⚡Lee's Full review video: ruclips.net/video/Usj8ahCmbxs/видео.html 🛒 Save 15% on our tutorials with code "RUclips": www.fstoppers.com/store 📷Fstoppers Photo Contests: ➡www.fstoppers.com/contests Subscribe to the Fstoppers RUclips Channel: ➡ruclips.net/user/FStoppers The Flashes in this Test 1: Godox V1➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=godox+v1&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303 UPDATED: Godox V1 Pro:➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=godox%20v1%20pro&sts=ma&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=674415-152 2. Neewer Z2➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=neewer+z2&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303 3. Westcott FJ80 II➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=westcott+fj+80+ii&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303 4. Profoto A10 ➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=profoto+a10&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303 5. Sony HVL-F60RM2➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1668145-REG/sony_hvl_f60rmii_hvl_f60rm_ii_wireless_radio.html?BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303 🛒🏪🛍 Support Fstoppers by shopping at: B&H Photo and Video ➡ bit.ly/3K7CrlX Amazon ➡ amzn.to/3hkTEXS 📸Follow Fstoppers on Instagram: ➡ instagram.com/officialfst... Follow Lee and Patrick's Puerto Rico Instagram: ➡ instagram.com/fstopperspr/ In this video Patrick Hall tests 5 of the most popular speedlights to see which ones perform best with a global shutter as found on the new Sony A9iii Mirrorless Camera. A global shutter allows photographers to sync flash to shutter speeds much faster than the traditional max shutter sync of 1/250th of a second. Unlike using a neutral density filter or using HSS, a global shutter allows more of the flash power to sync to the camera without wasting energy or having to shoot at full power. In this test Patrick looks at the Profoto A10, Westcott FJ80ii, Godox V1, Neewer Z1, and Sony HVL-F60RM2 flashes and does a variety of tests at 1/8,000 and 1/80,000 of a second.
FYI the A9III is not the first full frame global shutter mirrorless camera, it is the first global shutter STILLS camera, but there have been global shutters in the cinema space for ages. The Vita 25k is a full frame mirrorless global shutter cinema camera that came out in 2010
It’s interesting tech and it’s just being released to the masses. While it might only apply this this one camera, global shutters are coming to many more cameras in the next few years. -P
What I realize is how insane sync speed is not going to work when shooting with more than one flash and it will make flash adjustments a pain even when using it with one flash. I was excited about global shutters, but you made me realize it's not that great after all.
Yeah that's a rabbit hole I haven't even attempted to dive into. I'm thinking this is mainly useful for single light setups outside when the light is bright and you want to shoot wide open with your main go to light. -P
IMO don’t knock it until you tried it. In reality, you can set them all at one flash timing value and the difference might not be that big. And it’s not like Global shutter prevents you from using the conventional approach. At least you have an option to get the same captured output of a B10X+ out of a speedlight. Not sure how that is not amazing by any standards.
Well you only get close to the same output with the timing settings dialed in perfectly. The settings seem to be much more unforgiving at shutters closer to 1/80,000 than at 1/4000 so your comment about using multiple flashes together is only useful with those slower settings. In my tests, the flash sync setting needed for 1/4 power and then 1/16th power didn’t always overlap and at 1/16th it’s much easier to miss the peak. You might be okay if everything is the same power and same brand of flash but then you have to physically move the light closer or further to achieve the lighting output you want which as we all know changes the quality of the light. -P
@@hiepvophan I understand how amazing it can be and I've dreamed about that for years. However, there are a few things that Fstoppers mentionned that I wasn't thinking about : - The fact that, at hyper high shutter speeds, you are cutting into the flash curve. That might mean that you won't be getting the full light spectrum as you normally need the entire flash curve for that. But that's a small problem, for me. - IGBT flash units work by cutting the tail end of the flash to control power. It means that the flash is always at full power, but if you cut the power, it will just be shorter. That means that powering up or down the flash unit will not technically alter the flash power when shoot at, say, 1/80000. It might become a pain to control the flash power at those speeds since any adjustment you make on the flash unit is not reflected on the exposure. That means it will be hard to use in practice. - Multiple flash at the same time might require multiple timing setting to get it right, depending on the unit, the power level, etc. Other thing is makes me think about is that this technology might really be way better with old school voltage controlled flash units. These units have longer flash durations and they put out less light if you decrease the power levels. My guess is that when global shutters become the norm, a lot of people will want to go back to their old non-IGBT flash units for that. My old Elinchrom units might have a boost in value at that time :)
@@YogueDaddy it’s simpler than you think: - If you know your flash duration at each power setting, just use a setting which has a similar speed as your shutter speed or faster. As you get to 1/256, that’s when you want to mess around with your flash timing. A friend of mine is using his strobes and the A9iii almost at 1/256 all the time to capture high speed action at 30fps. - 1/80000 iso 250 is 1.3 stop darker than 1/8000 iso 100. Have you ran into a lot situations that you want to go higher than your typical max shutter speed? I doubt many would want to shoot at 1/80000 with multiple lights. So this is academic. And you can only one flash timing; so normally, you want a value that can work well enough with your multiple lights. I hope Patrick will dive into this to have a clear answer. - Since you are/were an Elinchrom user, not sure why you feel playing with the flash timing as a hassle, Elinchrom ODS is pretty much similar. And a voltage controlled flash has a lower peak power since on the Hyper Sync head, they try to flatten the peak to lengthen the flash duration so that the traveling shutter curtains can capture about the same amount of light during its travel. IGBT is currently the best tech to work globally shutter. The only thing to boost the output is to have strobes with even faster flash duration, like the new Godox AD600 Pro II. Global shutter is not a perfect solution for strobes since the technology on these strobes is also pretty dated. But it’s still the most efficient for flash use currently.
Patrick, thank you for the awesome series on GS and flash/strobe use. Absolutely the best out there. Your findings on the Sony is really insightful. With the new Godox series, they might be the best on the market for Global Shutter. I think at this point there is only that multiple flash/strobe set-up left for you to test. Cheers! Hiep
Yeah I wish we had that one but Lee ordered the V1. I'm not sure that it would make a huge difference since this test didn't show that much variation. -P
@@FStoppers the westcott was dead last under normal sync speed by a significant margin but ended up first at high shutter speed. The new Godox AD600ii has a freeze mode with about thrice as fast duration. Should have a significant advantage.
An interesting, though one with a relatively small user base. One thing that you didn't consider when conducting these tests was the possibility that the radio triggers may also have some influence on the flash duration. That's something which could be easily checked using the Godox V1 as I believe you guys have two or maybe more Godox, Sony flash-mount triggers. Does that make any sense whatsoever, or am I going completely mad?
I haven’t found that the radio trigger interferes with the flash. You can use the sync timing to adjust it even more. I have heard it might play a roll in a leaf shutter though. -P
The sign of true scientific approach is the conclusion: "it was not what I expected, and you should not use this test as a decision maker because results are all within a small range". Kudos to this attitude! This differentiate you from many others...
I did that test a few videos back. HSS performed much worse than both using a neutral density filter or using a global shutter. HSS is the old way of syncing with faster shutter speeds but it’s also limited to like 1/8000th max. After that speed it doesn’t work at all. -P
Besides automating the syncing, I’m not sure there is some magic tech that will make it better. Maybe you could have a flash with an even faster flash duration but so far that tech has always cost soooo much more money with larger physical units. -P
Did you see how many icons were displayed on the back of the Home Screen? It also has a low red lcd like the older flashes from 20 years ago. It’s just not the most intuitive screen. Profoto and Westcott are the best and Godox is pretty good too. Sony….my least favorite. -P
The menus on Sony Alpha cameras were completely overhauled in 2020. All new cameras released in 2020 had a new menu item called ‘External Flash Settings’. The ‘External Flash Settings’ menu allows Alpha photographers to change most of the settings of the flash unit without having to touch the flash settings on the flash unit itself. It is also possible to review and change these settings using the camera’s monitor and/or finder, rather than the LCD panel on the flash.(copyright Mark Galer)
For AA battery powered flashes, the recycle speed depends to a very large degree on the batteries used. Basically you want NiMH rechargeable batteries with low internal resistance. Eneloops are a safe bet and easy to find, but many others are just as good. GP actually makes some specifically for flash use. Avoid alkaline and lithium.
⚡Lee's Full review video: ruclips.net/video/Usj8ahCmbxs/видео.html
🛒 Save 15% on our tutorials with code "RUclips": www.fstoppers.com/store
📷Fstoppers Photo Contests: ➡www.fstoppers.com/contests
Subscribe to the Fstoppers RUclips Channel:
➡ruclips.net/user/FStoppers
The Flashes in this Test
1: Godox V1➡
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=godox+v1&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303
UPDATED: Godox V1 Pro:➡ www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=godox%20v1%20pro&sts=ma&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=674415-152
2. Neewer Z2➡
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=neewer+z2&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303
3. Westcott FJ80 II➡
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=westcott+fj+80+ii&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303
4. Profoto A10 ➡
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?q=profoto+a10&BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303
5. Sony HVL-F60RM2➡
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1668145-REG/sony_hvl_f60rmii_hvl_f60rm_ii_wireless_radio.html?BI=6857&KBID=7410&KWID=673225-303
🛒🏪🛍 Support Fstoppers by shopping at:
B&H Photo and Video
➡ bit.ly/3K7CrlX
Amazon
➡ amzn.to/3hkTEXS
📸Follow Fstoppers on Instagram:
➡ instagram.com/officialfst...
Follow Lee and Patrick's Puerto Rico Instagram:
➡ instagram.com/fstopperspr/
In this video Patrick Hall tests 5 of the most popular speedlights to see which ones perform best with a global shutter as found on the new Sony A9iii Mirrorless Camera. A global shutter allows photographers to sync flash to shutter speeds much faster than the traditional max shutter sync of 1/250th of a second. Unlike using a neutral density filter or using HSS, a global shutter allows more of the flash power to sync to the camera without wasting energy or having to shoot at full power. In this test Patrick looks at the Profoto A10, Westcott FJ80ii, Godox V1, Neewer Z1, and Sony HVL-F60RM2 flashes and does a variety of tests at 1/8,000 and 1/80,000 of a second.
Great test man. Thanks for putting so much time and effort into this project, much appreciated.
FYI the A9III is not the first full frame global shutter mirrorless camera, it is the first global shutter STILLS camera, but there have been global shutters in the cinema space for ages. The Vita 25k is a full frame mirrorless global shutter cinema camera that came out in 2010
True, I’ve just not heard video cameras called mirrorless cameras. Did they ever have a SLR mechanism that then went mirrorless? -P
Thanks for making this video for a9III users like me
It’s interesting tech and it’s just being released to the masses. While it might only apply this this one camera, global shutters are coming to many more cameras in the next few years. -P
This is incredible. How does this work if youre using a trigger for multiple flashes? Or simply an off camera flash
What I realize is how insane sync speed is not going to work when shooting with more than one flash and it will make flash adjustments a pain even when using it with one flash. I was excited about global shutters, but you made me realize it's not that great after all.
Yeah that's a rabbit hole I haven't even attempted to dive into. I'm thinking this is mainly useful for single light setups outside when the light is bright and you want to shoot wide open with your main go to light. -P
IMO don’t knock it until you tried it. In reality, you can set them all at one flash timing value and the difference might not be that big. And it’s not like Global shutter prevents you from using the conventional approach. At least you have an option to get the same captured output of a B10X+ out of a speedlight. Not sure how that is not amazing by any standards.
Well you only get close to the same output with the timing settings dialed in perfectly. The settings seem to be much more unforgiving at shutters closer to 1/80,000 than at 1/4000 so your comment about using multiple flashes together is only useful with those slower settings. In my tests, the flash sync setting needed for 1/4 power and then 1/16th power didn’t always overlap and at 1/16th it’s much easier to miss the peak.
You might be okay if everything is the same power and same brand of flash but then you have to physically move the light closer or further to achieve the lighting output you want which as we all know changes the quality of the light. -P
@@hiepvophan I understand how amazing it can be and I've dreamed about that for years. However, there are a few things that Fstoppers mentionned that I wasn't thinking about :
- The fact that, at hyper high shutter speeds, you are cutting into the flash curve. That might mean that you won't be getting the full light spectrum as you normally need the entire flash curve for that. But that's a small problem, for me.
- IGBT flash units work by cutting the tail end of the flash to control power. It means that the flash is always at full power, but if you cut the power, it will just be shorter. That means that powering up or down the flash unit will not technically alter the flash power when shoot at, say, 1/80000. It might become a pain to control the flash power at those speeds since any adjustment you make on the flash unit is not reflected on the exposure. That means it will be hard to use in practice.
- Multiple flash at the same time might require multiple timing setting to get it right, depending on the unit, the power level, etc.
Other thing is makes me think about is that this technology might really be way better with old school voltage controlled flash units. These units have longer flash durations and they put out less light if you decrease the power levels. My guess is that when global shutters become the norm, a lot of people will want to go back to their old non-IGBT flash units for that. My old Elinchrom units might have a boost in value at that time :)
@@YogueDaddy it’s simpler than you think:
- If you know your flash duration at each power setting, just use a setting which has a similar speed as your shutter speed or faster. As you get to 1/256, that’s when you want to mess around with your flash timing. A friend of mine is using his strobes and the A9iii almost at 1/256 all the time to capture high speed action at 30fps.
- 1/80000 iso 250 is 1.3 stop darker than 1/8000 iso 100. Have you ran into a lot situations that you want to go higher than your typical max shutter speed? I doubt many would want to shoot at 1/80000 with multiple lights. So this is academic. And you can only one flash timing; so normally, you want a value that can work well enough with your multiple lights. I hope Patrick will dive into this to have a clear answer.
- Since you are/were an Elinchrom user, not sure why you feel playing with the flash timing as a hassle, Elinchrom ODS is pretty much similar. And a voltage controlled flash has a lower peak power since on the Hyper Sync head, they try to flatten the peak to lengthen the flash duration so that the traveling shutter curtains can capture about the same amount of light during its travel. IGBT is currently the best tech to work globally shutter. The only thing to boost the output is to have strobes with even faster flash duration, like the new Godox AD600 Pro II.
Global shutter is not a perfect solution for strobes since the technology on these strobes is also pretty dated. But it’s still the most efficient for flash use currently.
actually there is another aspect that can be tested: global shutter + the same flashes but when they are external and work via trigger
It would be great if we could start using an AD200 for everything and have similar power outputs to a much larger flash.
Awesome video! Exactly what I need
Patrick, thank you for the awesome series on GS and flash/strobe use. Absolutely the best out there. Your findings on the Sony is really insightful. With the new Godox series, they might be the best on the market for Global Shutter. I think at this point there is only that multiple flash/strobe set-up left for you to test. Cheers!
Hiep
Yeah I wish we had that one but Lee ordered the V1. I'm not sure that it would make a huge difference since this test didn't show that much variation. -P
@@FStoppers the westcott was dead last under normal sync speed by a significant margin but ended up first at high shutter speed. The new Godox AD600ii has a freeze mode with about thrice as fast duration. Should have a significant advantage.
very useful information, you did a lot of work, thank you for your effort.
Thanks
Does the Sony flash automatically give you the full output (aka automatically sync correctly) or do you still need to go adjust it?
Aaaaaaand just got to 11:05
An interesting, though one with a relatively small user base. One thing that you didn't consider when conducting these tests was the possibility that the radio triggers may also have some influence on the flash duration. That's something which could be easily checked using the Godox V1 as I believe you guys have two or maybe more Godox, Sony flash-mount triggers. Does that make any sense whatsoever, or am I going completely mad?
I haven’t found that the radio trigger interferes with the flash. You can use the sync timing to adjust it even more. I have heard it might play a roll in a leaf shutter though. -P
The sign of true scientific approach is the conclusion: "it was not what I expected, and you should not use this test as a decision maker because results are all within a small range". Kudos to this attitude! This differentiate you from many others...
Thanks Patrick, now my brain hurts 😱👍
If only fraction of power can capture with extreme shutterspeed,, maybe highspeed sync is better powerwise. Not sure.
I did that test a few videos back. HSS performed much worse than both using a neutral density filter or using a global shutter. HSS is the old way of syncing with faster shutter speeds but it’s also limited to like 1/8000th max. After that speed it doesn’t work at all. -P
Science!
Sony know what they doing !! They really want you to buy their $500 speedlight if your considering getting the Sony a9iii
Conclusion: global shutter is still too fiddly and needs some time to get streamlined with newer flash technology.
Besides automating the syncing, I’m not sure there is some magic tech that will make it better. Maybe you could have a flash with an even faster flash duration but so far that tech has always cost soooo much more money with larger physical units. -P
This is cool if you want to pay 6000 USD for a 24 MP camera.
More global shutters are coming! -P
Or buy a Nikon D70 ,D1x or similar
@@FStoppers And in the future, when that's the reality, the flashes featured in this video will have been replaced as well.
Name a global shutter camera that's cheaper, higher megapixels, faster FPS and card slots, larger buffer, and better autofocus.
@@Rocky_KO New technology is never cheaper... Quite the opposite
‘Sony performed the best but we don’t like it the most’
What? You rarely have to dive into flash menus once you have them set
Did you see how many icons were displayed on the back of the Home Screen? It also has a low red lcd like the older flashes from
20 years ago. It’s just not the most intuitive screen. Profoto and Westcott are the best and Godox is pretty good too. Sony….my least favorite. -P
The menus on Sony Alpha cameras were completely overhauled in 2020. All new cameras released in 2020 had a new menu item called ‘External Flash Settings’.
The ‘External Flash Settings’ menu allows Alpha photographers to change most of the settings of the flash unit without having to touch the flash settings on the flash unit itself.
It is also possible to review and change these settings using the camera’s monitor and/or finder, rather than the LCD panel on the flash.(copyright Mark Galer)
So the owners of that one single camera that this applies to.....
Global shutters are coming to many more cameras soon! This will be a common feature . -P
Waiting for the Sony a9iv with global shutter , higher mp and less $$
See you in 2032.
@@erbterb I’m very optimistic considering how fast they bring out new cameras maybe within a yr the most
3 people are interested 😂
For AA battery powered flashes, the recycle speed depends to a very large degree on the batteries used. Basically you want NiMH rechargeable batteries with low internal resistance. Eneloops are a safe bet and easy to find, but many others are just as good. GP actually makes some specifically for flash use. Avoid alkaline and lithium.
Yeah these were Eneloops that I was using. The recycle rate was about twice as long at full power compared to the other 4 flashes used. -P