One of the Top 1% to 3%-ish players here: (no idea if anyone sees this, but) Generally, everything what grubby said is pretty spot on. It gives you a good ground to work with. I have a few further tips for you, if you want: A few pits that a lot of people fall into is trying to build very symmetrical, or fill out rows with a unit, etc. while aesthetically pleasing, that most of the time is not really what you want to do. First of all you want to counter anything that your opponent is doing, and then play to the strengths of your comp. That means if opponent is building 5 necros, building 3 or 4 spirit walkers or priests is enough to dispel that, I know the urge to fill out a row when it is 75% complete is huge, but try to resist! Secondly: If you dont really feel like you can grasp when you have enough units for your weapon and armor upgrades, a general good line of thought is every 10-12 minutes. Attack upgrade has higher priority, especially if youre on the opposite site of the map! So getting 2-1 by minute 18-20 while youre pushing is a good example of what you might be going for. Lastly I want to give you some very good easy advice, that can win/lose you games if you dont heed it: If youre on the opposing site of the map, disable cyclone/polymorph/tornado as IT WILL LOSE YOU GAMES! These spells are only good defending, and makes the defending team stack, no matter who casts it. You can disable / enable abilities with the "Ability AI" button on the bottom left, over the minimap. Lastly, you can join the direct strike discord, where you can meet a lot of cool people. If you have any questiosn, feel free to hit us up! I for one am always open to talk. And most importantly: Have fun!
Oh and while I am at it. ALWAYS have some form of Dispel in either T1 or T2. Else you can get screwed over pretty hard by Summons. It is also advised that you have at least one AoE dispel. In T3 you can have destroyers for example, in T2 Spirit Walker or Priest. If you dont get mass dispel, and they have Bloodlust, Frenzy, Necromancers, Curse, Spirit Link etc. then you will probably suffer a lot.
@@alexanderromanov1587 oh yeah true. If you go directly into W3 champions youre probably gonna have a bad time haha. Just do like 3-5 matches on bnet first just to see everything
why is it good to start with goldmine ? it pays 5minute later, to me, it would make sensse for the player with the first wave to go max units to win the middle fight and get that 3 goldmine value for the team then he can go for a mine. its only seconds later you dont lose much gold but u win the mid for some time
One tip (from SC2): If you want to maximize your combat power, spend all your gold placing units before your wave is launched, then upgrade as they are already on their way. Upgrades affect existing units. I had a 75% win rate in SC2's Desert Strike btw. Also if capturing the mid income bonus is on the stake, prefer that over adding a gold mine. Never let go of mid dominance. Building a gold mine incurs an economic cost that might weaken your combat power enough for the opponent to win fights. On the other hand, if your opponent builds a gold mine and you didn't, you are likely to win, thus capture the mid and effectively have +1 gold mine for your team (+3 total). I recommend not building a gold mine before your first wave if you are the first or second player. You can build it right after they launch. I found out in SC2 (from half a decade ago) that building 3 gold mines (refineries) was more often a bad than a good move. It took very long to pay off, and usually that's the time frame where either side wins. And building a forth one was even worse. Being greedy is risky. However if you are behind and know you won't recover for a while, rushing the first or second gold mine should be ok. It may grant you a come-back opportunity later on, but it won't be easy.
SC2 direct strike has slightly different economy than wc3 direct strike and that's why you make your first goldmine instantly. In SC2 direct strike controlling mid gives a value of 2 refineries instead of 1(like in wc3 DS) so it's much more important to have middle controll than in SC2. Also, in wc3 DS waves spawn a bit less often than in SC2 and first wave always dies to the tower right before next players wave arrives so first wave spawn has 0 effect on who's gonna controll mid during the game. Last but not least, it's actually worth to not build anything at all for your first wave, because as I said, first waves have 0 impact on the later spawns. Meanwhile what you get by not building anything is that you can see what your opponent is opening with and immediately start building to counter. Summarize all of that and it turns out rushing first mine is quite good.
i have been experimenting on not having a gold mine as first player (not the second) It has pros and cons but very situational and very luck based. I lost my team games sometimes because of that. To be a competitive player you really need a lot of situational awareness. what would happen if you leak units? what kind of units u gonna leak? what would your teammate could do against them. This is very important. If your leaked unit gives an advantage against your teammate and your teammate doesn't have anything to counter that units advantage, this could result in a stacking loop where you even lose the whole game because of that. The first weave you don't have any amount of time to see and decide such tings. You either go for that opening and not and hope for the best. if ur opponent starts with a mine, you almost always guarantee winning the first round. Yes you basically die to tower, however it also allows 3rd player to click the hero upgrade earlier which could result an extra unit in time, based on their composition (or help for an extra support unit on second round) your opponent will have slightly more advantage against you after 5 minutes according to gold u spent on extra first weave units. No game lasts less then 5 minutes. This sometimes can be very disadvantageous due to mid game mechanics (like an extra fairy dragon against casters could sometimes deadly or disabling and may cost you mid control)
You inspired me to start playing! I haven't played wc3 since I was a little kid and I was never gonna learn all that micro but this is much more accessible
Only problem is now, if this actually blows up and the dev wants to make a stand alone game blizzard own's it now because of the EULA they implemented with reforged which sucks.
Blizzard doesn't own the idea, they own the assets. A lot of people, Grubby included, seem to not understand that part of the EULA. However, in this case, the particular wc3 dev that made the map doesn't own the idea, he just copied it from sc2 - says so in the description.
@@JJJBunney001 Are the devs the same people that made the SC2 custom? Because if not then they'd be stealing from SC2. They also can just make a game outside of WC3 as we have seen dozens of these cases already so idk what's the confusion there.
The reason they made reforged was to renege on the older Eula and make a new one that tells ppl all custom maps are owned by blizz 😂 Ofc, a serious judge would throw that out in the US. But the system is so corrupt you have to spend a lot of money to get that win.
It's consistently amazing how the various wc3 customs could be adapted by major studios into franchise titles. Island troll tribes x starwars, angel arena x lord of the rings, etc.
Hi Grubbs! This looks super fun and interesting! As a lover of custom maps (I basically never played melee) this looks right up my wheelhouse.
3 месяца назад+1
this map is awesome, i started playing because of your videos! you are sure very influential on the w3 community, to the point that people play awesome stuff just because you play
I think the original history of the game could have started all the way from around 2007-2008 with the map Castle Fight, which got ported to SC:BW and eventually got turned into Desert Strike (which I played way too much) and then ported to SC2 as Direct Strike, which got ported back to WC3. Yes, Direct Strike as a map originated from SC2 like Grubby said, but the WC3 version will always be better and it bothers me that SC2 will be credited as being the origin (I hate SC2, WC3 has better variety), when tug-of-war maps have existed way before SC2. Glad to see regardless more people playing this!
Not sure why you hate the SC2 version so much? I agree that the WC3 version having heroes is a unique spin on it and therefore maybe better variety? The SC2 version has like 5 modes though including mutations that are changed weekly and commander mode that has about 150 units that aren't standard Z/P/T. Certainly seems like more unit variety to me.
i have been eyeing grubbys stream several times watching him play this map abit and i almost logged in to try it, but this video does it gotta try it out after. also i used to play alot of the castle fight map so this one seems up my alley.
Grubby you would probably love Broken Alliances if you haven't already played it. I would really enjoy seeing you play it. Insane RTS with such a dedicated community and so many cool strategies
"This game mode is OVERTAKING WC3 1v1! " Yeah, for the same reason that DOTA overcame regular WC3 melee back in 2006-2009: because it is easier to learn and play. Grubby doesn't understand that the extreme difficulty of WC3 1 Vs 1 melee that appeals to us purists. I do like playing custom games too(especially Footmen Frenzy and Legion TD). But don't ever confuse it with the *real* WC3. That's where the real skill lies. I don't know if Grubby is pushing this narrative because he gave up trying to beat Happy(or whatever), but Wc3 melee is definitely the richer and more complex game.
Nobody says that those custom maps are more complex lmao(although dota has actually much more variables than wc3, wc3 is harder simply because of how much micro you need to manage whole army and multiple bases). Stop inhaling copium grandpa.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 What a dumb comment. I really wish RUclips would just auto-mute m0rO.n$ like you. WC3 is more complex than DOTA in *every* way. In fact, DOTA became popular back in the day because kids that got reckedt over and over in melee went play it. Imagine thinking that controlling 1 hero unit is harder than controlling up to 3 hero units + army + managing an economy.
Thank you for making this, I wanted to try direct strike after watching you play and I couldn't figure out how to play it on W3Champions. The drop down under Non-Melee was hard to spot for me.
I actually made this exact gamemode a few weeks ago in Age of Mythology without knowing about this one, great to see people like this kind of gamemode tho
I actually played this a bunch this weekend after watching you play it all week. Very fun mode but I wish that there were more viable alternative strats since it seems like rushing mass minions is just better than strong heroes
Direct Strike is also on SC2. But it's a bit different. You choose a commander instead of drafting unit packs. And each commander comes with their own units, upgrades and abilities. EDIT: I wrote too quickly. He also mentions this in the video.
My favorite part about direct strike is when I deviate slightly from the meta, seeing as this is a game designed for casual play, and always, one of my teammates will start insulting me and calling me an idiot. I don't know what kind of life a person has led for them to be gatekeeping the bottom rung of a game made for casual players, but it must be incredibly sad. Mute is !mute BTW, then you find the name on the list, say it's number 3 who's being pathetic, then type !mute 3
Grubby, this mode started in old starcraft game. Originally it was called desert strike. 15 years ago i was playing wuyh a guy callef QueenGambit. He created this mod
I played this same game 20 years ago with original Warcraft 3. The only difference here is that you can unit formation instead of just a clump that spawn in the same space.
it overtook starcraft, from a wc3 funmap (castle strike) to desert strike in sc2 to red tides ( indie game from the creators of wukong btw LOL!) back to a wc3 funmap .... Man and i was there for all of them!
I would love to play this but everything online has some level of toxicity that I find just unnecessary to expose myself to during my leisure time (I'll stick to offline games). So I love watching your videos because I get my nostalgic WC3 fix without interacting with the 'grubs' of the world.
Crazy that new banger game modes are still being created within warcraft 3. This game is probably the most influential game historically in the medium and it is crazy that this is still the case
Yeah, autobattlers were a thing for decades in both Brood War and Warcraft 3. Protect the Overmind - Protect the Lich King Desert Strike Castle Fight Civilisation Wars Blood Tournament
There used to be an older auto battler like this, it's been so long I can't remember the name of it but it was 6 v 6 with two lanes and a bunch of different tribes.
Always starting with a mine isn't recommended. Let's see what happens if you build a mine on round 1 as the first player, and what happens if you build only units on round 1 as the first player - for 30 seconds or so, you get more money from the mine, but you are already 150 gold behind. Then when the units fight in the middle, unless you are countered, your units win and your entire team has the same bonus for roughly the same time. Now we have the same problem with player 2, and then player 3. But the catch is, that whoever holds the mid has more advantage in consecutive rounds. So I would advise, as player 1, to build army first round, if you have some of the "good" meta units, otherwise - build a gold mine and build no army and tech for a good tier 2 unit, or a single unit, to see what your opponent has and try to counter it, or hope to get a free mid. For example - you are player 1 and build a mine and 2 footmen. Your opponent builds 4 footmen. What happens? You have more money than your opponent until the first fight, then you lose the fight and you have gained roughly 5 gold more than your opponent, hardly enough to matter, but your opponent has given that advantage to his 2 allies "for free". Then your opponent builds a gold mine in his "downtime" - the time when other people's armies spawn. Then you are at a disadvantage - your opponent has given his allies some gold, and has the momentum - you have to counter him now. And if all players on one side do this, by round 2, they have middle income, more units, and gold mines equal to yours. That is countered by niche "meta" units, which is kind of the downfall of the game - once you learn it, there are some units you build and some units you don't build. Also, thank you for bringing attention to this map, it is one of my favourites!
Also you didn't address the Ability AI button - if you click it you can choose which spells your units can use, and which they can't. It is quite useful. And there are also hero items in the shop, not only auras, and sometimes it can be quite nice to equip your hero with items, even though it is a noob trap 90% of the time. Also building a hero as soon as possible isn't as needed as you make it out to be, as the experience gained from units is quite low, and especially in the early waves, there is little chance your hero will level up fast enough to keep up with the raw power of building just army.
The first wave always dies to the tower before next wave can arrive so the first wave of all the players have literally 0 impact on who's gonna establish controll over mid.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 Once you cross the middle, you keep the bonus, until a unit of the enemy team crosses the middle and stays there, while no allied unit is in the enemy half. The only reason why you shouldn't build units early is being countered. Which depends a lot on luck, especially with draft. While units in early waves die easily to the tower, they apply pressure, which more often than not, is hard to counter, especially if the entire enemy team builds mine AND units. If they wait to see what you build, then they risk losing the tower, while losing money, so then it bounces back and you have to counter them again. If the build immediately a mine, and you don't, but opt to build your mine after your wave spawns, they have 99% of the time lost middle and you are roughly on the same ground in round 2, and you are better off in round 3.
@@krutokh9755 you never played wc3 version of this map did you? First waves are so small and tower is so tanky that even if one side has built absolutely no units first wave and on the other side all 3 players will skip first mine and all 3 of them will make as much units as possible, the tower will still be standing and will lose maybe 1/4 or at most 1/3 of it's HP. What you are saying makes sense in SC2 DS. Not Wc3 DS. These 2, altough made from the same general idea are balanced much differently and have different strong and bad strategies.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 The tower isn't as strong as you make it out to be, even though it is significantly tankier than the sc2 version. I remember a few days ago, when I had as first wave 4 footmen vs 1 huntress, the footmen managed to do about 200 hp dmg to the 1200 hp tower. But in any case it isn't about killing the tower quickly - it is about keeping mid income and having tempo.
Can someone please tell the Direct Strike players in Starcraft 2 what Grubby says here about being greedy and getting a mine instead of taking middle? I swear it's the bane of my existence there, teammates always rushing 4 mines and not having the army to even hold tower.
History overview: It started with SC BW's Desert Strike which then spawned Warcraft 3's Legion TD and Castle Fight. When SC2 came, Nexus war amalgamated all those idea and Direct Strike completed the formula, This is why its called Direct Strike, its the latest evolution of Desert Strike, but instead of building production buildings, you're directly building units. then in in the last couple of years, they recreated Direct Strike in WC3. Mechabellum took this idea and went stand alone. So its not really a ripoff, but more of rebuild for WC3's game enviornment.
Grubby. Very similar game mode but in SC2 called Desert Strike Legacy 2. Check it out. VERY fucking good autobattler. Very similar to this. I've been playing it for literally 14 years at this point ;)
Since i havent booted my WC3 up since...idk reforged launched and dissapointed? How exactly do you play that? I assume you download it somewhere put in some folder and play it like an custome map? Like DotA back in the day? Edit. Say that at the start, not 4 Minutes in ;_;
Ye it got added recently and pushed the full random mode away. I don't know if it replaced random mode in custom games(through wc3 client not the wc3champions one) tho because in custom maps versions there was always random and classic mode.
"You would play people same level as you" Well, kinda yes and kinda no. Then I started several months ago, I wasn't even ranked in mmr, as I not play 1vs1. And already got on high level mmr grinders, who shitting others for not playing "right", and panicked other loss of their precios mmr. And still got them every 2 or 3 games after.
On the map release and a for some time after - I was the best player, I played Human Alliance. I would often lose games for the two players I was playing with, finding a 1 VS 1 match was my priority, that rarely happened. My good play was mostly for I played a lot. Lazz had made amazing maps, one before Direct Strike, and its predecessor, was Desert Strike, similar but it looked poor and ugly, akin to my liking, community of xWizzard, streamer that has been, played it a lot on the release of first test versions, it was abandoned before it was released. I do not like Direct Strike. Of course that Dester Strike was made according to a StarCraft map.
No, it's not new but it's coming back in popularity now and it's receiving regular updates since. Old WC3 mods that inspired those in SC2 got wiped by Reforged so they unfortunately fell off.
it's not new but it just got more popular recently because it finally entered to wc3champions. Before your could only play it throuhg wc3 custom games directly.
Tried to play one of these games since it was all I read about in the W3 champions chat And holy shit the toxicity, I'm just not gonna do that again. Shame, because it looks fun.
One of the Top 1% to 3%-ish players here:
(no idea if anyone sees this, but)
Generally, everything what grubby said is pretty spot on. It gives you a good ground to work with. I have a few further tips for you, if you want:
A few pits that a lot of people fall into is trying to build very symmetrical, or fill out rows with a unit, etc.
while aesthetically pleasing, that most of the time is not really what you want to do.
First of all you want to counter anything that your opponent is doing, and then play to the strengths of your comp. That means if opponent is building 5 necros, building 3 or 4 spirit walkers or priests is enough to dispel that, I know the urge to fill out a row when it is 75% complete is huge, but try to resist!
Secondly: If you dont really feel like you can grasp when you have enough units for your weapon and armor upgrades, a general good line of thought is every 10-12 minutes.
Attack upgrade has higher priority, especially if youre on the opposite site of the map!
So getting 2-1 by minute 18-20 while youre pushing is a good example of what you might be going for.
Lastly I want to give you some very good easy advice, that can win/lose you games if you dont heed it:
If youre on the opposing site of the map, disable cyclone/polymorph/tornado as IT WILL LOSE YOU GAMES!
These spells are only good defending, and makes the defending team stack, no matter who casts it. You can disable / enable abilities with the "Ability AI" button on the bottom left, over the minimap.
Lastly, you can join the direct strike discord, where you can meet a lot of cool people. If you have any questiosn, feel free to hit us up!
I for one am always open to talk.
And most importantly: Have fun!
Oh and while I am at it.
ALWAYS have some form of Dispel in either T1 or T2. Else you can get screwed over pretty hard by Summons. It is also advised that you have at least one AoE dispel. In T3 you can have destroyers for example, in T2 Spirit Walker or Priest. If you dont get mass dispel, and they have Bloodlust, Frenzy, Necromancers, Curse, Spirit Link etc. then you will probably suffer a lot.
1 more tip, play custom on bnet to practice before u join w3c
@@alexanderromanov1587 oh yeah true. If you go directly into W3 champions youre probably gonna have a bad time haha. Just do like 3-5 matches on bnet first just to see everything
this is all good advice
why is it good to start with goldmine ?
it pays 5minute later,
to me, it would make sensse for the player with the first wave to go max units to win the middle fight and get that 3 goldmine value for the team
then he can go for a mine.
its only seconds later you dont lose much gold but u win the mid for some time
Custom game overtaking WC3 happened quite often.
ANd during my time, DoTA was born
One tip (from SC2): If you want to maximize your combat power, spend all your gold placing units before your wave is launched, then upgrade as they are already on their way. Upgrades affect existing units. I had a 75% win rate in SC2's Desert Strike btw.
Also if capturing the mid income bonus is on the stake, prefer that over adding a gold mine. Never let go of mid dominance. Building a gold mine incurs an economic cost that might weaken your combat power enough for the opponent to win fights. On the other hand, if your opponent builds a gold mine and you didn't, you are likely to win, thus capture the mid and effectively have +1 gold mine for your team (+3 total).
I recommend not building a gold mine before your first wave if you are the first or second player. You can build it right after they launch.
I found out in SC2 (from half a decade ago) that building 3 gold mines (refineries) was more often a bad than a good move. It took very long to pay off, and usually that's the time frame where either side wins. And building a forth one was even worse.
Being greedy is risky. However if you are behind and know you won't recover for a while, rushing the first or second gold mine should be ok. It may grant you a come-back opportunity later on, but it won't be easy.
SC2 direct strike has slightly different economy than wc3 direct strike and that's why you make your first goldmine instantly.
In SC2 direct strike controlling mid gives a value of 2 refineries instead of 1(like in wc3 DS) so it's much more important to have middle controll than in SC2.
Also, in wc3 DS waves spawn a bit less often than in SC2 and first wave always dies to the tower right before next players wave arrives so first wave spawn has 0 effect on who's gonna controll mid during the game.
Last but not least, it's actually worth to not build anything at all for your first wave, because as I said, first waves have 0 impact on the later spawns. Meanwhile what you get by not building anything is that you can see what your opponent is opening with and immediately start building to counter.
Summarize all of that and it turns out rushing first mine is quite good.
i have been experimenting on not having a gold mine as first player (not the second) It has pros and cons but very situational and very luck based. I lost my team games sometimes because of that. To be a competitive player you really need a lot of situational awareness. what would happen if you leak units? what kind of units u gonna leak? what would your teammate could do against them. This is very important. If your leaked unit gives an advantage against your teammate and your teammate doesn't have anything to counter that units advantage, this could result in a stacking loop where you even lose the whole game because of that. The first weave you don't have any amount of time to see and decide such tings. You either go for that opening and not and hope for the best.
if ur opponent starts with a mine, you almost always guarantee winning the first round. Yes you basically die to tower, however it also allows 3rd player to click the hero upgrade earlier which could result an extra unit in time, based on their composition (or help for an extra support unit on second round)
your opponent will have slightly more advantage against you after 5 minutes according to gold u spent on extra first weave units. No game lasts less then 5 minutes. This sometimes can be very disadvantageous due to mid game mechanics (like an extra fairy dragon against casters could sometimes deadly or disabling and may cost you mid control)
If people are playing this, then nice! I remember playing a lot of Desert Strike which eventually became Direct Strike in Starcraft 2
Its fun mode because you dont have to control all those units its just autochess chill
Desert Strike Legacy 2 is the better one than Direct Strike. But yesb
As lots of people have said, auto battlers like this arent new and this one especially was directly copied from SC2 amd its a shit load of fun
Desert Strike
@@Lmaokekw975 For real this shit is ancient at this point, broodwar custom maps did this in 2000
I bought W3reforged for this mode alone, I play warcraft with friends using game ranger still (we old school) but this got me finally
Why do I watch these videos, when I watch the stream every night ? XD
You inspired me to start playing! I haven't played wc3 since I was a little kid and I was never gonna learn all that micro but this is much more accessible
It would be cool if blizzard hadn’t broken the Mac version of their game
Sameeeee
How? Can you play this ?
I thought Mac stopped working because they stopped using power PC hardware architecture? Or did reforged work on modern macs but no longer does?
It would be cool if you would get an actual PC instead of supporting apple aka we restricting everything we can. 😂
@@RichyRich2607 enjoy your machine that constantly needs maintenance and breaks down
Only problem is now, if this actually blows up and the dev wants to make a stand alone game blizzard own's it now because of the EULA they implemented with reforged which sucks.
Blizzard doesn't own the idea, they own the assets. A lot of people, Grubby included, seem to not understand that part of the EULA. However, in this case, the particular wc3 dev that made the map doesn't own the idea, he just copied it from sc2 - says so in the description.
@@sbonel3224 This type of style of game was a thing back when DOTA was a thing in custom maps.
It's super popular in SC2 and has been around for years, so they'd be stealing it from themselves? 😂
@@JJJBunney001 Are the devs the same people that made the SC2 custom? Because if not then they'd be stealing from SC2. They also can just make a game outside of WC3 as we have seen dozens of these cases already so idk what's the confusion there.
Legion TD was/is a big mod in Warcraft 3, They still were able to release Legion TD as a Standalone game on Steam.
Reminds me of Castle Fight, one of my all time favourite custom games
its honestly a concept map that could be turned into its own game like dota xD
@@LW_4226 they dont, because this comes originally from SC2
This genre of game already exists so we wont have the same problems and struggles
The reason they made reforged was to renege on the older Eula and make a new one that tells ppl all custom maps are owned by blizz 😂
Ofc, a serious judge would throw that out in the US. But the system is so corrupt you have to spend a lot of money to get that win.
There is one already very simliar, called Legion TD
It's consistently amazing how the various wc3 customs could be adapted by major studios into franchise titles. Island troll tribes x starwars, angel arena x lord of the rings, etc.
Hi Grubbs!
This looks super fun and interesting! As a lover of custom maps (I basically never played melee) this looks right up my wheelhouse.
this map is awesome, i started playing because of your videos! you are sure very influential on the w3 community, to the point that people play awesome stuff just because you play
I think the original history of the game could have started all the way from around 2007-2008 with the map Castle Fight, which got ported to SC:BW and eventually got turned into Desert Strike (which I played way too much) and then ported to SC2 as Direct Strike, which got ported back to WC3.
Yes, Direct Strike as a map originated from SC2 like Grubby said, but the WC3 version will always be better and it bothers me that SC2 will be credited as being the origin (I hate SC2, WC3 has better variety), when tug-of-war maps have existed way before SC2. Glad to see regardless more people playing this!
Not sure why you hate the SC2 version so much? I agree that the WC3 version having heroes is a unique spin on it and therefore maybe better variety? The SC2 version has like 5 modes though including mutations that are changed weekly and commander mode that has about 150 units that aren't standard Z/P/T. Certainly seems like more unit variety to me.
@@Edward-d5f ...who is hating? LOL
Castle Fight was so much fun. There was a lot of ragequitting though, like most WC3 custom maps.
i have been eyeing grubbys stream several times watching him play this map abit and i almost logged in to try it, but this video does it gotta try it out after.
also i used to play alot of the castle fight map so this one seems up my alley.
Quite similar to Nexus Wars in SC2, which I enjoyed a lot.
more like 'direct strike' in sc2... (sc2 has this exact arcade format with a single lane of wave spawns 3v3)
Grubby you would probably love Broken Alliances if you haven't already played it. I would really enjoy seeing you play it. Insane RTS with such a dedicated community and so many cool strategies
"This game mode is OVERTAKING WC3 1v1! " Yeah, for the same reason that DOTA overcame regular WC3 melee back in 2006-2009: because it is easier to learn and play.
Grubby doesn't understand that the extreme difficulty of WC3 1 Vs 1 melee that appeals to us purists. I do like playing custom games too(especially Footmen Frenzy and Legion TD). But don't ever confuse it with the *real* WC3. That's where the real skill lies.
I don't know if Grubby is pushing this narrative because he gave up trying to beat Happy(or whatever), but Wc3 melee is definitely the richer and more complex game.
Nobody says that those custom maps are more complex lmao(although dota has actually much more variables than wc3, wc3 is harder simply because of how much micro you need to manage whole army and multiple bases).
Stop inhaling copium grandpa.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 What a dumb comment. I really wish RUclips would just auto-mute m0rO.n$ like you. WC3 is more complex than DOTA in *every* way. In fact, DOTA became popular back in the day because kids that got reckedt over and over in melee went play it. Imagine thinking that controlling 1 hero unit is harder than controlling up to 3 hero units + army + managing an economy.
I do agree 100% with you, these modes attract more newbies because there is no skill but the fun is what matters, real wc3 is still on top
"purists" lmao
Thank you for making this, I wanted to try direct strike after watching you play and I couldn't figure out how to play it on W3Champions. The drop down under Non-Melee was hard to spot for me.
The exact guide I needed. Ty Grubstor!
I actually made this exact gamemode a few weeks ago in Age of Mythology without knowing about this one, great to see people like this kind of gamemode tho
Bro I am still awake after playing it all night. Saw you play it. Fell in love over the weekend. It is crackk cocaine!!!
So this is what castle fight evolved into? Cool
Archer Wars was my first step into this type of same in AoE2. Footmen Frenzy was amazing in wc3.
I actually played this a bunch this weekend after watching you play it all week. Very fun mode but I wish that there were more viable alternative strats since it seems like rushing mass minions is just better than strong heroes
because of your first direct strike video it got me to download w3c and download all the different patches of the map from bnet
That accually seems epic, i gotta try it. Thank you mr streamer! :D
i wanted to ask for a beginners guide in your stream and here we are. LUL
hope for a legionTD guide too next year. xD
Direct Strike is also on SC2. But it's a bit different. You choose a commander instead of drafting unit packs. And each commander comes with their own units, upgrades and abilities.
EDIT: I wrote too quickly. He also mentions this in the video.
My favorite part about direct strike is when I deviate slightly from the meta, seeing as this is a game designed for casual play, and always, one of my teammates will start insulting me and calling me an idiot.
I don't know what kind of life a person has led for them to be gatekeeping the bottom rung of a game made for casual players, but it must be incredibly sad.
Mute is !mute BTW, then you find the name on the list, say it's number 3 who's being pathetic, then type !mute 3
I play a lot of Direct Strike on SC2. Good relaxing timewaster with minimal APM. It's also the most popular arcade game on SC2.
Grubby, this mode started in old starcraft game. Originally it was called desert strike. 15 years ago i was playing wuyh a guy callef QueenGambit. He created this mod
Love this mode sm sm thanks for the guide!!!
Grubbyyy thanks for actually explaining how to JOIN the game
Man this game mode has been around under different names since the dawn of time
I played this same game 20 years ago with original Warcraft 3. The only difference here is that you can unit formation instead of just a clump that spawn in the same space.
Love the custom maps. Never got into the actual game. Don’t even know a build order, but I’ve been playing since the game came out.
This looks like a really fun version of the sc2 game! I will try it :)
Looks pretty good. Seems to need polishing but it could turn into a completely new game like it happened with dota and autochess
it overtook starcraft, from a wc3 funmap (castle strike) to desert strike in sc2 to red tides ( indie game from the creators of wukong btw LOL!) back to a wc3 funmap .... Man and i was there for all of them!
I'd say it's time for a unit tier list for this map!
Thank you my dude 😊
So a clash royale type of gameplay. Interesting that they implemented like this.
@4:30 Grubby discusses how to play the game: i.e. game client set-up, need for Warcraft 3: Reforged™, etc.
i'm guessing this is from desert strike in broodwar (also kinda like castle fight).
yes. Direct strike in SC2 got inspired by desert strike in BW and wc3 direct strike was inpired by sc2 direct strike
I would love to play this but everything online has some level of toxicity that I find just unnecessary to expose myself to during my leisure time (I'll stick to offline games). So I love watching your videos because I get my nostalgic WC3 fix without interacting with the 'grubs' of the world.
Can you mute people? I mostly play HOTS, started playing WC3 again lately. In HOTS I just turn off in game chat and you can avoid internet bullies
Crazy that new banger game modes are still being created within warcraft 3. This game is probably the most influential game historically in the medium and it is crazy that this is still the case
This mode is quite old actually. It's just that only recently it got added to wc3champions so only now it got more popular.
Yeah, autobattlers were a thing for decades in both Brood War and Warcraft 3.
Protect the Overmind - Protect the Lich King
Desert Strike
Castle Fight
Civilisation Wars
Blood Tournament
Been playing Direct strike since 8 months back atleast, its just a really nice custom map
Custom maps were the heart of wc3!
This game reminds me of my childhood game battlepillars
Would be cool if they added more units, hero's and items to this mode!
Love this guide
You should put timestamp to video like this.
Love your content!
This is just like DotA Allstars all over again. 😅 (Overtaking Wc3 Melee in popularity)
Grubby, you playing this mod is what made me buy wc3 reforged... Blizzard should pay you a percentage of every copy of wc3 sold at this point xD
So you can play this game if you buy wc3 reforged? Does it work out of the box?
There used to be an older auto battler like this, it's been so long I can't remember the name of it but it was 6 v 6 with two lanes and a bunch of different tribes.
It reminds me of castle wars!
Yes, castle fight, it was super similar to this
You could even compare it with Civilization Wars. Another auto battler with a creative twist.
I remember playing a starcraft map just like this
Always starting with a mine isn't recommended. Let's see what happens if you build a mine on round 1 as the first player, and what happens if you build only units on round 1 as the first player - for 30 seconds or so, you get more money from the mine, but you are already 150 gold behind. Then when the units fight in the middle, unless you are countered, your units win and your entire team has the same bonus for roughly the same time. Now we have the same problem with player 2, and then player 3. But the catch is, that whoever holds the mid has more advantage in consecutive rounds. So I would advise, as player 1, to build army first round, if you have some of the "good" meta units, otherwise - build a gold mine and build no army and tech for a good tier 2 unit, or a single unit, to see what your opponent has and try to counter it, or hope to get a free mid. For example - you are player 1 and build a mine and 2 footmen. Your opponent builds 4 footmen. What happens? You have more money than your opponent until the first fight, then you lose the fight and you have gained roughly 5 gold more than your opponent, hardly enough to matter, but your opponent has given that advantage to his 2 allies "for free". Then your opponent builds a gold mine in his "downtime" - the time when other people's armies spawn. Then you are at a disadvantage - your opponent has given his allies some gold, and has the momentum - you have to counter him now. And if all players on one side do this, by round 2, they have middle income, more units, and gold mines equal to yours. That is countered by niche "meta" units, which is kind of the downfall of the game - once you learn it, there are some units you build and some units you don't build. Also, thank you for bringing attention to this map, it is one of my favourites!
Also you didn't address the Ability AI button - if you click it you can choose which spells your units can use, and which they can't. It is quite useful. And there are also hero items in the shop, not only auras, and sometimes it can be quite nice to equip your hero with items, even though it is a noob trap 90% of the time. Also building a hero as soon as possible isn't as needed as you make it out to be, as the experience gained from units is quite low, and especially in the early waves, there is little chance your hero will level up fast enough to keep up with the raw power of building just army.
The first wave always dies to the tower before next wave can arrive so the first wave of all the players have literally 0 impact on who's gonna establish controll over mid.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 Once you cross the middle, you keep the bonus, until a unit of the enemy team crosses the middle and stays there, while no allied unit is in the enemy half. The only reason why you shouldn't build units early is being countered. Which depends a lot on luck, especially with draft. While units in early waves die easily to the tower, they apply pressure, which more often than not, is hard to counter, especially if the entire enemy team builds mine AND units. If they wait to see what you build, then they risk losing the tower, while losing money, so then it bounces back and you have to counter them again. If the build immediately a mine, and you don't, but opt to build your mine after your wave spawns, they have 99% of the time lost middle and you are roughly on the same ground in round 2, and you are better off in round 3.
@@krutokh9755 you never played wc3 version of this map did you? First waves are so small and tower is so tanky that even if one side has built absolutely no units first wave and on the other side all 3 players will skip first mine and all 3 of them will make as much units as possible, the tower will still be standing and will lose maybe 1/4 or at most 1/3 of it's HP.
What you are saying makes sense in SC2 DS. Not Wc3 DS. These 2, altough made from the same general idea are balanced much differently and have different strong and bad strategies.
@@krzysztofputerko1943 The tower isn't as strong as you make it out to be, even though it is significantly tankier than the sc2 version. I remember a few days ago, when I had as first wave 4 footmen vs 1 huntress, the footmen managed to do about 200 hp dmg to the 1200 hp tower. But in any case it isn't about killing the tower quickly - it is about keeping mid income and having tempo.
Have you tried "castle fight"? It's also very fun.
Modern wc3 bnet Castle Fight!! pogchamp
Custom games are what's keeping WC3 alive.
nah wc3 ladder is still very popular and there are weekly tornaments always
Small question if we are losing too bad after lost shall I get mines ? Like 3? Other wise I think we would just lose anyways due to short income
"Do as I say not as I do" 😂😂😂😂😂
Can someone please tell the Direct Strike players in Starcraft 2 what Grubby says here about being greedy and getting a mine instead of taking middle? I swear it's the bane of my existence there, teammates always rushing 4 mines and not having the army to even hold tower.
So basically like that old starcraft 2 gamemode.. sounds great 😊
And even older Starcraft Brood War Desert Strike :D
@@TheHalogen131 damn i didnt even know that 😅
Going blind hero or wave 2 hero is way too early and calls to be countered hard, or to have the wrong hero
so basically castle fight with heros ?
i think castle fight UI and map was more appealing
Not gonna lie, I actually had no idea people played custom games through w3champions
Is it still possible to get a hold of the original WCIII?
Now i have to ask how does this direct strike correlate to SC2 direct strike? Which one is the ripoff?
History overview:
It started with SC BW's Desert Strike
which then spawned Warcraft 3's Legion TD and Castle Fight.
When SC2 came, Nexus war amalgamated all those idea and Direct Strike completed the formula, This is why its called Direct Strike, its the latest evolution of Desert Strike, but instead of building production buildings, you're directly building units.
then in in the last couple of years, they recreated Direct Strike in WC3.
Mechabellum took this idea and went stand alone.
So its not really a ripoff, but more of rebuild for WC3's game enviornment.
@@GIIToTIIG
Most interesting, thanks for the insight
Grubby. Very similar game mode but in SC2 called Desert Strike Legacy 2. Check it out. VERY fucking good autobattler. Very similar to this. I've been playing it for literally 14 years at this point ;)
Since i havent booted my WC3 up since...idk reforged launched and dissapointed?
How exactly do you play that?
I assume you download it somewhere put in some folder and play it like an custome map? Like DotA back in the day?
Edit. Say that at the start, not 4 Minutes in ;_;
can you try vampirism fire?
Hey Grubby what are your thoughts on your influence on the player base moving to DS? 1v1 is kinda dead.
Where'd the graph come from at 0:52 ?
W3champions play stats
Is the draft a new feature? I've never seen Grubby choose these before. I thought all units were completely random.
Ye it got added recently and pushed the full random mode away. I don't know if it replaced random mode in custom games(through wc3 client not the wc3champions one) tho because in custom maps versions there was always random and classic mode.
This reminds me of Hero Line Wars
How do u apply the items from shop to your hero
Have you played risk custom map in wc3
I even considered buying WC3R just to play this map alone... (Lost my copy of the old WC3, very sad.)
To be fair, i spamed this mode on Starcraft II
"You would play people same level as you"
Well, kinda yes and kinda no. Then I started several months ago, I wasn't even ranked in mmr, as I not play 1vs1. And already got on high level mmr grinders, who shitting others for not playing "right", and panicked other loss of their precios mmr. And still got them every 2 or 3 games after.
I play this custom game on starcraft 2 every day, weekly brawl is the best
On the map release and a for some time after - I was the best player, I played Human Alliance. I would often lose games for the two players I was playing with, finding a 1 VS 1 match was my priority, that rarely happened. My good play was mostly for I played a lot. Lazz had made amazing maps, one before Direct Strike, and its predecessor, was Desert Strike, similar but it looked poor and ugly, akin to my liking, community of xWizzard, streamer that has been, played it a lot on the release of first test versions, it was abandoned before it was released. I do not like Direct Strike. Of course that Dester Strike was made according to a StarCraft map.
This is a popular sc2 mod. Is this mod actually new in wc3?
No, it's not new but it's coming back in popularity now and it's receiving regular updates since. Old WC3 mods that inspired those in SC2 got wiped by Reforged so they unfortunately fell off.
@@k.e.v.2011 wasn't desert strike already in sc1 before wc3?
@@halqthedarktemplar it was, desert strike was inspiration for SC2 direct strike and SC2 direct strike was inspiration for wc3 direct strike
it's not new but it just got more popular recently because it finally entered to wc3champions. Before your could only play it throuhg wc3 custom games directly.
Don’t let Blizzard to know they gonna patent it to avoid dota drama again 😂
OrkaBellum is a cool game mode
Do we have to own warcraft 3 to play this version?
Cant wait for Riot games to steal this idea too!
Try SC2 Direct Strike
looks like castle fight. played that 15 years ago.
Heh, I can tell you right now this game mode or map did not start in SC2, this actually dates back to WarCraft 2.
You never mentioned the economic damage the shade does :(
You should defenetly look at Castle Fight
I downloaded W3champions but when i start it say failed to launch warcraft 3 how to fix this??
Wish we could move multiple units at once.
I'd love to play it mate, but WC3 ain't launching with MAC 😭
so it's castle fight?
better
Tried to play one of these games since it was all I read about in the W3 champions chat
And holy shit the toxicity, I'm just not gonna do that again. Shame, because it looks fun.