10 Most Hated Retcon Changes In DC Comics
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- Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
- Remember Wally West? For a time, DC actually didn't.
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I hate the fact that DC changed Mr. Freeze's sad backstory. The newer one makes him look like a delusional loon. Being delusional can work for characters like the Mad Hatter, but Freeze was supposed to be sympathetic.
One of the worst work of scott snyder
@@ryanmadej6694 but Scott Snyder's run on Batman and Justice League is good
@@dcmarvelcomicfans9458 agree batman and recent justice league is awesome as hell but he shouldn't have changed freeze origin
Just wait. DC reboots so often that I'm sure his classic origin will be restored eventually.
@@blackphoenix77 yep
Justice League DCAU TV Show: We understand Lanterns, Flashes, Hawks and Legionnaires are complicated, even in our own setting, but we're still going to give definitive versions everyone can get behind.
DC Comics: Okay. I see what you did there. We're keeping none of that.
DCAU was in fact made by DC as WBA is subsidiary. Problem with DC comic is that they are grilled by Werner over income, what force them into idiotic decisions. They did have completely free hand in case of Animation, so they used it well.
Why DC should keep the animated show as canon? It was its own thing. This isn't marvel and its synergy with the mcu.
@@ArmandoUlloa I don't think Wanderlustwarrior's point was that DC should've made the DCAU's universe their official canon. I think they were implying that the DCAU took the jumbled mess that was and still is DC comic's canon and found a way to make a definitive concrete universe out of it. And while the comics could've used this as an example on how you should establish a better, more comprehensive and easily digestible canon, they seem to be ignoring it. I know it's not a simple task to create a single canon for so many different books that are all going on simultaneously, but it sometimes doesn't even feel like they're trying to keep it straight at all. It feels like they've got a dart board with plot points as targets and character names on the darts and are just going nuts trying to make something stick.
@@ArmandoUlloa Not the point. DCAU was series what was close to comic at the time, being also slightly more modernized. Many people use it as example of how you should adopt some characters. Modern comic is broadly criticized by many fans as being too edgy and needlessly convoluted. What sadly strain on the movie adaptation, leading to disasters like early DCEU.
@@MoostachedSaiyanPrince "I know it's not a simple task to create a single canon for so many different books that are all going on simultaneously"
Well.. MCU proved that it isn't that hard. Though according to my knowledge some rules they fallow were in fact established already in the comics themselves. People may joke about time travel in Endgame, but it is in fact something based on one of time travel theories, known as parallel timelines theory. What is quite efficient in solving grandpa paradox, by making time fixed (it is why they couldn't alter it).
One of advantages of DC, on the other hand is that it allow more creative freedom. Specifically its comic books are written as so called hyper-verse. In fact lack of consistent canon is something existing by design. Problem is only that it serve them as excuse for laziness, as at least specific series (especially robots) should have at least some defined canon.
Swear to God, if it was up to Dan DiDio alone, Wally and Nightwing would be long gone for good.
Um, "kill Nightwing" was just DiDio spitballing in Infinite Crisis, and he planned to do it *because* it would disrupt the status quo. Thankfully, saner heads prevailed. Now, why they gave him an old Wonder Woman storyline from the 70s that nobody liked back when it first was published, I don't know.
@Will N Donna...wasn't Diana's sidekick. And I'd argue that if we're going by "original kid sidekick", you don't meddle with Jimmy Olsen.
@Will N Ridding of Nightwing wouldn't crash down the comic industry but it'd surely upset DC's fanbase and cause some boycotting.
I understand, and agree, with the arguments against “GL: Rebirth” replacing Kyle Rayner with Hal Jordan again, considering how great Kyle’s book was prior to Rebirth, but the thing is that the way Hal was corrupted came completely out of nowhere and for literally no reason other than “let’s do something shocking to make money”. It’d be one thing if his corruption was built up over time and done in a way that made sense to his character, but nope, just, out of nowhere, Hal’s crazy and killing all his friends, so I’m more than happy they retconned that as not being his fault (and gave an explanation to that stupid grey hair).
You know George Lucas was reading that run. "Why is it taking so long for Hal to turn evil? Man, that's so unrealistic, I would be chopping up kids the first hour!"
AGREED Omar Harris!!!
Kinda thought it was already built up, everyone he knew and his family was dead and he was trying to cope by recreating them and Guardians just told him, "Nah son, that's breaking the rules", and I think he just broke. That's fairly understandable for just a normal person, but not so much for 'corrupting' purposes. The 'it was Parallax parasite all along' thing is just a cheap way to preserve a bankable character. They can do the most heinous shit possible, as long as it isn't their fault entirely, then it's okay.
The video is right tho, any of the other GL's are MONUMENTALLY more interesting personality wise than Hal, but they just keep bringing that plain ol whitebread back. I'd love for anyone else to fully take it over and replace him in movie or series adaptations.
Obviously jules hasn't gotten around to heroes in crisis yet
Obviously you don't know when to use hasn't instead of haven't. Dipshit.
@@keeganshigh it was a typo on my phone, chill grammar police
keeganshigh goodness gracious, we’ve found the fanboy
Wow.
I'm a "Grammar Cop" and even I feel that that comment was uncalled for.
It was OBVIOUSLY a typo.
Everyone knows that autocorrect will change words if IT feels like you made a mistake.
Mistakes can be forgiven, being a douche however....
@Eric Burkheimer lol you're so highly ranked you even correct yourself!
I don't want to correct you, but Clark Kent and Lois Lane were also survivors of the post-Crisis continuity. They had a child and moved far away from Metropolis during the New 52 era so that they would not be mistaken for the New 52 Clark Kent and Lois Lane. Eventually, the old Superman continuity was merged with selected bits of the new 52 continuity, but it is still confusing as to what is what.
Beat me to it (someone else read Lois and Clark😃)
If he came inside her she'd die..
@@talkanders6058 that Lois and Clark series was great... it added stakes for Superman... it didn't matter how powerful he was or the villian he had to do all his "super heroing" while making sure no one saw him or found out about him. It was fantastic
It doesn't matter anyway; whatever settles down will be changed up in the next Crisis and they'll never give up on the cussed things.
@@dzzyvilanova560 Not true. The kid wouldn't have any exposure to sunlight until born. He's just dormant until he's out in the world. Think like a comic book, seriously.
Dr. Light: I have no fear
*Raven enters the room*
Dr. Light: Someone hold me
Dr.light from the teen titans cartoon wasnt even close to how he was in the comic. Ask Ralph digby
Raven *demonicly looking at him* : What ? Are you afraid of rthe dark ?
I love the comic book version of Raven.
There is also what they did to Lobo, trashing his Main Man look for something out of the Prince of Persia series looks wise and turning him from a bombastic anti hero to an unfitting tragic figure who didn't wipe out his race for a high school science project but being forced to do it due to his king's insanity.
Yup.. how hard is to get that he was a parody of 90's antihero? Even Nostalgia Critic Devil Boner is better Lobo then that ;D
Thankfully, that Lobo is gone.
couldn't agree more.
the Main Man would frag out if he saw this
It's almost like they tried to make him a real character instead of a cheap, tacky joke. FOR SHAME! But really, Lobo can go away forever. The man man's usually a poor man's Deadpool (compensating intergalactic flair for his empty personality) and this retcon actually made him interesting.
@@seymourglass26 Even if, why retcon caricature on the first place? At least in case of TMNT what make them popular was cartoon adaptation. So modern adaptations are of it. But Lobo? It did make as much sense as turning Deadpool in example of virtues.
I loved Jason Todd. I didn’t know that his resurrection was so disliked. The super punch was stupid, but I’m glad to have the Red Hood. Red Hood and the Outlaws was one of the only series I liked in the New 52.
Yea the Lazarus pit retcon was smart and redhood is one of my favorite characters now
Oi! Superboy Prime Punch gave us Red Hood. No matter how ridiculous the reason, and no matter how "some Bat fans" (aka Ewan) hate him, it was worth it.
There's a device that is placed in the damaged section of Barbara's spine which restores her control over the lower body. Thus allowing her to become Batgirl again. Her paralysis temporarily returned when a villain electro shocks the device.
I don't mind Barbara walking again and being Batgirl, but I will never understand why it took so long or why Batman didn't use the Lazarus Pit for her sooner.
@@AnthonyWLeone because it makes you nuts.
@@AnthonyWLeone Honestly, Bruce managed to walk again after being paralyzed. I'd say that it took to long for them to get around to Barbara.
Imo it ruined a major point of her character. Barbara's depth came from overcoming her disability and seeing it as an opportunity to explore the other side of her talents such as computing and showing her genius side.
@@BatmanRules she still is a genius, just let the girl walk too
At least Wally is getting a solo miniseries soon, and hopefully DC manages to actually give a shit about him. I think sometimes DC forgets that Barry isn't everyone's Flash
NO JUSTICE FOR WALLY UNTIL DAN DIDIO IS GONE!!!
Well Scott Lobdell's writing his mini so that shows they still don't seem to give that much of a shit.
@@justinpullen1097 I'll give Lobdell a chance since he can be good and Happy Death Day proves he can still be good. That said: I don't know that I want to give mopey post-HiC Wally my money; that wasn't at all what Wally was about.
@@craigwood9520 I'm gonna at least trade wait and see how the reviews are.
@@mikebatchelor slowpoke.jpeg We're supposed to be hating Tom King now.
They may have brought Wally back but they murdered his character in Heros in Crisis
Wally might return in Suicide Squad
Swanay Mohanty when he says murdered i’m pretty he means in the context of destroying everything he was supposed to be instead of what he turned out to be in the story
@@talentroller4413 yes, they did him dirty and I'm not happy.
I expected you to complain about Renegade Hal, but Rebirth? That's not a (hated) retcon, that's just good writing.
Well, it WAS a retcon, let's not kid ourselves. But the story made a lot of the Green Lantern Corps lore a lot better.
It was still a retcon, just a good one. Retcon doesn't necessarily mean something bad.
My bad, I wasn't clear. The video title implies this was a hated retcon, when it was arguably the best thing to happen to GL lore. Retcons can go either way, yeah, but I've never heard someone complain about this one.
@@Kyru82 Indeed. Because there's nothing to complain about. I never thought there'd be another Justice League member as badass as Batman (though Wonder Woman and Aquaman do try) until I read Johns' Green Lantern run and Hal's Rebirth issues.
Why not just keep the good stories when they retcon a universe -- I'm not a writer
They could redo those story's but if the universe is completely different then that makes no sense... say if Jay Garrick is from earth 1 then how can the Flash of two earth's story work... or if you retcon the Arrowverse to be in continuity with the DCEU! Now you have, 2 flashes and a Batman that is a public menace and one that no one knows about! You could merge them into one character but that doesnt work! If Barbara was never Oracle how is she Oracle?
Yall should update this for Heroes in Crisis
7:54 Joker and Harley are not a power couple. They're the exact opposite. Do you even read Batman comics?
yeah, wow, THIS IS WHY I don't usually watch "WhatCulture Comics" videos. You are right George! Harley and Joker are not a couple. man!
Prison, after what happened in Heroes in Crisis. But it won't end there definitely.
His new series flash forward is coming out soon
Is it possible Wally is going to create another flashpoint to right his wrongs?
This should be titled "10 Reasons why Ewan hates the New 52"
Exactly.
I loved Wally West but god I can't stand when his fanboys whine about me liking Barry more.
"Why? Barry is not funny and not as fast as Wally". I don't give a shit. I grew up with both and I like Barry cause I find him the most relatable speedster on what a personal life of being a speedster would be like in real life.
Wally is my favorite and Barry is my fourth favorite DC hero. But I can see what you mean. A lot of people only like Wally as Flash but don't seem to care as much about him when he's not Flash.
Wait wait wait wait
You mean to tell me you have a *DIFFERENT OPINION*
Seriously though i think any whiny fans are just a problem in general but to be fair, Wally West was ignored for years so that's probably what makes them so whiny in the first place.
Still doesn't excuse them.
@@phantomknight6428 I understand what they mean. Like I said I love Wally. I just like Barry more. But his fanboys can't accept that. They would shit on me at times I mentioned why I love Barry. Like I'm the new kid in town not knowing nothing about the classic 90s and early 2000s.
Kinda like those John Stewart fans who consider you racist of you're more of a Hal Jordan or Kyle Rayner fan.
@@chrislang8164 I'm glad you're reasonable because a lot of people can be really unreasonable when it comes to liking someone
I love Barry too
In the comics that followed Hal Jordan's resurrection, it was made clear that many lanterns still didn't trust him. In fact, Hal himself still claimed responsibility, and a lot of the early series after his return handled his own guilt. In particular, the Lost Lanterns, Green Lanterns who were off world and stranded when Hal went on his rampage.
My goal to just live in an animated series bubble and be happy. The fact they put out new content in that universe has reinvigorated those feelings.
Superman survived from the Post Crisis line too! He and Wally had a great conversation about it!
"Completely unaccountable"
Nah. Maybe not as accountable as people liked back them, but Hal's character arc was all about how, although manipulated by Parallax, he had let it in and was partly on board there, so he had to redeem himself.
Gotta disagree with GL.. gotta love Hal, man
I was originally a Hal fan and was very upset when they turned him villain. However, that said, both Kyle and Guy grew on me. Kyle, I think, is arguably the better GL, since he actually does think more deeply about what he does and as an artist uses the ring more creatively. Guy started out somewhere between comic relief and nigh villain but his character development was believable and he ended up the proverbial better person. I thought he was a lot more interesting when he tossed the ring entirely and discovered he had innate alien powers.
The one thing I really liked from the New 52 was Wonder Woman's new Origin of her being a Demigodess although I hope eventually DC takes a page from the Justice League Animated Series which implied that Hades was really her Farther which could produce some really compelling Storytelling in the Comics
I also like the origin that was introduced in the New 52 as she was the child of Zeus & her mother making her a demigoddess, rather than being sculpted from clay.
@@biggiejerseysTV yes
If I remember correctly there was also a storyline with her having a brother but I haven't read that one.
Also, having the Amazons act as the Sirens of the Greek Mythology makes sense.
Actually, in one of his labors Hercules had deal with some wild horses that would eat some humans when they would rampage, only to find out later that they were actually women who were cursed by one of the 12 gods for something.
Athanasios Demertzis well that is accurate
I was never to much fond with the idea of Wonder Woman being Zeus's daughter. Personally I would have gone with Hercules since both he and Hippolyta have history, especially this would make Hera and even Ares encounter with Wonder Woman even more personal.
The New 52. To paraphrase Zoolander it made me feel like I was on crazy pills.
He's getting his own Solo Miniseries
I remember when the Powergirl retcon was a thing. Ah simpler times.
I prefer Barbra being able to walk plus I like both new 52 Batgirl runs and believe changing her design, giving her a more distinctive colour scheme was good idea, Purple is good colour for gordan.
I agree. Only 1 Batgirl and that's Barbara Gordon.
She was much better and compelling as Oracle. Not to mention being Batgirl again ruined Barbara's character development as Oracle and Stephanie Brown being a succesor as Batgirl. Its regression tbh.
I'm pretty sure DC fans are happy now about Jason Todd's resurrection given he has since become one of the most popular characters as the Red Hood
Don't know why new 52 get so much hate
Wally got the short end of the rebirth and return. I like both Wally and Barry as the Flash, just wish they didn't get rid of him like they did and just did the New 52 as a new earth story like Earth 1 is
@@Fiiwse5676 well Wally always operate in Keystone City while Barry in Central City. Wish he would have his Flash suit from Vol.2 #50 with white iris and crimson colour with shiny metal highlights. Other than that his new suit is awesome, just to show how his KF suit was well designed, probably better than Barry's Flash costume.
@@Fiiwse5676 I think there was a debate when Wally got his own KF costume (not just a small copy of Barry's), which one is better. I still think its great since it has Wally's hair shown. While not practical, it certainly can be used by the artist to convey motions and winds by movement of the hair. While I think Barry's costume was a classic, yet feels modern, I think Wally's costume with Stylized belt and metal highlights was an improvement compared to Barry's old costume. Possibly the best.
"Here's hoping he's back for good"
So when was this recorded?
What about how everyone just forgot about the JSA?
Which is why I say Flash of Two Worlds was DC's original sin, retconwise.
Yeah, about Wally being back.....
He's joining Suicide Squad.
Jon Brewer he better not istg. There’s like 6 evil speedsters I can think of off the top of my head, just use one of them. Edward Clarris The Rival, Thawne, Zoom, Inertia, Negative Flash Meena and Godspeed
@@nightsbeatswitch9950 But now he's, you know, a mass murderer. Yeah, it was dumb af. (Really? Automated therapy? Really?)
I do you one better: how is wally?
HulK TopF: Why is Wally?
HulK TopF not good he had a panic attack that killed his best friend
7:31 I miss clay given life by the gods Wonder Woman. And when she had actual weak points, like Batman still being a flesh and blood human (in theory), and Sups STILL have viable weaknesses (magic, the countless forms of Kryptonite, red sunlight) in spite of being the most powerful being on the planet.
Not to mentions the new 52 did do a lot of damage to a lot of legacy characters like superboy Conner Kent the teen titans and so many others that it wasn’t even funny, also I am so happy that the new 52 Superman and Wonder Woman relationship is dead buried because I am more of a fan of Superman and Lois Lane as husband and wife and they have there son Jonathan Samuel Kent superboy the son of Superman and Lois Lane who is tons of fun and adorable in my opinion.
It made sense in the new 52 for them to be a couple but I get your point and yes there were some bad things and if you too but there were some good things as well you got to take the good with the bad
@@dcmarvelcomicfans9458 true yes there was some good but it wasn't going to last unfortunately and the end result of the new 52 was nothing more then a complete disaster that it took 5 years of garbage to finally get someone at the higher ups to realized the new 52 was a huge mistake and people weren't going to take it anymore.
DC didn't retire the JSA to a parallel Earth in the 1950's, they simply cancelled them outright because superheroes were no longer popular with readers. Earth-2 wasn't a concept to DC in 1952. What DC did under the pen of Gardner Fox in 1961, was explain in narrative the reason for the retirement of the heroes and why characters like Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman have no idea of their existence. Parallel Earths! Even so, Flash of Two Worlds was a one off story, but strong sales and favorable responses from the readers prompted the entire JSA to return.
Bringing Babs back as Batgirl also had the effect of deleting Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown for a couple of years
Bendis's run on Superman should be considered a disappoontment
Ascendance nuclear man?
8:59 Given it's a setting of the 30th century, I imagine their timeline is always in flux.
While Hal is my favorite GL I have always loved how you can write so much about the GLs like the Jedi; If Geoff Johns didn’t do such a great job bring Hal back, I would have left him dead for the sake of making so many more GL books with various other lanterns not just the earth ones
The New 52 at DC and "Fear Itself" over at Marvel pretty much killed my efforts to keep up with comics at all.
There is only so many times I can hear, "This is the worst thing ever" (Marvel) or, "This has never happened before" (DC) before it just loses all meaning.
The 2nd should be missing wally and 1st should be turning wally into a murderer
I'm surprised you didn't mention what they did to Lobo, fucking hate what they did to him
Across the multiverse, only two things remain constant...
Superman and Lois Lane become an item,
and the whole universe will get reset and the Flash is the only one who remembers any of it.
Wait on another list you were praising the green lantern retcon
I actually really like the New 52 Flash comics.
Me to
Only if you like it despite knowledge about old stuff it would make comment valid. It is natural that new fans usually like new series. Failure of New 52 was that it divided fandom.
I am someone who was reading comics in early 90s BUT I really liked the New 52.
Yeah, it had good and bad things but to me it was enjoyable.
What I hate is that New 52, just like the Ultimate Universe in Marvel tried New things, starting from ground zero and fans hated both of these for many, many reasons.
Aaaaand, Superman being with Wonder Woman is BEST storyline, no matter that Booster Gold, out of all the future characters, had to time jump to prevent them from hooking up.
@@athanasiosdemertzis8847 Outside that I disagree with you on many levels. I should point out that Marvel was at least smart enough to test radical changes in completely separate universe. It did failed, but it didn't pull everything else with it, like New 52 did.
Luke Thomas rebirth series
10 reasons to hate the New 52 XD
Wait, had Parrallax being a separate entity really come about in Rebirth? I could've sworn they established that much, much earlier in DC
Late reply, but it’s a different rebirth than the more recent one. You’re right to think it was earlier
Hawkman deserves a movie of his own
Tom King you son of @^#%$
@Ante Herco ok boomer
The less said about The Legion of Super Heroes, the better. Used to love that series.
Anyone else notice that the more diverse or "woke" comics get, the fewer red-heads they have?
The 'woke' crowd really seems to have an issue with red heads. Find any red headed character and you can bet they want to change them into a black person.
Who tf gives a shit about the red heads? Also Batwoman and Poison Ivy are both lesbians and have red hair. Go back to crying about the Little Mermaid recast.
Wally's back for good? Well, about that, Heroes in Crisis happened.
As for the New 52, I really really liked most of it. I might be one of the minority here but I liked that they tried something different.
I think that the New 52 from DC and the Ultimate universe from Marvel were GREAT and they should have kept them. But that's just me.
Yes, HIC happend, but Wally is also a getting a solo called Flash Forward where he will get his redemption.
As 30 year DC fan i have to confess that list was PERFECT!!!
I hate heroes in crisis it ruined everything with my flash Wally west
Blame the editor who started the new 52 and Tom King the worst Batman writer ever
Tevya Smolka yeah
@@srstriker6420 indeed
Tevya Smolka 👍🏻
We're not gonna mention "heroes in Crisis?
Heroes in Crisis isn't a retcon so much as a hated arc. By the end it just leaves you with a scrunched up brow saying wtf?! DC seemed to use it as a way to say Barry is the one true Flash so all the Wally fans can just go sit in a corner and get over it. It showed how trauma and loss can have an effect on people but still...
@@igitaq it wasnt done well. Many liked HiC because it showed heroes trauma, but in reality theyre only praising the concept, while the excecution was done poorly. Many characters was written to fit the narative, not the other way around. It felt really unnatural with characters doing stupid things or being badass for no reason (for ex, Harley defeated the trinity ON HER OWN).
I personally loved Wally west my flash more then barry Allen flash mostly because Wally west is the flash I grew up with and it blows my mind that Wally west my flash keeps getting screwed over while Barry Allen flash gets all the love, now don’t get me wrong I know some people like Barry Allen that’s fine you are entitled to your own opinions and in fact j am glad you guys like Barry Allen but for me personally i loved Wally west my flash even more then Barry Allen but that’s just my opinion.
@@Fiiwse5676 i can understand that and i respect your opinion on barry allen too and in fact nothing would make me happy but to see all of the flash family Jay garrick the first flash Barry allen flash Wally west flash his wife Linda park & his kids Irey & Jai wally's kids and Bart allen kid flash finally back together again as a family that would be tons of fun and badass. Also another thing i would really love to happen is to see Jonathan Samuel Kent superboy & Damian Wayne Robin meeting Wally kids Irey and Jai so they could go on fun adventures as the Super sons and daughters that would be really cute and adorable :).
@@Fiiwse5676 actually funny enough before the new 52 actually happened i think Wally west my flash did had his own town to look after i think it was keystone city not central city but unfortunately when the new 52 happened his city and his family got erased from existence which sucks.
Yeah, I always knew about Barry Allen, but I grew up with Wally West as well.
All The World's A Stage! Indeed and I can agree with that
Quite frankly, if it was up to Didio, he wouldn't have hesitated to have gotten rid of all the characters that were part of the New Teen Titans outside of Raven, Starfire and Cyborg.
I'm ok with the idea of Paralax as it made way for the other entities. I do think they could handle it better.
Never knew people hated n°6 tbh
Punkero245 Seems like it's more of a personal bias from Whatculture's writers, actually. I remember GL Rebirth was greatly loved when it came out, aside from the die-hard Kyle Rayner fans. Then again, Whatculture also listed Hal's return as one of the "most hated" comic book resurrections too, so there you go...
They don't. Watch Culture has a bias against Hal. It becomes pretty abundant in a lot of their videos when they bring him up as mentioned above.
Ok, as for the Parallax thing, people were far far more pissed off about Emerald Twilight than they were about Green Lantern Rebirth. And it wasn't even a bad retcon, as it explained the Yellow impurity, and almost no one forgave Hal for what he did, especially not himself. That was shown even in GLR.
And while " the others rose to the task", no they didn't. Hal was always the most popular lantern, even after Final Night and into Morrison's run with Rainer.
I don't deny it was a retcon, but I honestly haven't seen anyone hate Geoff John's Green Lantern runs, especially not Rebirth. Might just be because Hal fans cover it up, but most people agree it was good.
No you're right. Comic fans loved Green Lantern Rebirth. It's just certain "fans" hate that Hal gets more attention than everyone else, especially folks that grew up with John Stewart in the JL cartoon.
So they try to frame Hal coming back as a bad thing when in reality everyone pretty much loved him coming back and the explanation that Parallax was the reason for emerald twilight.
The Rebirth explanation is satisfactory though...
Whatculture comics: Where's Wally.
Me: "Better question. Why is Wally?!
Heroes in Crisis, though....
pretty sure hawk and dove were siblings, at least in one incarnation possible the last one
The original Hawk & Dove were brothers, Don (Dove) and Hank (Hawk) Hall. During "Crisis On Infinite Earths" Don Hall died and his powers were transferred to Dawn Granger, who became the new Dove.
Later, a villain named Monarch appeared and turned out to be a future version of Hank Hall who was an absolute dictator in the future and killed all of the other heroes. Monarch killed Dove and then Hawk killed Monarch. In that moment, the powers of both Hawk and Dove fused into Hank Hall and he became Monarch, and then Monarch fused with Waverider to become Extant.
Later, Dove (Dawn Granger) returned to life and her sister Holly became the new Hawk.
After that point, I don't know the details but apparently with The 52 Hawk & Dove returned to being Hank Hall and Dawn Granger. I'm not sure how much of the above is still in continuity.
It's too many retcons that really sucks!
Wally West is the best Flash
I agree with you
DC is known for their CRISIS series...so much so that it gave their continuity existential crises.
It's the primary reason why I never bought the New 52 Series
6:45 The reincarnation angle you think would allow some leeway in their backstory.
...and people say Geoff Johns is good for DC? All but one of the complaints in this can be traced back to Geoff Johns “fixes”
Really not as hated as the video makes them out to be, more picking some mildly divisive stuff there. Like Green Lantern: Rebirth is a largely lauded title.
I happen to take issue with such complaints and think Geoff Johns a masterful writer.
Barbara should be Oracle
Stephanie should be Batgirl
Tim Red Robin pre new 52 suit
Wally main Flash, Barry dead
Bart Allen Kid Flash
Titans shouldn’t be shat on with every occasion especially since they have a TV show.
JL ROSTER: Superman
Batman
Wonder Woman
Flash Wally West
Green Lantern Kyle, John or Jessica
Martian Manhunter
Hawk girl
Aqua man
Doomsday clock is the worst thing that DC has ever done
They retcon the new 52...in dooms day clock...and wally is back died or in jail for murder
Glad to know I'm not the only one confused about Hawkman, specially after reading Metal, also because of that stupid Legion nobody knows Superboy got ruined as a character.
How is Jason Food getting brought back to life due to the superboy prime punch on here?
Why do folks complain about Wally accidentally killing people when Hawkman is now shown to have killed millions?
coz wally always had a code against killing. Most if not all flashes don't kill period. Its a big thing if they take a life. Hawkman never set those principles
I'm a lifelong Barbara Gordon fan and I'm ecstatic that she's back as Batgirl. Oracle was wonderful, but it made no sense in the DC Universe that she would stay disabled -what with characters being brought back from the dead every week and other bat characters have their spines heal and all.
Was there ever an explanation given in universe about how the spinal damage was undone?
@@billygreci9739 I believe it was explained as some experimental neural implant surgery that she had done in South Africa. Which makes sense to me in a comics universe.
@@no1wonderfan921 Got it.
Surprised martian manhunter being taken out of the justice league isnt on here.
Honestly I kind of just wish they would let characters age naturally and get replaced over time and move on with a cohesive story
Wally getting Blackwashed was also really bad. Also fringing isn't real.
not blackwashing wasnt wally its wallace different character idiot.
@@neonsamurai4604 Yeah, I'm sure they planned this from the beginning to introduce two Wally's
Blackwashing is not a thing.
Fridging is.
Deal with it.
@@Fiiwse5676 The show came out 4 years after
@@TimTE01 I realise you have no actual defense and I brought up something that clearly upsets you but at least try and come up with a defense instead of just saying that. What do you call a (usually) white character being tokenised? Diversity? cause it's not. And fridging is just something SJW comic writers came up with.
There is a new 1, its brian michael bendis new run on superman, it ruin eveything tommasi worked on including the new fan favorite character jonathan kent, we went from the greatest superman run to one of the most mediocre ones.
I did not like heros in crisis TBH I understand what they was trying to do with sanctuary but it felt dumb and bland to me
Only thing I liked about the New 52 was the Shazam stories
Nightwing was okay, both as a secret agent and apparently as someone who was almost trained as an assassin.
Ok the Barbara Gordon thing let me explain when lex was good he fixed Barbara Gordon’s spine and helped make the suit
I knew because how much you hate Hal Jordan he'd be on this list
Yep. That Hal Jordan hate video he released the other day was ridiculous.
Crisis on Infinite Earths really accomplished nothing except prolong a simple necessity - get rid of the multiverse - unnecessarily. It was the books that followed (especially John Byrne's Man of Steel and George Perez' Wonder Woman) that would iron out the DC Universe for the next twenty-five years. That's why DC had two Green Arrows and two Wonder Womans (Wonder Women?) for about 6 months until DC figured out whether they WANTED two Green Arrows and two Wonder Women. So, technically, Crisis was a failure, but it did serve a necessary purpose.
Oh, and I HATED New 52/Rebirth. The one was pathetic; the other was a pathetic attempt to FIX the pathetic. It turned me off DC for almost 5 years.
Since it's a name, Wonder Womans is really the correct usage...but most seem to favor "Batmen, Supermen, Wonder Women."
And while New 52 really messed things up, I thought Rebirth did miracles at bringing the old DC charm back. Flash and Teen Titans especially benefited from Rebirth.
In my opinion, the problem with "Crisis On Infinite Earths" was that they didn't go far enough. I think many of the problems were the result to trying to keep some of the old continuity despite the problems that it might create. As an example, they made it that Superman was never a Superboy but that created so many problems with the Legion of Super-Heroes (for years the Creative Teams had to keep trying fix after fix after fix) that The Creative Team ended up wiping out everything and starting all over again from scratch because they reached a point where they were spending more time fixing problems than telling stories.
@@Solitaire001 Exactly. The same for Power Girl, who had six origins over the next ten years before they finally threw up their hands in defeat and just brought back Earth 2 so she had an origin again.
Sorry, but I love Barbara Gordon as batgirl
Aaaaah the Legion of Superheroes. My favorite team from DC. If you want to read a great, self contained story to get the team either read 'Superman and the Legion of Superheroes' by Johns or 'Legion Lost'. The 2004 one not the New 52 one.
...so. Who wants to tell him who the murderer was in "Heroes in Crisis"?
Awww you called her Babs! 😍😍😍
I wonder if heroes in crises will be listed someday
"Here's hoping Wally West is back for good" Hahahahaha. After Heroes in Crisis and a Flash War, wally was nixed... only to be the next Doctor Manhattan/Metron. In other words... nope Wally's gone.
Hate on the New 52 all you want, but like you said it was a gateway, it's how I got started with DC. Unlike the Crises before it, it was an actual place where someone whose knowledge about the DCU was based entirely in Batman, Superman, and the Justice League TAS. I wasn't burdened with having to know 50 years of lore to get on board. Eventually yes I want back and read the classics, but I didn't have to work around the gatekeepers to enjoy what I was reading. Something that a lot of modern fans who started with the MCU films are encountering trying to bridge into the comics.
Where's Waldo is a children's book... 🖐
PS pretty much every WhatCulture list seems to have something negative to say about Azzarello’s Wonder Woman but I distinctly remember just about everybody loving the series and it’s changes when it was coming out. WTF WhatCulture? Ditto for John’s Green Lantern rebirth.
WW was definitely one of the best comics of the New 52, especially because it wasn't crossover laden, and was allowed to tell its own distinct story start to finish.
I really hate they undid Azzarello's gods with Rucka after Rebirth, Azzarello's gods were fascinating, and they just reverted back to bog standard deities. Not nearly as interesting.
Heroes in Crisis specifically with Prison.
Look The Flash tv show got me into DC comics but Wally West is and always will be my flash
Didn't they make Wally West into some kind of serial killer? Or was that retconned too?
So basically the New 52 sucks. Already thought that.