Why nobody plays or talks about Final Fantasy II!
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 9 янв 2023
- Why Nobody Plays or Talks About Final Fantasy II!
Final Fantasy II is oft-considered the ugly stepchild of the Final Fantasy franchise, and having spoken to MANY people who feel this way, and having played through the game numerous times myself, I thought I'd take a dive into why people might feel this way, and see for myself whether Final Fantasy II truly is the worst Final Fantasy!
• Why nobody plays or ta...
A Big Thank You to all of the Patreon patrons that enable me to keep this channel going with such fervor, I hope to make you all proud! If you'd like benefits such as a bespoke title card like the ones you've seen in the video, check out the link!
Patreon: / joesephyr
Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/joesephyr
Twitter: / joesephyr
Twitch: / joesephyr
Facebook: / joesephyr
Discord: / discord
Music: Battle II, Pandemonium (Final Fantasy II
All audio I upload here are used for non-copyright infringing purposes, and all Fair Use laws are complied with.
Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use. 
Игры
I won't lie, I'm a sucker for Final Fantasy II. It just did something for me.
One of the FFs of all time
Girl FF II gave us the Queen that is the Emperor, the og slayer.
With the console versions of the Pixel Remasters, they implemented the ability to toggle encounters and alter stat multipliers to adjust how quickly you level.
This means the rooms that seem to go nowhere, but have high encounter rates, are good locations to grind if you wish to spend maybe 10 minutes to an hour grinding what you want.
I think the end goal is to get Evasion and Shields going as soon as possible, then get as many spells and weapon skills to 16 wherever you can. Take your time if you want to do so, or turn off encounters and go at your own pace. The game doesn't require you to have vast levels, but you'll need at least Evasion in order to avoid some on-hit effects. If you can max out Shields and raise Agility as high as you can, equip two shields and Defend in combat for a bit to see that sometimes your Evasion Multiplier will increase, letting you dodge more than before. Max this out, and the rest of the map opens up to you, but beware of magic.
With this, I was personally able to bully the Captains early on despite the game threatening me with them and how they can one-shot you if you talk to them, but if you raise your Evasion Multiplier to about 7x99% then you can take them on with ease and use them to grind at will since they can be triggered by talking to them. Their Bow attacks will still go through, but you can use this to work on Cure and gain health, which has been fixed to keep track of lost HP even if you heal it before the fight ends, meaning no more having to end fights on low health!
A lot of the issues people have with FF2 are steadily being fixed, but it ultimately needs a remake from the ground up. There's just not enough support or interest from the fanbase to warrant this risk, but I feel FF2 deserves better.
Final Fantasy II is definitely my favourite of the 3 NES games. Mostly because I'm more about the story when thinking about them, which is why I rank it above 1, 3 and 5 as well. And I really like the "level what you do" aspect. The keyword system was very interesting as well. While most of the games weren't handled perfectly I kinda like the ambitions the game had. Which is why I really like 8, 12 or 13 much more than safer entries (in terms of gameplay) like 9, 5, or even 7.
I don't think you need to look further than the first hour of the game. The level up system being non-standard (it's not like Saga is popular to most english speakers), the fetch quest back and forth of needing to walk somewhere and walk back to Altair for your next objective, the high chance you'll walk the wrong way and instantly die to the higher level enemies to the west, the lack of direction on how to build characters.
The original release and the PSX release also were much much harder and required either understanding the game's systems or grinding but since the system is non-standard it could be hard for a player to understand even how to grind, and due to the challenge level system stat ups come very slow early on. There's a reason the glitch to level up is so well known, it's a massive quality of life for anyone actually trying the older versions.
Basically I think most people didn't get far enough to get filtered by dead end rooms, tricky enemies, or the like. There's a reason Minwu is the most popular character when he plays such a short and minor role in the whole game, it's cause his part is the part most people played before quitting.
As a follow up, another reason that is more Meta is that for most English speakers, FF2 has never been it's own game. We never got the original release despite the game being mostly translated before being cancelled and having to wait for the Origins release (also skipping the Wonderswan version). As Origins it was part of a collection with FF1 meaning most people who picked it up would likely be inclined to play FF1 first, fully completing it before starting FF2 right after meaning they might feel burn out and have an even sharper reaction to first hour.
Later it was released with FF1 in the Dawn of Souls version for GBA, having a similar issue despite the difficulty being severely reduced. Then as part of the PSP anniversary collection being it's first stand alone release but still part of a collection where mostly people are gonna play FF1 first or only. This continues on for the mobile and Pixel Remaster versions, FF2 is always part of a collection of better, more loved games which never gives someone the chance to experience it on it's own or as their first FF game. Despite being a terrible version this is how FF3 remains more relevant, it had a stand alone release on DS when a lot of people were children playing RPGs for the first time so for a lot of people it was their first or one of their first RPGs and holds a beloved status. Basically FF2 never stood a chance in the west.
Guy speak beaver ... Sadly
I totally get why it's not more popular as it has some real negatives (those trap rooms, woof) but I have just such a weird soft spot for it. It's like going back to a trashy easy read novel to me.
Love the video mate, really loving this content. Definitely wanna see a video on VIII which is actually my favourite.
When I finished II I wasn't immediately fond of it, but the longer time passes the more this game is on my mind. The story definitely holds some very memorable moments!
It's the whole combat and encounter system. Romancing Saga is better because the player is not strictly tied to just doing something repeatedly and still have a leveling system. It makes a player wonder when will I ever get these stat and magic leveled up so I can keep progressing.
The major thing i despised about the dead end doors, it places you IN THE MIDDLE of the room.
Usually dungeon dead end rooms leaves you infront of the entrance and it takes one step to exit.
And, this more of my personal thing. But sometimes, those fake doors have treasure in them. So even if i got the right door, my own curiosity makes me go back to check all the doors anyway.
I hate these things so much that when i tried soul of rebirth, i turned the first corner and saw a set of doors, i dropped my playthrough right then and there.
Those doors are just the worst, good thing I knew it beforehand so it's the game that even when I play blind I still have Dungeon map just to avoid those and knows what doors exactly I want to enter.
Speaking of Soul of Rebirth, I have no knowledge of what it's like before I got into it and here's the problem : I know that the 4th slot until Leon will have characters come and go one way or another (Usually dead) and by knowing that I don't really train them up at all and even unequipped them if I know for sure the moment they'll leave, so I got screwed hard when Minwu starting up with NO EQUIPMENT and got rekt in the first fight ! I tried it a few more times and somehow managed to passed it but then I realized oh crap everyone are going to be like this so if I want to have a chance at it I have to replay the whole game again? No thanks! So I dropped it.
Just wanted to say that I agree with your evaluation completely. Also, I look forward to more of these Off-Dissidia vids, despite really missing those, because of your takes and love for the games. Keep it up.
Would love to see a video on FF8 in this format, highly entertaining watch. That sped up section had my mouth a gap, never seen anything that rough from when I've played FF2 guess I got lucky :p So yeah great work man :)
So far im enjoying it. Question, do you consider Stranger of Paradise cannon?
This video feel so fresh and still so familiar. you really knocked it out the park here, Joe. I’m hella proud of you.
Omg I clicked on this because of the title and then I realised it was made by you!
I'd love to see the video on Final Fantasy VIII. This video was super fun honestly. Was intrigued with all of it. Haven't played FFII before and I would like to give it a go sometime after seeing this. I'll just be wary of the encounter rate, haha.
Seeing as you love FFV, it would be cool to hear your thoughts on how they should do Time Mage in FFXIV if they were to bring it over.
You killed it with this video. Keep it up!
After years of not playing it cause I couldnt put my finger on that character development system, I blew the dust off my old FF2 Famicom cartridge and playing it on my Sharp Twin Famicom in raw Japanese and I cant put it down now cause I finally got the hang of the stat building
Please make video on FFVIII it's my favourite FF! However, I'm not sure what you mean by "breaking it" maybe you could include some examples?
Is just the junction system with assigning spells to beef up stats?
To be honest I could never fully put a finger on why I could not stand this game. I came back to it with pixel remaster in which the new map helped save sometime and stopped allot of pointless travelling to dead ends. The new music was just boss and overall found it just ok but would not return anytime soon.
I really enjoy this new format! The "essay-like" video suits you well. Cheers
It's not the if you do it you get better, it's the I've spent hours raising magic and now I'm in an area with no mp do I use my sword and I get weaker at my magic
Well, that was a nice video. Quite different, but we were warned, and I'm here for it. I really enjoy this type of content !
As for FF2, well... I have to admit that's the only one I played and didn't finish because of the leveling system. And the only one I didn't play is the 11. I wouldn't say it's a really bad game, but I can say for certainty that it's not for me.
Now, about FF8... that's my favourite, and I'd love to see the game get some love, cause it deserves it !
Once agan, very entertaining to watch, so I'm eager for the next one. And good day to everyone :D
Fantastic that RUclips brought you to my attention! Love this!
One of the few mini-essay/reviewers that doesn’t make bloated and elongated videos.
2:00 this game allows you to be overpowered early. Unarmed at 16.99 kills most things. Sword at 16 with 2 blood sword kills the final boss in no time.
I personally haven’t played it because I haven’t gotten a copy yet. But would love to play it once I get it
I love FF8, I'd love to see you cover it! I do get why people hate the battle system, but I quite like it XD
I would still give 2 a higher rating than 13... at least 2 didn't go Final Hallway.
I feel like one of the three/four people that actually likes this game lol I agree on all the flaws and I played the PSP remaster, the one in bundle with the 1st FF, which was easier than the original one. Like... I clearly remember my first fight with the Adamantoise. It was straight after finishing a boss battle, Minwu KO and no aethers to recover my MPs. I... I just wanted to cry.
But I think the good things even out the flaws: despite being the second title, _here_ we meet for the first time staples of the FF franchise such as moogles and chocobos, the soudtrack slaps, and I appreciate a game that tries new things and fails more than one that does just what the previous did with little to no changes (looking at you FF3).
Also, this is very personal, but I am INSANELY in love with Minwu! I love that he has a chinese-sounding name but an arabian-like appareance, I love that his design is the white mage coat revisioned to match the arabian aestethic, that alone makes him stand out from all the other white mages in the franchise. And character-wise I have a soft spot for mentors as well: he saves our life, teaches us about the passwords, slays enemies with us, dies for us?? I just can't. I love him more than I think I should.
Aaaand, thanks to DFFOO I know now that he also has pointy nails and that soft "Fufufu" laugh. The man is a perfect score.
I like this video, thank you for making this type of content, I very much enjoyed you as a content creator, I stopped playing DFFOO so I had no interest in that, so I'm glad I can appreciate your content again
I love Final Fantasy II. Its either my fourth or fifth favorite game in the main series (I've played everything except VII Remake, XIV and XVI though I didn't play XI much, and I believe I'm still early in VII Rebirth) depending on my mood and the only one of my favorites before the VI, VII Classic. and VIII trio which are all also in my top five,
Saga/Final Fantasy Legend II was the first Squaresoft RPG I played and easily my favorite of the first three JRPGs I owned (Dragon Quest/Warrior II, it and Final Fantasy I, which I didn't play until returning from a trip I started playing Saga/Final Fantasy Legend II on). So I have a soft spot for the stat growth system and I've always had a soft spot for rebellion against evil government or megacorp themed stories.
As someone who could never get through FF2 before the pixel remaster because of the combat / growth system, I understand your perspective on it, "not being the combat." That said, I would contend that it's a great idea with exceedingly poor implementation. You are penalized for attempting any "hybridization" because of the stat losses and the insane amount of time it takes to drive up any skill. When you only have enough MP to cast a spell 2-3 times before needing to recover and it can take dozens of casts to level up a single spell, it's just an exercise in boring and repetitive frustration. As the Saga and Elder Scrolls games have shown, this type of system can be great--but the implementation in FF2 is shit.
The pixel remaster smoothed enough of the rough edges of that system for the game to be playable and it was the first time I finished it. That said, putting the "Sleep Blade" into Firion's offhand and leaving it there the whole game is practically a cheat code.
I think a lot of people took advantage of the cancel glitch and that is why they don't like the game. Its worse than level grinding. I played through without using the cancel glitch. I rather liked it.
FF8 is one of my favourites as well, I'd really appreciate a video on that as well!
I tried to play through the FF titles I hadn't played not too long ago and I stopped playing 2 at exactly the dreadnought and continued with 3, but I wanna go back to it.
But I really understand the points you brought up and felt the same frustration.
Using the interact barracuda 2 with the final fantasy origins (ps1 version) makes it easier to become overpowered early on. Perhaps worst part is the inn system. If your max hp is really high and you current hp is low, a stay at an inn could wipe out you cash.
My main issue is that a lot of it isn't really supported well. Like there are like 9-10 weapon types but unless it's swords, bows, spears, or axes you only get crappy weapons. Like there are no daggers or staves so if you sunk a bunch of time in those well too bad.
just picked up the remasters of ff1-6 , i like the story so far very star warsy with han solo/cid and the princess being captured an all. im playing through for the 1st time in order so we'll see how it goes.
the leveling system is cool but ya i would've preferred levels and maybe spec points into whatver u needed than lvling by doing if it needs to be different
I’ve always wondered why people disliked this game so much, since I didn’t play it. The random encounter rate would drive me mad! Appreciate the video as always
For me it was the main villain, the emperor Mateus, it'd be one thing if the guy was more a threat because of his mind since his boss battle wasn't really that difficult but somehow he falls upward and takes over both Hell and Heaven after dieing. Its ridiculous.
Yeah even as someone whom likes ff2, the encounter rate is my bain.
I would love a video like this for FF8. FF8 is one of my faves
I love 2 and 8 please please do a video on 8 :D
Definite yes on the FFVIII video! One of the most underrated FFs!
I enjoyed FF2, but what bugged me most about the combat was the running!!! Being able to run from fights is important. Even in FF1 running was important. But in FF2, i could NEVER run. I would be in trouble, too weak to fight and try running and i think... Of probably 200 attempts, i only successfully ran twice.
Having now played through 1-4, it's actually my personal favorite and I'm not sure why...
I like to pretend I like the games that others don't like, so this is not only my favorite FF but my favorite video game in general.
What had turned me off from FFII on the NES? Watching as some of those stats you worked so hard for degraded because you weren't constantly working on them. That pretty much turned me off the game right then and there.
I tried playing FF2 several times, and always got annoyed and quit pretty early on. I could never put my finger on it but, you're right, it's the encounter rate.
With the Pixel Remaster, I made an effort go beyond where I previously had. I ended up liking and finishing the game.
Did I like it enough to replay it, ever? Probably not. But I enjoyed it just fine.
It's probably my second to least favorite, after 3. 3 is the only numbered FF I've never finished- including XI, XIV, and sequels/spin offs.
I would love to see a similar video on FF8. That's one I've always enjoyed, but it's even more fun once you know how to break it.
I would love a ff8 video like this one
I can respect FF2j for what it tries to do; I don't fully hate it, but it is frustrating to try and play.
When the worst main Final Fantasy game is a 6/10, you know it's a good series :)
Also, can we get a link to that THE END music ?
I finally got the pixel remaster and played through FFII, it was a lot of fun. I'm pretty sure I would have had less fun if I didn't have a map for the dungeons. They are a bit of a mess, and I'm sure most people who complain about the game played an earlier version and then wrote it off. After I finish the other pixel remaster games I might go back for another round of FFII.
The irony is out of the original 3 NES games it's by far the best in terms of plot and story, since it had an actual narrative and cast instead of 4 faceless dinks aimlessly faffing about.
And in fairness to 2, I actually do like what they tried to do with it with regards to combat proficiencies - it just didn't quite pan out in the execution. If they ever tried it again in a modern FF I'd absolutely be willing to try because I like the idea of being able to shape my character's growth.
It's also worth noting that FF2 is what spawned the SaGa franchise ^_^
But yes, it's easily my least favorite and it stands out alongside 8 for being a bit too different
VIII is easily my favorite FF title and I could identify with Squall when I was growing up. I'd replay it so much just to see how overpowered I could get before certain points. A video like that would be great and so nostalgic. Triple Triad ftw.
I feel that if most ppl played the original version, or even the ps1 version to an extent, they would hate it. But honestly, from the gba version onward, alot of the stat pacing was heavily improved, and some of ghe biggest online jabs at the game were fixed or at least nerfed. Most of the ppl I know that did like the game got started on the gba or psp versions.
Yes, ppl hated the game when it came out even in ps1, but considering most complaints online are things that were ps1 OR earlier issues, I think a lot of its hate is basically from the echo chamber that is the internet.
I agree it's a bit odd but I thought it wasn't too bad once you get into it, my least favourite is FF3
Its definitely the combat leveling for me. I played it and beat it, but that system is god-awful. More than 90% of the spells become useless because they stay at a low level. I found myself just using haste and spamming attack the whole game. This was very effective to wipe out all the encounters and bosses, but it gets redundant and boring fast
i feel it's more a combination of the keyword system and the dugneon desighn. i odn't feel it's the leveling system anymroe as people do enjoy the SaGa series.
ff2's dungoen are just alittle too mazy for thier own good to thepoint ifeel ff3 backpeddled abit to hard haveing pretty simple dungeons until near the end.
While the encounter rate or combat system didn't help, it was the dark story and specifically villain for me that made me not like the game. Soul of Rebirth makes Mateus a total villain sue. Seriously the concept of him taking over not only Hell but Heaven is utterly ridiculous.
10-2 is the worst by far. If you're saying only mainline entries then 14 is the worst, it's nearly completely creatively bankrupt being a wow clone in design who's every world/lore idea is borrowed from the earlier games. Not to mention it's monetary cost is potentially infinity dollars since it requires a monthly subscription to play.
I love 2. It's in my top 3
FF2 easily has the best story of the three NES FF games. It also has the least fun mechanics for a battle system of the three. I personally feel that the Final Fantasy series is at its best when it is strongly using its classes.
Yes it is even though the GBA/PSP version do NOT require to kill your own party or close to death to increase HP that changed system still sucks since its still a WORSE version of how HP increases in Chrono Cross only its DONE at random so even on the GBA/PSP version its still very hard to increase HP so that bosses end game won't kill you in 1 hit.
That and a LV 16 UItima spell in every version of FF2 does PATHETIC damage but FF2 NOT FF6 was the first game WITH Ultima as a spell.
I love ff2…
Well that's just a lie.
Ff6 mostly copy this plot but ff6 made a joke villain the main villain
13-15-16 are much worst than 2
I think the breakability and replay value of FF2 trumps that of FF13 in every aspect. I've played 13 maybe twice in my whole lifetime as opposed to FF2 which recently broke 10 playthroughs recently. 13 is the weakest entry imo.
I might be biased though because I am massively into the Saga games haha xD love the vid Joe, I'm so glad you've found a new pep in your step - really makes you shine darling
Hard disagree. There's a lot to complain about in FF13; but, once the combat system clicked for me (i.e. switching paradigms almost constantly in battle) I learned to have fun with it. I'd still rate 13 near the bottom; but, I personally found 2 (and 8, btw) basically unplayable due to their arcane and broken systems.
@@nalthien Hard disagree. Where you see something arcane and broken, many see a system that rewards you the more effort and time you dedicate to it.
With the Switch version (and PS4) you can actually toggle encounters on or off, then use the high-encounter rooms when you really want to grind a lot in a short time. The stat multipliers definitely make it faster since you can gain up to 4x the exp for them, then disable encounters and continue at your own pace.
I've gotten all my stats, weapon and magic skills maxed out and am about to get Ultima. I'm really hoping for some good damage as it scales with use!
Mystic quest is the worst.
You don’t need to find out…. Just accept it’s bad
You don't need to rename anyone.... Just accept it's Aeris
What i remember disliking of FF2's battle system, and its been nearly 20 years, is the fact that every time you receive a new spell your previous spell that you've been leveling up becomes completely obsolete. Level up Fire to level 127? well here's Fire 2 at level 0, have fun with that! (example im using may or may not be factual, as i said its been a long time).
Yeah, that's not how it works in FF2. FF2 you level a spell up and it becomes the next level of power. So Fire 2 becomes Fire 3 and does more damage, gets a new animation (only every set number of levels) and costs 1 more MP. You never have the situation that you describe happen.
It's really not that bad. 🤷♂️
FFII was too ambitious for it’s time. It’s an NES turn base game that tries to have a growth system as a tabletop rpg. Something we wouldn’t see successfully developed until games like Elder Scrolls. FFII is a misunderstood masterpiece. Final Fantasy VIII is in a similar boat. Both are solid Final Fantasy games. The worst Final Fantasy is FFXIII. Due to the development hell it’s the worst entry since other than graphics it does nothing else right.
XV is still worse
The biggest problem I've heard about FF2 and why people don't like it has always been the lack of understanding of how the level up system works. The grind of FF2. People go into the game and grind early on. Especially HP and dual wield weapons. It's never explained that agility and evade are the god stats of FF2. Nor that the more HP you have the more damage enemies that drain your health do, thus leading to more healing. Then in the Famicom/WSC/PS1 versions you can select cancel which a lot of people who got sick of the game claim is the only way to beat the grind... which is counter to the best way to level up.
Another major problem is that if you have low agility because you never focused on building that up, you'll always go last in combat. Add to that the fact that there's two types of armor, heavy and light, that is also never explained and people's agility is usually in the gutter. Add to THAT the fact that everything gives you a penalty to your magic stats in the pre-GBA version and you get people with horrifically low magic damage. Then on top of that people don't know that instant death spells are amazing in this game and you've got people trying to work with the elemental spells, which while decent are nothing compared to instantly killing anything.
The encounter rate is high, granted. The trap rooms are annoying. But if the base systems of the game make combat a slog (especially the plethora of status ailments), then playing the game will be more annoying the more fights you get into. Play the game with a focus on building up evade to the point where status ailments become less common and use the instant kill spells, you'll find yourself having a lot less of a problem with random encounters. The end game where you're frequently fighting enemies who have drain touch attacks can be brutal if your agility is low (thus low evade) and your HP are high. It doesn't matter how high your defense is if they are doing 1/16th of your max HP in drain damage per hit.
But most reviews of the game focus on how much grinding it took to beat the game and show no basic understanding of the mechanics. So I'd say the mechanics are the biggest reason people don't like the game.
EDIT: Forgot to mention the people who talk about how you HAVE to beat your other characters up to level up faster. You *NEVER* have to do this.
I'm currently playing 2 right now for the first time. It's not the best but it's great.
FF2 is my favorite 8 bit FF game. I never notice the statue problem, it takes a few turns to get out, I think being locked like in that video comes down to stats, high stats a good chance to recover in a few turns, low stats you get beaten to death, unless its Stone.