Why Schneider Electric Chose this New Consumer Unit Busbar
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- Опубликовано: 31 май 2024
- The new Easy 9 Multi-Row consumer unit from Schneider Electric introduces a new way for electricians to comply with the latest UK wiring regulations - BS7671 18th Edition Amendment 2
The new double pole busbar is designed to use the latest Arc Fault Detection Devices - VigiARC. The AFDDs are fitted to a dedicated busbar within this dual or triple-row consumer unit arrangement.
In this video, Gary Hayers and Richard Gaunt run through the assembly procedure, and choices electricians can make to deal with most residential electrical installations.
Check out the full installation video
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⏱TIME STAMPS ⏱
00:00 Schneider Easy 9 Compact Multi Row Consumer Unit
00:21 Easily removed DIN rail
01:00 AFDDs
01:30 Dual pole comb busbar
01:56 Neutral links
02:29 SPD wiring kit
03:40 Right-hand configuration
05:08 A Type RCBOs
05:23 Identifying the functional earth
07:14 Fully assembled
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PART2 - Check out the *full installation video* ruclips.net/video/xI7asTkbcCg/видео.html
That all looks wonderful!! Only problem is it will be out of date by the time the customer has regained consciousness after you tell them how much the bill is 😂
Man I can just see how expensive this is. It hurts my eyes 😭
Import the French units unpopulated, just with DIN rails, and populate with UK RCBOs.
@@johnburns4017 Plastic panel box is now not allowed to be installed in homes in UK.
@@IAmThe_RA
They are behind a metal door panel. Totally acceptable in the UK.
@@johnburns4017But their breakers are double pole. Their standard DB usually has only one short Neutral bar, one short Line bar and one long Earth bar. It's even more complicated if you are going to install RCDs+MCBs instead of RCBOs.
The dual pole vigi busbar was developed decades ago originally for RCD + MCB setup. It is widely used in some countries. If the dual comb busbar would be used on bottom side of RCBO or AFDD, then the neutral fly leads could be completely eliminated. In addition to that if the functional earth would be connected to the DIN rail with a spring connector then it would eliminate the need of functional earth cable as well. (The DIN rail should be connected to earth bar of course) As an installer I do not understand why those are not developed years ago.
Note for the video: Use the plastic end cap for the busbars (mandatory in my country), cut the copper bar next to the comb and you should not worry about the exposed conductor.
Yep. Us Aussies generally use the Clipsal (by Schneider) or the NHP versions of the 1P or 3P busbar for boards. We dress on the left, so Main switch, then RCBOs left/right. These assemblies have been a thing here for more than 20 years. We would cut them up between RCDs - no more than 3 final subcircuits per RCD and no more than 63A per RCD.
We don't get metal consumer units here for domestic. I'd love to see that be a thing...
With the busbar sticking out a bit, I always cut mine back to the nearest tab. That way the busbar is always inside the width of the breakers.
It is so interesting and simple how they wire up a load center across the pond is so different we do over here in the US
Your distribution board looks 20 years behind.
Full height RCBO's and functional earths! Have we gone back in time?
and double wide afdds and SPDs, truly schneider is behind the times and their prices are horrendious
Agree, fusebox do better for a fraction of the price.
Exactly who in their right mind is gonna buy this
@@arcadia1701e I can get mini rcbos that are double pole for half the price, a 20way (which this looks to be) a fraction of the size and single module afdds.
For the domestic market my money is always on fusebox, even tho anything remotely commercial or industrial I'll only go for schneider
That's what I was thinking.
absolutely Beautiful! I love the fact he's dressing his cables.... first time I've seen Cable Ties being used in a consumer unit! I would love to see that done here in the states.... we are still so sloppy with our cabling!
Thanks for calling them Cable Ties.
Correctly.
@@FirstDan2000
In the USA is usually Ty-wraps.
THEY ARE ALL COMPETING WITH EACH OTHER TO SEE WHO MAKES THE MOST DIFFUCULT BOARD TO COMPREHEND
And the most money
I seen double stack consumer units used in Europe for years and also the busbar fed from the top. I guess we are heading more this way now with more and more tech going inside. In Europe I’ve seen a plug socket and contactors in domestic consumer units
Yes, because here you can mix different manufacturer in one box. Like using one or more 9 rows Schneider Prisma (or any other manufacturer) and you can build the entire smart home into one system. UK loves the metallic boxes puzzle with trunks. The only disadvantage is that in the UK the manufacturer is responsible for the conformity of the boxes, while here the installer is responsible for the documentation and the CE mark if multiple things are installed to the same cabinet.
@@gabor.nadudvari With bus-bars you could usually can't mix multiple manufacturers. Only with cables it's possible. That's the sense of standardization: to be able to mix multiple systems and be interchangeable. I don't like his installations as he mixes multiple cables diameters without any explanation. Why use a neutral terminal block if he daisy chain some neutral connections. The certification had to be done after installation as you need to take the measurements of the whole system and not only the box. Today you plug in an installation tester and press the correct button for the test and print out the measurements.
They need to bring PoN RCBOs DBs to the domestic market, they are so good and you can make industrial Installs look really good,
Regulations - Must install AFDDs in certain locations.
Most manufacturers - Let's make a single pole device that fits in existing consumer units.
Schneider - let's make massive AFDDs separate from the breakers and then make a huge consumer unit to fit them in and tell electricians this is the best way of doing it, at the same time, charging them 3 times as everyone else.
Best we go all the French way. That is mandatory double pole interrupters and a _comb_ L&N busbar at the top. Best have the the interrupters make the earth fylead against the DIN rail behind. Then just earth the DIN rail with a 1.00mm conductor.
We have a three phase Hager distribution panel, what I like about this install is that the mains distribution to the breakers comes through a three phase bussbar system which cleans up and simplifies providing power to the breakers. What is annoying is that all breakers from any manufacturer utilize Popi drive screws. It literally took me ten years to find a certified insulated number two Pozi drive screwdriver. It is a good idea to annually shut down the mains and re torque all screws within the consumer unit (aka breaker panel in the USA ) this will prevent loose contacts which can overheat and lead to a breaker failing.
Great job guys as always! I have a question… Would there be anything wrong with using Acti9 for a domestic setting? I know that easy9 is Amendment 3 compliant and has 6kA breaking capacity whereas Acti9 is made for commercial/industrial applications and mostly has 10kA+ breaking capacity. But does Acti9 conform to amendment 3? Acti 9 DBs are all metal, non combustible material apart from the lid opening device which is a plastic locking mechanism. Long winded question I know, just curious.
which model of busbar are you using in this video?
Working with 3871’s all week this set up looks quite impressive.
Were they feeding some lovely 4293's? I love them; it's a shame they fail so readily as they get ancient...
hi, about the busbar, ... i have a situation where there is a MCB with a hole in the middle one pole , and RCBO with a hole on the side, with PN poles. the positioning of the hole in the MCB and the RCBO is not the same, one in the center and the other on the right... so how can one fit a busbar in this situation?.
Those RCBO's are enormous!!We in the Netherlands have them to,but smaller in hight!
There are mini RCBOs available and double pole as well.
The RCBOs on the bottom row is slim.
Still frustrates me that it's so hard to change a faulty breaker. I remember boards where we could just flip one out and put the replacement straight in without turning off the whole installation.
With the Acti9 series you can do it today as well.
@@gabor.nadudvari after paying 5x as much for the kit.
ABB has a bus system intergrated in (below) the DIN rail. Don't know if it's available in the UK though.
@@stalincat2457 sounds like crabtree starbreaker
@@stalincat2457 Smissline is an interesting solution for the industry. It is definitely not in residential price level. The video was about Schneider, so I did not want to refer to other manufacturers here.
Was adding MCB for recommended by Schneider ? is it part of the kit ? As far as i know msot of SPDs does not need overcurrent protection.
Regrettably untrue and will automatically fail a routine inspection and test. You are required to wire up SPDs using a minimum CSA according to Type and an OCPD suitable for the conductors in normal operation to allow switching off for the device to be tested. If you cannot switch it off, you cannot test it, it's as simple as that, and so it fails before the tester comes out of the case.
Unfortunately, Schneider have a strange idea contrary to the harmonized ISO standards that their devices do not need to be tested, ever, even at the point of initial verification upon installation, and they love to supply industrial DBs with 3-pole (not 4-pole) Iso + meter + SPD + 3Φ bus bar to link them directly on the bottom incomer DIN rail. And the SPD still tends to be the old Furse Type-2-missold-as-Type-1 model with phase pilot LEDs that cannot pass a full test because of the internal PCB controlling the LEDs. A shame since the LEDs a lot of the time give misleading information (still glowing green after the device has done its job, saved your installation, and now failed).
Busbar insulation would be better with end caps preferably glue on after making sure there long enough !!!!!! Expensive and behind the times regarding size of components .
Don't like this at all, would be better with their 3 phase style layout but as a single phase variant. Total snakes wedding before circuits are even added. And like mentioned before, when are Schneider, arguably the gold standard in board's going to make compact rcbos standard issue.
So as i understand some circuits will be afdd and others rcbo right? woulnt it make more sense having rcbo and afdd. or dose the afdd have build in rcd protection? rarely seen thouse in germany. everything is single rcd per flat.
The afdd used in the UK has all functions - MCB, RCD & Arc fault - Siemens produce some for Germany with just MCB & ARC
@@efixx We can use CU, MCB, machine in a chain without socket and plug. So the electrician install only MCB-AFDD. Typical installation are immovable machine e.g. heater, band-saw, etc. IMHO is the price difference very small and we should use only RCBO-AFDD's too.
Hi eFixx I have also wrote on GSH channel too. There still seem to be an awful lot of confusion still regarding AFDD's also on the forums and wondered if you can do a proper decent video regarding this issue by any chance.
If we are doing let's say a couple of outdoor sockets for a customer spurring off a ring final or alterations in the property on a lighting circuit, do we have to fit AFDD's? But also what if the DB board is already RCD protected by a split load board or main swich RCD board how would this work.
Can we just pop in an AFDD in series with the RCD or have we got to tell the customer that the job a few weeks back would've cost you around £120 will now cost you hundreds of pounds for an outdoor socket. Cheers
Here’s our free training module on AFDDs - ruclips.net/video/d-Ew7RcA_Qw/видео.html
Hi eFIXX, seems all rather old fashioned, considering wylex has combined rcbo and afdd in one single module and doesn't need the functional earth lead, making the consumer unit a lot smaller and practical in my opinion. Also the wylex breakers are shorter allowing more space in the board. I've used both most most brands of consumer units including schnider but this just seems way bigger than it needs to be. Is there any reason for this? Thanks guys
Love the double pole bus bar but why not the rcbo’s and het rid of all the fly leads. Looks untidy before it has cables in. With all the technology we have now should be plug in RCBO/AFD no leads floating around and have wago style terminals like the din rail connectors
Less chance of arching or short circuit if the the Line (input) becomes loose.
Come on Schneider, let's have plug-in devices, didn't Schneider have a single mod AFDD, why have they gone to a two mod one
Why do you have so few circuits? Our breaker panels typically have 32-40 spaces and I'll be darned if we don't use every last one!
Where does the arc arrestors fit
Watch the video
It’s crazy how different our panels are, USA here
This is hybrid panel. The top is French layout (Schneider are French) with a _comb_ L&N busbar and double pole _interrupters._ The bottom is UK. The best is the French layout.
USA panel gives 80s vibe
@@johnburns4017 I like separate busbars more.
hello just want to know if these are AC or DC breakers because i saw a thin wire for panel board? hope you answer my question? Thank you
Please stay away from circuit breakers 😂
Wait a compact board that needs a 2 way SPD as well as using another way for the ocpd for the SPD??? Thats 3 ways used for an SPD, never seen that before, you either have a 1 way SPD with an MCB or a 2 way SPD that does not require and SPD... Seems a little silly if you get a compact board it means you are short of space... Apart from that can see some uses for a two tiered compact board..
I found the mystery words.
Polaritized, and Thai Wraps.
Do I win an eFixx cheque book and pen?
😂 Even I don't have those!
I don't like the top row neutral being daisy chained off the neutral bar, when the line for both top and bottom come direct from the main switch. Just feels wrong.
There should be a better way to install the SPD that generates this problem.
And the price of this setup is over thousand pounds? Correct me if I'm wrong.
They are showing you what is available and how it is wired up. The rest is up to you.
Totally pointless for the UK.... other manufacturers are making single module DPole AFDDs to fit on a standard bus bar..
Also most manufacturers have done away with the functional earths... Seems like a massive pointless headache that will be costing your client a fortune if he accepts your quote..
My wylex rewire able has been going 40 years strong no problems, you guys are ripping out boards that were installed 2 years ago saying ther not safe
Yes and lots of those old Wylex had wooden backs. we were told we had to replace them as wood was combustible. Guess what we had to put in plastic consumer units that were 20 times more combustible .
I been say this for years . If it old rip it out and make a lot more money charging for a new one that isn’t really needed. The art of ripping people off
Tbf blame the regs not the installer's, can't install something new if it doesn't have the right protections and often it's easier to replace the whole board than try and protect just one circuit
@@THECALLOF241 yes but we are not required to bring older installations up to the current standard, and there is no legal requirement or regulation requirement to do so. Note page 99 of the onsite guide, and the HSE note in BS7671. They recognise that in most cases older installations are safe for continued service so why can’t electricians? . We are on rewired to test older installations to the current standard and if all test readings are within the maximum limits specified in BS 7671 the we can sign it off as safe for continued use RCD additional protection is only required for new circuits from the 17th edition onwards . Lack of RCD on older installations is nothing more than a C3.
@@Dog-whisperer7494 100% there are a lot of electricians who like to cite C2s unnecessarily as an excuse to drum up more work, I was more talking about the situation where a client asks you to make modifications or additions to an install and your options are either installing protective measures for just the work you've done or recommending the entire install be brought up to date.
Hi , why did you mix RCBO,s AND AFDD ? Surly one or the other ? or was this just for Demo , As all new installs will be AFDD on all circuits , if the client will pay the AFDD £149.00 p cost per item ? Happy days as I retired a few years back , just like to see how it is all changing . £78.00 p supply and fix with a cooker point in a 2 bed bungalow in the mid 1960,s and made money. Now days Sparks must be on £78 .00 an hour with all the time they spend filming and put it on You Tube ? LOL.👍👍
Wire forming could be much better than shown in the video.
Not a fan of that.. love the acti9,, better off fitting a smaller one of those with a 3ph to single ph link out it .. Gaz's Wylex board looks better IMO
While I appreciate a over engineered setup this looks very expensive. But I dont know the standards over there. Here In Austria you usually have one or two RCDs or maybe two RCBOs if you wanna be fancy and alot of normal breakers. Newer installs require a surge arrester where the power comes into your house. The main switch is either just a circuit breaker or a screwable fuse...I think that last one isnt too legal anymore (dont worry we upgraded that)
All RCBOs is now quite common in new installs. Unfortunately we do not have double pole as mandatory, but they are available. AFDDs, combined RCBO and AFDD, are now mandatory on socket circuits in some situations, They are _recommended_ on all installs. We need to adopt the continental DIN rail rows and dual L & N comb busbars.
Only good thing is if these AFDDs are double pile otherwise soooo many leads and so much space used by old tech?!
Now make it socketed so you don’t need the stupid bus bar. Why do you need the functional earth when it’s on a grounded metal DIN rail?
There's no sign of those DIN rails actually being grounded!
Looks like European style boards are being phased in.
Just need to go back to plastic!
Hmmm ... not really in domestic. We not use more as 64 Ampere on one phase in Europe and Asia. We use three phases normally. We not have SPD nor AFDD till now in normal houses. My apartment in Germany have only one RCD (we need it for bathroom (or for garden outside)) and so it is put over-all. My CU is metal box in the wall how is the back secured with plastic plate so that consumer can make on-off self behind the thin metal door. We do not tested or change all every xx years CU nor cable. We use fire alarm boxes with batteries normally.
At new installations we should use RCBO's specially for every socket line. So a gas heater need only 10 Ampere MCB direct (without socket). We should mix socket (living room) and lamp (bed room) so that never the full apartment is without power. In a bigger house I install two RCBO's for every room. Now they are not so expensive more, I pay for Hager RCBO ~ €30. These days do you need more power and more sockets as in the history in every room.
In the house from a friend (build 1955) they use only one phase (his house was the first house at this street) and have one socket at door and two sockets in room. One light switch per room only the living room have two so that this lamp can use three and three E27 socket. With typically 60 Watt they consumed 3x60=180W (plus 3x60=180W (=360W)) only the lamp! In the history he can not use the sockets in first floor for the vacuum cleaner, newer models have a soft-start. Till now nothing change there but now he use more and more electrical equipment.
@@efixx Curious to see regulation different in different countries. Here in Italy for example we prefer consumer unit in plastic material, not that you can't install them metallic, but if you do so you have to put an RCD externally to protect the consumer unit itself for indirect contact (the reason is that if for some reason a wire gets loose before RCD protection and touches the metal housing it will become live, and nothing will trip since we have the TT earthing system everywhere in domestic settings).
Also they are usually put inside the wall, that is there is a big box in the wall like the one used for switches and sockets, and everything that can be seen outside is just the front panel. That makes it more acceptable to have on your wall (since we usually place them in convenient places, such as right next the front door so if you return from vacation and you did turn off power you don't have to go to the other side of the house with a torch)
@@efixx Yes, our modern CU is in plastic but most we build them into the wall with three DIN-rail closed with a door. We known that we not touch with our wet fingers inside. The once what aI like is the newer British socket and plug - our Schuko can change polarity too easily. So bigger machines (and caravan) use CEE DIN EU plugs and sockets.
We are not stupid and chrashed electrical lines, boxes, CU's with hard metal things - specially in the consumer construction. It is difficult at ships or outside.
I saw what you did there.
Phased In.
Nice.
someone likes their woodbines 😂
What a mess I would like to see a cleaner board without tails flying everywhere
Yet we across the pond are able to fit an AFDD, 3 phase RCBO or who knows what in a board from the 1980s, din rail and wires to connect various kinds of busbars are future proof. It may not look nice but it works.
Those white wires seem awfully thin!
Were you meant to upload this a couple of years ago? So much wasted space! This looks quite dated to what you can get from a Crabtree starbreaker board, single module surge device, single module AFDDs and compact RCBOs without functional earth leads. I’m waiting for a brand that can beat Crabtree for their domestic consumer units as they are unrivalled currently.
We do not twist cores to be entered into a ferrule.
The SPD earth should not be like that - 534.4.8.
Looking at the triple version of this instead of needing 2 x standard consumer units but the lid is junk! Where it would be is next to a door and every time you open the door the wind would clap the lids like the letter box is going! They dont even have magnets to hold them closed let alone proper retaining clips. The hinge is made from some bent metal folded round and electricians say BG consumer units are cheap nasty. I dont understand electricians your minds are not wired like engineers yert you ar e in an engineering trade. Who designed that and said it was as good as it can be. was a half jobber. And the knock out holes on the side look so industrial. They could be much nicer. I could re design that thing in a morning 3 times as good.
Gaz’ breathing sounds like a tardis taking off!
Me and Rick?
They are going more European in terms of setup
Yes the are going more European. Proves Brexit was a complete waste of time based on lies. What happened to Britton making our own rules and laws . It’s time to the bureaucrat in Brussels to gut stuffed and keep there overpriced gear .
Sir hinde me batawa
Jeez ... STILL no 18mm, dual pole RCBOs! WHEN will we actually catch up? Ridiculous! 🙄🤔😱🥺🥺👎👎
We’ll take that as a No from you Bob
@@efixx correct! I already have a full dual pole 18mm RCBO setup and have had it quite a while. Complete with overvoltage, total supply over current (not available on any CU AFAIK) monitoring, surge protection, individual final ring leg current monitoring (to monitor for excessive ring imbalance, overtemp cutout, etc.) Functions simply not available at a reasonable price (or any price) from the industry.
@@boblewis5558 I'd like to see that. What is the setup protecting - feeding and what are the parts used please?
@@jmileshccustom & proprietary electronics design with non contact current transformer per live and neutral (4 transformers per final ring). 100A isolator from an 80A incoming supply. 65°C and 85°C temp switches in the enclosure plus linear temp measurement to monitor rate of temperature change (fire can't start in/on plastics until over 220°C so electricity is cut via twin 63A isolators in the event of rapid heat increase).
Monitoring is performed by an Arduino micro controller which feeds data to alarm software on the internal network (Rasberry Pi & home automation server) and then to mobile phone/s. The Arduino scans, via a mux, each individual current transformer (up to 64 if required) in a round Robin sequence 120,000 times a second and logs any significant change/s to the server and logs a "clear" signal every 10 seconds to prove the logging is active and for troubleshooting.
Imbalance monitoring of current in live and return legs helps diagnose faulty tripping. Rapid pulsing of leg currents in final ring/s indicate potential arcing problems especially if high frequency, high current spikes are seen.
Full data logging can be used to diagnose intermittent problems as well as highlight static issues. As further IOT devices are added to appliances, individual appliance monitoring will also be added for tracking and diagnosing problems and energy consumption mapping.
The data will also be used in the future for energy resource allocation after our solar PV is upgraded and battery backup included.
RCBOs are standard TOMZN IEC61009 type C, dual pole, 18mm breakers (before the recent changes, not that type A's would be needed as there is no dc offset on the supply - I've scoped it!) with dual feed bus bars, top fed for much easier cable management.
Outputs at the bottom of breakers rather than the top mean power transition to DIN mounted terminal output feeds via PCB mounted current transformers leaves all connections from cables being logical and neat with LEN connections per cable and short connections direct to DIN terminal blocks - all 32A rated except for cooker feed (40A) which are 57A rated terminals. Each ring leg fed via its own contact triple block.
Multiple alarm outputs for first enclosure overtemp (65°), second enclosure overtemp (85°), ring leg imbalance, individual cct L/N imbalance (resolution to less than 1mA), overvolts etc. Electronics have built in battery backup sufficient to last one week minimum and use minimal power
About time they got rid of the functional earth, like other manufacturers. I would not entertain an rcbo with that shit cable on it
It's a minor improvement, but still brutal and archaic. Boards and their devices need a complete re-design for the future. Messy wires, stupid fly leads...then in a few years time try having to replace an RCBO in a fully populated TP&N board. It can be almost impossible. Just terrible designs everywhere cluttering up what little space you're allowed inside.
Schneider are welcome to pay to consult me.
Schneider have that in their French range.
@@johnburns4017 Any links to them ? I've never seen anyone offer what I want/propose.
@@blow0me
Schneider have _Acti 9_ 3-phase panels, which can be easily linked out to be single phase. And I believe 1-phase as well now. They also have the _Easy9,_ which can have the comb L&N _comb_ busbars.
ruclips.net/video/cxguDCDrAZg/видео.html
@@johnburns4017 thanks. Still completely different and not what I propose should happen. That still relies on cable terminations at the device, It partially deals with flying leads though, but still doesn't really address the main problems. But it is neater for a small board.
I want a system where all terminations are made on the base enclosure, and all devices simply plug in. It future proofs maintenance, ease of access, changing devices in the future ( when you're in a maintenance role, changing devices at present with boards literally rammed full of wires and likes of earth and neutral bars are almost inaccessible, you'd see why ). Plus just generally, even new installs where boards are rammed packed because of RCBO's etc, and now same when AFDD's etc become common.....current board/enclosure designs MUST change. They are stuck in the dark ages. Fitment, changing of devices has to be made safer and easier, not just when new and first installed, but years down the line.
In a few years time the RCBOs will probably be obsolete and replacements not available. Oh is anyone going to stock them in the first place
This isn't new they have been using this for over a decade on the continent
Majority of homes don't have RCBOs but combo MCB+RCD. In developing countries you'll hardly find RCDs or RCBOs in their panel boxes, only MCBs.
Expensive mess, no thanks
Shnieder technology is amazing
blue wire is always a no no !!!!!!! unless its dc dah
Blue wire is pretty standard for neutral in almost every European country
DC traditionally uses black and red.. Look at your multimeters lol.
@@efixx And blue is neutral in many parts of Asia , Africa and Latin America.
that looks a mess. All that space and its still cramped
That's a stupid setup. Totally takes the fun out of switchboard building!
Whos out of breath breathing on the mic 😮
The French have been using these for years …about the only good thing from france
crap way of doing it, the three phase/american style is much better.
That true.
My eyes are bleeding. Terrible cable management. Neutral bar will burn out under heavy loads.
North American breaker boxes honestly make much more sense
Care to explain?
This is hybrid panel. The top is French layout (Schneider are French) with a comb L&N busbar and double pole interrupters. The bottom is UK. The best is the French layout.
Top row power going (mostly) top to bottom, bottom row power going (mostly) bottom to top - thats just bad.
Not very nice electric work