Doctor Who | Reaction & Review 8x12 "Death in Heaven"
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Doctor Who Reaction - "Death in Heaven" - Peter Capaldi
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If you're looking for new TV shows in future:
- Sherlock (BBC with Benedict Cumberbatch) Cleverly written & very detailed show with 3 long episodes per season.
- Community (meta comedy with Donald Glover, Danny Pudi, & Ken Jeong) covers heaps of pop culture, film, and television in hilarious ways. While making fun of itself all the way to the last episode. They have a movie in the works now too.
- Broadchurch (David Tennant. Intense crime drama that didn't reveal the murderer to most of its cast until the last minute. To keep them all uncertain who it was.)
A lot to unpack here!
So the goodbye scene between The Doctor and Clara was originally filmed and intended as her exit. Jenna Coleman felt that the two years or so she'd done was about the right time.
When they wrapped filming on Series 8, they then embarked on a World Tour - Cardiff and London first (I was there for the London launch of Deep Breath) before they headed to Seoul in South Korea, Sydney Australia, New York, Mexico City and Rio. Capaldi, Coleman and Moffat went around screening Deep Breath for fans, doing Q&As and promotions (Moffat was probably the most popular of the 3 of them in Mexico, if I remember!).
On the tour, Capaldi and Moffat attempted to persuade Coleman to stick around a little longer, and eventually persuaded her - she wasn't ready to go just yet. So when filming the Christmas Special they shot that post credits scene for Death in Heaven with Nick Frost - you'll have to wait and see how that pans out!
I think the 'love is a promise' thing makes total sense, and it's a line I've never forgotten. If you think about and consider any committed long-term relationship, or even one that you *intend* to be for the long term, then once the sort of honeymoon phase of the relationship is over, there will inevitably be at least some moments, however fleeting, where loving the other person is or becomes difficult - perhaps it's small things like little irritating habits they may have, or more tricky things, say for example if they have a complicated family life or struggle with a chronic physical or mental health condition that might affect their temper or similar. Whether big or small, sometimes those moments might make loving that person more difficult, but at that point, even if you don't acutely feel it in that moment, if you are committed to the person and relationship (this doesn't even have to be a marriage, although that might be the clearest expression of that commitment), then you *choose* to continue to love that person, either despite those things, or to love that person in their totality including when things are difficult. Obviously that's not the same as loving them if something they do or a way they behave is toxic, but in general I think the principle is sound, that love is not just an emotion, but a promise and commitment too, and so no matter whether Danny emotionally feels that love, he feels that connection and that promise.
I agree with you on Missy - I love John Simm but think Michelle Gomez is probably my favourite Master, certainly of the modern era. You will have to wait a while longer for the explanation/discussion of what happened when The Doctor and Master last parted company in The End of Time, but I promise you, it does eventually come!
The moment with Kate's Dad (The Brigadier) coming to The Doctor's rescue at the end there was very pertinent for us fans of Classic Who, especially as The Master was introduced in the 70s, around the same time The Brigadier became a series regular when The Doctor became exiled to Earth for a couple of seasons by the Time Lords. The Brigadier and The Master had a mutual animosity and even long after they stopped meeting regularly, in the 20th Anniversary Special then The Brigadier enjoys sneaking up behind the Master to land a punch(!)
Having the dead Brigadier as a Cyberman actually divides opinion among fans - I love it personally because it allows a moment between The Doctor and Brigadier that we never got in the new series (there were a couple of attempts but the original actor, Nicholas Courtney, was too frail and ill when they attempted to get him in to meet David Tennant or Matt Smith when they guest starred in The Sarah Jane Adventures). But there are some who see it as disrespectful to the actor who played him in the Classic Series to have the character turned into a Cyberman etc. or just don't like it story-wise.
Personally I love Series 8, I love Danny Pink and him and Clara's relationship (I may be slightly biased as Samuel Anderson looks vaguely similar to, and plays the role in a similar way, to a friend of mine at school who is an actor and performer and so myself and my family are reminded of him whenever we watch Danny Pink!)
I think they probably deserved more time together in the series but I think they still well utilised the time they'd got.
I feel you have kinda jumped the gun here Henry because I'm fairly sure that wasn't the goodbye ending that was planned for Death In Heaven. Your right about the circumstances surrounding Jenna's decision but it's the wrong episode. It was "Last Christmas" (filmed after the world tour) & it was confirmed in Moffats Farewell interviews with Cristel on Doctor Who: The Fan Show at the end of S10 as well as who would have been the new companion
@@fleason771 Moffat confirmed in his exit interview for The Doctor Who Fan Show that they originally filmed Death in Heaven as her exit and then him and Capaldi persuaded her to do Christmas
I forgot that we got a glimpse of Santa at the end of this episode, but Nick Frost is always a welcome sight!
Onto my all time fav series! Hoping you like it just as much 😁Series 8 is a close second!
Wow, not a popular opinion but those are my favorites too. Best of times.
Series 9 is the best season in all of Who in my opinion. Series 10 is a close second for me.
Season 9, my favorite too.
S9 is absolutely my fav season starting off with a banger Christmas ep. the culmination of what has been built from s8 and Heaven sent? Greatest Doctor who episode ever...ugh such good memories😂❤
I have to completely disagree there but Im glad you're excited.
In the opening credits, Jenna’s name comes before Capaldi’s and it’s her eyes instead of his immediately after.
I was hoping to see his reaction (assuming he noticed).
I was laughing pretty hard when I first saw the modified credits. The fact that there was 0% chance she was the Doctor made the joke funnier.
I love the Christmas Special that comes next. It really completes the Clara & Capaldi Arc of Season 8. Love the next season coming up! My favorite of NuWho.
Nothing breaks my heart more than a lonely Doctor. Seeing him beat on the console of the Tardis brings me to tears.
It's funny you mention how Missy may have even run over Danny as I believe Moffat actually said that in an interview once, probably as a joke but it does still feel very apt given her own machiavellian attitudes so far with putting the Doctor and Clara together and being one step ahead the whole time
@Therealgamer Not just in your canon. The Missy Chronicles book establishes that Missy did indeed run over Danny with a milk float.
I have been watching your doctor who and dark reactions and I love how you connect with the characters and their stories. You have a knack for seeing small details which most people miss. It would be fun to watch you react to 'the good place'. It is a light hearted show with some major teachings. I am sure you will love it.
Love all the giggles in your reaction 😂 this is such a great episode. And missy is amazing, love her
Glad you didn’t miss the mid credits scene which sets up one of the best Xmas specials for my money
Superb reaction as usual and great insight too.
Michelle Gomez is really fantastic, isn’t she? I’m surprised no one seems to have mentioned yet that the ‘Hey Missy, you so fine’ bit was unscripted -- Gomez sang that as a warm-up before her take, but the producers loved it so much they quickly scrambled to get the rights to ‘Hey Mickey’.
Oh, you missed the title sequence easter eggs?
This one is not perfect but as you said a lot of iconic moments. Wraps up the season nicely IMO.
SPOILERS BELOW:
Honestly I wish Clara's story had ended at least with the Christmas special, I liked Clara at first but as it went on it just felt like she stuck around a little too long, the only positive to come out of it was Heaven sent arguably one of the best 12th doctor eps.
Hm yeah she stayed too long
But I like Bonnie
Gotta tell you I'm excited that you're about to move onto my second favourite Christmas special followed by my favourite season! I know what you mean about this finale. There's too much going on for any of the emotive moments to resonate, you need those pauses.
Honestly, I think Clara saying 'I feel like I'm killing you' makes me think back to the episode cold war and her reaction to seeing a dead body. While a stronger relationship would've been nice, I don't think it was needed. Initially, I didn't buy the Amy x Rory relationship due to how Amy acted, and it's still my least favorite in NeWho. So I brought the upset of this scenario than any of that couple over the two-and-a-half series we had them for.
In regards to Listen and the future look, remember that time is always in flux. That was one possible future. Certain times are set in stone (fixed points) but others aren't.
Missy is a truly terrifying villain because you can't predict her moves. She did all this to give the doctor everything she built up. If she hadn't given the controller to Capaldi, I don't know how this would've been won by twelve. She also did something I never thought I'd see, a lot of villains have mentioned the Doctor's parasitic relationship with his companions (remember Davros' speech in the s4 finale) but she actually used his companion against him in setting up Clara for him. A brilliant move on the writer's place. With Missy escaping the time lock, there's a fan theory that when the Doctor returned to Gallifrey within the Day of the Doctor, and burst through the painting, Missy followed through at some point after. I would also like to point out that Missy's 'Hey Missy' parody was improvised and kept in... if anything that proved Michelle Gomez was perfect for this role.
I can understand some of the SciFi elements being too much, like cyber-rain but given the boundaries the show has gone to before, I'm willing to look past it to enjoy the story.
Danny... I've heard people call the start of this two-parter a fake out over the years but given how his story ends, I don't think it is. I would say how Rose left in S2 was more of a fake-out and it truly showed his character, regardless of the logistics of what would happen. I also think he was able to withstand the cyber command because he had some degree of detachment training for the army, so switching his emotions off wasn't so jarring, and thus he might've been moved into the position without changing sides. Remember the head of Torchwood in s2 finale, who did something similar.
Onto the star of the series, Capaldi. His 'I am an idiot' speech is one of the high points of the entire series (not just series 8 or Capaldi's run). It truly showed the essence of who the Doctor is. Obviously, other doctors had 'Doctor' moments but none felt as earnest as this one for me. It truly felt like he came to a realization and not just using a speech to get the upper hand. I'd like the finish on one of my favourite scenes... the show of him hitting the console panel after being tricked into looking for Gallifrey is just raw and showed his rage.
When the doctors come out of the painting there's a hand on the frame, I always thought that was Missys hand as I think it's wearing a ring that none of the Doctor's are wearing and Clara isn't wearing. I might be wrong as I'm going off memory.
very good finale. not perfect but my 2nd favourite so far after the big bang. i do like how intimate the whole thing becomes. it doesn't abandon the character work of s8 for spectacle. s8 as a whole very strong and again only beaten so far for me by s5.
Missy is just amazing!
Nice. I don’t know if you’ll agree with this. But personally in series 8. I think the doctor has a defence mechanism to avoid connecting to people to avoid breaking his heart due to loads of times previously and that’s why he’s distant and slightly arrogant and he’s also judging the meaning of his name hence the am I good man. But when he realises who he is “am I an idiot” he realises not to judge himself and that there’s no point of having a defence mechanism).
As for Danny. I think him accidentally killing that child is what influenced him to become a teacher and have a passion for kids.
Let me know what you think of this.
When the Dalek Girl loves the Cyberman
I also really enjoy the level of intimacy moffat gave the master and the doctor this series. I know it's very "oh now that the master is a woman and the doctor's a man we can have them kiss, we can have her call him her boyfriend, etc etc" but it does imply some things about the intensity that ten and simm had going on and ALSO, in my personal opinion, makes watching the third doctor and delgado!master's interactions much more fun lol
Glad you enjoyed it... been watching a lot of your vids... haven't been able to watch all of them yet. But have been enjoying your reactions and reviews
Regarding this finale and series... im up and down with it... ive certainly come to enjoy it more on rewatch since not engaging very well with series 11-13... made me appreciate the Moff era more... but i still have issues with it. I love Capaldi, jenna and Michelle... they are fantastic as their characters... it is some of the way the character arcs are presented... for example im not a fan of the whole "clara is a control freak" just cos she didn't want her two lives to mix or have some element of control of what is a hectic life...and the fact that Danny pink really only exists to show this "control freakness"...and cause conflict for Clara and the Doctor...Clara isn't the first companion to lie to the Doctor or to her friends/family... i mean Rose went missing for a year and Jackie still didn't know what exactly happened until she saw the TARDIS for herself...and we know how she treated Mickey... Martha not telling her family caused issues for her and allowed the Master to literally enslave them, Donna also lied to her mum...i felt it was unfair that Clara was made to look like a bad person for the choices she had to make... the Doctor and Danny (a guy who she had only just started dating) putting her in awkward positions and demanding answers to questions that had nothing to do with them... Clara can be friends with whoever she wants and date who she wants...and she doesn't need to explain her choices to either..(this is why i hate Danny, and this so called love story .. never believed in it). She's a young woman juggling two lives... give her a break. That also takes me to the idea that Clara being like the Doctor is something new... literally Rose also was presented in the same way by end of series 2 and 4... and this whole "she'll take you to hell if she asked" ...are we forgetting that Amy basically killed herself and the Doctor in Amy's choice cos Rory had "died"?. So this is why i don't like how the Doctor, Danny and Missy present Clara's flaws as something unique and negative... hence why Missy "chose" her ..nah hate that.
And talking of Missy... i like the idea of her wanting her friend back... now that she no longer has the drums driving her mad...and gallifrey still existing in supposedly a pocket universe and not dead after Day of the Doctor..howeve i don't think her plan makes any sense... she knows the Doctor... while she wud like him to be like her .. she knows he's not. Her giving him an army, makes no sense... this Doctor isn't the 9th Doctor after his belief that he destroyed the timelords... that was born out of war... niether was this the 10th Doctor in his time lord victorious stage where he started to think he was God... this Doctor didn't really know who he was...and while he did "dark" things...at no point did i believe he wanted an army... he wasn't even happy being a president...he only says that to mock the Master's craving for Power... he doesn't do anything presidential...he doesn't give orders... hes just running around like the idiot he is... so its just not a believable moment for me. The rest... him giving the control to Danny and deciding to kill rather than save the Master to save Clara's soul were perfect and made sense...
I feel if we had Amy and Rory...i wud have felt more emotional about the choice that Danny makes and believed it possible as they often ended up having their love being a solution... but cos i never believed that Clara and Danny actually loved each other... the conclusion didn't work for me...
Also the brig as the cyberman didn't go down very well with fandom... im not sure how i feel about it myself... but cos the actual actor had died a few years prior to this... it felt very disrespectful for many fans... i understood the idea of it .. hence im not really fussed one way or the other...
Hope u enjoy the Christmas special... its one of my favs...and apart from one moment...a better development of a certain relationship...🥰
OVERJOYED that you picked up on that "egomaniac needy gameplayer" line being attributed to Missy, even though the Doctor was talking about Clara and Clara was talking about the Doctor. The dynamic between the three of them is so interesting; Clara being "chosen" by Missy for the Doctor is a perfect explanation for why she, more than past companions, is capable of pushing him to these extremes and I love thinking about what Missy's thought process must've been. Because, let's be honest, if Missy was going to choose someone to put pressure on the Doctor's moral code, someone he would make exceptions for, someone to develop a kind of codependent addictive relationship with, she would choose someone... like herself. It just makes Clara's character worth examining a little closer, and the Doctor's too because, as Missy said, "we're not so different"
Oooh i rele hate the brigadier being turned into a cyberman. But great ending to the episode with the doctor and clara lying to eachother, great unique way to send off a companion…..
I checked out your patreon last week and couldn't join because you are having problems. Has this been resolved yet, because I really want to support you and watch extended content?
Replying to myself, just read your community post, am I best to wait til June then to access your patreon? Very happy to see you are taking a holiday until June, health breaks are so important 👍
We need Vinland Saga 😩
I love this final the only bit i didn't like was the Cyber brig at the end it felt abit disrespectful not only to his character but the actor as well and also doesnt make sense as hes spent his whole military life fighting the Cybermen.
I’m confused by your comment. I don’t think he ever encountered the cybemen. I’m going through the classic era and am halfway through the 3rd doctors era where he’s the main character. I’ve also seen clips of the brigadier with other doctors but never the cybermen. So when does he encounter the cybermen?
@@luciadwhpanimallover9222 Big Finish and comics he also mentioned them in "Battlefield".
He fought them in 'Invasion' and nearly had his arm crushed by one in 'The Five Doctors'.
Not Santa... Father Christmas!!
I agree about not feeling as strongly to this finale as I thought I would.
I think the problem is pacing (editing or the script). Too much going on.
Maybe the individual scenes are okay. We are given that extra heartbeat to have CyberDanny react to Clara saying she is a good liar, or Osgood being terrified that she is going to die.
I think the episode needed to slow down for the audience. When we are given a big revelation, the viewers will need time to process it. Instead, the show is racing to the next scene, the next big revelation, so it is tough to have more than just an intellectual reaction.
(That is my biggest complaint about the Moffat era. I completely enjoy his humor and the brilliant ideas, but when there are so many racing at us, the emotional impact of any particular moment is diminished from what it could be.)
One question. Does anyone know why he havent done any vinland saga reactions lately? :/
Won't lie, not a fan of this finale.
Just feels way too basic.
I disagree. My least favourite finale’s are End of time and Doomsday.
Oh mon dieu, je déteste tellement Danny Pink !!
Holy shit, this episode is way better than I remember