Great lessons as maint. due. Also, I take note of how well the scraping was done in past *manufacture and assembly. All along the tasks, how a focus of inspection to movement is a key part of re-assembly with accurate check and re-check. Quite all the effort to best performance as tool meets job and chip metrics. Properly schooled, I am heading for my workshop with a renewed energy and safety glasses. To fire up my old relic as a South bend lathe as not so much for any paying job as more to enjoy craftsmanship. It is fitted as an upgrade with a very nice quality 3 jaw chuck. My thinking as influenced where best simplicity might benefit workpiece .Thank's Max, for the great videos. *M.
Max, I really like your machine repair videos. You do a great job explaining how each machine works and your repairs are always spot on. Looking forward to part two!
A shaper and a tool cutter grinder… Oh and a surface grinder.. and maybe a lathe tool grinder…. Well maybe a horizontal mill too. Just a couple more machines I need. But I don’t have the room yet. Need to build the barn first. But “baby steps” as they say I guess. Either way I still enjoy watching you go at it. It’s interesting to see how things work and how things are made anyhow. Another great video Sir. Thank you once again. 🍻
Hello Max. Until you mentioned the blanking screws/plugs @ 40 mins, I was totally confused. I was saying - how can this work? Good fix with the shim. I really enjoy watching you put your wealth of experience and knowledge to work before our eyes. Much appreciated. Thanks.
There are too many people in this world lacking mechanical sympathy, that somehow get their hands on tools and machine tools, causing generally unneccessary levels of stress for the rest of us. Still - here we are and another machine brought back from the verge of destruction. Excellent!
G'day Max, looking forward to your take on inspection and tune up of the shaper. Hopefully i will pick up some tips for mine even if it is only 1/2 the size Odd that an Italian machine has BSW
Listening to your descriptions and how you work takes me back to my childhood days in the 60’s you’re just like my dad. Cock in a shirt sleeve was something my dad used to say. 👍
Looks like a pretty decently thought out and built machine. My 18" Elliott does not have a built-in oil system, the machine is total loss, you fill all the oil cups before and during use and the oil gradually flows through the machine and drips out on the floor, but then it is British so its playing to type. It does have one handy feature, that being that is possible to pass a 70mm dia bar through the machine under the ram.
Max, in case you don't have a foundation drawing for *your* shaper, you can find copies of the foundation drawings for Cincinnati Shapers on Vintage Machinery. You obviously don't need their Parts Lists, Operator's Manuals, Service manuals, or Setup manuals, but they are there too for Cincinnati Shapers. I'm pointing them out only because I have to ASSuME that these big shapers are all very similar in construction/operation. Thumbs up! ;)
Thanks . I will be fabricating a large RHS frame that gets bolted to the floor . It needs the extra height of the frame for the table elevation screw as it will hit the floor . Cheers 👍
No power but Max finds a repair without electricity. Always has a great understanding of mechanics. While the rest of the population is going to bunnings, max just makes it.
There's at least ONE problem, and possibly TWO with this machine's crank throw adjustment: The carriage that slides in the yoke, has no defined stop(think of the wedged gib as you would a lathe cross slide(Always clamped/adjusted at BOTH ENDS). Possibly second is the tail end support of the adjustment screw. - the screw MUST ALWAYS BE RIGID, but free to adjust(think lathe lead screw). If it has no support(dead or live(rotating support), then change it - machine tool manufacturers get things wrong too. For machines like this(high impact/transient loads, require HIGH TACK/COMPRESSION OILS. If specifically blended oils are a problem, then use. 90 grade GEAR(Yes it stinks and is as toxic as hell) oil mixed with 30-50 grade hydraulic oils until your satisfied. Keep up. The great posts.. Ps I exclaimed "crap", just before I was pleasantly surprised when you said it(gotta love YT algos)! 👍👍👍
Max this is going to be a great series for us Shaper fans. I need to take my 7" Southbend apart and fix a clogged oil line also. Pump works fine but only one side gets oil as it should. You are certainly right about them being open. Jon from Jon's Workshop had one that was full of swarf when he took it apart. I will be stuck to this series like glue to a fly strip.
as another viewer said I enjoy watching you repair the old machines.in the shop. I think they are as good or better than when they were new. I voting for you to not only cut the sides in the shaper but cut the "V" on the shaper as well. KOKO!
Yup, that should stop its farting in church! 😜 Another fascinating video Max. One by one you will bring these machines back to fully operational. Keep up the good work. 👍
Great job Max. . pretty amazing how you figure out what is right and what is wrong and the best part, how you decide to fix it. . and it all works great. .
Hi Max, Cork and felt on a machine tool, who would have thought that after 100 plus years that they were still the best method of wiping. Those guys knew a thing or two. Looking forward to seeing a chip or two. Best wishes, Mal.
Your diagnostic skills are up to snuff eh. The few times you've been around the block have learned you a thing or two. Good content Max. That shaper appears to be a good one. Your machine inventory seems to be class a stuff. Obviously you have an eye for the good used machines. You've put together a great shop mate that any , machinist worth his salt would be happy to work in. Goes to show that experience is invaluable and that young folk need to look to guys like you more often to learn, but it seems the CNC world turned its nose up at manual machining, which is stupid cause CNC was built on the mannual machining. This world is heading in some strange directions that make me scratch my head a lot. This new generation has access to more information than any other, but seems to be getting stupider. Good show Max!
@@swanvalleymachineshop I forgot to say that you have a knack for teaching Max, and it appears you enjoy sharing knowledge. I am also a fairly good teacher with a need for sharing knowledge. But some look at that as: ”your a know it all", and that can be hurtful, but I try not to let it bother me too much. I think the RUclips platform idea is a great one and has had a real impact on all societies worldwide. It's wonderful to have a way to share knowledge with strangers who can appreciate it. Your a good teach Max, and I for one am grateful for you sharing your knowledge and for providing entertaining content for me to watch. THANK YOU! Cheers mate, see you in the next one. 👍
Hi Max, hate oil leaks, glad you fixed it and the over adjusted slider block. Wondering if the wedge on the slider block moved during operation, surely someone wouldn't adjust it that tight? Need something like a MC cover to throw over her to prevent any foreign objects going into the sump when not in use.
G'day Max. Excellent Tutorial Video on being very meticulous on how to diagnose & repair or adjust your shaper. With the oil grub screw / valve, the oil leaking past the threads vertically, wondering if a minimal sized Neoprene or similar material washer be fitted around the grub screw. I realise you used the alloy strip that appeared to solve the problem. Excellent overall job, Well Done. 👍🏻
I really enjoy these videos. Never ceases to amaze me of the way past owners make adjustments to kit that are not required, or fail to put them back together correctly, that oiling port in the top port was a prime example, maybe the machine was reassembled by a different person to the one that stripped it down... We'll never know :) Do you have a date of manufacture for your machine?
Pretty appropriate Whitworth fasteners on the Whitworth invented Bull Gear Crank shaper mechanism……. Those old tools take us back Max….Were they your Dads ?
All of Dad's workshop stuff was sold at auction when he passed away , i was working away at that time & got fu--ked over by the step family . I just have a few bits . I did not know Whitworth invented the Bull Gear . Cheers 👍
I know the feeling , living in Perth ! Generally the ones that pop up here on a rare occasion are British built ones but have already been around the world 6 times . 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop Seriously, considering importing one from India. You can buy one brand-new from the manufacturer for less than you will pay the thieving local machinery “dealers” for a worn out piece of junk.
Max couldn’t further screwing in the set screw on the top part of the oil galley adjust the oil flow through the tube? Unless I’m mistaken it’s like a cruciform where the oil comes up, the tube that you adjusted goes across and is fed with 2 set screws blocking the path from the top and operation side of the machine.
Great diagnosis, dissection and repair, that thrust washer is strange as you state, is the external radius to fling oil? Good catch on the adjustable gib cross lube tube, possibly in hindsight felt packing couod be used? Strange that BSF threads are used, didn't think England travelled to South America 🤔 lol. Thanks for sharing
@@swanvalleymachineshop Just looked up the manufacturer of the shaper, what popped up was a 6 part YT with your actual machine, ref identified by number 3 stamping, and missing paint patch. Found Zocca grinding machines though. TTFN John
If the hole on the dovetail is too small for the amount of oil being pumped to it, why not just adjust the valve for that tube down slightly until the input matches the output? It is there a pressure requirement that prevents that?
Max, the ram adjustment side didn't seem to be getting anywhere near the same amount of oil that the other side did. Is that going to be a problem down the line?
Thanks Max, what type of oil is used in those as I am sure a gear oil might be too thick and with the stroke mechanism, I have not been able to fully understand how the fast return of the ram acts, I know it has something to do with the bull gear but just puzzled as to how. I came across a shaper that did this the wrong way round an had a slow return. Thanks.
The return stroke happens over less than half of a complete rotation of the bull gear, so the ram has to reach a greater speed during the return stroke. If you draw a circle and then draw a V around it, you can see the points where the lines of the V touch the edge of the circle are not even around the circumference, this is how the shaper operates.
Usually 46 or 68 hyd oil will be fine . I run 15w40 diesel engine oil in my one . If the return stroke is slower than the cutting stroke , the wiring is wrong on a 3 phase motor . 2 of the phases just need to be swapped over . If the feed is back to front but the stroke is right , the feed drive & rod are on the wrong side of the centre of the drive hub . I will try & point that out next shaper video . Cheers 👍
Max, I enjoy your work! Practical, no added theater; just get it done! Thank you Max!
Cheers 👍
It's like being in the shop with grandpa and he's teaching us about machines. Reliving my childhood agqin.
Lol , Cheers 👍
I think he just be called you an ol fart Max….. 😁👍🏻
😂 haha
Grandpa 😂🎉
@@RalfyCustoms lol, 😆
Nothing wrong with a little age. As long as it comes with wisdom !
Haha
@@jasonhull5712 What's wrong with being an old fart?
Amazing what care and perseverance can bring out of an old but indestructible machine !
Thanks 👍
Great lessons as maint. due. Also, I take note of how well the scraping was done in past *manufacture and assembly. All along the tasks, how a focus of inspection to movement is a key part of re-assembly with accurate check and re-check. Quite all the effort to best performance as tool meets job and chip metrics. Properly schooled, I am heading for my workshop with a renewed energy and safety glasses. To fire up my old relic as a South bend lathe as not so much for any paying job as more to enjoy craftsmanship. It is fitted as an upgrade with a very nice quality 3 jaw chuck. My thinking as influenced where best simplicity might benefit workpiece .Thank's Max, for the great videos. *M.
Cheers 👍
Max, I really like your machine repair videos. You do a great job explaining how each machine works and your repairs are always spot on. Looking forward to part two!
Thanks 👍
A shaper and a tool cutter grinder…
Oh and a surface grinder..
and maybe a lathe tool grinder….
Well maybe a horizontal mill too.
Just a couple more machines I need. But I don’t have the room yet. Need to build the barn first.
But “baby steps” as they say I guess.
Either way I still enjoy watching you go at it. It’s interesting to see how things work and how things are made anyhow.
Another great video Sir. Thank you once again. 🍻
Thanks . I started in a 4m x 5m shed ! 👍
Hello Max. Until you mentioned the blanking screws/plugs @ 40 mins, I was totally confused. I was saying - how can this work? Good fix with the shim. I really enjoy watching you put your wealth of experience and knowledge to work before our eyes. Much appreciated. Thanks.
No worries 👍
A man and his shaper, doing stuff that needs to be done. Carry on, sir.
Thanks 👍
There are too many people in this world lacking mechanical sympathy, that somehow get their hands on tools and machine tools, causing generally unneccessary levels of stress for the rest of us. Still - here we are and another machine brought back from the verge of destruction. Excellent!
Cheers . 👍
G'day Max, looking forward to your take on inspection and tune up of the shaper. Hopefully i will pick up some tips for mine even if it is only 1/2 the size
Odd that an Italian machine has BSW
Thanks . A metric machine with BSW , made in Brazil ! 👍
Listening to your descriptions and how you work takes me back to my childhood days in the 60’s you’re just like my dad. Cock in a shirt sleeve was something my dad used to say. 👍
Lol , My Dad used to say the same thing ! 👍
Looks like a pretty decently thought out and built machine.
My 18" Elliott does not have a built-in oil system, the machine is total loss, you fill all the oil cups before and during use and the oil gradually flows through the machine and drips out on the floor, but then it is British so its playing to type.
It does have one handy feature, that being that is possible to pass a 70mm dia bar through the machine under the ram.
Cheers 👍
Max, in case you don't have a foundation drawing for *your* shaper, you can find copies of the foundation drawings for Cincinnati Shapers on Vintage Machinery. You obviously don't need their Parts Lists, Operator's Manuals, Service manuals, or Setup manuals, but they are there too for Cincinnati Shapers. I'm pointing them out only because I have to ASSuME that these big shapers are all very similar in construction/operation. Thumbs up! ;)
Thanks . I will be fabricating a large RHS frame that gets bolted to the floor . It needs the extra height of the frame for the table elevation screw as it will hit the floor . Cheers 👍
Always educational, always interesting.
Thanks Rob . Been meaning to call you to see if that letter had arrived . The cutters are on their way over form our East coast on a truck ! Cheers 👍
ive been on the lookout for a shaper, not many shops have them but mine will. love the work max
Thanks . They still have their uses in the shop . 👍
No power but Max finds a repair without electricity. Always has a great understanding of mechanics.
While the rest of the population is going to bunnings, max just makes it.
Lol , had to go to Bunnings to buy the no stink Kero & red oxide primer for the JFMT's chip trays ! 👍
G'day Max, only just popped up in my feeds, sat down with Chook for tea, pants o'clock on a summers day 😂 happy days mate
Lol , don't get sunburnt ! 👍
There's at least ONE problem, and possibly TWO with this machine's crank throw adjustment:
The carriage that slides in the yoke, has no defined stop(think of the wedged gib as you would a lathe cross slide(Always clamped/adjusted at BOTH ENDS).
Possibly second is the tail end support of the adjustment screw. - the screw MUST ALWAYS BE RIGID, but free to adjust(think lathe lead screw).
If it has no support(dead or live(rotating support), then change it - machine tool manufacturers get things wrong too.
For machines like this(high impact/transient loads, require HIGH TACK/COMPRESSION OILS.
If specifically blended oils are a problem, then use. 90 grade GEAR(Yes it stinks and is as toxic as hell) oil mixed with 30-50 grade hydraulic oils until your satisfied.
Keep up. The great posts..
Ps I exclaimed "crap", just before I was pleasantly surprised when you said it(gotta love YT algos)!
👍👍👍
Cheers 👍
Max this is going to be a great series for us Shaper fans. I need to take my 7" Southbend apart and fix a clogged oil line also. Pump works fine but only one side gets oil as it should. You are certainly right about them being open. Jon from Jon's Workshop had one that was full of swarf when he took it apart. I will be stuck to this series like glue to a fly strip.
Cheers . 👍
as another viewer said I enjoy watching you repair the old machines.in the shop. I think they are as good or better than when they were new. I voting for you to not only cut the sides in the shaper but cut the "V" on the shaper as well. KOKO!
Thanks 👍
Excellent job mate.
Thanks 👍
Yup, that should stop its farting in church! 😜
Another fascinating video Max. One by one you will bring these machines back to fully operational.
Keep up the good work. 👍
Cheers 👍
Hi from Nacogdoches, Texas. This is shaping up to be a great video.
Lol , Cheers 👍
Olá amigo gostei de mais este trabalho!!!
Boa sorte sempre!!!
Thanks 👍
Great video max the slotter we had would still be working if you were in are shop 👍👍👍
Thanks 👍
Great job Max. . pretty amazing how you figure out what is right and what is wrong and the best part, how you decide to fix it. . and it all works great. .
Thanks 👍
Hi Max, Cork and felt on a machine tool, who would have thought that after 100 plus years that they were still the best method of wiping. Those guys knew a thing or two. Looking forward to seeing a chip or two. Best wishes, Mal.
Cheers 👍
Hi max, thanks for another awesome video,
From kiwi land
No worries . 👍
Your diagnostic skills are up to snuff eh. The few times you've been around the block have learned you a thing or two. Good content Max. That shaper appears to be a good one. Your machine inventory seems to be class a stuff. Obviously you have an eye for the good used machines. You've put together a great shop mate that any , machinist worth his salt would be happy to work in. Goes to show that experience is invaluable and that young folk need to look to guys like you more often to learn, but it seems the CNC world turned its nose up at manual machining, which is stupid cause CNC was built on the mannual machining. This world is heading in some strange directions that make me scratch my head a lot. This new generation has access to more information than any other, but seems to be getting stupider. Good show Max!
So true Eric . We did not have the benefits of google ! 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop I forgot to say that you have a knack for teaching Max, and it appears you enjoy sharing knowledge. I am also a fairly good teacher with a need for sharing knowledge. But some look at that as: ”your a know it all", and that can be hurtful, but I try not to let it bother me too much. I think the RUclips platform idea is a great one and has had a real impact on all societies worldwide. It's wonderful to have a way to share knowledge with strangers who can appreciate it. Your a good teach Max, and I for one am grateful for you sharing your knowledge and for providing entertaining content for me to watch. THANK YOU! Cheers mate, see you in the next one. 👍
Thank you Max!
Cheers 👍
Hi Max, hate oil leaks, glad you fixed it and the over adjusted slider block.
Wondering if the wedge on the slider block moved during operation, surely someone wouldn't adjust it that tight?
Need something like a MC cover to throw over her to prevent any foreign objects going into the sump when not in use.
Maybe it was adjusted at either end of the stroke , it was not so tight there . 👍
G'day Max. Excellent Tutorial Video on being very meticulous on how to diagnose & repair or adjust your shaper.
With the oil grub screw / valve, the oil leaking past the threads vertically, wondering if a minimal sized Neoprene or similar material washer be fitted around the grub screw.
I realise you used the alloy strip that appeared to solve the problem.
Excellent overall job, Well Done. 👍🏻
Cheers Ted . I first thought of an O ring . 👍
thats a good repair max ! you always go for the extra mile about reparing stuff, i like that !
cheers
ben.
Thanks 👍
The shaper does not seem like it has had alot of use. Looking forward to more on it. Cheers
Thanks 👍
It will be interesting to see how much sag the ram has at full stroke. Also, will be interesting to see how you measure it.
No worries , next shaper video . 👍
A job well done. 👍
Thanks 👍
Great video.
Cheers 👍
Hey Max great Job.
👍👍👍
Love the content - keep it coming
Thanks 👍
Nice camera work, Max.
Thanks 👍
Nice video Max, enjoyed it, Thanks--- Mike,Loving,Texas
Thanks 👍
Braziliense Machine. God job Max.
Thanks 👍
Nice work Max, enjoyed watching. Cheers Tony
Thanks 👍
Good job as usual . We expect great things .. thanks for sharing
Cheers 👍
I never seen anyone tackle with yoke mechanism before, Very impressive.
No worries 👍
Great videos !!
Thanks 👍
I really enjoy these videos. Never ceases to amaze me of the way past owners make adjustments to kit that are not required, or fail to put them back together correctly, that oiling port in the top port was a prime example, maybe the machine was reassembled by a different person to the one that stripped it down... We'll never know :) Do you have a date of manufacture for your machine?
No worries . Machine was made in 1981 . 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop Still got plenty of life left in that case :)
> nice going there max, thumbs.
Cheers 👍
👍👍😎👍👍 Banging good job ! Cheers Max
Thanks 👍
Pretty appropriate Whitworth fasteners on the Whitworth invented Bull Gear Crank shaper mechanism…….
Those old tools take us back Max….Were they your Dads ?
All of Dad's workshop stuff was sold at auction when he passed away , i was working away at that time & got fu--ked over by the step family . I just have a few bits . I did not know Whitworth invented the Bull Gear . Cheers 👍
I’d love a shaper. Trying to find one (that’s not absolutely munted)within 1000 km of Bundaberg seems to be exercise in frustration.
I know the feeling , living in Perth ! Generally the ones that pop up here on a rare occasion are British built ones but have already been around the world 6 times . 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop
Seriously, considering importing one from India. You can buy one brand-new from the manufacturer for less than you will pay the thieving local machinery “dealers” for a worn out piece of junk.
good video friend max
Thanks 👍
thanks for the video
Cheers 👍
Max couldn’t further screwing in the set screw on the top part of the oil galley adjust the oil flow through the tube? Unless I’m mistaken it’s like a cruciform where the oil comes up, the tube that you adjusted goes across and is fed with 2 set screws blocking the path from the top and operation side of the machine.
Might work . Cheers 👍
Looks like the Zocca is ready to peal some chips.
Working again , still need to do a bit more . When time permits ! 👍
Max could you give a brief explanation why you use a shaper over milling
A brief answer is , i must have rocks in my head as milling would take a fraction of the time ! Watch out for part 2 in the Vee Block's
Cheers 👍
Great diagnosis, dissection and repair, that thrust washer is strange as you state, is the external radius to fling oil?
Good catch on the adjustable gib cross lube tube, possibly in hindsight felt packing couod be used?
Strange that BSF threads are used, didn't think England travelled to South America 🤔 lol.
Thanks for sharing
Not sure why that radius , took me by surprise ! 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop Just looked up the manufacturer of the shaper, what popped up was a 6 part YT with your actual machine, ref identified by number 3 stamping, and missing paint patch. Found Zocca grinding machines though. TTFN John
It's nice to see that th the machine has almost no wear. I don't think it has many flight hours.
Still a lot of life in it yet ! 👍
Thx for the vid.
No worries 👍
If the hole on the dovetail is too small for the amount of oil being pumped to it, why not just adjust the valve for that tube down slightly until the input matches the output? It is there a pressure requirement that prevents that?
No pressure requirement but it would then reduce the oil flow to the underside flat slide . 👍
Max, I must admit I’m disappointed 😤 where’s the calendar girl today? 😍.👍🏴
She is still there ! Cheers 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop Max, share share alike. You should introduce her😍.👍🏴
Shaper..mmm 👍!
Mmmmm 👍
Can you reduce the flow at the needle valves at the oil pump Max ?
Yes , for each line as required . 👍
Max, the ram adjustment side didn't seem to be getting anywhere near the same amount of oil that the other side did. Is that going to be a problem down the line?
No , just adjustment of the oil flow control for each line . 👍
Max do you reckon it is lack of knowledge by the previous operator or owner in the adjustment or the I don't care attitude ? Good onya
Maybe it was all they could do at the time for a quick fix . Cheers 👍
Thanks Max, what type of oil is used in those as I am sure a gear oil might be too thick and with the stroke mechanism, I have not been able to fully understand how the fast return of the ram acts, I know it has something to do with the bull gear but just puzzled as to how. I came across a shaper that did this the wrong way round an had a slow return. Thanks.
The return stroke happens over less than half of a complete rotation of the bull gear, so the ram has to reach a greater speed during the return stroke.
If you draw a circle and then draw a V around it, you can see the points where the lines of the V touch the edge of the circle are not even around the circumference, this is how the shaper operates.
@@dutchgray86 Thanks Mate. I will study that.
Usually 46 or 68 hyd oil will be fine . I run 15w40 diesel engine oil in my one . If the return stroke is slower than the cutting stroke , the wiring is wrong on a 3 phase motor . 2 of the phases just need to be swapped over . If the feed is back to front but the stroke is right , the feed drive & rod are on the wrong side of the centre of the drive hub . I will try & point that out next shaper video . Cheers 👍
@@swanvalleymachineshop Thankyou
Maxi, always enjoy your tool repairs / setups. Great demo for maintaining the equipment. Thanks!
No worries 👍