Community discussion on "The Value of Others" (Part II)
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- My book has been out for over a month now, which should have given you plenty of time to peruse its contents. Let's get together to discuss your questions about intersexual dynamics and the economic model of relationships.
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Presented by Orion Taraban, Psy.D. PsycHacks provides viewers with a brief, thought-provoking video several days a week on a variety of psychological topics, inspired by his clinical practice. The intention is for the core idea contained within each video to inspire viewers to see something about themselves or their world in a slightly different light. The ultimate mission of the channel is to reduce the amount of unnecessary suffering in the world.
#psychology #dating #relationship
My book has been out for over a month now, which should have given you plenty of time to peruse its contents. Let's get together to discuss your questions about intersexual dynamics and the economic model of relationships.
Buy my book, "The Value of Others"
Ebook: amzn.to/460uGrA
Audiobook: amzn.to/3YfFwbx
Paperback: amzn.to/3xQuIFK
Book a paid consultation:
oriontarabanpsyd.com/consultations
Subscribe to my newsletter: oriontarabanpsyd.com
Social Media
TikTok: www.tiktok.com/@oriontaraban
Facebook: facebook.com/profile.php?id=100090053889622
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/orion-taraban-070b45168/
Instagram: instagram.com/psyc.hacks
Twitter: twitter.com/oriontaraban
Website: oriontarabanpsyd.com
Orion's Theme: ruclips.net/video/WrXBzQ2HDEQ/видео.html
Thinking of going to grad school? Check out STELLAR, my top-rated GRE self-study program based on the world's only empirically-validated test prep system. Use the code "PSYCH" for 10% off all membership plans: stellargre.com.
Become a Stellar affiliate and earn a 10% commission for every membership purchased by a new student you conduct into the program: stellargre.tapfiliate.com.
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Sound mixing/editing by: valntinomusic.com
Presented by Orion Taraban, Psy.D. PsycHacks provides viewers with a brief, thought-provoking video several days a week on a variety of psychological topics, inspired by his clinical practice. The intention is for the core idea contained within each video to inspire viewers to see something about themselves or their world in a slightly different light. The ultimate mission of the channel is to reduce the amount of unnecessary suffering in the world.
#psychology #dating #relationship
Please fix your AV setup so that the picture doesn't shake whenever you touch the screen/keyboard
(and the audio is breaking up in places too. This doesn't happen in your usual videos)
I've bought your book, and it is great apart from at the very end where you give your view of the future of sexual relationships, which, unlike everything else you say, seems based purely on personal experience (?) and naive optimism. Perhaps you could do a video explaining why you think (a majority of) people might actually behave that way in future?
( Personally, I think that society cannot function under any system other than traditional mongamy even if it doesn't work very well, and the only long term, stable, future "solution" is to replace relationships with people with relationships with chatbots/sexbots 😞)
I just finished it and I'm in awe. This might just be the best book on relationships ever written. Brutal realism, insanely nuanced insights bringing together the enormous complexity of modern relationships. Even the few slightly weak theories had highly instructional facets. The views on romanticism remain questionable. Detractors aside, romanticism has nothing to do with eroticism, narcissism or looking for trouble...and everything to do with nature speaking after grabbing a couple by the collar. Just because its rare in terms of realization and often inconvenient doesn't mean it's unreal or a sickness.For the intelligent, romanticism distills to multifaceted compatibility. Far from the scourge society makes it out to be, it's the only thing that can make the hyperconflation of marriage actually work. The last chapter was glorious. I bought the Kindle but now I need the paperback to annotate the living lights out of it.
Superb tour de force.
Taraban is my go-to guy when it comes to life/dating. I've been watching him for about 6 months or so. Im so grateful for his insight.
Thanks Orion, as always your knowledge is just mindblowing. Although, not only the knowledge, the way you teach is really exceptional, you are really exceptional and excellent mentor.
I'm north of average, but not by much. My wife has always been amazing in my eyes but she's actually south of average. That said, she filed for divorce a few months ago and my heart breaks every morning since. Obviously we dated and mated but it didn't result in a lifelong relationship.
Captains have to accept that passengers can leave the ship. It's a part of life. Are you going to look for new passengers? Or, are you going to sail on your own for a bit?
Sorry to hear that. It’s really hard and probably beyond what I can comprehend. You’ll grieve and heal and sail on. Much love brother.
Happened to me unexpectedly. When I told a Christian co worker he said "Well we are all flawed" that was not the answer I was looking for, but it really is accurate of both sexes. My opinion, Cherish what you had and cherish what comes next.
@wayne7936 I'll steer clear of women. My son, who is high functioning autistic, needs all of my help right now and probably for the rest of my life. I'll focus on helping him build a legacy so that when I'm gone he will be okay. Another woman will only drain resources.
Keep on keeping on, my friend. Easier said than done, right? But that's what you have to do.
59:53 - "You signed up for monogany, not for celibacy. Enforced celibacy is as distant from a monogamous arrangement as cheating. Both fail to comply with the act of providing sex for one other person".
That's what a therapist is for. A proper reframing of the expectations that should be derived from a contract.
I will print this wisdom and keep it visible to myself. I also live in a forced celibacy, and I find it so unfair. I could easily get laid with pretty women, but my moral standards did not allow me to do that. In light of Orion's perspective, I will rethink what marriage is from scratch. Not that I will go and sleep with other women starting from tomorrow, but I will never see my commitment the way I did so far.
@@JinyKafe Take into account this reads quite differently if you are a single man. A married man already signed a legal contract where, unless he is with a woman that has brought money to the house and bought a significant amount of the marital assets, he will lose a lot.
It's not just about cheating. Even if you file for divorce, the cost is likely higher for your lifestyle. All that said, it might still be a worthy price.
This is why Orion says "men date women for acceptable loss". That's a worthy video essay to look at in your situation.
@@nikeisagreekgoddess4135 Thank you for the input.
Our marriage is not black or white. My wife is a good friend and an excellent mother. But we are terrible lovers. The sexual appetite is not there from her side, and over the years, it has faded from my side, too.
I agree with Orion that relationships are transactional and that values change over time. If we raise our kids, marriage has more benefits than being single. I also want to ensure my wife is provided materially.
But what then, after everything is done? I am not a sexual beast. It is about intimacy, you understand.
Anyway. I find very few channels talking about modern marriage problems. My intention was not to talk about myself. I am strong, and I take things as they are. But it is great to share the experience with others.
Greetings from the Czech Republic
These live streams are my favorite! 😍 I love seeing how quickly you process the questions and what comes forth off the cuff. 🔥 Every bit as delicious and articulate as the essays. 🙌 The variety of topics covered is like getting 10 new episodes at once too. 💖
Something i don't think a lot of people think about with the 1-10 scale in judging someone's value is that the further you get away from the average, the more rare it is exponentially. As an example if you line up 10 people the odds a 10 is there is nearly 0. 10's are so rare they almost don't exist at all.
A couple of thoughts: Interviewing two couples in a room together can be successful. Telling the truth will always work itself out. They may not like it and may develop some resentment, but when they choose to ponder what was said, they will likely respect what was said in the end. Biblically speaking, " speak the truth with love." As far as the other thing you mentioned, about romance, if you can't be your true authentic self around a person that person is not likely the relationship for you. From a biblical perspective, God may have called you to the gift of singleness. Oftentimes, in life, we push for things that we want without taking into consideration what God wants for our lives. There has to be that altruistic connection, or it may be a sign you're not moving ahead with his plan.
Your answer for that First question was spot on and a perspective I’ve not previously considered.
Thank you.
I should have known that Pareto would probably explain something that confounds me.
Thanks for clarifying the parable in your book. I pondered on it for a while after finishing reading it.
I just giggle I was the first to get a review in Apple Books 🤭
Incredible book folks. Get it. I’m on my 3rd go around trying to even digest a fraction of its contents
You should do more of these, not only for your book, but for our questions in general.
Amazing book ! I'm recommending it every around me. You make a great and honest contribution in the field. Keep up the great work ! 👏👏👏
Thanks for all your hard work Orion. I had to re-read chapter 10, 2 times, due to the dense content which I at first couldn't fully comprehend due to the structure of the chapter. However everything became clear in the final few pages. Truly an apt read for the modern times. I know there is particular difficulty embedded in the challenge, but I'd love to see a follow up book in the future with perhaps some practical advice on making long term relationships go the distance and how to walk that fine line of love. Cheers
I'm so sad that I missed another one of your lives. The book is excellent, thank you
What a resonating perspective. With the current times, and refreshing as hell. Thanks my dude.
Parental disapproval and positive life options reduces alcohol issues. In france studies showed that introducing alcohol earlier was still a factor in increased risk for alcohol abuse.
Brilliant analysis on why divorce is so prominent, fact is, you get what you incentivise! And our state laws are implicit in the transfer of wealth, in most instances, from men to women.
Comminincation is a mean to acheve a task. If you already know what you spouse wants, there is no need for further "communication".
Sometimes being heard is the current "goal", this is a different context.
My favorite audiobook 👍
Congratulation on the success, Orion! 💪💪 I really enjoy your work!
Always happy to watch, read any of your ideas. There are chapters, concepts in the book that are verbose and impenetrable on first read. Would it be possible for you to demonstrate the game of “please/no”? I’m unclear how this works in practice and can’t find anything on RUclips. Many thanks! UK reader 🙏🏼
I jave a great title for an episode.
"Situationships - Men go where they are Welcomed"
I think this would be a great working title to explore the current dating scene and why women always blame men to staying in Situationships longer than we should.
Thank u Orion. Very useful.
I'm not sure the primary lesson of the monk parable starting at 48:30 is the importance of being in the present moment. I think being present in that story is mostly just a strategy to resist attachment to objects of desire, which is really the main lesson.
The monk who violates the letter of the law by touching the woman to help her nevertheless adheres to the spirit of the law by not fixating on his physical contact with her. He understands that the law isn't some arbitrary provision against contact because contact is *inherently* bad, but that it is meant to prevent all of the consuming distractions that come with lust, intimacy, etc. Since he has a (probably cultivated) resistance to these temptations, he can violate the technicalities of the law without being "corrupted" by the bad outcomes the law was created to prevent. Which frees him to pursue a greater good than mere absitence: helping her cross the river safely.
So yes, "being present" is a very important tool in that monk's strategy to avoid attachment. But it's not necessarily the presence itself that is the goal here (though it may be the goal in other contexts like meditation). In this case, the goal is to resist fixation on earthly pleasures (and fantasies of their potentiality).
I am pretty ignorant about Buddhist belief. But my limited understanding is that many practices do involve moral rectitude, asceticism, etc. Not only this pursuit of "being in the present moment" for its own sake. I might very well be wrong, but it seems like a lot of Westerners only focus on the therapeutic, personally beneficial, feel-good aspects of Buddhism (feeling "chill") and leave out the moral imperatives (i.e. resist earthly temptation, help others, etc.). It seems to me that these things are fundamentally interconnected.
Just got your book on audible
Enjoy your videos!
As a former sailor, I appreciate that Dr. Orion curses like a sailor.
4:10 With your value-based model, Briffault’s Law and hypergamy in mind, does associative mating (a 5 dating a 5) make sense? Or should men who are 5s consider dating women who are 3s?
I've listened to the doc's response with interest... my related take would include that even the 3's current condition is impermanent, and unlikely to change upwards (though that may evade her perception). pragmatically, if there isn't anything else in such option, eg personality-wise, the effort of constantly building her up (for what she isn't, as may dawn on her, and be frantically denied...) may not be found worth it, one day. and assortative, like age-apropriate choice won't entail genuine attraction on any side, either.
@@VaronPlateando to summarize "the juice isn't worth the squeeze"
@@marriagecausesdivorce7540 well… that quasi goes without saying. I just wanted a slightly more explanatory spin in it, to whomever yet to ‚get‘ the issue.
For the guy who is married for 20 plus years and his wife is no longer sexual. Look up rian stones books on dread. Praxeology i believe is the name of his book. Its your only option. Also next time dont get married so you can simply just choose better. As long as you're upholding your end of the bargain there is no room for that in a relationship.
Hello Orion,
Love your book and your videos. Your content is excellent and I highly recommend it to anyone who need to hear it.
That said... Please consider working on your jokes. Hope I haven't overstepped. Take care man
Dr ssid " you have to be a salesman." To women.
Thisvis why wome fall in love with what they hear, this is why men lie to women.
Men fall in love with what they see, reason why women wear make up.. its never changing. .. Be the best salesman you can be.
You comment on drinking. German kids can drink at around 15-16 years of age. It wasn’t until around the early 2000’s that hard alcohol was banned until you reached 18. From my observation as a multi decade expat, German kids relationship to drinking is similar to American kids being to drive at 15/16. The situation dips a few years later. German kids at like total morons when they are able to get their drivers licenses, to the equal extent that American kids act when they reach legal drinking age. Seeing this, if I ever have kids, they will learn to drive like I did. At the age of 10-12 (i first learned to drive tractors), and drinking, if they wish to try, at the age of 16, in the presence of their family. And it will be introduced with food, as I so often saw while living in Europe. The experience is totally different than just going to a club or a bar.
57:15 well... the relatively 'better' option may be found 'to go one's own way' though, as quite some (eg 63% in u.s.) gents do seem to realise recently. or (see aaron clarey) that one section of 'the menu' is actually empty (of what one could wish for).
Hi Orion! I donated during the live stream but my question wasn’t addressed. My first time donating so I may have done something wrong. My question was how should a man navigate the sexual marketplace if he’s Alpha in everyday life, but submissive in the bedroom?
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
No Alpha here!
Define Alpha, objectively then stop house playing!
The dynamic in the bedroom flows directly into the relationship in general, so no worries, whatever woman you find, they will take the control in the relationship, thereby, negating the 'alpha' aspect of your view of yourself (whatever you mean by Alfa buddy)
Has to be trolling
@indyZar317
Please give women advice on dating men like you
38:25 and I'd guess this is where majority of affected gents' issues were ignited. definitely worth mentioning here. also as further down the trajectories, gyn.cent psy.thrp + professionals are seen as mere continuation of same kinda evil. who'd (in his right survivor's mind) really grant trust to such ?!? [that's reg. mens' mental health month...]
35:00
44:00 inauthentic but functional relationship
It becomes easier
Dr..your word is GOSPEL ❤
Your funny 😄 👍🏻
I bought the book immediately. So glad to see someone sharing so much value without the need to wear weird suits😅
About the man's age when to settle down.
My grandson was born in the winter, my daughter is 27, I'm 48, my father is 68, my grandfather passed few months ago at the age of 97.
If you wait until you are 35+ until you start a family, what are the odds of you enjoying having grandchildren in your life.
Do most men even live past 70?
Last time I looked the average guy lived to 75.
@@IfSemper which means that if you have kids when you are 35+, you may meet your grandchildren but they will never have any kind of memory of you.
If we look at the data about grandparents role in a successful life, is it easier or harder for kids who have living grandparents?
@@Egsise Yeah, I wasn't arguing, just answering your question about men's mortality age. I think as long as they aren't a negative influence, extended family is good for the kids & the parents in a myriad of ways. One of my Grandfathers didn't marry until 35 & died before I was born, as an example of what you're talking about.
@@IfSemper sorry me neither, I'm just throwing around thoughts.
@@Egsise No apology necessary; I understand. On the topic, there are pros & cons with a man having children earlier vs. later, but I personally think what's most important is him being ready/capable of have a healthy relationship with the child while raising them & picking the right woman to Mother his child. Somethings need to be done right or not at all & certainly not rushed.
binging isn't a problem in Europe? tell that to the English n Irish
No, he means actual Europeans. I'm British and can confirm the U.K. has a very different attitude to most of western Europe. It's practically a sport in the U.K. due to it being such a depressing place to live. It was quite mind blowing when I travelled more widely in Europe, to see how differently they regard excessive alcohol consumption, it happens but it's far less normalised, at least until you get far enough east on the continent.
Timestamps
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You are simply wrong about the cow and the milk explanation because sex involves emotions. If women could give away free samples AND not become attached to the potential customer you would have a point. But the vast majority of women become attached to one of the men they are giving free samples to in one of the first few customers. When they do they become damaged, and as they continue with the free samples over time that damage builds up. That accumulated damage causes that woman to become increasingly difficult to deal with. The first thing most men don't want is a damaged woman who is difficult to deal with, especially when the emotions come from a source having nothing to do with that man and he cannot help manage those issues. Like it or not, this makes free samples a horrible piece of advice for almost every woman. What's best is for women in general is to demand payment up front. Whether you as a man like it or not.
1:00:55 HAIL this !! and this is why | where gents may come to 'cheat to stay' (vs xx.s doing so to leave, probably)...
Oh yes...Mr Tarantula...umm Taraban! Youre an elusive soft silver surfer in the realms of reality. Having been hurt and being needy...Now look at you! Best regards!
What about over 60 dating.
This is way too long. Should be 5 minutes or less.
Terribly written book. Pls hire a good editor. I don't have an opinion yet because i need to get through it first, which is quite a challenge.
The physical book is of poor quality. The glue that holds it together came apart and some of the pages are loose. Could you please make a cotton-stitched hardcover in the future. Your book has become gospel-like and the quality of the material should complement the physical characteristics of a religious book. Keep up the good work, cheers.
The audio book is excellent because he narrates it himself
@@Alexxx492 I’m asking for a better quality physical book because I want to reread it over and over again and highlight it like a textbook. Audio books are not capable of that feature.
Ebooks are!
My softback is good quality
Most low volume, self published, books on Amazon are printed to order.
The only way you'll get a decent one is if he sells so many that traditional publisher wants to get involved 😞
29:30 well... I guess, it's not unwise to rather err on the side of 'hypergamy doesn't care' - as for xx.ine (evo.psych) nature to be expressed, potentially, or even utmost probably so.