predict that there will be an increase in Road accidents and incidents were cars trying to get to chargers are hit by others .
The target of 2030 stopping the sale of ICE cars and the restrictions and incentive will cause us to go back to 1970s car ownership . And a big increase in Motorbikes .
@@alistairbrebner1998 caravan sometimes can do 2000 miles.
@@lesleyriseam1282 …except that in central London now I see half the motorbike parking spaces being reallocated to e-scooter hire companies, so the motorbike option isn’t really there either, as it’s much harder to find a parking spot.
@@chrishb7074
They will push e mopeds .
I live very rural so it will be very dangerous on e bikes .
Big agricultural vehicles no lights , twisty roads .
Lucky I am not starting out in my motoring life .
So a range of 30 miles on the way back from a cycling holiday with the caravan, if its raining?
This is probably the most useful review of real world EV performance I’ve seen, thanks Matt it must have been a super boring day. Most reviewers seem to be hiding the truth about EV’s practicalities, not that I don’t think EV’s are perfect for many people, two car families and ultimately the future.
I’ve an Ampera PHEV, does most daily driving in EV mode, think maybe something like the new Mercedes C class PHEV with 62 miles of pure EV range might be my next car.
Last year we got a 30kw Nissan Leaf from 2018. We it for everything. The wife's commute and day to day driving around the city and suburbs - school runs, shopping, trips to the park. We still have our 2017 Megane diesel estate but so far have only used it for family holidays and the odd weekend trip or family visits. Thought I'd use the Megane more but we're only using it a couple of times a year and I'm thinking of selling it and just renting when we need the extra range. Like how often do must people do 100 miles?
@@aidanoconnor7299 I CAN DO 100 MILES IN A DAY I WOULD DESTROY AN EV RANGE , EVS ARE TERRIBLE
First class review, the truth !
I have had 5.5 miles per kW with Kona, driving slow country roads, gave 320 miles one charge.
About time a car reviewer did this kind of test on an electric SUV. Well done Matt. 👏👏
TFL have been doing this too. Although carwow does a great job of clearly showing the results.
@@2157AF I think not most UK folk watch TFL because quite a few comments said “it was about time someone did this”…Or maybe they’re just not subbed…TFL did it recently to the rivian1 & Tundra.
Most of the EV "reviewers" the last decade+ have been influencers...which means 2 bit PR and advertisers....they either are hoping to be paid, or they were using glowing videos to get loaner cars to get views...or to get perks like Tesla points to obtain a free car.
@@STho205 Isn’t some guy named Ben owed 2 Tesla Roadsters?…I don’t know how they can afford to give out so many of these already expensive roadsters.
I love this type of testing. Great job Matt! Please do more of these types of reviews using other electric vehicles. Thanks!
Decent review. For the moment, towing our 2000kg caravan, I’ll be sticking with my Ford Ranger. 1500kg spare capacity and can be recharged to full on nearly every corner in 15mins. 😂
An important fact that was missing regarding charging an EV when towing. Charging bays are single car size. What do you do with the caravan when you are on a long trip.
Block multiple stalls or the road🤷♂️😅 you could have similar problems with a low roof tho
sell it
Keep a gas generator in the trunk so you can charge as you drive.
@@patriciajames6601 you win the prize with the correct answer .
Had a great laugh last night on a country trip. Watching ev owners settling in for their charge. A queue of deluded fellow ev owners waiting for their turn while we stopped at the servo, not for fuel but for coffee. We were only 160 km from sydney. We will do our 1200km round trip on the same tank of diesel we left home with, towing a small boat. Evs have a long way to go before they canbe any more than a short distance commuter. Your caravan point is hilarious.
I have an ID4 and the range numbers match pretty well with the real life numbers I'm getting. Worth mentioning that the range numbers also vary depending on weather as it'll go lower if it's cold outside. Also, after about a year of usage, I've seen my range reducing as well...
Bet you won't be buying an ev ever again 😆
@@BubblesTheCat1 I’m on my 3rd. I wouldn’t go back to internal combustion again, it’s too agricultural.
It's interesting how a lot of these suv evs fair when it comes to range, I was looking to swap the wife's car to one but their efficiency is still pretty poor went from Manchester to London and back in my m3 lr and managed 4.3 miles per kwh with fully loaded car 5 people and ac on, I do want to go back to legacy manufacturers but they're still a couple of years behind
@@aerox69x was that in the summer? My I.d3 will do that in the summer my 58kwh battery will get me 180 miles in the winter (until V3 software where I believe we will be back just over 200 miles). I swapped my 2019 plate LR AWD Model 3 for an ID3 I much prefer the VW. Yes it’s slower and the range isn’t as good but as a car it’s miles better.
@@scottwills4698 that was this weekend between 5 and 9 degrees (it's a fair bit better in the summer) I do like the id3 and think the space comfort and hatch suit family needs more. But the supercharger network for the tesla makes it much easier (until its opened up )
The thing that probably hit your "everything on" range was setting the A/C to max. I keep my A/C to 19/20°C, which is plenty warm enough - it's what my central heating at home is set to.
Another test you should try is stop start traffic jam simulation. I got stuck in a 2 hours jam on the M25 last night and there were several e-cars on the hard shoulder (luckily there a still are some places with a hard shoulder), with no lights, no hazards, nothing. And rescuing is far more effort than just finding a can of petrol
Yep, the equivalent of getting a can of petrol for an EV would be a portable generator, I imagine. But you'd need a decent generator and a couple hours of charging to charge the EV enough to make it to the next charging station. It would be quicker and easier to get a tow truck.
That's odd because EV's are more efficient at lower speeds. That's why they're so good in town and on smaller roads.
@@mikedoverskog But on cold or hot days the heating/aircon saps battery, and lighting does. Nobody plans to get stuck in a traffic jam so if you do get stuck when you are close to full discharge for a couple of hours, of slow shuffling forward, you are going to run out of juice
Hey Matt great review was chatting to my mum about taking a caravan from Birmingham to Cornwall and having to stop and charge it 3 times. She raised a good point, how are you going to park an suv hooked to a caravan and get to a charging point they are for cars only.
hmm - if its summer and you use aircon maybe 4 or 5 charges - I'm still running a diesel - just like the Government told me to do a few years ago !
@@fingerintheair That statement is completely false. Using the A/C doesn't affect the range that much, maybe around 5% to 10% or so. It would absolutely not add 2 extra charging stops for any reason.
@@redbaron6805 Not necessarily. If your maximum range is already down to 100 miles on a full charge then aircon is knocking another maybe 5 miles off. I doubt you want to arrive at the charger with zero miles or stay for ages to get the last 5% of trickle charge so your 'effective' range is now around 80 miles. Chargers don't appear exactly every 80 miles so it could indeed add 1 or 2 more charges to some routes.
@@P-Bee You are a bit off for several reasons. Track driving EV's makes poor numbers for a simple reason, you are the only car on the track. In traffic, you would be quite surprised how much extra range traffic gets you as they break up the wind resistance. Also, on a normal highway, you don't just cruise flat out at 60Mph for the entire trip, and slowing down for traffic or congestion down to 50Mph or 40Mph at times makes the trip that much more efficient.
There are many other factors involved of course also. If you were towing, you can find an EV with larger battery and better range. And in the USA, chargers are often spaced 50 miles apart or less. Not sure how that works out in the UK.
We are also talking about the UK. I lived in Europe for 2 decades and never had a car with air conditioning. It isn't exactly Arizona over there, and the A/C isn't exactly working very hard to keep you cool.
@@redbaron6805 it depends where and when you go towing or whatever. ive almost never needed to slow down to that extent. also aircon isnt just for cooling, its also for drying air for demisting etc.
19:22 for all the ones that just want the efficiency results
Really enjoyed this review. Answered a lot of questions I had regarding EV's. Thank you
Always seems to forget that evs are more efficient around town
That roofbox sounds as if it would rattle up a storm on the motorway!
Good fun. My daughter just bought one of these and has problems on long journeys finding a) charging points, b) charging points in working condition (France), and c) charging points without a waiting time for someone to finish.
Only carwow does these kinds of tests, keep up the good work !!
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Yes, other reviews will only tell you about official 300+ miles of range without even bothering to look at actual power consumption rate (which is not lying, in contrary to VW marketing team).
@@APopov hi Oleksandr. How are you tonight?🙏 Fine?
Mat, I feel like you missed out a critical step in this test. Me and my friends want to go on a skiing and camping holiday. 5 Blokes with a ski rack, towing a caravan. Also its dark and rainy so full lights and wipers on with some tunes going for the journey. Lets see what that puppy can do! FOR SCIENCE!
probably about 30 or 40 miles.
@@alllen2426 Don't know why this test wasn't done lol. I feel like carwow would end up in some legal battle for making a mockery of these electric motors.
Matt, as can be seen all comes to air drag , speed and mass. You cannot cheat physics...thanks for great video!!
Should've tested it while towing, roof rack and bike on, four blokes, and all systems enabled --- all at the same time xD.
Probably couldn’t even done his 10 miles xD
I went hybrid (PHEV) last month; for the moment it's the best of both worlds.
Disagree. It's the worst of both worlds.
With an EV and no gas engine, you eliminate over 2000 parts that need maintenance and can fail.
A PHEV has all the complexity of a gas car plus the electronics, battery and motor of an EV. Plus you still have oil changes etc
Pure EV is the way to go.
@blackvr4tt I agree that EV is the path forward but there's still progress needed on weight, capacity, charging times and infrastructure. Today (and for my profile), PHEV suits me better: EV for most of my commutes and ICE for longer trips. I do cross my fingers to go full electric in the near future though.
I think that there needs to be much more development before it would be realistic to switch from ICE to an EV vehicle, apart from the range, you also need to factor in the time it takes to recharge and also to find a vacant charging point, not to mention one that is both A/ compatible with the car system and B/ one that is actually working. With an ICE car, you can drive to the nearest garage and do a complete refuel to a full tank again and be back on the road in about 5 minutes all in, no contest as far as I'm concerned.
Agree. Also, electric cars lose charge even if parked, just like a phone loses some of the battery even if not in use. Also, if it's cold outside, the range is even worse. Let's say you're like my dad who has to drive 80 kilometers to work in another city. If it's a winter morning, you'd also likely have air con, heated seats and steering wheel enabled, which would also lower the range. In my opinion it's just too early to buy and electric car as a reliable replacement for an ICE car
For the germans 😄
3.0 mi/kWh = 20.7 kWh/100km @60 (96,6 km/h)
2.6 mi/kWh = 23.9 kWh/100km @70(112,7 km/h)
1.9 mi/kWh = 32.7 kWh/100km @5 people
1.3 mi/kWh = 47.8 kWh/100km @caravan
Or anyone outside uk.
Basically all of Europe 😆
you basically mean "rest of the world"
Brits, still thinking they're relevant :))
Thanks, this was very informative. The only issue I have is with the "all systems on" test - it takes a lot more energy to reach a certain temperature than to maintain it. So, you had to first drive 10 laps and when reaching sauna temperatures, only then to reset and start the consumption test.
Good point. Also, who would ever put the temperature (and probably also the ventilation speed) to the maximum it can go. The test would be more realistic if it would be at max 21/22 degrees C and average fan setting.
Also would have been nice to see one with with all systems on and with a family of 5 with all their luggage, as it is very common.
@@HypnOlli There are many scenarios that could have been explored. But, keep in mind for heating, having 5 people in a car requires less heating than with 1 person, as each person emits body heat into the car and reduces air volume.
Also, as noted, no one runs a car with the heat on max as it would be intolerable within minutes, hence that test is wildly unrealistic, running max cooling would be the same. No one is going to be driving a rolling refrigerator down the road while dressing up for the arctic inside.
@@redbaron6805 here in the cold northern hemisphere in winter (often around 4 months through November December January and February) I often put my car heat to max to clear the windows and keep myself warm
@@brianmclean8666 I think you are missing the point. You can put the heater on max to clear your windows and warm up the car, no one is disputing that. But that process lasts a few minutes.
You can't take that energy number and then claim this is what the car is consuming for the next hours. Once your windows are clear and the car is warmed up, the car simply has to maintain the existing temperature.
That means the heater will cycle on and off, using far less energy each hour than the surge needed to begin with.
Also, many EV owners do this when the car is plugged in before they leave. The cars have a pre-conditioning time you can set, so you tell the car to start heating up and clearing the windows at 6:50 and the car will be warm and the windows clear by 7:00 when you are ready to leave.
That way, there is zero impact on the cars range to heat up the car and it only has to maintain the temperature for your journey.
that was the best EV review ever, many times you see the title "real world test" but no one even come close to how this video is so useful
Great information, Matt makes is fun to watch boring stuff, love it
Keep up the grind🔥🔥
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html.
very interesting, thanks for spending the time. Even with your caveat at 19:30, I would still like to see this stacked against a similar ICE car (Kodiaq?), both in terms of loss of range & cost per mile with all the bits. We don't think about this stuff so much with dinosaur juice, do we? So it's good that EVs are making us think about how much we drive and how much fun we allow ourselves
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
@Czarodziej begone bot
Trailer aerodynamics are a major factor for efficiency even for fuel driven combos: My TDI Passat gets 47 mpg solo, my high-box trailer gets it down to 26... but when I had an old Westfalia lower profile, slightly aerodynamic trailer of the same size (weight and loading area), the combo got away with 40+ mpg. So mostly about wind resistance.
Thanks for the interesting infos as always!
I'd love to see a similar test with an ICE car, perhaps even comparing diesel and petrol.
there's a reason that commercial vehicles are diesel - just saying :)
@@waynedl99 Yeah, I'm aware, I'm just curious about the size of the difference. And also how they compare to electric.
@@kissgergo5202 There are very few electric vans and trucks available, they are usually much heavier than a diesel version of the same vehicle, and don't have the range.
For example, an e-sprinter van (Mercedes) has a WLTP of 82-95 miles (estimated real world range), BUT only has a load capacity of 731kg.
Compared to my old 1999 Sprinter which did Manchester to London and back on a tank of diesel, still had fuel left, and had a carrying capacity of 1500kg.. OK, I know, more modern ones have a lower carrying capacity - and it depends on the size of the van, mine was a MWB high top, but it still shows the issues.
Now, scale that up to 44t vehicles :o
With my unit and 'skelly' (skeletal trailer), I had the capacity to carry just over 30t container, and my fuel range was around 700 miles. An electric HGV unit - let's take for example, a DAF FT electric (basically a 4x2 CF size unit), weighs in at 9,000kg and has a range of UPTO 137 miles..
So, your carrying capacity is lower, and your range is lower, and it's not like 'it's ok, driver needs a break' and you just nip into a services to fuel up, a 'quick charge' on the batteries is 75 mins - normally this is up to 80% charge.
@@kissgergo5202 30% difference in my case (diesel...with our with out 1400kg caravan )
Here's some real world figures from my 2.0 TdCi Mondeo. Steady 60mph gives 55-60 mpg with a range to empty of approx 550 miles. 70 mph gives 50mpg. Towing a two berth caravan between 55-60mph gives 29 - 33mpg at best, so about 50% of the best range figure which compares about equal to the test result on the EV at a little over 1mile/KWhr.
Have been considering an ev for my next car for a while now, but the more videos I watch of them and the cost of electricity going up by 54% I think I will be giving it a miss until I am forced to change.
Yep, electric cars are great for short journeys - the issue is charging the bloody things!
Electric prices will only increase and fast chargers will cost a ridiculous amount as demand increases.
Been looking at plug in hybrids but most of them are not great either. 20 odd miles of electric range in the real world. It would be enough for my commute though.
Wait until they introduce a per mile or km depending where you live tax to replace the money lost on fuel excise. In Australia, fuel tax is about a third the total cost per litre. So add that onto your electricity costs which will continue to skyrocket and then add the fact that evs are at least 50% more expensive than their ice equivalent…..
@@foxxster3565 These claims are obviously false. Fuel costs in Australia are $6.78 per gallon. Electricity prices are 25 cents to 40 cents per kWh.
On a car with 26Mpg fuel economy the cost per mile is 26 cents per mile. Since EV's typically get 4 miles per kWh, the price per mile is 6 cents to 10 cents per mile. Elementary math would say that 6 to 10 is less than 26.
Adding a few cents per mile tax on an EV still wouldn't change the math. In the USA they have done that already in some areas, but it maxes out at around USD 150 annually or around 1 cent per mile. Still doesn't change the math in favor of EV's.
@@redbaron6805 fuel excise is around 45 cents a litre or over $2 a gallon. Now add that to you equation. And given evs cost around 100% more than their equivalent ice vehicle you are not going to break even. Eg the Kona is from $28 aud for the petrol version. The electric version of exactly the same car is from $60k. You are NEVER going to recoup the $30k price difference. Apart from which there are an awful lot of people who simply cannot afford $60k for a small car, and obviously more for a decent size family vehicle.
@@foxxster3565 You are not going to add that to the equation as there is literally nowhere how this actually works. And EV's don't cost 100% more than ICE vehicles, that is utter baloney. Even current price premiums which are shrinking are 10% to 40%.
A Hyundai Kona is around $23000 in the USA, the EV version is $34000. But after the $7500 for tax credit, the EV is $26500, a difference of 15%.
So, you maybe looking at this from the perspective of the disastrous policies in Australia, but that is not how this works in the rest of the world.
The tests up to the caravan were very good and the test with the caravan cruising on level ground at a constant speed showed a drop in range that was shocking but just for fun, you should do the caravan test on the road where you'd be stopping and starting, and going up and down hills. Starting off and going uphill would really take it out of the battery. Yes, slowing down and running downhill puts some back but when the car is powering, it'd be sucking the battery dry.
How about producing caravans that compliment an electric car by having a battery bank onboard to attach to the car as part of the car's battery pack during towing. One thing is for sure you shouldnt run out of electicity for the caravan if you keep both car and van batteries fully charged.
Nice idea and there's also a reasonable bit of roof space on the caravan to allow for some erectable solar panels that can be optimally aligned once parked up. Charge the van battery and then you've got the option of dumping that into the car. That said, it would add a fair bit of cost and would probably cost far more than just paying for the extra public charging once in a while that would be needed.
Fantastic review! Small request though, can you also flash up some other alternative units for consumption such as wh/km?
Would appreciate Wh/km, too. I compiled a list from the video:
Electrical systems off @ 96 km/h: 207 Wh/km
Electrical systems off @ 112 km/h: 239 Wh/km
Electrical systems on max. @ 112 km/h: 327 Wh/km
+4 passengers, systems off @ 112 km/h: 248 Wh/km
Ski rack @ 112 km/h: 296 Wh/km
Roof box @ 112 km/h: 270 Wh/km
Bike @ 112 km/h: 282 Wh/km
Caravan @ 96 km/h: 478 Wh/km
im sure there are channels that use KMs that will supply this information. as the UK uses miles and KW/h for energy consumption, and its a UK based channel, that is what is used here. there are very few channels on youtube that convert to 'foreign' measurement units (as in ones not generally used in the home country)
@@petelattimer6808 The metric system is dominant in practically all countries, hence the additional five minutes required to translate the table are not a waste of time in my opinion. There is no harm in showing both units.
For American viewers, please quote megacalories per deca-furlong. Thanks.
Can you imagine doing a trip in an EV with a caravan? You'd have to disconnect the caravan every 100mi (well less, realistically) to recharge the car.
I have a Toyota LC200 with a 4.5lt twin turbo diesel. It does have an aftermarket 2nd fuel tank fitted, but towing my 1.7tonne camper I can easily go for 1400-1500km between fills. To pump the 275lt (theoretical capacity) takes about 6 minutes. It will be a long time before a car can do this, let alone a big 4wd with mud tyres, roof rack with a 270 degree awning and a bullbar running an EV system!
Matt can go into anything 😂😂😂
Would be amazingly interesting to make this test also with other EV´s. Especially with a Tesla. Maybe cut some test out for time puposes, but would be amazing to see differences at load.
using Nautical Caravan miles?
Good review, I’ve been driving electric cars for just under 7 years. But I also have a diesel Motorhome. I’ve been brainstorming whether in the future I would go back to towing (with a Tesla model Y). Maybe! But Caravan technology has to change also. Good news is, there is some development ongoing (“towing assist”) which incorporates motors in the wheel hubs of caravans, (similar to E-bike technology, but on a bigger scale), which also by necessity incorporates batteries on board the caravan, effectively increasing your range, so that not all the load is concentrated on the towing vehicle. These can also act as “motor movers” when the caravan is unattached for pitching the van. It also does away with the need for gas bottles, (because all energy needs can be accommodated through an inverter from the caravan’s battery). The weight of batteries in the van is offset by not needing LPG cylinders or separate motor movers. Added benefit, is the van batteries can be trickle charged on site, from the electric hook up or solar. With regard to consulting the Caravan and Motorhome club, I’ll take that with a pinch of salt, they are far too backward thinking for my liking. The fact is we can’t keep burning fossil fuels, poisoning our children and creating global warming. I can totally understand the frustration over the lack of suitable chargepoints for towing vehicles. I made that point in a government study I was involved in 5 years ago. The other fact is that the UK government is so far behind Europe and other countries with it’s EV charger role out strategy, (it doesn’t really have a strategy, leaving it to the “market”, to the private sector is not good enough). There’s no wonder there is so much scepticism about EVs the UK.
one of the best carwow reviews I've seen for a while, well done Mat & team
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
or shall i say well done Mat & ballast…
Love the data screen at 19:22, thanks.
It looks like drag is more important than weight (four blokes).
I used to have a 66 reg Leaf, that got 4.4 miles/kwh in summer and 3.8 in winter, but that was all urban driving, again 15% loss due to systems on. Can you do the same test across lower speeds, I expect the lower speed (and lower drag) will make a massive difference.
Yes, drag is the killer. caravans roughly double the consumption for ICE vehicles, too, no matter the weight.
I think we will need to keop our diesel Passat for quite some time to be able to do road trips with our caravan... But I so badly want to buy an EV! :)
At a steady speed, the extra weight just adds a little more rolling resistance to the tyres.
If you're in a city, you need good regen otherwise you're wasting energy starting and stopping the movement of that extra mass.
kinetic energy is the square of the speed, not the mass.
I appears the 'controls' for the screen are all touch sensitive which may well be ok but it does mean you have to take your eyes off the road in order to see where the 'buttons' are located. It would be safer to have 'manual' buttons/controls which can be easily found by touch with a quick glance at the screen to check setting. Great review btw.
Simplest way to increase range: smaller rims
Its not the rims per se, its the tire size, but yes. But its a small difference.
@@GoldenCroc the overall tire size is the same, look up plus one, or plus 2, tire rack has a good explanation. The penalty is from heavier total weight with large wheels, and more performance oriented tires.
@@allterrainrandy2587 Are you sure you arent thinking of the wheel size? Not rim size, but the entire wheel, as in a rim + tire combo. Because I have never really heard of a european manufacturer running anything else but very similar outer diameter wheels, no matter what spec/trim you buy.
So to clarify, what you say in your last sentance is true, but the big thing in my mind is generally the tires are wider, as well as have a decreased sidewall with bigger rims, which means a stiffer sidewall and different tire construction that generally have a higher rolling resistance.
@@GoldenCroc the English language is a little confusing. Rim and wheel can mean the same thing, but rim+tire and wheel can also mean the same thing. I do mean the overall diameter is the same. I.E. a 245/45/19 and a 245/40/20 and a 245/35/21 are all the same overall diameter. The tire is generally a little wider and definitely higher rolling resistance. The bigger wheels are also much heavier with the same construction. The tire is also just as heavy.
One thing to consider about your setup vs the manufacturer claims of range is that you're going in a constant circle. This means you are constantly turning, and also that the effective weight is a little greater, both create extra friction.
The turning is so discreet it probably doesn't matter a lot
We got caught out with our Tesla 3 when we first put a bike rack with 2 bikes on the towbar. A trip that would have got us home with plenty of juice left had us limping home at gradually reducing speeds ("slow down to 90Km/80km/70Kmper hour to reach your destination " ) and making it home with 1%. The extra wind resistance makes a huge difference to consumption at highway speeds.
We love the car though, would never go back to ICE.
It would be interesting to compare efficiency of bike carrying systems for roof, boot door or towing hook.
Bike with both wheels on roof is hellish. Massive turbulence at highway speeds. Worse than 2 short windsurf boards.
Brilliant video. Now can you repeat with the Skoda 2.0 TDI so show impact of attaching accesories to car has on its efficiency? Fossil cars still the way for towing unless you have $ for a Model X. Even then it doesnt have the range of an ICE car.
No such thing as a "fossil" car, you used the correct word near the end of your post; ICE. I believe using words invented as pejoratives is detrimental to progress. Just a bugbear.
I've got one of those...Octavia 4x4...they're excellent... 9l/100km with 1500kg caravan 3 kids...me...my good lady and a german shepherd on board.
We´ve got a 9 year old Skoda Superb Combi 2.0 TDI 4x4 with 170hp and a 6-speed manual. We were recently skiing and had an average consumption of 5.6l/100km on the 500km long journey with a fully occupied car fitted with a roof box.
With a caravan we averaged about 9l/100km on the German Autobahn
Great video Mat,proper real world video for EVs, first video that I’ve seen for any channel,thank you.👍🏻
Finally the video I've been waiting for months
Well done for a great review on an EV towing etc.
I'm a caravan owner and currently would never consider an EV for towing at this time.
Two considerations....One which you've pointed out is the rediculous range and Two the high price of EVs just to get a decent spec.
But will done involving a caravan.
I have an Hyundai Kona Ultimate EV, £39k, via Motability. As at yesterday, since 14 June 2021, I've driven 615 miles. SIX HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN MILES! You read it right. Why so few? Well, I'm chronically disabled and don't go out much but the main reason is range. I wasn't told how badly cold weather affected the range, nor how few 50kwh chargers there are near me, nor was I told that, and I'll be very specific here, when the car showed I had14 miles range left, and I wanted to go 0.6 mile to a restaurant, to celebrate my daughter's 26th birthday, it would tun out of juice. That did it for me. I'm returning it to Motability next Friday and buying a used Peugeot 3008, 2013, hybrid. Half the price oer month. I've also insured the Peugeot via RAC PAYD (Pay As You Drive) and based on 4000 miles a year, for less that £50 a month. £29.01 for when it's parked and 6.2 pence per mile. If I drive more than 4k miles, I'm charged more 6.2 pences. Similarly, if I drive fewer miles, my monthly mileage charge is reduced accordingly.
It's a win-win for me and I'm hoping I'll be going mire places too, now I'll be rid of the ever present range anxiety!!
It's great to have a test which shows the problems with the official economy figures for EVs.
Internal combustion engine cars are at their best in these sorts of conditions, and I bet you'd easily do much better than official MPG figures at constant 60 and 70 (at least until you start adding aerodynamic blockers like things on the roof rack or that caravan).
On the other hand, ICE cars are at their worst in stop-start conditions, which I imagine is precisely why official economy tests try to replicate those conditions and don't measure constant speed figures any more (go back enough years and they did this).
However electric cars are the other way round - they're good in stop-start traffic because of regen, but this means the official economy figures flatter them compared to long distance driving, where the official range figures for EVs look much too optimistic.
Which is rather unhelpful, because long journeys with lots of time at a constant 70 are exactly the time those range figures become most important for most people (except perhaps people like taxi drivers and delivery drivers who clock up many miles in stop-start conditions and/or short journeys).
"Internal combustion engine cars are at their best in these sorts of conditions", that statement makes very little sense. Wind resistance is wind resistance, EV's are more aerodynamic than combustion engine cars. Hence, there is no scenario where combustion engine cars would somehow magically do better than more efficient EV's at speed.
Tests with EV's have confirmed many times their highway range with cars like the Tesla Model 3 and others. Ultimately, driving non stop hundreds of miles doesn't reflect real world conditions. I drive tens of thousands of miles, and every rest area I pass is packed with people taking a break, getting food and using the restrooms. And almost all of those people are driving combustion engine cars.
Oh I forgot - physics doesn't apply to ICE cars...
Same test for Model Y please!!!
Not full electric my partner is thinking about the RAV4 plug in hybrid as his brother has one and never uses fuel, for me full electric makes no sense,and with to massive electric price rises totalling 80% I believe , I must say your wonderful review saved a elderly couple who were just about to purchase an electric car to tow their caravan, otherwise their retirement dream of long distance traveling towing their caravan would have been a nightmare Big Thanks on their behalf for saving their dream
Great review. People worry about range and most EVs promote the ideal range. It is good to see what they do in more realistic conditions. We need more of these.
I would like to see a similar test done at low speeds with some start/stop and hill climbing/descending would be good a well. I take lots of holidays in areas with lots of ups and down. It would also be nice to see comparisons to a somewhat comparable ICE car. That should keep you busy for a few months :)
What will be interesting is to repeat these tests in the future with a 10 year old EV. An ICE vehicle with 150,000 Km on the clock at 10 years would still be near it's new performance.
Who on earth would taw a caravan without his family, in the car?
@@marcellogenesi6390 Well, a thief stealing someone's caravan from their house in the dead of night would appreciate a nice quiet electric car as the perfect getaway vehicle.
batteries lose power when they discharge. Their output voltage goes down. The whole test is bananas. Your 25% charge battery will provide much less power than a full charge one. There's already a noticeable drop between 100% and 80% charge.
There are a lot of disadvantages to electric noone ever talks about for some reason
And thats why you gotta question everything always. As soons as there is only one way of thinking, you know something is off a out the whole thing
I never intend to buy a caravan so not a disadvantage...
It's socially unacceptable to find fault with EVs, you are supposed to love them, apparently
What do you mean with disadvantages, it requires a new way of driving and planning, doesn't necessarily mean it's an disadvantage
@@Markcain268 finding faults is allowed, just ill-informed people bring up the same old 10-15 year old arguments time and time again
Great review Mat! A lot of really interesting points 🙂
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
beautiful caravan!
Pulling a heavy caravan with our Insignia 2.0CDTI 160, we used to get fuel consumption of around 30mpg, compared with around 50 without it (on a long run). So, efficiency does not drop to the same extent with a diesel engine as it does with the electric Skoda Enyaq, even taking into account that our caravan weighed around 1600kg.
Thank you so much for this video and it's insane
Does the state of charge of the battery affect the efficiency of the battery and/or motor? Should all of these tests have been conducted on a fully charged battery?
Wow!!!! This is by far the best rest of an electric vehicle yet, I bet the caravan club are overjoyed with pleasure. Thx for great vid Car wow
100 miles range is actually the best case Scenario for EV Towing
I mean who tows a Family Caravan (Alone ) and with no Systems on 😳🤷
The biggest thing that needs to be dealt with: the electrochemical cells inside batteries wearing out faster because of fast charging.
They recommend using slow charging where possible. The majority of people will probably charge slowly and home and only fast charge on the odd longer drive.
They only wear out slightly faster.
Teslas with over 300k miles that only Supercharged showed only a bit higher degradation.
But most ppl charge at level 2 a majority of the time so it's a non issue for most ppl.
Whilst I can't comment on the battery chemistry in the Enyaq, I drove a Gen 1 30kWh Nissan Leaf for 2 years / 25,000m.
I used my 7kW home charger for probably 99% of my charging.
However, I needed to do one particular longer journey which required me to rapid charge 3 times on that day at 50kW each time.
The battery State of Health percentage INCREASED after my journey...!
Plus, there are significant numbers of 100,000+ mile Leaf (taxis) which are showing exceptional battery health - the common factor being that they are rapid charged 2-3 times daily.
Conversely, there are 20,000 mile models that have lost 2 or 3 battery 'bars'.
@@jonathantaylor1998 Gen 1 Leaf is old tech because the battery did not have a thermal management system to regulate the battery temp.
Almost all new EVs have this system which greatly extends battery life, especially in very hot climates which are the hardest on batteries.
Hi, We have a Kia Niro EV and have clocked up just on 50,000km in 2 1/2 years. Kia claim 455 km range for this model (62kwh battery). According to it's predicted range meter (which seems remarkably accurate) I usually show about 480km, and my wife has had it up to 515! But she doesn't enjoy that 200 hp as much as I do! We don't usually carry a lot of load. Most of the places we normally travel to we can get there and back on a single charge. We usually charge at home from our solar panels, at NO cost. We have topped it up at a public charge station just 14 times since we have had it. Kia have no recommended towing spex; I think I might instal a tow-bar so that I can carry moderate loads on my household trailer; an all-up load less than carrying a car full of All Blacks! (We live in NZ). But presently don't want to invalidate it's 3 year warranty. Any car that has good aerodynamics will really up it's fuel use given the changes shown, so the extra battery used is not surprising. If it has poor aerodynamics, it will scoff fuel all the time! Readers please remember that we are going to EV's to reduce climate change; ICE's have to go, sorry. But then we would not go back to petrol even if climate change was not a problem.
Would be interesting if a diesel vehicle had a range that differs 60% from the manufacturers range. The EV is worse than the Diesel Gate…
Agree.
Its all politics from the EU, EVs are garbage for anyone who doesnt live in a huge city
Of course they do. Diesel or electric, they are on the same WLTP test cycle. It doesn't matter if you put that carvan on an EV or a Diesel, the range reduction will be exactly the same on the motorway, while you will have more range in town on the EV as it can break regeneratively.
But wtf does this have to do with dieselgate?
@@jojodroid31 So u mean you have half the range if you put on all systems in a diesel vehicle? Please explain 👍
The diesel gate (short version) was about VW claimed a different consumption than real life. I think that, this video shows that. Maybe it’s far-fetched for some 👍
@@Tomas-tx6lq Diesel gate was VW faking emmision tests so that diesels looks cleaner than they actually are, but hey, you do believe whatever you want.
Great informative video as always, thanks Matt.
I would not buy an EV because:
1: It is too expensive
2: I live in south London with no off-road parking, so not possible to charge at home, or anywhere nearby.
3: My elderly mother lives in Southampton and I could not do the return journey on a full charge, my current petrol Peugeot 2008 will go there and back more than twice
4: I don't believe the environmental benefits; they may put out little CO2 etc at the point of use but the electricity still has to be produced and distributed
5: I believe the environmental damage caused mining the Lithium and other elements needed for the batteries is catastrophic, plus the problems of recycling.
6: The actual life of the battery and cost of replacement could mean these cars are practically a write-off before 10 years or 100,000 miles, requiring the manufacture of new vehicles.
7: I think the 'green' argument is being pushed for political reasons with no thought of the practicalities for ordinary people, and if all cars suddenly went electric we would need a few more nuclear power station as the massive drain on the power grid each evening would be astronomic.
ICE cars pollute way more than per specification in real world scenario. "Mining" for petrol is waaaaayy worse than mining for lithium which is a very small % of the battery. Petrol needs to be distributed, electricity mostly travel on existing infrastructure. Producing electricity with coal is still way cleaner than ICE. Even then electricity production should be cleaned up. The problem of producing electricity are businesses and data centers during day/ peak time. Charging a car at night is virtually free. Batteries will do 100k m happily, my leaf has 70k m already and its 3yo with retention of 90% of the battery. Battery replacement are becoming cheaper and cheaper to the point that you just need to replace the battery and not the car after 10 years if at all.
@@allfredcg When a petrol car is no longer serviceable, you can drain the fluids and you essentially have scrap metal. When an EV car is not serviceable, you essentially have a ton of hazardous material.
@@Josh-kp8si so what do u use in your laptop or your phone? It feels like most ppl are looking for an excuse for progression. Rechargeable batteries are everywhere, embrace and make sure they are good quality so that their life span is great. Ev are still in the steam engine phase, so expect major improvement in battery chemistry, maybe we will get this solid state batteries made of salt and graphite so you stop complaining about hazardous materials. If you are concerned about hazardous materials think about oil spillage from oil tankers, transmissions and gear fluid, engine oil and engine cleaning solutions, without considering air pollution an ice vehicle produce. If you are concerned about batteries, stop using single use batteries for your tech stuff like headphones, keyboard, mouse, kids toys, cameras and what not and use rechargeable batteries. Think of non rechargeable batteries waste over the course of 10 years of these devices. BTW car batteries after EV use are still good to be used in areas where space isn't a big concern like storage unit. Many car batteries are resold for other purpose.
8: EV's are gay.
@@allfredcg yeah, but one car is like few hundred kilograms of batteries. In just UK alone there is about 32 mil cars on the road and about 4 mil of LGV and 0.5 mil HGV, that means a lot of batteries needed to replace cars in just one country.
Matt, this could be the first ever review of it's kind in the world, comparing the battery drain on different scenarios. Brilliant😀
Less than 50 miles with 5 passengers, ski box, all systems on and caravan :) My 2001 sharan can do 440 miles with this set up on a single tank :)
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
Would be nice to have the official range estimate on the same screen with the test results :)
Would be nice if the measurements were in metric
I like this because he gave distance in miles rather than kilometers.
Britain needs more guys like this guy!!!
Now all you need to do is dump that ridiculous currency of yours and switch over to the easy and superior decimal-based currency system like the U.S..
The Dollar is the basic currency.
Pennys (1 cent), is 1/100th/0.01 of the basic currency.
The Nickel (5 cents), is 1/50th/0.05 of the basic currency
Dimes (10 cents), is 1/10th/0.1 of the basic currency.
The Quarter (25 cents), is 1/4th/0.25 of the basic currency.
The Half-dollar (50 cents) is 1/2/0.5 of the basic currency.
Easy!!!
You don't need to give out tourist guilds to understand the U.S. currency system.
When you have joined the rest of the world with an intelligent decimal-based currency, we can finally get you all to start driving on the right side of the road at last.
Great info. Really shows where electric cars need some improving. going 100km/hr and only getting 370 km of range is quite low compared to a gas car. Which is really the reason I couldnt warrant a EV car yet. Makes sense for a strictly city car, but getting out of the city and driving places >200k away just doesnt work well.
It's not just the range, but the length of time required to recharge plus the nagging feeling that after a few years you'll need a new battery, at great expense.
@@ParaBellum2024 My car including the battery has warranty for 7 years - I have never kept any car longer than about 5 years.
I regularly do 200 mile journeys in my Kia Soul EV without needing to stop and charge - it works fine for me.
@@czmitche OK, but when you sell after five years, what will the car be worth? I'd still be worried if I was the buyer, that the battery might fail just outside warranty, and that would make me think twice about paying big money for the car.
@@ParaBellum2024 Except that claim has already been proven to be fiction. A 4 year old Tesla Model 3 after 100,000 miles of driving had lost 2.2% of its battery capacity. The idea that EV's will require battery replacements is proven more and more to be fiction.
There is a reason most EV's come with a 8 year battery warranty. The batteries will easily last 15 to 20 years or more.
Thank you CARWOW to emphasize the real problems of electric cars!!!! I really can't understand why car makers persist to say that Electric cars are more efficient than ICE cars...maybe in a laboratory an electric motor is more efficient than a diesel one but as soon as other factors come into play such as speed, weight, aerodynamic, the electric is just very bad.
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
Exactly people never mention that, an EV going at higher speeds than regular uses way more range than an ICE at similar speeds
You are not understaning the results properly. It just because electric cars are so effective that there is a a big loss of range with added drag. A petrol car burns more than half of its energy straight into heat and that means added drag of a caravan will be noticed less.
@@erikmolander lol…. EVs have to use way more aluminum and other composite materials which are even worse to the environment to squize the latest mile possible. Aluminum is an abundant element but an energy guzzler to produce. Same goes with the rare earths….. and guess what? They use oil to make those EVs.
@@carholic-sz3qv You are really making no sense at all. The video is about how range is affected with added drag/weight. Not about materials used to build the car.
An EV converts around 90% of the stored energy in the battery to usable torque.
A petrol car will almost never even reach 40% efficency.
If you double the drag of the vehicle it will affect the range of the more efficent vehocle a lot more since it does not have a lot of spare energy that goes to waste.
Energy used to make the vehicles is another topic. I drive a diesel for the amazing range by the way. But its less iffeicent than an EV. That is just simple math and not a discussion =D
When towing a caravan you will need to consider whether you can access a charging station with the caravan attached, or will you need to unhitch & park the caravan somewhere else. Of course you will also need to find a charger in less than 100 miles on your 400+ mile trip on holiday, & of course that was a very small & light caravan, no car lights on & no passengers & no luggage!
What this shows is just how inefficient a Skoda EV is. It would be interesting to see the results from an efficient EV say an E Niro or Tesla Model 3 (or Y). I think my E Niro is very efficient.
Can you please do a combined test. Caravan full of supplies, bikes on the roof, luggage in the boot wife in passenger seat and 2 kids in the back. Just like your setting off on holidays.
I bet the range would be near single figures. 😆🤣
already bought an ev, love it, wont be going back
Brilliant review that just highlights everything I ever thought about these stress boxes. Hell would have to freeze over before I buy one and even then I wouldnt because I'd worry about using the heater !
I've had two EVs and am getting rid of the second one next week and going back to combustion. You're right, they're just a stress if you actually need to use them to travel places. Public charging points are also so expensive that per kw/mile they work out about the same as an efficient petrol hatchback in fuel costs. Things have gotten better over the 4 years I've had EVs, but the real underlying problems are related to the concept itself and infrastructure. So I think are decades away from being sorted... if at all. I have friends with Teslas and I'm convinced that they have forced themselves to love them because EVs are such a huge investment.
@@BoxFlyHaydn This. People have convinced themsleves that they are 'doing their bit for the planet' without looking at everything that is involved in the whole process. EVs are an utter joke and always will be. I once saw Elon Musk described as a man who takes existing technology and makes it worse and nothing I've ever seen about anything he is doing will change my mind. With the possible exception of SpaceX
The way the tests were carried out showed the mileage figures in a much better than real world scenario as the car was travelling at a constant speed and not having to brake or accelerate at all. This shows how limited EV vehicles actually are as regards to running out of charge, this was also shown in your test with small EV cars although even then you were driving on motorways and not really driving much around town, stopping, accelerating etc.
If you add in all the emissions produced in sourcing the metals and then manufacturing the batteries, manufacturing the chargers, running far more power stations to cope with the extra demand on electricity then EV's are not really that green at all!
I have an ev. Hyundai kona ultimate. Love it, wouldn’t go back. Haven’t noticed the cost on my electric bill. I don’t do a lot of miles but mostly stop start short trips round town, with the odd long trip in summer. I can leave the ac on for the dog in summer when the car is unattended. I will never go back to an ice.
EVs: daily driver
Diesel: long road trips and towing
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
Very nice and informative review!
Would be nice to also see a review with a bit more realistic driving tho, meaning one that would include these tests while combining both road and city driving. I think majority of people use their cars in various environments, so that would make the test vid even more useful.
Please subscribe to my channel I also talk about cars
most people would be loaded up with caravan, roof box etc to get to their holiday destination, so this would be fairly realistic. if using in mixed environments its unlikely you would have the caravan on, so range is less of an issue (but still an issue)
Approx 230 mile range from a 77kWh battery. At current energy prices of approx 33p/kWh it would cost about £25 for a full charge. £25 to travel 230 miles is equivalent to averaging 50mpg in a petrol/diesel car at current fuel prices. Using the 141 mile range with everything switched on, it's cheaper per mile to drive a petrol/diesel car as that is the equivalent of avergaing 35mpg which think most cars could do at 70mph.
Great video lots if very good information but we all know no one drives at 70 or 60 all the time on a motorway we sometime drive at 70 sometimes even 50 or sometimes ur stuck in traffic not moveing but yes we do need better range in ev cars we also need more charging points
Yeah, especially with a carvan you don't drive that fast. I mean all this range stuff applies 1:1 to gas cars as well, it's exactly the same.
ruclips.net/video/3S6XRk9Ioc4/видео.html
@@jojodroid31 yes but not this much. If you compare the heating. This is only waste from the engine.
On an ev the additional things are earlier visible. People even notice different rims tires or a wet road when they are driving.
This constant driving consumption is for me 1000x better than these average things. Years years ago they mentioned this in car prospects. Constant consumption in different speeds.
This was great! Thank you for doing it!
Everyone needs to see it!
And yes, combustion engine range also drops when towing but does it drop by half?
No it doesn’t, nowhere near half. Most people towing get reasonable ranges these days. One of the benefits of diesel engines.
I disagree. It depends on the vehicle and what you are towing. My f150 EcoBoost will do around 13 L/100 kms empty on the hiway. When I pull my camper it will go to around 22-25L/100kms if there is any headwind at all It will push up over 30L / 100kms. My ecodeisel would do slightly better running about 11L/100kms empty and around 18-22L/100kms towing my camper. My F450 deisel will get about 1100kms to a tank when empty and as low at 400kms when towing my big trailer but that trailer weighs 35,000lbs. So in my experience towing will cut your ice vehicle down In half on range as well but granted it would not be as bad if you were just pulling a small camper or something like that.
The amount of energy needed to tow the caravan is same no matter what car you drive. Internal combustion engine are very inefficient and that’s why your consumption doesn’t go up as much. Most of your fuel is transferred to heat instead of moving the car.
Very nice video, I second the comment on the buggy infotainment system. I have an octavia RS iV (bought new, not second hand) and within the first year I had to bring it back 5 times!! The software is soooooo crap it is unbelievable. They had to replace the steering wheel with all electrical components, a boardcomputer in the trunk and a completely new software pack. Now that I have seen the same thing happen here I highly recommend staying away from Skoda until these things are fixed.