IMPETUS + HUGE Range = Instant Kill in Legends of Dota
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- Опубликовано: 18 окт 2024
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The purpose of having a pure damage spell is the immunity it has to building up resistance. You can build a pipe against Zeus to counter him, for Timbersaw, your only hope is HP. Similar to how AM used to completely destroy QOP when her ult was magical but making it pure makes her have a chance. It adds more nuance to balance.
It makes sense from a balance perspective but not too much from a design perspective. Magic and pure are very similar, but the distinction between magic and physical makes much more sense
@@sarthak-ti not really, ppl mosstly think so becuz of unclear representation of pure dmg. take a look at league, pure dmg is literally everywhere, on both spell and item so it doesn't feel like a subset of magic dmg
@@nguyenucanh3248 I think my issue is that pure damage seems rather arbitrary. Like magic makes sense being hit with fire or ice won’t help if you have a ton of armor. Or if there is a mage with strong magical resistances, physical hits still deal a lot of damage. But now suddenly there are some spells that go through those resistances? Like just thematically it’s not like these are special kinds of spells, it’s very hard to guess which spells would do that, but just visual indication of an ability is usually enough to guess if it’s physical or magic. And that’s not even considering abilities that randomly change damage type like husksr
wait.. this legends of dota can play against AI bot ?
I got the notification and thought it was a video from 5 years ago
Me too, was like "wait 4 minutes ago?" Lol
Facts
Lmao same
Same
lol me tio
If I may, "honey, I bought you that Coco you asked for" would have been a zinger boomi ;) great fun vid, it's nice to cut loose and go full OP now and again
On multiple damage types, I guess it serves two purposes: making gearing more varied across games and helping devs manage the relative timings on a character's power progression (with pure being stronger early but not scaling as well, for an example)
Functionally, the sole purpose for having a "type" associated with a damage value is so that certain instances of damaging effects to be generically altered without also altering other instances of damage in the same manner.
If you want to be able to alter, modify, or otherwise have *anything* "happen" to/because of a certain instance of a damage effect (and/or similar other effects). If you want damage from attacks to be reducible in some mathematically specific fashion (such as the commonplace "Armor" calculation mechanic most games have), but you don't want that calculation to affect damage from other sources- then you create damage types. You could "hard code" that specific interaction, but that is tedious, time-consuming, and can create major issues if the systems are ever modified or expanded (such as by the addition of new sources of "attack" damage). The creation of the type allows for an easy and simple way to categorize sources of damage for generic modification of all sources under the type.
In most games, there is a simple 2-type split between damage from "autoattacks" which are a form of damage which costs only time (and conditions such as being in range, hitting, etc.)- and damage from "spells" (or abilities, or whatever the game happens to call it) which are a form of damage which is typically committed at the press of a button and can have a variety of other characteristics such as a resource cost, cooldown, channel/cast times, etc.
Most games with this system don't see or have a need for a third damage type because typically they do not have any modifications to damage to categories other than autoattacks. Some games may have an equivalent "magic" resistance system however- and that's when you start needing to consider other types of damage. Because while "autoattacks" are typically consistent across all characters, spells or abilities are not. Any two abilities could behave in radically different ways or have radically different damage values, and the introduction of magical resistances demands the developer to decide whether or not any given ability should be reducible- if the ability is somehow broken if so.
For most games, this means powercreep- in order to ensure that certain types of abilities aren't broken and rendered more or less unusable or too weak due to the introduction of a generic resistance type, devs will increase the power of those abilities (and most future abilities introduced with new characters, items, etc.). Some devs will instead create the Third damage type, often referred to as "Pure" or "True" damage. Essentially a category for all damaging effects which the devs have decided should not be reducible or affected by the same mechanics as the other two types- abilities which would be either far too weak, or impossible to effectively balance, if they were affected.
Relatively advanced games where values can get high will introduce True or Pure damage as a way to "Bust" tanky characters who would otherwise be nigh unstoppable due to high resistances combined with high amounts of health.
Particularly advanced games may have damage types as part of a countering system- where certain types of damage are better against a particular unit because said unit lacks any resistance to that type- thereby demanding a change in strategy and creating space for skill expression. RTS games are well known for this, thanks to the progenitors of the genre more or less unanimously doing this. In games like this, "Pure" damage is usually the type reserved for abilities- to ensure that abilities perform consistently without having to interact with the countering system. Consistency is what a "Pure" type is all about. Damage that does not interact with essentially anything else.
Long time off/on follower, have always appreciated your videos! Favorite game mode is LoD, could you show a build to max out reaper's scythe to get enough regen to be essentially unkillable or not really possible?
I tried playing this build back in the day with take aim and psiblades(it added range back in the day)... It wasnt great because impetus back then was an ultimate... Which heavily restricted the build as a late game one... And in LOD late game builds rarely pop off
Hi I was just wondering and too lazy to try it myself, is it possible to proc Bad JuJu(or whichever spell reduces cooldowns on ability cast) with arcane orb and OD passive to make really small cooldowns with Snapfire E?
lil' shredder isn't really a spell that causes attacks. it's basically like overpower but with a bunch of extra effects tacked on; specifically, the bonus attack range, the bat reduction, the modified attack projectile, the set attack damage, and the hook to catch when the modified attacks land so that the armor debuff can be applied. the "set attack damage" thing might be something that seems a little odd, but really it's just the same effect as swashbuckle except used in a context where the hero can actually attack normally while it's active
that said, the multishot talent _does_ cause lil' shredder to send out attacks in the same vein as swashbuckle and dagger and such, so that part can absolutely count. though, that raises an interesting question - is _split shot_ also a spell that causes attacks? because there's certainly arguments for why lil' shredder should fall into the same category as split shot and certainly ones for why it shouldn't
I think that less damage types will make dota more casual. They already did her more casual than it was. Remember such thing like "orb effect", when you wasn't able to combine lifesteal, manaburn, skadi, desolator and mjolnir with each other, only one type of attack modifiers could be applied. For example: the only way to get lifesteal on Antimage was "Vladmirs" in otherways manaburn skill stops working.
BTW... Pure damage was the only way to pierce magic immunity, but Valve already broke that mechanic.
nah universal, composite, and hp removal pierced magic immunity, too
Looking at that rhytmic lag - turn based dota might be unexpectedly fun idea.
Attack move on this character is so much stronger than just right clicking manually
Is there a Legend of Dota but Boosted mod?
It's about weakness and strength, like about piercing dmg, seige dmg, hero dmg in dota 1. Adopted to dota 2 for variety of win conditions.
i dont need sleep i need to watch this vid first lol
from my understanding:
- if you summon fire and throw it on somebody it's magic damage
- if you summon a rock and throw it on somebody it's physical damage
- and if you combine fire + rock it creates a meteorite and drop it on somebody it's pure damage lol
...conclusion, maybe what makes it pure damagee is combination of physical ang magic damage
I'm a firm believer that Trample is magic because Volvo didn't want PB to be another Bristleback
Upd:
Well, this is an interesting exercise, don't mind me rumbling.
I don't think many people will argue, that physical damage is sorta default damage type, because everything that attacks, from summons and creeps to towers and heroes, deals physical damage. Dota, historically being focused on attacks, and even with all the changes over the years to help casters, is still mostly played around right-clicking your way across the map until you can right-click your target, and there isn't anything wrong with that in my opinion. On the opposite, such simple base allows DOtA to approach it from different angles, and, what I especially love about this game, make chance-based effects work properly.
In other MOBAs, with more focus on "exciting" spells, which can one-shot anything and have fancy descriptions, over "dull" attacks (which usually just end up being equally one-shot-ey), playing with odds tends to spell disasters, as just few lucky hits could immediately take out objective or wipe out entire enemy team without any warning or effort, what makes any sort of chance-based effects in them a literal hell. Meantime in DOtA, since heroes don't run out of damage once they run out of mana, you can have all sorts of defensive options, like damage block, or ghost form, or some massive lifesteal, because simply outliving opponent's "exciting" wombo-combo won't guarantee your survival. In return, you can enhance attacks with crits, lightnings, bashes and whatnot to deal with opponent's defences in an interactive arms race of sorts. So, yeah, I, personally, enjoy that DOtA is balanced around having potentially infinite damage via attacks, and, by extension, via physical damage.
As for magic damage, being much more restricted by cooldowns and mana in comparison to physical, I think three big reasons to have it are buildings, utility and farm.
Most obvious of all is, naturally, buildings being immune to most spells and as such not even needing magic resistance, so that, say, Lion doesn't finger enemy support and coincidentally takes out rax. While buildings are already immune to many chance-based attack effects, leaving crits and such as primarily just assassination tools, it's nice to have a more reliable counterpart to purely chance-based effects. And staying on the topic of assassination, heroes only taking three quarters of magic damage by default doesn't only allow drawing bigger, more exciting damage numbers without actually having that much of a frustraing effect on human opponents, but also in many cases helps DOtA avoid typical "deals double damage to creeps" bullshit, although exclusions still apply. Finally, magic damage pairs very nicely with all different sorts of utility. Be it Atos holding enemy down to let Skywrath unleash his ultimate or Eul's helping Lina or Leshrac line up a stun, having multiple effects with cooldowns work together feeds nicely into enjoyment of executing a good combo. At the same time though, for spells that provide utility on their own, supplementing them with magic damage instead of physical helps to mitigate their impact with magic resistance and Magic Immunity, like how BKB doesn't stop Void's bash, but does cancel it's damage (tho with all the changes to Magic Immunity I'm not even sure that's how it works anymore, but you get the idea). While not being the main focus of the game, magic damage brings DOtA a lot of micromanagement and clutch moments, that can't normally be achieved with only right-clicking and chances.
At last, pure damage is just a reliable tool. It doesn't get decreased from magic resistance, it doesn't get increased from minus armour (then again, I'm pretty sure it can now be increased with spellamp, what, in my personal opinion, is just bogus, but whatever), it always deals same damage. If you are worried character might have some sort of way to abuse spell, like Bane theoretically being able to cast Nightmare for free transfering it back and forth, then you just make it deal pure damage, so that there won't be any Ethereal/Discord or Deso/Medal shenanighans. Of course, you can counteract pure damage with Magic Immunity, what might seem strange and brings obvious suggestion to add separate effect to block pure damage if it's so necessary, but having such a thing would defeat the idea of pure damage not being reduced by anything, and it already tends to pierce Magic Immunity as if it was physical damage where it's needed, so I don't think pure damage needs to be changed or "cleared up" or something. Being inconsistent at times by itself, it brings more consistency to DOtA as a whole, exempt from (most) fluctuations in infinite arms race.
So, yeah, that would be my opinion on damage types. Now, wether attack types like heroic-normal-siege-piercing need to be hidden or stated as abilities, is a completely different question deserving it's own rant, but I'm done for the moment.
A 3 hour stun is way more effective than killing the guy, it's an instant 4v5 without catch-up mechanics for the rest of the game.
I think that physical, magical and pure dmg types are fine... it have the same three "countres" in defense - armor, resistance and "dmg reduction" (dispersion for example). And why? Welp, just for more balance options... Question "Why there isnt only one dmg type?" is besicaly the same as "Why have every hero diferent attack range?" - yea, they could all have the same, why not... just one range for melee and one range for ranged. It would be "easier". But would it be good for the game? No, there are heroes that are defined by the attack range - same, as they are heroes that are defined by the dmg type.
The only thing that is anoying about pure/magical, is the inconsistency with BKB piercing. That used to be the big thing.
- Magic was reduced by magic resistance and blocked by magic imunity (BKB).
- Physical was reduced by armor and blocked by etheral (ghost scepter).
- Pure wasnt magic nor physical = it was not affected by anything (only by "dmg reduction")
Easy set of rules that made sense... but now, some pure (and maybe even some physical spells) are blocked by magic imunity? WTF?
What I see as big problem is attack and armor types. There is sooo many of them, nobody really know what they do (I could probably name all of them from w3 and guess what dmg type is good against certain armor type, but i have no idea what are the % reduction/amplifications). At least, Valve tryed to do something and they put them as "buff" on creeps... but that really isnt enough. Tbh they could be simply removed and replaced completly. I really dont see why creeps and heroes should have diferent types. Yea, some creeps are stronger thanks to that, but that really isnt anything gamechaging. The only attack/armor type that have a real sense is siege, but that could be easily fixed by giving catapults passive that says "Deals 20 extra dmg to towers." Everything else can be balanced in other already existing factors (dmg, AS, HP, armor, magic resitance...)
Imagine if you could use the 1x6 hero abilities in this mode or just on the regular map
I like this channel, its fun to watch
Half way through the video and baumi still hasnt gotten impetus Im losing my mind
Anime question- Baumi talked about an anime/manga in one of his videos. It goes something like, 2 siblings(protagonists) have some power related to fire. One of them has complete resistance to fire. And one villain has a never ending fire. Does anybody remember the name of this?
Thanks!
you might be thinking about fire punch but the sibling protags dont have fire powers but a different power not gonna say more coz of spoilers
Something about siblings and fire i saw in *forgot two first words of manga name* Love Lock. But Fire Punch definitely closer
primal beasts ult should go through BkB! prove me wrong :)
I see baumi is having Chinese for dinner
No shadow realm :(
Cat in a blanket??
You mean a purrito? 😂
rofl) 2 MM is sick)
Protest for more Baumi News!
1st! (only uploaded 16secs before)
hi
AM would be glad to remove pure)
Early algo comment
3rd. 7 mins