As I was born in the Netherlands I travelled by train quite a lot during the eighties. My school was a train journey of about half an hour each way on the Amsterdam-Enkhuizen route. I don't consider myself a train spotter, but I did like watching trains and learning about them. Enjoyed this video, thanks!
04:38 a Dutch (!) railway fan noting the numbers on his hand. He had forgotten to bring his spotters book with him He was a guest on the tour. Known him a long time, but have lost track since 2018... Note the left track running at 12:45 through Purmerend Overwhere. "We" normally drive on the right, so maybe a request from the tour organisation.
There's been many a discussion about that and it's all down to the pan heads and amount of current drawn when trains are powering away from stations. Some Dutch locos kept their diamond pans while others, such as the 77s/1500s, were fitted with Faiveley pans, but these had two twin-strip (if that's the correct terminology) pan heads per pan to deal with the high current draw. Once the train was moving one pan could be dropped and it could continue with one. They definitely look better with two diamond pans though, without a doubt.
Thr tragedy and stupidity of the UK amazes me. Without a doubt any new railway would be electrified with 25kv AC. It only requires 1/16th of the current for a a similar dc 1000 loco plus tje wiring is not so heavy. Britain was so quick to either convert or remove 1500DC. The Liverpool St to Southend line only lasted a few short years before conversion to AC. The Woodhead route which totally closed is a criminal waste of money. A whole new tunnel built in 1954. France who pioneered 25Kv has a massive amount of 1500DC and I would say they have more DC than AC. The DC trains are fast. They have a dual voltage BB26000 loco of 5.6 Mega watt and it has a top speed of 200kph. Your right about the use of dual pans. Last time I was n France in 2017 I noticed many passenger trains raise the second pan when stopping and when leave it. Ovviously the starting current is very high. Interest is how the Woodhead locos always appeared to use both pans
I have seen both pans up at both stopping and starting from stations in France under 1500v DC catenary presumably because of high starting current and high regeneration current when braking.
@@Steven_Rowe there was by 1980 excess capacity of the Trans-Pennine routes due the recession. The primary traffic on the Woodhead route was coal for Fiddler's Ferry power station, but this required motive power changes at each end of the Woodhead route, and that traffic was reducing. This coupled with electrification equipment being both non-standard and life-expired (ie in need iv being replaced) along with spare capacity at the time on the Hope Valley line lead to BR decidingbto close this route. And, no mothballing the line against future needs wasn't an option. BR couldn't afford it. Mothballing means that the route should be ready to use with minimal effort and that costs money. Take the Bramley Line from March to Wisbech. This line is in situ, well most of it is under a forest of birch trees, buddleia and bramble. The signals are still in place but inoperative. But the biggest obstacles to reopening are the lack of level crossings as all of them have been removed. So much for mothballing. A better line for retention was the GE-GN Joint line from March to Spalding, closed around the same time. The removal of this line resulted 40 years later in an underpass needing to be dug at Werrington to allow freight trains from Felixstowe to reach the Spalding line without interrupting the trains on the ECML. Butbthe benefit if retention is only clear with 40 years of hindsight.
@@neiloflongbeck5705 good info, the idea of non standard equipment I do find somewhat hard to swallow and I feel BR was simply over zealous in its modernization approach. The French pioneered 25Kv yet even now huge proportions of the network are 1500DC and they still run trains at 200Kph It would be nice to see an EM2 or EM1 with suitable transformer and rectifer so they could run them on 25Kv It isn't going to happen but a nice thought. I live in Aus and the Sydney and Melbourne networks are 1500 DC. Also Dublin has electric trains only dating from the 80s and they use 1500 which I find strange
Quite ironic really and a typically British. These sturdy locos spend longer working in the Netherlands than they do for the people who paid for them.!
Six of the Class 77 EM2 locos were rebuilt to Class 1500 standard. Unfortunately the seventh member E27005 Minerva was unfit for conversion because she was considered beyond economical repair and the specialists broke her up for spare parts to keep her sisters in service.
the hoek van holland haven station (when the boat from harwich arrives) stopped running its international train somewhere in the 1980's i believe. the entire line to hoek van holland has as of recently (april 2017) been shut down for train services and is currently being rebuilt to be used by the metro.
I expect that the main lines to Amsterdam and Rotterdam aren't too far from the Hoek, but it's a long time since I was there so I don't know. As long as it works out!
As someone from the Netherlands it pains me to be compared to Holland Holland ia most often associated with Amsterdam and most Dutch people dislike Amsterdam to some degree
this was a completly different railtour!!! Hoek v Holland - Utrecht - Amersfoort - Utrecht Railwaymuseum - Amsterdam - Hoorn (and a trip on a steamtrain) - Haarlem - Den Haag - Rotterdam - Hoek van Holland. Not the route with the line-up at Boxtel was on!
In those days NS Dutch Railways 1500 UK Class 77 does Hollandstrecke Duisburg Utrecht to Emmerich am Rhein where a DB Baureihe 110 103 takes over the train for Emmerich am Rhein Duisburg Hbf
As I was born in the Netherlands I travelled by train quite a lot during the eighties. My school was a train journey of about half an hour each way on the Amsterdam-Enkhuizen route. I don't consider myself a train spotter, but I did like watching trains and learning about them. Enjoyed this video, thanks!
04:38 a Dutch (!) railway fan noting the numbers on his hand. He had forgotten to bring his spotters book with him He was a guest on the tour. Known him a long time, but have lost track since 2018... Note the left track running at 12:45 through Purmerend Overwhere. "We" normally drive on the right, so maybe a request from the tour organisation.
Keep them safe Kim. They'll be worth a fortune in a few years, if not already!
There's been many a discussion about that and it's all down to the pan heads and amount of current drawn when trains are powering away from stations. Some Dutch locos kept their diamond pans while others, such as the 77s/1500s, were fitted with Faiveley pans, but these had two twin-strip (if that's the correct terminology) pan heads per pan to deal with the high current draw. Once the train was moving one pan could be dropped and it could continue with one. They definitely look better with two diamond pans though, without a doubt.
I bloody agree. Diamond pans are the only pans as far as I'm concerned!
Thr tragedy and stupidity of the UK amazes me.
Without a doubt any new railway would be electrified with 25kv AC.
It only requires 1/16th of the current for a a similar dc 1000 loco plus tje wiring is not so heavy.
Britain was so quick to either convert or remove 1500DC.
The Liverpool St to Southend line only lasted a few short years before conversion to AC.
The Woodhead route which totally closed is a criminal waste of money.
A whole new tunnel built in 1954.
France who pioneered 25Kv has a massive amount of 1500DC and I would say they have more DC than AC.
The DC trains are fast.
They have a dual voltage BB26000 loco of 5.6 Mega watt and it has a top speed of 200kph.
Your right about the use of dual pans.
Last time I was n France in 2017 I noticed many passenger trains raise the second pan when stopping and when leave it.
Ovviously the starting current is very high.
Interest is how the Woodhead locos always appeared to use both pans
I have seen both pans up at both stopping and starting from stations in France under 1500v DC catenary presumably because of high starting current and high regeneration current when braking.
@@Steven_Rowe there was by 1980 excess capacity of the Trans-Pennine routes due the recession. The primary traffic on the Woodhead route was coal for Fiddler's Ferry power station, but this required motive power changes at each end of the Woodhead route, and that traffic was reducing. This coupled with electrification equipment being both non-standard and life-expired (ie in need iv being replaced) along with spare capacity at the time on the Hope Valley line lead to BR decidingbto close this route.
And, no mothballing the line against future needs wasn't an option. BR couldn't afford it. Mothballing means that the route should be ready to use with minimal effort and that costs money. Take the Bramley Line from March to Wisbech. This line is in situ, well most of it is under a forest of birch trees, buddleia and bramble. The signals are still in place but inoperative. But the biggest obstacles to reopening are the lack of level crossings as all of them have been removed. So much for mothballing.
A better line for retention was the GE-GN Joint line from March to Spalding, closed around the same time. The removal of this line resulted 40 years later in an underpass needing to be dug at Werrington to allow freight trains from Felixstowe to reach the Spalding line without interrupting the trains on the ECML. Butbthe benefit if retention is only clear with 40 years of hindsight.
@@neiloflongbeck5705 good info, the idea of non standard equipment I do find somewhat hard to swallow and I feel BR was simply over zealous in its modernization approach.
The French pioneered 25Kv yet even now huge proportions of the network are 1500DC and they still run trains at 200Kph
It would be nice to see an EM2 or EM1 with suitable transformer and rectifer so they could run them on 25Kv
It isn't going to happen but a nice thought.
I live in Aus and the Sydney and Melbourne networks are 1500 DC.
Also Dublin has electric trains only dating from the 80s and they use 1500 which I find strange
Quite ironic really and a typically British. These sturdy locos spend longer working in the Netherlands than they do for the people who paid for them.!
EM2 locomotives are great!
Six of the Class 77 EM2 locos were rebuilt to Class 1500 standard. Unfortunately the seventh member E27005 Minerva was unfit for conversion because she was considered beyond economical repair and the specialists broke her up for spare parts to keep her sisters in service.
the hoek van holland haven station (when the boat from harwich arrives) stopped running its international train somewhere in the 1980's i believe. the entire line to hoek van holland has as of recently (april 2017) been shut down for train services and is currently being rebuilt to be used by the metro.
Yes I learned about that very recently. I hope that the Netherlands' transport authorities know what they're doing!
i hope so too, ive lived all my life next to that line, it was such a shame to hear they were going to stop with train services on it
I expect that the main lines to Amsterdam and Rotterdam aren't too far from the Hoek, but it's a long time since I was there so I don't know. As long as it works out!
Sorry to hear about this. Bad news for everyone especially the people of the Netherlands
i wish they kept the original pantographs on them.
As someone from the Netherlands it pains me to be compared to Holland
Holland ia most often associated with Amsterdam and most Dutch people dislike Amsterdam to some degree
I have got models of 27002 and 27006, both EM2s/ class 77s/ class 1500s.
No footage of the line-up in Boxtel that day. I was there that day as a little boy living in Boxtel. Maybe someone still has it ...
this was a completly different railtour!!! Hoek v Holland - Utrecht - Amersfoort - Utrecht Railwaymuseum - Amsterdam - Hoorn (and a trip on a steamtrain) - Haarlem - Den Haag - Rotterdam - Hoek van Holland. Not the route with the line-up at Boxtel was on!
@@Keikdv o.k. thank you
In those days NS Dutch Railways 1500 UK Class 77 does Hollandstrecke Duisburg Utrecht to Emmerich am Rhein where a DB Baureihe 110 103 takes over the train for Emmerich am Rhein Duisburg Hbf
"Flanged fascinations"! 😂 😂 😂 😂