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For those still who didn't get the message of the story, Ellie was not on a rampage to avenge Joel, but it was the anger she felt towards Abby that she(Abby) took away her(Ellie) chance on forgiving Joel. The anger Ellie felt was the unexpressed love she never got a chance to show or will show towards Joel.
@@jeongminkim4409 What's even worse is she doesn't care that Marlene or other Fireflies died. She's just felling sorry for herself that she didn't die.
@@jeongminkim4409 Well she grew up without parents or any familial figure. To her Joel is the first time shes ever had a parental figure so I can see why she acts this way.
Gojira Fan HD She’s not sorry that she didn’t die she’s sorry that she wasn’t able to create a cure even if it would’ve killed her she wanted to save lives I’m not saying that if I was Joel I’d do anything differently but Ellie has a good reason to be mad and the fireflies wouldn’t have died if Joel didn’t save her anyways bruh
“If somehow the lord gave me a second chance at that moment...I would do it all over again.” Joel loves her so fucking much and he did not deserve what he got 😭😭😭
@@Z50nemesis Nah bro they did Joel dirty…and I fucking loved it like yes I love Joel and I don’t regret a damn thing I did while playing as him but people have to accept that there’s always another side of the story.
@@Z50nemesisthey're not missing the point, Joel didn't deserve that, no one deserves that, the game frames Joel's death as a tragedy for everyone involved. It's completely understandable why Abby's group did that to him but it doesn't justify it nor is it deserving.
joel was in so much pain when ellie said she could never forgive him for what he did.. that part almost made me cry and its the first time ive ever nearly cried playing a game. it sucks that ellie never got to forgive him
I like how these characters are very believable down to the smallest of details. Joel once said that he really misses coffee in the first game. And we see him in the second game finally drinking it again.
such amazingly written dialogue is not easy to come by, this is up there as one of the best conversation scene i've ever seen in any media ever. tears start rolling down my eyes every time i rewatch this, and you dont need to know how much i cried the first time i watched it. every line, bears more then what it seems on the surface, even Joel's quirky remarks of "I'm a little embarrassed as to what i had to trade to get it (coffee), but it's not bad", is a subtle way of Joel telling Ellie he knew what he did was wrong, and what he traded to get this happiness he has had with Ellie by his side for the last 4 years. even better is the context. prior to this scene we did not know it even existed, we did not know that Ellie came over to Joel's house late that night to talk with him. Ellie has not been able to talk to Joel for probably about a year since she learned the truth about Joel's choice. if this scene did not exist, the last time Joel and Ellie spoke to each other before Joel died the next morning, would have been the bar scene, when Joel stepped in to stop the angry bar owner from harassing Ellie and Dina, to which Ellie disapprove cause Joel is once against interfering with Ellie's life when she can already handle herself. and angrily she yelled at Joel: "I dont need your fucking help!". just imagine, how tragic that would have been for Joel, to think that the last words your "daughter", your 2nd chance, said to you before you die, is she didn't need you and hate you. but it wasn't, thanks to the fact that Ellie did came over to Joel's house later that night, it showed she didnt really mean what she said, she understood Joel, even though he did something terrible, it was all because he loved her, and Ellie has taken the first step in mending the bonds between them. "I would like to try (to forgive)..." means deep down in her heart she already has. and at the very least, in that last moment before Joel is gone from this world, he opened his eyes and saw Ellie before him, still trying to save him, and knowing... she loves him too.
The problem with The Last of Us 2, is that there are stories for 2 games there! I would be much more pleased if The Last of Us 2 were entirely over the 5 years before Joel's death! Then we could get to know Abby well, understand her motivations, see Joel and Ellie's relationship grow, fall apart and have a spark of hope that is shown in this scene ... and at the end of the game it would be Abby killing Joel! So only on the third one we would see this confrontation between Ellie and Abby and what it all cost them both!
That's a good idea when I played at first I wanted revenge then overtime my anger die downed and then I played ws abby and I started to like her but a part of me still hated her cause of killing joel then when ellie is at the farm I wanted her to let it go for her sake. Then when it ended I felt mad she didnt kill her but glad she let go of hate so she could be open to love but lost everything learning that lesson and is now alone
aashrith madagiri the flashbacks don’t give us what we want they only patch up the missing pieces no one who plays the game will get attached to a new character who kills the Main character if the game would’ve made us attached to abby earlier then maybe more people would feel where she’s coming from but since we are mostly attached to Joel and Ellie we would obviously take their side over some new character who we didn’t know anything about
But that‘s not what ND envisioned, they wanted you to hate Abby and see if you can get over your hate by seeing that Abby is not a bad person and was just consumed by hatred, just like all the people are right now that are doing that witch hunt, which is kinda funny tbh
@@JustCauseFan after the ending i liked the game and understood what it was trying to say to me but nevertheless i hated abby so much i didnt even collect everything...at the end it was a nice game but literally the whole abby campagne is lost.
her leaving the guitar and sparing abby speaks volumes to her forgiveness for Joel. Instead of lingering on what he did, she lets go of all of it whether it be the guitar or abby, she let go. Her main source of pain came from not forgiving Joel, and she thought that ‘justice’ for joel would alleviate that guilt and anger. Instead she only indulged in the worst parts of him rather than remembering the most important parts of him. I find the games ending to be so profound and really add a new sense of depth between their relationship even though joel is dead. Ellie’s resilience to forgive him and let go of the pain he caused her is just so beautiful.
I’m just glad they had Joel day he would do it again. I was afraid they would completely destroy his character by having him be remorseful which is not Joel.
I mean, the games were never saying that what Joel did at the end of the first game was the “right” thing. It’s the same writer here as the first game, he’s not “destroying” his own characters. If it wasn’t for Neil there wouldn’t BE a Joel in the first place. This game is just solidifying the original creator’s view on the events of the last game, it’s not changing anything. I fully understand why Joel did what he did, so does the game, but he very clearly did a questionable thing. He rid the world of a cure to save Ellie. It’s not like Ellie didn’t want to die for the cure in the first game but now she wanted to, she’s always been like this
@@jw1714 They know what most people wanted but they also knew that people wanted a generic cliche story. They could easily go with the safe route and make a generic cliche game but they had the balls to do their OWN game and not a game that the general public wanted.
@@spbspb2413 There’s a reason the best parts of the game are the flashbacks with Ellie and Joel together. Chemistry, and actual depth to characters. Having Abby and her friends force fed down our throats with little to no story building on most of her friends that get killed and I’m supposed to feel sorry for them? No...sorry that doesn’t take balls, that takes a bunch of yes men and few bad decisions.
It doesn't help that she has poor character development that is also irrelevant to the overall story between Ellie and her. It's just a cheap thrown together side story to try and get you to feel bad for her despite her unforgivable act to kill Joel.
Honestly the genius of the story in that Ellie never getting to reconcile properly with Joel leads her to recklessly endanger her life after he'd sacrificed everything to save her and the guilt and anger not only at Abby, but at herself for not forgiving him and moving on and like him, one angry action led to her losing him and having no way to get him back so she tries to purge herself of the guilt by getting revenge. The fact druckman was willing to do this and throw two of gamings most loved characters on the fire to make such an incredibly impacting story takes enormous balls.
This game really shows you the best part of TLOU storyline is the bond between Joel and Ellie. When you strip the game of that for an overwhelming majority of the game, it becomes immediately absent of emotional connection. I guess Ellie and Dina’s bond was nice, but even that, we barely got for half the game.
Amen, Joel and Ellie’s bond is what they should’ve focused on instead they ruined there chances of milking this serious and got rid of the best thing they had going from the previous game
I mean, this game is still ultimately about Joel and Ellie’s relationship. Much of it works symbolically to represent that. Abby mirrors Joel in more ways than one, and Ellie forgiving Abby is ultimately the way that she finally forgives Joel. It’s still about Joel and Ellie, just not in the way you’d expect
The last of us part 2 in my opinion has an amazing story, it tells of how someone was torn apart by revenge, it isn’t that “revenge is bad,”, it’s what it costed her that is bad. But yeah it’s probably just a bad story and I’m a fanboy for liking it. Of course we are entitled to our own opinion, but being angry over Joel’s death is just stupid, I am very sad but I’m not angry because of it.
@@gamblorrr I kinda like how they let him let his guard down, to me it felt like he grown more as a person to try to help more people. That being said I think the way it happened was a bit much Instead of saying "it seems like you all have heard that name" He looked at Tommy and started to draw a gun and then get shot would be much better of a sence than what happened
The worst of it is that ELLIE was the one who engaged in a relationship with Joel. She TRIES to get his affection, he was passive all the time, while she was the one who wanted to be something more to Joel in the first game. And She did conquered him, and became his daughter. And as time goes, she becomes to mean so much for Joel that, for him, there would be no world without her... and hearing these words out of her mouth is just so painful.
I don’t know why but this scene doesn’t feel like a memory it feels like Joel is some angel now talking to Ellie when he was sitting and playing guitar
I just wish this was the whole game about what happened the bonding of Joel and Ellie and eventually she will learn what really happened and then she will ran away and try to find them by herself. Then Joel obviously have to find her then boom he has to meet new zombies, have to fight more gangs and then eventually when he finally found Ellie *arguments and all that shit*. Then she will have to accept Joel's decision then come back, and there's a good or bad ending. Either Joel got bit and asked Ellie to finish him off or they would go back to Jackson's and just forget the whole shit happened and pretend this sequel never existed
Steph Aves yeah Ellie literally said she planned to watch a movie with Joel that night but little did she know he would be gone before then sad we never got to see them patch things up
MPkidd facts I’m just happy they atleast had a little closure at the end and atleast Joel knows that Ellie would forgive him and that she cares for him
They could never make another last of us game and I would be satisfied solely because of this scene, its heartbreaking but perfectly sums up Ellie's journey throughout this game. 10/10
I don't think Ellie went to Joel to try to forgive him at first but after he tells her that he would do it all over again even though he knows that will drive Ellie away from him, she realises how deeply Joel loves her, that he is willing to throw their relationship away so that Ellie can live and have a meaningful life that isn't just defined by her immunity. That's when Ellie decides that she wants to begin the process of forgiving him. So Ellie leaving for seattle and her attempt to avenge Joel is a complicated feeling of guilt and never having the chance to say thank you to Joel for allowing her to live and experience the adversity of life, the feeling of love (Ellie and Dina at the dance), and the unforgettable moments she shared with Joel (musuem flashback).
She didn't forgive Abby tho. She may have let her go but that's only because she realized killing Abby wasn't going to solve anything other than cause each of them pain. She walked away with the acceptance that he was gone, allowing for grief to finally set in. The game is about anger and the pain that you inflict upon yourself and others around when you pursue revenge. Not forgiveness because nobody was really forgiven. If anything, it was an unspoken mutual agreement at least where they both hope they never see each other again.
If we can forgive joel who is a monster in the eyes of the world for his actions what’s stopping us from forgiving Abby for an arguably less heinous act
Okay I have to confess. I hate the game but all the scenes with Ellie and Joel I love. Easily best part of the game and the only sequel worthy scenes. In my opinion at least. Hopefully others can notice those scenes at least when thrashing the rest of the game.
It would have been so much more satisfying to see more of Joel and Ellie’s relationship as she tries to forgive him. Then after all that rebuilding of their relationship, Abby comes in for revenge. It would have made the circumstances around Joel’s death more interesting and more emotionally impactful.
In my opinion, that would not have worked. You see, right after Joel's death, we see Tommy trying to convince Ellie not to leave Jackson in search of Abby. He's trying to cope with his brothers death in a healthy way, but Ellie is incapable of doing the same 'cause she was taken the chance to rebuild the relation with Joel in a brutal way, and the trauma drives her to seek revenge. If they had gotten the time to heal emotionally and live a few more years together, Ellie would have had enough reasons (Dina, Maria, the community) to not leave and carry on with her life. Changing the events would kill the game's soul porpoise of existing.
I will take the Joel telling the truth as cannon but the rest of the game and Joel’s death never happened. I think Joel tells Ellie the truth and then Ellie eventually forgives him and they live in Jackson in peace.
Its crazy how every scene joel is in(except for the golf scene)is amazing but everything else is either trash or boring and sometimes just flat out disgusting(like that abby sex scene)
It’s funny how the game wants you to hate Joel and feel emotional for Ellie and Abby but the only sad scene is Joel’s death and when Ellie embarrassed Joel in the dance
ellie bite abby so my teory she will get a new kind of infection and he need to find ellie get a new cure cause thi new infection will change everthing
God I loved the moments with Joel and Ellie, except the Winter Dance moment, Ellie was being a cunt. Just serves as a reminder that what made TLOU great was the bond between these two. With it being absent (except for flashbacks) in this game, it killed it.
But that’s the whole point of the game, Joel lied to her in first game. They can’t have a good relationship. This is not a Disney story. Where everything is happily ever after. It actually explains how life is.
Ellie was mad because she felt like her life didn’t matter to anyone and that dying would help save lives and something such as what happened to her friend Riley wouldn’t happen to others but she realized her life did matter when Joel said he would do it again she realized her life mattered to Joel, Dina, Jessie etc
甲斐 She wasn’t going to die for nothing she was gonna die for a possible cure that’s why she was mad Joel just did what anyone who loves someone would do and stopped it
甲斐 yeah but a cure would atleast have saved some lives and in the end Ellie forgave Joel because she realized people cared about her life more than a cure
Joel saved Ellie's life, gave her a family, friends, a stable life, loved her as a daughter of blood. And in return he gained ingratitude and a miserable "I will try to forgive you". Very disappointing what she became in Part II.
The moment she embarrassed joel when he defended her aftont of all the ppls . I Dont Need your fucking help joel . I felt fucking sad for a man who sacrificed everything for her treated like trash im glad dina left her ass all alone like she did to joel . What a fucking bad writing
Can’t you see from Ellie’s prospective ? How would you feel if you knew you were special and were going to save millions of lives but only to be lied that you weren’t special by the only one you cared about. Joel lied to Ellie multiple times until she found the truth herself. Yes Joel only did that because he cared for her but in someways he only saved Ellie for himself as he could not risk losing another person. The fact she was angry at joel is what makes her human, she isn’t someone who forgives anyone instantly for lying to them for 4 years.
@@kinderjoy278 Why or how does she still have faith in humanity? She saw that humans were the bigger problem than infected in the first game, her trauma came from being ambushed by hunters, Joel getting impaled to deliver her to the Fireflies, and David nearly raping her. *Is this girl really that stupid to feel hate towards Joel if he was able to give her so many memories?*
That's mainly what it was, at first it wanted you to hate Abby, then sort of feel concerned about Ellie then hate Abby again then feel sympathy for both characters at the end. But most people weren't buying it and hated Abby regardless and rooted for Ellie no matter Abby's backstory.
I hate Ellie, so they succeeded. Abby, i kinda hater her, but still don't care about her at all so it doesn't impact me as much. I liked Ellie when she was 14, now she's a bitch.
Noobmaster 69 exactly the doctor didn’t even need to die the writing is weird Joel could’ve beat the doctor without killing him and not even using any weapons if he wanted also the doctor put his life on the line knowing he had no chance against Joel
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For those still who didn't get the message of the story, Ellie was not on a rampage to avenge Joel, but it was the anger she felt towards Abby that she(Abby) took away her(Ellie) chance on forgiving Joel. The anger Ellie felt was the unexpressed love she never got a chance to show or will show towards Joel.
"but i'd like to try it" absolutely brokes my heart
Honestly all the flashback scenes of Joel and Ellie were the best parts of Last of Us 2.
Soo. Shes forgive him??? Because joels story musnt end like this 😣😣😣
They are meant to be the best of the game
Would be great to see a game about the 4yrs between the 2 games. With Joel and Ellie being the main focus together again.
That, and Jesse… ugh, the potential.
@@thesamuraiman I would like that but ellie spent most of the time angry at joel
my heart aches every time ellie says a bad word to Joel
Poor Joel 😔
Ellie was such a big jerk to Joel even though we understand why. She really needs to get over it and move on.
@@jeongminkim4409 What's even worse is she doesn't care that Marlene or other Fireflies died. She's just felling sorry for herself that she didn't die.
@@jeongminkim4409 Well she grew up without parents or any familial figure. To her Joel is the first time shes ever had a parental figure so I can see why she acts this way.
Gojira Fan HD She’s not sorry that she didn’t die she’s sorry that she wasn’t able to create a cure even if it would’ve killed her she wanted to save lives I’m not saying that if I was Joel I’d do anything differently but Ellie has a good reason to be mad and the fireflies wouldn’t have died if Joel didn’t save her anyways bruh
“If somehow the lord gave me a second chance at that moment...I would do it all over again.”
Joel loves her so fucking much and he did not deserve what he got 😭😭😭
he did , you're probably missing the point here
@@Z50nemesis correct
Just because people can sympathize with him doesn't mean he should walk away free of consequences, tho.
@@Z50nemesis Nah bro they did Joel dirty…and I fucking loved it like yes I love Joel and I don’t regret a damn thing I did while playing as him but people have to accept that there’s always another side of the story.
@@Z50nemesisthey're not missing the point, Joel didn't deserve that, no one deserves that, the game frames Joel's death as a tragedy for everyone involved. It's completely understandable why Abby's group did that to him but it doesn't justify it nor is it deserving.
I love how even though he's desperate for her forgivness he refuses to apologise to her saying he doesn't regret saving her
2:59 that was easily the most powerful line in the entire game i get goose bumps every time i hear it
The title of the song that Joel was playing is Helplessly Hoping by Crosby, Stills, and Nash
Ye the only difference is that Joel’s playing it at a slower pace
I just listened to the song and the lyrics of it fit the moment
joel was in so much pain when ellie said she could never forgive him for what he did.. that part almost made me cry and its the first time ive ever nearly cried playing a game. it sucks that ellie never got to forgive him
If this scene didn’t move you when you first watched it then you’re not human.
I like how these characters are very believable down to the smallest of details. Joel once said that he really misses coffee in the first game. And we see him in the second game finally drinking it again.
Joel 100% cried himself to sleep after this
such amazingly written dialogue is not easy to come by, this is up there as one of the best conversation scene i've ever seen in any media ever. tears start rolling down my eyes every time i rewatch this, and you dont need to know how much i cried the first time i watched it. every line, bears more then what it seems on the surface, even Joel's quirky remarks of "I'm a little embarrassed as to what i had to trade to get it (coffee), but it's not bad", is a subtle way of Joel telling Ellie he knew what he did was wrong, and what he traded to get this happiness he has had with Ellie by his side for the last 4 years.
even better is the context. prior to this scene we did not know it even existed, we did not know that Ellie came over to Joel's house late that night to talk with him. Ellie has not been able to talk to Joel for probably about a year since she learned the truth about Joel's choice. if this scene did not exist, the last time Joel and Ellie spoke to each other before Joel died the next morning, would have been the bar scene, when Joel stepped in to stop the angry bar owner from harassing Ellie and Dina, to which Ellie disapprove cause Joel is once against interfering with Ellie's life when she can already handle herself. and angrily she yelled at Joel: "I dont need your fucking help!". just imagine, how tragic that would have been for Joel, to think that the last words your "daughter", your 2nd chance, said to you before you die, is she didn't need you and hate you.
but it wasn't, thanks to the fact that Ellie did came over to Joel's house later that night, it showed she didnt really mean what she said, she understood Joel, even though he did something terrible, it was all because he loved her, and Ellie has taken the first step in mending the bonds between them. "I would like to try (to forgive)..." means deep down in her heart she already has. and at the very least, in that last moment before Joel is gone from this world, he opened his eyes and saw Ellie before him, still trying to save him, and knowing... she loves him too.
Amazing voice acting from Troy Baker
RIP JOEL legend
Yes good work
The problem with The Last of Us 2, is that there are stories for 2 games there! I would be much more pleased if The Last of Us 2 were entirely over the 5 years before Joel's death! Then we could get to know Abby well, understand her motivations, see Joel and Ellie's relationship grow, fall apart and have a spark of hope that is shown in this scene ... and at the end of the game it would be Abby killing Joel! So only on the third one we would see this confrontation between Ellie and Abby and what it all cost them both!
The flashbacks gave you what you wanted.
That's a good idea when I played at first I wanted revenge then overtime my anger die downed and then I played ws abby and I started to like her but a part of me still hated her cause of killing joel then when ellie is at the farm I wanted her to let it go for her sake. Then when it ended I felt mad she didnt kill her but glad she let go of hate so she could be open to love but lost everything learning that lesson and is now alone
aashrith madagiri the flashbacks don’t give us what we want they only patch up the missing pieces no one who plays the game will get attached to a new character who kills the Main character if the game would’ve made us attached to abby earlier then maybe more people would feel where she’s coming from but since we are mostly attached to Joel and Ellie we would obviously take their side over some new character who we didn’t know anything about
But that‘s not what ND envisioned, they wanted you to hate Abby and see if you can get over your hate by seeing that Abby is not a bad person and was just consumed by hatred, just like all the people are right now that are doing that witch hunt, which is kinda funny tbh
@@JustCauseFan after the ending i liked the game and understood what it was trying to say to me but nevertheless i hated abby so much i didnt even collect everything...at the end it was a nice game but literally the whole abby campagne is lost.
her leaving the guitar and sparing abby speaks volumes to her forgiveness for Joel. Instead of lingering on what he did, she lets go of all of it whether it be the guitar or abby, she let go. Her main source of pain came from not forgiving Joel, and she thought that ‘justice’ for joel would alleviate that guilt and anger. Instead she only indulged in the worst parts of him rather than remembering the most important parts of him. I find the games ending to be so profound and really add a new sense of depth between their relationship even though joel is dead. Ellie’s resilience to forgive him and let go of the pain he caused her is just so beautiful.
3:45 Legit made me cry. I was in Joel's shoes.
it was the first game ive ever almost cried to mann its sad how ellie never got to forgive joel
I’m just glad they had Joel day he would do it again. I was afraid they would completely destroy his character by having him be remorseful which is not Joel.
They almost destroyed him tho
It’s just crazy how clear they show us they know what we want and still just shit on the characters lol
I mean, the games were never saying that what Joel did at the end of the first game was the “right” thing. It’s the same writer here as the first game, he’s not “destroying” his own characters. If it wasn’t for Neil there wouldn’t BE a Joel in the first place. This game is just solidifying the original creator’s view on the events of the last game, it’s not changing anything. I fully understand why Joel did what he did, so does the game, but he very clearly did a questionable thing. He rid the world of a cure to save Ellie. It’s not like Ellie didn’t want to die for the cure in the first game but now she wanted to, she’s always been like this
@@jw1714 They know what most people wanted but they also knew that people wanted a generic cliche story. They could easily go with the safe route and make a generic cliche game but they had the balls to do their OWN game and not a game that the general public wanted.
@@spbspb2413 There’s a reason the best parts of the game are the flashbacks with Ellie and Joel together. Chemistry, and actual depth to characters. Having Abby and her friends force fed down our throats with little to no story building on most of her friends that get killed and I’m supposed to feel sorry for them? No...sorry that doesn’t take balls, that takes a bunch of yes men and few bad decisions.
3:34 This is how I feel about Abby
It doesn't help that she has poor character development that is also irrelevant to the overall story between Ellie and her. It's just a cheap thrown together side story to try and get you to feel bad for her despite her unforgivable act to kill Joel.
This moment is perfection
Honestly the genius of the story in that Ellie never getting to reconcile properly with Joel leads her to recklessly endanger her life after he'd sacrificed everything to save her and the guilt and anger not only at Abby, but at herself for not forgiving him and moving on and like him, one angry action led to her losing him and having no way to get him back so she tries to purge herself of the guilt by getting revenge. The fact druckman was willing to do this and throw two of gamings most loved characters on the fire to make such an incredibly impacting story takes enormous balls.
This game really shows you the best part of TLOU storyline is the bond between Joel and Ellie. When you strip the game of that for an overwhelming majority of the game, it becomes immediately absent of emotional connection. I guess Ellie and Dina’s bond was nice, but even that, we barely got for half the game.
which is really why most of us wanted a part 2 :( but ya know we ended up getting only like 1% ugh tnx naughtydog
Amen, Joel and Ellie’s bond is what they should’ve focused on instead they ruined there chances of milking this serious and got rid of the best thing they had going from the previous game
I mean, this game is still ultimately about Joel and Ellie’s relationship. Much of it works symbolically to represent that. Abby mirrors Joel in more ways than one, and Ellie forgiving Abby is ultimately the way that she finally forgives Joel. It’s still about Joel and Ellie, just not in the way you’d expect
The last of us part 2 in my opinion has an amazing story, it tells of how someone was torn apart by revenge, it isn’t that “revenge is bad,”, it’s what it costed her that is bad. But yeah it’s probably just a bad story and I’m a fanboy for liking it. Of course we are entitled to our own opinion, but being angry over Joel’s death is just stupid, I am very sad but I’m not angry because of it.
Im not angry he died. Im angry how stupid he was in how he let his guard down.
@@gamblorrr I kinda like how they let him let his guard down, to me it felt like he grown more as a person to try to help more people.
That being said I think the way it happened was a bit much
Instead of saying "it seems like you all have heard that name"
He looked at Tommy and started to draw a gun and then get shot would be much better of a sence than what happened
The worst of it is that ELLIE was the one who engaged in a relationship with Joel. She TRIES to get his affection, he was passive all the time, while she was the one who wanted to be something more to Joel in the first game. And She did conquered him, and became his daughter. And as time goes, she becomes to mean so much for Joel that, for him, there would be no world without her... and hearing these words out of her mouth is just so painful.
That's teens for you. As they grow older they begin to become more distant.
This game could've just been flashbacks then what we got now
I don’t know why but this scene doesn’t feel like a memory it feels like Joel is some angel now talking to Ellie when he was sitting and playing guitar
I just wish this was the whole game about what happened the bonding of Joel and Ellie and eventually she will learn what really happened and then she will ran away and try to find them by herself. Then Joel obviously have to find her then boom he has to meet new zombies, have to fight more gangs and then eventually when he finally found Ellie *arguments and all that shit*. Then she will have to accept Joel's decision then come back, and there's a good or bad ending. Either Joel got bit and asked Ellie to finish him off or they would go back to Jackson's and just forget the whole shit happened and pretend this sequel never existed
All-Around Player Gaming right? Geez why can’t they thought about this
Hopefully you are not a writer
Yeah. A whole game about just Joel and Ellie. Nothing like that exists at fucking at all.
You just predicted the whole fucking story which would make it boring af.
@@aashrithmadagiri6711 Atleast it wouldn't be more boring than playing Abby for half the whole fucking game. Nobody cares about her story.
Damn this duo care a lot about each other. Joel destroyed the firefly for her and she destroyed everyone who helped Abby kill him
When he says he would do it all over again, does he mean he would still save Ellie?
yes
Sebas Tian no it means he should of left her there and make the right decisions and not lie to her.
JamesHLanier oh 😯
@@sike5759 Why the fuck would he do that
@@sike5759 *should've
I feel much better about this scene knowing she was planning on watching a movie with Joel the following night.
I don't know what to do man.. this game broke my godamn heart.
I feel ya i was the same after rdr2 it made me a mess
Well I'm guessing now she regrets it..
Thats what hurt the most is that they never get to go back on what they were befoee because Joel died
Steph Aves yeah Ellie literally said she planned to watch a movie with Joel that night but little did she know he would be gone before then sad we never got to see them patch things up
@@SlumpyHaven this game really made players feel some type of sadness
MPkidd facts I’m just happy they atleast had a little closure at the end and atleast Joel knows that Ellie would forgive him and that she cares for him
Slumpo yes but they never got back :’(
They could never make another last of us game and I would be satisfied solely because of this scene, its heartbreaking but perfectly sums up Ellie's journey throughout this game. 10/10
I can't watch this scene without crying , this is really sad
i cried when she said "but i would like to try" and he said "id like that" FUCKKKKKK
MAN this hit me in the feels.
I don't think Ellie went to Joel to try to forgive him at first but after he tells her that he would do it all over again even though he knows that will drive Ellie away from him, she realises how deeply Joel loves her, that he is willing to throw their relationship away so that Ellie can live and have a meaningful life that isn't just defined by her immunity. That's when Ellie decides that she wants to begin the process of forgiving him.
So Ellie leaving for seattle and her attempt to avenge Joel is a complicated feeling of guilt and never having the chance to say thank you to Joel for allowing her to live and experience the adversity of life, the feeling of love (Ellie and Dina at the dance), and the unforgettable moments she shared with Joel (musuem flashback).
“Id like that.”
This man died knowing at the very least there was a chance things between him and Ellie would be fine…
So it all means that the game is about forgivness, she forgave Abby, never forgave Joel. She did it for Joel, this is why the game is so beautiful.
She didn't forgive Abby tho. She may have let her go but that's only because she realized killing Abby wasn't going to solve anything other than cause each of them pain. She walked away with the acceptance that he was gone, allowing for grief to finally set in. The game is about anger and the pain that you inflict upon yourself and others around when you pursue revenge. Not forgiveness because nobody was really forgiven. If anything, it was an unspoken mutual agreement at least where they both hope they never see each other again.
*i don’t think i could ever forgive you for that but i would like to try*
abby: Ain’t nobody got time for that
someone knows what song is he playing?
Also very much eager to know this
Future days ❤
@@sultanmahfries6402 unfortunately it's not that
The title of the song is Helplessly Hoping by Crosby, Stills and Nash
If we can forgive joel who is a monster in the eyes of the world for his actions what’s stopping us from forgiving Abby for an arguably less heinous act
Cuz Joel is a good well developed character and we understand his ideology. Abby shouldn't be compared to Joel
When Joel says he would do it all over again, does he mean save her again or let her die this time?
Save her again
Idk how u people got past elementary school with these interpretation skills or lack there of
this game fucked me up too much
Is this the conversation they have before Joel walked into her house, gave the guitarr and told her the joke? That scene from the very beginning.
This is the last conversation they had together.
when he says he'd do it all over again, he means that he wouldn't change a thing or does he mean he'd do it differently?
he wouldn't change a thing ;)
@@AllAroundPlayerGaming fuck, I thought the other way around when I first played last year 😭 this got me crying even more now
Okay I have to confess. I hate the game but all the scenes with Ellie and Joel I love. Easily best part of the game and the only sequel worthy scenes. In my opinion at least. Hopefully others can notice those scenes at least when thrashing the rest of the game.
It would have been so much more satisfying to see more of Joel and Ellie’s relationship as she tries to forgive him. Then after all that rebuilding of their relationship, Abby comes in for revenge. It would have made the circumstances around Joel’s death more interesting and more emotionally impactful.
In my opinion, that would not have worked. You see, right after Joel's death, we see Tommy trying to convince Ellie not to leave Jackson in search of Abby. He's trying to cope with his brothers death in a healthy way, but Ellie is incapable of doing the same 'cause she was taken the chance to rebuild the relation with Joel in a brutal way, and the trauma drives her to seek revenge. If they had gotten the time to heal emotionally and live a few more years together, Ellie would have had enough reasons (Dina, Maria, the community) to not leave and carry on with her life. Changing the events would kill the game's soul porpoise of existing.
I refuse to take this as cannon.
I will take the Joel telling the truth as cannon but the rest of the game and Joel’s death never happened. I think Joel tells Ellie the truth and then Ellie eventually forgives him and they live in Jackson in peace.
Grow up
Look at all these insecure babies that can't handle a death so they're creating their own little safe space.
Bless their little cotton socks.
I refuse to take is as cannon too! I will however, take it as canon!!
@@Ashby2508 Joel's death isn't even worth feeling emotion for his death is so pathetic that most people don't care.
Its crazy how every scene joel is in(except for the golf scene)is amazing but everything else is either trash or boring and sometimes just flat out disgusting(like that abby sex scene)
It’s funny how the game wants you to hate Joel and feel emotional for Ellie and Abby but the only sad scene is Joel’s death and when Ellie embarrassed Joel in the dance
Arthur Morgan has spoken!!👏🏻
ellie bite abby so my teory she will get a new kind of infection and he need to find ellie get a new cure cause thi new infection will change everthing
im confused is this ellies dream? bcus after kiss incident with dina he never talk to joel until that golf incident
No this is the same night as the dance ( edited )
Golf incident lol
@@AllAroundPlayerGaming lol that's actually quite funny
God I loved the moments with Joel and Ellie, except the Winter Dance moment, Ellie was being a cunt. Just serves as a reminder that what made TLOU great was the bond between these two. With it being absent (except for flashbacks) in this game, it killed it.
But that’s the whole point of the game, Joel lied to her in first game. They can’t have a good relationship. This is not a Disney story. Where everything is happily ever after. It actually explains how life is.
Wdym Joel regrets?
The last of us 1 was the ending for me, this game is not cannon because the last of us is a brutal survival game, not a LGBTQ fan fiction
same dude
They ain’t nothing wrong with gay pride but you were right
Joel and Ellie are the soul of the last of us series :)
They did Joel dirty, I’m done
This isn’t about lgbt characters. Yeah there’s gay characters in the game but that doesn’t fucking matter. What matters is the story.
I still don't get why Ellie is mad, like bro do you want to die for nothing?
Ellie was mad because she felt like her life didn’t matter to anyone and that dying would help save lives and something such as what happened to her friend Riley wouldn’t happen to others but she realized her life did matter when Joel said he would do it again she realized her life mattered to Joel, Dina, Jessie etc
@@SlumpyHaven That's stupid
甲斐 She wasn’t going to die for nothing she was gonna die for a possible cure that’s why she was mad Joel just did what anyone who loves someone would do and stopped it
@@SlumpyHaven I cure would be useless it wouldn't fix mankind people would still be divided and probably fight over it.
甲斐 yeah but a cure would atleast have saved some lives and in the end Ellie forgave Joel because she realized people cared about her life more than a cure
Joel saved Ellie's life, gave her a family, friends, a stable life, loved her as a daughter of blood. And in return he gained ingratitude and a miserable "I will try to forgive you". Very disappointing what she became in Part II.
The moment she embarrassed joel when he defended her aftont of all the ppls . I Dont Need your fucking help joel . I felt fucking sad for a man who sacrificed everything for her treated like trash im glad dina left her ass all alone like she did to joel . What a fucking bad writing
Years*
Can’t you see from Ellie’s prospective ? How would you feel if you knew you were special and were going to save millions of lives but only to be lied that you weren’t special by the only one you cared about. Joel lied to Ellie multiple times until she found the truth herself. Yes Joel only did that because he cared for her but in someways he only saved Ellie for himself as he could not risk losing another person. The fact she was angry at joel is what makes her human, she isn’t someone who forgives anyone instantly for lying to them for 4 years.
@@kinderjoy278 Why or how does she still have faith in humanity? She saw that humans were the bigger problem than infected in the first game, her trauma came from being ambushed by hunters, Joel getting impaled to deliver her to the Fireflies, and David nearly raping her.
*Is this girl really that stupid to feel hate towards Joel if he was able to give her so many memories?*
Eastwaters So you’re telling me she had no faith in Sam ? Or Tess ? Or Riley ?
Somehow this game made me hate Ellie
That's mainly what it was, at first it wanted you to hate Abby, then sort of feel concerned about Ellie then hate Abby again then feel sympathy for both characters at the end. But most people weren't buying it and hated Abby regardless and rooted for Ellie no matter Abby's backstory.
I hate Ellie, so they succeeded. Abby, i kinda hater her, but still don't care about her at all so it doesn't impact me as much. I liked Ellie when she was 14, now she's a bitch.
Gojira Fan HD you should hate the writing. They litterally made a random character. They wanted us to feel bad for the random NPC doctor.
Noobmaster 69 exactly the doctor didn’t even need to die the writing is weird Joel could’ve beat the doctor without killing him and not even using any weapons if he wanted also the doctor put his life on the line knowing he had no chance against Joel
@@SlumpyHaven At least he was an ass in TLOU2.
Only good part of this game lmao
😁