Exactly! I was going to buy 2 of their DS1823xs+ systems for our offices as I wanted OOB management until I found out about that little tidbit which led me to scrapping that idea as we have too many non-Synology drives already that we wanted to move to the new systems.
It really is worth it, many solutions do it. You don't need to look at every dashboard every day or out of hours, find a replacement and order it, get it signed off receive it and install. If you're busy on something else and a disk shows up, you pop it in and move on with your life
@@Bob_Smith19 None of their DS line of devices have OOB management though that I could find which was a requirement for me after fighting with an offsite QNAP for the last 7 years that won't restart on it's own.
So this is what Synology has been abandoning their home user base for. They have burnt most of us at this point. Only allowing their branded drives should be a deal killer for everyone. They charge twice the price because it has their name on it.
The time of blackboxes is over. I went through that hell when you're responsible and can't troubleshoot without the vendor. Technically a great Idea, and the Hardware can do it, but vendor lock in can bring your business quickly in serious troubles.
Enterprise guy here. Already scheduled a demo with them. This may shock people not in this world but good backup systems cost more than top tier SAN storage.
Considering the headaches Veeam has caused us as an MSP with the pricing, feature support especially for offsite replications the past year I'm all for more competition in the backup space.
Disruptive would be support for Proxmox or XCP-ng at launch and it would sell like hotcakes. Synology has no track record on the enterprise market, would you trust them with your backups? My company uses rackstations with DSM for Office 365 backups and it does a great job at it. However it lacks support for automation and the synology blessed nvme capacity tops 800mb? Metadata and cache on SATA SSDs in 2025? But competition is a good thing, I wish them well.
I used veam back in the day together with VMware. I also used many systems other like Borg, bacula, duplicity, proxmox backup server, restic. Backups are super important and often overlooked, we always had the rule that we have the backup data at least stored in 2 locations on 2 different file system types.
You can scale up by adding appliances, up to 2500 in a cluster 😅 With a guesstimate of 140TB usable per appliance with 2500 of them this could scale up to 350PB. That’s impressive
After just shy of three decades in IT, the simplest solution I've found for backup and malware protection has been to use an old server for a secondary weekly backup, and turn the machine off when not doing backups/restore. Sure, not automatabke, always available, but leaving it off when not in use is the best way to defeat malware spreading
Upgraded a fleet of Hyper-V servers for a government healthcare agency weeks before Broadcom bought VMware. Reduced our hardware footprint by 75% while now having clustering and automatic failover, all while moving 10 years ahead in terms of hardware age. I felt great. Then Broadcom bought VMware and I got scared about our next renewal cost. Still saved the agency a ton of money, but that renewal fee was brutal.
Why not have a backup employee responsible for backups ? I think its a serious enough job. And the costs will be lower than subscriptions over the long run.
I've been at a VMware / Veeam shop for a few years now, and haven't worked with much else (other than Synology Active Backup for Business in a few small office environments), so it's interesting to see what else is out there. Alas, for better or worse (but mostly better, because Broadcom), the decision has been made and we're switching to XCP-NG with Xen Orchestra, so this won't be for us. Oh well, it still seems like a solid first generation product with great potential.
Few problems with this. 1) Synology needs support in North America. Their current Asia based support is too slow, and painful to deal with (I have a FS series rack NAS, and it took almost a week to resolve an issue). 2) They need to support for XCPNG (MANY businesses are moving to XCPNG away from ESX. 3) I dont mind the custom drives, but these kind of hosts should come with QSFP+ nics for the backup process.
Subscription models are getting out of hand, however ala 'carte pricing falls apart when scaled and when Mergers happen. Not to mention investors love the look of the Percent of users that forgot about the recurring fee and no longer use the product.
Synology,, the latest supported HDD is from 2019 JUN.. The company is a joke. they delay (or don't even do) compatibility driver upgrade for HDDs. Seagate 24-26-28TB none of them works. And they don't even plan to do anything. (Even after open support ticket)
Thanks Wendell. Since I built my server (Trunas Scale), I now have to focus on my new workstation, as my old one does not support Windows 11. It is sad to ditch such a beautiful, very fast device, but now 5Ghz chips are now the norm. My Blackmagic camera's BRAW is 250 MBytes/second, but I can edit from the server's memory in 128 GByte chunks. My biggest project has been less than 1/2 of that.
yes, I would be quite interested in running a proxmox backup server in a VM.. but as standalone itself, not in combination with synology. Like, going into the way smaller homelab region, since for smaller homelabs it isn't feasible to run an extra real machine just for PBS - since at least you would need to run some extra tasks there if you would like to use that machine as central backup server.
This looks like it is using the same code underneath or part of it like ABB. However: ABB can restore individual files directly to the VM's. Looks like this is missing in the UI.
Can you whitelabel/privatize this for domains, like colocate this somewhere with a firewall in front and then use it for multiple businesses but still give them a customized domain portal (with only their ACL/devices) for each business/domain? Do you need some Entra or premium Microsoft 365 role to do that cloud backup? Or does it work with any plan, like Exchange Online Plan 1? Basic email plans, with bare minimums of roles but still have admin accounts?
If charged with the decision, I could never bring myself to sign up for anything that makes a business about selling collective knowledge UNLESS THEY MAKE IT *FREELY* AVAILABLE FOR OTHERS TO USE. e.g; "smart" mail apps, anti-mailware software (if it reports, sends samples, etc rather than just getting definitions in bulk,) Google's Play Protect or Microsoft's Defender, Google's Federated Compute something, this, which comes in part from tons of data collected through Synology's Active Insight, also something I don't use - BTW, noticed how Synology's apps know have a privacy statement thing when it used to advocate for "your own cloud" and blahblah? Always-On Active Insight can only be uninstalled thought hacks as well, and last but definitely least least: AI. I don't see anywhere in the terms of these companies how are users compensated for their data. Oh! I almost forgot: Wind- Microsoft's telemetry is another. I don't think it's ethical, and I don't know how it came to be that everyone seems to be trained to just gloss over that fact.
I never geek out over hardware, but when I saw where you are able to scan drives to find the bad one. Nothing sucks more than trying to fix drives because someone touched the drives and mixed them up.
Let's hope they don't abandon any of the software that makes all this work. Synology does have a history of selling hardware with software and then abandoning (actually ending and deleting) the software - think "Video Station" as at least one example.
For about 10 years I have wondered if there may be sufficient market for geographically-distributed physical backup drive storage via USPS Flat Rate Priority Mail. The idea is that you back up two copies of your system, and keep one copy on premises, and send me the other copy. I put it on a shelf for up to a year, then send it back to you on a regular schedule. You send additional backups on a weekly, monthly, or quarterly basis, and the destination rotates between dedicated facilities around the country (in different threat zones). If you want your backup returned early, it's free via USPS FRPM, or you pay a few extra bucks for express mail. But I will NEVERY OPEN THE BOX. I think this model can be done for ~$30/rotation, and could be ramen profitable for only a few thousand rotations per month. But I can't tell if there would be enough demand (and if individuals and SMBs would do the periodic backups that they think they should) without trying it. Any thoughts?
@@prashanthb6521 ZFS Rent would be a good competitor price-wise. My idea may be strong only with people who don't trust the security of any ISPs. Though I have been told that receiving a fresh box in the mail periodically might be a good reminder that it is time to do seasonal backups (home user).
@@buckturgidson9666 When I called them 10+ years ago, it was $140+ per month for pickup (with chain-of-custody logging) and storage on a shelf. If you have multiple backup copies, and one is near you, then the need for chain-of-custody security is close to zero. And I'm proposing $30-40 for up to a year of storage.
This offering is very similar to how Redstor run, although you don't get the hardware delivered to you - Redstor maintain that. Presume you do with this type of Synology? Although while Redstor can install an agent on Hyper-V for guest vm backups, they recommend you install the agent within the vm itself and this would be the same for a hypervisor that runs KVM.
Your statement on the "USB cable" situation reminds me of a sign I used to display. It read " We don't do Synchoo's" Because if I had £1 for everytime I provided basic advice like "check you haven't left a 3.5" floppy disc whilst booting" and 3 months later I got a "Synchoo did that..." 😂😂😂
I just installed a Supermicro server that looks kind of like this. XCP-NG as the OS off a boot raid, and a SAS card and drives to feed to TrueNAS Scale. Backup target and XCP-NG will store my backups there (as well as in S3). But of course with XCP-NG doing the backups itself in Xen Orchestra the need for third party software diminishes. I'd still prefer to keep using Veeam, tbh.
@@harveyweizman yep i know, tbh probably they have access to the device to do all that extra stuff, but the "hdd bad send new" thing is just an api endpoint where device just reports the failure to synology
@@pcislocked unless it’s open source, there’s no way to confirm it does only that. By the way he described it in the video, it sounds like they have some sort of real-time access to the sever…
He wrote in a comment it's less than $12k, if you're in AU that's still less than $20k at current exchange rates (unless Aussies get ripped off as usual...)
On the point of PBS - I use the cheapest solution I guess... Intel NUC8i5 with 16gb RAM, 500gb nvme & 6tb SATA HDD... yes 3,5". PBS gets a 8GB VM + 50gb boot + 150gb zfs special device + the HDD, also it's running a router/vpn VM and so. As these all connect to two wireguard endpoints in the datacenter (hetzner & vultr) and run BGP to each host, they see eachother and each of the site nodes holds the backups of the others or the replicas. Why replicas? Two sides have a PVE cluster for rendering 3d models and so they can back up locally to the nuc and PBS replicates it offside.
From the things that I do it comes down to price. Solution this is very good. Veeam seem to increase there price. I will say I am interested to learn more about something like this
But now... what about us peasant powerusers who just have a DIY TrueNAS Scale box at home? I'm just syncing one ZFS Dataset to a replica and putting that up into Crashplan. $10/mo isn't bad but also never had to do a full restore and I heard that absolutely sucks with CrashPlan (The upload was like 1TB/mo, dreadfully slow)
Having somewhat recently bought MCX515A-CCAT 100Gbps cards and very recently getting them working pcie 4.0 and poking them bits over SMB Direct at 10GB/s, the 10gbps port in this product seems a bit feeble.
Glad to see someone trying to disrupt veeam in the smaller business space, just like how the scale out cloud focused backup systems have in the enterprise (Rubrik and Cohesity). Too small for my environment at work so I'll stick with my briks and laugh at the ransomware fvckers as I restore everything with a single click.
Came to say this, despite the price. Infected backup scanning, backup everything from almost anywhere out of the box, and if you do get ransomed someone on the phone until you're back up
Im sorry this is all very interesting and all but I could not focus once I noticed the zombie golden girls picture .. what in the name of $deity is going on there
I understand if you are performing system level backups of laptops or similar. Their endpoint software might be appealing, especially features like global dedup, but I don’t know of any companies who don’t already use broad endpoint management software and some type of cloud / shared documents solution. I imagine anything that is not endpoint would be fine with network storage and snapshots. I don’t work at a large enterprise, am I missing some piece of the equation?
What you are describing is the first step in the chain to have backups for users of their data. Send it to a NAS. Then the company makes a copy of the data on the NAS on an appliance to have a backup locally. In many cases, the data eventually gets copied out to a cold tier on a cloud destination. The 321 Backup Policy that should be the minimum for any business specifies you should have at least 3 copies (original, copy on NAS, copy on backup/archive ) on 2 media (NAS and Backup appliance) with 1 copy off site. The backup appliance is typically actually 2 or more clusters that replicate the data between themselves to remove the copies from the datacenter that is most likely hosting the VMs with the production databases and other such important infrastructure.
*heavy breathing into the al gore rhythm mic* I'm just a nerd with a "nerd shelf" as dubbed by the wife above the fridge. I do like when low-mid hardware solutions pop... because I am a bottom feeder and my server needs another $4 Xeon or maybe I'll upgrade to something efficient. But not during the winter, it's helping.
Never thought of DP as something bad, but here we are. Knowing Synology, it will be demanding branded drives. Their 2-disk DP has gigabit ports ffs... This bigger thing looks better, because apparently it's gearing to cater to business more than to smb/soho/home usesegment, but still, they're sus now
They get you, not by your uploads, but by charging you to download and retrieve. This is a huge dis-incentive for you to get your stuff, and go to a competitor. BEWARE !!! In the long run, it is cheaper for you to host 3 of your own servers, and have a tech to do maintenance.
nope, and I just packed it for return shipping. The backup software subscription renewals are getting brutal and I really don't care for that AT ALL. It blew my mind this actually does cost less than last years renewal cost for JUST THE SOFTWARE to backup about 100 virtual machines in a small cluster.
Synology has lost their way... watch someone like dell come out with this and synology just looses all momentum because Dell shops are just gonna stick with Dell. And the enthusiasts market doesnt want synology back at this point...we see what they care about
Datto Backups: Get new appliance, assured migration is as easy as opening the migration wizard and pressing go. Unpack device, setup, go to Wizard... down indefinitely for maintenance. Spend a week going back and forth with support until the agree to migrate for us. Schedule for Friday afternoon. Do all the prepwork, go home, come back Monday... nothing. Support says they forgot. Take more time for them to finally migrate for us. Next bill comes in. Billed an extra month for the old appliance because support took so long to get off of it. Complain. Tech team says they can't issue refunds, billing team says its not their problem the tech team screwed up. Takes weeks of escalating to get our money back. During the last meeting on issue we are invited to buy 900 dollar tickets to their Las Vegas event.
They can't even back up ReFS properly. They dont know how to safely package disks. They dont have a reasonable net of onesite tech. I know people this is a logical choice since they just so understand Syno NAS and ABB is stable enough but oh dear. Oh dear. This is not an enterprise system. It's looks like a good idea for SMB if you do it wisely (separate admin teams, scale them near to your clusters and dont share them cross envs. Will be nice. But please let's not call it enterprise. You could not even implement an enterprise setup with a 100 of these. Syno needs to stay humble in that env if they wanna make their name.
hehe my NAS is stupid overkill. 16c Xeon E5 2697A V4 with 256GB RDIMM and a dual port SFP28 25gig connectx-4lx. And my storage..... four 4tb 7200rpm sata drives. lol Maybe some day solid state will become affordable - or I'll get an HBA and eight 4tb 7200rpm SAS drives. I'd be happy to keep using Macrium Reflect for my disk imaging backups like I used to, but I will not subscribe to software - period. I'd pay like 40 bucks per device or like 120 bucks for unlimited devices for personal use without an expectation of getting the next major software version - but never yearly. The software is the product, not me.
Synology products are not even in the same universe as Veeam. Veeam doesn't recommend synology appliances as backup storage either, because they lack a raid controller and will easily corrupt your data during any power issue. A proper server with windows and raid controller offers far better performance and reliability. so in short, this won't disrupt anything but the smallest customers who cheap out and then will be sorry later.
As someone with a 4 bay synology, never had data corruption with power outages. Also my windows servers at work break way more often than synology and truenas systems
Many enterprise backup vendors won't even officially support Synology NAS appliances. I can't say the number of times connecting to them with proper permissions has been a pain point. Maybe they've come light years from where they were a few years ago, but I have my doubts they won't have a lot of teething problems trying ot support "medium" sized businesses.
Oh boy, a forty minute video about a device I'll never be within a hundred feet of. Immediate watch.
So you are not interested. Tough, use your back button.
@@Headplant55 you missed the point. We're watching because the videos are good and interesting, not because we're likely to be a customer.
I'm in this picture and I don't like it.
I mean...after a decade when it's deprecated we can likely get our hands on some :D
@@frollard Xeons are space heaters if you plan (or are surprised) enough
Sounded good up until "synology takes care of everything as long as you buy their drives".
Exactly!
I was going to buy 2 of their DS1823xs+ systems for our offices as I wanted OOB management until I found out about that little tidbit which led me to scrapping that idea as we have too many non-Synology drives already that we wanted to move to the new systems.
@@jlfickenThere are no restrictions on the DS line of devices. It’s only for their rack mount devices. But no one likes where this is going.
It really is worth it, many solutions do it. You don't need to look at every dashboard every day or out of hours, find a replacement and order it, get it signed off receive it and install. If you're busy on something else and a disk shows up, you pop it in and move on with your life
@@Bob_Smith19 None of their DS line of devices have OOB management though that I could find which was a requirement for me after fighting with an offsite QNAP for the last 7 years that won't restart on it's own.
@@Bob_Smith19 that is wrong.. DS devices with 8+ bays are VERY fussy and will be constantly in "degraded" state if you don't use Synology drives.
Yeah Synology have burnt their goodwill. Donate to open source
So this is what Synology has been abandoning their home user base for. They have burnt most of us at this point. Only allowing their branded drives should be a deal killer for everyone. They charge twice the price because it has their name on it.
Generally speaking home user would buy a device with eight bays or less. For those you do not need Synology drives.
@@diavuno3835hard agree.
Its a solid product for me and im looking into upgrading soon.
What would you recommend for a home user? @@diavuno3835
@@diavuno3835there is no legitimate technical reason to require them; it is a profit-engineered solution.
The time of blackboxes is over. I went through that hell when you're responsible and can't troubleshoot without the vendor. Technically a great Idea, and the Hardware can do it, but vendor lock in can bring your business quickly in serious troubles.
Yep my church went through that.
Scrapped it all. Went to a open source and 1 administrator and our headaches dropped 90%.
Definitely true. I know others are suffering because of this.
You can ssh into any Synology….
Enterprise guy here. Already scheduled a demo with them. This may shock people not in this world but good backup systems cost more than top tier SAN storage.
This is a market I cant wait to see finally get some decent competition. Lot of room for a disruptive sw/hw combo.
Veeam is now owned by private equity, so expect prices to go down and quality to go up 🤔😂
🤣
😂
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Considering the headaches Veeam has caused us as an MSP with the pricing, feature support especially for offsite replications the past year I'm all for more competition in the backup space.
how much is this? Or like an estimate? It is so crazy how much even this company obfuscates costs.
If you have to ask ...
Every 3 years we get prices "adjusted" due to change in the product licensing.
14:55 - "Use the chapter markers" RUclips eats the chapter markers. Classic derp.
Huzzah! The markers are back.
You can still find it in the description
@@justinliu7788 Wasn't in the description at the time. They fixed it. All is well
Subscriptions are so early 2000s.
To beat a dead horse is a fools quest. Nothing beats an on site admin.
Disruptive would be support for Proxmox or XCP-ng at launch and it would sell like hotcakes. Synology has no track record on the enterprise market, would you trust them with your backups? My company uses rackstations with DSM for Office 365 backups and it does a great job at it. However it lacks support for automation and the synology blessed nvme capacity tops 800mb? Metadata and cache on SATA SSDs in 2025? But competition is a good thing, I wish them well.
I used veam back in the day together with VMware. I also used many systems other like Borg, bacula, duplicity, proxmox backup server, restic.
Backups are super important and often overlooked, we always had the rule that we have the backup data at least stored in 2 locations on 2 different file system types.
Hoping that proxmox, nutanix and xcp-ng support will be added.
And is there an easy way to scale a site up by adding more nodes?
You can scale up by adding appliances, up to 2500 in a cluster 😅
With a guesstimate of 140TB usable per appliance with 2500 of them this could scale up to 350PB.
That’s impressive
@@aapjeisbaas- And impressively expensive! 😮
After just shy of three decades in IT, the simplest solution I've found for backup and malware protection has been to use an old server for a secondary weekly backup, and turn the machine off when not doing backups/restore.
Sure, not automatabke, always available, but leaving it off when not in use is the best way to defeat malware spreading
Clicked on this thinking it was a back pain subscription video
I mean, it can sometimes be a pain in the back lifting up all these servers
@@Level1Techs just erase the heavy data first ;-)
every company now wants to DP me with subscriptions
Upgraded a fleet of Hyper-V servers for a government healthcare agency weeks before Broadcom bought VMware. Reduced our hardware footprint by 75% while now having clustering and automatic failover, all while moving 10 years ahead in terms of hardware age.
I felt great. Then Broadcom bought VMware and I got scared about our next renewal cost.
Still saved the agency a ton of money, but that renewal fee was brutal.
Why not have a backup employee responsible for backups ? I think its a serious enough job. And the costs will be lower than subscriptions over the long run.
I read the thumbnail as back pain subscription. I was confused for a bit.
Backup software has been very much caught up in the emprise software cost disease glad to see some new players.
I've been at a VMware / Veeam shop for a few years now, and haven't worked with much else (other than Synology Active Backup for Business in a few small office environments), so it's interesting to see what else is out there. Alas, for better or worse (but mostly better, because Broadcom), the decision has been made and we're switching to XCP-NG with Xen Orchestra, so this won't be for us. Oh well, it still seems like a solid first generation product with great potential.
Few problems with this. 1) Synology needs support in North America. Their current Asia based support is too slow, and painful to deal with (I have a FS series rack NAS, and it took almost a week to resolve an issue). 2) They need to support for XCPNG (MANY businesses are moving to XCPNG away from ESX. 3) I dont mind the custom drives, but these kind of hosts should come with QSFP+ nics for the backup process.
Subscriptions are for magazines and newspapers - and those things are dead. No more subscriptions.
Subscription models are getting out of hand, however ala 'carte pricing falls apart when scaled and when Mergers happen. Not to mention investors love the look of the Percent of users that forgot about the recurring fee and no longer use the product.
SaaS vendors enter the chat...
does your isp give you free internet?
Synology,, the latest supported HDD is from 2019 JUN.. The company is a joke. they delay (or don't even do) compatibility driver upgrade for HDDs.
Seagate 24-26-28TB none of them works. And they don't even plan to do anything. (Even after open support ticket)
Synology can't even fix there Drive sharesync, where a sync between two NAS randomly stops with files stuck in initialising state
I’d be curious how much access their monitoring would have as a threat vector
Thanks Wendell. Since I built my server (Trunas Scale), I now have to focus on my new workstation, as my old one does not support Windows 11. It is sad to ditch such a beautiful, very fast device, but now 5Ghz chips are now the norm. My Blackmagic camera's BRAW is 250 MBytes/second, but I can edit from the server's memory in 128 GByte chunks. My biggest project has been less than 1/2 of that.
yes, I would be quite interested in running a proxmox backup server in a VM.. but as standalone itself, not in combination with synology.
Like, going into the way smaller homelab region, since for smaller homelabs it isn't feasible to run an extra real machine just for PBS - since at least you would need to run some extra tasks there if you would like to use that machine as central backup server.
Synology NEEDS to open-source their OS or at least unlock its devices’ bootloaders.
If they want to die as a company, sure
This looks like it is using the same code underneath or part of it like ABB. However: ABB can restore individual files directly to the VM's. Looks like this is missing in the UI.
Can you whitelabel/privatize this for domains, like colocate this somewhere with a firewall in front and then use it for multiple businesses but still give them a customized domain portal (with only their ACL/devices) for each business/domain? Do you need some Entra or premium Microsoft 365 role to do that cloud backup? Or does it work with any plan, like Exchange Online Plan 1? Basic email plans, with bare minimums of roles but still have admin accounts?
If charged with the decision, I could never bring myself to sign up for anything that makes a business about selling collective knowledge UNLESS THEY MAKE IT *FREELY* AVAILABLE FOR OTHERS TO USE. e.g; "smart" mail apps, anti-mailware software (if it reports, sends samples, etc rather than just getting definitions in bulk,) Google's Play Protect or Microsoft's Defender, Google's Federated Compute something, this, which comes in part from tons of data collected through Synology's Active Insight, also something I don't use - BTW, noticed how Synology's apps know have a privacy statement thing when it used to advocate for "your own cloud" and blahblah? Always-On Active Insight can only be uninstalled thought hacks as well, and last but definitely least least: AI. I don't see anywhere in the terms of these companies how are users compensated for their data. Oh! I almost forgot: Wind- Microsoft's telemetry is another. I don't think it's ethical, and I don't know how it came to be that everyone seems to be trained to just gloss over that fact.
I never geek out over hardware, but when I saw where you are able to scan drives to find the bad one. Nothing sucks more than trying to fix drives because someone touched the drives and mixed them up.
Solution. Good records and 1 full time admin on site and hybrid.
Headaches dropped 90%.
How about a red led lamp for the bad drive?
I like the silverstone cases for there RF shielding.
Read that as "Subscription back pain" and boy do i feel like i pay for that every dang week...
Let's hope they don't abandon any of the software that makes all this work. Synology does have a history of selling hardware with software and then abandoning (actually ending and deleting) the software - think "Video Station" as at least one example.
For about 10 years I have wondered if there may be sufficient market for geographically-distributed physical backup drive storage via USPS Flat Rate Priority Mail. The idea is that you back up two copies of your system, and keep one copy on premises, and send me the other copy. I put it on a shelf for up to a year, then send it back to you on a regular schedule. You send additional backups on a weekly, monthly, or quarterly basis, and the destination rotates between dedicated facilities around the country (in different threat zones). If you want your backup returned early, it's free via USPS FRPM, or you pay a few extra bucks for express mail. But I will NEVERY OPEN THE BOX. I think this model can be done for ~$30/rotation, and could be ramen profitable for only a few thousand rotations per month. But I can't tell if there would be enough demand (and if individuals and SMBs would do the periodic backups that they think they should) without trying it. Any thoughts?
Isn't that similar to a part of Iron Mountain's business model except they pick it up themselves instead of using USPS?
Is this similar to ZFS rent ?
@@prashanthb6521 ZFS Rent would be a good competitor price-wise. My idea may be strong only with people who don't trust the security of any ISPs. Though I have been told that receiving a fresh box in the mail periodically might be a good reminder that it is time to do seasonal backups (home user).
@@buckturgidson9666 When I called them 10+ years ago, it was $140+ per month for pickup (with chain-of-custody logging) and storage on a shelf. If you have multiple backup copies, and one is near you, then the need for chain-of-custody security is close to zero. And I'm proposing $30-40 for up to a year of storage.
This offering is very similar to how Redstor run, although you don't get the hardware delivered to you - Redstor maintain that.
Presume you do with this type of Synology?
Although while Redstor can install an agent on Hyper-V for guest vm backups, they recommend you install the agent within the vm itself and this would be the same for a hypervisor that runs KVM.
Let's mention cost of ownership multiple times.... but not the cost.
Your statement on the "USB cable" situation reminds me of a sign I used to display. It read " We don't do Synchoo's" Because if I had £1 for everytime I provided basic advice like "check you haven't left a 3.5" floppy disc whilst booting" and 3 months later I got a "Synchoo did that..." 😂😂😂
everytime isn't a word
On this the week of ZFS 2.3 with new fast dedup and direct I/O for the nvme inclined.
I just installed a Supermicro server that looks kind of like this. XCP-NG as the OS off a boot raid, and a SAS card and drives to feed to TrueNAS Scale. Backup target and XCP-NG will store my backups there (as well as in S3). But of course with XCP-NG doing the backups itself in Xen Orchestra the need for third party software diminishes. I'd still prefer to keep using Veeam, tbh.
Dell also offers all in one backup appliances without subscription, like the PowerProtect DM5500.
00:14 sus amd cpu box in the back. its a bigger box than the last zen5 cpu boxes but is it a cpu with cooler probablyyyy, like a 9600?🤨
Another good video thx you buddy ✅✅
great subject and solutions
Weve had to drop security products to keep backup going. Its expensive.
Could someone some how use the USB 3.2 Gen2x2=Thunder Bolt 4=40Gb/s for Straight Networking Maybe with like something like the M.2 Cheat Codes?
Can it also work with windows shadow copy from the client side?
Commvault bait and switched us last renewal by charging for AD backups after it was previously "free". I absolutely can't stand these companies.
I get the harrasment from Dell for warranty replacement. Unfortunately I have to send the device 600 Km to get the service done.
I don’t trust that… what is preventing them from accessing my data without my knowledge?
pulling the plug does.. also you can use it offline, or in a closed network
@@pcislocked I was referring to the features that allow them to preemptively send out a replacement HDD/PSU…
@@harveyweizman yep i know, tbh probably they have access to the device to do all that extra stuff, but the "hdd bad send new" thing is just an api endpoint where device just reports the failure to synology
@@pcislocked unless it’s open source, there’s no way to confirm it does only that.
By the way he described it in the video, it sounds like they have some sort of real-time access to the sever…
@@harveyweizman i was speculating obviously. either way for me this device is either running on a closed network or it is not on my rack
Has anyone mentioned the 45k US$ price tag?
He wrote in a comment it's less than $12k, if you're in AU that's still less than $20k at current exchange rates (unless Aussies get ripped off as usual...)
NovaStor enterprise Backup is actually a steal. However, there are amazing FOSS tools for enterprise backup if you don't care about support
People still do ssd caching? Its gotten cheap enough for us to do all ssd arrays instead.
Hyper Backup for Business vs the ActiveProtect she tells you not to worry about
On the point of PBS - I use the cheapest solution I guess... Intel NUC8i5 with 16gb RAM, 500gb nvme & 6tb SATA HDD... yes 3,5". PBS gets a 8GB VM + 50gb boot + 150gb zfs special device + the HDD, also it's running a router/vpn VM and so. As these all connect to two wireguard endpoints in the datacenter (hetzner & vultr) and run BGP to each host, they see eachother and each of the site nodes holds the backups of the others or the replicas. Why replicas? Two sides have a PVE cluster for rendering 3d models and so they can back up locally to the nuc and PBS replicates it offside.
They don't tell me a price = not a real product
CDW has this at $47k, is that right?
From the things that I do it comes down to price. Solution this is very good. Veeam seem to increase there price. I will say I am interested to learn more about something like this
I'll buy this because my 100gb google drive is getting full!!!!
But now... what about us peasant powerusers who just have a DIY TrueNAS Scale box at home? I'm just syncing one ZFS Dataset to a replica and putting that up into Crashplan. $10/mo isn't bad but also never had to do a full restore and I heard that absolutely sucks with CrashPlan (The upload was like 1TB/mo, dreadfully slow)
Having somewhat recently bought MCX515A-CCAT 100Gbps cards and very recently getting them working pcie 4.0 and poking them bits over SMB Direct at 10GB/s, the 10gbps port in this product seems a bit feeble.
Glad to see someone trying to disrupt veeam in the smaller business space, just like how the scale out cloud focused backup systems have in the enterprise (Rubrik and Cohesity). Too small for my environment at work so I'll stick with my briks and laugh at the ransomware fvckers as I restore everything with a single click.
DP stands for Deep Pockets.
Nothing can beat Rubrik for true enterprise backup though...
Came to say this, despite the price. Infected backup scanning, backup everything from almost anywhere out of the box, and if you do get ransomed someone on the phone until you're back up
Their SQL Server backup system is rough tho.. Not that Synology is necessarily better
@@Viperviretrue. But any excuse to annoy a dba is ok with me
It's so fargin expensive. Yet so good... still going to check out Synology so I can say we did our diligence and yes the renewal is $$$$$$
Hi I’m your fav Rando ❤😂
We going back to, Nobody got fired for buying IBM
Woot!
Im sorry this is all very interesting and all but I could not focus once I noticed the zombie golden girls picture .. what in the name of $deity is going on there
It’s a Wendell thing =)
Wendel need some more head room
so tired of crappy backup solutions. Going to look into this for sure.
I still don’t understand why this would be more desirable than TrueNAS plus a reliable hardware vendor.
you don't also then have to buy software.
I understand if you are performing system level backups of laptops or similar. Their endpoint software might be appealing, especially features like global dedup, but I don’t know of any companies who don’t already use broad endpoint management software and some type of cloud / shared documents solution. I imagine anything that is not endpoint would be fine with network storage and snapshots.
I don’t work at a large enterprise, am I missing some piece of the equation?
What you are describing is the first step in the chain to have backups for users of their data. Send it to a NAS. Then the company makes a copy of the data on the NAS on an appliance to have a backup locally. In many cases, the data eventually gets copied out to a cold tier on a cloud destination. The 321 Backup Policy that should be the minimum for any business specifies you should have at least 3 copies (original, copy on NAS, copy on backup/archive ) on 2 media (NAS and Backup appliance) with 1 copy off site. The backup appliance is typically actually 2 or more clusters that replicate the data between themselves to remove the copies from the datacenter that is most likely hosting the VMs with the production databases and other such important infrastructure.
bacula for the win :)
I know exactly what you're talking about.
Are those framed photos of Margaret Thatcher?
Zombie Golden Girls
So early that porn bots are still in comments… oh lawd YT do better!
*heavy breathing into the al gore rhythm mic*
I'm just a nerd with a "nerd shelf" as dubbed by the wife above the fridge. I do like when low-mid hardware solutions pop... because I am a bottom feeder and my server needs another $4 Xeon or maybe I'll upgrade to something efficient.
But not during the winter, it's helping.
15:14 Cooler Master XG Plus PSU 😅
interesting as synology runs linux and either btrfs or zfs...:)
Synology are done
Never thought of DP as something bad, but here we are.
Knowing Synology, it will be demanding branded drives. Their 2-disk DP has gigabit ports ffs...
This bigger thing looks better, because apparently it's gearing to cater to business more than to smb/soho/home usesegment, but still, they're sus now
Nutanix is noo-TAN-icks not noo-TAWN-icks
Nah, Veeam is cheap for what if offers and offline and tape backups will never be something Synology offers.
But can it run Crysis?
2014 called....it want's it's joke back.
@thbadmin7751 Um actually the joke goes back well before 2014, as far back as 2009 Infact. Like and Subscribe for more facts
They get you, not by your uploads, but by charging you to download and retrieve. This is a huge dis-incentive for you to get your stuff, and go to a competitor. BEWARE !!! In the long run, it is cheaper for you to host 3 of your own servers, and have a tech to do maintenance.
Very true. You will only realize the problem you are in after they have sunk their teeth deep enough into you.
Are you getting paid to do this review?
I doubt they're stupid enough to not disclose a sponsored video.
nope, and I just packed it for return shipping. The backup software subscription renewals are getting brutal and I really don't care for that AT ALL. It blew my mind this actually does cost less than last years renewal cost for JUST THE SOFTWARE to backup about 100 virtual machines in a small cluster.
Dont backup, go forward.
Idk why im watching this, i will never need this for anything i do 😂
no one does, it sux
Potty training your data server. Not something I ever thought...
Synology has lost their way... watch someone like dell come out with this and synology just looses all momentum because Dell shops are just gonna stick with Dell. And the enthusiasts market doesnt want synology back at this point...we see what they care about
F dell storage. F all of it. F networker, too. They won't touch Rubrik or Cohesity
@@spunkmunki networker/avamar is junk.
Has a random 9575f processor. 😂
Google synology security problems ..it is scary ,,why do you push such a junk
Datto Backups: Get new appliance, assured migration is as easy as opening the migration wizard and pressing go. Unpack device, setup, go to Wizard... down indefinitely for maintenance. Spend a week going back and forth with support until the agree to migrate for us. Schedule for Friday afternoon. Do all the prepwork, go home, come back Monday... nothing. Support says they forgot. Take more time for them to finally migrate for us.
Next bill comes in. Billed an extra month for the old appliance because support took so long to get off of it. Complain. Tech team says they can't issue refunds, billing team says its not their problem the tech team screwed up. Takes weeks of escalating to get our money back.
During the last meeting on issue we are invited to buy 900 dollar tickets to their Las Vegas event.
They can't even back up ReFS properly. They dont know how to safely package disks. They dont have a reasonable net of onesite tech. I know people this is a logical choice since they just so understand Syno NAS and ABB is stable enough but oh dear. Oh dear. This is not an enterprise system. It's looks like a good idea for SMB if you do it wisely (separate admin teams, scale them near to your clusters and dont share them cross envs. Will be nice. But please let's not call it enterprise. You could not even implement an enterprise setup with a 100 of these. Syno needs to stay humble in that env if they wanna make their name.
Sorry, but ReFS isn't anywhere remotely enterprise (unless you have access to the Microsoft dev team to fix it when it breaks).
hehe my NAS is stupid overkill. 16c Xeon E5 2697A V4 with 256GB RDIMM and a dual port SFP28 25gig connectx-4lx. And my storage..... four 4tb 7200rpm sata drives. lol
Maybe some day solid state will become affordable - or I'll get an HBA and eight 4tb 7200rpm SAS drives.
I'd be happy to keep using Macrium Reflect for my disk imaging backups like I used to, but I will not subscribe to software - period. I'd pay like 40 bucks per device or like 120 bucks for unlimited devices for personal use without an expectation of getting the next major software version - but never yearly. The software is the product, not me.
Synology products are not even in the same universe as Veeam. Veeam doesn't recommend synology appliances as backup storage either, because they lack a raid controller and will easily corrupt your data during any power issue. A proper server with windows and raid controller offers far better performance and reliability. so in short, this won't disrupt anything but the smallest customers who cheap out and then will be sorry later.
As someone with a 4 bay synology, never had data corruption with power outages. Also my windows servers at work break way more often than synology and truenas systems
ups. always use an ups.
@@JefferyBurke300 I'm sure your anecdote outweighs the mountains of data veeam has built internally on the subject from testing.
Many enterprise backup vendors won't even officially support Synology NAS appliances. I can't say the number of times connecting to them with proper permissions has been a pain point. Maybe they've come light years from where they were a few years ago, but I have my doubts they won't have a lot of teething problems trying ot support "medium" sized businesses.
Disruption of bullcrap by bullshite.