I feel the best content is what the maker wants to make. It may seem like a basic and silly thought, but it really does make a difference when a creator enjoys what they make. I only got into the hobby last year, but have already found some favorite creators who branch out from warhammer to paint what they like. Keep up the goodwork, and try not to let the algorithm get you down. Thanks for all the awesome videos!
Videos about painting Warhammer minis got me into the hobby (Thanks Goobertown Hobbies!!!) but videos like yours helps me improve and enjoy it evermore. I love the diversity, and having a broader range of miniatures being showcased would be really nice. By the way, I'd love to see you paint an Owlbear :D
The market has spoken, WH is popular and it will get more views. That’s the reality, there’s not a question of right or wrong here, just do what you what you think is best. I like WH and I do watch more WH content. If you’re a painter it doesn’t do any harm to pain WH models.
Hey thanks for the shout out! Humbled to be a part of such a talented and enthusiastic bunch of creators. This was a great look at Warhammer. I come mostly from D&D and fantasy minis, so it's been interesting to come fresh to Warhammer to learn about all the rule systems, lore and minis.
One thing that I love about your content is how you push artistic creativity from color theme to building contrast. Definitely stepped up my paint game thanks to you!
Unfortunately it seems this is happening across the board on RUclips now. It *seems* like the algorithm only cares about extremely popular content now. If it's very popular, it gets thrown everywhere. If it's slightly less popular? It gets buried. I am seeing this with gaming content too. It's very sad.
It's so refreshing to see NOT just Warhammer stuff all the time but other figures and how different painters approach the subject, I love Bestarium and Cobra Mode 3D prints and it's a shame those gorgeous figures are upstaged by another painting tutorial about space marines. I'd really love to see more videos about painting larger scale display quality figures, that would be wonderful! *Onwards and upwards!*
I feel like Marco Frisoni really opened my eyes to this a few years ago when he started to paint with oils. For so long, miniature painting has had this mentality that they were re-inventing the painting wheel and Marco made me realise that art has literally been around for centuries so why not use all the techniques and information already available and utilise it in our hobby. Games Workshop has had the monopoly of thought and process in the miniature world for so long, they made people think they invented the whole subject. I think the way Games Workshop have marketed limited techniques on their customer base to sell their average paints originally opened the hobby to be more accessible but now there is more competition, their failings become more apparent with comparision. On the flip side, not everyone is into painting and/or has the time to dedicate to the craft as it can take a while to become proficient depending on what you are aiming for. Games Workshop will always try to keep their niche market as a closed circle. From the inside, it looks like you have everything you need, but from the outside, there is a whole world of art and creativity out there to be explored
I love Marco -- I've been using oils for figure painting for a while, but in a more painterly way. I tried his "slap it on and wipe it off" technique, and was pleasantly surprised by the results. If you want more oil painting techniques on figures, check out Milan Dufek -- he uses the basic technique I learned and use today: base coat with acrylics, details and finish with oils. He goes back and forth between mediums a lot, and mixes his own colors from a limited palette, and I find I've learned a lot from him as well. His subject matter is historical, not fantasy, so you'll also be helping retrain the algorithm away from GW.
@@khanoclast Hey Jon, thank you so much for the recommendation! I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and insight. I love working with a limited palette too! Just subed to Milans page thankyou. I feel its only fair I trade you a recommendation for one of mine too haha. One of my favourite artists who i have learnt the most about colour mixing from is Andrew Tischler. He is more traditional for sure and has really taken my knowledge to another level. Hope you enjoy and i love your passion so keep painting my friend :)
@@patrickhamilton-ferren1041 And a thank you for the reference as well! I just watched the quick clip on skin tones -- now I've got more stuff to try! Oh, and thanks to Lyla for providing a place for us to connect!
You realize the 'take' is basically 'I want to have all sunshine and rainbows super happy fun time at my job but instead I have to do things people pay me for'?
The diversity I've encountered by branching out and watching other creators has taught me so much in the past year: new techniques, new styles of painting, even new ways of thinking about why we're doing this at all! I'm grateful that folks like you take time to share your thoughts about how GW affects the hobby, for good and ill.
Thank you for saying this! I'm about to start posting my own mini painting and terrain video but don't touch anything GW. I know it is a bad business idea on my part to not include GW content but I want to be part of bringing other game systems to light. Like you I am inspired by influences outside of just traditional mini painting. I bring graphic design and art influences as well as from doing model trains growing up. I hope that we can try to change the perception that you need to use warhammer and other GW products/systems to succede on youtube.
Thanks for the mention! Great topic. This is so true and not just for RUclips, but most platforms. Warhammer always brings in more visibility. As much as I love Warhammer, I don't want to only see that or tailor my content around it.
Hey Lyla, one of the things I enjoy about your channel is that you want to use art history and techniques of some of the great artists. If you were to show me the difference between Baroque, Impressionism, and surrealism, you'd probably try by showing me a portrait, or a landscape, in each style. A Space Marine happens to be the miniature equivalent of a bowl of fruit. We all know what an apple looks like. Most art classes have taught us how to draw one through shading a sphere, but how would Dali and Van Gogh do it? There's your opportunity! I don't play any mini war games. I have painted MANY of the same models for board games and that repetition allowed me to experiment, compare like to like, and grow. You gotta keep yourself sane when painting 20 goblins, right? That's the perfect time to say "I'm going to use of the ideas Lyla shared." You're crushing it here on RUclips doing it your way. Keep it up! But, maybe these suggestions will help you feel less opposed to doing some GW content.
It makes me feel so much better to hear you say you don't play mini wargames, either. I really want to get deeper into painting minis, but I just don't have the time or a sustained interest for playing the games. I just like art and want to paint! Great to see that someone who's become so accomplished can come from the same perspective, even if you get stuck pushing GW content too much!
I agree with you and totally feel the same way - making a video and NOT making it related to Warhammer is a bad business decision at this point. It's not all bad though, I think that Warhammer still opens the doors for many people that will be interested in painting other brands as well!
This was such a fantastic video Lyla! You're absolutely right that warhammer just dominates the niche in terms of views, but there are lots of amazing creators out there and I'm so happy I reguarly dig through search to find them haha. Also thanks so much for the shoutout!!
Just want to say your channel is awesome. And thank you to Lyla for promoting it. My wife has been looking into making and painting scenery instead of minis and without this video we may have never found your page.
This hits me right in the feels. Trying to get YT to understand I want painting not WH seems impossible. But I get content creators are trapped, many have commented as much. I love your channel and your art history early content was right up my street and had me hooked. I’m trying to paint board game minis mostly and looking for other interesting miniatures to expand my options. This video is great thanks for recommending some small creators. Also this confirms my thinking about jumping on your patreon.
theyre not really trapped, they have decided they want to do it. its like saying i want to make a company that makes chocolate bars out of dirt and dead leaves, but no one wants to eat them so im 'trapped' into making chocolate bars out of chocolate because thats what people want to eat. youre not trapped, you have decided you want to make a product that X amount of people will willingly consume, thats a free choice you are making, no ones telling you what you have to make, you are freely deciding to limit your creativity within certain boundaries.
@@marmaladegrrl sure, i think capitalism, certainly the sort of neoliberal consumerism model of it that has taken over the world is destroying genuine meaning and motivation in society. its a shame people chose to play into that system by making clickbait 'gw is ruining the hobby' videos in order to cash in on name dropping gw instead of actually using their platform to examine the real reason our entire world is going down the toilet right now by showing an honest and insightful window into how its effecting their niche.
The difference is that this demand for Warhammer content has only seriously been affecting views over the past year. Before that: Warhammer was an easy slam dunk, not a requirement.
@@LylaMev so how does that = games workshop is now ruining the hobby? youre just talking about you making money from youtube and what you feel constrained to make videos about in order to meet your own self determined profit goals. you are basically trying to make the case that warhammer is ruining the hobby by making hobby products that people want to buy. this is what it boils down to once you start including warhammers name in this and attributing blame for any of this to warhammer, and its a completely illogical take that is actually backwards because them making hobby products that people want to buy is actually creating the hobby, not ruining it. but youre only really trying to push that idea to 'make content' to fuel your own channel right? cause this isnt really anything to do with games workshop or the hobby space, its just about you and your relationship with the money you make from youtube when you really examine it.
I agree so hard with this. I want cool minis to paint that are not like 35€ for a mini barely bigger than a normal unit, but I just don't want to 3d print it because I don't enjoy resin 3d printing. I wish youtube would shove me new models from other brands like it does with games workshop
then the problem isnt games workshop for existing, the problem is youtube creators who are using games workshop to cash in on youtube clicks rather than promoting miniatures they love right? youtube creators like... this one right here, who is making this very video to cash in on youtube clicks by name dropping games workshop rather than simply making positive content about an alternative.
With my painting, (I used to work for GW a VERY long time ago) so I did their painting style for work, my own was somewhat sparser, then I did minimalist style paining, and have now drifted into a more impressionistic style over the last few years.
I love the lore and world of Warhammer, but I much prefer the painting side of the hobby and have been looking for more display pieces to paint. I love watching your videos on techniques and how to slowly improve my painting, especially anything not involving a GW model :D
This is actually really coincidental timing... I was just searching for videos about fantasy miniature painting last night because I was tired of looking at warhammer models all the time haha.
I think part of the problem is that most people who play D&D, such as myself, aren't into painting minis. I started buying prepainted minis from Wizkids, and then I noticed they look like they were painted by a three year old with arthritis. So I watch people who paint Warhammer to learn to paint my 3D printed models, because most of the Wizkids sculpts are also terrible, and I have even bought some Warhammer models to use in D&D. I think D&D must be as if not more popular than Warhammer, so that can't be the problem. I think the majority of people playing D&D aren't into painting minis, at least not compared to Warhammer, which has painting armies built into it.
The crossover between D&D model painters and players was (is?) small. That was my 13 year old back in the 90's. I actually PAID someone to paint the models in our party so we could set them up for different things relevant to the RPG. I eventually learned to do a bit of painting but it was from the GW magazine. There was a TSR miniature combat game (Battlesystem) but it predictably fizzled. Heck, this was even before M:TG existed. In a certain way I think we got this wrong - we should learn more from other media more: model train hobbyists, actual painters (as in canvas, wood, etc.) for more advanced techniques.
I agree with you that Warhammer is a mixed blessing. I started out with Ral Partha miniatures and loved painting them. But my hobby shop soon got into Warhammer and soon stopped carrying other lines. Anytime I want to find miniatures to paint or build I have less choices due to Warhammer being the standard. Personally I like the weird and strange ideas other companies used to have as they opened the hobby in new directions. But with the holy Warhammer holding court over all it's impossible to go far outside of this universe. I feel there is a lot more to the miniature wargaming and painting hobby but, until Games Workshop stops being the focus, there won't be much growth.
why do you have less choice because warhammer exists? why is it impossible to go outside of their universe? its not really, you are just deciding that and doing it to yourself. its like saying when i watch a movie i can only watch marvel superhero movies.... because i have made a decision im only allowed to watch movies that X million other people are watching. and thats marvels fault for existing and making movies a lot of people want to see, how dare they?
@@necaacen 100% agree. I ran out of Ral Partha miniatures to paint because of lack of availability in the early 90's. I literally had to travel out of my country of birth to find something I wanted to paint. This is the golden age of miniature painting as far as I am concerned.
It's a bit weird that we seem to be of the same vintage with such a different outlook. I started with Tamiya models, then Ral Partha. Mostly self taught and a bit of knowledge from railway modelling and some magazines. Having the advice from HM Masterclass was amazing - "wait, you don't use the paint straight from the pot?! why would I add water to it???". Painted some Ral Partha miniatures with Testors enamels. Painted Battletech Mechs without priming them and then wondered with the paint kept flaking off. Wondered why the brushstrokes were so GW may be the largest one, and the current gateway. But it doesn't stop anyone else from painting more grandiose miniatures and more diverse stuff. Having a bulwark such as GW anchors the hobby - and allows for experimentation around it and myriad of options around it. I recently painted some Among Us characters for my son (he hated painting). I painted a chimera from Reaper with my daughter (who loved it, and now jokes about "Thousand thin coats" because the Scale75 paints instant colours were so thin). And have a small Chtulhu bust going on after painting all the Lovecraftian monsters in a tabletop game. Never have we had so many options. There are literally dozens of miniature ranges being released monthly on kickstarter if you really feel that GW is clamping on your aspirations. There are many more options - not all of them well supported. But that goes with what one philosopher told in a conference I attended "one of the problems of modern people is that we have so much access to information we want Champagne at the price of Fanta". It should take less than 30 minutes to anyone with even middling motivation to find quality non-warhammer content on RUclips.
@@necaacen A lot of it has to do with easy availability. Back in the day you just went to the store and bought your miniatures and that was that. Gaming stores stocked a lot of variety and it was easy to see what was new and different and pick it up. But Games Workshop dominates most hobby stores and they just don't carry much else. You can go online and try to track stuff down but it's expensive with shipping. 3-D printing is actually making it much easier to branch out and sites like myminifactory are great. But even Games Workshop casts a huge shadow just like Marvel and DC do on the superhero genre. What is popular sells and is imitated ad nauseum. This leads to a lot of stuff looking the same and the trend is to follow the money. I gravitate towards less popular stuff because I like something more unique and innovative. I don't say it's wrong that they make stuff people want to buy and if it's popular that is great. But the days when you could find miniatures that are outside the norm are gone. Even sci-fi miniatures follow the trends of doing Star Wars or Aliens or other pop culture icons rather than taking a risk on something unique. Anyhow, just my opinion.
This video is assuming that all the views going to Warhammer content would be evenly distributed amongst the more niche topics but I feel like a lot of it simply wouldn't exist. Unique, unusual art is universally difficult to market - it's difficult for people to search for things they haven't seen before. Keep doing what you're doing Lyla, every so often make a video and don't worry about views/revenue. Actors and directors will make some films for money and use that to fund their passion projects, which are usually much more interesting.
🤗Hi. The closest I come to 'miniature painting' are 1/35 scale military figures to go with my model tanks & other WW-II vehicles. Still, I've watched several 'technique' videos and found some of the info helpful. Some things like underpainting are as easily applied to my hobby as yours - personally, I'm voting for more technique videos, especially ones aimed at beginners in the miniature painting field. Hang in there and do your thing, it's art and the world can always use more art - even miniature art....
Wow, now that you point this out, it's very noticeable. Looking back at my searches, there are a lot of "How to paint specific model X" and not so much "How do I glaze?" or "How do I edge highlight red?". You are 100% right that modern search algorithms key into previous searches and return more relevant search results based on those previous searches. If I look for a lot of "How to paint Space Marine", then when I type in "How to glaze with acrylic paint", it'll return videos about glazing Space Marines. Unfortunately, I don't think it's going to change because new painters are typing in "How to paint a blue Space Marine with contrast paint" and not "how to use glazes to paint a model", which might be what they wanted in the first place. More experienced painters/hobbyists might be trying to branch out and try new things, but will be hampered by their previous searches and the searches made by others. Anyways... thanks for making the non-GW content! I like it, and find it interesting. I hope others do to, and use your channel as a stepping off point to other non-GW hobby content. There is so much more out there then what GW marketing would like you to think...
Lyla, you're doing such a good thing. Shout outs to indie projects and creators with yet small audience is genuinely kind and so nice of you. It's so sick and sad that youtube is dominated by merciless and unfair algorithms, and not all creators happen to born equal according to them. I wish you all of luck at fighting with them and breaking them down! The True Art should win.
Thank you for this video, and for shouting out other content creators! The very limited amount of painting I do is on board game minis (though admittedly, one of those games is Warhammer Underworlds Nightvault!). And where can I find chicken-flavoured opiates for "my cat"?
I feel like you nailed it when you talked about the market. By using GW or Warhammer, creators can get people who may not care about the hobby (building/painting), but care about the lore, books, video games, upcoming Amazon series, and table top game. This could be pumping up the viewership numbers to include people searching for things outside the niche miniature painting community. I think it would be interesting to see a media agency do market research into finding out how many people specifically look for miniature painting (GW specific, or not), versus, people who look for GW things, but are not actually looking for the miniature painting part of their products.
@@LylaMev do you think if someone made a video about painting Critical Role inspired minis, with Critical Role in the title and thumbnail, that it would have the same affect as GW/WH, but bringing in the Critter crowd instead?
@@weekendminis If you did a diorama of an iconic scene, then maybe. but probably not! the Critter niche us not commonly associated with miniature painting, so the two niches don't cross paths as frequently as GW and miniature painting.
Thanks for the playlist loop technique! I have 3 different computers at work with nothing better to do then help some great content makers. Studson is my new fix for fun while Model Mayhem has been a mainstay since I started with Gunpla then came to miniatures. You are my favorite breath of fresh air of course!
This was well said!! I am an avid 3D printer/painter of D&D miniatures and it's getting harder and harder to find content for that genre specifically. Everything I search for was created some time ago. And yup...i play them often...I have no interest in warhammer but those artists that paint them do have great techniques that I apply to the models I choose to paint. Again, thanks for saying what needed to be said! I love your channel and your tips!
I’ve been building 1/48 aircraft models since I was 7 or 8. I am now pushing 50. I don’t do the war hammer thing, but channels like yours really helps my overall painting skills.
I do love Warhammer, but I also watch all kinds of painting/modeling/terrain content. I watch train people like Luke Towan and Kathy Millat, D&D creators like RP Archive and Wyloch, and many more. There's a lot of great content out there that's not Warhammer related, but the techniques can be applied to anything... :)
I’m hoping to start the switch from painting models for games (which I don’t play very often) to display pieces and dioramas, so content on 3d printed parts for displays, for instance, would suit me more than another video on new Warhammer stuff. That said, Warhammer will always be my first geek love so I’ll never completely wean myself off it.
I love how popular wargaming content creators feel like they need to "educate" other hobbyists watching RUclips about non GW games like they are going to change the world.
I wish people would watch more videos about not the warhammers sometimes. But I also like painting little robot lunch box boys. Mostly in blue because that makes the warhammers obsessed people upset, but that makes me happy sometimes hahaha
Great video Lyla! Thanks so much for bringing this up. Every bit of content I consider making always starts with an argument inside my head over whether interesting to me also equals interesting to RUclips.
Hi Lyla, I recently found your channel and after a couple of tutorials I subbed. The reason, I used to play 40k and Warhammer 20 yrs ago and I have quite a collection of GW models. Old school metal ones. Coming back to the hobby after the family have grown up I decided to get into 3D printing for the purpose of painting what I want and not just jumping back on the GW wagon. Self printed minis is such a diverse area that I'm now printing and painting minis that I would never have thought of. Your channel is a ray of independent light in a GW dominated you tube, long may you continue and your tips for an old painter like me are going to be fun to try and master and for that, I thank you 👍
I miss the tutorial for sure.. and honestly, I could care less about warhammer... I only paint them because some of the models look cool, that's it for me. I paint what I want to paint. I didn't get into the hobby because I played the game so honestly I wish you could paint more of the different miniatures out there. It would be epic. Hopefully things change... it's hard to get sheeple to change their habits in our cookie cutter world. Thanks for sharing! Love your content!
Great video and message! I am a relatively new RUclips-Creator and can already feel the dominance of Warhammer and GamesWorkshop when it comes to visibility of content. And thanks for showing my channel logo at 6:07 ☺
Hi. Great video and recommendations! I don't play Warhammer tabletop game, so basically RUclips doesn't show it to me in my RUclips feed. When I search for miniature painting, it doesn't appear. Instead what I like shows up, like D&D or miniature painting tips content.
imho, the one who is ruinning the content creation in youtube is youtube itself and its algorithm, how it demands click baiting titles, specific thumbnails, same themed videos, etc... I hope someday YT stops treating content creators so badly; you people don't deserve this.
I am new to tabletop miniatures and wargaming. I watch a lot of videos on various topics related to it. I especially love tutorials, and I've been watching and commenting on a lot of them. So far, I play OPR fantasy skirmish and mini gangs, and I got to this video starting out looking for info on OPR fantasy regiments. Warhammer's too expensive and intricate for my tastes, though I do like their lore and watch a fair number of lore videos too.
Wonderful job on Death. Those models of the 4 Horsemen look quite nice. I am always happy to view your (and other creators' content) regardless of GW. I mostly paint and look for ideas for deluxifying board games and RPG models.
I would love to witness a seminar with you, Discourse, Terri Litorco, Dana Howl, Sword’n’Steele, Vince Vinturella, squidmar, Uncle Atom, Miniac, Marco Frissoni.
I totally agree that Warhammer/games workshop needs to be separate from the miniatures painting hobby. I haven't played a game by GW since like 2006-2007? But with the algorithm, if I am looking for a painting technique for miniatures i generally have to type "painting fur Warhammer" so I don't get inundated with folks painting fur for like oil paintings or portraits. Thank you for bringing this topic up
I'm not into wargaming but I do enjoy miniature painting. What I really dislike about GW is that they had such amazing paints(charadon granite, I miss you so much) and nowadays have a great range of paints as well bottled in the worst possible containers. I've long moved all my GW paints to drop bottles but it is for sure a waste of plastic; regarding this issue, I´ve used the empty GW bottles in combination with tack as handlers but that does not solve the problem. As everithing out there it is a matter of choice, I think digital modelling and 3D printing will have a great rise in the coming years and with that we'll have more variety and more sources to get miniatures (both in wargaming scales and artistic scales). Right now major brands like Kimera, Aradia, FeR and the likes are getting more and more great figures made this way. Personally, I prefer a nice sculpt like those of Pedro Fernández or Karol Rudyk but I know this style will prevail eventually. Maybe in some years we'll be able to buy a Forgewolrd Thunderhawk STL file (pre-supported of course) with only one print allowed for only $499🤣
As someone who is trying to post more of their miniature painting online, I've found that other folks post almost solely Warhammer. But, I play mostly D&D/Pathfinder/Call of Cuthlu and I don't want to just post Skaven...even if I love my little ratfolk dearly.
What you mention in this vid is why I sub. I'm a scale modeler (military stuff), and dabble in dnd and have picked up more than a few lessons by watching your content. Keep it up, big fan of your work
Coming from the indie RPG space, what you're describing is basically the exact situation between tabletop RPGs and Dungeons & Dragons. Even though Kids on Brooms (for example) might get a nod from Polygon, nobody except niche gamers will play it. GW dominates the wargaming and miniatures space in the same way: D&D is simply synonymous with tabletop roleplaying games and Warhammer is synonymous with painting little space mans. So, I hear what you're saying completely. It's true that Warhammer is becoming its own entity entirely, in the same way that D&D essentially is (I mean there won't be a Wanderhome movie, right?). But remember that indie...*everything* is always going to lurk beneath the surface, so will indie miniatures, indie wargames, indie paint producers, and all the affiliated content creators. We have to find what we love, settle into our niche, and tell as many people as possible that, yes, there games that are not Warhammer just like there are cafes that are not Starbucks or metal bands that aren't Metallica...which is exactly what you've done! High five!
0:28 I'll pull you up here. GW makes terrible games, but great models. Horribly overpriced models, but great ones. The rules part of their games is rubbish. I've been wargaming for 50 years now (yeah, I'm old and grey), and without a doubt the rules for 40k are the biggest pile of steaming mess I've ever seen. I've played in a variety of settings, from 6mm modern, to 15 mm ancient, 1/72 WW2, to 25mm sci-fi, and all the rules were so, so much better written, and didn't need the near constant modifications and rebalancing. I've written rules for a variety of games companies too, and had them tested hard, but GW just seems to throw stuff at the wind and see if it sticks. One thing I loved about virtually every other genre is that models could be sourced from a variety of suppliers. Don't like a particular model? Buy the kit from a different company! The rules were detached from the companies making the models. Even GW was like this once, even encouraging you to scratchbuild things. The last vestige of that I saw was the Ork 4th Edition codex. My boys and their friends complain that models are so much more monopose now, and the codex reflects what's in the box these days, limiting wargear options. If GW keeps this up, more and more people will just invest in a 3D printer. I did a few months ago, and while it's been a learning curve all of its own, being able to make parts for models for just a few cents is brilliant. My terrain looks better too now (the mushroom forest came out awesome!), and I have models I could only dream about having before. Totally understand why YT'ers make GW centered content. It brings in the views. I'd love to see more comparison videos. "Hey look at this model! It's half the price of this similar GW model, and looks better. Watch me paint it!" Still, it's hard to bite the litigious hand that indirectly feeds you.
As an aspiring Content Creator, I will do my best not to fall into the trap of WARHAMMER ALWAYS! I like multiple hobbies, and don't want to get sucked into one particular game and system.
Thank you!! I have often thought the same thing. I search out more videos that address board game miniatures, because that is my interest. There are so few. I'm not a DnD or Warhammer player, but I love my BG minis and have been wanting to get the courage to paint them. I love classical painting techniques and wonder if you ever use chiaroscuro from an up-light source? All of the light sources from the videos I've watched seem to be from above or at a 45-degree angle at most. What would you think about a stark uplight on your Horsemen minis? Am I off-base? Thank you for your content!
As someone who enjoyed this hobby since the 90s and does not play Warhammer or any mini games anymore, the fact that most of your vids are NOT about warhammer is a huge bonus for me. I would love to learn more about other more niche studios and their products and while I enjoy the occasional warhammer mini I find Games Workshop's decisions and pricing of their product really offputting(and we already said they were too expensive in the early 90s).
I'm old enough to remember a time when GW had actual competitors and it irks me when people refer to miniature painting and/or wargaming as "the Warhammer hobby". My entry to was Warzone and I was only vaguely aware of WFRP and Wh40k until Dawn of War came out. I'm glad that the landscape is changing again, there are more games than ever and even classics like Battletech, Warzone and Chronopia have returned from the undeath!
I really appreciate this video and it definitely resonates with me. I have been painting miniatures for years, and the only Warhammer I've ever painted was for commission. I love learning new techniques, understanding art history, lighting, and painting theory, but I watch all the big great WH creators because of the techniques and information found in those Warhammer-centric videos (i.e. Vince Venturella). But, people like yourself definitely are a breath of fresh air in this hobby, and I appreciate you. Thanks for all you do!
I remember when playing D&D mid 80's at school yes I had the red box which brings back so many memories. Once I left school I used to just paint for my own enjoyment then 40k came along and yes I did start buying some of those figures but not the game, then X amount of years later I am now looking at getting back into painting my own miniatures. I just searched miniature painting tonight and your video was at the top however that may be because I am already following your channel which by the way is fantastic. It is true though every other video was Warhammer of some description which is a shame as there is so much variety of types of painting which I have been overadored by the quality across so many channels but can be hard to find sometimes. Thank you for your inspiration.
I feel like the actual problem is RUclipss algorithms. Yes, GW content clearly drives bigger numbers but RUclips filtering people almost exclusively towards only those popular creators is the issue. I can't imagine that Warhammer content has pulled fans of general mini-painting away from non-GW videos but RUclips sure would do that nor can I imagine a world where the popularity of Warhammer has done anything but get SO many people into the mini painting world in the first place. This is all basically re-stating a lot of stuff you said in the video, I know that Good video!
I'm tired of seeing videos about getting models to a "table top quality". I want to paint my miniatures as good as possible. I'd like to learn more about color mixing, theory or different types of pallets. I recently discovered the Zorn pallette and it was so fun to paint with a limited style.
I don’t care about Warhammer, I paint for me, I use the colors I want, the contrast I want, literally everything, Warhammer is for a select group, not bad by any means just not everyone.
This is what I like about your channel and why I'm subscribed. You produced painting tutorial videos that I can follow, you feature a range of models that showcase different creators, and you have intelligent discussion about issues facing the community (and proposed action). The tone is supportive, positive, and educative, and I'm sorry you need to 'play the game' for the algorithms (although I completely understand). Finding tutorials for non-GW models is challenging (I mean good production quality with an articulate host who knows how to instruct), so please keep creating. As far as I'm concerned, you're not only filling a niche - you are completely owning it.
I don't think it's all doom and gloom (not that that's what this video is all about) Yes, it's definitely an oroboros. 40K is THE most popular and recognizable brand, and a one-word-phrase to search for that will find you miniature content - so more people will be searching for Warhammer content, which in turn makes sense for content creators to generate content about warhammer to rope in that crowd, thus keeping warhammer the most popul... et cetera. Saying that, personally, I've found _many_ great youtube channels that deal with kitbashing/scratch-building from getting interested in Warhammer. And larger miniature-painting/wargaming creators end up creating their own games, learning/teaching 3D printing, dabbling in absurd techniques... I think a lot of creators managed to glow up thanks to Warhammer, but aren't necessarily limited to JUST warhammer, even if it's a constant in their content output. There's also something to be said for the applicability of a lot of the 40K videos - since every space marine model is basically the same (don't @ me, GW), seeing how different creators tackle the same model is really good for contrasting/comparing/isolating their technique in a way that can be a little harder if people were painting 20 different techniques on 20 different miniatures. If... if that makes sense.
Is "Games Workshop" a plague on the hobby is a complex question. As someone who has been into miniatures and gaming for over 40 years (yes that long) I have seen almost everything. The bad sides of GW are - 1: A lack of "games design innovation" in it's rules (they all use the same mechanic and its very broken . ..throw away the single D6 for everything it's 16.5% fidelity use a D20 as that is 5% fidelity and reduce the number of times rolled ie change the statistics) and constant rules revisions just to sell more books, not for the reasons of game improvement. 2: overpriced miniatures, tools and materials, and a lot of the tools they do sell are to be honest cheap rubbish....go compare GW branded plastic cutters with Tamiya ones! Ok so what's good - 1: figure/model designs- the figures do mostly fit together we'll, multipart figures means you don't have 20 identical miniatures to paint (which is boring) and the designs that are made are interesting to paint. 2: inovation with premixed "glaze" paints....yes contrast it is good for getting lots of figures on the table for beginners which is a good thing.....however it's hugely overpriced for what it is is the problem and you can now get similar paints from other manufacturers far cheaper than contrast....but to give GW a thumbs up for pushing the idea .
The Wahammer Effect as it were can be annoying in other game systems as well. While I'm glad to see more people joining the Battletech community for example, the Warhammer guys also drive me with how much they end up trying to make us change the way we play to facilitate a more 40K like experience
thank you for having the courage to look out for your patrons / viewers first. the content does seem very single tracked over the last few months. the variability of content is controlled. You and other like you are being coerced into providing content for the masses. Conspiracy theories for monopolies abound. So much for diversity via algorithms. I consider myself a neophyte in this hobby. I paint with trepidation. Varied content help stir my imagination. And the tutorials are, without question, the main reason I watch the RUclips videos.
My Problem is with this GW Center in Hobby is that most Tutorials are only talking about Citadel colors but me coming from Scalemodelbuilding is just confused with the Nameing of Colors sometimes ^^'
You are exactly right. Good for you for pointing this out. The RUclips algorithms are a black magic science and if you are a new creator and you focus on topics outside of the mainstream you are doomed to virtually no views. I watch channels like yours to learn painting tips, not because it's about a particular type of model or game. My Channel is about developing a different type of world, model railways. It's still modelling. My first layout was based around medieval buildings scaled down from wargaming structures. You guessed it, because it wasn't standard model railways that layout did terribly on RUclips. And because I focus on mostly English train models I'm virtually ignored in Australia. One other thing I've noticed is that my videos seem to be restrained to Australia, Southeast Asia and India. RUclips seems to be putting my videos in a box, only published in these areas. Local zoning? Certainly looks that way. So the English audience I'm aiming at don't see my videos it seems. Thanks RUclips. So much could be better for new creators like myself. Sadly I think that nothing will change and all the efforts to create content done by channels like mine will be lost in the virtual world and ignored by the algorithms that should be helping us. Good luck with your channel. Mon
I'm pretty new to the mini painting hobby, and I have ZERO interest in Warhammer. In fact, I will skip videos if they seem warhammer-centric, unless it's one of my favorite content creators (like Lyla is). There are literally decades worth of space marine videos on RUclips. And when a new GW thing comes out EVERYBODY does a video with or about it. Ugh.
Hey Lyla, I appreciate being included in this, thanks! Personally I think the problem is more with how RUclips works, but Games Workshop certainly does not help with all the problems and toxicity creators have to deal with. Para Bellum Wargames come to mind when I think of miniature companies that are better to work with, both as a member of the community, and someone who makes content.
I don't think the situation is quite as dire as you portray it. Yes, the big channels all use exclusively GW models - mostly because those bring in the views. But I also feel like Ninjon, Miniac, Vince, and Marco Frisoni all still give tutorial/guide content all the time. And I think it's been a while since Angel Giraldez and Jose Davinci have painted anything Warhammer related - if indeed ever. I think a lot of creators just opt to use the GW models as a base, because it is the biggest game in town, so a lot of people will gravitate towards those models. It's a good way to get the most amount of views. But while you will then luck out on Bust and 75mm detail work, teaching pretty much everything and anything else is still possible with GW models. Giants and Ogres are big enough that you can create complex skintones, and practice tattoo work that would just as well translate to 75mm and busts. There's enough metal on knights and titans and primarchs to get 75mm NMM guides in. Vehicles for weathering and chipping and burns and battle damage that can be utilized in display pieces too - not to the same level as Nightshift does with his tanks and historical dioramas, but still the basics. I don't play either, but I think the tutorial and guide content has suffered from the GamesWorkshopification of model selections quite as bad as this video makes it seem.
Techniques still seem popular to me, you need them no matter what you paint. I'm not understanding I guess. I only paint WH and that's what I'm interested in. I'd love other brands to get on GW's level in terms of quality. I think that's the best solution to all this. WOTC has the money, they should invest in it.
3:50 I too don't play war games at all. I play board games. I got started in mini painting when Power Rangers Heroes of the Grid came out. It was my childhood in a box. Then CMON came out with Marvel United and I've been hooked on that as well. I just paint the games that I enjoy or want to play the most. Warhammer is not my cup of tea, but I understand why people post videos of it all the time on youtube. To be honest Lyla, I love your videos that talk about techniques. I've learned a ton from what you show off and explain in your videos. I don't care what you paint, just keep up with all of your awesome videos!
Another avid D&D player here! I'd love to see someone painting classic D&D monsters. Hooked Horrors, Gibbering Mouthers... all the cool weird stuff from the Monster Manual. I'm tired of seeing space marines for sure!
I’m not a war gamer at all, just a model maker. Looking for figure painting and it’s warhammer warhammer warhammer. But it did bring me here and your tips and tricks have been awesome so thank you ☺️
Lyla! I can't believe I only just caught wind of this! I guess I got messed up by two issues: 1) I had no idea there was a mentions tab in YT Studio 😅 2) I was already following your advice and not clicking vids with WARHAMMMMSSSSS titles... 😂 Such a super generous thing of you to do, pointing people in the direction of smaller creators. Thank you! And yeah, I hope there will always be a niche for folk like me who just want to paint little things and talk about colours. Build it and they will [maybe depending on whether the algorithm smiles upon you] come!
Hey thanks for the shoutout. Great video, the struggle is so real with content in videos. I mean don’t get me wrong, I like GW stuff, but I’ve been putting off a Star Wars Legion video for over a year because guess what, it’s not GW. Keep up the great work :)
As a returning hobbyist several years ago it's the tutorials that caught my eye, warhammer or not they are what I searched for. Often after I saw them mentioned in another video then googled them, it taught me a lot practicing along side them. The new short form ones often make it more stressful to follow so tend to ignore them more.
The miniature niche was never just GW stuff. As far back as I can remember, and further, there have been other minis to paint, other games to play, and hell, once upon a time, Games Workshop was just one small fish in a pond full of them. But they found some success, and then proceeded to use that, and some really underhanded and nasty practices, to exert total dominance over the space -- in the process shrinking the market to only the people who were into Warhammer. and pushing everyone else to the margins. Those margins grew steadily smaller through my lifetime, and are today miniscule. Some companies managed to hold onto a tiny part of the now-shrunken niche, to the point that even seeing miniatures in stores that are not Games Workshop is almost strange. If I am to name one thing that has changed something, it's the resurgence of D&D. That is the one other set of minis I will see with any regularity outside of the internet.
Couldn't agree more! I don't play Warhammer and prefer not to give GW my money, so this video was/is exceedingly relevant to me. I paint models from Massive Darkness and Enigma, Privateer Press & Wizkids on occasion, and a plethora of 3-D printed models (I have a guy in Tyler, TX I frequently order from via eBay), because it's for me learning more about art and how to create what I see in my mind in general more than anything else. Some of my favorite RUclipsrs include Don Suratos, Sorastro, and Banda Inku, who don't normally paint Warhammer stuff and produce quality content in general. I enjoy your videos because I like hearing you expound in general whether it's on art or matters like this. But yes, Warhammer is something I really couldn't care less about more often than not.
My favorite thing about your channel is how often you remind us to return to the roots of WHY we love this as a hobby in the first place. Definitely helps relax/recenter me when I get weighed down.
Thanks for this video. I’m not a D&D guy or a Warhammer guy. I don’t know what the hell they’re talking about. I subscribed to your channel, Vince V, Ninjon, and others because you’re all brilliant at painting figures and willing to share your thoughts and knowledge. If you’re new at this like me the learning curve is a bitch. I’ve also expanded my interest, thanks to you. Some of the figures you’ve done and the companies products you shown us I would never have known about without you. I know how hard you work to bring us content and I’m grateful. And I love your cats.
Lyla!!! Awesome ummm.... rant (?) I paint historical miniatures, almost exclusively Napoleonics. Occasionally big prestige figures but primarily 28mm ( maybe 500) and 15mm (about 5500 of them) The gain I get from tutorials like yours are manifold: technique, new products, ancillaries like basing and terrain. I thought about doing a few tutorials but non-warhammers go nowhere (poor Christie B at WSS, awesome artist, great presenter but no algorithm boost 🤦♂🤦♂ ) Great job! Like you I only paint, I DO NOT do the games. Keep up the great work!
As someone who likes making all different kinds of hobby videos, it's the same thing where the algorithm doesnt know what to do with your stuff if it isn't in the first niche it found to feed your content to. Here it's called the warhammer effect, but it happens in all niches, unfortunately. It doesnt have a solidified group of channels to feed "painting" videos to, but it does have one to feed warhammer to. it doesnt have one for dioramas, but it does have one for D&D. You have to play to existing "algorithm sets" which, in reality, really freaking sucks.
Pleased to hear someone saying this - I'm not a gamer I'm here to watch people paint stuff and hopefully learn a few things in the process. Seeing GW or Warhammer in a video title is a turn-off for me but I've come to realise that many of my favourite content creators feel bound to include it because well..more views. Watching someone paint yet another space marine is like ...yeah, like watching paint dry. I enjoy watching the same models I'm taking off my 3D printer being painted. Stuff by Great Grimoire, White Werewolf Tavern, Crippled God Foundry etc - models a little left of centre, perhaps somewhat niché and not a space marine in sight.
I feel that same frustration. I've never really been a warhammer guy and most of what I see just isn't the kind of subject matter I want to sculpt or paint anyway. I will also say that it's worth giving some of the smaller channels a follow. I've found a bunch just by looking for videos on sculpting. Arga Miniatures is definitely worth a follow, he sculpts and paints some pretty cool figures from scratch.
I generally do not care about the miniature because techniques can be applied to any mini, regardless if made by GW or self-printed. Honestly I care more about the creator. If they are passionate, fun and/or relaxing to watch I subscribe. There are some likeable creators who not rely on GW miniatures (only)
With all the grey plastic out there from games like Oathsworn and Tainted Grail, I'm surprised videos other then Warhammer can't gain traction. I for one have never watched a Warhammer painting video, and I must have watched at least a hundred as I have started painting.
The ''warhammer effect'' is almost as bad as ''D&D 5e effect'' like if you make content for TTRPGs good fucking luck getting anywhere unless that's what you're making content for. I actually made this comment before seeing the sponsor, good grief that was on point.
It drives me nuts I type in to a how to paint a certin brand of model with say reaper or p3c paint and all I get is Ges workshop and Citadle paint when I don't even use those brands
I played D&D back in the day (early 80's), and learned to paint minis for that. However, I got out of gaming before GW showed up, so I have no idea what a 200 point army is, or why I want to speed paint them all using the slapchop method. I still paint figures and minis, but not for gaming, and I have zero interest in space marines. I see your point, but from my POV of not being a gamer nor a YTer, GW is keeping the mini painting hobby alive by keeping people interested in it. That said, I watch you and others to learn new techniques, get insights into new products (you convinced me to get a wet palette, RedGrass FTW), to keep in touch with the hobby, and if the reference to the 80's didn't give it away, to connect with young people with youthful excitement and enthusiasm. You can't stay young at heart if you only listen to old people.
Agreed! I dont play or paint warhammer, but I do watch youtube videos and paint miniatures. I click based on the content being provided, not the model being presented. Mostly because the games that I do play aren't featured on YT much
I mean, this really sounds more like a RUclips problem than a GW one. But it is always nice to see different miniatures being showcased and less GWcentric techniques.
If I am not wrong the Warhammer effect is very close to the concept of an echo chamber. It's a big issue with RUclips recommendation, and in general any recommendation engine.
What do you think!? Are you happy with the youtube content you are seeing?
I want you to have fun, and I want you to succeed. So I will support whatever you make. If that means Warhammer, then thats okay with me.
squidmar is the best. why are you ragging on him?
I feel the best content is what the maker wants to make. It may seem like a basic and silly thought, but it really does make a difference when a creator enjoys what they make. I only got into the hobby last year, but have already found some favorite creators who branch out from warhammer to paint what they like. Keep up the goodwork, and try not to let the algorithm get you down. Thanks for all the awesome videos!
Videos about painting Warhammer minis got me into the hobby (Thanks Goobertown Hobbies!!!) but videos like yours helps me improve and enjoy it evermore. I love the diversity, and having a broader range of miniatures being showcased would be really nice. By the way, I'd love to see you paint an Owlbear :D
The market has spoken, WH is popular and it will get more views. That’s the reality, there’s not a question of right or wrong here, just do what you what you think is best.
I like WH and I do watch more WH content. If you’re a painter it doesn’t do any harm to pain WH models.
Hey thanks for the shout out! Humbled to be a part of such a talented and enthusiastic bunch of creators.
This was a great look at Warhammer. I come mostly from D&D and fantasy minis, so it's been interesting to come fresh to Warhammer to learn about all the rule systems, lore and minis.
One thing that I love about your content is how you push artistic creativity from color theme to building contrast. Definitely stepped up my paint game thanks to you!
Unfortunately it seems this is happening across the board on RUclips now. It *seems* like the algorithm only cares about extremely popular content now. If it's very popular, it gets thrown everywhere. If it's slightly less popular? It gets buried.
I am seeing this with gaming content too. It's very sad.
It's so refreshing to see NOT just Warhammer stuff all the time but other figures and how different painters approach the subject, I love Bestarium and Cobra Mode 3D prints and it's a shame those gorgeous figures are upstaged by another painting tutorial about space marines. I'd really love to see more videos about painting larger scale display quality figures, that would be wonderful!
*Onwards and upwards!*
I feel like Marco Frisoni really opened my eyes to this a few years ago when he started to paint with oils. For so long, miniature painting has had this mentality that they were re-inventing the painting wheel and Marco made me realise that art has literally been around for centuries so why not use all the techniques and information already available and utilise it in our hobby. Games Workshop has had the monopoly of thought and process in the miniature world for so long, they made people think they invented the whole subject. I think the way Games Workshop have marketed limited techniques on their customer base to sell their average paints originally opened the hobby to be more accessible but now there is more competition, their failings become more apparent with comparision. On the flip side, not everyone is into painting and/or has the time to dedicate to the craft as it can take a while to become proficient depending on what you are aiming for.
Games Workshop will always try to keep their niche market as a closed circle. From the inside, it looks like you have everything you need, but from the outside, there is a whole world of art and creativity out there to be explored
I love Marco -- I've been using oils for figure painting for a while, but in a more painterly way. I tried his "slap it on and wipe it off" technique, and was pleasantly surprised by the results.
If you want more oil painting techniques on figures, check out Milan Dufek -- he uses the basic technique I learned and use today: base coat with acrylics, details and finish with oils. He goes back and forth between mediums a lot, and mixes his own colors from a limited palette, and I find I've learned a lot from him as well. His subject matter is historical, not fantasy, so you'll also be helping retrain the algorithm away from GW.
@@khanoclast Hey Jon, thank you so much for the recommendation! I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and insight. I love working with a limited palette too! Just subed to Milans page thankyou. I feel its only fair I trade you a recommendation for one of mine too haha.
One of my favourite artists who i have learnt the most about colour mixing from is Andrew Tischler. He is more traditional for sure and has really taken my knowledge to another level. Hope you enjoy and i love your passion so keep painting my friend :)
@@patrickhamilton-ferren1041 And a thank you for the reference as well! I just watched the quick clip on skin tones -- now I've got more stuff to try!
Oh, and thanks to Lyla for providing a place for us to connect!
Can you recommend me you favorite types / brands of paints please?
The quality of this video's take cannot be overstated.
Thank you! I felt so rushed :'(
You realize the 'take' is basically 'I want to have all sunshine and rainbows super happy fun time at my job but instead I have to do things people pay me for'?
The diversity I've encountered by branching out and watching other creators has taught me so much in the past year: new techniques, new styles of painting, even new ways of thinking about why we're doing this at all!
I'm grateful that folks like you take time to share your thoughts about how GW affects the hobby, for good and ill.
Thank you for saying this! I'm about to start posting my own mini painting and terrain video but don't touch anything GW. I know it is a bad business idea on my part to not include GW content but I want to be part of bringing other game systems to light. Like you I am inspired by influences outside of just traditional mini painting. I bring graphic design and art influences as well as from doing model trains growing up.
I hope that we can try to change the perception that you need to use warhammer and other GW products/systems to succede on youtube.
subscribed!
Thanks for the mention! Great topic. This is so true and not just for RUclips, but most platforms. Warhammer always brings in more visibility. As much as I love Warhammer, I don't want to only see that or tailor my content around it.
Hey Lyla, one of the things I enjoy about your channel is that you want to use art history and techniques of some of the great artists. If you were to show me the difference between Baroque, Impressionism, and surrealism, you'd probably try by showing me a portrait, or a landscape, in each style. A Space Marine happens to be the miniature equivalent of a bowl of fruit. We all know what an apple looks like. Most art classes have taught us how to draw one through shading a sphere, but how would Dali and Van Gogh do it? There's your opportunity!
I don't play any mini war games. I have painted MANY of the same models for board games and that repetition allowed me to experiment, compare like to like, and grow. You gotta keep yourself sane when painting 20 goblins, right? That's the perfect time to say "I'm going to use of the ideas Lyla shared."
You're crushing it here on RUclips doing it your way. Keep it up! But, maybe these suggestions will help you feel less opposed to doing some GW content.
Bowl of fruit- great analogy.
It makes me feel so much better to hear you say you don't play mini wargames, either. I really want to get deeper into painting minis, but I just don't have the time or a sustained interest for playing the games. I just like art and want to paint! Great to see that someone who's become so accomplished can come from the same perspective, even if you get stuck pushing GW content too much!
I agree with you and totally feel the same way - making a video and NOT making it related to Warhammer is a bad business decision at this point. It's not all bad though, I think that Warhammer still opens the doors for many people that will be interested in painting other brands as well!
The Bearded Master is with us!!! 😍
Great video Lyla! Needing to frame everything around GW can be super frustrating, it really is a shame that its the best way for consistent clicks
This was such a fantastic video Lyla! You're absolutely right that warhammer just dominates the niche in terms of views, but there are lots of amazing creators out there and I'm so happy I reguarly dig through search to find them haha.
Also thanks so much for the shoutout!!
Just want to say your channel is awesome. And thank you to Lyla for promoting it. My wife has been looking into making and painting scenery instead of minis and without this video we may have never found your page.
This hits me right in the feels. Trying to get YT to understand I want painting not WH seems impossible. But I get content creators are trapped, many have commented as much. I love your channel and your art history early content was right up my street and had me hooked. I’m trying to paint board game minis mostly and looking for other interesting miniatures to expand my options. This video is great thanks for recommending some small creators. Also this confirms my thinking about jumping on your patreon.
theyre not really trapped, they have decided they want to do it. its like saying i want to make a company that makes chocolate bars out of dirt and dead leaves, but no one wants to eat them so im 'trapped' into making chocolate bars out of chocolate because thats what people want to eat. youre not trapped, you have decided you want to make a product that X amount of people will willingly consume, thats a free choice you are making, no ones telling you what you have to make, you are freely deciding to limit your creativity within certain boundaries.
@@necaacen perhaps more accurate then to say capitalism is the trap? Until you don't have bills to pay there are always external forces at play.
@@marmaladegrrl sure, i think capitalism, certainly the sort of neoliberal consumerism model of it that has taken over the world is destroying genuine meaning and motivation in society.
its a shame people chose to play into that system by making clickbait 'gw is ruining the hobby' videos in order to cash in on name dropping gw instead of actually using their platform to examine the real reason our entire world is going down the toilet right now by showing an honest and insightful window into how its effecting their niche.
The difference is that this demand for Warhammer content has only seriously been affecting views over the past year. Before that: Warhammer was an easy slam dunk, not a requirement.
@@LylaMev so how does that = games workshop is now ruining the hobby?
youre just talking about you making money from youtube and what you feel constrained to make videos about in order to meet your own self determined profit goals.
you are basically trying to make the case that warhammer is ruining the hobby by making hobby products that people want to buy. this is what it boils down to once you start including warhammers name in this and attributing blame for any of this to warhammer, and its a completely illogical take that is actually backwards because them making hobby products that people want to buy is actually creating the hobby, not ruining it.
but youre only really trying to push that idea to 'make content' to fuel your own channel right? cause this isnt really anything to do with games workshop or the hobby space, its just about you and your relationship with the money you make from youtube when you really examine it.
I agree so hard with this. I want cool minis to paint that are not like 35€ for a mini barely bigger than a normal unit, but I just don't want to 3d print it because I don't enjoy resin 3d printing. I wish youtube would shove me new models from other brands like it does with games workshop
I second this, word for word.
then the problem isnt games workshop for existing, the problem is youtube creators who are using games workshop to cash in on youtube clicks rather than promoting miniatures they love right? youtube creators like... this one right here, who is making this very video to cash in on youtube clicks by name dropping games workshop rather than simply making positive content about an alternative.
With my painting, (I used to work for GW a VERY long time ago) so I did their painting style for work, my own was somewhat sparser, then I did minimalist style paining, and have now drifted into a more impressionistic style over the last few years.
I love the lore and world of Warhammer, but I much prefer the painting side of the hobby and have been looking for more display pieces to paint. I love watching your videos on techniques and how to slowly improve my painting, especially anything not involving a GW model :D
This is actually really coincidental timing... I was just searching for videos about fantasy miniature painting last night because I was tired of looking at warhammer models all the time haha.
I think part of the problem is that most people who play D&D, such as myself, aren't into painting minis. I started buying prepainted minis from Wizkids, and then I noticed they look like they were painted by a three year old with arthritis. So I watch people who paint Warhammer to learn to paint my 3D printed models, because most of the Wizkids sculpts are also terrible, and I have even bought some Warhammer models to use in D&D. I think D&D must be as if not more popular than Warhammer, so that can't be the problem. I think the majority of people playing D&D aren't into painting minis, at least not compared to Warhammer, which has painting armies built into it.
The crossover between D&D model painters and players was (is?) small. That was my 13 year old back in the 90's. I actually PAID someone to paint the models in our party so we could set them up for different things relevant to the RPG. I eventually learned to do a bit of painting but it was from the GW magazine. There was a TSR miniature combat game (Battlesystem) but it predictably fizzled. Heck, this was even before M:TG existed.
In a certain way I think we got this wrong - we should learn more from other media more: model train hobbyists, actual painters (as in canvas, wood, etc.) for more advanced techniques.
I agree with you that Warhammer is a mixed blessing. I started out with Ral Partha miniatures and loved painting them. But my hobby shop soon got into Warhammer and soon stopped carrying other lines. Anytime I want to find miniatures to paint or build I have less choices due to Warhammer being the standard. Personally I like the weird and strange ideas other companies used to have as they opened the hobby in new directions. But with the holy Warhammer holding court over all it's impossible to go far outside of this universe. I feel there is a lot more to the miniature wargaming and painting hobby but, until Games Workshop stops being the focus, there won't be much growth.
agreed. It actually stunts the growth of the hobby for everything to be so focused on one company, with so many sycophants.
why do you have less choice because warhammer exists? why is it impossible to go outside of their universe?
its not really, you are just deciding that and doing it to yourself. its like saying when i watch a movie i can only watch marvel superhero movies.... because i have made a decision im only allowed to watch movies that X million other people are watching. and thats marvels fault for existing and making movies a lot of people want to see, how dare they?
@@necaacen 100% agree. I ran out of Ral Partha miniatures to paint because of lack of availability in the early 90's. I literally had to travel out of my country of birth to find something I wanted to paint. This is the golden age of miniature painting as far as I am concerned.
It's a bit weird that we seem to be of the same vintage with such a different outlook. I started with Tamiya models, then Ral Partha. Mostly self taught and a bit of knowledge from railway modelling and some magazines. Having the advice from HM Masterclass was amazing - "wait, you don't use the paint straight from the pot?! why would I add water to it???".
Painted some Ral Partha miniatures with Testors enamels. Painted Battletech Mechs without priming them and then wondered with the paint kept flaking off. Wondered why the brushstrokes were so
GW may be the largest one, and the current gateway. But it doesn't stop anyone else from painting more grandiose miniatures and more diverse stuff. Having a bulwark such as GW anchors the hobby - and allows for experimentation around it and myriad of options around it. I recently painted some Among Us characters for my son (he hated painting). I painted a chimera from Reaper with my daughter (who loved it, and now jokes about "Thousand thin coats" because the Scale75 paints instant colours were so thin). And have a small Chtulhu bust going on after painting all the Lovecraftian monsters in a tabletop game.
Never have we had so many options. There are literally dozens of miniature ranges being released monthly on kickstarter if you really feel that GW is clamping on your aspirations. There are many more options - not all of them well supported. But that goes with what one philosopher told in a conference I attended "one of the problems of modern people is that we have so much access to information we want Champagne at the price of Fanta". It should take less than 30 minutes to anyone with even middling motivation to find quality non-warhammer content on RUclips.
@@necaacen A lot of it has to do with easy availability. Back in the day you just went to the store and bought your miniatures and that was that. Gaming stores stocked a lot of variety and it was easy to see what was new and different and pick it up. But Games Workshop dominates most hobby stores and they just don't carry much else. You can go online and try to track stuff down but it's expensive with shipping. 3-D printing is actually making it much easier to branch out and sites like myminifactory are great.
But even Games Workshop casts a huge shadow just like Marvel and DC do on the superhero genre. What is popular sells and is imitated ad nauseum. This leads to a lot of stuff looking the same and the trend is to follow the money. I gravitate towards less popular stuff because I like something more unique and innovative. I don't say it's wrong that they make stuff people want to buy and if it's popular that is great. But the days when you could find miniatures that are outside the norm are gone. Even sci-fi miniatures follow the trends of doing Star Wars or Aliens or other pop culture icons rather than taking a risk on something unique. Anyhow, just my opinion.
This video is assuming that all the views going to Warhammer content would be evenly distributed amongst the more niche topics but I feel like a lot of it simply wouldn't exist. Unique, unusual art is universally difficult to market - it's difficult for people to search for things they haven't seen before. Keep doing what you're doing Lyla, every so often make a video and don't worry about views/revenue. Actors and directors will make some films for money and use that to fund their passion projects, which are usually much more interesting.
🤗Hi. The closest I come to 'miniature painting' are 1/35 scale military figures to go with my model tanks & other WW-II vehicles. Still, I've watched several 'technique' videos and found some of the info helpful. Some things like underpainting are as easily applied to my hobby as yours - personally, I'm voting for more technique videos, especially ones aimed at beginners in the miniature painting field. Hang in there and do your thing, it's art and the world can always use more art - even miniature art....
Wow, now that you point this out, it's very noticeable. Looking back at my searches, there are a lot of "How to paint specific model X" and not so much "How do I glaze?" or "How do I edge highlight red?". You are 100% right that modern search algorithms key into previous searches and return more relevant search results based on those previous searches. If I look for a lot of "How to paint Space Marine", then when I type in "How to glaze with acrylic paint", it'll return videos about glazing Space Marines. Unfortunately, I don't think it's going to change because new painters are typing in "How to paint a blue Space Marine with contrast paint" and not "how to use glazes to paint a model", which might be what they wanted in the first place. More experienced painters/hobbyists might be trying to branch out and try new things, but will be hampered by their previous searches and the searches made by others.
Anyways... thanks for making the non-GW content! I like it, and find it interesting. I hope others do to, and use your channel as a stepping off point to other non-GW hobby content. There is so much more out there then what GW marketing would like you to think...
Lyla, you're doing such a good thing. Shout outs to indie projects and creators with yet small audience is genuinely kind and so nice of you. It's so sick and sad that youtube is dominated by merciless and unfair algorithms, and not all creators happen to born equal according to them. I wish you all of luck at fighting with them and breaking them down! The True Art should win.
I am always looking for tutorials and techniques. And I would really like to see more from you about producing vibrant colors on minis
Thank you for this video, and for shouting out other content creators! The very limited amount of painting I do is on board game minis (though admittedly, one of those games is Warhammer Underworlds Nightvault!).
And where can I find chicken-flavoured opiates for "my cat"?
Love the Carravagio shoutout. That dude has some WILD paintings.
I know! I didn't include his more "interesting" pieces...
@@LylaMev It's better that way. It gives us a viewers a nice little rabbit hole to get into.
I feel like you nailed it when you talked about the market. By using GW or Warhammer, creators can get people who may not care about the hobby (building/painting), but care about the lore, books, video games, upcoming Amazon series, and table top game. This could be pumping up the viewership numbers to include people searching for things outside the niche miniature painting community. I think it would be interesting to see a media agency do market research into finding out how many people specifically look for miniature painting (GW specific, or not), versus, people who look for GW things, but are not actually looking for the miniature painting part of their products.
I hate that looking for mini painting just gets me mostly Warhammer. Their sculpts aren't even that amazing overall.
Doing Warhammer videos used to be an easy slam dunk. Over the past year it has been a requirement. I'm hoping the market shifts back!
@@LylaMev do you think if someone made a video about painting Critical Role inspired minis, with Critical Role in the title and thumbnail, that it would have the same affect as GW/WH, but bringing in the Critter crowd instead?
@@weekendminis If you did a diorama of an iconic scene, then maybe. but probably not! the Critter niche us not commonly associated with miniature painting, so the two niches don't cross paths as frequently as GW and miniature painting.
@@LylaMev that’s really interesting to know! I figured there could have been a potential for a big miniature/D&D/Critical Role crossover market
Thanks for the playlist loop technique! I have 3 different computers at work with nothing better to do then help some great content makers. Studson is my new fix for fun while Model Mayhem has been a mainstay since I started with Gunpla then came to miniatures. You are my favorite breath of fresh air of course!
That is very kind!
This was well said!! I am an avid 3D printer/painter of D&D miniatures and it's getting harder and harder to find content for that genre specifically. Everything I search for was created some time ago. And yup...i play them often...I have no interest in warhammer but those artists that paint them do have great techniques that I apply to the models I choose to paint. Again, thanks for saying what needed to be said! I love your channel and your tips!
I’ve been building 1/48 aircraft models since I was 7 or 8. I am now pushing 50. I don’t do the war hammer thing, but channels like yours really helps my overall painting skills.
I do love Warhammer, but I also watch all kinds of painting/modeling/terrain content. I watch train people like Luke Towan and Kathy Millat, D&D creators like RP Archive and Wyloch, and many more. There's a lot of great content out there that's not Warhammer related, but the techniques can be applied to anything... :)
I’m hoping to start the switch from painting models for games (which I don’t play very often) to display pieces and dioramas, so content on 3d printed parts for displays, for instance, would suit me more than another video on new Warhammer stuff. That said, Warhammer will always be my first geek love so I’ll never completely wean myself off it.
I love how popular wargaming content creators feel like they need to "educate" other hobbyists watching RUclips about non GW games like they are going to change the world.
I wish people would watch more videos about not the warhammers sometimes. But I also like painting little robot lunch box boys. Mostly in blue because that makes the warhammers obsessed people upset, but that makes me happy sometimes hahaha
Great video Lyla! Thanks so much for bringing this up.
Every bit of content I consider making always starts with an argument inside my head over whether interesting to me also equals interesting to RUclips.
Hi Lyla,
I recently found your channel and after a couple of tutorials I subbed.
The reason, I used to play 40k and Warhammer 20 yrs ago and I have quite a collection of GW models. Old school metal ones.
Coming back to the hobby after the family have grown up I decided to get into 3D printing for the purpose of painting what I want and not just jumping back on the GW wagon.
Self printed minis is such a diverse area that I'm now printing and painting minis that I would never have thought of.
Your channel is a ray of independent light in a GW dominated you tube, long may you continue and your tips for an old painter like me are going to be fun to try and master and for that, I thank you
👍
I miss the tutorial for sure.. and honestly, I could care less about warhammer... I only paint them because some of the models look cool, that's it for me. I paint what I want to paint. I didn't get into the hobby because I played the game so honestly I wish you could paint more of the different miniatures out there. It would be epic. Hopefully things change... it's hard to get sheeple to change their habits in our cookie cutter world. Thanks for sharing! Love your content!
Great video and message! I am a relatively new RUclips-Creator and can already feel the dominance of Warhammer and GamesWorkshop when it comes to visibility of content. And thanks for showing my channel logo at 6:07 ☺
Hi. Great video and recommendations! I don't play Warhammer tabletop game, so basically RUclips doesn't show it to me in my RUclips feed. When I search for miniature painting, it doesn't appear. Instead what I like shows up, like D&D or miniature painting tips content.
imho, the one who is ruinning the content creation in youtube is youtube itself and its algorithm, how it demands click baiting titles, specific thumbnails, same themed videos, etc... I hope someday YT stops treating content creators so badly; you people don't deserve this.
I am new to tabletop miniatures and wargaming. I watch a lot of videos on various topics related to it. I especially love tutorials, and I've been watching and commenting on a lot of them. So far, I play OPR fantasy skirmish and mini gangs, and I got to this video starting out looking for info on OPR fantasy regiments. Warhammer's too expensive and intricate for my tastes, though I do like their lore and watch a fair number of lore videos too.
Wonderful job on Death. Those models of the 4 Horsemen look quite nice. I am always happy to view your (and other creators' content) regardless of GW. I mostly paint and look for ideas for deluxifying board games and RPG models.
I would love to witness a seminar with you, Discourse, Terri Litorco, Dana Howl, Sword’n’Steele, Vince Vinturella, squidmar, Uncle Atom, Miniac, Marco Frissoni.
I totally agree that Warhammer/games workshop needs to be separate from the miniatures painting hobby. I haven't played a game by GW since like 2006-2007? But with the algorithm, if I am looking for a painting technique for miniatures i generally have to type "painting fur Warhammer" so I don't get inundated with folks painting fur for like oil paintings or portraits. Thank you for bringing this topic up
I'm not into wargaming but I do enjoy miniature painting. What I really dislike about GW is that they had such amazing paints(charadon granite, I miss you so much) and nowadays have a great range of paints as well bottled in the worst possible containers. I've long moved all my GW paints to drop bottles but it is for sure a waste of plastic; regarding this issue, I´ve used the empty GW bottles in combination with tack as handlers but that does not solve the problem.
As everithing out there it is a matter of choice, I think digital modelling and 3D printing will have a great rise in the coming years and with that we'll have more variety and more sources to get miniatures (both in wargaming scales and artistic scales). Right now major brands like Kimera, Aradia, FeR and the likes are getting more and more great figures made this way. Personally, I prefer a nice sculpt like those of Pedro Fernández or Karol Rudyk but I know this style will prevail eventually.
Maybe in some years we'll be able to buy a Forgewolrd Thunderhawk STL file (pre-supported of course) with only one print allowed for only $499🤣
As someone who is trying to post more of their miniature painting online, I've found that other folks post almost solely Warhammer. But, I play mostly D&D/Pathfinder/Call of Cuthlu and I don't want to just post Skaven...even if I love my little ratfolk dearly.
What you mention in this vid is why I sub. I'm a scale modeler (military stuff), and dabble in dnd and have picked up more than a few lessons by watching your content. Keep it up, big fan of your work
Coming from the indie RPG space, what you're describing is basically the exact situation between tabletop RPGs and Dungeons & Dragons. Even though Kids on Brooms (for example) might get a nod from Polygon, nobody except niche gamers will play it. GW dominates the wargaming and miniatures space in the same way: D&D is simply synonymous with tabletop roleplaying games and Warhammer is synonymous with painting little space mans.
So, I hear what you're saying completely. It's true that Warhammer is becoming its own entity entirely, in the same way that D&D essentially is (I mean there won't be a Wanderhome movie, right?). But remember that indie...*everything* is always going to lurk beneath the surface, so will indie miniatures, indie wargames, indie paint producers, and all the affiliated content creators.
We have to find what we love, settle into our niche, and tell as many people as possible that, yes, there games that are not Warhammer just like there are cafes that are not Starbucks or metal bands that aren't Metallica...which is exactly what you've done! High five!
0:28 I'll pull you up here. GW makes terrible games, but great models. Horribly overpriced models, but great ones. The rules part of their games is rubbish. I've been wargaming for 50 years now (yeah, I'm old and grey), and without a doubt the rules for 40k are the biggest pile of steaming mess I've ever seen. I've played in a variety of settings, from 6mm modern, to 15 mm ancient, 1/72 WW2, to 25mm sci-fi, and all the rules were so, so much better written, and didn't need the near constant modifications and rebalancing. I've written rules for a variety of games companies too, and had them tested hard, but GW just seems to throw stuff at the wind and see if it sticks.
One thing I loved about virtually every other genre is that models could be sourced from a variety of suppliers. Don't like a particular model? Buy the kit from a different company! The rules were detached from the companies making the models. Even GW was like this once, even encouraging you to scratchbuild things. The last vestige of that I saw was the Ork 4th Edition codex. My boys and their friends complain that models are so much more monopose now, and the codex reflects what's in the box these days, limiting wargear options.
If GW keeps this up, more and more people will just invest in a 3D printer. I did a few months ago, and while it's been a learning curve all of its own, being able to make parts for models for just a few cents is brilliant. My terrain looks better too now (the mushroom forest came out awesome!), and I have models I could only dream about having before.
Totally understand why YT'ers make GW centered content. It brings in the views. I'd love to see more comparison videos. "Hey look at this model! It's half the price of this similar GW model, and looks better. Watch me paint it!" Still, it's hard to bite the litigious hand that indirectly feeds you.
Decent mid-tier models at premium prices. They're not really the best.
As an aspiring Content Creator, I will do my best not to fall into the trap of WARHAMMER ALWAYS! I like multiple hobbies, and don't want to get sucked into one particular game and system.
Thank you!! I have often thought the same thing. I search out more videos that address board game miniatures, because that is my interest. There are so few. I'm not a DnD or Warhammer player, but I love my BG minis and have been wanting to get the courage to paint them. I love classical painting techniques and wonder if you ever use chiaroscuro from an up-light source? All of the light sources from the videos I've watched seem to be from above or at a 45-degree angle at most. What would you think about a stark uplight on your Horsemen minis? Am I off-base? Thank you for your content!
As someone who enjoyed this hobby since the 90s and does not play Warhammer or any mini games anymore, the fact that most of your vids are NOT about warhammer is a huge bonus for me. I would love to learn more about other more niche studios and their products and while I enjoy the occasional warhammer mini I find Games Workshop's decisions and pricing of their product really offputting(and we already said they were too expensive in the early 90s).
I'm old enough to remember a time when GW had actual competitors and it irks me when people refer to miniature painting and/or wargaming as "the Warhammer hobby". My entry to was Warzone and I was only vaguely aware of WFRP and Wh40k until Dawn of War came out. I'm glad that the landscape is changing again, there are more games than ever and even classics like Battletech, Warzone and Chronopia have returned from the undeath!
I really appreciate this video and it definitely resonates with me. I have been painting miniatures for years, and the only Warhammer I've ever painted was for commission.
I love learning new techniques, understanding art history, lighting, and painting theory, but I watch all the big great WH creators because of the techniques and information found in those Warhammer-centric videos (i.e. Vince Venturella).
But, people like yourself definitely are a breath of fresh air in this hobby, and I appreciate you. Thanks for all you do!
I remember when playing D&D mid 80's at school yes I had the red box which brings back so many memories. Once I left school I used to just paint for my own enjoyment then 40k came along and yes I did start buying some of those figures but not the game, then X amount of years later I am now looking at getting back into painting my own miniatures. I just searched miniature painting tonight and your video was at the top however that may be because I am already following your channel which by the way is fantastic. It is true though every other video was Warhammer of some description which is a shame as there is so much variety of types of painting which I have been overadored by the quality across so many channels but can be hard to find sometimes. Thank you for your inspiration.
I feel like the actual problem is RUclipss algorithms. Yes, GW content clearly drives bigger numbers but RUclips filtering people almost exclusively towards only those popular creators is the issue. I can't imagine that Warhammer content has pulled fans of general mini-painting away from non-GW videos but RUclips sure would do that nor can I imagine a world where the popularity of Warhammer has done anything but get SO many people into the mini painting world in the first place. This is all basically re-stating a lot of stuff you said in the video, I know that
Good video!
I'm tired of seeing videos about getting models to a "table top quality". I want to paint my miniatures as good as possible. I'd like to learn more about color mixing, theory or different types of pallets. I recently discovered the Zorn pallette and it was so fun to paint with a limited style.
I don’t care about Warhammer, I paint for me, I use the colors I want, the contrast I want, literally everything, Warhammer is for a select group, not bad by any means just not everyone.
This is what I like about your channel and why I'm subscribed. You produced painting tutorial videos that I can follow, you feature a range of models that showcase different creators, and you have intelligent discussion about issues facing the community (and proposed action). The tone is supportive, positive, and educative, and I'm sorry you need to 'play the game' for the algorithms (although I completely understand). Finding tutorials for non-GW models is challenging (I mean good production quality with an articulate host who knows how to instruct), so please keep creating. As far as I'm concerned, you're not only filling a niche - you are completely owning it.
I don't think it's all doom and gloom (not that that's what this video is all about)
Yes, it's definitely an oroboros. 40K is THE most popular and recognizable brand, and a one-word-phrase to search for that will find you miniature content - so more people will be searching for Warhammer content, which in turn makes sense for content creators to generate content about warhammer to rope in that crowd, thus keeping warhammer the most popul... et cetera.
Saying that, personally, I've found _many_ great youtube channels that deal with kitbashing/scratch-building from getting interested in Warhammer. And larger miniature-painting/wargaming creators end up creating their own games, learning/teaching 3D printing, dabbling in absurd techniques... I think a lot of creators managed to glow up thanks to Warhammer, but aren't necessarily limited to JUST warhammer, even if it's a constant in their content output.
There's also something to be said for the applicability of a lot of the 40K videos - since every space marine model is basically the same (don't @ me, GW), seeing how different creators tackle the same model is really good for contrasting/comparing/isolating their technique in a way that can be a little harder if people were painting 20 different techniques on 20 different miniatures. If... if that makes sense.
It's not even warhammer is everwhere...it's warhammer 40k is everywhere. Not even their entire line, 40k MASSIVELY overshadows the entire mini world.
and especially SPACE MARINES!! What I would give for a bit of love for age of sigmar 😂
Is "Games Workshop" a plague on the hobby is a complex question.
As someone who has been into miniatures and gaming for over 40 years (yes that long) I have seen almost everything. The bad sides of GW are -
1: A lack of "games design innovation" in it's rules (they all use the same mechanic and its very broken . ..throw away the single D6 for everything it's 16.5% fidelity use a D20 as that is 5% fidelity and reduce the number of times rolled ie change the statistics) and constant rules revisions just to sell more books, not for the reasons of game improvement.
2: overpriced miniatures, tools and materials, and a lot of the tools they do sell are to be honest cheap rubbish....go compare GW branded plastic cutters with Tamiya ones!
Ok so what's good -
1: figure/model designs- the figures do mostly fit together we'll, multipart figures means you don't have 20 identical miniatures to paint (which is boring) and the designs that are made are interesting to paint.
2: inovation with premixed "glaze" paints....yes contrast it is good for getting lots of figures on the table for beginners which is a good thing.....however it's hugely overpriced for what it is is the problem and you can now get similar paints from other manufacturers far cheaper than contrast....but to give GW a thumbs up for pushing the idea .
The Wahammer Effect as it were can be annoying in other game systems as well.
While I'm glad to see more people joining the Battletech community for example, the Warhammer guys also drive me with how much they end up trying to make us change the way we play to facilitate a more 40K like experience
That must be especially frustrating since Battletech is older than 40k. I bet Chainmail players feel the same way about WHFB and AoS.
thank you for having the courage to look out for your patrons / viewers first. the content does seem very single tracked over the last few months. the variability of content is controlled. You and other like you are being coerced into providing content for the masses. Conspiracy theories for monopolies abound. So much for diversity via algorithms. I consider myself a neophyte in this hobby. I paint with trepidation. Varied content help stir my imagination. And the tutorials are, without question, the main reason I watch the RUclips videos.
Watching this whilst I’m painting some 3Dprinted proxy genestealers for KillTeam.
My Problem is with this GW Center in Hobby is that most Tutorials are only talking about Citadel colors but me coming from Scalemodelbuilding is just confused with the Nameing of Colors sometimes ^^'
You are exactly right.
Good for you for pointing this out.
The RUclips algorithms are a black magic science and if you are a new creator and you focus on topics outside of the mainstream you are doomed to virtually no views.
I watch channels like yours to learn painting tips, not because it's about a particular type of model or game.
My Channel is about developing a different type of world, model railways. It's still modelling.
My first layout was based around medieval buildings scaled down from wargaming structures. You guessed it, because it wasn't standard model railways that layout did terribly on RUclips.
And because I focus on mostly English train models I'm virtually ignored in Australia.
One other thing I've noticed is that my videos seem to be restrained to Australia, Southeast Asia and India. RUclips seems to be putting my videos in a box, only published in these areas. Local zoning? Certainly looks that way.
So the English audience I'm aiming at don't see my videos it seems.
Thanks RUclips.
So much could be better for new creators like myself.
Sadly I think that nothing will change and all the efforts to create content done by channels like mine will be lost in the virtual world and ignored by the algorithms that should be helping us.
Good luck with your channel.
Mon
I'm pretty new to the mini painting hobby, and I have ZERO interest in Warhammer. In fact, I will skip videos if they seem warhammer-centric, unless it's one of my favorite content creators (like Lyla is). There are literally decades worth of space marine videos on RUclips. And when a new GW thing comes out EVERYBODY does a video with or about it. Ugh.
Hey Lyla, I appreciate being included in this, thanks! Personally I think the problem is more with how RUclips works, but Games Workshop certainly does not help with all the problems and toxicity creators have to deal with. Para Bellum Wargames come to mind when I think of miniature companies that are better to work with, both as a member of the community, and someone who makes content.
@4:04 the winged model on the left is almost identical to an art piece by Gerald Brom.
I don't think the situation is quite as dire as you portray it. Yes, the big channels all use exclusively GW models - mostly because those bring in the views. But I also feel like Ninjon, Miniac, Vince, and Marco Frisoni all still give tutorial/guide content all the time. And I think it's been a while since Angel Giraldez and Jose Davinci have painted anything Warhammer related - if indeed ever.
I think a lot of creators just opt to use the GW models as a base, because it is the biggest game in town, so a lot of people will gravitate towards those models. It's a good way to get the most amount of views. But while you will then luck out on Bust and 75mm detail work, teaching pretty much everything and anything else is still possible with GW models. Giants and Ogres are big enough that you can create complex skintones, and practice tattoo work that would just as well translate to 75mm and busts. There's enough metal on knights and titans and primarchs to get 75mm NMM guides in. Vehicles for weathering and chipping and burns and battle damage that can be utilized in display pieces too - not to the same level as Nightshift does with his tanks and historical dioramas, but still the basics.
I don't play either, but I think the tutorial and guide content has suffered from the GamesWorkshopification of model selections quite as bad as this video makes it seem.
Techniques still seem popular to me, you need them no matter what you paint. I'm not understanding I guess. I only paint WH and that's what I'm interested in. I'd love other brands to get on GW's level in terms of quality. I think that's the best solution to all this. WOTC has the money, they should invest in it.
3:50 I too don't play war games at all. I play board games. I got started in mini painting when Power Rangers Heroes of the Grid came out. It was my childhood in a box. Then CMON came out with Marvel United and I've been hooked on that as well. I just paint the games that I enjoy or want to play the most. Warhammer is not my cup of tea, but I understand why people post videos of it all the time on youtube.
To be honest Lyla, I love your videos that talk about techniques. I've learned a ton from what you show off and explain in your videos. I don't care what you paint, just keep up with all of your awesome videos!
Another avid D&D player here! I'd love to see someone painting classic D&D monsters. Hooked Horrors, Gibbering Mouthers... all the cool weird stuff from the Monster Manual. I'm tired of seeing space marines for sure!
I’m not a war gamer at all, just a model maker. Looking for figure painting and it’s warhammer warhammer warhammer. But it did bring me here and your tips and tricks have been awesome so thank you ☺️
Lyla! I can't believe I only just caught wind of this! I guess I got messed up by two issues: 1) I had no idea there was a mentions tab in YT Studio 😅 2) I was already following your advice and not clicking vids with WARHAMMMMSSSSS titles... 😂
Such a super generous thing of you to do, pointing people in the direction of smaller creators. Thank you! And yeah, I hope there will always be a niche for folk like me who just want to paint little things and talk about colours. Build it and they will [maybe depending on whether the algorithm smiles upon you] come!
Hey thanks for the shoutout. Great video, the struggle is so real with content in videos. I mean don’t get me wrong, I like GW stuff, but I’ve been putting off a Star Wars Legion video for over a year because guess what, it’s not GW. Keep up the great work :)
As a returning hobbyist several years ago it's the tutorials that caught my eye, warhammer or not they are what I searched for. Often after I saw them mentioned in another video then googled them, it taught me a lot practicing along side them. The new short form ones often make it more stressful to follow so tend to ignore them more.
Would you mind doing a video on painting mini faces, particularly the eyes?
I noticed Josh from The Pickle Jar at 5:51, he comes to our local GW store at the weekends 🙂
The miniature niche was never just GW stuff. As far back as I can remember, and further, there have been other minis to paint, other games to play, and hell, once upon a time, Games Workshop was just one small fish in a pond full of them.
But they found some success, and then proceeded to use that, and some really underhanded and nasty practices, to exert total dominance over the space -- in the process shrinking the market to only the people who were into Warhammer. and pushing everyone else to the margins. Those margins grew steadily smaller through my lifetime, and are today miniscule.
Some companies managed to hold onto a tiny part of the now-shrunken niche, to the point that even seeing miniatures in stores that are not Games Workshop is almost strange.
If I am to name one thing that has changed something, it's the resurgence of D&D. That is the one other set of minis I will see with any regularity outside of the internet.
Couldn't agree more! I don't play Warhammer and prefer not to give GW my money, so this video was/is exceedingly relevant to me. I paint models from Massive Darkness and Enigma, Privateer Press & Wizkids on occasion, and a plethora of 3-D printed models (I have a guy in Tyler, TX I frequently order from via eBay), because it's for me learning more about art and how to create what I see in my mind in general more than anything else. Some of my favorite RUclipsrs include Don Suratos, Sorastro, and Banda Inku, who don't normally paint Warhammer stuff and produce quality content in general. I enjoy your videos because I like hearing you expound in general whether it's on art or matters like this. But yes, Warhammer is something I really couldn't care less about more often than not.
My favorite thing about your channel is how often you remind us to return to the roots of WHY we love this as a hobby in the first place. Definitely helps relax/recenter me when I get weighed down.
Thanks for this video. I’m not a D&D guy or a Warhammer guy. I don’t know what the hell they’re talking about. I subscribed to your channel, Vince V, Ninjon, and others because you’re all brilliant at painting figures and willing to share your thoughts and knowledge. If you’re new at this like me the learning curve is a bitch. I’ve also expanded my interest, thanks to you. Some of the figures you’ve done and the companies products you shown us I would never have known about without you. I know how hard you work to bring us content and I’m grateful. And I love your cats.
Lyla!!! Awesome ummm.... rant (?) I paint historical miniatures, almost exclusively Napoleonics. Occasionally big prestige figures but primarily 28mm ( maybe 500) and 15mm (about 5500 of them) The gain I get from tutorials like yours are manifold: technique, new products, ancillaries like basing and terrain. I thought about doing a few tutorials but non-warhammers go nowhere (poor Christie B at WSS, awesome artist, great presenter but no algorithm boost 🤦♂🤦♂ ) Great job! Like you I only paint, I DO NOT do the games. Keep up the great work!
As someone who likes making all different kinds of hobby videos, it's the same thing where the algorithm doesnt know what to do with your stuff if it isn't in the first niche it found to feed your content to. Here it's called the warhammer effect, but it happens in all niches, unfortunately. It doesnt have a solidified group of channels to feed "painting" videos to, but it does have one to feed warhammer to. it doesnt have one for dioramas, but it does have one for D&D. You have to play to existing "algorithm sets" which, in reality, really freaking sucks.
Pleased to hear someone saying this - I'm not a gamer I'm here to watch people paint stuff and hopefully learn a few things in the process. Seeing GW or Warhammer in a video title is a turn-off for me but I've come to realise that many of my favourite content creators feel bound to include it because well..more views. Watching someone paint yet another space marine is like ...yeah, like watching paint dry. I enjoy watching the same models I'm taking off my 3D printer being painted. Stuff by Great Grimoire, White Werewolf Tavern, Crippled God Foundry etc - models a little left of centre, perhaps somewhat niché and not a space marine in sight.
I feel that same frustration. I've never really been a warhammer guy and most of what I see just isn't the kind of subject matter I want to sculpt or paint anyway.
I will also say that it's worth giving some of the smaller channels a follow. I've found a bunch just by looking for videos on sculpting. Arga Miniatures is definitely worth a follow, he sculpts and paints some pretty cool figures from scratch.
I generally do not care about the miniature because techniques can be applied to any mini, regardless if made by GW or self-printed. Honestly I care more about the creator. If they are passionate, fun and/or relaxing to watch I subscribe. There are some likeable creators who not rely on GW miniatures (only)
With all the grey plastic out there from games like Oathsworn and Tainted Grail, I'm surprised videos other then Warhammer can't gain traction. I for one have never watched a Warhammer painting video, and I must have watched at least a hundred as I have started painting.
The ''warhammer effect'' is almost as bad as ''D&D 5e effect'' like if you make content for TTRPGs good fucking luck getting anywhere unless that's what you're making content for.
I actually made this comment before seeing the sponsor, good grief that was on point.
Have you looked at the figures at Nuts Planet? Or others that aren't games related?
And look at El Greco
It drives me nuts I type in to a how to paint a certin brand of model with say reaper or p3c paint and all I get is Ges workshop and Citadle paint when I don't even use those brands
I played D&D back in the day (early 80's), and learned to paint minis for that. However, I got out of gaming before GW showed up, so I have no idea what a 200 point army is, or why I want to speed paint them all using the slapchop method. I still paint figures and minis, but not for gaming, and I have zero interest in space marines. I see your point, but from my POV of not being a gamer nor a YTer, GW is keeping the mini painting hobby alive by keeping people interested in it.
That said, I watch you and others to learn new techniques, get insights into new products (you convinced me to get a wet palette, RedGrass FTW), to keep in touch with the hobby, and if the reference to the 80's didn't give it away, to connect with young people with youthful excitement and enthusiasm. You can't stay young at heart if you only listen to old people.
Agreed! I dont play or paint warhammer, but I do watch youtube videos and paint miniatures. I click based on the content being provided, not the model being presented. Mostly because the games that I do play aren't featured on YT much
I mean, this really sounds more like a RUclips problem than a GW one. But it is always nice to see different miniatures being showcased and less GWcentric techniques.
If I am not wrong the Warhammer effect is very close to the concept of an echo chamber. It's a big issue with RUclips recommendation, and in general any recommendation engine.