A very interesting review, Sam! When you pulled the first car from its package I could see that the couplers were defective. The shape of the uncoupling arms (which is deliberately curved to look like an air brake hose) is usually adjusted by US modellers using a special pair of rounded pliers sold by Kadee Products. (Other long nosed pliers can also be used.) There is also a standards gauge that can check the clearance of the lower part of the arm with the railhead. That being said, the orientation of the arm is relatively critical, and a coupler where the arm is rotated off the correct angle with the centerline of the car is a serious defect. It might be repairable, but usually it is not (at least not easlily). By the way, some modellers cut the arms off completely for more realistic looking couplers. This makes using uncoupling ramps or electromagnets impossible, but many modellers (including myself) typically use an uncoupling tool anyway. As for the trucks, I'd suspect that either the wheel flanges do not actually follow NMRA standards, or the connection of the trucks to the cars is problematic. Again, thanks so much for this review, and Cheers from Wisconsins!
For North American models, it's recommended to have an NMRA gauge to check for wheelset flanges and coupler heights. There's also a reamer tool for the trucks (bogies) to loosen up the wheels so they move more freely.
There is also a tool to bend the coupler pins. Most major manufacturers will ensure they fit properly, but its not uncommon when fitting knuckle couplers to have to adjust the pins.
I tend to just use a small drill bit to get the bogies to move more freely. I once had a problem with an old Walthers SP hopper car kit, mainly its bogies. The bogies would not turn, and would derail on curves. So, I had the bright idea to take a drill bit and drill out the inside of the bogies’ mounting holes. After that, the hopper car became one of the freest turning wagons on my layout.
As a Model Railroader from the US, I'd suggest changing these for Kadee Couplings. Kadees are a lot nicer and are great at coupling together and staying together nicely as well as bearing weight. I'd also recommend that if you go for Kadee couplings, I'd recommend, depending on the coupler box, the Kadee #5 couplers. Generally, they are 6 bucks for a pack of two with coupler boxes and screws. It's up to you if you want to change the couplers over.
We call these pieces of rolling stock “Reefers” as for the yellow one if you do wish to make a paint scheme. I would suggest painting it up into the “PFE” livery (Pacific Fruit Express). It was run by Union Pacific and Southern Pacific. There is a tool made by Kadee just for bending the coupler hooks (they are supposed to resemble the air hoses for the air breaks) and they make couplers for HO scale and other scales. They are the go to for couplers and they even have difficulty with quality for their couplers, as such for the above the had to make tools for it that you can buy.
My recommendation for getting rolling stock cheap is to just buy used. You're probably getting something better for cheaper, and I've often seen used stock go for like five bucks a car
In the US these cars were commonplace during the 1920's up to maybe 50's. These cars are Wood sided Ice Reefers. In the wood-car days, freight reefers would be 40' long (with a fair number of 36' ones still around ) and special express or passenger reefers would be 50' long. The express reefers didn't look like regular freight cars, they were designed to be used in passenger train service. After WW2, 50' freight reefers started to become common (about the time new reefer construction switched to steel) but wouldn't become more common than 40' cars until probably after the steam era. By the sixties-seventies 50-55' long reefers became quite common (mechanical Reefers) . Still some 40' woodside iced reefers did survive into the very early seventies on rare occasions. The Woodside ICE reefers had a galvanized metal compartment at either end of the car on the inside of the car. What you would do is the train would load with produce and or fruits or cheese or dairy etc... and then the bunkers (under the hatches on the roof) would be filled with ice. The foods inside would be cooled or refrigerated by ambient cooling only. The problem was that the railroad would need to position an "icing" station every so often and then the entire consist would need new ice. This took a long time as one can imagine. During the 60's with the advent of the mechanical reefer (which was basically a small petrol or diesel engine that ran a compressor or chilling unit and fans etc. ) much more reliable and could go longer distances with lower temps..
The derailing on your points test is likely in part due to the s curve that is present. With body mounted knuckle couplers, you get a shear force on a curves since the couplers end up parallel next to each other. A straight section as long as the longest bit of rolling stock is required between curve directions. It’s not as much of an issue with UK and Euro rolling stock because of the loop couplers, truck mounted couplers, and shorter car lengths.
Sam, you should buy a KAD0205 KADEE HO Coupler Height Gauge. They have a properly set coupler and a shelf to use to set the trip pin height. You use needle nose pliers to adjust the pin by bending the curved section.
Great video as always, Sam! The issue you found with these cars is fairly common with cheaper American rolling stock. This also happens with older cars that had molds originally made for horn-hook couplers. It is unfortunate, but they are still nice filler cars to make a long train! Thanks for sharing! Trevor
@@westernnewyorkrailfan They should be considered as inexpensive starting point. Add weight, rework truck mounting and couplers and it should be decent. But as is, without tuning, it's a waste of time.
Nothing that can't be solved by trimming the pin a bit, adding weigth to the wagons, and greasing the trucks. And Kadee couplers are the best ones for me. I discarded all Fleischmann and Roco couplers in all my fleet (more than 200 locomotives and 500 wagons) and replaced them by Kadees . One of my guilty pleasures is to buy cheap American wagons and tune them until they work flawlessly. It is very easy to fix American rolling stock.
The Grand Union van is for a supermarket/grocery store that was around when I was a child in the early 1970s in New York state. They were around from the 1870s until around 2001. They were bought out. There are still a few around today.
Sam, Your conclusion about the couplers is correct. The coupler pins were to low and in the wrong loocation. Low coupler pins are the cause of the derailment at your turnouts. The couplers are Chinese clones of Kadee couplers, and the non coupling is typical of the Chinese clone couplers. If you replace them with genuine Kadee wisker couplers and make sure the coupler pins and couplers are the correct height, using a Kadee coupler height gauge, they will work property. Also it looks like the wheel back to back or bogies are to tight, in this case it's not your trackwork.
Ad a general practice, I personally replace all my couplers with Kadees so the stock coupler issue isn't deal breaker for me. I'd be willing to take a chance on a cou6of these.
Thanks for reviewing these Sam! Judging from the roofs these look like Reefers which were early refrigerator cars and those hatches on the roof were for sliding giant blocks of ice into the cars to keep them cold on the long trips. They do look nice but it’s a shame that they need so much tweaking and maintenance to actually work
These refrigerator cars (or “reefers”, for short) look decent for the money and that fix you did for the whisker/uncoupling pin on the coupler is pretty much what I do with my rolling stock if it derails. 😅 I might pick up a few of these, but I will implement that quick fix to ensure they run smoothly; I might also loosen the screws securing the bogies to the frame slightly to allow for more play. Good review, Sam! Looking forward to the next one 👍🏼
For the derailing issue, I believe that might be due to the radius of the points, especially with where the couplers are mounted. If you have access to a larger radius points, you may find a different result.
A Kadee trip pin pliers would help with the trip trip pins. I would have replaced them with either Bachmann’s EZ mate II or McHenery couplers. Check the wheel gauge, this seems a little wide, and would cause excessive friction on the rails and cause the wheelsets to derail through the points. If the trucks (bogies) are screw mounted, back one out just enough to relieve the binding, and the other so the car (van) can rock slightly side to side. This should help with tracking. These would be my “cheap” fixes. Other things would be far more money. Replace the couplers with Kadee “whisker” couplers, and the trucks ( bogies) with a better unit, like, from Walthers or another manufacturer of solid frame trucks ( bogies). Like you said though, these cars being in the $20.00 range, just how much do you want to spend on someone else’s short comings?
Back in the 1970s, when I was into Rivarossi US line freight cars, I improved them with Kadee couplers, metal wheels, sprung bogies ( RR did make both Archbar and Bettendorf with springs between side frames and transoms. Finally I replaced the self-tap screws or plugs, with a threaded bush in the Frame bolster, and a 2mm MA screw and washer through Bogie cross piece. Made for very reliable running. Some of these cars were 1950s manufacture and second hand ( mostly unused). Still have them, along with Big Boys, Challengers ( RR and Brass) stored since 1983...may be resurrected soon.
I'm tempted as I'd be changing the couplings out for D tension lock couplings any how. I find tweeking and adjusting things quite fun. Not that you should have to but you could replace all the couplings with some of your 3D printed couplings.
Sam Good video and you definitely need a Kadee Coupler Height Gauge. It not only sits on the track but also has a plate that is the gauge for the coupler pins. The pins should not be cut off, but should be simply bent to clear the plate with a pair of needle nose pilers. Makes coupler height and coupler pin height a breeze. Also it seems that those couplers are a Kadee rip-off and almost certain they have no centering spring in the coupler pocket. Kadee Whisper couplers have a centering spring already fitted. Having said all that you may consider it not worth it to replace the couplers. Most Modelers of American rollingstock will replace cheap manufacturers couplers with the real McCoy. As for the bogies not turning freely it may be due to the screw holding them onto the bottom of the car that could be loosened and perhaps even fitting a washer to allow free rotation. The wheels do look blackened to me and are very close to the colour of real railway / railroad wheels so not sure how they appear to you. Anyway good review and it all depends on the value placed on them by the purchaser. If the dimension matches a certain prototype than some modelers will even replace the bogies altogether. Keep up the good work.
Sam the small print on the wagon sides will tell you the manufacturing date of the vehicle.i think these are a 1928 to1930 design but ran till the 60's (ice blocks were packed in through those roof top hatches ) when mechanical reefers took over,they usualy caried fresh meat and vegetables etc. from the midwest to Chicago and the eastern states. Get a KD coupler height guage so you can set them to the correct operating height. Using the trucks securing screw set one truck so as to swivel easily without wobble and the other truck set to move easily with the bare ammount of woble .this should give 3 point suspension and good tracking.
Sam the coupling is an easy fix, just bend up the bar. Also slightly loosen the truck screws to improve the cornering and points. For the price fit Kadee #5 couplings. Yes you are right they "should" work but plastic knuckle couplers have never been the best even the Bachmann EZ Mate ones have there problems. Did you check the back to back on the wheels?
You're completely correct for calling out those couplers. They break the fundamental principle that ALL rail vehicles need to stick to, whether they're models or full size: Nothing except the wheel flanges should EVER be lower than rail height. If something is hanging off a vehicle below that level, then it is impossible to clear ANY pointwork (hornby, peco or british rail) without something hitting something else.
they're called trip pins, and one modeller described their purpose here (from 2004) "Trip pins are installed as a quick and easy way to test rail height in turnouts and crossovers. IF the trip pin catches and destroys the coupler and coupler box you know your track is too high" (!) :)
Great review Sam. I'm a Brit who models American railroads in HO. I started buying into American RR models because they offered great value compared to Brit models especially DCC. Whether new or pre-owned I have the appropriate tools to ensure they work as expected. Kadee coupling replacements, NMRA gauges etc even new trucks (Bogies) where needed. Plus the extra after market detailing parts to raise them to a higher level and it still works out cheaper than the latest eye watering prices British outline models now command.
Hi Sam, Just to correct you. All the wagons you have are not actually boxcars, they are in fact Reefers (refrigerated wagons) The large access panels on the corners of the roof were where the ice was inserted to keep the contents cold. I bought some Everail gondola wagons, unlike the european one, these had the same cheapo type knuckle couplers. After swapping them out for Kadees they certainly worked better. Also about the coupler trip pins. They certainly are too low. But I have bought Kadee where the trip pin has also been too low. A set of pliers will correct them. As someone else has suggested, a NMRA gauge and/or a Kadee coupler gauge might be worth investing in. Keep up the great work!
In the US there are several firms tht produce decals and dry transfers that can be used on undecorated cars. Several of them will produce items to order. You provide the arrt work, pay for a minimum lot and can have cars lettered for your model railroad.
I keep re-watching them reverse over the points. Best laugh I've had in quite awhile 🤣I'm visualizing an alternating,reversing rake of these with the egg vans next live stream. Good , fun, interesting review. Please do a decorating vid on these, that would be great ! Thanks Sam.
I'd say these cars are perfectly fine! You just have to take a pair of pliers and bend the coupler trip pin upward till it clears the track. It's a really common problem, especially on older models that have been retrofitted with modern couplers. I always bend mine up, regardless of whether it's a now or old piece of rolling stock. Some of my friends cut them off completely.
Those are realistic models of rolling stock that actually ran on American rails. That Grand Union Food Markets (yes that is the old full name) car is a 40 foot reefer car common in the 1930s for transporting perishables. Grand Union was and still is an actual American Supermarket chain that very likely used a reefer car like that 90 years ago. One thing about American prototype rolling stock; the great majority of the time there is an actual prototype of the model, even in cheap trainsets (but yes some of the livery is fanciful in trainsets). Oh and the wheels are blackened even if they aren't pure black, they look a lot more realistic than in the usual nickel plate. I am sure they got permission to use the trademarks which is standard.. They don't want to get sued out of existence
Hello from America. Couplings are always a pain, especially on non-level track. I like to use the older Horn Hook Coupling, (aka Tyco couplings), because they are more robust and stay together better. Though, they are less realistic looking and not compatible with the Kadee and Kadee-esc couplings. Those pins under the couplings are used for a special magnetic coupling/uncoupling system. Very common to have those pins get in the way. Gently Trimming them won’t do any harm.
This type and class of model rolling stock has always been available and should be considered (out of the box) as siding fillers. They are always going to need work to make them mainline runners. Check all wheels on ground, all wheels rotate and are concentric, there is nothing fouling wheel bogie movement, make sure couplings are to NEM standard for height and articulation. All these cars are top ice loading reefer from the steam age but still seen trackside if the wooden bodies have not rotted.
Thank you, I was wondering about these. They might make an inexpensive display in a shop for Christmas. Grand Union is a chain in the North East US, with only a few stores, which makes me think there aren't real train cars with that name.
I believe the spring to return to center on those couplers don't have enough force to straighten the knuckle, perhaps because they are made of plastic and are just whiskers molded onto the shank of the coupler.
Hi sam totally agree with you that any product should work as intended, but i was always intrigued when you would open a very expensive train product and was and still is pleased that it even worked such is the nature of this hobby 🤨
Step one the cars are vintage 1930s to 1950 American manufacturers have decals check micro scale. Kaydee makes a pair of round nose jewelers pliers to bend the pins for clearance not an unusual problem even on higher end cars. Try to loosen the truck screw a little. Also look for flash on the coupler knuckle.
Merchants Despatch was jointly owned by Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati and Indianapolis Railway (CCC&I), the Lake Shore and Michigan Southern Railway, and the New York Central Railroad (NYC), all of which were part of Cornelius Vanderbilt's railway empire. CCC&I (the "Big Four") and LS&MS were eventually merged into the New York Central Railroad. MDT managed to survive NYC's merger into Penn Central and its evolution into Conrail, but was dissolved in 2000. I don't know if any of New York Central's successors still hold the rights to the MDT name or not. That style of wooden car/wagon dates from the 1930s and 1940s. I don't think there were any wooden carbodies left on the major railroads by the 1960s.
For the licensing, the original Grand Union supermarkets went down in 2013, bought by another company... For the price, it's not a bad choice if you don't care about the hyper-accuracy and overdose of details, but if you factored the couplers, it's something else, see later. The prototypes were refrigerator vans used from the 1920s to the 1960s. The couplers are a piece of schlitz and needs to be replaced : too low and an oversized coupling tail for the shank, but you just need a screwdriver to do the job (fixation box for the shank). That's add the price of a Kadee shank to it (around GBP 3 for a wagon, shanks sold by 2 pair packs) and you have to fiddle around to have correct bogies, I'm not talking about replacing the bogies (also Kadee, GBP 5 a pair in HO if I remind the prices correctly). You have tools to regauge the wheels and polish the axles pinpoint holes, by DCC Concepts (I have the gauges for OO/HO and the axle tool). That's a drag to have unuseable couplers and visibly out of gauge wheelsets, even if you can fix the later with a wheel gauge. That's something to consider before buying those wagons. I already have those tools, that would not be a problem for me, but replacing the coupler's shanks would certainly be a no-go for me, even if it's simple to do.
those are refridgerator cars not boxcars, main difference is they have hatches on the roof to slide ice blocks in propr to being loaded with meat or produce or other perishables.. they may be more insulated as well. Athearn made some with opening hatches in kit form.
I’ve paid good money for rolling stock and have had issues with coupler hight and trip pin issues. I’ve had out of gauge wheels and have had to oil the axles. So for the price, it’s worth buying.
I don't suppose those couplers are genuine Kadee but are obviously modelled on them. It is well known that Kadee couplers need to be 'set up' to work correctly. To this end it is possible to purchase a gauge to ensure that the coupler itself is set at the correct height, as well as a special tool that is used to bend the pin so that it clears a step on the gauge, ensuring that the pin will not subsequently foul on the track. Maybe with wagons that are supplied with this type of coupler already fitted, you would expect it to be 'gauged' correctly, but it is no worse correcting this than it would be to correct wheels that have a poor back to back setting.
Hi Sam, I liked the review. It's fair to review them "out of the box" as such, and you pointed out multiple shortcomings of the models. To my eyes, these appear to be on par with the "train set" type of car. They should at least stay on the track for this amount of money. Interesting to note, body mounted couplers are the preferred method for north American rolling stock, even though it can cause coupling problems on "first and second" radius curves. The cars clearly need betting couplers and the trucks need adjusting and possible reaming of the axle point bearings. By the time you spend the money and time you simply could have purchased another brand's cars and been done.
I'm surprised it costs $2 just to have lettering and graphics printed on these refrigerated cars. Bachmann does not charge less for their cars that have no printing on them. The Bachmann versions of these cars have an MSRP of $40, but can go for $25-30 at model shops. 7:13 I've read that back in the old days (and possibly today), some companies didn't care if their name was put onto model trains as it was free advertising for their company. A lot of people tend to clip the curved wire from the knuckle couplers on their models, and I have gotten a few that way.
If they are that definitely, use one of your engines to push them off a clip, use them as containers on a ship, repurpose them into flatbeds like the Tesco container, or turn them into scrap sausages to give to the Evil Scrap Man, or have them be scrap props.
I changed out the couplers for metal kadees they work a lot better with those instead. Eve model have a lot of inconsistencies as I've bought a few wagons from them now and they also sell kits. The rtr stuff they make for instance comes with metal wheels and the kits come with plastic wheels and sometimes the kits they sell have many missing parts or moulding mistakes such as a warped chassis on one example.
You are supposed to bend the coupling glad handle, not cut them. There is a special tool for that. Those couplings are rubbish, and we replace them with KayDee couplings. Regards Peter
FYI: The coupler trip pins are absolutely NOT supposed to freely turn like that. As for the height of the bottom of the trip pin, it should be about 1 to 1.5 mm above the railhead. Too high, and it won’t uncouple well, and too low, and it’ll catch on turnouts or grade crossings. Then you’ll be modeling Derail Valley. 😢 Another problem can occur if the draft gear box covers (which are usually held on by screws) are too loose; then the coupler will drag too low, causing the same problems with the trip pins. Hint: fix any problems with the covers first, THEN worry about the trip pin height. HTH! 😊
Seems like a lot of the issues could be resolved possibly with simply backing the screws off a bit. I’ve heard tighten to snug then loosen them 1/8-1/4 or a turn.
I have purchased Eve model rolling stock, but I bought it with the intention of replacing the couplers, trucks, and wheelsets. It can, I suppose, be argued as to what kind of value they represent, but I was/am pleased with Eve model overall.
Those trucks (bogies) look to be the proper 50-ton with 28-inch wheel sets. Trimming the trip pin is not needed if you simply add washers between the bolsters to raise the car to the correct coupler height. The screw holding the trucks are too tight and not allowing free rotating of those trucks. Loosing the screw by a fraction of a turn should fix that issue. The car is a wooden body design not a metal design so they would be limited to less than 50 mph. The hatches on top are to add blocks of ice for refrigarating the food inside.
I was going to say recurve the trip pins, and you'll be fine!!! I have to do this with all of mine!!! You can spread the sideframes a bit just like I do, and the difference will be worth the time!!! Shane.
There is a tool that can be used to clean the axle boxes so that they roll better For those that want to, the couplers could be changed for relatively cheaply Also if the trucks/bogies are having a hard time turning the screws that hold them on might just be a bit to tight, by loosening the screw even a little bit it can help make the car handle better
Looks similar to Kadee couplings. You need to adjust the magnetic bar not cut them off! You can get pliers and a track block to adjust the them. Bit of fiddling about but when set up they are great. I use cable operated lifting magnets and they work a treat. Sorry, not an option on carpet! You can get fixed magnet ones, no idea if they are any good. Neither tension lock nor Kadee couplings are prototypical but Kadee are far more discreet and if you want to take a piece of rolling stock out you just lift it. A future project for you: evaluating Kadee couplings but you'll ideally need a bit of baseboard and do some work to make comparing them with tension locks valid.
I recommend if you want to fixed them. You have to lift the car up a bit with spacers. And make the axel boxes bigger to fit the axel. Or buy new trucks. Edit: also recommend to get new couplers.
For the undecorated versions, some weathering with a wash techniques should pick out the mounding detail nicely, plus some graffiti ? Body mounted couplings on long wheelbase vehicles are always going to be a problem on the tighter than prototype curves we all have on our model railways. There’s a reason why all our UK models have them mounted on the bogies ever since prewar Hornby Dublo. Even on long 4 or 6 wheelers (like the now ancient Triang-Hornby 6-wheel vans) there’s a mecanism which actually adjusts the tension locks on curves! Sorry as a certified old git I still can’t get my head around paying for a wagon what I used to pay for a locomotive. On a recent trip home to the UK I found some nice bargains at the Hornby factory shop in Margate at £5 each which made me a lot happier 😉
By13:11 looks good for the price, spring couplers, trucks with screws that's 10 bucks right there.. to me. Once you did the back up test, your value grade was one star to much. Better off with a used silver series or similar.
Ron from Classic Model Trains did a video on making cheap rolling stock run better, titled "$2 Car - Runs Like a $50 Car?" The couplings on the wagons look to be lower than the ones on the loco pulling them. Raising the couplings to the same height should help.
I think the derailing on the points is the fault of the wheels. I bought a pack of these wheels to upgrade existing bogies and found that the flanges are just too shallow to negotiate points reliably. Maybe they would be fine with Code 75 track or something but they certainly didn't work on my ordinary track so I couldn't use them. The box cars look great though but those couplings are a nuisance. 😊
Sam, you could do a lot better for the same amount of money, if not a few dollars more, when it comes to American rolling stock. Bachmann, Walthers, and sometimes Athearn have a number freight cars that can easily be acquired for under $25. However, a few of them aren't exactly prototypical. Also, I see you've acquired a Norfolk Southern EMD engine of some sort. As an NS modeler, I look forward to seeing what you have to say about it.
If I had any need for more boxcars, maybe I I'd consider picking up some of these. Steel wheels on a $20 car is pretty good for my eyes. However boxes make up a good half of my rolling stock.
I did notice that there was a small amount of drop on the loco's coupler and also there was a height difference between the loco and the box car. Using a height gauge may help.
Take your white undec wagon, paint it orange and get the Pacific Fruit Express Decals from microscale and you have the beginings of the Roseville Fruit Train!!!
Hey Sam, I have a solution to the trucks not turning well. There should be a screw attaching the trucks to the body if you loosen the they should work like a dream.
The wheels are chemically blackened. So, they are not going to look a true blackened painted color. This detail of the wording was most likely lost in translation due to being a Chinese manufacture. The two things that I noticed were the trip pins on the couplers being low along with the coupler shank drooping, and the free rolling of the trucks as shown in the video. The couplers would need an adjustment with the KD Trip Pin pliers and the coupler height checked with the KD coupler height gage. With the quality of the couplers, it may be better to replace with real KD couplers along with shimming the coupler height with washers on the frame bolster. As far as the trucks, a reamer tool could improve the performance of the free rolling of the wheels. My final thoughts: The coupler height issues will cause derailments as shown with the trip pins catching various things along the rails. This would be something to lower the overall scale of the review. As far as the free rolling trucks, this would rate in the score, but I view it as a minor weight value in the score. Last is the price. At a price around $18, the coupler and truck issues make it a hard choice for me to buy even though I could fix the issues of the car. This car would be considered more of a project/modification car than a RTR model. So, I'm on the fence about the price of the car being a good value.
I've had to replace most of my couplings even on expensive rolling stock, with genuine Kadee couplings. It's not much of an expense relative to the cost of expensive and finely detailed rolling stock - but forking out for a pair of Kadees would be a significant additional cost on 'cheap' stock. PS - I'd rather have two detailed wagons than four cheap ones. Each to their own.
Ref note; That MDT reefer was a New York Central subsidiary,and the aforementioned PFE,was a joint operation of the UP/SP,also the Santa Fe had reefers marked SFRD,for Santa Fe Refrigerator Department! That's another bit of trivia/ history,and it's pretty complicated,as a whole book was written on it! Check your library! Thanks for an interesting video,very different! Thank you 😇!
the wheels are dropping into the shoes on the points try setting the gaps or try a set of hornby silver wheels the actual rims are wider rims then they dont drop into the shoes on the points
Great review Sam, everyone I know's about the problems with the lack of performance of the replicated Knuckle Coupler from the Car/ Wagon's/ Loco manufacture's. Most people rely on as the go to Knuckle is made by( Kadee )brand. They even have fixed height gauges that are NMRS correct for reliable operations. Addressing this issue is like beating a dead horse with these other manufactures. LOL!🤣The only one that comes close to Kadee's standards is Bachmann. It would be ideal that other rolling stock Manufacture's would just use Kadee Knuckle system instead of wasting time trying to reinvent a new rendition of it. Cheers Sam, have a wonderful day.👍
These are the same guys who made those ali express hoppers that somehow just barely still hold the record for most free rolling Sam's train wagon ever. there was one review that was a photo finish, but I'm pretty sure the hoppers were still the better rollers. I'm astonished their boxcars are so poor, given how wonderfully their hoppers performed.
Keep in mind that there’s nothing really complicated about an American boxcar. It’s just a much longer wagon than those in the U.K., and it uses 2-axle bogies (trucks), instead of the more common single-axle arrangement on most British wagons. The other difference is that the type-AB brake gear is a bit more complicated than the British equipment, and uses the absence of pressure to trigger the brake application. It has three basic parts; the brake cylinder, the triple-valve, and the air reservoir. Even on the cheapest models, these are usually molded on. Better quality models have more detail such as the pipes and rods and levers and such (brake rigging.) Then, you have the North American standard knuckle couplers, usually Kadee-compatible ones. Finally - depending on the era modeled - the boxcar may or may not have a running board on top. Newer ones do not, as the ICC (Interstate Commerce Commission) banned them for safety reasons. Also, even now, there’s a Royal sh*tload of boxcars wandering the North American rail network, so there’s probably a prototype for those, though for ones that old, you’ll have to look in a transportation museum, as those are “billboard” boxcars, which were also banned, but not for safety reasons. 😮 So, unless one is modeling a specific road in a specific era, I wouldn’t worry too much about detail fidelity; just check the wheel gauge, the coupler trip-pin height, and if the wheels roll freely and all touch the rail on a straight and level piece of track.
Great Video Sam. Just getting over Covid so It was great to see that you had done another Information Video that keeps your followers updated with what's good and what's dodgy. I run British outline here in Western Aust but I have fitted Kadee couplings and only have trouble if I use cheap Kadee Knock offs what about a video where you replace some of these couplings with true Kadees or European-style couplings. And see if it makes any difference. All The Best Sam Bill from WA
Re the derailing, have you tested the back-to-backs of the wheels? They seemed to lock up and ride over the tight flangeway as the rear bogie needed to swing.
A very interesting review, Sam! When you pulled the first car from its package I could see that the couplers were defective. The shape of the uncoupling arms (which is deliberately curved to look like an air brake hose) is usually adjusted by US modellers using a special pair of rounded pliers sold by Kadee Products. (Other long nosed pliers can also be used.) There is also a standards gauge that can check the clearance of the lower part of the arm with the railhead. That being said, the orientation of the arm is relatively critical, and a coupler where the arm is rotated off the correct angle with the centerline of the car is a serious defect. It might be repairable, but usually it is not (at least not easlily). By the way, some modellers cut the arms off completely for more realistic looking couplers. This makes using uncoupling ramps or electromagnets impossible, but many modellers (including myself) typically use an uncoupling tool anyway. As for the trucks, I'd suspect that either the wheel flanges do not actually follow NMRA standards, or the connection of the trucks to the cars is problematic. Again, thanks so much for this review, and Cheers from Wisconsins!
For North American models, it's recommended to have an NMRA gauge to check for wheelset flanges and coupler heights. There's also a reamer tool for the trucks (bogies) to loosen up the wheels so they move more freely.
There is also a tool to bend the coupler pins. Most major manufacturers will ensure they fit properly, but its not uncommon when fitting knuckle couplers to have to adjust the pins.
I tend to just use a small drill bit to get the bogies to move more freely. I once had a problem with an old Walthers SP hopper car kit, mainly its bogies. The bogies would not turn, and would derail on curves. So, I had the bright idea to take a drill bit and drill out the inside of the bogies’ mounting holes. After that, the hopper car became one of the freest turning wagons on my layout.
Kadee usually includes a coupler gauge and horn tool in starter sets which is nice. I normally just set the gauge height and cut the horns off.
So I guess like their real life American counterparts
As a Model Railroader from the US, I'd suggest changing these for Kadee Couplings. Kadees are a lot nicer and are great at coupling together and staying together nicely as well as bearing weight. I'd also recommend that if you go for Kadee couplings, I'd recommend, depending on the coupler box, the Kadee #5 couplers. Generally, they are 6 bucks for a pack of two with coupler boxes and screws. It's up to you if you want to change the couplers over.
We call these pieces of rolling stock “Reefers” as for the yellow one if you do wish to make a paint scheme. I would suggest painting it up into the “PFE” livery (Pacific Fruit Express). It was run by Union Pacific and Southern Pacific. There is a tool made by Kadee just for bending the coupler hooks (they are supposed to resemble the air hoses for the air breaks) and they make couplers for HO scale and other scales. They are the go to for couplers and they even have difficulty with quality for their couplers, as such for the above the had to make tools for it that you can buy.
Burlington did it too
My recommendation for getting rolling stock cheap is to just buy used. You're probably getting something better for cheaper, and I've often seen used stock go for like five bucks a car
In the US these cars were commonplace during the 1920's up to maybe 50's. These cars are Wood sided Ice Reefers. In the wood-car days, freight reefers would be 40' long (with a fair number of 36' ones still around ) and special express or passenger reefers would be 50' long. The express reefers didn't look like regular freight cars, they were designed to be used in passenger train service. After WW2, 50' freight reefers started to become common (about the time new reefer construction switched to steel) but wouldn't become more common than 40' cars until probably after the steam era. By the sixties-seventies 50-55' long reefers became quite common (mechanical Reefers) . Still some 40' woodside iced reefers did survive into the very early seventies on rare occasions. The Woodside ICE reefers had a galvanized metal compartment at either end of the car on the inside of the car. What you would do is the train would load with produce and or fruits or cheese or dairy etc... and then the bunkers (under the hatches on the roof) would be filled with ice. The foods inside would be cooled or refrigerated by ambient cooling only. The problem was that the railroad would need to position an "icing" station every so often and then the entire consist would need new ice. This took a long time as one can imagine. During the 60's with the advent of the mechanical reefer (which was basically a small petrol or diesel engine that ran a compressor or chilling unit and fans etc. ) much more reliable and could go longer distances with lower temps..
The derailing on your points test is likely in part due to the s curve that is present. With body mounted knuckle couplers, you get a shear force on a curves since the couplers end up parallel next to each other. A straight section as long as the longest bit of rolling stock is required between curve directions. It’s not as much of an issue with UK and Euro rolling stock because of the loop couplers, truck mounted couplers, and shorter car lengths.
I bought 6 flat cars from them last year. replaced the couplers with KD No5's and Intermountain wheel sets, they now run great.
I don't think Sam is across the great range and variations of Kadee products to suit different wagon heights and shift lengths
Sam, you should buy a KAD0205 KADEE HO Coupler Height Gauge. They have a properly set coupler and a shelf to use to set the trip pin height. You use needle nose pliers to adjust the pin by bending the curved section.
Great video as always, Sam!
The issue you found with these cars is fairly common with cheaper American rolling stock. This also happens with older cars that had molds originally made for horn-hook couplers.
It is unfortunate, but they are still nice filler cars to make a long train!
Thanks for sharing!
Trevor
That being said, the clip at 25:45 is pretty darned bad. They should at least couple to themselves!
@@westernnewyorkrailfan They should be considered as inexpensive starting point. Add weight, rework truck mounting and couplers and it should be decent. But as is, without tuning, it's a waste of time.
Yeah, I would recommend some Accurail kits as a palate cleanser. Just keep in mind that they don't come with metal couplers or wheels.
Nothing that can't be solved by trimming the pin a bit, adding weigth to the wagons, and greasing the trucks. And Kadee couplers are the best ones for me. I discarded all Fleischmann and Roco couplers in all my fleet (more than 200 locomotives and 500 wagons) and replaced them by Kadees . One of my guilty pleasures is to buy cheap American wagons and tune them until they work flawlessly. It is very easy to fix American rolling stock.
The Grand Union van is for a supermarket/grocery store that was around when I was a child in the early 1970s in New York state.
They were around from the 1870s until around 2001. They were bought out. There are still a few around today.
Yeah I did look those up - cool that it's a real thing :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
yup, i used to shop at one in northern NJ. i think it turned into an A&P?
Sam,
Your conclusion about the couplers is correct. The coupler pins were to low and in the wrong loocation. Low coupler pins are the cause of the derailment at your turnouts. The couplers are Chinese clones of Kadee couplers, and the non coupling is typical of the Chinese clone couplers. If you replace them with genuine Kadee wisker couplers and make sure the coupler pins and couplers are the correct height, using a Kadee coupler height gauge, they will work property. Also it looks like the wheel back to back or bogies are to tight, in this case it's not your trackwork.
Ad a general practice, I personally replace all my couplers with Kadees so the stock coupler issue isn't deal breaker for me. I'd be willing to take a chance on a cou6of these.
Thanks for reviewing these Sam! Judging from the roofs these look like Reefers which were early refrigerator cars and those hatches on the roof were for sliding giant blocks of ice into the cars to keep them cold on the long trips. They do look nice but it’s a shame that they need so much tweaking and maintenance to actually work
Those would be a really hard sell in the US. There are still piles of new old stock blue box Athearn rolling stock a available for $10 or less.
These refrigerator cars (or “reefers”, for short) look decent for the money and that fix you did for the whisker/uncoupling pin on the coupler is pretty much what I do with my rolling stock if it derails. 😅
I might pick up a few of these, but I will implement that quick fix to ensure they run smoothly; I might also loosen the screws securing the bogies to the frame slightly to allow for more play.
Good review, Sam! Looking forward to the next one 👍🏼
Better to bend the pins up a little.
I always cut the pins short to avoid any possible contact with ties or turnout parts, it's a great idea
@@beefs0ck911
I guess it depends if you use the uncoupling feature.
For the derailing issue, I believe that might be due to the radius of the points, especially with where the couplers are mounted.
If you have access to a larger radius points, you may find a different result.
A Kadee trip pin pliers would help with the trip trip pins. I would have replaced them with either Bachmann’s EZ mate II or McHenery couplers. Check the wheel gauge, this seems a little wide, and would cause excessive friction on the rails and cause the wheelsets to derail through the points. If the trucks (bogies) are screw mounted, back one out just enough to relieve the binding, and the other so the car (van) can rock slightly side to side. This should help with tracking. These would be my “cheap” fixes. Other things would be far more money. Replace the couplers with Kadee “whisker” couplers, and the trucks ( bogies) with a better unit, like, from Walthers or another manufacturer of solid frame trucks ( bogies). Like you said though, these cars being in the $20.00 range, just how much do you want to spend on someone else’s short comings?
Back in the 1970s, when I was into Rivarossi US line freight cars, I improved them with Kadee couplers, metal wheels, sprung bogies ( RR did make both Archbar and Bettendorf with springs between side frames and transoms.
Finally I replaced the self-tap screws or plugs, with a threaded bush in the Frame bolster, and a 2mm MA screw and washer through Bogie cross piece.
Made for very reliable running.
Some of these cars were 1950s manufacture and second hand ( mostly unused).
Still have them, along with Big Boys, Challengers ( RR and Brass) stored since 1983...may be resurrected soon.
I'm tempted as I'd be changing the couplings out for D tension lock couplings any how. I find tweeking and adjusting things quite fun. Not that you should have to but you could replace all the couplings with some of your 3D printed couplings.
Sam
Good video and you definitely need a Kadee Coupler Height Gauge. It not only sits on the track but also has a plate that is the gauge for the coupler pins. The pins should not be cut off, but should be simply bent to clear the plate with a pair of needle nose pilers. Makes coupler height and coupler pin height a breeze. Also it seems that those couplers are a Kadee rip-off and almost certain they have no centering spring in the coupler pocket. Kadee Whisper couplers have a centering spring already fitted.
Having said all that you may consider it not worth it to replace the couplers. Most Modelers of American rollingstock will replace cheap manufacturers couplers with the real McCoy.
As for the bogies not turning freely it may be due to the screw holding them onto the bottom of the car that could be loosened and perhaps even fitting a washer to allow free rotation.
The wheels do look blackened to me and are very close to the colour of real railway / railroad wheels so not sure how they appear to you.
Anyway good review and it all depends on the value placed on them by the purchaser. If the dimension matches a certain prototype than some modelers will even replace the bogies altogether.
Keep up the good work.
Sam the small print on the wagon sides will tell you the manufacturing date of the vehicle.i think these are a 1928 to1930 design but ran till the 60's (ice blocks were packed in through those roof top hatches ) when mechanical reefers took over,they usualy caried fresh meat and vegetables etc. from the midwest to Chicago and the eastern states.
Get a KD coupler height guage so you can set them to the correct operating height.
Using the trucks securing screw set one truck so as to swivel easily without wobble and the other truck set to move easily with the bare ammount of woble .this should give 3 point suspension and good tracking.
Sam the coupling is an easy fix, just bend up the bar. Also slightly loosen the truck screws to improve the cornering and points. For the price fit Kadee #5 couplings. Yes you are right they "should" work but plastic knuckle couplers have never been the best even the Bachmann EZ Mate ones have there problems. Did you check the back to back on the wheels?
You're completely correct for calling out those couplers. They break the fundamental principle that ALL rail vehicles need to stick to, whether they're models or full size: Nothing except the wheel flanges should EVER be lower than rail height. If something is hanging off a vehicle below that level, then it is impossible to clear ANY pointwork (hornby, peco or british rail) without something hitting something else.
they're called trip pins, and one modeller described their purpose here (from 2004) "Trip pins are installed as a quick and easy way to test rail height in turnouts and crossovers. IF the trip pin catches and destroys the coupler and coupler box you know your track is too high" (!) :)
Great review Sam. I'm a Brit who models American railroads in HO. I started buying into American RR models because they offered great value compared to Brit models especially DCC. Whether new or pre-owned I have the appropriate tools to ensure they work as expected. Kadee coupling replacements, NMRA gauges etc even new trucks (Bogies) where needed. Plus the extra after market detailing parts to raise them to a higher level and it still works out cheaper than the latest eye watering prices British outline models now command.
Hi Sam, Just to correct you. All the wagons you have are not actually boxcars, they are in fact Reefers (refrigerated wagons) The large access panels on the corners of the roof were where the ice was inserted to keep the contents cold.
I bought some Everail gondola wagons, unlike the european one, these had the same cheapo type knuckle couplers. After swapping them out for Kadees they certainly worked better.
Also about the coupler trip pins. They certainly are too low. But I have bought Kadee where the trip pin has also been too low. A set of pliers will correct them. As someone else has suggested, a NMRA gauge and/or a Kadee coupler gauge might be worth investing in.
Keep up the great work!
In the US there are several firms tht produce decals and dry transfers that can be used on undecorated cars. Several of them will produce items to order. You provide the arrt work, pay for a minimum lot and can have cars lettered for your model railroad.
Something feels nostalgic about your videos, something that takes me back
I keep re-watching them reverse over the points. Best laugh I've had in quite awhile 🤣I'm visualizing an alternating,reversing rake of these with the egg vans next live stream. Good , fun, interesting review. Please do a decorating vid on these, that would be great ! Thanks Sam.
I'd say these cars are perfectly fine! You just have to take a pair of pliers and bend the coupler trip pin upward till it clears the track. It's a really common problem, especially on older models that have been retrofitted with modern couplers. I always bend mine up, regardless of whether it's a now or old piece of rolling stock. Some of my friends cut them off completely.
Those are realistic models of rolling stock that actually ran on American rails. That Grand Union Food Markets (yes that is the old full name) car is a 40 foot reefer car common in the 1930s for transporting perishables. Grand Union was and still is an actual American Supermarket chain that very likely used a reefer car like that 90 years ago.
One thing about American prototype rolling stock; the great majority of the time there is an actual prototype of the model, even in cheap trainsets (but yes some of the livery is fanciful in trainsets).
Oh and the wheels are blackened even if they aren't pure black, they look a lot more realistic than in the usual nickel plate.
I am sure they got permission to use the trademarks which is standard.. They don't want to get sued out of existence
Hello from America.
Couplings are always a pain, especially on non-level track.
I like to use the older Horn Hook Coupling, (aka Tyco couplings), because they are more robust and stay together better. Though, they are less realistic looking and not compatible with the Kadee and Kadee-esc couplings.
Those pins under the couplings are used for a special magnetic coupling/uncoupling system. Very common to have those pins get in the way. Gently Trimming them won’t do any harm.
Great vid Sam, just been binge watching your old videos, and seriously, you should consider doing more like them!
Thank you!! Which ones were you watching??
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
This type and class of model rolling stock has always been available and should be considered (out of the box) as siding fillers. They are always going to need work to make them mainline runners. Check all wheels on ground, all wheels rotate and are concentric, there is nothing fouling wheel bogie movement, make sure couplings are to NEM standard for height and articulation. All these cars are top ice loading reefer from the steam age but still seen trackside if the wooden bodies have not rotted.
Thank you, I was wondering about these. They might make an inexpensive display in a shop for Christmas. Grand Union is a chain in the North East US, with only a few stores, which makes me think there aren't real train cars with that name.
Perfect for a freelance/free-mo layout
At one time they were big enough they had rail cars.
I believe the spring to return to center on those couplers don't have enough force to straighten the knuckle, perhaps because they are made of plastic and are just whiskers molded onto the shank of the coupler.
Hi sam totally agree with you that any product should work as intended, but i was always intrigued when you would open a very expensive train product and was and still is pleased that it even worked such is the nature of this hobby 🤨
Step one the cars are vintage 1930s to 1950
American manufacturers have decals check micro scale. Kaydee makes a pair of round nose jewelers pliers to bend the pins for clearance not an unusual problem even on higher end cars. Try to loosen the truck screw a little. Also look for flash on the coupler knuckle.
Merchants Despatch was jointly owned by Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati and Indianapolis Railway (CCC&I), the Lake Shore and Michigan Southern Railway, and the New York Central Railroad (NYC), all of which were part of Cornelius Vanderbilt's railway empire. CCC&I (the "Big Four") and LS&MS were eventually merged into the New York Central Railroad. MDT managed to survive NYC's merger into Penn Central and its evolution into Conrail, but was dissolved in 2000. I don't know if any of New York Central's successors still hold the rights to the MDT name or not. That style of wooden car/wagon dates from the 1930s and 1940s. I don't think there were any wooden carbodies left on the major railroads by the 1960s.
those "pins" hanging from the couplers are supposed to be the air line or hoses or resemble them anyways
For the licensing, the original Grand Union supermarkets went down in 2013, bought by another company... For the price, it's not a bad choice if you don't care about the hyper-accuracy and overdose of details, but if you factored the couplers, it's something else, see later. The prototypes were refrigerator vans used from the 1920s to the 1960s.
The couplers are a piece of schlitz and needs to be replaced : too low and an oversized coupling tail for the shank, but you just need a screwdriver to do the job (fixation box for the shank). That's add the price of a Kadee shank to it (around GBP 3 for a wagon, shanks sold by 2 pair packs) and you have to fiddle around to have correct bogies, I'm not talking about replacing the bogies (also Kadee, GBP 5 a pair in HO if I remind the prices correctly). You have tools to regauge the wheels and polish the axles pinpoint holes, by DCC Concepts (I have the gauges for OO/HO and the axle tool).
That's a drag to have unuseable couplers and visibly out of gauge wheelsets, even if you can fix the later with a wheel gauge. That's something to consider before buying those wagons. I already have those tools, that would not be a problem for me, but replacing the coupler's shanks would certainly be a no-go for me, even if it's simple to do.
those are refridgerator cars not boxcars, main difference is they have hatches on the roof to slide ice blocks in propr to being loaded with meat or produce or other perishables.. they may be more insulated as well. Athearn made some with opening hatches in kit form.
I’ve paid good money for rolling stock and have had issues with coupler hight and trip pin issues. I’ve had out of gauge wheels and have had to oil the axles. So for the price, it’s worth buying.
I don't suppose those couplers are genuine Kadee but are obviously modelled on them. It is well known that Kadee couplers need to be 'set up' to work correctly. To this end it is possible to purchase a gauge to ensure that the coupler itself is set at the correct height, as well as a special tool that is used to bend the pin so that it clears a step on the gauge, ensuring that the pin will not subsequently foul on the track. Maybe with wagons that are supplied with this type of coupler already fitted, you would expect it to be 'gauged' correctly, but it is no worse correcting this than it would be to correct wheels that have a poor back to back setting.
Hi Sam, I liked the review. It's fair to review them "out of the box" as such, and you pointed out multiple shortcomings of the models. To my eyes, these appear to be on par with the "train set" type of car. They should at least stay on the track for this amount of money. Interesting to note, body mounted couplers are the preferred method for north American rolling stock, even though it can cause coupling problems on "first and second" radius curves. The cars clearly need betting couplers and the trucks need adjusting and possible reaming of the axle point bearings. By the time you spend the money and time you simply could have purchased another brand's cars and been done.
I'm surprised it costs $2 just to have lettering and graphics printed on these refrigerated cars. Bachmann does not charge less for their cars that have no printing on them.
The Bachmann versions of these cars have an MSRP of $40, but can go for $25-30 at model shops.
7:13 I've read that back in the old days (and possibly today), some companies didn't care if their name was put onto model trains as it was free advertising for their company.
A lot of people tend to clip the curved wire from the knuckle couplers on their models, and I have gotten a few that way.
If they are that definitely, use one of your engines to push them off a clip, use them as containers on a ship, repurpose them into flatbeds like the Tesco container, or turn them into scrap sausages to give to the Evil Scrap Man, or have them be scrap props.
I changed out the couplers for metal kadees they work a lot better with those instead. Eve model have a lot of inconsistencies as I've bought a few wagons from them now and they also sell kits. The rtr stuff they make for instance comes with metal wheels and the kits come with plastic wheels and sometimes the kits they sell have many missing parts or moulding mistakes such as a warped chassis on one example.
You are supposed to bend the coupling glad handle, not cut them. There is a special tool for that. Those couplings are rubbish, and we replace them with KayDee couplings. Regards Peter
The pins on the coupler can be formed with a needle nose pliers. Best you
do it with a Kadee uncoupling magnet. Bend them up or down as needed.
FYI: The coupler trip pins are absolutely NOT supposed to freely turn like that. As for the height of the bottom of the trip pin, it should be about 1 to 1.5 mm above the railhead. Too high, and it won’t uncouple well, and too low, and it’ll catch on turnouts or grade crossings. Then you’ll be modeling Derail Valley. 😢 Another problem can occur if the draft gear box covers (which are usually held on by screws) are too loose; then the coupler will drag too low, causing the same problems with the trip pins. Hint: fix any problems with the covers first, THEN worry about the trip pin height. HTH! 😊
Seems like a lot of the issues could be resolved possibly with simply backing the screws off a bit. I’ve heard tighten to snug then loosen them 1/8-1/4 or a turn.
Bachmann makes a Grand Union box car that looks exactly like that one.
I have purchased Eve model rolling stock, but I bought it with the intention of replacing the couplers, trucks, and wheelsets. It can, I suppose, be argued as to what kind of value they represent, but I was/am pleased with Eve model overall.
Here in North America, we would replace the couplers for Kaydee, and adjust the trip pins !
Those trucks (bogies) look to be the proper 50-ton with 28-inch wheel sets. Trimming the trip pin is not needed if you simply add washers between the bolsters to raise the car to the correct coupler height. The screw holding the trucks are too tight and not allowing free rotating of those trucks. Loosing the screw by a fraction of a turn should fix that issue. The car is a wooden body design not a metal design so they would be limited to less than 50 mph. The hatches on top are to add blocks of ice for refrigarating the food inside.
These items are sold ready-to-run, so your criticisms are valid. Also, your demonstration of how to remedy the issue is very welcome and useful.
You should decorate one of the box vans with “Sam’s Trains”
Sam, if you have brothers or sisters with children, you could decorate as UNCLE SAM'S TRAINS.
I was going to say recurve the trip pins, and you'll be fine!!! I have to do this with all of mine!!! You can spread the sideframes a bit just like I do, and the difference will be worth the time!!! Shane.
There is a tool that can be used to clean the axle boxes so that they roll better
For those that want to, the couplers could be changed for relatively cheaply
Also if the trucks/bogies are having a hard time turning the screws that hold them on might just be a bit to tight, by loosening the screw even a little bit it can help make the car handle better
Those boxcars are knock offs. I have a bachmann grand food union one that looks EXACTY like that one.
Looks similar to Kadee couplings. You need to adjust the magnetic bar not cut them off! You can get pliers and a track block to adjust the them. Bit of fiddling about but when set up they are great. I use cable operated lifting magnets and they work a treat. Sorry, not an option on carpet! You can get fixed magnet ones, no idea if they are any good. Neither tension lock nor Kadee couplings are prototypical but Kadee are far more discreet and if you want to take a piece of rolling stock out you just lift it. A future project for you: evaluating Kadee couplings but you'll ideally need a bit of baseboard and do some work to make comparing them with tension locks valid.
Bachmann actually produces a Grand Union refrigerator, exactly like that one. One of the best pieces of Bachmann rolling stock I’ve ever gotten.
Perfect cars to try your hand at some weathering sam great video as always
I recommend if you want to fixed them. You have to lift the car up a bit with spacers. And make the axel boxes bigger to fit the axel. Or buy new trucks.
Edit: also recommend to get new couplers.
For the undecorated versions, some weathering with a wash techniques should pick out the mounding detail nicely, plus some graffiti ?
Body mounted couplings on long wheelbase vehicles are always going to be a problem on the tighter than prototype curves we all have on our model railways. There’s a reason why all our UK models have them mounted on the bogies ever since prewar Hornby Dublo. Even on long 4 or 6 wheelers (like the now ancient Triang-Hornby 6-wheel vans) there’s a mecanism which actually adjusts the tension locks on curves!
Sorry as a certified old git I still can’t get my head around paying for a wagon what I used to pay for a locomotive. On a recent trip home to the UK I found some nice bargains at the Hornby factory shop in Margate at £5 each which made me a lot happier 😉
One thing that's good about it being dirt cheap you could use them as stunt cars (for runaways and crashes).
By13:11 looks good for the price, spring couplers, trucks with screws that's 10 bucks right there.. to me. Once you did the back up test, your value grade was one star to much. Better off with a used silver series or similar.
Ron from Classic Model Trains did a video on making cheap rolling stock run better, titled "$2 Car - Runs Like a $50 Car?" The couplings on the wagons look to be lower than the ones on the loco pulling them. Raising the couplings to the same height should help.
Love the description "Poo coloured wagon"
I think the derailing on the points is the fault of the wheels. I bought a pack of these wheels to upgrade existing bogies and found that the flanges are just too shallow to negotiate points reliably. Maybe they would be fine with Code 75 track or something but they certainly didn't work on my ordinary track so I couldn't use them. The box cars look great though but those couplings are a nuisance. 😊
The pins though on most knuckle couplers are designed to be bent to suit each modellers needs. There is even a tool you can buy to help bend the pins.
Sam, you could do a lot better for the same amount of money, if not a few dollars more, when it comes to American rolling stock. Bachmann, Walthers, and sometimes Athearn have a number freight cars that can easily be acquired for under $25. However, a few of them aren't exactly prototypical.
Also, I see you've acquired a Norfolk Southern EMD engine of some sort. As an NS modeler, I look forward to seeing what you have to say about it.
If I had any need for more boxcars, maybe I I'd consider picking up some of these. Steel wheels on a $20 car is pretty good for my eyes. However boxes make up a good half of my rolling stock.
I’d recommend putting some weights in to the cars as well as put some oil on the wheels and maybe even loosen the screws holding there boggy on
I did notice that there was a small amount of drop on the loco's coupler and also there was a height difference between the loco and the box car. Using a height gauge may help.
Take your white undec wagon, paint it orange and get the Pacific Fruit Express Decals from microscale and you have the beginings of the Roseville Fruit Train!!!
I recently purchased the exact same wheels as these have to convert some old wagons, and now they do the exact same thing over the hornby points!
Hey Sam, I have a solution to the trucks not turning well. There should be a screw attaching the trucks to the body if you loosen the they should work like a dream.
The wheels are chemically blackened. So, they are not going to look a true blackened painted color. This detail of the wording was most likely lost in translation due to being a Chinese manufacture. The two things that I noticed were the trip pins on the couplers being low along with the coupler shank drooping, and the free rolling of the trucks as shown in the video. The couplers would need an adjustment with the KD Trip Pin pliers and the coupler height checked with the KD coupler height gage. With the quality of the couplers, it may be better to replace with real KD couplers along with shimming the coupler height with washers on the frame bolster. As far as the trucks, a reamer tool could improve the performance of the free rolling of the wheels.
My final thoughts: The coupler height issues will cause derailments as shown with the trip pins catching various things along the rails. This would be something to lower the overall scale of the review. As far as the free rolling trucks, this would rate in the score, but I view it as a minor weight value in the score. Last is the price. At a price around $18, the coupler and truck issues make it a hard choice for me to buy even though I could fix the issues of the car. This car would be considered more of a project/modification car than a RTR model. So, I'm on the fence about the price of the car being a good value.
What you could also do is add spacers between the trucks and body as the couplers are attached to the body and not the truck housing
I've had to replace most of my couplings even on expensive rolling stock, with genuine Kadee couplings. It's not much of an expense relative to the cost of expensive and finely detailed rolling stock - but forking out for a pair of Kadees would be a significant additional cost on 'cheap' stock. PS - I'd rather have two detailed wagons than four cheap ones. Each to their own.
16:31 Is that a possible ScaleTrains model I see? I can already tell I’ll be excited for a review on that loco!
that is not a scaletrains. it's the Athearn genesis SD60E. I have the Athearn SD60E in 6920 and from the picture I can tell it's an Athearn SD60E.
Can't wait for that review!
I agree with you Sam. Any model should be fit for purpose out of the box.
Ref note; That MDT reefer was a New York Central subsidiary,and the aforementioned PFE,was a joint operation of the UP/SP,also the Santa Fe had reefers marked SFRD,for Santa Fe Refrigerator Department! That's another bit of trivia/ history,and it's pretty complicated,as a whole book was written on it! Check your library! Thanks for an interesting video,very different! Thank you 😇!
the wheels are dropping into the shoes on the points try setting the gaps or try a set of hornby silver wheels the actual rims are wider rims then they dont drop into the shoes on the points
Swap the couplers with Kadee couplers and loosen the trucks (bogies) and you might have some good runners.
Great review Sam, everyone I know's about the problems with the lack of performance of the replicated Knuckle Coupler from the Car/ Wagon's/ Loco manufacture's. Most people rely on as the go to Knuckle is made by( Kadee )brand. They even have fixed height gauges that are NMRS correct for reliable operations. Addressing this issue is like beating a dead horse with these other manufactures. LOL!🤣The only one that comes close to Kadee's standards is Bachmann. It would be ideal that other rolling stock Manufacture's would just use Kadee Knuckle system instead of wasting time trying to reinvent a new rendition of it. Cheers Sam, have a wonderful day.👍
These are the same guys who made those ali express hoppers that somehow just barely still hold the record for most free rolling Sam's train wagon ever. there was one review that was a photo finish, but I'm pretty sure the hoppers were still the better rollers. I'm astonished their boxcars are so poor, given how wonderfully their hoppers performed.
I would replace the couplers with Kadee knuckle couplers, they are expensive but are the best, I use Kadee's throughout and swear by them.
Keep in mind that there’s nothing really complicated about an American boxcar. It’s just a much longer wagon than those in the U.K., and it uses 2-axle bogies (trucks), instead of the more common single-axle arrangement on most British wagons. The other difference is that the type-AB brake gear is a bit more complicated than the British equipment, and uses the absence of pressure to trigger the brake application. It has three basic parts; the brake cylinder, the triple-valve, and the air reservoir. Even on the cheapest models, these are usually molded on. Better quality models have more detail such as the pipes and rods and levers and such (brake rigging.) Then, you have the North American standard knuckle couplers, usually Kadee-compatible ones. Finally - depending on the era modeled - the boxcar may or may not have a running board on top. Newer ones do not, as the ICC (Interstate Commerce Commission) banned them for safety reasons. Also, even now, there’s a Royal sh*tload of boxcars wandering the North American rail network, so there’s probably a prototype for those, though for ones that old, you’ll have to look in a transportation museum, as those are “billboard” boxcars, which were also banned, but not for safety reasons. 😮 So, unless one is modeling a specific road in a specific era, I wouldn’t worry too much about detail fidelity; just check the wheel gauge, the coupler trip-pin height, and if the wheels roll freely and all touch the rail on a straight and level piece of track.
With recent events in mind, it would seem that they work just like the real thing.....
Make sure that the couplers on the GP9 are not McHenrys with the catwhisker springs!!! You couplers on the Evemodels are the good ones!!!!!!!!
For the undecorated versions, some weathering with a wash techniques should pick out the mounding detail nicely, plus some graffiti ?
I had this idea of making a China prototype layout.. there are some good Chinese models, mostly for the domestic market, but those are not cheap.
Great Video Sam. Just getting over Covid so It was great to see that you had done another Information Video that keeps your followers updated with what's good and what's dodgy. I run British outline here in Western Aust but I have fitted Kadee couplings and only have trouble if I use cheap Kadee Knock offs what about a video where you replace some of these couplings with true Kadees or European-style couplings. And see if it makes any difference.
All The Best Sam Bill from WA
Re the derailing, have you tested the back-to-backs of the wheels? They seemed to lock up and ride over the tight flangeway as the rear bogie needed to swing.