Why Rugby is based on a lie (probably)
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- Опубликовано: 5 май 2024
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The origins of Rugby can be traced back to the origins of Soccer. That tale is fairly well known among fans of the egg-shaped ball. But the tale involving William Webb Ellis, that most fans retell, is probably not true.
Seb Stafford-Bloor explores the true origins of Rugby. Illustrated by Philippe Fenner.
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Music sourced from epidemicsound.com
Additional footage sourced from freestockfootagearchive.com
#Rugby #RugbyUnion #Football 
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The spilt between Rugby Union and Rugby League would be a great topic to cover. It's something that many don't know but is important to know about.
Indeed. It's funny that they talk about 1895 ("when rugby's popularity was growing") given that's the year the schism occurred. Although considering they used what looks like an Australian Kangaroos RL player to represent 'rugby' (0:04) they probs need to do a good bit of learning first.
@@wolfishjtNoticed that too.
@@wolfishjt Real football ⚽️ is the best and the most entertaining sport in the world ⚽️ ❤
@@wolfishjt ⚽️ is growing faster and better
Posh people wanted to play an amateur sport, while the working class wanted to professionalise. Split happened, and today, you have to go to posh schools to get recognition as a rugby union player, while league players can attend Croxteth High School.
Growing up in a village in Nepal we used to play football in fields after school, we had no knowledge of rugby not even heard of it. But after playing football for a while and got tired late in the evening someone would just shout let's remove handball and foul , and all just tried and grab the ball and put it in the goal in pure chaos, later in life i realised it's pretty similar to what Rugby is so i imagine the origin of the sports is pretty similar to this just bunch of people thinking differently
Handball Is a Sport in itself as well
Spontanious evolution of Australian Rules Football in Nepal.
Nepal Rules Football if you will.
We had a game in school in Ireland called “murderball”. Basically you got the ball and ran. Everyone (no teams) would try and get it off you by any means. It usually meant being tackled to the ground and buried under a pile up of people trying to get the ball. One person would eventually get it and take off running with the mob after him.
There was no points scoring and no rules. Utterly pointless but great fun.
Joe Devine sure knows his stuff he should narrate a purely football channel
I don't know might not be enough money in that.
Ooooh buddy... You not going to believe this...
If only he had cool hands and a warm embrace
You mean American football?
I think people tend to overlook just how similar all the 'football' games were until the 1860s. Rugby might have evolved from football, but the truth is that rugby is far closer to the original games of the time than football is now. Within a decade or so, they'd changed the offside rule to allow forward passing, banned handling, which lead to the introduction of goalkeepers and heading, added a crossbar, whereas goals could originally be scored at any height, replaced the free 'try' at goal with the corner kick, and introduced the tactic of passing the ball on the floor, among other things, changing it completely from a game mainly based on strength, to one on skill.
I've always wamted to see Tifo do rugby.
Tho if they want to do it any justice, they to hire people like squidge n the likes.
Most people who play rugby know rugby is a form of football. Hence why its called rugby football. The RFU and IRFU for example stand for the Rugby Football Union and Irish Rugby Football Union respectively. Its one of about half a dozen sports that are football. Of course association football fans like to think otherwise.
Honestly nfl fans are worse about that. Most of them don't even know the difference between rugby, AFL, rugby league, and GAA
@@tsherwood2112 Probably because none of those sports you mentioned are played in the US. Some of us do know the difference though. I find Union to be boring and too many rules involved, but love League/CFL/NFL.
@@jmill3147 American football isn't played in Europe or Australia, yet they know what it is over there. Also how TF do you think rugby union is too slow but watch the NFL 😂
The NFL is miles slower, no way I'm sitting around for 3 hours to watch a 10 minute game
@@tsherwood2112 Sheesh triggered much?? The fact people know what american football is in those other countries is a testament to its popularity.
@@jmill3147 by your logic, Americans would know soccer. But most can't even name a single team. The problem here is that the average American is uncultured and closed-minded (I'm American, I see it on a daily basis)
This is like the story of Jebediah Springfield.
I think you mean Hans sprungfeld
He was great
"A noble spirit, embiggens the smallest man"
@@insertnamehere5809It’s a perfectly cromulant word
How it probably started was just some group of student football players just thought of playing it slightly different. A game like football can be changed so drastically with few changes so we get so many different forms
Ceid was the name of the game which was played in tipperarywhere Ellis lived.
This is why the meaning of the word "football" has the power to start pub brawls
Yes, there's "the good kind of football"(rugby union), "not quite enough players to make a full side of good football"(rugby league), "upside down football"(Aussie rules), "don't really use feet anymore football" (American football), and of course the OG, "theatrics-minded weiners"(association football).
@@R.J._Lewisand then there's 7s lol
@@titussalter8070 7s is so unserious. Watching it sucks, but playing at festival style tournaments is fun. Especially for outside backs
@@tsherwood21127 was great back in the 90s when top players like Lomu etc played. Now it’s mainly players who couldn’t get a second pro contract in 15s.
@@eoin8156 true, but now we're seeing Dupont in 7s. He's the only reason I'll be watching at the Olympics, and I assume many others can say the same
Most sports originate from England because the elite private schools codified all the laws so most major sports play under the specific rules from 1800s Britain
no really, English sports just became popular because of the British empire
Nowadays, if a kid picked up a ball and ran with it in a school football match, they'd simply diagnose the boy with ADHD and prescribe Ritalin
Go be boring somewhere else, boomer.
As someone who lives in Rugby and did this stuff for a local history project in school, this was really cool to see. Also pretty wild seeing local landmarks like that statue in a RUclips video haha. Thanks for making this.
Good to see a history vid again - it's been a while but it was watching you fantastic football history vids that got me into Tifo in the first place - when are you going to do a video on Bela Gutman?
huw edwards really summed it up well tbf
And from the same era a young Tom Will's who was also attending the school, took what he learnt back to Melbourne to create a game for cricketers to keep fit in winter. Merging both football & rugby, we now have Aussie Rules Football.
Aussie rules also owes a lot to Gaelic football from Irish ex pats. I believe there is now a combination game of the 2 known as international rules football.
Tom Wills as a boy also watched & knew of an Aboriginal game called MARN GROOK, which had a ball made with stuffed possum hide & kicked between players
In truth, all of the football games were very similar back then. The diversification of the rules came later.
Ooooh, that's why Aussie rules football field is round-shaped? Because It was originally a cricket field?
@@elzurdorodriguez6650 A lot of early football clubs were formed by cricketers who wanted a winter sport. It's actually a bit of a surprise that their version was the only one to retain the cricket field shape. It does mean that most of Australia's cricket grounds are far larger, in capacity, than they would be based on cricket crowds.
Gilbert are the gold
standard for
Rugby Union balls become of the unic way they go about, making them.
No mass manufacturing for Gilbert they make every ball from start to finish buy hand unlike other ball manufacturers.
Gilbert is the best, Rhino is a distant second. I've used a mitre ball too but it was terrible
Rugby is a lot closer to mob football than association football. The real beginning of rugby was the 1860’s and 1870’s. The six nations is one of the oldest sporting competitions going back to 1883 as the home nations championship.
The f in either union or league governing bodies stands for football. Garyowen from Limerick are formally known as Garyowen FC. Unlike American and Canadian football kicking is crucial.
Modern Rugby balls since the 1980’s and 1990’s are not made with leather and pig bladders which have made kicking including drop goals, conversions and penalty kicks more consistent.
I'd seen previously that as there were no established laws of football at the time the players, at Rugby school and others, would decide on the rules between themselves before each game (and probably change them during as well).
When boys from that school eventually decided to write down a set of rules based on the versions they played, they included running with the ball etc.
William Webb Ellis may well have picked up the ball and ran with it but it may also not have been considered a big deal or particularly notable at the time.
That sounds similar to what I have been told, that the rules weren't a formal set but more to settle disputes between schools, there was no laws of rugby so to speak but Eton had its rules, Rugby school had its rules, and so on. It was common for boys from each school to carry a small book in their pocket to be able to settle disagreements
They did the same thing with baseball. I believe in 1920's the created the story of Doubleday, creating a brand new sport to make it less British. In reality Baseball is a derivative of British Rounders, and has forms of Cricket.
Yup. "Hey, some random old guy claims that a famous Civil War general also invented our National Pastime™? Let's just go with that!"
@@CCNYMacGuy In Cooperstown NY of all places, hitherto known as the family seat of James Fenimore Cooper's family, prompting the question of whether Natty Bumppo played baseball, or more likely lacrosse.
eh there evidence of the rounders link is pretty questionable also. we realistically don’t entirely know where baseball came from besides the fact that the modern code of the game was based off a variant being played in Canada at the time adapted by north eastern Americans sometime in the 1800’s. It clearly has rounders influence but you can say this about any bat and ball game they all have similarities and neither rounders, cricket, nor baseball are the oldest of these types of sports. The Doubleday story is some revisionism though for sure lol
@@Fatblue246 If you weren't familiar with either game you'd be hard pressed to distinguish between rounders and baseball. They could be played on the same field with the same equipment and use the same skills.
Joe Devine's dulcet tones put to rugby? Something I never knew I needed
Great. But how does this affect the use of the inverted fullback in the Bundesliga today?
Would love to see more Rugby content tbh such an underrated sport much more better than soccer maybe you could even do a video on the NBA
Real football ⚽️ is the best and the most entertaining sport in the world ⚽️ ❤
⚽️ is growing faster and better
Real football ⚽️ is the greatest sport of all time ⚽️❤️
@SenuraKumara-ii5rq most entertaining thing about soccer is the players' acting when they fake an injury after being slightly brushed
@wolfishjt American football, basketball, and hockey have fake injuries
that sudden American accent at the end of the video is rather jarring 🤣
Eton’s form of football is a precursor Australian Football. It came about as a hybrid of this game and Rugby.
Many cultures have had kicking ball games but Association Football comes directly from the kicking ball games first played in England.
That's why it's called soccer
Very nice animation!
Do a video on Gaelic Football and Hurling 🫡
Would it get the viewing numbers though that is the thing.
I would watch it.
@@alanfox691sure like even people would watch it to learn about it lol
Seeing as Rugby School was the first to ever have written rules for its version of football, it's more accurate to say that every other form of the game we know today came from rugby.
1:45 funny how two of those cups shown aren’t used to this day 😂
I like how you do different sports
Not just football
Very cool 👍
Was this channel advertised on the Football channel
Oh my god. A non American sport being covered?
Please more of this!!
You must be new here
Can Tifo also cover why rugby Union used the Nazis in France to push away rugby league, and never apologized?
It’s almost like the name football wasn’t related to the use of the foot on the ball.
I’ve heard somewhere that foot refers to the size of the ball, not the fact that you kick it
@@Pesso86
Heard that it might refer to the fact that the players were on foot, i.e. not on horses like polo.
A bit like "foot soldier".
So for all intents and purposes, William Webb Ellis is to rugby as Abner Doubleday is to baseball - a mythical "creator" anointed as such by others.
I grew up in the town of rugby and i went to rugby school. And somehow i didn't know this😂
The outright theft of assets belonging to the Rugby League by the Rugby Union in France during WWII is a topic it would be good to cover (while on the subject of lies, disregard for laws and thuggish behaviour).
Do a video on
Aussie Rules Football
that would be of interest.
I was watching Gaelic football the other day and (not knowing any about either sports) couldn't help but draw a lot of comparisons between Aussie Rules and Gaelic Football. There must be a link there somewhere.
@@TheStubertos The myth goes that Irish convicts sent to Australia brought it with them, but that's likely a load of bollox. The game we know as Gaelic football today was codified in 1887 and AFL got its start in 1858. AFL, much like rugby was most likely derived from 'football' played in English public schools, but we'll probably never know for certain.
@@HerrCron Irish populations were small compared to English populations that were migrated to Australia so that story is fasle too.
@@ifldiscovery8500 what is it you think k you're contributing here?
Great video!
You got to do a video on Nelson Mandela and Rugby someday! No sport is as important for a country as Rugby of South Africa, it’s incredibly interesting. And it is an opportunity to talk about Apertheid and racism. I just read an interview Hugo Porta did (Argentinian Rugby Legend) in which he talked about it, he played matches in South Africa during Apertheid and was the Argentinian ambassador in the country during De Klerk and Mandela’s government.
"No sport is as important for a country as Rugby of South Africa"..............have you heard of New Zealand and a small team called "All Blacks"?
@@jondnz Did rugby in New Zealand play a part in anything as important for the country as the end of apertheid in South Africa?
@@bautistachasseing7164All Blacks Rugby is truly synonymous with NZs national identity at levels of life there so Jon is not wrong but I also understand what you’re saying about 1995 RWC impact on SA politics as well, you’re both right about how important Rugby is to both countries 👊🏽.
@@BP__15 what a nice dude 😄
@@bautistachasseing7164 Not directly but, the protests associated with 1981 Springbok tour to New Zealand were pretty significant
Create a video on ringball
1:38 Pig’s Bladder?
Yes, rugby balls were originally made using pigs bladders.
I want American Gridiron Football split from Rugby vid
That wasn't born from a split. It developed on its own. From Wikipedia:
"The sport developed from informal games played in North America during the 19th century. Early games had a variety of local rules and were generally similar to modern rugby union and soccer. The earliest recorded instance of gridiron football occurred at University of Toronto's University College in November 1861. Later in the 1860s, teams from universities were playing each other, leading to more standardized rules and the creation of college football. "
He may not have invented it but everything needs an unbelievable origin story
Fun fact ; Nelson Mandela became and still remains Rugbys' greatest marketing 'prop '(no pun intended) 💯❤️
Actually the name Rugby is short for Rugby Football, which is a varient of football played the same as Aussie Rules football, Galic Football and American Football and this is the reason why Football is also called Soccer in a large part of the world. Most governing bodies are called "Rugby Football Union", thus refering to football being played according to the Rugby varient. The William Web Ellis legend was generally accepted as the most probable origin of the Rugby Football varient when the game of Rugby Union was being promoted to a broader audience. The game was widely played in Europe, especially in France and the British colonies. One other strong claim to the origins of the game is the Welsh claim, but it was never called football, hence disgarded.
0:10 football not association football⚽️
Football back then can be played with both hand and foot different citie. Colleges have their own version of football , then in 1863 FA made some rule and that becames the football ⚽️ as of today
I heard William Webb Ellis is a South African
Some kid broke the rules n had a damn statue erected in his honour? 😂 I should have 5 statues at least
First international match? Isnt that supposed to be between two countries? That's right up there with world series.😂
Soccer became Rugby, like a boy becomes a MAN.
I don't understand how there could be a rule to not do something if no one had ever thought to do it
A eureka moment?
Rugby started when one footballer said 'fck the rules!'
In American Football, a brain injury is more certain, than the opposite, even with helmets on!
Yes but in America it's harder to diagnose. 😆
Helmets possibly add to brain injuries, I think they are doing scientific studies on it.
Just intuitively, the Webb Ellis story makes no sense. It must have been more complex. In it's simple form, he would have just been penalised for breaking the rules of the game.
Determining the history of modern codes suffers from a dearth of written history through the middle of the 19th century because they were still mostly school yard games. Purely based on written codes, it appears that Australian Rules Football is the senior code - largely written by Tom Wills, a former school master from Rugby School and the collegiate form of American Football emerged soon after.
The rivalry between Rugby and Soccer was heated in England in the 1870s during the early years of the Football Association. They Webb Ellis mythology appeared at around this time and appears to have been based on the 30+ year old memories of an old boy. Tellingly, the first FA cup had a set of rules including handling and when the rules were updated for the second season (probably by the enthusiastic administrator, Charles Alcock), to more closely reflect the non-handling Winchester game, many of the inaugural clubs dropped out, to return several years later as members of the initial Rugby Union.
I don't think any code can legitimately be determined as first, all the differences are somewhat fine threads that are lost in the midst of time.
PS - I'm somewhat dismissing the 1845 written rugby code as it is so different to modern Rugby. It's much more closely aligned with the 1858 rules of Australian Football.
Then how rugby evolved into gridiron football both American and Canadian ?
Rugby...smashed him bro ⛳
The new scrummage rules will make it even more of a lie...
Interesting 🤔
why it took rugby so long to professionalize?
I'd love to see a video on that.
big up my family from Rugby.
Rugby Football *DID NOT* evolve from Association Football. Both descended from a myriad of football games, and codified their own rules.
This is why Association Football should still be called "Soccer".
I myself love rugby Union because I find it more interesting and a male sport. Realistically, in my country it is sadly nonexsistant (in addition to football it is still possible to watch American football, but not Rugby )and I can watch online. Otherwise, besides karate and mma the most interesting sport
Yes i doubt it was as simple as a boy picking a ball up and running with it the Georgians have a game similar to rugby called Lelo that they've played for centuries
Then a country in the southern most tip of Africa would go on to be the greatest rugby nation the planet has ever seen 🏆🏆🏆🏆
I love the boks but you guys sure as cocky. You have every right to be but the History of rugby is still being written.
@@joelmonteiro1419 as of present day, South Africa is a juggernaut of the sport... I'm sorry these facts make upset, Joel.
@@NhlanhlaMathe they don't upset me, the Boks are my favorite international team after Portugal.
@@joelmonteiro1419 So what's cocky about stating facts?
Why is the outro guy American? It's just....wrong
So
How about a video on how World Rugby tier 1 nations continually block tier 2 nations from joining big tournaments like the 6 Nations and the Rugby Championship? in 2026 the new Nations League (aka Nations Championship) will begin but it will only be contested and owned by the tier 1 nations. They say there may be promotion and relegation for tier 2 nations, but only starting in 2031. This is essentially rugbys version of soccer European Super League, but in soccer the fans, media, FIFA and UEFA put a stop to it, meanwhile in Rugby, the World Rugby org have given it their full backing. Also in Rugby only the tier 1 unions have any real voting power on the World Rugby Board, and they keep voting to keep the tier 2 unions down. A video on this would be fantastic. Thanks
neat
The South African Springboks are Rugby World Cup Champions btw.
Rugby is a place in England 🤣
🇿🇦❤
A Webb gets famous for something he didn’t do...hmm...
Everything the athletic touches turns to tabloidic garbage.
This video was entirely too brief to serve a purpose.
🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🙃
first?
Shut up
And then they taught the South Africans how to play it,,, 😊 biggest mistake they ever did
Do rugby league please
Was going so well till that bloody yank accent ruined the ending
Rugby football is related to association football? Wow, who would have thought 🙄🤦♂️
Ahhh Rugby, like American Football but for men...
Over simplicittion buy yourself there.
*Gentlemen, Rugby is a gentleman's game
Feel free to come join my team at training and see how you get on
and more simple
Funny how whenever rugby players try to catch on the NFL they flame out within a year.
William Webb-Ellis was, according to contemporary accounts, much keener on Cricket and a pretty accomplished player. That origin myth was just the first of the lies that the code has swathed itself in over the decades.
And that's before we get to Rugby Union's enthusiastic cosying-up to some of the vilest regimes of the 20th century. The French using the invading Nazis in the 1930s to help eliminate sports they saw as competition, Peter Howard (the England Rugby Union captain) being the leader of the gang of racist thugs that Oswald Mosley (leader of the British Union of Fascists) hired as protection and Rugby Union's close association with apartheid and the Afrikaner-Broederbond in South Africa, among others.
And yet few sports have tried to claim some form of moral superiority as often. Except maybe golf.
Did u know that Rugby DIDN'T evolve from football champ? William Webb Ellis never picked up the ball & ran with it because it was never on the ground in the first place ffs. Check Tony Collins research & get an understanding of a topic before failing it from ur opening line.
Racist now
...how?
Stick to football bro. Rugby ain’t for you.
Football is way better ⚽️ ❤
Proof Rugby isn't a real sport.
Worst sport In history
Said by a soccer fan
It's alright, you can admit the Laws are too complex for you.
I never understand why soccer fans are so insecure that they have to constantly attack all the other forms of football.
Soccer fans only know and play soccer, don't have diversity and complexity of life
@@AfricanCorn-np8jt Real football ⚽️ is way better