497. I’ve finally managed the perfect KERF bend
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- I had resigned myself to using veneer or laminate before trying a few more attempts on the beech ply and one of my techniques worked perfectly. Now it’s full steam ahead on the planned design
#diy #design #like
Hi James, whilst I admire your persistence what you really need is “flexible ply” which is quite expensive but will bend very easily to any radius you want very quickly and with out fear of breaking and no waste !
I mentioned this to James weeks ago . i use`d to sell loads of the stuff to my local cabinet makers,,
I think a little steam from a iron will help soften it.
James, have you thought about using a steam cleaner, when we want to bend wood we tend to put our piece of wood into a steam tube, let them steam for a few hours then put them into the jigs then clamp it up and leave it to dry.
those hand held steam cleaners could be an ideal thing to use, or even maybe trying with an iron and blasting it with steam from the iron. better than soaking it with water ..... maybe that will give better results.
there is one downfall with kerf bending and tight radius corners you will always get those lines appearing , and trying to sand them falt could cause the cuts to appear or even break through. i would say make up a steam box and steam the tighter curves.
Or an industrial thick polythene bag , for size of pieces he is using . .works just as well .... with a few vent holes so steam can flow .... Heck a pressure cooker and bit of copper tubing . .. diy style
Hi James I give you 10 out of 10 for effort, lovely to see it forming. Have great week 😊
Reminds me of a time when I referred to my dad as stubborn. He was quick to reply that he was not stubborn, he was determined.
I used to work for a small company which repaired school furniture and we often had to make replacement ply seat bases which had a double curve (down at the front and up at the back). They would have originally been steamed and bent, but we didn't have the equipment, so we used boiling water which we poured over the ply, then clamped it in a jig which we left overnight. This provided an even curve without the need for cuts. From memory I think we used 6mm ply, so a bit thinner than yours. The ply required only a light sanding to smooth the grain raised by the water. You may be able to use your method, but removing less depth of material, then pour boiling water and bend. This may give the result you are seeking, but retain more strength in the curve.
Fibreglass would be the ideal reinforcing material, James, and it would be another string to your bow.
Also, bear in mind that caravan cupboards (and internal walls) are usually made of 4mm ply, on thin hardwood carcassing. No need for 3" x 2" everywhere. 2" x 1" softwood will do.
You'll save a fortune!
All the best, mate.
Yes old school 2x1 inch softwood roofing batten is cheap as chips .
Paid less than £10 for 6 lengths at 3.8 meter each
Heat and steam will help with the wood bending mate
I think old-time cabinet makers used a steam cabinet to apply heat and moisture to the wood they wanted to bend. Things like Thonet chairs were made that way.
I hired a wallpaper stripper for a very similar project. You need a good jig, space and a lot of patience. Steam works well but it has done in very gradual stages. Having said that if I was to do something like this again I absolutely would use steam again. It works well but it's very slow.
Makers of traditional bentwood boxes use steam to put ninety degree bends in solid western red cedar boards.
I made a steam box for bending hazel poles when Yurt building
Young James. Its all about the "Grape" and the "Grain". One should never mix the two. Take it from me thats one hell of a hangover ! Love Ya Man ...🤣🤣🤣
I admire your tenacity with this James it is a no comprise attitude .that every one should use when it comes to fitting out a boat
After all it is going to be their home ..For many years to come.
When you start cutting corners it will only come back and bite you in the bank account. further down the line.
As many have found out to their cost...I recently was contacted by a boat owner who wanted a estimate for work that needed
Doing on his boat.. I e . A new kitchen as the cabinets had warped...??? When asked by him why. this issue had occurred..
As the boat was only five years old. ..the simple answer to this question was ..none of the edges of all the cabinets had been sealed when they were installed...none of the work tops edges had been sealed ....if this had been carried out before installation
He would not be looking at a new kitchen for years to come...
James if you are looking for narrow units ..check out the depth of wall mounted kitchen units they come in a variety of heights.
And if you don't need the doors they cost next to nothing to buy I can't build them for what they cost when you add in the labour and materials cost...just a thought .mate..if you were concerning building your own. Units. ..
Anyway James keep safe and well. And keep up the high standards you are showing to all.
Hi James , fibreglass resin and matting will make your curve very strong and it's cheap and easy to work with. Regards Brad.
Hey James here’s an idea try using an clothes iron on a steam setting to soften the wood,Before you bend and glue it. Just a thought. Cheers.
Or a wallpaper steamer
Perhaps some thin strips of ply glued vertically on the back of the curve will strengthen the wood cheaply and quickly
James, you need to use very hot water or steam to saturate the boards, so the fibres expand and make the veneer more flexible. Give it more time too, at least an hour or two, and don't rush when shaping the curve.
Cold water doesn't work nearly as well.
What you arrived at at the end is not really kerf bending any more, might as well buy thinner plywood for the flat sides and some of the very thin flexible plywood to act as a veneer. You already noticed the downside - the curve is much thinner so easy to damage.
That glue looks like your porridge :) there's a thought Quakers filler
Loving it! But what I like the most is the guitar instrumental you are using. I think of it as your theme song now.
Dad made it a few weeks ago as he has finally managed to learn how to use the loop pedal
I’ve sent it to a friend who’s going to add some drums to it
@@TheNarrowboatThatJamesBuilt tell him it’s fabulous. It works beautifully!
To stiffen up the bend and give it some protection how about your favourite medium ....... expanding foam ?
You could line the inside of the curve with some of the waste curves you’ve done as fillets, when glued would look a lot neater inside
I definitely recommend having some forms that the inside of the curve is resting against to properly keep it in shape. I also agree with everyone else suggesting steaming the panel before bending. Steaming is an extremely effective way to bend wood.
Yes from experience a former on inside and outside curves give best results
That was so frustrating . Glad you found a sweet spot with the ply. It’s coming on James x
Really starting to look good James, awesome job!
Anoche solution I would propose is paper mâché, made with wallpaper paste is amazingly strong, but made with PVA woodworking glue it would also be reasonably water resistant
Use a wallpaper steamer it will help better than just water
Hi James ,I started my joiner apprenticeship at 16 and am now 58 , I watch with a mixture of horror , wonder and admiration at your joinery but your perseverance is beyond reproach , you`ve basically hit upon how a bull nose step on the bottom of stairs are sometimes done with the ply bent around a solid curved block of cheaper timber , obviously your not wanting to make a block 900mm long ,so from where you`ve left it and as much as I`m horrified to suggest this , PVA glue the back as you are doing and spray with your trusty foam , when its dry it`ll be solid enough , just trim to tidy .
Perseverance should be the name of his boat.
That is the best way to do it! Nice job!
Have you thought of using wallpaper stripper to steam the cuts ?
Using kerf cuts + moisture + heat + jig is what I've seen mostly, also usinga few thin sheets with glue and then formed into the shape to dry is another method. But I think you've got it!
You might try using in the kerf, where you have removed the wood on the inside, the black or white bendy laminate that you chose not to apply to the outside, instead of the glue and sawdust mixture. it is rigid and you could get away with maybe just one ply of it or possibly two plys, still using glue to laminate them all together . still forming your kerv like the plywood, but with a flexible product. hidden from the eye. creating the bendable ply with the strength you need, and still having the wood face on the outside.
If you got a wallpaper steamer or can attach a pipe to the spout of kettle and keep it boiling and steam the wood it will bend a lot better
Hi James why not try a wallpaper steamer you know the flat ones
regards Gary
your up to yer neck in it there mate....from narrowboathands
Someone below in the comments said you should name your boat "Perseverance"....I second that suggestion, since you have it in spades! 🙂
It may be better if you can steam the cuts as well as wetting it down. Get a boiling kettle under it.
A steamer is good or you can buy mdf with a veneer already fluted. To stop the lines you need them closer together like cardboard.
Try cascamite mixed with saw dust for the filler. Dad used it when he built our sailing cruiser back in the 1970's. He swore by the stuff. Only thing is if you get it wrong planing concrete is easier.
Hi James look up Colin Jacks he done his narrowboat fit out a couple of years ago he had curved furniture for his kitchen well worth the Look he is a carpenter by trade
some steam from say an iron or a wallpaper steamer might do the job
Could you use the cheaper ply your using now for 90% of the cupboards and just use flexi ply just for the rounded bits you need to cut on costs?
Most impressive how you reason these issues through. By the way, is that really some of your dad's music in the vlog? Leigh
Good thinking
Try and use a wallpaper stripper to steam the wood first
💜💙💚
You could fill the curve with clear resin !
Hi you can buy flexible plywood it take the headache out of what your doing hope this helps.
I’ve spoken about this - it’s quite expensive and tricky to work with by the looks of things - I’m hoping this will work
Thanks Trev
What is so tricky about using flexible plywood? It’s made for exactly the purpose you need it for .
Im wonderjng about using copper or stainless steel in instead of wood ? For me copper would look nice and bend easy
Also the thinned bit of panel will be very prone to breaking if hit.
You need bowling hot water for 25 mins 😊ok have fun
Hey, my husband was wondering why you don’t use Lauan as it is easily bendable? Can you jot get it there in England?
👍
You can buy flexible plywood you know ?
Told tha o James ..... router was the way to go ..... but you really want steam , as water only penetrates the upper layers ...
You want full penetration...
Great job though ,but chisel on plywood NO NO NO ....
Grand job
If you're worried about weak of thin areas , where braces are ,the channel ,fill with car body filler
Good idea wy porridge mix ... sawdust and glue
I’ve learned my lesson - no chisels near ply !!!
@@TheNarrowboatThatJamesBuilt oh and James, make your life easier .... if all of your rounded boards are off similar size ,
Make yourself a jig ,so that you can use a template, make it how you'd draw a box in pen , divided into quarters ....
So router can stay always level ...not balancing on one edge
Use 5mil ply and just add that 5mm to depth of cut required ...
Use the metal plate ,with small stuck out metal funnel ,as this is made for jig use...
That's if your bisch router came with that attachment !! Bosch not bisch 😂
Actually scratch first jig idea , make like a 3inch wide rectangle ,so router base covers both sides ,which can be as long as you need ...
Make from some mdf , much more useful for jigs ... and make sure guide attachment funnel ,sits around a mm shy of depth ....
Then as said before you can then route out all material ,quxik and easy ,just by camping your jig in place ... make edge of jig around 5inch on each side after rectangle cut out ...to give support .
Plus do clamps don't get in way of router .
Hi James defo steam and its slowly does it need to get the wood soaked through the steam forces the moisture in iron with wet towel or wall paper steamer its a slow process to bend then fix and let dry
So would 4mm ply suffice?
Have you thought about sanding down the curve on your bent wood shaping?
Sorry just seen the end result, looks good! 👍
Why not use spray foam on the curve.
What if you make the cuts closer using 5 mm instead of 10mm
Uniform cuts of same depth and made closer together will allow maximum flexibility when bending to create curves
@@andrewarthurmatthews6685 umm…isn’t that what I just said???
When you use the router, why aren't you running the curved edge of the router against your spirit level 'fence'? It would save you making the initial saw cuts.
(It's what I did when making my lighting channels)
more cuts closer together not less
👍👌❤️🇨🇦
Hi , what's your trade please.
I don’t have one. Just a DIYer - although I feel I’m getting better
@TheNarrowboatThatJamesBuilt Thought you were a chippy , don't know
how you juggle all those kids , x's and two boats fair play .
Thanks for playing the music again. What is the title?
Van Halen - Eruption
@@knight2255I’ll take that as a nice compliment, mate, but I don’t think Van Halen would be too chuffed to be mistaken for little old me!
Your wasting a lot of ply messing about with this, buy some flexi ply or have square cabinets.
Steam it
hot water
It amazes me that Tubers go through time, money, and material to reinvent stuff, when it can be researched and done right the first time or bought at a low cost. But that would cut into views.
Please just buy flexible ply like many of already commented you just laminate them together. Any curve you like very very easy. This is quite painful watching
body filler would work
epoxy
Yeah I agree