My favorite start to a campaign ever (not dnd but still a ttrpg) was when the gm took our background info and went "okay [cracks knuckles]... Player 1, you're a teacher of this subject so you brought everyone on a field trip- Player 2, You're a teacher for a different subject but Player 1 needed another supervisor and you weren't doing anything that day so you signed up for the overtime pay- Player 3 and 4, you're regular students who are in this class because it's part of your major- Player 5, you're not really into this whole thing like everyone else. You're a hermit of sorts who likes moving from place to place every so often and when you moved to this big city you were shocked by the higher cost of living. Then you saw students get a discount and hatched a plan to take some bs classes while you stay here. Anyone got any corrections with anything I said?" Just bam, bam, bam, bam. It got us right into the first scene without hardly any effort. Don't overthink it, just an elevator pitch's worth of background info to get the PCs in a place together when the call to adventure happens was all we needed. I realize that won't fit every group but it really worked well for ours.
I am trying to get a group of fairly inexperienced players together in addition to me being a new DM, but I feel like I don’t entirely know where to start. I’ve got lore regarding the world and ik people don’t necessarily want to pay attention to every fine detail so I try not to bog them down with everything. Just enough for them to tell me who their characters are, but they can’t even seem to engage with character creation and it’s been months now so I’m stumped on how to re-engage them. They have even said they’re ready to play but NO ONE has anything written or typed out anything. Like the world is baked and ready to go, their races all have some history for them to pull from if they wanted to, but I can’t get anything substantial beyond one of my players wanting to be the Dragonborn from Skyrim and the other wants to be a level 1 dragon slayer shaman that is a taller-than-normal frost giant. I’ve even tried to work with them on making those ideas work in the world but it just screams “I want to be badass chad main character from the start with no room for development” like cmon man no one is perfect let alone in a fantasy realm where an untold number of variables can go awry at any given time. Sorry if this feels like I’m venting. I kind of am
I kind of like that approach to getting the PCs together: The Players write the background context, the GM hooks those contexts into the opening scene by circumstance, and the Players may submit final tweaks before confirming. This way, less is disclaimed to the Players, in favor of getting the action moving so that they can start developing their characters and relationships as emergent properties. I'm going to remember that.
@danielfenton9742 in my experience those kind of people are not going to actually try to play. If you can't even get them through character creation you won't be able to get them through playing. Every time we've dropped such a player from our group we've noticed everything speeds right up, the way we wanted, because they were sandbagging the whole process. Sorry but you're better off starting from scratch when it comes to players.
Favorite start for my dark fantasy campaign: Party all came off a boat and were traveling togeather, stopped at a village for drinks, awesome RP, and went to bed. Started with each of them waking up in a Coffin deep underground. Each member had to claw their way out before suffocating (one fell unconscious, the others helped dig her out). Found out BBEG minions cursed the village they were in, buried them, and began a ritual to turn them into minions for BBEG. Soon as they all got out, the had to fight and disrupt necrotic ritual to save the rest of the buried villagers. Awesome punchy start, loved it 🤘🔥🍻
That is a REALLY good idea! And I think could also be fun when it's not the start of a campaign. I'll probably try to use this with my players, when they are on the road and spend the night in some random village.
@@needycatproductions6830 Oh for sure, and hell yea! That sounds like a great idea to spice up travel. Should be a hell of an encounter. Fun to run, just awesome from the player side 😂Cheers 🍻
@tizithegiant basically just noticed that they were missing someone. Perception/Investigation checks to figure out where disturbed dirt was, STR checks to pull her out, medicine checks to revive. Sense that wasn't the main feature of the session, the combat was, I made it easy so all players could participate in the combat. No sense in having a dead character not even 30 mins into session 1 lol. But, at the same time, sets the tone which is still quite important.
My first dm told us to imagine what our characters were doing right before they fell asleep, then promptly informed us (after we told him what our characters did) that after this, our PCs had a very strange dream, then woke up together in the middle of a burnt forest. Cue in a few minutes of roleplay (with mine even getting to say 'not again.') and that's how our party formed.
I once solved this problem by first playing an individual session with each player and after that, slamed all of them into the same dungeon from different entrences with the same goal of clearing it out. They weren't forced to come up with excuses to team up, even though they all had strong, different personas.
Once I made the party survive the Apocalypse (one almost died). Another time they had to share the same table on a full tavern for a while, then I tried to kidnap them during the night. There's also this time when we started "in media res", aka they were already an adventuring party competing against other groups. Aaand another time I had a "recruit the team" montage, where they were doing X thing before getting hired. :D
One of my favourite ways to build pcs is to say this person spent a lot of time alone and he's looking for friends and adventure. It's simple but as far as my characters concerned theyve found friends and its adventure time. Complexity can come later
00:54 Tip 1: Make them come together narratively 01:21 Tip 2: Have pre-existing relationships 02:01 Tip 3: Give them no other option 03:23 Tip 4: Create shared character goals 04:03 Tip 5: Give them moments to roleplay 04:28 Tip 6: Introduce an external threat 05:06 Tip 7: Set expectations at the beginning
I appreciate your phrasing on the terms: "This is often considered hard railroading". However, presenting your players with a unifying reason to band together isn't simply railroading itself. You are correct that somehow people think it is, but the railroading version of that would be if they witnessed a murder in the city, the guard showed up and immediately detained everyone without giving anyone the chance to role play out of it. Then said they would only be allowed to leave the city if they could prove who actually killed the person that the guards now believe they killed.
I run my groups 'Troupe style' so everyone has multiple characters ready to go. Whether starting fresh, or an established campaign - generally speaking they are already a part of a community and acquainted (even if only somewhat) with one another, and they swap out characters regularly when the situation dictates. (Healing, training, etc). If we start a new adventure, as opposed to continuing an ongoing adventure, any new characters are already assumed to have made the acquaintance of the group off-camera so to speak. That avoids the whole awkward RP thing that sometimes happens. Oh, and go on over to 5:22 and give Tobias a Displacer Treat!
tobias 5:22 an idea i had was the tavern/inn keep is super nice and lets them stay for free when they wake up they find them hanging from a tree outside with a note or something making demands
I've mostly used the "Rules of the Campaign" approach, like you described. I tell my players that "You need to consider some way/reason that your character WANTS to go/get along with the party" and that I am not looking to babysit some lone wolf fantasy, this is a team game, DM included. It worked out well so far. Yes this will turn away some people, but I am looking to have fun and not all games are a place for all people and I am fine with that.
So far, with the campaign I'm writing for at the moment the setting is starting with two regions separating by a giant clock tower, one is in the sky and one is on the ground, the ones in the sky live this rich and "perfect" life with angels at their command which help them whenever they need, and the bottom are fighting for their lives against demons and some have gained control over them. There is a barrier created by the upper regions preventing the bottom regions from going through the clock tower. My idea for how the party will meet is that this strange energy emits from the clock tower and for the first time in centuries that clock towers hand has moved to 1. Leaders from the upper and lower regions force certain people to investigate the tower, upon investigating the tower the floor drops sending them into this dungeon will no exit it feels like. I would then let them role-play for a bit before them hearing a mechanism click which then opens a door they can go through. On the walls to this giant hallway are some murals of some strange creatures they haven't seen before seeing a quick glimpse of a man who runs by, upon catching up to him, he leaves them with a gentle hint about a place to go if they wanna change the rules of this world, before snapping sending them all into the upper region of the world.
Starting out in a prison always works well in Elder Scrolls games, and it's worked super well for me in past D&D campaigns. Once they help each other escape, they're usually pretty close, and then we determine what they have in common, where they're all from, etc.
@Abelhawk The intro, in my current campaign is a massive prison for levels 1-3. Whether they escape or how they escape should bind them, but there is also a mystery haunting the prison a false hydra.
When I joined my first DnD game, it was part way through the campaign, so my half drow arcane trickster was troned into the water elemental plane (long story) by a godlike sphinx. He did not trust anyone there. Gave a fake name and played the part of a willing party member. Very slowly, over many sessions, he learned to trust them bit by bit an told them his real name. He was so used to seeing people he knew drop dead the next day, he didn't bother getting close to anyone. Now he has a rivalry with the fighter who tries to steal an extra set of thieve tools off of him, is like a brother to the sorcerer, gets annoyed with the warlock, interigates and makes plans with the barbarian, and talks to the life cleric about religion. Our campaign is still ongoing. Who knows what lies ahead for Emeric.
I made my first campaign as a DM start with every party member been taken hostage by pirates. It gives a first goal (get free), and a common goal/reason to adventure together (hunt down the pirate lord who captured them).
Alright, you guys met on the ship, Player1 the prompt is you have gathered everyone here to discuss something with them... Player1: "Hey guys, does this scab look weird?"
One of my favorite ways I entered a campaign was one I entered after it had already begun. So I was later addition. The party was in the place to not only get healing for an npc friend of theirs but was also trying to reunite and get assistance from a druid friend of one of them. Well, they arrive at the nature and research facility my character is based out of (my character is a field researcher, charged with recording and reporting on finds they come across in the ruins nearby). The party learns that their druid friend is missing, hasn’t been seen in a while and the last person who saw them was my character. This is when I took the moment to step up and tell the “boss” that this was what I had wished to discuss with him, that I was worried and wished to get permission to find our druid. And that’s how the party and myself teamed up. Honestly the hard part for me wasn’t the mission (was a rousing success actually which, in dnd, is rare). It was when it became obvious that it was time for the party to depart. I had to figure out why my character would go with these people they have known for a mere few days over the people they had built relationships and trust with in equally dangerous situations for two years. My solution ended up hinging on the god connection my character was already secretly (at that time) established with in their backstory. Basically, my character gets hunches. I made it clear and dropped hints leading up to the departure that my character was feeling this inexplicable pull to accompany the party on their journey. They used some transparent excuses and told those in-character to the party members but eventually admitted, once the god connection came out, that they have had these hunches since childhood that tell them when something needs their attention or for them to do something or warn them about. The implication is that it’s this god. Which actually tied in with two other players’ characters too, as they too shared one. My dm has been great to further expand on this and had woven in that certain family members of each of us used to be their own adventuring party, lol, also with ties to that same god! Should be fun. Anyway, yeah so that was one of my favorite ways I joined a campaign and then, yeah, the awkwardness of trying to make up a reason for remaining with them after the mission ended. And then the fun of the dm taking that quirk I made up on the fly to help with that and then weaving it into the wider narrative. 😊 It’s just been a ton of fun!
I’m currently playing in a campaign with three “lone wolf” characters. Two of them (played by me and a friend who are more experienced) view it as professional courtesy to pull their weight. The other is played by a pretty inexperienced guy and doesn’t trust anyone, including the party. It’s mostly cool, though, he’s still learning and we’re ready to help him out.
5:23 Cute kitten. In one of my last DND sessions I had a displacer beast pet and I think I would rather sacrifice my character than let any harm come to him. I love your visual representation of what a kitten would look like. I hope you continue to keep him along for the ride on your videos.
I spy with my little eye, a displacer kitty at 5:21 ! In my current campaign, I got them all to make their characters with each other in a group to bounce ideas and establish any relationships as the character idea forms in their head. It also helps that we are all coworkers so we have a real world relationship too.
My current campaign is my first true campaign experience, I've only played in a few oneshots before. All the players are people I'm friends with so we get along so well but this is a great video for our DM. This is a steampunk themed campaign he wrote himself. I've sent him a few of your videos and he's great considering he's never been the DM before. He wrote his villains with the intent of then being hateable in ways that really brought us together character wise quite fast. When we first started each of our characters ended up being hired by a mercenary guild and after our first job our characters knew each other well and agreed to take more jobs together, we're now getting a reputation in one of the cities for reliable security contractors.
@@TheFantasyForge We had another game today, a tough boss fight with a corrupt mayor who was using a thieves guild to rob his own people. Our characters have grown even closer now after we attempted to carry out an arrest on the mayor that ended in a fight.
@@TheFantasyForge We're still on a similar job, just on a much larger scale. In this setting humans and elves are at war with each other and most people believe the elves instigated the conflict. Our quest is to find proof the human king secretly instigated an attack by the elves so he could declare war simply because he was willing to trade thousands of his soldiers for more political power. We're not big fans of the king, kind of ironic because my character is a war veteran who was in the King's Musketeers for 7 years.
I personally like to make the wilderness in my setting dangerous, to the point where a fighting-able person or ideally two or more is the only reasonable way to travel between settlements, unless you wanna gamble with your life. Any first adventure will either start on the road, or will demand traveling through the wild to get to the main location. As such, there is allways that forced relience on each other for safety on the road and spending hours if not days traveling togeather, eating togeather, camping togeather, and inevitably getting to know each other at least a little, which makes that whole social contract a lot easier to follow without cognitive dissonance. A tavern is a neat and iconic way to start, because you could concivably find anyone there, and there will be opertunities for light roleplay, but I find that the road is as good if not better, as any narrowing of who you'd find there just limits it to the adventuring type and people with class levels, which is already a restriction the players have to follow.
One thing that I never understand is the "I work alone" character, "I dont wanna walk in group" trope, the edgy and dark person. I mean, this is a COOPERATIVE game, why there are so many people who do this?
Because it's real. You see those characters in all kinds of media. Usually, a good player would ideally want to leave openings for growth, maybe a reason why they're trying to be solo that the party could eventually remedy. If they're just I don't want to be a part of a group and there's nothing deeper than that, then yeah, that's an issue, but we go through all of these backstories and making fleshed out characters and some parties don't actually bother talking about who they are and want they care about. It makes it feel like a wasted effort.
@@cjg1029 I know it's a trope and it's real on other medias, but something being popular or even cliche in storytelling doesn't necessarily mean it will work in roleplaying game. If the player isn't experienced or even the party is not at the same page at this specific player, it won't work. In my almost 10 years of experience playing RPG, the tendency is that it will not work, because those who want to do this do not play this characters because they want to explore a deep and sad backstory or something like that, most of the time they just want to me edgy and act like a fuckin badass solo hero
I like to ask my players what they want out of their characters naratively. "To do big damage and beat the bad guy" is a fine enough reason to play a ttrpg, but you can do so much more. Are you playing a rogue to avoid the spotlight and be the enforcer of your group, or are you just a five finger discount lover? Are you a sorcrerer because you want to explore the pull of destiny and go on the Hero's Journey, or maybe you wish to tell the tale of how natural talent can triumph over hard work, only to realize that by youing your talent, you engaged in the hard work? So on. What is your character arc, and how big does it have to be to be meaningful. An example. I played an eladrin sorcerer who held a view that might makes right and those in power earned it through might. This was immediatelt challenged by the gnome artificer. He was an anarchist. Backstory was a literal anarcho-terrorist cell. We butted heads, and after failing a wisdom saving throw, I contracted madness that made me a staunch monarchist. Nothing could fix that, save death. Well, I died. Don't worry, I got better. After being revived, she took a new worldview, more in line with the gnome. Keep in mind, we are two years into a campaign, and our characters still hutted heads, but we had grown a strong friendship. I went from telling everyone what to do to asking what everyone wanted to do in the situation. That's right, I invented democracy for my table. True democracy that included our NPCs! And the gnome? We became extremely close friends. Any time the party split, for shopping or anything, we were together. Never evolved beyond friendship, but we watched each other's backs constantly.
I am a brand new DM and have only been actually playing for about 2 months now but I liked my first session quiet a bit but one of my players who is also the DM who got me into dnd did mention the whole no reason for them to work together so these tips are appreciated so far there is a Dracolich which is part of my why of the campaign and they are about to meet two new factions too but with these tips should help me keep it rolling steady
I could get on board with a campaign in which I start out traveling to investigate a place mentioned in a message a thief who stole an object of great personal value to me. When I get there, I find others with the same problem. Maybe that object has a greater purpose and they must be brought together for good or for ill? Either way, I have to work with my newfound allies to get back what was stolen.
@@TheFantasyForge It could make for an interesting session 0. have a one on one with the DM for 30 minutes to an hour tying your backstory into the campaign through RP. That way, it will be a surprise to all of the players to find themselves bumping into each other on session 1, learning they all have a mutual goal (and a mutual destiny).
first key: travelling together gives them a reason to be in the same place in the same time second key: pre-existing relationships. former comrades, friends, family members, same faction/organization/company third key: give them on other option. usually dire situations. for example: only survivors of the crashed ship fourth key: shared character goals and/or motivations. may be the same personal vendetta, quest for finding the same artifact etc fifth key: DM tip. give players moments to roleplay sixth key: introduce an external threat. quick way to force player characters together (they all want gold, artifacts, power etc) seventh key: set expectations at the beginning. talk to the players before the game even starts, one of the rules is to work together
Tobias ar 5:20! In my first homebrew campaign, I had everyone arrive at the same dock town Tavern and let them interact naturally, but in the middle of the night, the city alarm sounded. PIRATES! Everyone got involved real quick ☠️
Writing an Uber dark fantasy campaign and this was one of the issues I feel I struggle with as a DM. I can’t wait to cook up a good intro with these tips!
BRO THE COW NOISE IN THE AD SCARED ME I AM NOT CUT OUT FOR THIS On a more serious note, after running 3 campaigns (2 flops, 1 still running), I've come to realize two things: 1: GETTING ON THE SAME PAGE: Some people are just not meant to play together. If I want to DM a dark & gritty experience where the players are ex-convicts banished to a hell-adjacent realm because the world's prisons became flooded, one player wants to play Strixhaven (which is an amazing module, fight me abt it), and a second player wants to be a shounen anime protagonist, we need to talk that shit out. None of us are gonna have fun if we're all looking for different experiences. Mood = ruined. 2: SESSION 0 IS IMPORTANT, APPARENTLY: There's not much to say here. All players need to agree on what role in the party each person fills. No shit right? Do a session zero, or all the stuff in the video you just watched is gonna become reality.
LMAO it's okay we'll do this together 100%, we all have different personalities and session zero is good for feeling out who is good for your table and who is not
My party all woke up in the same enchanted forest together, with their memories of how they got there wiped. So, forced to work together with no recollection of if they know each other or not, so might as well assume they do
In my upcoming campaign I will force them together. Like in the inn they are staying at is attacked by zombies. So now they will need to first fight off the zombies and find out what caused the outbreak. Before getting to a safe heaven, but that will require them to work together or become part of the hoard
I like all of these, but Tip 3 has never gotten me anywhere. Any time I've tried the "you guys needs to cooperate" angle with new people, they seem to each want to go off on their own goals which splits the narrative immediately. Maybe it's just my experience, but it unless action is involved the "survival" aspect especially seems to make people want to split up and explore. The final tip about laying out guidelines beforehand has been my best friend. I tell everyone straight out, "We do like to roleplay and make sure everyone is having fun."
Yes, set expectations at the beginning! First and foremost, make an adventurer! Second, you must make a character that will work with the party! I always start off my players with a good reason to trust one another by having them do something together that requires teamwork. Because, let's be honest, you would not travel in the wild with someone you don't trust.
Now, separately, because I am never going to clutter a Tobias sighting post with my own rambling, your comment about the "edgelord" characters and the comment about one of the rules being that they need to be willing to work together. And, this is going to be a LONG one. No, really, it's stupidly long, and is probably venting to a degree. Because, ho'boy. Yeah, there's this one guy. Maybe we all know of one of them. It's "interesting" because he's an experienced player, with a bit of acting background. Let's call him Mr. Trouble. SOME of the others in my gaming groups have gamed with him before. In the first game I played with him, he was interesting. His character was a little odd/out there, but in a way that mostly worked WITH the group. There was a slight undercurrent of him wanting to do something to screw with the fellow party members, but subdued, and he intentionally delivered it in a way that suggested "you should not go along with what my character is saying." Maybe that was a hint. Game 2, different genre, Mr. Trouble wasn't there at the very beginning, and when he did join, was there irregularly at first (real-world issues going on), but his character started as a comic-relief, though a troublesome one, that quickly had me wondering why we were working with the guy. He "evolved," but not for the better. Definitely all about himself, and the rest of the group was just a convenience for him. A very "fair-weather friend" with a generous dollop of self-entitlement thrown in. Side note: my GF, who will call me out on my crap when I engage in crap, observed this game for a while well after the beginning, then joined in some time significantly later. What irked me more is that his character engaged in a very low-level not-quite bullying of my character. Game 1 ended relatively early into Game 2. Game 3, fully remote (my GF and I live together, so online together from the same location), started and ended while Game 2 ran, and was yet a different genre from the first two. My GF was in this game start to finish, and, Mr. Trouble again came in a little late in. His persona was so similar to that in Game 2 that my GF and I had both slipped and called his character by his Game 2 character's name. Once. Between ourselves, more often because he seemed like the SAME guy, down to the self-entitlement and, in this case, rubbing most other PCs the wrong way at a minor level. I could excuse SOME of it as his character was intended to work to cross-purposes with the rest of the PCs, but we weren't supposed to know. You would think he would try to play nice to allay any suspicion. BUT, his character, NOT physically imposing, and NOT winning any popularity contests, did something SUPER dumb. My character was a hulking brute whose people are known for short tempers and violence. Mostly my character had been one of few words, VERY reserved, reluctant to speak unprompted. And, while the players didn't know, but the DM did, my character, based on their background story, definitely had a little paranoia and a bit of a persecution complex. Plus a weird undercurrent of being a slightly scientific-minded. The only thing I can think of is, maybe from Game 2, he had become so accustomed to the low-level mouthing off and picking on my character that he forgot that he was in a different game. Maybe. I've also been told that he may be utterly incapable of backing down. Or, maybe it was this pair of particular, matched magical weapons he had, which were intensely powerful, but, when they hit, would dish out some damage to the wielder. Out of character, we knew about them. In-character we had no idea. You can see where this is going. We'd achieved some of what we'd set out to do, and noticed something unusual with a magic item we found. Two pieces which merged into one, and, a PC I'll call Mr. So And So put the pieces together. Mr. Idea, remarked on the similarity in markings between that, and Mr. Trouble's weapons, stating that it could not be a coincidence. Upon hearing that statement, my character approached Mr. Trouble and suggested trying to join his two weapons. Mr. Trouble: (tries, but nothing happens): "I don't feel anything." Me: "Perhaps let Mr. So And So try." Mr. Trouble: "Yeah, if you think you can take them from me." I was taken aback, as I didn't know what the hell caused THAT response. There's no way I could see my character taking that lying down, because the tone was definitely insulting/demeaning. Me: (absolutely shouting this) "SAY THAT AGAIN!!!" Mr. Trouble: "Show me what you got." ONE ROUND of combat ensued. This was 3 years ago. I started RPGs with 1st Edition AD&D back in the mid-80s. Other than one incident that involved lycanthropy and a set of EXTREMELY improbable circumstances deliberately orchestrated by the DM, this was the first time I've ever engaged in a PvP kill. Out of character, I think I'd assumed that the weapons that Mr. Trouble had would do far less "blowback" damage to the wielder, and more damage to the target, than was really the case. I attacked, "knowing" that my character was almost definitely going to die. A shame, because I really liked the full background story I came up with. A lot of shouting/crosstalk ensued, some of which was happening while I was rolling dice. I think some of it involved warning Mr. Trouble, and pointing out the rest of us were a higher level than he (news to me as well), and maybe (I would hope) asking what the hell he was doing. Because I'm pretty sure bellowing "SAY THAT AGAIN" into the mic caught everyone's attention. He talked of only defending himself, but, he won initiative, and just attacked. A natural 20 on my part made this pretty ugly, but the "blowback" damage from his magic weapons did more damage to him than I did. Chaos ensued. My GF was pissed at me at first. Multiple people talking/interjecting back and forth, what was that about, etc. At one point when I explained what happened. Me: (in response to my GF, and having said this multiple times) "I abso-f*cking-lutely DID give him a warning! He got mouthy with the biggest guy in the room, whose people are known for violence. I didn't attack right away, I gave him a very obvious warning! I yelled 'SAY THAT AGAIN!'" My GF: (pause, looks at camera, speaking to Mr. Trouble) "And, did you?" Mr. Trouble: (hesitatant, looking extremely uncomfortable with the question) "Uh, yeah, I did." Needless to say, even though this DM generally had a standing rule of "Whatever happens between players, happens, including PvP," this whole thing didn't go down all that well. Afterwards, via texting, things were said between myself and Mr. Trouble, and literally he said that it's water under the bridge. Backchannel, though, that apparently was NOT the case. Texts from the DM said "Don't let him fool you, he's pissed," and, let's just say that, to this day, some people have been convinced that the words my character spoke were something COMPLETELY different than what was actually spoken. He eventually came in with a new character. I guess I shouldn't have been surprised, though, when the first interaction with my character, based on actions I stated I was considering, potentially life-threating to myself, he tried to screw me over. Using info I was thinking, as my character hadn't spoken at all about it. Mr. Trouble: (to DM) "Let me make a Persuasion check to convince him to do this! I say 'yeah, you can do it, this'll work!'" FOUR times he begged the DM to let him make a Persuasion check. My GF: (writing on a scrap of paper on the desk) "He's not even TRYING to hide it, is he?" DM goes completely stone-faced, but, otherwise acted as if he didn't hear a word Mr. Trouble was saying. Foiled at that attempt, let's jump back to Game 2, a few weeks later. The first session where his character was back together with the rest of the party, Mr. Trouble and my character had separately been brought in for interrogation. Then we were brought into a meeting room together with two NPCs, who laid out the plans for the next mission. After the meeting, we walk out, and for the first time in a very long time, both in and out of character, I thought "Ok, he's going with this. Maybe this is a turning point for his character." It was, but not the one I was hoping for. It was near the end of the session, and we wound up in a cafeteria with the other PCs, and two different NPCs who used to be enemies, but were now allied with us. One, a former slaver, the other an assassin who was now being targeted by their former employer. As part of the planning "for the mission," other PCs suggested certain actions they could take to convince someone we were dead, no longer a threat, etc., and then Mr. Trouble says "And, yeah, to make it look good, we have to REALLY rough up (my character)." And then it escalates. Instead of just negatively reacting to his words like I'd typically do, I "played along" with the verbal game. But, remember where I said he can't back down? Even though later, in texts, he said he expected that I'd just play along with the verbal banter, in game he escalated to a point of no return, in the form of paying the assassin ALL the money he had, IN ADVANCE, to break both of my arms and legs, in the middle of the mission, while we'd be in a very dangerous location. Then when my character objected, he tried to hand-wave it away and said "Let's move on." So, not just being an "edgelord" or "lone wolf" etc. Just a bad player, who not only carried a grudge from one character to the next in the same game, but, having been blocked on that, carried it over to a different game, run by a different GM, regardless of any harm that it would cause to that campaign. Game 2 is still going on, but, in hindsight, that definitely harmed the energy of the game, and of course, he doesn't back down. Let's see if it ultimately kills Game 2 before its time.
The GM of Game 2, while not being happy about that turn of events in Game 2, somehow ALSO seems to be trying to make sure that Mr. Trouble doesn't die/suffer consequences from his own stupidity. Like, seriously, who mouths off to a 4-star general and pulls a gun on the soldiers when you're literally on a military base? That's just one example. I did have something planned which one could say was against Mr. Trouble, but, in game, would probably have zero real consequences to his character. But might prevent something he'd want to do in the future, if it ever actually occurs to him. I'm not sure, but I got the impression that my planned action has already been short circuited by the GM. I'll probably find that out in the next session coming up. That would likely kill the vibe for me. Indirect information suggests that I'm the last player actually interested in going up through the final chapter. There's more detail, but I already maxed out one RUclips comment for length. ------------------- After that novella, I have to say this, because I'm an old codger. Back in my day, carrying a grudge from one of your characters to another, completely unrelated character would definitely get you some strong words of warning from a DM. Once. With a threat of being booted from the table for a repeat offense. Maybe a little more leeway given to a novice player. I can't even say what would've happened carrying a grudge from one campaign/GM to another. I've never seen it in nearly 30 years of gaming.
Ooooh boy, I've been there. I think sometimes people use characters to kind of...live vicariously? Or present a part of themselves they wish they could in real life? So I wonder if there's a reason for wanting to play that kind of character. I definitely left games like that in the past because I just can't with that kind of energy LOL
@@TheFantasyForge My GF, who is a behavior analyst, has expressed a number of ideas regarding that. Also, kudos for sheer endurance in reading through that novella of a post of mine!
I hate it when new characters tell everyone their stats, equipment, and abilities. When was the last time you started a new job and told your coworkers your net worth, where you’ve been the last five years, what you drive, and a family history? I tell them as little as possible and may even lie a little (if it’s within my character)
Im working on a campaign (not dnd) where my players are all going to come in having been arrested for minor crimes. Their goal is to endure trials of honor (essentially hardcore community service) in order to redeem themselves and be proper citizens again. They don't inherently need to work together for this campaign but they will find it easier if they do. They'll all have the same legal liaison (not a lawyer but like an advisor. There's no lawyers in this) which means sometimes they'll just be addressed as a group
@@TheFantasyForge Thanks for the encouragement! I've had this campaign in the works for a long time. I definitely encourage you to borrow the concept if you'd like.
@@TheFantasyForgeaww thanks. Yeah, she’s a race that doesn’t exist in the setting (magical experiment gone wrong), so she’d really like a normal life, but her only skill is sorcery and staying alive. Adventuring time it is!
![Twenty One Pilots - “The Line” (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/E2Rj2gQAyPA/mqdefault.jpg)
My favorite start to a campaign ever (not dnd but still a ttrpg) was when the gm took our background info and went
"okay [cracks knuckles]...
Player 1, you're a teacher of this subject so you brought everyone on a field trip-
Player 2, You're a teacher for a different subject but Player 1 needed another supervisor and you weren't doing anything that day so you signed up for the overtime pay-
Player 3 and 4, you're regular students who are in this class because it's part of your major-
Player 5, you're not really into this whole thing like everyone else. You're a hermit of sorts who likes moving from place to place every so often and when you moved to this big city you were shocked by the higher cost of living. Then you saw students get a discount and hatched a plan to take some bs classes while you stay here.
Anyone got any corrections with anything I said?"
Just bam, bam, bam, bam. It got us right into the first scene without hardly any effort. Don't overthink it, just an elevator pitch's worth of background info to get the PCs in a place together when the call to adventure happens was all we needed.
I realize that won't fit every group but it really worked well for ours.
Call of Cthulu?
@a.t3415 it was a power rangers game, if you can believe it. We had loads of fun giving our corniest dialogue like "that isn't good!" 😁
I am trying to get a group of fairly inexperienced players together in addition to me being a new DM, but I feel like I don’t entirely know where to start. I’ve got lore regarding the world and ik people don’t necessarily want to pay attention to every fine detail so I try not to bog them down with everything. Just enough for them to tell me who their characters are, but they can’t even seem to engage with character creation and it’s been months now so I’m stumped on how to re-engage them. They have even said they’re ready to play but NO ONE has anything written or typed out anything. Like the world is baked and ready to go, their races all have some history for them to pull from if they wanted to, but I can’t get anything substantial beyond one of my players wanting to be the Dragonborn from Skyrim and the other wants to be a level 1 dragon slayer shaman that is a taller-than-normal frost giant. I’ve even tried to work with them on making those ideas work in the world but it just screams “I want to be badass chad main character from the start with no room for development” like cmon man no one is perfect let alone in a fantasy realm where an untold number of variables can go awry at any given time.
Sorry if this feels like I’m venting. I kind of am
I kind of like that approach to getting the PCs together: The Players write the background context, the GM hooks those contexts into the opening scene by circumstance, and the Players may submit final tweaks before confirming. This way, less is disclaimed to the Players, in favor of getting the action moving so that they can start developing their characters and relationships as emergent properties. I'm going to remember that.
@danielfenton9742 in my experience those kind of people are not going to actually try to play. If you can't even get them through character creation you won't be able to get them through playing. Every time we've dropped such a player from our group we've noticed everything speeds right up, the way we wanted, because they were sandbagging the whole process. Sorry but you're better off starting from scratch when it comes to players.
Favorite start for my dark fantasy campaign:
Party all came off a boat and were traveling togeather, stopped at a village for drinks, awesome RP, and went to bed.
Started with each of them waking up in a Coffin deep underground. Each member had to claw their way out before suffocating (one fell unconscious, the others helped dig her out).
Found out BBEG minions cursed the village they were in, buried them, and began a ritual to turn them into minions for BBEG. Soon as they all got out, the had to fight and disrupt necrotic ritual to save the rest of the buried villagers.
Awesome punchy start, loved it 🤘🔥🍻
That is a REALLY good idea! And I think could also be fun when it's not the start of a campaign. I'll probably try to use this with my players, when they are on the road and spend the night in some random village.
@@needycatproductions6830 Oh for sure, and hell yea! That sounds like a great idea to spice up travel. Should be a hell of an encounter. Fun to run, just awesome from the player side 😂Cheers 🍻
@@JS_54 how di they spot the unconscious One?
@tizithegiant basically just noticed that they were missing someone. Perception/Investigation checks to figure out where disturbed dirt was, STR checks to pull her out, medicine checks to revive.
Sense that wasn't the main feature of the session, the combat was, I made it easy so all players could participate in the combat.
No sense in having a dead character not even 30 mins into session 1 lol. But, at the same time, sets the tone which is still quite important.
Wow thats a perfect video i am just writing a campaign for four relatively inexperienced players. Those tips will come in handy im sure!
aw yay! Hope this helps!
My first dm told us to imagine what our characters were doing right before they fell asleep, then promptly informed us (after we told him what our characters did) that after this, our PCs had a very strange dream, then woke up together in the middle of a burnt forest. Cue in a few minutes of roleplay (with mine even getting to say 'not again.') and that's how our party formed.
@@justintyner9615 LOL "not again". Almost as good as the Star Wars "I have a bad feeling about this"
I once solved this problem by first playing an individual session with each player and after that, slamed all of them into the same dungeon from different entrences with the same goal of clearing it out. They weren't forced to come up with excuses to team up, even though they all had strong, different personas.
Once I made the party survive the Apocalypse (one almost died).
Another time they had to share the same table on a full tavern for a while, then I tried to kidnap them during the night.
There's also this time when we started "in media res", aka they were already an adventuring party competing against other groups.
Aaand another time I had a "recruit the team" montage, where they were doing X thing before getting hired. :D
Lol those are so fun, love the montage thing, makes me think of Inglorious Basterds.
One of my favourite ways to build pcs is to say this person spent a lot of time alone and he's looking for friends and adventure. It's simple but as far as my characters concerned theyve found friends and its adventure time. Complexity can come later
00:54 Tip 1: Make them come together narratively
01:21 Tip 2: Have pre-existing relationships
02:01 Tip 3: Give them no other option
03:23 Tip 4: Create shared character goals
04:03 Tip 5: Give them moments to roleplay
04:28 Tip 6: Introduce an external threat
05:06 Tip 7: Set expectations at the beginning
I appreciate your phrasing on the terms: "This is often considered hard railroading". However, presenting your players with a unifying reason to band together isn't simply railroading itself. You are correct that somehow people think it is, but the railroading version of that would be if they witnessed a murder in the city, the guard showed up and immediately detained everyone without giving anyone the chance to role play out of it. Then said they would only be allowed to leave the city if they could prove who actually killed the person that the guards now believe they killed.
appreciate the love! Yeah and ultimately I think it also comes down to different tables, different players, different expectations :)
Awww, THERE you are, Tobias! 5:21 Who's the most adorable little displacer-kitty? Yes, YOU are!
I run my groups 'Troupe style' so everyone has multiple characters ready to go. Whether starting fresh, or an established campaign - generally speaking they are already a part of a community and acquainted (even if only somewhat) with one another, and they swap out characters regularly when the situation dictates. (Healing, training, etc). If we start a new adventure, as opposed to continuing an ongoing adventure, any new characters are already assumed to have made the acquaintance of the group off-camera so to speak. That avoids the whole awkward RP thing that sometimes happens.
Oh, and go on over to 5:22 and give Tobias a Displacer Treat!
I love the troupe idea! Super smart to do it like that
tobias 5:22
an idea i had was the tavern/inn keep is super nice and lets them stay for free when they wake up they find them hanging from a tree outside with a note or something making demands
That's actually really cool and a fun twist on the "meeting in a tavern" trope
I've mostly used the "Rules of the Campaign" approach, like you described.
I tell my players that "You need to consider some way/reason that your character WANTS to go/get along with the party" and that I am not looking to babysit some lone wolf fantasy, this is a team game, DM included.
It worked out well so far. Yes this will turn away some people, but I am looking to have fun and not all games are a place for all people and I am fine with that.
5:21 saw the kitty… and thanks a lot. This helps a lot with my campaigns 😊.
Thank YOU for the love :D
So far, with the campaign I'm writing for at the moment the setting is starting with two regions separating by a giant clock tower, one is in the sky and one is on the ground, the ones in the sky live this rich and "perfect" life with angels at their command which help them whenever they need, and the bottom are fighting for their lives against demons and some have gained control over them. There is a barrier created by the upper regions preventing the bottom regions from going through the clock tower. My idea for how the party will meet is that this strange energy emits from the clock tower and for the first time in centuries that clock towers hand has moved to 1. Leaders from the upper and lower regions force certain people to investigate the tower, upon investigating the tower the floor drops sending them into this dungeon will no exit it feels like. I would then let them role-play for a bit before them hearing a mechanism click which then opens a door they can go through. On the walls to this giant hallway are some murals of some strange creatures they haven't seen before seeing a quick glimpse of a man who runs by, upon catching up to him, he leaves them with a gentle hint about a place to go if they wanna change the rules of this world, before snapping sending them all into the upper region of the world.
Okay this is super creative and sounds really cool. Kinda gives me some crazy anime vibes
Starting out in a prison always works well in Elder Scrolls games, and it's worked super well for me in past D&D campaigns. Once they help each other escape, they're usually pretty close, and then we determine what they have in common, where they're all from, etc.
@Abelhawk The intro, in my current campaign is a massive prison for levels 1-3. Whether they escape or how they escape should bind them, but there is also a mystery haunting the prison a false hydra.
When I joined my first DnD game, it was part way through the campaign, so my half drow arcane trickster was troned into the water elemental plane (long story) by a godlike sphinx.
He did not trust anyone there. Gave a fake name and played the part of a willing party member. Very slowly, over many sessions, he learned to trust them bit by bit an told them his real name.
He was so used to seeing people he knew drop dead the next day, he didn't bother getting close to anyone. Now he has a rivalry with the fighter who tries to steal an extra set of thieve tools off of him, is like a brother to the sorcerer, gets annoyed with the warlock, interigates and makes plans with the barbarian, and talks to the life cleric about religion.
Our campaign is still ongoing. Who knows what lies ahead for Emeric.
poor guy 🥲if Emeric dies, we riot
I made my first campaign as a DM start with every party member been taken hostage by pirates. It gives a first goal (get free), and a common goal/reason to adventure together (hunt down the pirate lord who captured them).
I love pirate games! Sounds really cool
Alright, you guys met on the ship, Player1 the prompt is you have gathered everyone here to discuss something with them...
Player1: "Hey guys, does this scab look weird?"
LMAO there's two types of players in the world...
One of my favorite ways I entered a campaign was one I entered after it had already begun. So I was later addition. The party was in the place to not only get healing for an npc friend of theirs but was also trying to reunite and get assistance from a druid friend of one of them. Well, they arrive at the nature and research facility my character is based out of (my character is a field researcher, charged with recording and reporting on finds they come across in the ruins nearby). The party learns that their druid friend is missing, hasn’t been seen in a while and the last person who saw them was my character. This is when I took the moment to step up and tell the “boss” that this was what I had wished to discuss with him, that I was worried and wished to get permission to find our druid. And that’s how the party and myself teamed up.
Honestly the hard part for me wasn’t the mission (was a rousing success actually which, in dnd, is rare). It was when it became obvious that it was time for the party to depart. I had to figure out why my character would go with these people they have known for a mere few days over the people they had built relationships and trust with in equally dangerous situations for two years. My solution ended up hinging on the god connection my character was already secretly (at that time) established with in their backstory. Basically, my character gets hunches. I made it clear and dropped hints leading up to the departure that my character was feeling this inexplicable pull to accompany the party on their journey. They used some transparent excuses and told those in-character to the party members but eventually admitted, once the god connection came out, that they have had these hunches since childhood that tell them when something needs their attention or for them to do something or warn them about. The implication is that it’s this god. Which actually tied in with two other players’ characters too, as they too shared one. My dm has been great to further expand on this and had woven in that certain family members of each of us used to be their own adventuring party, lol, also with ties to that same god! Should be fun.
Anyway, yeah so that was one of my favorite ways I joined a campaign and then, yeah, the awkwardness of trying to make up a reason for remaining with them after the mission ended. And then the fun of the dm taking that quirk I made up on the fly to help with that and then weaving it into the wider narrative. 😊 It’s just been a ton of fun!
I’m currently playing in a campaign with three “lone wolf” characters. Two of them (played by me and a friend who are more experienced) view it as professional courtesy to pull their weight. The other is played by a pretty inexperienced guy and doesn’t trust anyone, including the party. It’s mostly cool, though, he’s still learning and we’re ready to help him out.
5:23 Cute kitten. In one of my last DND sessions I had a displacer beast pet and I think I would rather sacrifice my character than let any harm come to him. I love your visual representation of what a kitten would look like. I hope you continue to keep him along for the ride on your videos.
I spy with my little eye, a displacer kitty at 5:21 ! In my current campaign, I got them all to make their characters with each other in a group to bounce ideas and establish any relationships as the character idea forms in their head. It also helps that we are all coworkers so we have a real world relationship too.
Just wanted to say that the clips that accompany whatever your saying convey the ideas really clearly and they are really fun
My current campaign is my first true campaign experience, I've only played in a few oneshots before. All the players are people I'm friends with so we get along so well but this is a great video for our DM. This is a steampunk themed campaign he wrote himself. I've sent him a few of your videos and he's great considering he's never been the DM before. He wrote his villains with the intent of then being hateable in ways that really brought us together character wise quite fast. When we first started each of our characters ended up being hired by a mercenary guild and after our first job our characters knew each other well and agreed to take more jobs together, we're now getting a reputation in one of the cities for reliable security contractors.
Love this! Always good to have at least a couple know each other. Sounds like a fun campaign!
@@TheFantasyForge We had another game today, a tough boss fight with a corrupt mayor who was using a thieves guild to rob his own people. Our characters have grown even closer now after we attempted to carry out an arrest on the mayor that ended in a fight.
@@brennonlewis That's awesome! I love me some internal politics. So satisfying when they start connecting dots haha
@@TheFantasyForge We're still on a similar job, just on a much larger scale. In this setting humans and elves are at war with each other and most people believe the elves instigated the conflict. Our quest is to find proof the human king secretly instigated an attack by the elves so he could declare war simply because he was willing to trade thousands of his soldiers for more political power. We're not big fans of the king, kind of ironic because my character is a war veteran who was in the King's Musketeers for 7 years.
Just started a campaign with some friends who are new. Perfect timing!
Hope this helps!
I personally like to make the wilderness in my setting dangerous, to the point where a fighting-able person or ideally two or more is the only reasonable way to travel between settlements, unless you wanna gamble with your life.
Any first adventure will either start on the road, or will demand traveling through the wild to get to the main location. As such, there is allways that forced relience on each other for safety on the road and spending hours if not days traveling togeather, eating togeather, camping togeather, and inevitably getting to know each other at least a little, which makes that whole social contract a lot easier to follow without cognitive dissonance.
A tavern is a neat and iconic way to start, because you could concivably find anyone there, and there will be opertunities for light roleplay, but I find that the road is as good if not better, as any narrowing of who you'd find there just limits it to the adventuring type and people with class levels, which is already a restriction the players have to follow.
I started my last campaign on the road in a caravan for the same reason! I love starting in the wild because you're right, it's dangerous to go alone!
shutting up as a dm is a great tip ngl. that's something i struggled with slightly when starting out.
One thing that I never understand is the "I work alone" character, "I dont wanna walk in group" trope, the edgy and dark person. I mean, this is a COOPERATIVE game, why there are so many people who do this?
Because it's real. You see those characters in all kinds of media. Usually, a good player would ideally want to leave openings for growth, maybe a reason why they're trying to be solo that the party could eventually remedy. If they're just I don't want to be a part of a group and there's nothing deeper than that, then yeah, that's an issue, but we go through all of these backstories and making fleshed out characters and some parties don't actually bother talking about who they are and want they care about. It makes it feel like a wasted effort.
It can work, but needs to be by an experenced player who will role play it well.
@@cjg1029 I know it's a trope and it's real on other medias, but something being popular or even cliche in storytelling doesn't necessarily mean it will work in roleplaying game. If the player isn't experienced or even the party is not at the same page at this specific player, it won't work. In my almost 10 years of experience playing RPG, the tendency is that it will not work, because those who want to do this do not play this characters because they want to explore a deep and sad backstory or something like that, most of the time they just want to me edgy and act like a fuckin badass solo hero
this is so helpful and also a great reminder to think about the roleplay in a healthy way and how to guide it.
Glad it helps! Definitely always want to think about the team dynamic over anything else
I like to ask my players what they want out of their characters naratively. "To do big damage and beat the bad guy" is a fine enough reason to play a ttrpg, but you can do so much more. Are you playing a rogue to avoid the spotlight and be the enforcer of your group, or are you just a five finger discount lover? Are you a sorcrerer because you want to explore the pull of destiny and go on the Hero's Journey, or maybe you wish to tell the tale of how natural talent can triumph over hard work, only to realize that by youing your talent, you engaged in the hard work? So on. What is your character arc, and how big does it have to be to be meaningful.
An example. I played an eladrin sorcerer who held a view that might makes right and those in power earned it through might. This was immediatelt challenged by the gnome artificer. He was an anarchist. Backstory was a literal anarcho-terrorist cell. We butted heads, and after failing a wisdom saving throw, I contracted madness that made me a staunch monarchist. Nothing could fix that, save death. Well, I died. Don't worry, I got better. After being revived, she took a new worldview, more in line with the gnome. Keep in mind, we are two years into a campaign, and our characters still hutted heads, but we had grown a strong friendship. I went from telling everyone what to do to asking what everyone wanted to do in the situation.
That's right, I invented democracy for my table. True democracy that included our NPCs! And the gnome? We became extremely close friends. Any time the party split, for shopping or anything, we were together. Never evolved beyond friendship, but we watched each other's backs constantly.
I saw Tobias at 5:22 :3
this is my first of your videos I'm watching, I didn't realize he was an easter egg to hunt lol
LOL well good catch ;)
I am a brand new DM and have only been actually playing for about 2 months now but I liked my first session quiet a bit but one of my players who is also the DM who got me into dnd did mention the whole no reason for them to work together so these tips are appreciated so far there is a Dracolich which is part of my why of the campaign and they are about to meet two new factions too but with these tips should help me keep it rolling steady
5:25 didn’t know Tobias made a cameo in the D&D movie. What a talented kitty
I could get on board with a campaign in which I start out traveling to investigate a place mentioned in a message a thief who stole an object of great personal value to me. When I get there, I find others with the same problem. Maybe that object has a greater purpose and they must be brought together for good or for ill? Either way, I have to work with my newfound allies to get back what was stolen.
Love that idea! Like you just think it's special to you only to learn its actually special for other reasons too
@@TheFantasyForge It could make for an interesting session 0. have a one on one with the DM for 30 minutes to an hour tying your backstory into the campaign through RP. That way, it will be a surprise to all of the players to find themselves bumping into each other on session 1, learning they all have a mutual goal (and a mutual destiny).
@@greevar I normally have a one on one session with each player individually to help ease them into their characters
first key:
travelling together gives them a reason to be in the same place in the same time
second key:
pre-existing relationships. former comrades, friends, family members, same faction/organization/company
third key:
give them on other option. usually dire situations. for example: only survivors of the crashed ship
fourth key:
shared character goals and/or motivations. may be the same personal vendetta, quest for finding the same artifact etc
fifth key:
DM tip. give players moments to roleplay
sixth key:
introduce an external threat. quick way to force player characters together (they all want gold, artifacts, power etc)
seventh key:
set expectations at the beginning. talk to the players before the game even starts, one of the rules is to work together
5:20 Tobias is the best at setting expectations for the players.
purrfectly
Tobias ar 5:20! In my first homebrew campaign, I had everyone arrive at the same dock town Tavern and let them interact naturally, but in the middle of the night, the city alarm sounded. PIRATES! Everyone got involved real quick ☠️
Thinking of a cool idea for a one shot right now and dnd saw is kinda a cool idea. Might do that now. Thank you.
Haha I thought about that the moment I wrote it too. I was like "....wait....that sounds cool"
Writing an Uber dark fantasy campaign and this was one of the issues I feel I struggle with as a DM. I can’t wait to cook up a good intro with these tips!
5:24 - I didn't know Tobias had a cameo in the DND movie!
How could they not? Look at him!
Perfect timing ive been struggling with how im gonna do this for my upcoming campaign
glad it helped! :D
Nice work on the video!
BRO THE COW NOISE IN THE AD SCARED ME I AM NOT CUT OUT FOR THIS
On a more serious note, after running 3 campaigns (2 flops, 1 still running), I've come to realize two things:
1: GETTING ON THE SAME PAGE: Some people are just not meant to play together. If I want to DM a dark & gritty experience where the players are ex-convicts banished to a hell-adjacent realm because the world's prisons became flooded, one player wants to play Strixhaven (which is an amazing module, fight me abt it), and a second player wants to be a shounen anime protagonist, we need to talk that shit out. None of us are gonna have fun if we're all looking for different experiences. Mood = ruined.
2: SESSION 0 IS IMPORTANT, APPARENTLY: There's not much to say here. All players need to agree on what role in the party each person fills. No shit right? Do a session zero, or all the stuff in the video you just watched is gonna become reality.
LMAO it's okay we'll do this together
100%, we all have different personalities and session zero is good for feeling out who is good for your table and who is not
My party all woke up in the same enchanted forest together, with their memories of how they got there wiped. So, forced to work together with no recollection of if they know each other or not, so might as well assume they do
Tobias! 5:23-5:24 Watch out for that rogue, he’s a liar!!
he's got a good sense for people...unless they offer scritches
In my upcoming campaign I will force them together. Like in the inn they are staying at is attacked by zombies. So now they will need to first fight off the zombies and find out what caused the outbreak. Before getting to a safe heaven, but that will require them to work together or become part of the hoard
Love the idea of a zombie attack haha. Gives me COD vibes
@@TheFantasyForge Thank you session zero will be in a week. And I’m pretty excited as I have worked a lot to prepare for the campaign😁
5:22 is the lil kitty kat, thx for he vid! I've been trying to find a new group to play dnd with... any recommendations on how to fin 1?
Reddit! r/lfg is a great place to start
@@TheFantasyForge thx!
5:23 oh hey it's Tobias
5:24 sweet Tobias who is a good boy?
Hii Tobias 5:22 i’ve recently started a campaign of my own and this vid gave me some great ideas ❤
glad it helped! Would love to hear about them
My party meshed when i had a goblin kill their tracking hound. They all vowed to get revenge, and the bond they made could never be broken
WOW LMAO, going in hard 🤣 *insert John Wick "you shouldn't have killed my dog" meme*
Great video!
Last time I found a very simple way to make theme work together : I just made everyone broke
LOL I mean that works, that's definitely one way
5:25 give em’ a pet for me
I like all of these, but Tip 3 has never gotten me anywhere. Any time I've tried the "you guys needs to cooperate" angle with new people, they seem to each want to go off on their own goals which splits the narrative immediately.
Maybe it's just my experience, but it unless action is involved the "survival" aspect especially seems to make people want to split up and explore.
The final tip about laying out guidelines beforehand has been my best friend. I tell everyone straight out, "We do like to roleplay and make sure everyone is having fun."
5:21 ceat
Yes, set expectations at the beginning! First and foremost, make an adventurer! Second, you must make a character that will work with the party!
I always start off my players with a good reason to trust one another by having them do something together that requires teamwork. Because, let's be honest, you would not travel in the wild with someone you don't trust.
5:22 Tobias
You are on a ship. It is being attacked by a sea monster. Roll initiative.
Now, separately, because I am never going to clutter a Tobias sighting post with my own rambling, your comment about the "edgelord" characters and the comment about one of the rules being that they need to be willing to work together. And, this is going to be a LONG one. No, really, it's stupidly long, and is probably venting to a degree.
Because, ho'boy. Yeah, there's this one guy. Maybe we all know of one of them. It's "interesting" because he's an experienced player, with a bit of acting background. Let's call him Mr. Trouble. SOME of the others in my gaming groups have gamed with him before.
In the first game I played with him, he was interesting. His character was a little odd/out there, but in a way that mostly worked WITH the group. There was a slight undercurrent of him wanting to do something to screw with the fellow party members, but subdued, and he intentionally delivered it in a way that suggested "you should not go along with what my character is saying."
Maybe that was a hint.
Game 2, different genre, Mr. Trouble wasn't there at the very beginning, and when he did join, was there irregularly at first (real-world issues going on), but his character started as a comic-relief, though a troublesome one, that quickly had me wondering why we were working with the guy. He "evolved," but not for the better. Definitely all about himself, and the rest of the group was just a convenience for him. A very "fair-weather friend" with a generous dollop of self-entitlement thrown in. Side note: my GF, who will call me out on my crap when I engage in crap, observed this game for a while well after the beginning, then joined in some time significantly later.
What irked me more is that his character engaged in a very low-level not-quite bullying of my character.
Game 1 ended relatively early into Game 2.
Game 3, fully remote (my GF and I live together, so online together from the same location), started and ended while Game 2 ran, and was yet a different genre from the first two. My GF was in this game start to finish, and, Mr. Trouble again came in a little late in. His persona was so similar to that in Game 2 that my GF and I had both slipped and called his character by his Game 2 character's name. Once. Between ourselves, more often because he seemed like the SAME guy, down to the self-entitlement and, in this case, rubbing most other PCs the wrong way at a minor level. I could excuse SOME of it as his character was intended to work to cross-purposes with the rest of the PCs, but we weren't supposed to know. You would think he would try to play nice to allay any suspicion.
BUT, his character, NOT physically imposing, and NOT winning any popularity contests, did something SUPER dumb. My character was a hulking brute whose people are known for short tempers and violence. Mostly my character had been one of few words, VERY reserved, reluctant to speak unprompted. And, while the players didn't know, but the DM did, my character, based on their background story, definitely had a little paranoia and a bit of a persecution complex. Plus a weird undercurrent of being a slightly scientific-minded.
The only thing I can think of is, maybe from Game 2, he had become so accustomed to the low-level mouthing off and picking on my character that he forgot that he was in a different game. Maybe. I've also been told that he may be utterly incapable of backing down. Or, maybe it was this pair of particular, matched magical weapons he had, which were intensely powerful, but, when they hit, would dish out some damage to the wielder. Out of character, we knew about them. In-character we had no idea.
You can see where this is going.
We'd achieved some of what we'd set out to do, and noticed something unusual with a magic item we found. Two pieces which merged into one, and, a PC I'll call Mr. So And So put the pieces together. Mr. Idea, remarked on the similarity in markings between that, and Mr. Trouble's weapons, stating that it could not be a coincidence. Upon hearing that statement, my character approached Mr. Trouble and suggested trying to join his two weapons.
Mr. Trouble: (tries, but nothing happens): "I don't feel anything."
Me: "Perhaps let Mr. So And So try."
Mr. Trouble: "Yeah, if you think you can take them from me."
I was taken aback, as I didn't know what the hell caused THAT response. There's no way I could see my character taking that lying down, because the tone was definitely insulting/demeaning.
Me: (absolutely shouting this) "SAY THAT AGAIN!!!"
Mr. Trouble: "Show me what you got."
ONE ROUND of combat ensued.
This was 3 years ago. I started RPGs with 1st Edition AD&D back in the mid-80s. Other than one incident that involved lycanthropy and a set of EXTREMELY improbable circumstances deliberately orchestrated by the DM, this was the first time I've ever engaged in a PvP kill.
Out of character, I think I'd assumed that the weapons that Mr. Trouble had would do far less "blowback" damage to the wielder, and more damage to the target, than was really the case. I attacked, "knowing" that my character was almost definitely going to die. A shame, because I really liked the full background story I came up with.
A lot of shouting/crosstalk ensued, some of which was happening while I was rolling dice. I think some of it involved warning Mr. Trouble, and pointing out the rest of us were a higher level than he (news to me as well), and maybe (I would hope) asking what the hell he was doing. Because I'm pretty sure bellowing "SAY THAT AGAIN" into the mic caught everyone's attention.
He talked of only defending himself, but, he won initiative, and just attacked. A natural 20 on my part made this pretty ugly, but the "blowback" damage from his magic weapons did more damage to him than I did.
Chaos ensued. My GF was pissed at me at first. Multiple people talking/interjecting back and forth, what was that about, etc. At one point when I explained what happened.
Me: (in response to my GF, and having said this multiple times) "I abso-f*cking-lutely DID give him a warning! He got mouthy with the biggest guy in the room, whose people are known for violence. I didn't attack right away, I gave him a very obvious warning! I yelled 'SAY THAT AGAIN!'"
My GF: (pause, looks at camera, speaking to Mr. Trouble) "And, did you?"
Mr. Trouble: (hesitatant, looking extremely uncomfortable with the question) "Uh, yeah, I did."
Needless to say, even though this DM generally had a standing rule of "Whatever happens between players, happens, including PvP," this whole thing didn't go down all that well.
Afterwards, via texting, things were said between myself and Mr. Trouble, and literally he said that it's water under the bridge. Backchannel, though, that apparently was NOT the case. Texts from the DM said "Don't let him fool you, he's pissed," and, let's just say that, to this day, some people have been convinced that the words my character spoke were something COMPLETELY different than what was actually spoken.
He eventually came in with a new character. I guess I shouldn't have been surprised, though, when the first interaction with my character, based on actions I stated I was considering, potentially life-threating to myself, he tried to screw me over. Using info I was thinking, as my character hadn't spoken at all about it.
Mr. Trouble: (to DM) "Let me make a Persuasion check to convince him to do this! I say 'yeah, you can do it, this'll work!'"
FOUR times he begged the DM to let him make a Persuasion check.
My GF: (writing on a scrap of paper on the desk) "He's not even TRYING to hide it, is he?"
DM goes completely stone-faced, but, otherwise acted as if he didn't hear a word Mr. Trouble was saying.
Foiled at that attempt, let's jump back to Game 2, a few weeks later. The first session where his character was back together with the rest of the party, Mr. Trouble and my character had separately been brought in for interrogation. Then we were brought into a meeting room together with two NPCs, who laid out the plans for the next mission.
After the meeting, we walk out, and for the first time in a very long time, both in and out of character, I thought "Ok, he's going with this. Maybe this is a turning point for his character."
It was, but not the one I was hoping for. It was near the end of the session, and we wound up in a cafeteria with the other PCs, and two different NPCs who used to be enemies, but were now allied with us. One, a former slaver, the other an assassin who was now being targeted by their former employer.
As part of the planning "for the mission," other PCs suggested certain actions they could take to convince someone we were dead, no longer a threat, etc., and then Mr. Trouble says "And, yeah, to make it look good, we have to REALLY rough up (my character)."
And then it escalates. Instead of just negatively reacting to his words like I'd typically do, I "played along" with the verbal game. But, remember where I said he can't back down? Even though later, in texts, he said he expected that I'd just play along with the verbal banter, in game he escalated to a point of no return, in the form of paying the assassin ALL the money he had, IN ADVANCE, to break both of my arms and legs, in the middle of the mission, while we'd be in a very dangerous location.
Then when my character objected, he tried to hand-wave it away and said "Let's move on."
So, not just being an "edgelord" or "lone wolf" etc. Just a bad player, who not only carried a grudge from one character to the next in the same game, but, having been blocked on that, carried it over to a different game, run by a different GM, regardless of any harm that it would cause to that campaign.
Game 2 is still going on, but, in hindsight, that definitely harmed the energy of the game, and of course, he doesn't back down.
Let's see if it ultimately kills Game 2 before its time.
The GM of Game 2, while not being happy about that turn of events in Game 2, somehow ALSO seems to be trying to make sure that Mr. Trouble doesn't die/suffer consequences from his own stupidity. Like, seriously, who mouths off to a 4-star general and pulls a gun on the soldiers when you're literally on a military base? That's just one example.
I did have something planned which one could say was against Mr. Trouble, but, in game, would probably have zero real consequences to his character. But might prevent something he'd want to do in the future, if it ever actually occurs to him. I'm not sure, but I got the impression that my planned action has already been short circuited by the GM. I'll probably find that out in the next session coming up.
That would likely kill the vibe for me. Indirect information suggests that I'm the last player actually interested in going up through the final chapter. There's more detail, but I already maxed out one RUclips comment for length.
-------------------
After that novella, I have to say this, because I'm an old codger.
Back in my day, carrying a grudge from one of your characters to another, completely unrelated character would definitely get you some strong words of warning from a DM. Once. With a threat of being booted from the table for a repeat offense. Maybe a little more leeway given to a novice player.
I can't even say what would've happened carrying a grudge from one campaign/GM to another. I've never seen it in nearly 30 years of gaming.
Ooooh boy, I've been there. I think sometimes people use characters to kind of...live vicariously? Or present a part of themselves they wish they could in real life? So I wonder if there's a reason for wanting to play that kind of character.
I definitely left games like that in the past because I just can't with that kind of energy LOL
@@TheFantasyForge My GF, who is a behavior analyst, has expressed a number of ideas regarding that.
Also, kudos for sheer endurance in reading through that novella of a post of mine!
@@josephvahabzadeh1289 Hey I will read and respond to every comment until it becomes physically impossible haha.
I hate it when new characters tell everyone their stats, equipment, and abilities.
When was the last time you started a new job and told your coworkers your net worth, where you’ve been the last five years, what you drive, and a family history?
I tell them as little as possible and may even lie a little (if it’s within my character)
Yeah I do too haha, I always ask them "describe what they are seeing" instead of "introduce yourself"
Im working on a campaign (not dnd) where my players are all going to come in having been arrested for minor crimes. Their goal is to endure trials of honor (essentially hardcore community service) in order to redeem themselves and be proper citizens again. They don't inherently need to work together for this campaign but they will find it easier if they do. They'll all have the same legal liaison (not a lawyer but like an advisor. There's no lawyers in this) which means sometimes they'll just be addressed as a group
I love that! Sounds awesome to me, I'd love to play in that
@@TheFantasyForge Thanks for the encouragement! I've had this campaign in the works for a long time. I definitely encourage you to borrow the concept if you'd like.
o.o your head is on fire
Money
LOL yeah I mean fair, that's as good a reason as any
XD yes! My current character is literally in it to make a living, since nobody will hire her for a “normal” job.
@@hyzmarie "Normal"? LOL like your character just wants to work a counter but has to resort to adventuring? I love that
@@TheFantasyForgeaww thanks. Yeah, she’s a race that doesn’t exist in the setting (magical experiment gone wrong), so she’d really like a normal life, but her only skill is sorcery and staying alive. Adventuring time it is!
@@hyzmarie Love the experiment angle! Always fun to do something new and make your party guess haha