REL Classic 98, A Music Lover's Sub
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
- The REL Classic 98, it's $1,399. It's likely to offer a bigger improvement to the sound of your system than a $1,399 DAC, turntable, preamp, or amp could make. More info rel.net
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#subwoofers #greatbass
This is a REaL throwback !
Made in Bridgend Wales UK, its probably from the original factory 😊
I still have a collection of 90's RELs from the UK still throbbing strong
Love that you are reviewing equipment that I can afford. Still love to see the high end too.
I've owned my subwopfer for 2 years now And I cannot live without one
I used to have an REL Q50 and even though it was their bottom-of-the-range subwoofer, the depth it gave was astounding. I would love to have listened to one of top of the range ones. I'll bet 10 that your trousers would be flapping :)
Hey Steve, correct Amundo I have an old Sony 12 inch sub and you said everything correct happy birthday!
I use 2 RSL 12S subwoofers and have them set up for right and left channel and adjusted them so they disappear and love them with my Zu Omen Def Supreme speakers. Just love them and iften as Steve said at times wonder if they are on and then oh yes they are! After having them I can not imagine a system without at least one subwoofer. Just my opinion opinion. I listen to all kinds of music not just bass heavy. Great review and interesting subwoofer. Thanks Steve!!!!
every now and then i run without sub bass for a few minutes just to remind myself How the Other Half Live
I thought about trading my SVS SB3000's for a new pair of REL's, but after talking to folks that have owned both, I will keep the 3000's... Thankfully mine are hidden away so no need for furniture. These new RELs look very nice, and I really like the way they connect, as I am using a vintage Sansui 4000 receiver... But, there are always work arounds. And the remote that SVS offers with their ap... That is a deal killer... The remote control ability is so convenient, and really makes listening fun. Fun-Fi!
Yeah I wouldn't trade two sealed SVS subs for REL subs either. SVS subs are a bit more in your face, but that's no doubt solvable with tuning and careful integration. I don't dislike REL, but they're overpriced for what they are.
@@KimmoJaskari I can see your point... And yes, the SVS ap is very easy to use to dial these SB3000's in. I run that vintage Sansui 4000 that happens to put out a phenomenal amount of bass with my Zu DW6's. I have the subs really dialed back to darn near zero, with the crossovers set just around 40Hz, as the Zu's really dig deep with the Sansui.
REL subs are amazing. The way they integrate with your mains makes a huge difference.
'Fascinating Fact'.These RELs were made in Bridgend, Wales, UK (as shown on the rear panel), not three miles from the hospital where I was born some fifty years ago. (That's not the interesting part, btw.) What is interesting is that the light industrial estate where REL offices remain to this dy was once the site of the UK's largest World War II munitions plant. Extending over some 900 acres this Royal Ordnance Factory was, at its peak, said to employ over 40,000 people in the manufacture of explosive devices. In a natural dip in the countryside, the area was frequently shrouded in mist and so naturally camouflaged. It was also ideally located for the shipment of its products aross the country via rail or overseas via the docks at nearby Cardiff and Swansea, and was close to a ready supply of power (via the local collieries and their associated generating stations) and steelworks. During the war, over 1000 buildings and bunkers were constructed and equipped, and served by more than 60 miles of internal roadway, to ensure a ready supply of munitions for our forces. Now, music might be said to have replaced the harsher sounds of another era.
REL may be UK-based, but the subwoofers are made in China.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Were the subs not UK-made at one point?
@@williamevans9426
Yes they were.
They were sold by the Welsh owners in 2005.
@@jim586 Many thanks, jim586!
Fitting that they still design things that go boom
Finally:
A wood veneered REL!
HATE PIANO LACQUER
Would match my B3😊
Finally, a sub that doesn't look like crap.
Zu has had this exact design for a few years
I have a pair of black T/9x subs I use with my 4365 JBLs. The RELs integrated very well with the JBLs.
I guess I'm just old school but, *REL should offer optional walnut finish for their subs.* then my subs would match my JBLs!
@Click-Here-To-Massage-___-
Ok, send it....................
Would have liked T5 /7 comparison and optimally the new Maggie subs but its a REL and a looker to match up with the retro speakers in vogue right bow
Looks like the only sub my wife would ever approve.
So they're back to revisiting older models?
I am still very happy with my old Strata.
I wholeheartedly agree with your description of what a sub does for the overall sound. It’s more than just bass, it’s space too.
Yeah the Fourier Addition needs a sub but ... we can get a forward mid.
And down 20 hz is not needed for that.
Downstairs neighbors will really appreciate a down-firing subwoofer.
LOL
Like low frequencies, from a sub with drivers that aren't downward firing, don't touch the floor.
Still using 2 x REL Q150 subs, the original one going faulty but it is over 20 years old and I will get it repaired. The second I bought second hand for £100 about 3 years ago out of storage. As you say they are about extending the bass. Friends who come round and listen to my system ask me if the subs are even on, then I think its great when I see their reaction when I turn them off. REL subs are definately better in pairs.
Thanks Steve, I agree, the sub gives more dimension to the music, and like you, I cross the sub in where the main speakers begin to roll off. Great video!
I wish my REL t5 had a walnut veneer
Stereo subs, never going back to single sub.
Steve! Would you rather get two smaller subs and run them in stereo OR get one bigger sub? Cheers mate!
Two smaller subwoofers
I’ve just ordered a Classic 98 to go with my JBL L100 75th Anniversary’s, can’t wait to set it up now
let us know how you like the setup
@@michaelebouchard6452 it sounds amazing, the 98 is seamless. I have it set quite subtle but it’s very noticeable with the bottom end, very nice. Quality of the 98 itself is really good too so it’s like a piece of furniture
Apollo: Atmospheres and Soundtracks; is a studio album by the British musician and producer Brian Eno, the Canadian producer Daniel Lanois, and the composer, Released: 29 July 1983
REL is sold through dealers too. I've bought four RELs from Upscale Audio and their knowledge and service is the best I've ever had. They helped me to position my speakers first, then add the subs. If you don't get that right you are missing out.
Ive purchased my RELs through a dealer in Vancouver, Canada. Some of the best audio purchases that I’ve ever made.
The 98 reminds me of the Velodyne subwoofer I bought more than 30 years ago😁. I have had it reconed due to suspension failure. Still in my system. The REL X7 is in my basement system
Order one last night ! (Dead Sober)
Hope to dial it in soon.
Using entirly vintage set up.
Thanks Steve
System of the day is extremely well thought out by this viewer This is of course my own conclusion.
It's well ballance and sounds really good but need to get the power supply 😁
[ listening to that percussion album on Qobuz; I've heard the Varese before so starting with track 2 ]
Meet your neighbors, get a REL.
Don’t use it as a side table, your partner might put a glass of red wine on it 😂
I contacted Marantz tech support to ask why my preamp didn't have left & right outputs for subs and was told subs are omni directional.
I wish Rel had a switch to turn off the blue light on the plate amp. At night, mine light up the wall behind them, so I covered the lights with some electrical tape. Works good, but would have preferred a switch & would have paid the $$'s they added to the cost.
I use a REL sub with my Sonus Faber Guarneri Homage speakers, really helps underpin bass lines
Yeah but Sonus Faber doesn't really need a Sub, these belong to a community of you know, what would we say in New York? We'd say Sonus Faber owners are a crew and they use very powerful Krell amplifiers that you must have the stuff that that yacht owning crew use. otherwise you'll be using a sub.
Dang Rel dropped the 💣 on these 98s reviews !! Thanks Steve i agree on how to place sub but you crawl around not walk around on the front floor 😮Remb sub goes onto the floor hell I may make a video on how 2
I'd love to open them up and video the sub/amp' 😆
These would've been a wonderful pairing both sonically and aesthetically for the Cornwall 4s you rocked for a couple years Steve! I bet you wish you still had those around for this review.
'Cornwall 4s?' Well, I was looking at Barney's Collaro precision cloth turntable mat located in Motherwell, Scotland, the Audiophiliac System of the Day. You know Motherwell used to be one of those coal mining places like our Ehrenfeld, Pennsylvania near Pittsburgh. Well back in the late 1950s you know the British had the world's finest console piece of wooden Audio furniture known as the DECCA Stereo Decola and it had a transcription turntable by Collaro of olden times and it has just such a red, rubber mat. But as for Cornwall IVs, they take up even more space.
I'd really love to experience a Cornwall dual sub setup.
I have a pair of REL Predators II with CWIVs (music only). These were the preferred pairing coming from REL. I was skeptical but have now seen the light. With an invisible transition the wall of sound is even bigger and deeper.
This sub is making its rounds amongst RUclips audio channels
Yes, because it just came out! Few companies offer review samples of older models.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac not complaining
It's an uneventful subwoofer
@@ryanschipp8513i think thats sorta what REL was going for, honestly. It’s an articulate bottom firing instrument.
@@chrisfoxart it's a lousy value for what you get for $1,400. All it has going for it is a vintage look for the Vintage guys out there. Other than that I could list multiple subwoofers for a fraction that price that would murder it performance-wise
I just purchase the "Morel" sub-x 10" for 800$ and this is the best subwoofer i've ever have. Phenomenal bass!
2.1 for music is amazing.
I can not imagine my life without subwoofer again.
2.2 is even better.
20 years ago I purchased a Sunfire mk2 and it has worked ok… Rel is far better so might need 2 of these..
I have a Rel Britannia B2 (which came out in like 2008) its massive and weighs over 100 lbs. When it worked the bass was Titanic. The amp seems to be blown up, and i cant find anyone to look at it. As i understand the old Rels had one weakness, and that was the amp. Any ideas where to source a new amp ? I know i can use a Dayton audio plate amp, but id like to keep it original . (was like 3 grand brand new and its a beautiful thing, looks like the classic 98 but its bigger and better looking)
Started buying rel subs nearly 30 years ago , stentor, stadium , Britannia b1 and b1, storm 3 ,storm 5 , t5i, t9i, t9x , all the strata models !! I have just bought the classic 98 and now looking for another to make a pair. For me these sound most like the storm 3.
I used two storm 3s back in the 90s and still remember it as the first time I had real hi end bass in my system.. much much better than any speaker regardless of price.
Bye the way.... after all those rels... I have never had one break down ever. Rels are very musicality first focused ... if your after a sub for movies look elsewhere... rels are about underpinning your system with bass not overpowering your system.
The 98 is a great sub for two Chanel high end bass.
Is this Classic 98 a new model for REL? I bought a REL T7/x (?not 100% sure of model name, "7" is correct though) a couple years ago, but i' m thinking the Classic 98 is what i actually wanted (we're not exactly a gloss black household even though the sub lives underneath a 2015 Steinway Model A). ;-^)
Yes, the 98 just came out a few days ago.
I am totally hooked on subwoofers. My home theater system deploys an Infinity IL100 and an SVS SB-4000. My bedroom system has an Infinity PS410. I don't go for boomy, and they fill out the sound nlcely.
This appears to be the sub I’ve been waiting for to pair with my Cornwall IVs - VERY excited!!
Do give us your take on this sub pairing with the CW IV. I was about to switch to T9x. but Rel told me to stay with the HT-1508. Much respect for REL for giving the best of what they believe in than sale me another sub.
Conventional wisdom suggests that could be a challenge, ie., big sensitivity mismatch, a 4.5x difference in cone area, ... and most challenging would be phase alignment between sealed and vented.
It's not ideal, however it may be ok.
Personally, I would not recommend pairing this particular REL sub with your Cornwall IVs. At RELs recommendation (2 years ago), I paired my Heresy IVs with a single S/510, and it was pure heaven. However, REL has since changed their guidance and now recommend either a single or a pair of their HT 1510 subs for all Klipsch Heritage line speakers. Thus, my recommendation would be to try a single 1510. Per another commentator, I believe the 1510 would be a better match as well (vs the Classic 98) in view of the Cornwall IVs main woofer area vs the sub woofer area (generally, those should be matched for ideal blending). Note, you can use the HT 1510 using high-level speaker level inputs if you pair it with their Airship II wireless connector (i.e., a first for their HT subs, which historically had been limited to low level inputs only, even with their wireless modules...but, that has now changed with the 1510!). Good luck.
I found the old email.
Me. "Would the TX9 or TX7 a better match for my Cornwall IV? I am using the HT/1508 with Cornwall IV at the moment. Thinking moves the HT to theater and replace it with TX. Thank you"
REL response: "Unfortunately neither model is going to match well with those speakers. Your Cornwall speakers are very efficient, and you need really high output for those speakers. The HT1508 is a great choice for those speakers. "
@@slowestrider4918
My conventional wisdom would be right in line then.
Hi Steve. Love your channel.
I'm considering buying this sub and using the speaker level out put. The problem is, that I have an Exposure 2510 that only excepts banana plugs. I noticed that you have some speaker terminal adapters. What are they called specifically? I tried searching the Internet without luck. Thanks.
They have so many . I dont have a very good system i was told but I can't afford at my age to do something else . I have a Rotel 1592 MKII ,2 Polk R700s, & a Eversolo DMPA8 streamer device im struggling with . I really ,really enjoy it for what it is . Id like to buy a subwoofer or maybe 2 for it . Its in a 23 by 23 ft room 10 ft ceilings . Id like to buy something but kind of afraid of making a terrible mistake . Any feedback would be appreciated . Thank you all.
I say they have the classic look down. Loos like the storm, stata and stadium series with the volt drivers when I first got into this crazy hobby. Those were great subs and still still are if you can pick one up used.
Volt drivers were actually made in the same factory as the British EMI (record label) woofers. But the British Sound you know, had worked with their own stuff and what amplifier did you use with your Volt?
Does anyone have any experience with these and Klipsch La Scalas? The La Scalas don't need alot of extra bass but these would go well with the walnut. Thanks.
Getting a REL subwoofer really improved the sound of my HiFi. Sound stage is much more detailed.
That's what a good sub does, it doesn't draw attention to itself, you just magically seem to have speakers that can reproduce the full spectrum of sound. If you tune and integrate it well, anyway.
@user-tp7xq1kc9b oh wow! That’s amazing. Please post
i have only ever heard one negative review for REL parts. it can't be an illusion, they must sound great.
but for *fourteen hundred dollaridoos* i feel like they can do better than:
❌"steel frame" = stamped steel basket (entry level, bottom tier component)
❌27Hz, -6dB, IN ROOM (quarter space presumably? whose room? where's the -3dB point that we use for everything else in audio?)
❌0 or 180 phase
❌Class D, but only 300w RMS
i've not heard one. i admit this! i bet they sound terrific. i yield to that assessment.
but am i alone here? doesn't it look like they could aim for a better performance envelope,
_maybe if they used better, more robust parts,_ or
i do like the down firing driver.
down firing drivers are elegant af
can anyone reflect some light on the vintage Rel storm lll...
and how does it compare to the new classic 98/99
Hoping to add 98 to SourcePoint 8 and Rega ELEX 4. Thoughts?
Living in Europe, when I started looking for subs, I landed on a direct-to-manufacturer option, namely BK Electronics out of the UK. Used to make REL as an OEM, I believe. Either way, I picked up a pair of their XXLS400 in down firing, so also a nice veneered box that looks great in the room. Basically this... except with more everything, driver size and amp both, continuous phase, auto power on/off - just great and especially for the money which is way less than anything REL. Otherwise quite similar, including the Speakon connector. Old school - a nice class AB amp, no remotes etc. Still nice to get something REL-like, possibly better, for way less. As in, my pair of 12-inch sealed 400 watt subs added up to a bit less than this single REL. As for subs for music... I honestly think they belong in basically every system, unless we're talking stuff like gigantic flagships with built-in subs. You really should cover the 20-40 hz region even for music. Anyone with bookshelves are kidding themselves if they run them without subs, they're absolutely leaving some enjoyment on the table. Naturally, the sub has to be quality, and for music, probably sealed to get less "flabby" output.
Noticed this 98 says it is made in Wales.... maybe by BK?
dude, that's quite interesting info. REL does claim most of its performance lies in its filter. how fast are these BK's?
But the drivers used by BK are not as good as the ones we can find on the REL's sub.
This looks like it'd be a furniture mate to the old Bose 501's, say 1977 +- vintage.
The height and look of these things almost would let them work as a side table…could be a winner for people with a partner who doesn’t love staring at a big black box.
'A partner?' You know in New York, they have dozens of partners, one for every week in the year and side tables ... wow, they're auntie Beanie and so would cover it over with a black sheet making it hide in the LARGE listening place. (Not like in your trailer park I know). But trailers could use sub-woofers that turned on their sides would double as a bench chair. Used to be we could build sub-woofers into sofas.
@@keplermission
You did it again....
🤔
at those specs there is plenty of bk subwoofers that match for a fraction of the price
Here in Australia the classic 98 retails for $2,699 au
Aside from a nice wood veneer finish, how is this a better value than any of the Rythmik subs, which, at minimum, extend to 20hz? My dual F12's for music completely disappear and the overall soundstage is immersive with all the deep bass the recording has to offer. This is with smallish 2 way stand mount monitors.
I love maggies so much, even without subs.
A few years ago, I tried a pair of Magnepans. I just bought a pair because I couldn't get a good demo, and I always wanted to try them. After keeping them for about a year, I decided they weren't for me. However, I thought the bass was excellent. It was the speakers best aspect. It sounded like they were going for bass quality over quantity. I think so many people are used to HT bass, they forget what good quality bass sounds like. I know you're going to ask me which ones I had. I'm pretty sure they were 1.7's.
@@AT-wl9yq No you know I have the Realistic Optimus X-100 and they're better than any subwoofer, it's a true woofer that goes to 800Hz and they weren't top of the range but were very expensive back in the day. I also use Pioneer speaker, similar to the CS-656 that I recommend. Really good ... awesome memories of those terrible days when they were sold in places. The CS-656 was very hard to buy, they weren't in most stores, just the best, forget subwoofers.
@@AT-wl9yq Well put. Quality over quantity. Going from my 1.7i's to a higher end box speaker, LF can often sound flabby in comparison, and especially so with a slow sub.
I've still got a Q100which I got for my 18th back in 98. I havent used it for years and not sure if it still works. I don't use my Hifi much as I live at my Dads - recently bought some Hifiman Arya Organic headphones. I wonder if it's worth keeping the Q100.
Sadly I'm going to have to stick with my SVS sub for around the same price. So I can enjoy my pipe organ music 😂
Who are they ?lol
Are you sacrificing quality using the RCA over Speaker Level- looking at this for the Sonus Faber Duetto
Do you think this is a better option than a SVS SB-3000 or SB-4000? I'm looking for a strictly 2-channel setup. I'm leaning this way mainly for the high level input option. I wish more mfg included this option on all their models. I would be pairing with Polk SDA CRS powered by a Onkyo M-504 in a vintage 80's setup. The REL would fit aesthetically perfect.
Hi Steve, thanks for a great, thought-provoking review. I realise that there’s not a lot of stereo image information below 120Hz but when you connect one output channel to the sub, how do you not lose the bass signal from the one whole channel that you don’t use? For example, acoustic double-bass and electric bass guitar on “Walk on the Wild Side”? There must be a way of combining the left and right signals into one channel for the sub to handle in mono, surely? Any comments would be really helpful.
The left and right speaker level channels from the power amplifier were connected to the subwoofer!
Yeah, we use a Y connector, that combines the two channels into one but you subs with a single input usually use an output from a 'sub' socket on the amplifier and it's already combined. We could make our own sub filter because we can't put full frequency into a sub. We filter off the higher stuff and ground it via a resistor, unless you want it for other uses. But ... there are 'dead areas' in rooms that negate a sub's contribution. It's not a straightforward thing to set up.
Thanks for the info, looks like I can stop worrying!
$2,700 AUD In Australia. I Love the look but I just can't buy a woofer without an app so i can increase or decrease the volume, even turn it off at times. I can't just get up and get to the rear of the sub.
When I saw the pic, I thought it was a BK Monolith Plus. Very similar and BK used to make some REL subs, or components of same.
I just moved to Wharfedale Elysian-4 speakers which play down to 30hz and thought I might no longer need my twin subs, but though the Wharfedale sound great without, they sound even better with twin subs crossed at 45hz.
Steve, you forgot to mention the famous sub woofer in that guys system, the Jumbo...
😂
Hmmm, when I recently got my new Zu DW6 speakers I disconnected my 12" Klipsch subwoofer, but I guess I will power it back up and see what's cookin'.
I use it with a Rotel !592MKII with a pair of Polk R700s . It’s heaven . I feel like 1980 listening to Boston in my Time Machine
What about the REL S/510? anyone own one, thoughts?
Please get 2 Rel Quake's, thank me later.
Quakes?
if you have two pair, then do you get Quad Dmg
@@WeeWeeJumbo Haha yeah something like that.
The Quake is a small mosfet amplified sealed Subwoofer that offers quick response and deep bass for a very reasonable price
There’s one subwoofer which delivers the best of both worlds the SW-115 from Klipsch.
Steve any change of doing a review on the JBL 4305P active streaming speaker? Are they audiophile grade?
Placing the sub on the wall, you can get ~3db gain, and ~6db gain in a corner of the room, and yea move it around in that areas...
all low frequency from all box speakers are omni direction, but that does not mean the response will be the same around the room.
Adding a REL sub was the best $1k upgrade I’ve made to my system
Any chance of reviewing golden ear SuperSub XXL?
do you imagine this would do well with the klipsch rp 600m speakers. ?
If you're not doing a sub crawl, you are wrong. To correct the procedure, you do not move you listening chair necessarily. You should put the sub at your listening position at ear level. Play music you're familiar with that has good bass. You then maneuver all over the room, including crawling on hands & knees to fine where the bass sounds correct. That is where the sub should be placed & if it's not on the floor so be it. You use what you need to get the sub up where it needs to be.
Yeah, but putting an SVS PB 16 Pro at ear level where your couch goes has its challenges.
@KimmoJaskari I've got a Tannoy Definition sub myself. Unfortunately it rattles the rest of the house. No rattles in my room though. In any case due to complaints I am forced to use a little Bose Bluetooth speaker for my listening.
Interestingly, this method is not how REL recommends setting up their subs. If you do try RELs, I'd highly recommend watching their set up videos. Also, stereo pairs with REL really make these shine- each draws the sonic info from the main amp- left and right channels respectively and adds to the space and sound stage. I personally wouldn't use the crawl method as RELs set up for stereo subs worked spectacularly for me. In the world of good home audio, there are almost never any absolutes though- every system, every listening environment is unique.
The Studio One guys have great taste. Definitely my favorite reggae compilations bar none.
Actually Dr.Hsu recommends near field woofer placement
Thanks Steve for the great information. This newbie loves your thoughts.
Just was listening to some Taj today w/ my sub on...so good!
Great system from Barney, c’mon the Well.
I have the REL Stentor, is it good?
Better than the one shown here, as long as it has been looked after properly of course.
@@martinfarinha of course, it is in mint condition.
As an audiophile and music lover, can’t imagine a system without a subwoofer, to me a system without a subwoofer is the same as watching tv with a third of the screen gone. That’s how much you are missing from music without one.
That's a nice looking cabinet for a subwoofer! Thank you for the review. For my budget system, I opted for the Rythmik L12 sealed sub (12" 300W class D). It's basic matte black (don't need it to stand out aesthetically in the room). They have a piano gloss white option for more money, but there's a TV nearby, and I didn't want to be annoyed by reflections. Rythmik seems to have a reputation like REL for making some very "musical" subwoofers. My L12 is blended with sealed Arendal 1961 bookshelf speakers situated on actual (packed) bookshelves, crossover at 90 Hz, and Emotiva BasX A2 powers the mains.
I think the oldest subwoofer I have seen and herd was put out by Phase Linear as part of their Andromeda 3 system. sold a couple sets of those back in the early 80,s .
was the subwoofer you are referring sold to the general public ? . the phase linear was from the early to mid 70s. from 1977to 93 I sold thousands of pieces of classic audio equipment at a stereo store I managed . from mcintosh mc 275 to marantz model9 and even a couple of jbl paragons.@@keplermission
Hi Steve, I have a blue! red strata 3, its basically the original to this new classic subwoofer. I bought it used and the first owner decided to re-finish it but it was a snip at 150gbp! sounds great indeed with my ATC SCM7 MK2 speakers. for the high level connection from the power amp I investigated connecting at the power amp terminals and then at the speaker terminals and connected to to speaker terminals is a whole lot better. give it a go!
ATC SCM7 MK2 are Billy Woodman's stuff and people don't know what sort of community that stuff came from but tubes and their speakers don't work well with the wrong amplifiers. It's like somebody buying a used Rolls Royce and pulling a trailer with it. I mean why not buy a used Jeep? So we fit something to the Rolls Royce to make it pull better but it was never designed for that.
I'm sorry, but only 27hz at -6 db?? What an absolute joke of a cheap driver they used.
REL sacrafice really deep bass for speed and accuracy. That's why so many Maggie owners use REL. Very few subs can keep up with the speed of planar speakers, so you get this very slight time misalignment in the bass. It sounds off and probably contributed to the anti-sub sentiment that persisted in the audiophile community for a long time. If these were ported, they'd have better specs in that sub 30hz range. But that would sacrifice speed. So RELs don't thump out 20hz bass, at least not at this price, but they provide clean, fast bass for music.
@@dwymer86 Very well said ! And for music it is pretty deep enough !
Steve, I see new naim amp:)
I understand the method of finding the best place to set a subwoofer but that means giving up my entire room to my audio system which is not feasible to me. There is no way that I am going to run a cable(s)from my preamp or amplifier to a place possibly behind my listening position as it makes no sense to me. It's not a dedicated music room, it's my living room and I like keeping my subwoofer where the manufacturer recommends placement and adjust the volume, crossover, and phase controls to get the best possible result. I know it's not as good as this method that you describe but it's the best I can do. There has to be a limit to my passion for proper music reproduction.
That's why there's a wireless option
Janis Subwoofers -nicest mid century coffee table style cabinets
Yes!
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac a pair of them at Lyric w Tympanis w a think about six or eight Mark Levinson classA - think that wss 79 or 80
Steve...please best value for $1399. No way man. You know thats not true. Their own T9x at $1449...beats it out. And two RSL speedwoofer 10s would crush it regarding low frequency, bass smoothness and pure output. At $500 less!
As much as i love RELs, im a little disappointed in the class d. The Ti and Tx series are class ab.
Why what's wrong with class d for a sub
@@carlitosgomez71 I always liked the fact that REL continued to use AB for their subs when many others use D. Thanks for making me question that though! I actually take issue with people posting negatively when they haven't even heard a piece or given it a chance. So yeah, that was a little hypocritical of me!
@@dwymer86 no I get your point the only thing I can think of is that class A maybe more reliable long term and perhaps a little more musical subjectively but you loose the efficiency and weight associated with class d
The nait 50! The nait 50!
You said right from the beginning of this video that you were not speaking of home theater here but two channel stereo reproduction. My goal in life was never home theater and will never be home theater. It's bogus to me. If I want those effects, I'll go to the movie theater instead of constantly damaging my eardrums.
? but of course, owning a home theater doesn't imply running high output levels,
any more than owning a powerful stereo amplifier does.
in fact, cinema reference output levels are much, much higher than those actually running in most people's home theaters
Gold, Silver and Bronze, all the others that ran the race are forgotten. You know? It doesn't matter what you do unless you're a winner, nobody cares. You know, all you got in four walls just like anybody else.
I'm struggling to find the point of this comment.
Any sub that can output bass at high levels with low distortion and extension down to 15-20 Hz would work equally well for music and home theater, correct?
Probably not. Theater subs are set up different than music subs. The connections to start with. The speaker level connection is the best way to go for music, while a HT system has separate channels just for bass. How you have to adjust them is also different. You have to make some choices. Is music more important than movies? If yes, then get a pair of music subs and set them up for music. You'll still get improvements on movies. Or you can do the opposite and get HT subs if music is a secondary. Or, if you have the room and money, get a pair of music subs and put them on your main front speakers, and get HT subs for your LFE channels.
You asked for a recommendation. I can only recommend something for music. While I have a HT system, the speakers I use just don't need subs, and movies aren't my primary concern. I'm not the right person to ask for that type of sub. For music, I recommend Vandersteen without any hesitation. The Model 3's are great, and if you can find a pair of 2's you'll be happy with those as well. They're more expensive than REL, but nowhere near as expensive as some other high end brands. I can afford subs that cost a lot more, but I still pick the Vandersteens as my first choice. If you go over to his website, he has a lot of information on how they are made, and why he makes certain design choices. Even just reading the owners manuals will give you a lot of information.
@@AT-wl9yq I have an older pair of sealed MK subs. They work great with any kind of music, and they are fine for home theater. Line level connections, too. Audyssey does a great job integrating them with my other speakers.
Output vs fidelity
@@ns387241 there is no reason a good sub can't have both.
this proves all the speakers you talk about fall short and you need to try other true full range speakers like your former Cornwalls which also fall short in some cases.
Even large, full range speakers benefit from subwoofers that are appropriately specified and tuned
Or you can get two RSL speedwoofer 10s for $500 less. They will majorly outperform the one REL subwoofer. Honestly, this REL is a very poor value for what you get. $1399 for a 300 watt 37lb sealed 10" subwoofer? Wowsers!
I love the Duets CD and Reids nasty guitar is a knockout. I used to demo equipment at CES using this CD. People liked it so much that someone stole it from me and I had to go hunt up another in the middle of the show.