I think that’s actually the Eothvos effect that’s being experienced. Coriolis would have an effect shooting north or south causing you to miss to the left or right.
I repeat my reply from 4 years ago... *_Coriolis affects your north or south trajectory as well and he wasn't clear on that point. When you're shooting north the bullet will go left and vice versa to the south..._* *_...which is the main reason those damn Yankees won the war! lol_* *_So, what about north-west and such? North-west would be down and to the left, both about half the expected amounts of either straight on direction._* Coriolis is the term and it is merely referring to the spin of the Earth. Which direction you're shooting in doesn't change the physics of it, it's the same effect. To be sure there is some eotvos effect as well, but that is a _perceived_ gravitational effect and with a bullet that weighs 160 grains the difference of the eotvos effect over 1000 yards would be less than a millimeter.
I'll try and settle this for those reading the comments and wondering who knows the truth, who thinks they know the truth (that just ain't so), and who's on acid: He is in fact showcasing the effect the Coriolis effect can have.....AND the Eötvös effect. The Eötvös is the vertical (elevation or "up") component that the Coriolis effect has on a moving object. Backing up a bit, to calculate the Coriolis force with relation to directions that make sense to a shooter at a point on the earth's surface (North, East, Up), you must compute the cross multiplication of the Earth's rotation vector with the velocity vector of the object traveling (note: an object must be moving relative to the earth's surface to experience Coriolis. It can't be stationary or geostationary/floating). When you do this calculation, for a given latitude, and a given flight time (which can be estimated based on muzzle velocity and distance), there will be an expected push on the bullet to the right in the Northern Hemisphere, and to the Left in the Southern Hemisphere. This push is pretty much constant at your given latitude, no matter what direction the bullet is traveling. What DOES change depending on direction, is the "Up" push of the Coriolis force, which is also known as the Eötvös effect. So.... because the dude is trying to showcase the Coriolis without having to drive or fly several hours to change his latitude, he changes direction E to W, knowing that the bullet will be pushed up and down respectively (At Gunwerks Wyoming they're at about 43 degrees of latitude, and for 1000 yards, at an estimated muzzle velocity of 2800fps, I calculated about 4.8 inches of deflection up to the east, and down to the west). Props to him for trying to keep all other variables constant, like distance, gun, bullet, and environment. And, I guess in Wyoming they say CoriAlis. Jk, this is all bullshit, the earth is flat.
Yeah, Wyoming! I plink at trash cans-1300 yards...(1903 30.06 sporterized) this is awesome! Didn't know about the up and down. I studied meteorology and atmospheric science, and the coreolis effect. I just learned something new... i thought there was always a right "drifting" of the bullet. In an ideal world high pressure would run straight to low pressure-due to the coreolis (in n hemi) however, high pressure systems spin clockwise, low pressure systems anticlockwise. As a rule of thumb, find the direction of upper level cloud travel, line up looking down their path, low pressure center is 90° to your left. Awesome vid! Makes me want to get out there!
How comes snippers, hunters and the armed forces don't make these corrections before firing over long distances but always hit their targets? Maybe the scope on this person's riffle is off... or... maybe the scopes for all the riffles used by snippers, hunters and the armed forces in the world - ever - are off to such a degree that they coincidentally happen to be corrected perfectly for this 'theory' to appear plausible on its own? 🤔
“Keep in mind variable humidity and wind speed along the bullet's flight path. At this distance you'll also have to take the Coriolis Effect into account. ” - Cpt. McMillan
kdmc40 No shit, Sherlock. But it does have an effect on the duration of transatlantic flights; which is what the poster I replied to was talking about. Keep up, dude.
Your body in relation to space is rotating with the earth at the same speed, if you had a way to levitate in a fixed point you could wait for Europe to come to you... but remember that we are orbiting the sun too.
Iv'e been shooting through scopes for some time and account for everything down to the nearest fart. Never once accounted for the coriolis effect, I hit my targets.
Yep that's because the Earth doesn't spin at 1091 miles per hour. This guys paid shill or dumb. Only one video on the subject I keep getting. 5 millitary manual's on sniping in my phone and non account for this fake spin. Imagine trying to shoot East the target would run from you 1091mph at eqautor . Easy way to tell this is a lie. Shoot 1000 yards to the west and same to east ,then north, then South. Shoot a bell or metal. Have someone time it. They all will vary only puny split second apart and that is against wind obviously. RUclips , michealson and m Morley, michealson and Gale, aires failure. Theirs like ten others that price we don't move. They don't teach these in high school or collage. Also Google or RUclips government admit the Earth is flat and stationary. Let me look they sensor this heavily now.
@@charleysturbos7320 Lol the best part about this video is that you have to trust that the guy in this video is doing what he says. He doesn't show his work, we have to take his word on how far he is shooting, what direction, and what the wind is doing. we also cant see where he is aiming nor what kind of a shot he personally is.
+Nick: All that proves is that there are a whole pile of irrational dumbasses who own guns. YOU THINK!!?, lol. And that, like +charlysturb, there are a lot of people who own guns who are marginally mentally ill and/or do drugs. I too own guns, and for a LOT longer than you have. Done lots of shooting. There is nothing you or I do at a range that will prove or disprove coriolis. All you are doing here is the standard flatter "proof": If some effect is so small it cannot be seen, it doesn't exist. Obviously no proof of anything, my friend. Hey genius. You have never done precisely the test the guy did in the vid, at 1000 yds, correct?? You have done some shooting at targets though. Say, you sighted your rifle in at 300 yds. How are you at that range, at that spot, shooting at targets, like you do, EVER going to prove coriolis one way or the other? You cannot. The point is, at the ranges you shoot, and the way you shoot you cannot demo anything anyway. And finally, with this level of irrationality, it is probable you shouldn't be messing around with guns.
@@37rainman You make no sense. Other than insulting your basically saying theres no real way to see if the coriolis effect is real or not. You proved no point let alone have a point.. People have confirmed kills at a mile away. You think they had to account for the coriolis effect? NO
To everyone saying "It's not Coriolis, it's Eötvös!", this is just splitting hairs. Yes, it's true that in some applications the Coriolis force refers only to the horizontal (wrt the surface of the Earth) component of the cross product -2m(omega x v) and the vertical is called the Eötvös effect. However in general "Coriolis force" refers to the entire cross product. I've never come across a mechanics book that makes the distinction between the two components (most never mention the Eötvös effect by name).
@@pentallica893 Not accurate though. The Eötvös is the effect of different centrifugal forces "strenghening or weakening" gravity and coriolis is conserved momentum. The bullets were displaced vertically from Eötvös effect and horizontally from coriolis simultaneously.
Minor correction from your friendly physicist: The bullet will still rotate with the Earth, but not at the same rate. Angular momentum must be conserved, so as the bullet moves across the surface of the Earth and changes altitude, this affects the relative angular velocity of the bullet compared with the surface and thus all objects connected to it.
I'm bored so I did some math to see how far off a bullet would be if it just flew off into space like the guy said at 0:45 (I know he said "in lamen's terms", but it's more fun to take his words literally lol) Let's say you shoot a half mile (almost 1000 yards). A 300 winmag will get there in about .8 seconds. If you stood at the equator and shot south, the bullet would move sideways going west at 1000 miles per hour (or 1525 ft/s) and be like 1500 feet off target lmao. Not to mention the Earth also rotates around the Sun at like 67000 miles per hour, and the galaxy rotates at 130 miles per SECOND. Then you start getting into weird concepts like how do you even tell the speed of something in the universe if nothing is standing still.
If I'm understanding you correctly, the real "Coriolis effect" happens because the angular velocity the bullet inherits at the altitude of your barrel is slower than it would need to be to keep up with the Earth's angular velocity during the portion of the arc where the bullet is higher than it was initially, right? So if you were to somehow turn off gravity and shoot perfectly parallel to the ground, the bullet wouldn't drift sideways at all?
This explanation is wrong. Coriolis effect does not effect a bullet east west, only north south. The Coriolis effect comes from the Change in relative speed of the earth, relative to an object in motion above it. As a bullet fired north from the equator flies, it is travelling both north at 3000 feet per second, and east at 1500 feet per second, a target north of the equator is also traveling east, but at a slightly slower speed, since the bullet is moving both north and east, but east faster than the target, it will, in the same time, travel further east than the target does while in air, striking to the right. In reverse, if you fire from the slower moving target south towards the equator, the target at the equator is moving faster east than the bullet, so it the bullet fired this direction will also strike right. When firing from the equator south, the bullet is traveling east faster and will hit left (in both cases, when firing from a faster moving point on earth, to a slower one, the bullet strikes further east, when slower to faster, further west.) When firing East / West, a different thing happens, the shooter and the target are moving at the same speed. So when in flight, the target does not actually move up and towards the bullet, when firing west, or down and away when shooting east as depicted in the video. This is just plain 100% false, not arguments about it. Something else is happening to cause the results shown above. When firing east, the bullet is moving in the same direction as the earth, so, relative to the center of the earth, it is moving at a higher degree of rotation around the fixed point in terms of degrees per hour. This causes a greater amount of centrifugal force, which "slightly" counteracts the effect of gravity, essentially making the bullet "lighter" and it will follow a flatter arc, causing a higher "hit". When firing west, the angular velocity or speed of rotation around a fixed point is lower, causing less centrifugal force, and allowing gravity to take more effect, essentially making the bullet heavier, causing a lower hit. This is the Eotvos effect, something tangentially related, but different than the Coriolis effect.
***** The earth moves under the bullet either extending the flight time or reducing it. this causes the bullet to impact higher or lower on the target.
Tom Codie No, I does not. ^This is just plain wrong. The earth does not move under the bullet any more than it move under you when you jump up and down on a trampoline. When at rest the bullet it is moving with the earth relative to space, but is stationary relative to the ground. As long as the relative speed of the ground below the bullet does not change, as it would when traveling north or south from the equator, the earth's movement is essentially canceled out of the equation because it is a constant. The effect shown above is the result of Eotvos effect and is a result of centrifugal force.
***** Right i corrected myself later, please try to keep up. The equator moves at a higher velocity than the poles. So if you shoot north from the equator the relative ground speed at which you leave the barrel is, keep the demo simple, 1000mph as you move further north the relative ground speed slows down but you the projectile do not because the last time the earths rotation affected your relative velocity was when you felt the barrel. hence if firing north the bullet moves to the right. If you are firing south from the north pole the relative velocity would increase and you would still move to the right. Now shooting east and west is a bit more complicated but in essence a bullet will try to fly away from the center of rotation when moving with the rotation and towards the center of rotation when moving against it.
Tom Codie Tom, this is exactly, exactly the same thing that I said. The "trying to fly away from the center of rotation" is centrifugal force, which is slightly greater when firing east, so the bullet escapes gravity a bit more, and is slightly less when firing west, so it is pulled down a bit more.
***** Right, i am agreeing with you. we are just talking past each other. In the video his explanation is correct the terminology is wrong. Which really only matters to a very few people.
MedicXDm ,No ; North/South the rifle, bullet, and target are all moving together relative to each other. East/West the bullet exits the rifle at a specific point in the arc of earth's rotation as the earth continues to rotate towards or away from the point of launch.
ThisISREALLYDumb probably not significant enough to notice unless you were at one so the poles. That would be a highly unlikely scenario. How about this... would the deviation east to west be greatest at the equator, the same or least?
+ThisISREALLYDumb I'm impressed. You're the only person I've "met" on RUclips who really understands Coriolis. Especially the bit about how there is no effect when shooting north/south at the equator. Almost no one gets that, even after you explain it to them.
right but just how there is very little effect while shooting north/south at the equator, there is NO effect from Coriolis while shooting east/west no matter where you are.
You are correct about the bullet impact due to the Coriolis effect. The science is with you. Disregard the contrarian comments. If you had said Eötvös effect, you would also be correct, because Eötvös effect is a special case of Coriolis effect of a projectile motion only in the Earth's latitude direction. Good luck.
Coriolis effect does not occur when shooting east-west. That is Eotvos. Eotvos is simply the fact that shooting with/agaisnt the spin of the earth will effect its velocity relative to someone watching from a stationary spot in space (on the surface of the earth the velocity seems the same). It is this velocity from the perspective of a stationary spot in space which will determine the bullet drop, because earths gravity doesn't care about our perspective on the surface. Coriolis is North-South. If you are on the north pole, your angular velocity is small. But if you are on the equator it is large. If you try an shoot from the north pole to a target on the equator you'll miss.
What about shooting NE or SW or something. I have yet to seen any real world circumstances where the target happens to be exactly north, south, east or west.
LordDakson the more you are aiming N or S the bigger the effects gets. Technically it starts as soon as you deviate 1 degree to N or S, but then the effect is very small. I guess the effect grows like a sine function with respect to the degree of deviation
I looked up the Eotvos Effect and it seems to do with the resulting felt force of gravity comparing east to west moving objects. Or: "a phenomenon in which two objects, one at rest and the other moving relative to the earth, have different values of the acceleration of gravity at the same point." So, I would like to see more of how the curving earth will raise or lower a target and it's point of impact by the eastward or westward moving target. It certainly will not effect the mainstream citizen as they will not be doing TOO much hunting at 1000+ yards or defending self and home at those ranges either.
44sharpshooter You are right, and Sphere is right. Think rocket physics (which is much easier to think about in terms of objects in orbit rather than objects on the earth's surface.) The power of gravity remains constant, however the velocity affects the path of the object around the sphere. When an object is in orbit, it does not use any fuel to maintain its orbit. Its velocity is instead at the right speed and direction that when the force of gravity pulls it towards the center of the sphere, it cannot pull with enough force to bring it down, only to bend the path into a never-ending circle. If the speed decreases in the direction of orbit, the force of gravity doesn't increase or decrease, but the speed that pulls the object away from earth is lower, therefore the arc returning to earth is sharper. If the speed in the direction of orbit increases, the speed pulling the object away from earth also increases, so the arc returning to earth is more shallow. A bullet flying around the Earth is similar, except with near instantaneous changes in speed, and a starting speed equal to the speed of the Earth rotating at that point. So, when the bullet is fired against the rotation of the Earth, that is like an object in orbit lowering its orbital speed. When it is fired with the rotation, it is like increasing its orbital speed. Most planes and cars don't travel fast enough to really show any effect here, since orbital velocity is damn near 18,000 miles per hour, and even at the equator, the Earth barely tops 1,000, a speed fast enough to make you feel maybe a pound ighter at the poles than the equator (and faster than the speed of sound, but the air travels at the same speed, so no sonic boom), while cars and planes have land speeds slower than sound (most of the time). A bullet from a rifle, especially one that can accurately hit a target over a thousand yards, actually has a muzzle velocity closer to 2,000 mph, meaning that firing at the equator, the bullet actually has an initial "orbital" speed of 3,000 mph (1,000 + 2,000) in one direction (west to east), and an initial orbital speed of 1,000 mph (1,000 - 2,000, since its fired against the speed of rotation) in the other direction (east to west). Since one is 3 times the orbital velocity of the other, and even the lower one is 1/18th true orbital velocity, then if there were no air resistance to slow it down, the two would have drastically different arcs. Even with air resistance, the arcs are different enough to cause a noticeable drop over distances as small as even 500 yards. tl;dr, but still mind blowing... imagine if you launched a rocket exactly straight up at the equator, so that when it reached orbit, its orbital speed would be exactly the same as our rotational speed on the surface of the Earth. When it finally reached orbit, it would be one million miles up, 1% of the distance to the sun and almost 5 times farther away from the earth than the moon, and while we would travel all the way around this pretty spinning marble every 24 hours, that rocket would make one complete orbit of the earth in more than 270 days. Meanwhile, a rocket orbiting the earth at the equator at the same speed as a bullet fired to the east would be only 130,000 miles high (a little more than halfway to the moon,) and orbit the Earth once every 11 days. THAT is the difference the speed of a bullet makes.
Actually the Coriolis effect is active when shooting north and south because speed of the equator is spinning fast than a point closer to a pole because it covers more distance in a certain period of time because the radius of the circle it rotates with is larger. So when you are shooting northward the target is moving slower than the eastward momentum of the bullet so the bullet will hit to the right of the target. Shooting south ward the bullet will hit left.
even then, when you shoot from 1km below the equator to a target 1k above the equator it shouldnt make a difference, right? Cause bothe the shooter and the target are same distance from the equator and thereby moving at the same speed. Same should apply to the north and south pole.
Not correct, you will hit to the right whether shooting to the north or the south if you are located in the northern hemisphere. The reason is because when shooting south, the target is moving faster than the shooter, so it moves left faster, which means you hit right of the target.
Respectfully… This comment is incorrect as worded… In the Northern hemisphere, horizontal deflection due to Coriolis is always to the right relative to the shooter and always the same amount to the right regardless of shooting direction. In the Southern hemisphere it is always to the left relative to the shooter. The amount of horizontal Coriolis deflection is greater at the poles, lesser at the equator so to calculate horizontal coriolis deflection you need your latitude but you don’t need your azimuth of fire. Vertical deflection due to coriolis is different… anywhere on the earth it is zero when shooting due north or due south… and is maximum up shooting east and maximum down shooting west. So vertical coriolis depends on both latitude and azimuth direction of fire. Vertical coriolis deflection is zero at the poles and maximum at the equator. Unfortunately, the majority of the civilian shooting community has coriolis understanding wrong in one way or another… but fortunately the aviation and meteorological communities have it right… if they didn’t, airplanes would not arrive at their destination. The military artillery guys are definitely on point with their understanding of coriolis effects on projectiles.
A good way to help people visualize the Eötvös Effect is to think about orbits - if you're orbiting the planet at a very fast pace you'll start to leave the earth and if you stand still you'll plummet towards the earth. Shooting with the earth's rotation increases the bullet's orbital speed relative to the center of earth mass (helping it exit the earth's gravity pull) and shooting against it decreases the bullet's orbital speed relative to center of earth mass (making it harder to exit the earth's gravity). In other words, we're constantly being spun around on the surface (centrifuge) which reduces our perceived gravity, just like the spin on a merry-go-round tries to make us exit its surface (albeit horizontally). This is why your odds of getting pee on yourself if you pee into the wind while facing westward are better.
@@larryscott3982 I'm sure that I read somewhere about a snipers ballistic computer that used angle to target in its computations, so I'm assuming that there must be an effect. I'd just like to know for sure. I think these guys might know. Then I'll be able to sleep at night! rofl!
@@apxpandy4965 Coriolis correction for long range artillery is azimuth, latitude, and range sensitive. I was curious if in his location it would be as apparent as E/W shooting
The Royal Navy in the 1890s developed a mechanical computer for long distance naval firing. In the First World War it was used to calculate the drop, rise and the Coriolis affect for the shells , over 20 miles and the direction of fire , also to compensate for the wind as well. Bombsight from high flying aircraft need similar correction.
Hi Gunwerks team, thank you for all the videos and information. Just a slight correction on your video/title, what you are referring to is the Eötvös effect which affects the vertical component of the bullet trajectory in your example, your example is otherwise perfect. The Coriolis effect will give you a horizontal deviation depending on your latitude, Ciao, L
You are so correct, Lancelot! Also, Coriolis Effect only effects objects traveling far enough and slow enough to experience the effect (like weather systems moving from South to North (in the Northern Hem.). Bullits are moving too fast and for too short of a distance to experience the "Effect."
Hi Kirk, nice to finally read someone who has an open mind and/or is educated on the subject. The effects of Coriolis "laws" (vertical such as Eötvös effect and horizontal such as Coriolis proper) are there all the time but as you mentioned, for short distances/fast bullets, the results are negligible. When you look at hitting a target over 1,000 meters, depending on your theater of operation: latitude, direction of flight to target, size of target, weapon used (cannon vs. bullet vs. nuke ;-)!... you start making calculations. The sniper team works that on their hand-held computer and charts. Ciao, L
This is actually called the Eötvös effect. The Coriolis is a result of firing North or South. Because of differences in rotational speed as you go further North or South of the equator, less ground is travelling under the bullet so it travels to the side. I.E. A bullet fired directly North from the equator has an Eastern momentum of about 1,000-mph. If the ground below it is only rotating at 500-mph then the bullet will be travelling East at 500-mph making it appear to be travelling North-East. Of course, the rotational speed difference would never be that drastic with modern weapons because a bullet would have to travel from the equator to about halfway across Greenland more than 5,000-miles away. Despite the difference in rotational speed in mph, each part of Earth is rotating at the same number of degrees per hour, which is why if a person at the North Pole and a person at the equator could see each other through a telescope they would remain centered in each other's view no matter how much time passed. This is basically a 3D representation of a fan blade. The outer edge of the blade has more distance to travel than the inner edge so the outer edge has to travel at a greater mph to maintain the same number of degrees per hour and hold its position relative to the inner edge.
Also, having read another explanation and after thinking on this one more, this doesn't make sense. Why this explanation doesn't make sense: imagine a basketball-sized Earth in front of you with the South Pole facing you and the North Pole away from you. With an Eastern rotation the "top" of Earth is rotating to your right/clockwise. When firing East or West from the "top" of Earth the bullet wants to go in a straight line; however, gravity pulls that line down until it hits an object. In relation to that straight line's original point, yes, the East is rotating "down" from it and the West is rotating "up" towards it; however, that line is also rotating East with the planet so both the East and West targets should remain at the same relative elevation in comparison to the line. Now for the other explanation: at the equator you are moving about 1,670-kph East. A .50-cal bmg has a mass of 42-grams and a velocity of about 4,680-kph. When fired West, the bullet is travelling 3,010-kph West so it experiences about 0.47-grams of centrifugal/upward force. When fired East, the bullet is travelling 6,350-kph East so it experiences about 2.09-grams of upwards force. The greater upwards force on the bullet when firing East results in less drop so it hits higher than when firing West.
follow up question, at what height do I need to hover above the earth for an hour and then return straight down and find myself a thousand miles from where I started. physics only please.
Sorry but that's not how physics works. When you lift off from the earth you have the same momentum as the earth's rotation. SO you will continue moving in the same direction that the earth ws rotating. SO you will set back down in the same spot.
@@stuartgray5877 But the insrtuctor in the video just said that it does.He said at 1:10 that the earth rotates out from underneath the bullet after it leaves the gun or contact with the earth.
@@tammyhayden56 - "that the earth rotates out from underneath the bullet after it leaves the gun or contact with the earth. " But only if you shoot north or south. Then the momentum of the bullet when it leaves the barrel will NOT match the linear rate of the ground as it moves away from the gun. If you shot the gun straight up it will maintain the same momentum and hit in the same spot it was launched from (neglecting wind and assuming a perfectly "Plumb" aiming)
@@stuartgray5877 If the bullet is already moving with the constant speed of the earth then it is already in sink with the earth and no rotatation of the bullet is to be expected. Wind and atmosphere would be more of a factor at these ranges than some undetectable effect that practically no one allows for. You said that the bullet is independent of the earth when it leaves the the barrel only when shot north or south so how does shooting straight up make any difference if there is a rotation of the earth? If you noticed in the video this guy changed his direction and his point of origin by at least 6 feet when he turned the shooting table. That alone would give differnt impacts on target at 1000yds.
This is the Eötvös effect. The Coriolis effect influences left/right curve. It will curve the bullet right in the northern hemisphere and left in the southern with greatest effect at the poles. The Eötvös effect accounts for the drop difference east to west with greatest effect at the equator.
Head and tail wind will give at least that much variation, also the velocity variation from round to round could add to the wind effect and give even more elevation spread.
I too am wondering about the wind speeds on that day. Obviously it wasn't blowing but I did see the grass moving and the gunpowder smoke blow away rather quickly. Even a few knots of wind can cause several inches of drop. (depending on the load and its drop table)
+Rafael: No, the rt/ft veer is exactly the same no matter which direction the object is moving. This veer is caused by the earth rotating underneath a moving object. Obviously the earth is rotating under it whether it is moving north or east. Lol, also obviously a Foucault pendulum rotates the same no matter which direction it swings. Large numbers of very intelligent sounding utube experts cannot visualize this matter, so they commonly make this error. One of these is Justin Green, and it would be interesting to know at what point he becomes embarrassed at some of the things he says. It is very easy to visualize mathematically Coriolis in the north direction, and more difficult to visualize it in the East/west direction. This is what causes this mistake, which curiously has almost gone viral on utube.
When we were shooting 4.2" Mortars and doing the calculations manually, Coriolis effect was an additional calculation if you wanted to be more accurate on the first shot. 81MM and 60MM did not have enough range to make a difference
We understand these unseen forces in physics & probability. This is why we get as close to the target as possible. It is however valuable to know these no matter how minute they may be because it is very entertaining to bring these things up at a beer joint during hunting season.
@4:25 I believe you forgot to divide by 2. Your total difference was 11 inches, but that's between targets that are 2000 yards apart. You only shot 1000 yards. So you can only take half the difference. So at 1000 yards, the effect is only 0.5 minutes. Reminds me of Jeep people that say they went from 35's to 37's and got 2 more inches of clearance. Umm, No. The axle only raised 1 inch.
you are incorrect. the distance from muzzle to target is still 1000 yards. the same 11 inches would have shown up if he had put two target 1000 yards apart and set up shooting positions next to each target and faced the other one 1000 yards apart not 2000 yards apart from a central shooting location.
So the fact you're shooting on what appears to be uneven ground doesn't effect your calculations? The earth curves roughly 8 inches every mile, put that at roughly half a mile (1000 yards) you're at 4+ inches + the uneven ground would put you at the 8 inches off the center like you were. Your other shots were high like you said the coriolis effect would cause them to be, however, that could also be a result in uneven ground. Respect for the work but I wouldn't call this a legit experiment
There's a small effect there too, since you are moving slightly faster the closer you are to the equator, the horizontal momentum applied to the bullet is slightly different than the speed that the target is moving. At distances over 1000 yards, it does have a small effect.
Do pilots take the Coriolis effect when landing? How about if I hover in a helicopter 10,000 feet at the equator. Do I land 1,600 meters elsewhere in an hour?
+gateway833 Yes except people tend to forget that the atmosphere is also moving with the earth. When I jump, I still move with the earth and its atmosphere. It's like tossing a ball in a moving car, because the car is not accelerating, the ball, car, and air within the car move along with the car, the ball does not shoot to the back of the car at 60 mph.
@@gateway833 No you don't dumb fuck. The Earth is not a spinning ball. If that were true all the planes going to Europe would fly opposite the Earth's spin to get there faster. They say the Earth spins at 1000 miles per hour.
Pilots adjust trim constantly. Remember newtons laws. And remember, that you.. the craft.. the device you are measuring with.. the fluid you are breathing and flying in.. *are all rotating the same direction and speed.* Have you ever ran in a pool with a bunch of people (around the edge) making a whirlpool? When you stop running. You feel like you are in smooth water, but you are traveling around the edge of the pool. You can make short movements... but you are still traveling with that water. _This is what the Helicopter is doing too_ Air is so thick, that it weighs down on you.. at 14 POUNDS per square inch. Thats crazy immense. More like a liquid. BUT.. you are thinking right.. the _difference_ in atmospheric density the higher you go.. has a huge impact.. just like 2 storm fronts moving at different speeds makes a tornado.. these different air layers (moving at different speeds due to altitude and density) is where we get hurricanes. Youre on the right track.. just not considering all the variables. (or if you are a conspiracist.. you are dismissing variables because it would mean giving up the conspiracy)
@@timsmith7351 In the northern hemisphere you aim left (west) shooting north because you are moving east faster than the target. Still in the northern hemisphere, you aim left (east) because the target is moving faster than you. In the southern hemisphere, you aim right for the same respective reason when shooting along a longitude line. But most people can't hit a man sized target at sufficient range for this to matter, particularly under emergent conditions.
@@digitalnomad9985 the earth is still and motionless. You and your 5 senses know it, but your mind believes something that has no bearing in reality. It's infuriating to find out all that you are led to believe is fantasy. It'll take time. Good luck
@@erikydelauritsen3973 Coriolis Effect depends whether the object is in the northern or southern hemisphere. The effect explained in the video doesn't depend on that. Therefore, it can't be the Coriolis Effect.
@@rogernevez5187 . If the direction of the movement isn't parallel to the axis of rotation, then the coriolis acceleration is non-zero. That's about it. Independent of north, south, east west, equator or hemisphere.
All this is simply semantics. Coriolis is simply the apparent displacement of an object as it moves over a rotating plane. The plane does not necessarily need to be parallel to earths surface. For instance, on the equator the object does not displace in the horizontal plane, but does in the vertical plane. Both cases are 4 all practical purposes coriolis,
Can group over water, no wind, calm sea at 12 - 1300 meters with consistency. Rarely over land. Thermals? 300 Win Mag I reload and fiddle a bit. Down Here, our concrete trucks and rifling spin the other way !! The Coriolis effect is important when throwing a Boomerang. Cheers, from Adelaide
Why do I have this backwards? It seems if you are shooting east the target is trying to move further away and the shot would be low. If I were shooting west I'd think the target is approaching the bullet and it would hit high. This is reverse of what you've demonstrated.
So, if your shot is Eastbound, your target is definitely moving away. Instead of picturing that your target is moving just further ahead; picture it as its on an atlas/globe/earth. Its moving away as its moving lower as well. So as its moving further and lower, your cross hair is now targeting the higher portion of the target. For westbound, its the opposite. Imagine your target being on a globe. As it is moving close to yourself; its also raising in height. (Remember its on a globe). So if you had aimed your crosshair at the center of the target; as the target is getting closer AND RAISING; you shot will hit the LOWER portion of the target. I hope I was able to convey my point. :)
The way the question is put together is the failure. The target is NOT moving toward or away from you. The target is effectively moving UP or DOWN not forward and backward.
@Hector Lozada It's not quite that simple, although the effect is similar. In essence, when you shoot towards the East (either hemisphere), the movement of the earth 's rotation moves the target further away from the bullet as it flies. This results in a longer flight time, and so the bullet hit's the target lower in it's trajectory path, and so there is a low strike. And obviously the reverse when shooting towards the West. Shooting uphill or downhill is about the gravitational force not applying a full value to the bullets flight. Exactly like having a half value wind because it is at 45% to the bullets path, not at 90%.
@@andrewlongfield3102 it is simple. The effect in the video is that he is just shooting uphill one direction and downhill in the other.. Its easy to spot since I put the period of time in the comment so you can go back and forward and see the difference
@@andrewlongfield3102 The only thing shooters ever have to worry about when it comes hitting a target is wind speed and bullet drop. Based on how good the bullet Is some may have more FPS than others.
"As you can see, every time I jump into the air, the Earth rotates out from underneath me and I can travel from Texas to Australia in just one giant leap for mankind."
FYI: I dug this info out of my old scout sniper school notes.........General Reference: The earth circumference is 24,901.5 miles at the equator. The earth makes a rotation every 24 hours. The earth moves 1,037 feet per hour, 17 feet per minute and .28 feet per second. Rough estimate finger math for Marines that's 1 foot every 3 second (give or take). So if I bang out a .338 or .50 at 1500 yds and have a 4 second flight time muzzle to impact depending on my direction of shot my point of aim might move 6-12 inches before point of impact. This is rough math and differs based on where you are at and the direction your shooting and your elevation compared to target. A lot to compensate for in rifle shooting but artillery guys will probably understand quickly. Most rifle shooter will just shake their heads and fog over at this point but there are some ballistic nerds who really get into this for accurate shots and just a few more yds of range......like me..:) ANYTHING in the quest for that one perfect exact extreme long range "one" cold bore shot. Ohh Rahh Semper Fi!!
Rd Dn Your correct, I had to go back and re-read my old notes. My apologies, I wrote them in the 1970's...:) Its 1037 Miles of travel in 1 hour which is 17 miles per minute and .28 miles per second. So a 3 second flight time to target from muzzle the earth will move 3/4 mile in rotation again moving the target up or down based on direction. But again this is only a variable in extreme long range shooting.
scott merrow I have no "links" I have my old issue green military notepads with hand scrawled notes taken in field classes during the scout sniper course.......way before computers and ipads were ever thought of. I saved everything I have ever done shooting related as well as my manuals and books and find myself going back to them at times because good shooting data is always in style....:)
MrAzrancher That's nice.....break out the notes and SHOW US...is there ANYTHING in ANY army training manuals related to "the Coriolis effect" published BEFORE flat earth became popular...say from the 30's or 40's or 50's or 60's? Did your teacher talk about this with you without referring to manuals? It should be easy for you to PROVE the armed services took this "effect" into account by showing exactly where it's talked about in sniper and artillery training MANUALS. I can't wait to see your PROOF that the military EVER took this "force" into account. Your WORD and supposed "notes" aren't good enough evidence. You'd think you would have SHOWN the notes up close and readable. How do you think other snipers would feel about you if they ever watched this video? This topic seems important enough for you to make a video about, so why not get the man who trained you to come on video and confirm he taught you about Coriolis and explain it further? After all, the number of "dummies" who think the earth is flat is growing daily...
The planet is still turning so look for shots to be left or right of your placement, wind of course also has to do with placement as well as humidity. Imagine what a shot at 2500 meters which have been done en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Hathcock Amazing is the only word I have for that kind of shot. The reason he did not go into North and South is because the Coriolis effect does not affect your shots in those directions.
Alex Cardosa The Coriolis Effect still applies when shooting North/South. This video is about bullet DROP. Shooting West/East will affect your medial grouping, whereas shooting North/South will affect your lateral grouping.
What's even more amazing is that guys with with a Swiss rifle from the fifties can shoot farther, with open sights , and they hit bang on no scope. No corialis no bs
If you always shoot at the same location in the same direction and you adjust your shots for there, yes you can disregard the effect, regardless of what you are shooting with.
This effect only becomes visible when shooting in different directions. Otherwise you will not notice that your sights need to be zeroed differently depending on shooting direction.
@@joeltunnah Oh, a flat Earther, awesome! While you're here, could you briefly explain what causes the line drawn by a Foucault pendulum to rotate? What are you saying, Bob Knodel? You're picking up a 15° per hour drift? Oh, sorry, Joel Tunnah. Bob beat you to the punch. But you can still explain why, for the pendulum, the rate of drift depends on the latitude. (Well, you can't, because of too much density, but could you try, please? I'm getting some popcorn in the meantime.)
+Joel: Lol, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. I am sure your irrational idiotic world view is about you "believing in God", rather than you being insane. I wonder what God thinks about his best creation making such a fool out of itself?? All in some vain attempt to get Gods attention. Attempts to get Gods attention is not going to ever work. You are obviously worshiping a religion, based on things you think you get out of an old set of books. Worship of religions, and worship of old books is not worship of God, and is indeed blasphemous. You are supposed to be witnessing the Gospel of Christ, but in witnessing this rubbish, you are causing any sane impressionable mind to reject your stupid message, and likely the real message along with it. You are making Christians look like morons to the world. The fact is, there is not a thing in science today that conflicts with belief in God. But science surely DOES conflict with a whole lot of stupid religions dogma, and should. Correction, it would be better for you if you were doing this because you are insane, rather than because you "believe in God.".
This entire video is an excellent demonstration of the Corona effect, that 4.8% alcohol sure affects the brain after a half dozen bottles or so in quick succession.
Not very relevant unless the elevations varied quite a lot. The difference would be somewhat proportional to the cosine of the angle off the horizontal. If one target were even 80 yds yards above the other, the angle would be only 0.25degrees. The cosine of that angle, 0.99999976, while the cosine at level is 1.00000000. No practical difference. This was not done for utmost exactitude, it was done for demonstration. But my complaint is that he did not do it several times. I fear that he may have, and then selected the one which he liked the best. That is not an honest experiment.
I would need to see wind measurement at 5 points on both sides. And elevation. I would like to see it done right with 5 5 shot groups in all 4 direction and wind data
swissgunner Language is ultimately an arbitrary opinion. It's funny you say it's not a joke when I laughed at that assertion about the Queen's english. To disagree is to misunderstand the nature of language and the evolution it constantly is going through, albeit slowly to our perceptions.
I’m wondering also we’re the two targets at the same height off the ground? It looked to me the first target was higher in elevation than second target.
i remember traininng on the lee enfield 303 many moons ago and being told about this. Also somethng about the barrell twist to compensate for northern hemisphere?
different effect. the up/down movement shown here is not coriolis effect. if you shoot at a target to the due east, then the earth is spinning at the same rate when you fire as it is at the target, same if you shoot due west. it's the same as thinking that if you jumped upwards on a moving train the train will continue on underneath you. no, you don't notice the train move ahead as soon as you jump because you are moving with the train at the same velocity.
You are claiming Coriolis effect kicking in to a substantial amount at a (mere) 1000 yards? I am very skeptical. The wind, spin drift, and even atmospheric pressure are all going to be screwing with your POI versus your line of sight a LOT more than Coriolis is at 1000 yards, enough so that Coriolis is practically a negligible consideration compared to them. If you are pinning down Coriolis effect to this fine degree, then how much spin drift are seeing with this gun at this distance ?
At 1000 yards it is 2.125 inches up or down drift for a bullet at equator level flying 1.1s long. At lat 45° N the effect results in exactly 1.5 inch up or downdrift. I agree that wind, temperatur, moisture, ... might have a bigger influence here!
Quadrant14 All other issues are added to this effect. In many situation the shooter and his equipment produce much worser results than this effect is able to. Then it would be negligible, but it's still there. The effect has no practical! impact for a pistol shooter at 10 Meter, it has small impact for a long range shooter but it has extreme impact for artillery, as they have a minimum of possible "shooters problems" and maximum ranges.
lupuszzz true I was speaking as a former Australian SF Sniper who did long range , high angle/altitude shots, so many factors my friend but in essence pistol is of nought impact, but for rocketry and Arty it is very very important indeed
Plugging in the numbers for the Coriolis effect in the worst case for up/down drift (worst at the equator), and assuming the bullet travels at 3000 fps, there would be EXACTLY (to within the number of decimals of accuracy shown) 10.47 inches total combined up/down drift between targets 1000 yards east and west. At a latitude of 45 degree (a bit south of Seattle), it would be EXACTLY 7.40 inches. Assuming the shooter was at a latitude more in the middle of the lower 48 states, his 8 inch estimate is spot on. As you head to the poles, the Coriolis effect starts to manifest itself in left/right drift. At the pole itself, the left/right drift would be the same value as the up/down drift at the equator. Unfortunately for the shooter though, shooting in ANY horizontal direction will drift
If they actually had to take the corialis effect into consideration with bullet trajectory they would have to take it into effect with planes landing also. A PLANE CANT LAND ON A RUNWAY SPINNING AT 1000MPH CAN IT?
Navin Johnson Everything is in motion. The plane landing at the equator is also moving at 1000mph to an relatively stationary observer in space. So there is no problem.
Bs, there is too much room for bias here. You literally just said that you shot at a mirage. The wind could have had strong influences on your accuracy, not to mention that nobody shoots perfectly. AND you only showed two targets. This experiment could not have been more bias. This prooves absolutely nothing. Funny how you say this affects bullet travel yet it literally has zero affect on planes. I find that to be hilarious.
That is due to the jet stream caused by wind not rotation. If the earth is spinning, shooting against the rotation would just cause the bullet to fall to the ground (or at least greatly reduce range if the bullet travels faster than this supposed revolution), like throwing a ball out the back of a moving vehicle it just stops and falls. THE DECEPTIONS ARE REAL, WAKE UP!
Christian Ewing Look. All parts of the equation are valid as reasons for any variance found in your results. If the wind speed, etc is relevant to shooting or flying. Then surely the other, less important, factors at play have just as much to do with variance as anything. It's also true that this is an invalid test, as he simply shot rounds without the slightest regard for verifying the angle of departures.
It has alot of impact on planes. Due to their time in the air. Granted the changes are barely noticeable, in comparison to weather.. but it does happen. Like rotating a water bottle with something floating around in it.
1:03 hahahah as I jump up I'm leaving surface of the earth, that is spinning under me xD So all I have to do to travel west is just jump up, or better "get to the choppa" and just hover over spinning earth. Dude the gravity still affects the bullet (btw the atmosphere=air too) that is why it will eventually hit the ground and not fly into space. He's right about hitting low/high, he just did shitty job explaining it.
No, man. The bullet tends to follow a straight line because it has a initial velocity. The gravity has its role, but it is not the responsible for the effect we saw on the video. Gravity always curves the bullet down, not up. And the velocity of the bullet is different from that of the earth, so even under the effect of gravity, its trajectory will not follow the curvature. From Physics, in the Circular Motion, the trajectory will depend on the centripetal force (gravity) and on the velocity. For example, sattelites only follow the curve of the Earth because of gravity, but it has to be at a specific velocity. That is not the case for a bullet. The curvature of the eath has a drop of about 10 cm for 1000 m. That is the vertical correction for Coriolis on ballistic charts. Because when you shut, it takes a time to the bullet hit the target, but the target will move with the velocity of the earth in that time (depending on direction east-west).
Even a falling object deviates from vertical due to the rotation of the earth, and that is also call Coriolis Effect. So when you jum, you don't fall back at the exact point where you was, theoretically.
Actually 7.9 cm. But when we talk about the results of this shooting test we are talking about much more than how far the surface drops off the tangent at a given distance. Are you actually implying that that is all the calc is? The calc involves much more than that, for instance your latitude is going to be in the calc.
This is a good demonstration of a bad experiment. Coriolis effect is most noticeable when shooting north or south. The explanation in the video is not correct. The effect is due to the fact that the surface of the earth is rotating faster at the equator than at any other latitude, as can easily be demonstrated by imagining yourself standing at the exact north or south pole, where your speed (relative to the center of the earth) is zero. That is why satellites are launched in an easterly direction at low latitudes. A rocket launched due east at the equator takes full advantage of the speed of rotation of the earth, requiring less thrust per pound to achieve the same orbit (see Sea Launch). The Coriolis effect on a bullet is the same Coriolis effect that acts upon winds moving north or south from the equator. Winds (or bullets) moving north appear to turn to the east. This is because the wind (or the bullet) retains the angular velocity it had at the equator as it moves northward (law of conservation of angular momentum). However, the land under the bullet travels slower than the bullet the farther the round travels north, and so the bullet appears to turn east. Proper computation of Coriolis effect is essential for accuracy with long-range artillery and is well documented. The Coriolis effect has no bearing at all upon the point of impact in the vertical direction. As a thought experiment to prove this, consider that when firing due east or west as in the example, both the shooter and the target have the same angular velocity at the instant of firing. There is no relative difference in motion of either the rifle or the target due to the rotation of the earth, since both are at the same latitude. This is equivalent to the case where there is no angular motion at all. If the earth stopped rotating, the relative speed difference between shooter and target would still be zero. I suspect that if the same experiment were carried out in carefully controlled conditions, and that several hundred rounds were fired at least, the data would most certainly lead to a different conclusion from that propounded in the video. I suspect that the real cause of the results have more to do with human error in the hold, and a forgone conclusion (wishful experimentation). In fact, the effect of a zero-value full headwind or tailwind of only a few miles per hour could easily explain the results obtained when shooting at that range.
You are absolutely correct. I am a marine sniper and have never once adjusted for the "rotation of the earth" out to 1000. Artillery and other longer range weapons would need to adjust.....not a man behind a gun.
The statements about relative direction are true. A target to the east is moving "down" relative to a line between the shooter and the target. And to the west the target is moving "up" relative to that line. I think the question would be whether it's moving fast enough relative to the duration of the shot to make a noticeable difference. My concern with the video is there seems to be as much variation within the grouping as there is from target center. I definitely think you would need more shots and more precision to measure this effect empirically.
Navel gun targeting solutions include the curvature of the earth, coriolis, and Eötös effect. Here is a much better explanation than I can give. mathscinotes.com/2017/12/earths-curvature-and-battleship-gunnery/ And in a life or death situation when someone is shooting at me I sure would like the best shooting solution I could get to shoot back at them. I sure hope the ones shooting at me are using some flaturds calculations.
unfuckingmaker The Coriolis effect is certainly real, but it only has to do with change in position North and South. The earth is spinning faster at the equator than it is at the poles, so things tend to "curve" when moving through the air North and South. It's even seen in air flow within weather, it's most certainly real.
unfuckingmaker. It's apparent that you don't even have a moderate understanding of Physics nor the scientific method. The good thing about facts though is that they don't change based on your opinion. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriolis_force
I flew 53s in the Navy so let me pose the question in a slightly different way. The surface velocity of Earth is about 1000 miles per hour due to it's rotation. If I wanted to fly 1000 miles west, couldn't I just pick up into a hover and hover for an hour. Then after landing an hour later, I would be 1000 miles west of where I started the hover This would be one fast helicopter wouldn't it at 1000 miles per hour? Everything that starts on the ground is moving with the surface of the earth including helicopters, bullets and people. We're all moving at about 1000 miles per hour. You would start seeing a difference with balloons over a significant amount of time compared to bullets but for the scope of this conversation, I hope I made my point. MC
Not necessarily, hypothetically it works but you would need to reduce the velocity of the plane or helicopter because when you take off you are moving at about 1000 mph, earths rotation, in reference to earth your not moving, but chose another reference point and you are moving with the earth, so once you reduce your speed to 0 mph from the non earth reference point, then you will eventually get there however, from the reference point of earth you will be moving at 1000 mph which is not hovering.
I think that would work if the earth had no atmosphere, but you have to take into account the atmosphere. It moves with the earth otherwise we would have 1000mph winds all the time. You don't move when on the surface because it is solid, but with gases you can move through it a lot more freely, so you would slowly move but not very much.
Go on a train traveling 100 mph. Jump. Land on the same place? Yes. You and the train have the same velocity. Now try this on a fast merry go round. Jump...oops you go off on a tangent. The merrygoround spins under you. It’s velocity is changing and you have the velocity (speed and direction) at the time of your jump. Rotation is different.
Your explanation is correct for another effect called Spin Drift hitting up or down. Coriolis affects bullets flying to the North or to the South, hitting left of right the target.
@@camurgo It is to do with rotation, not due to the bullet 'not rotating' as it leaves the gun. That would be like saying you wouldn't be moving if you jumped off a high speed train. It's because the speed of rotation of the Earth increases as you move toward the equator.
I said he's 'flat wrong' and not mis-naming because as soon as he says 'bullet isn't rotating' he isn't talking about any real effect at all, since the bullet is rotating.
if your not on the equator of the earth, east vs west will not be simply higher or lower. there will be a slight left/right component as well depending on your location
I get 5 minutes to sight my rifle and 2 sighting shots on the mound. As my rifle is actually sighted for the target I do not worry about Coriolis effect. On the other hand if my first shot was my only shot I would do the calculation .
+Stefan F. Weirdly this is not true. Note that his shots drifted to the right both for East and West targets. In the northern hemisphere, your shots always drift right, regardless of direction of fire. In the southern hemisphere they drift left. The drift becomes zero at the equator and grows as you move toward the poles. He is in Wyoming, U.S.A. I think, judging by the nothingness we see in all directions. I just learned this today. Even though I just read some really good explanations of why, I still don't understand it. :)
@@jeffhawkins420 I'm cutting at pasting this from another post because I doubt I could explain it any more succinctly. *This isn't actually due to Coriolis, and he did not properly explain the Coriolis Effect anyway. The Coriolis Effect is due to a difference in the speed of rotation of the Earth at two differing points of latitude. The rotation speed of the Earth is greater at the Equator than it is at the poles. The Earth isn't rotating beneath the bullet. The rotation of the Earth is imparted to the bullet. Conservation of momentum. The bullet shifts because the Earth is rotating more slowly, or more quickly, at the destination latitude than the firing latitude.*
Why are you schooling on Eötvös Effect that occurs in east-west shooting angles and calling it Coriolis which effects north-south shooting angles? Coriolis requires a windage change in aimpoint and Eötvös requires an elevation change in aimpoint.
@@jimsagubigula7337 You have been misinformed. It is best to get your information from a highly reliable source such as Lapua. Their opinion is as follows - Often the Eötvös Effect is considered to be part of the Coriolis phenomenon, but it is in fact its own separate phenomenon.
There is very good reason for them to have separate names. They are basically names that correlate to left right and up down corrections and calling it all the same would be like saying windage and elevation adjustments are the same. Written and spoken language is used to convey a specific thought and lumping both together muddies the waters of communication.
@@johnnybarbar7435 Hmm, from this perspective you aren't wrong. Although it's important for people to understand it's basically the same phenomenon. The math is the same
Wrong. The Coriolis effect is not just north/south shots. The shots parallel to the equator, latitude, effects the the vertical impacts, the shots will be high or low, where as the shots that are parallel to the lines of longitude effect horizontal impacts, the shots will be to the left or to the right. The shots not parallel to neither longitude nor latitude will have impacts that are mixed in combinations. Good luck
@KKKn50cal I don't dispute the definition. The fact is, Earth is not flat but a spheroid and the bullet moves along the curvature of Earth. While the English word definition of Coriolis effect(force) is good, a mathematical definition is better. Namely: the Coriolis component is the vector cross product of 2 times Earth's rotational velocity and the bullet velocity. This means that when bullet is traveling in the east to west or west to east direction, the earth's rotational velocity is perpendicular to the bullet's velocity, because the earth's rotational velocity is along the spin axis, south to north direction. High or low bullet impact is confirmed by the shooter in the video. Some claim that the shooter demonstrated the Eötvös effect and they are correct. Eötvös effect is a special case of Coriolis effect when the direction of travel is only in east-west or west-east direction. I hope this helps. Good luck.
@KKKn50cal OK. I misunderstood your point of view when you cited the definition of Coriolis effect, which had little to no relevance to east-west and west-east shooting, in the video. I wish you no offense. Good luck.
The earth does not sit on its vertical axis upright but rather tilted to the left at the top and spins from West to East (left to right). Ignore the bullet moving but rather as static and imagine the target moving. So if you are shooting East the target moves away/lower from the bullet and from right to left. And if your are shooting to the West the target moves closer/higher and from left to right. Also if you are shooting North the target moves from left to right and away/lower. And if your shooting South the target moves closer/higher and from right to left. Does this make sense? Hope so....
Nolom Ebal Yeah I noticed that too. He doesn't seem to go in too deep into the specifics of his elevation relative to the targets, and if you use him and his table for scale, the first target is either on a hillock or in a basin of some kind. Second target seems to be fairly low to the ground.
+Anthrolithos over 1 kilometer a slow dip in elevation would have to be equalized by a small hill. It makes very good sense that one of them was on something like that, because the chances of getting level ground without one are much lower. In this age it's easy to verify the elevation. There's all sorts of tools to do it. The simplest method I could imagine would be simply using a laser and a level. done. To think that he would be so incompetent not to do such a simple and critical thing is absurd.
+Anthrolithos yes, there seems to be a lot of controversy on this theory I don't shoot much at a thousand yards but I do at 400 so next time I miss at 400 I think I will use this as an excuse even if its not avaiable hypothesis. my shooting range is set up north and south so I don't know if I shoot north instead of South if the effect is the same but I'm going to say it is if I miss. unlike most people if I can blame it on something other than shooter error I will take advantage of that
First it's not the Coriolis effect but only the horizontal component known as the Eotvos effect, when shooting east/west. The surface of the earth (at the equator) is moving 1050 mph or 1540 fps. The bullet speed from Gunwerks info sheet is about 3100 fps. Firing East, with the rotation of the earth, these too are additive meaning the bullet is moving 4640 fps, and firing West, against the rotation, the bullet loses velocity and is moving at 1560 fps. This is based on the inertial frame of reference. Gravity is constant regardless of speed. At muscle velocity of 3100 fps, the bullet will take just over 1 sec to reach the target, either way. The rotation of the earth in 1 sec is approximately 0.292 miles. The earth's surface curves about 8 inches per mile, so in one second, the earth drops off to the east or rises to the west by 2.3 inches, that certainly is part of the error, but the rest lies in the difference in centrifugal force which fights the pull of gravity. This change is due to the inertial frame of reference speed of 4640 fps firing West, and 1560 ft firing East. Take into account the velocity of the bullet drops after leaving the muzzle and that air resistance is NOT linear. Now...is everyone thoroughly confused?
Since we're counting on earth's gravity, the frame of reference is from a singular 3D point in spacial orbit so the rotational speed most definitely figures onto it.
Isn't the North / South direction even more important? First line of google: _"The Coriolis effect is most apparent in the path of an object moving longitudinally."_ It should be like accounting for windage.
no, longitudinally = north/south. yes, for coriolis effect, it is north/south movement which is important. the effect due to east/west movement depicted in the video is mistakenly referred to as Coriolis effect but it is something else entirely
His definition of Coriolis is completely wrong. The bullet leaves the barrel with the velocity of the earth rate. This means that a notherly shot in the northern hemisphere will land to the right of the target, a shot to the south will land to the left. Coriolis tis why low pressure weather rotated counter-clockwise in the northern hemisphere.
Probably the most unscientific method way to measure a result done by someone who has no understanding of a subject that they have confused with another phenomenon
@Cooper Bradford Yes this is exactly what he is doing, but he knows that all the cool gun guys talk about 'Coriolis' , so he wants to be cool. Except that for his initial discussion of vertical dispersion when shooting either towards East, or towards West, he has things completely ass about. I bet you he has no idea about Eotvos effect at all, actually the vast majority of rifle shooters don't. There is actually a third effect that is even smaller which has to do with the diameter of the earth increasing till it hit's maximum at the equator, and which alters a gyroscopic precession force that acts on the bullet in flight. I have never seen this force mentioned in a shooting article, but it's part of what makes the equation very complex to calculate properly. You can usually tell as soon as they start speaking because they all fail to accurately and adequately define all directions and forces, and in doing so they confuse one thing with another. However I have noted, and I have had this discussion with a couple of well accredited shooting gurus, every explanation of the Coriolis and Eotvos effect (there is no actual force being applied, it is simply an observed effect due to being within the rotating system), quoted in rifle shooting, gets at least half of it backwards. I have actually spent months trawling through scientific articles on tracking weather systems (the main use for the equations), and artillery theory (because by and large every article I have ever found written by a shooter has parts that are not just inaccurate, but they are actually incorrect, a different thing entirely). My mathematics isn't strong enough to follow the equations through (didn't do 3 years of pure mathematics at university), so I have never found the actual source of the error, but my best guess is that at some stage in an early article on rifle ballistics (ie, in the 30's, or 40's), someone inadvertently moved a value from one side of the equation to the other, hence giving the inverted data that so many well researched rifle ballistic documents quote. My guess it was a well intentioned, and probably knowledgeable rifle writer trying to make sense of transposing meaningful data from a complex article on calculating artillery flight paths, where the theoretical math equations were too complex for him to follow and understand properly. In no way am I having a go at this person, because, as I said, I've spent months dragging through scientific papers, and increasing, what i realize is that i am not understanding the whole thing. If you don't have a good working understanding of the way the equations work, then you can't understand what each part, or value does, and so I can completely see where it would be possible to leave seemingly unimportant bits out for the sake of simplifying things to a level where ordinary folks can have a chance of understanding things, but in doing so you actually leave a critical cog out (because you don't understand the importance of it's function), and the equation becomes reversed for one set of values. I constantly hear the reversed deviations given for East-West shooting, and often reversals given for shooting in the southern hemisphere, although sometimes both hemispheres are given with reversed values, and sometimes reversed values are given when the direction of shooting is changed from North To South. The one thing I have never actually found in a rifle article, blog, clip etc, is a complete set of correct directions/ deviations quoted. That's pretty weird isn't it. The clearest way to refute these reversed values is to have a hypothetical bullet path that has it's origin point in the Southern hemisphere, traveling along a path towards the North, and observe (hypothetically), what happens to the bullets flight when it crosses over the equator as it travels along it's flight path. If directions of divergence changed from Northern to Southern hemisphere, then this hypothetical bullet would be swinging perhaps towards the West while traveling in the Southern hemisphere, then once it crossed the equator into the Northern hemisphere it would in order to 'obey' the law of this particular system, need to instantaneously reverse it's direction of horizontal deviation (swing), to the East. Obviously no real physical system can do this because the physics involved would actually not obey the laws of physics, like conservation of momentum, where a body traveling in a certain direction will continue to travel in the same direction unless-acted on by an external force. This brings us neatly back to the point where we said that this is an observed effect, there is no actual force being applied to the projectile. In fact, at all times regardless of observations (restricting the discussion to theoretical observance of pure Coriolis/ Eotvos effects, within a frictionless frame, also unaffected by gravity), the projectile conforms to a completely straight path. Any deviations are observed only, not actual. So simply, the bullet cannot turn one way, then turn the other as it crosses the equator, which it would have to do if directions were reversed from one hemisphere to the other. In fact the supposed change from curving leftwards, to curving rightwards, if you reverse your shooting direction from shooting Northwards, to shooting Southwards, is in this case just a visual trick. The direction of East-West dispersion when shooting along a North South axis (facing either direction), is ALWAYS towards the West. The reason for this is that the earth rotates in the same direction regardless of which direction you are facing, or which hemisphere you are standing in when you take the shot. And because both the Coriolis effect, and the Eotvos effect are related to observations of a projectiles flight path observed in relation to the spin of the earth, then for all these values it's easy to see that East-West dispersion from a North-South trajectory can only ever be to the West, and a projectile fired towards the East will only ever strike low, just as a projectile fired towards the West will only ever strike high regardless of which hemisphere the shot is taken in. There are other complex forces taking place, but their values compared to environmental values (wind, temp. pressure humidity, etc.), are extremely small and for shots where the flight time is under a couple of seconds, they are pretty much irrelevant. For a 300 WinMag at 1000m, at a temp of 100F, the horizontal dispersion when firing on a North South line is something like 0.08 inch. In all honesty, when it's common enough to have a wind value that can be 20 inches, or larger for that flight time, I cannot see how anyone can observe the actual dispersion caused by Coriolis. Obviously it can be calculated, but i think that anyone who says they can see the dispersion from the Coriolis effect is kidding themselves, unless they are shooting at extreme ranges (2500+), or with a very slow round, or combination of both. Even then values will never be large and are likely to be in the order of 100th magnitude of the winds value. There was a thumbnail on the right hand side of this page for a channel called Mark and Sam after work, where Mark is shooting a 375GIBB out past 5000yards. I've chatted to Mark on this subject (fellow Aussie), and they are great guys and very knowledgeable about all this stuff. I can tell you that he calculates Coriolis effect for these distances, and that it would be a large enough value at these ranges to affect accuracy, but he still explains Coriolis in a way that gives an inverted value for some directions, and I have seen time and time again, first shots at extreme ranges that can be off the target by a couple of target widths (they spot hits as 1 target high, 2 targets right, etc, using the target dimension as a measurement), and then Mark walks his shots onto target by adjusting his point of aim (hold off point often at that range, as a single click on the turret could be 3 target widths), and sending another projectile down range. Realistically a value of '2 targets left', which is then interpreted as being slightly off on the wind doping, could just as easily be an inverted Coriolis value, it's probably about the right value for the sort of ranges they are shooting at, but there is absolutely no real way of verifying if it is an inverted Coriolis value, or an incorrectly judged wind value. If you reversed the Coriolis value, and took the shot again, you're just going to offset the impact point against the wind value again anyway. For real world rifle shooting, I honestly think that Coriolis is probably just a bit of a waste of time to bother calculating, especially if you can 'walk' the shot onto target. Where first shot cold bore hits matter at extreme ranges, then either make sure you're calculating the value correctly, or what's probably easier, learn to incorporate it in your wind doping, so that it becomes instinctive. To hit anything at those extreme ranges anyway, you need to virtually be shooting every day, as the skill set for evaluating environmental inputs and giving them a usefully accurate estimated value, is extremely perishable, and would erode very rapidly if you stop shooting, even for a couple of days, or a week. Sorry if I've banged on a bit, it sounded like you actually know something about this stuff, unlike most internet commenters, and i thought some of my conclusions might interest you. Also apologies for long winded technical nomenclature, but it is just so easy to get wires crossed as to what is actually meant unless you use complete definitions, and then everyone winds up thinking everyone else is an idiot.
+Andrew: With all due respect to your tedious manuscript, you are wrong in some things. The 0.08 veer you assert for a Win300 Mag at 1000yds would be one. You suggest you aren't great at the math. This can be very closely accomplished with some relatively ad hoc math. But quite obviously your visualization of the problem is not too strong either, and basically that is the biggest thing in conquering this problem. Or any problem as Einstein pointed out. Lets assume a shot that takes 1.4 second, at the 45 latitude I live on. The veer to the right due to coriolis would be a tiny bit under 2 inches. That is a whopping 25 times than your "0.08 inches". (-; Do I REALLY need to calculate that for you? The exercise would be good for you to tackle. But the thing that really makes us smile is your naïve assertion that 'the E/W dispersion of a N/S shot is always to the west, no matter whether which direction you face" really DOES take the cake! In the N hemi, the veer is always to the right. So shooting N it veers E, and shooting S it veers west. If you do insist that it always veers to the west, your visualization of the issue is really infantile. Fact is it will veer to the right no matter which direction you are shooting at all, but it seems like basically all the utube "experts" seem to fail on that concept. So if you do not even have such simple concepts in hand, you should really not be presuming to teach on this subject. But hey, thanx for your effort.
I'm wondering if it would be possible for the force of gravity to cancel out the eastward Coriolis effect? Would there exist such a distance of shooting that would cancel out the impact area of the bullet so it would land right on the target? To clarify, since gravity would lower the impact area under the target, and the eastward Coriolis effect would raise the impact area of the target, wouldn't there be such a distance from where the sniper shoots that would make this possible?
The explained mechanic of coriolis-effect is wrong here. The bullet is still confined to the earth's reference frame by the atmosphere. This would be called "wind" or air drag. Coriolis-effect really is an effect of the earth's curvature. Places near equator are spinning with faster velocity than those closer to the poles. The bullet retains the amount of sideways motion of the place where it leaves the barrel and drifts eastward when shooting away from the equator (to the right when shooting north, left when shooting south) and westwards when shooting towards the equator. The effect is stronger at the poles (you shoot almost in direct angle to the axis of rotation) and extremely weak at the equator. Interestingly the down- up- effect is the most pronounced at the equator.
MVHiltunen , actually No, he bullet path is always straight with the exception of windage, drag and gravity drop. Tossing a ball between two convertibles driving down the highway does not cure the path of the ball, it travels in a straight line from one moving target to the other moving target. Just ask Albert Einstein. Cheers,
samesaw Well yes that is true, but my point stands also. The path of the bullet is straight but the path of the earth isn't. If your convertibles are driving directly east (or west) at the exact same speed, one of them will gain slowly, since the the path around the world is different in length at different latitudes. One convertible gains slowly, and you have to throw the ball in angle accordingly; hence coriolis effect.
Why do people think this is a real thing? Simple math shows that if you were at a spot on earth that was spinning 900 MPH (15 miles per minute/.25 miles per second) and you had a target to your North or South, you'd have to adjust a quarter mile to the west for just 1 SECOND of bullet travel time. Nobody does this because it's laughably absurd. You'd have to apply it to anything that leaves the earth's surface, which means helicopters/blimps could never hover or they'd lose their position, sports would be hilarious to watch as a golfer has an average drive hang time of 6 seconds which would give make any North or Southward shot travel 1.5 miles off course. This is serious brainwashing that's been going on for generations.
@@tbonebugam1 You could easily test whether a person can accurately determine the levelness of a line going directly away from your eye. One way would be to take a 20 ft 2 x 4 into an area w/o a sea horizon or any buildings or water bodies in sight. Put your eye on one end, sight along it, and with hand motions have a friend move the other end around till you think it is level. You wont do well in the test. There is nothing in that vid to alert you to the things you are claiming Secondly, a little bit out of level will do frightfully little to the shooting results. The difference will be proportional to the cosine of the angle. If it were level, the angle is 0, so the cosine is 1. Out there 3000 ft, if the target were out of level a whopping 100 feet, the cosine would be 0.99944. There is no practical difference between those cosines. For differences to be relevant the out of level angle will need to be VERY much larger
What is being demonstrated here is indeed due to the rotation of the Earth, but it is demonstrating the Eötvös Effect; which makes projectiles fired due East or West "drift" above or below the intended location, respectively. The Coriolis Effect makes projectiles fired towards or away from the equator "drift" East or West, respectively--from the perspective of the person firing the projectile. This is due to the fact that, although the rotation is a little over 360⁰ per day) everywhere on the Earth, the *lateral* speed depends on your distance from the axis of rotation. Thus, while the *lateral speed near the equator is close to 1000 miles per hour, the lateral speed near the poles is close to 0. If a person is firing in any direction between the four directions mentioned, then the result is some combination of both effects.
This is not because of coriolis effect!!! Coriolis effects will be if you shoot north or south and the bullet went to the right/left. If you will shoot north(on northem hemisphere) the bullet will fly a little bit right. If you will shoot south it will fly left. (opposite on southem hemisphere). Have no idea if there is difference in right/left on 1000 yards or 5000 yards... So you can try...
Yes if you shoot North and South the Coriolis effect will change the horizontal impact on the target. Shooting East to West has the effect of changing the vertical component of impact, because in one direction the earth is moving away from from the bullet, and in the other direction the earth is toward the bullet. This changes the time it takes for the bullet to hit the target thus making the bullet hit at different heights.
frederickhf241 (*Read edit below.. changed my mind*) Conservation of momentum, the bullet's speed relative to the earth does not change shooting east vs shooting west. The bullet is already moving with the earth (as are you and the rifle) no matter which direction you're shooting. That momentum doesn't just disappear when you fire the bullet. A better demonstration of how there *isn't* a "Coriolis effect" firing east/west would be to set up a bullet chronograph and fire through it each direction and show that the muzzle velocity is the same (within normal variations) in each direction. EDIT: Actually now that I think about it a little more, there will be a difference shooting east vs shooting west. Whether it's measurable I'd have to do some calculations on... it doesn't have to do with the earth coming towards or going away from the bullet, but if you think about it from an orbital mechanics perspective: To make the math easier, let's just say you're at the equator. In that case you're traveling roughly 1040 miles per hour, or ~1522 feet/second. The speed necessary to be in a circular orbit about the earth at the surface (~2.1X10^7 feet from the center of the earth) is V=SQRT(2.1*10^7*32.08) = ~26,000 feet/second. So if you're facing east and fire a bullet, it'll be going about (let's say for a .308 round) 2700+1522 feet/second = 4222 feet/second (relative to the center of the earth, not the surface). This is actually a sizable fraction of the 26,000 feet/second. Shooting west the orbital speed of the bullet will be 2700-1522=1178 feet/second, which is obviously smaller than 4222... so the total "downward" (towards the earth) acceleration will be greater shooting west than east. Turns out 4222 takes our total acceleration from 32.2 feet/second^2 to about 31.36 ft/s^2. 1178 takes us down to about 32.13 ft/s^2. Difference of about .8 ft/s^2, firing at 1000 yards, let's just say bullet flight of about 1.5 seconds... could be a difference of 1.2 feet! This is a rough estimation since the bullet doesn't actually travel at 2700 ft/s relative to the earth's surface for the entire flight, but as a proof of concept I guess it shows that there could be quite a difference.. Interesting!
Matthew Brown To make things clear - this does not happen in real life - the bullet is shot from a rifle, the rifle is being held by a person, the person is standing on the earth. This means that the person is spinning together with the earth due to static friction and the rifle is spinning with the person as well as the bullet inside of it. - all of them in the same speed the earth is moving. now, when the bullet is fired from the rifle he has speed both in the direction of the spinning of the earth ( even if it is not in a specific direction as north or south - the speed in the direction of the earth's spinning can be described as a complicated vector) and in the direction it was fired and because there is no external force applied on the bullet (except of friction and gravity) it will keep moving straight ( and downwards because of gravity) and it wont deflect or move right left or up and down due to it being not connected to the earth. This was described long ago in NEWTON'S FIRST LAW OF MOTION - the earth and the bullet act as inertial reference frame and the bullet is only going straight relatively to the earth. " When viewed in an inertial reference frame, an object either remains at rest or continues to move at a constant velocity, unless acted upon by an external force". this phenomenon described in the video simply does not exist because we are looking at it from our earth - our own inertial reference frame and therefore the bullet is only moving in a "free fall" (parabola). Thanks for reading - ( this is high school stuff ) :)
Meron Bridge Grade school if you are in Korea or Russia :) yes you are mostly correct. the external forces are acting on the bullet you will find a miniscule difference in speed of the bullet leaving the rifle if you fire it east as opposed to west. again MINISCULE as in inches per minute! not nearly the difference they showed in this video. my previous post was just pointing out there would be a miniscule difference because of the math Matthew came out with.
by your explanation the bullet traveling west has to only travel 540 yds as the one going east travels 1460yds. earth rotating at 460yds( actually meters so we loose 3in./yd) per second. or the bullet traveling west has a transit time to target of approx .72 seconds while the bullet going east has a transit time to target of 1.95 seconds. is that right? Since the bullet is flying independent of the earth. Assuming a projectile velocity of 2250ft/sec
The bullet has the same rotaional speed as the earth since it is on it and inside its atmosphere. Just like when you jump in a train, you still have the same speed as the train even while in the air. Otherwise you would go splat on the back wall of the wagon. Newtonian laws of motion 101.
+D Bradford: An airplane is effected by coriollis. ANY moving object, even you, are effected by coriolis. The effect on an airplane is so tiny that the many other variables effecting that plane completely drown out the coriolis effect. You do not seem to realize that a cannon shell is a ballistic object, and a plane is not. A plane flies upon the atmosphere and steers around in that atmosphere. A cannon shell does not steer to its destination. And yet, at all times corriolis is slightly affecting an airplanes flight path. The fact that an effect or a thing is tiny does not somehow prove the effect does not exist. If we would calc the amount a tossed ball veers as it moved 100 feet, here on the 45th latitude, the answer would literally be in the thousandths of an inch.
wow amazing. at ranges that far I'm pretty sure you are battling air density and movement. not the spin of the earth that nobody on the planet can feel except for weather.
I have a question? Shooting north to south, or south to north. What effect does it have on the bullet, if any? Which it should, because of the earth rotation.
"the target moving up and TOWARDS you" or "down and AWAY from you"???? You are at 1,000 yards....that will always be the distance regardless of what direction you are shooting. The rotation of the earth cannot make a target distance shorter or longer. I total understand the Coriolis effect he simply didn't explain it correctly.
So if the earth is in a constant rotation and if as you say that rotation stretches it.....when does it come back to 1000 yards? Because it would have to eventually or else the world would just keep getting bigger and flatter.
Well of course it does....the bullet once fired has to get closer to the target regardless of shooting east or west....that's a given...it cannot ever get further away....I am not even arguing whether 1000 yards is far enough to have the coriolis effect have an affect on the point of impact..... But lets get back to the original point....the man says as the world rotates shooting in one direction the target moves closer and the other direction the target moves away.....?????
I think that’s actually the Eothvos effect that’s being experienced. Coriolis would have an effect shooting north or south causing you to miss to the left or right.
My thought as well.
My thoughts too
My think also
Huh what they said 😎
I repeat my reply from 4 years ago...
*_Coriolis affects your north or south trajectory as well and he wasn't clear on that point. When you're shooting north the bullet will go left and vice versa to the south..._*
*_...which is the main reason those damn Yankees won the war! lol_*
*_So, what about north-west and such? North-west would be down and to the left, both about half the expected amounts of either straight on direction._*
Coriolis is the term and it is merely referring to the spin of the Earth. Which direction you're shooting in doesn't change the physics of it, it's the same effect.
To be sure there is some eotvos effect as well, but that is a _perceived_ gravitational effect and with a bullet that weighs 160 grains the difference of the eotvos effect over 1000 yards would be less than a millimeter.
Captain Price definitely watched this before shooting Zakhaev
This comment deserves so much more attention than it’s received in 2 years.
@@barefoot_fishing3187 😂
@@barefoot_fishing3187 SO MUCH MORE!! HAHAHA
🤣
I’m very happy to see this. Lucky he had little wind flags
I'll try and settle this for those reading the comments and wondering who knows the truth, who thinks they know the truth (that just ain't so), and who's on acid:
He is in fact showcasing the effect the Coriolis effect can have.....AND the Eötvös effect. The Eötvös is the vertical (elevation or "up") component that the Coriolis effect has on a moving object. Backing up a bit, to calculate the Coriolis force with relation to directions that make sense to a shooter at a point on the earth's surface (North, East, Up), you must compute the cross multiplication of the Earth's rotation vector with the velocity vector of the object traveling (note: an object must be moving relative to the earth's surface to experience Coriolis. It can't be stationary or geostationary/floating). When you do this calculation, for a given latitude, and a given flight time (which can be estimated based on muzzle velocity and distance), there will be an expected push on the bullet to the right in the Northern Hemisphere, and to the Left in the Southern Hemisphere. This push is pretty much constant at your given latitude, no matter what direction the bullet is traveling. What DOES change depending on direction, is the "Up" push of the Coriolis force, which is also known as the Eötvös effect. So.... because the dude is trying to showcase the Coriolis without having to drive or fly several hours to change his latitude, he changes direction E to W, knowing that the bullet will be pushed up and down respectively (At Gunwerks Wyoming they're at about 43 degrees of latitude, and for 1000 yards, at an estimated muzzle velocity of 2800fps, I calculated about 4.8 inches of deflection up to the east, and down to the west). Props to him for trying to keep all other variables constant, like distance, gun, bullet, and environment. And, I guess in Wyoming they say CoriAlis.
Jk, this is all bullshit, the earth is flat.
Yeah, Wyoming! I plink at trash cans-1300 yards...(1903 30.06 sporterized) this is awesome! Didn't know about the up and down. I studied meteorology and atmospheric science, and the coreolis effect. I just learned something new... i thought there was always a right "drifting" of the bullet. In an ideal world high pressure would run straight to low pressure-due to the coreolis (in n hemi) however, high pressure systems spin clockwise, low pressure systems anticlockwise. As a rule of thumb, find the direction of upper level cloud travel, line up looking down their path, low pressure center is 90° to your left. Awesome vid! Makes me want to get out there!
Thanks for clearing that up at the end
It's flat, it does not move and retrograde motion is bull shit to, and il burn anyone at the stake who sez otherwise! 🔥
How comes snippers, hunters and the armed forces don't make these corrections before firing over long distances but always hit their targets?
Maybe the scope on this person's riffle is off... or... maybe the scopes for all the riffles used by snippers, hunters and the armed forces in the world - ever - are off to such a degree that they coincidentally happen to be corrected perfectly for this 'theory' to appear plausible on its own? 🤔
Sounds like a long explanation for a simple answer the world is not spinning. We don't live on a ball.
“Keep in mind variable humidity and wind speed along the bullet's flight path. At this distance you'll also have to take the Coriolis Effect into account. ” - Cpt. McMillan
Altitude as well.
shoot the helicopter.
I was hoping someone would comment this
Legendary comment
I love it when he said "Coriolis Effect"
I have been such an idiot. Here I go paying for plane tickets when all I had to do was get up 3 feet in the air and wait for Europe to come to me.
raztubes This concept is the same as why a flight from Europe is hours longer than the same flight to Europe.. Try walking up the down escalator lol
raztubes The jetstream has little effect at 3ft,, dude!
kdmc40 No shit, Sherlock. But it does have an effect on the duration of transatlantic flights; which is what the poster I replied to was talking about. Keep up, dude.
Your body in relation to space is rotating with the earth at the same speed, if you had a way to levitate in a fixed point you could wait for Europe to come to you... but remember that we are orbiting the sun too.
So, a hot air balloon?
Iv'e been shooting through scopes for some time and account for everything down to the nearest fart. Never once accounted for the coriolis effect, I hit my targets.
Yep that's because the Earth doesn't spin at 1091 miles per hour. This guys paid shill or dumb. Only one video on the subject I keep getting. 5 millitary manual's on sniping in my phone and non account for this fake spin. Imagine trying to shoot East the target would run from you 1091mph at eqautor . Easy way to tell this is a lie. Shoot 1000 yards to the west and same to east ,then north, then South. Shoot a bell or metal. Have someone time it. They all will vary only puny split second apart and that is against wind obviously. RUclips , michealson and m Morley, michealson and Gale, aires failure. Theirs like ten others that price we don't move. They don't teach these in high school or collage. Also Google or RUclips government admit the Earth is flat and stationary. Let me look they sensor this heavily now.
Here's proof he lies. ruclips.net/video/CR3Fsj3-uYU/видео.html
@@charleysturbos7320 Lol the best part about this video is that you have to trust that the guy in this video is doing what he says. He doesn't show his work, we have to take his word on how far he is shooting, what direction, and what the wind is doing. we also cant see where he is aiming nor what kind of a shot he personally is.
+Nick: All that proves is that there are a whole pile of irrational dumbasses who own guns. YOU THINK!!?, lol. And that, like +charlysturb, there are a lot of people who own guns who are marginally mentally ill and/or do drugs. I too own guns, and for a LOT longer than you have. Done lots of shooting. There is nothing you or I do at a range that will prove or disprove coriolis.
All you are doing here is the standard flatter "proof": If some effect is so small it cannot be seen, it doesn't exist. Obviously no proof of anything, my friend.
Hey genius. You have never done precisely the test the guy did in the vid, at 1000 yds, correct?? You have done some shooting at targets though. Say, you sighted your rifle in at 300 yds. How are you at that range, at that spot, shooting at targets, like you do, EVER going to prove coriolis one way or the other? You cannot. The point is, at the ranges you shoot, and the way you shoot you cannot demo anything anyway.
And finally, with this level of irrationality, it is probable you shouldn't be messing around with guns.
@@37rainman You make no sense. Other than insulting your basically saying theres no real way to see if the coriolis effect is real or not. You proved no point let alone have a point.. People have confirmed kills at a mile away. You think they had to account for the coriolis effect? NO
To everyone saying "It's not Coriolis, it's Eötvös!", this is just splitting hairs. Yes, it's true that in some applications the Coriolis force refers only to the horizontal (wrt the surface of the Earth) component of the cross product -2m(omega x v) and the vertical is called the Eötvös effect. However in general "Coriolis force" refers to the entire cross product. I've never come across a mechanics book that makes the distinction between the two components (most never mention the Eötvös effect by name).
Good point
What exactly do you mean by horizontal and vertical?
Agreed.
@@Manudyne left or right vs up or down.
@@pentallica893
Not accurate though.
The Eötvös is the effect of different centrifugal forces "strenghening or weakening" gravity and coriolis is conserved momentum. The bullets were displaced vertically from Eötvös effect and horizontally from coriolis simultaneously.
Minor correction from your friendly physicist:
The bullet will still rotate with the Earth, but not at the same rate. Angular momentum must be conserved, so as the bullet moves across the surface of the Earth and changes altitude, this affects the relative angular velocity of the bullet compared with the surface and thus all objects connected to it.
you're right, but it's not a minor correction... the guy in the vid is completely wrong
Because everyone knows you can hover in a helicopter and just let the earth move under you. Saves fuel.... GTFOH
I'm bored so I did some math to see how far off a bullet would be if it just flew off into space like the guy said at 0:45 (I know he said "in lamen's terms", but it's more fun to take his words literally lol)
Let's say you shoot a half mile (almost 1000 yards). A 300 winmag will get there in about .8 seconds. If you stood at the equator and shot south, the bullet would move sideways going west at 1000 miles per hour (or 1525 ft/s) and be like 1500 feet off target lmao.
Not to mention the Earth also rotates around the Sun at like 67000 miles per hour, and the galaxy rotates at 130 miles per SECOND. Then you start getting into weird concepts like how do you even tell the speed of something in the universe if nothing is standing still.
If I'm understanding you correctly, the real "Coriolis effect" happens because the angular velocity the bullet inherits at the altitude of your barrel is slower than it would need to be to keep up with the Earth's angular velocity during the portion of the arc where the bullet is higher than it was initially, right? So if you were to somehow turn off gravity and shoot perfectly parallel to the ground, the bullet wouldn't drift sideways at all?
This explanation is wrong. Coriolis effect does not effect a bullet east west, only north south. The Coriolis effect comes from the Change in relative speed of the earth, relative to an object in motion above it. As a bullet fired north from the equator flies, it is travelling both north at 3000 feet per second, and east at 1500 feet per second, a target north of the equator is also traveling east, but at a slightly slower speed, since the bullet is moving both north and east, but east faster than the target, it will, in the same time, travel further east than the target does while in air, striking to the right. In reverse, if you fire from the slower moving target south towards the equator, the target at the equator is moving faster east than the bullet, so it the bullet fired this direction will also strike right. When firing from the equator south, the bullet is traveling east faster and will hit left (in both cases, when firing from a faster moving point on earth, to a slower one, the bullet strikes further east, when slower to faster, further west.)
When firing East / West, a different thing happens, the shooter and the target are moving at the same speed. So when in flight, the target does not actually move up and towards the bullet, when firing west, or down and away when shooting east as depicted in the video. This is just plain 100% false, not arguments about it. Something else is happening to cause the results shown above. When firing east, the bullet is moving in the same direction as the earth, so, relative to the center of the earth, it is moving at a higher degree of rotation around the fixed point in terms of degrees per hour. This causes a greater amount of centrifugal force, which "slightly" counteracts the effect of gravity, essentially making the bullet "lighter" and it will follow a flatter arc, causing a higher "hit". When firing west, the angular velocity or speed of rotation around a fixed point is lower, causing less centrifugal force, and allowing gravity to take more effect, essentially making the bullet heavier, causing a lower hit. This is the Eotvos effect, something tangentially related, but different than the Coriolis effect.
***** The earth moves under the bullet either extending the flight time or reducing it. this causes the bullet to impact higher or lower on the target.
Tom Codie No, I does not. ^This is just plain wrong. The earth does not move under the bullet any more than it move under you when you jump up and down on a trampoline. When at rest the bullet it is moving with the earth relative to space, but is stationary relative to the ground. As long as the relative speed of the ground below the bullet does not change, as it would when traveling north or south from the equator, the earth's movement is essentially canceled out of the equation because it is a constant. The effect shown above is the result of Eotvos effect and is a result of centrifugal force.
***** Right i corrected myself later, please try to keep up.
The equator moves at a higher velocity than the poles. So if you shoot north from the equator the relative ground speed at which you leave the barrel is, keep the demo simple, 1000mph as you move further north the relative ground speed slows down but you the projectile do not because the last time the earths rotation affected your relative velocity was when you felt the barrel. hence if firing north the bullet moves to the right. If you are firing south from the north pole the relative velocity would increase and you would still move to the right. Now shooting east and west is a bit more complicated but in essence a bullet will try to fly away from the center of rotation when moving with the rotation and towards the center of rotation when moving against it.
Tom Codie Tom, this is exactly, exactly the same thing that I said. The "trying to fly away from the center of rotation" is centrifugal force, which is slightly greater when firing east, so the bullet escapes gravity a bit more, and is slightly less when firing west, so it is pulled down a bit more.
***** Right, i am agreeing with you. we are just talking past each other. In the video his explanation is correct the terminology is wrong. Which really only matters to a very few people.
in this case accuracy would be affected left to right if shooting north and south.....right?
My thoughts exactly...
MedicXDm ,No ; North/South the rifle, bullet, and target are all moving together relative to each other. East/West the bullet exits the rifle at a specific point in the arc of earth's rotation as the earth continues to rotate towards or away from the point of launch.
ThisISREALLYDumb probably not significant enough to notice unless you were at one so the poles. That would be a highly unlikely scenario.
How about this... would the deviation east to west be greatest at the equator, the same or least?
+ThisISREALLYDumb
I'm impressed. You're the only person I've "met" on RUclips who really understands Coriolis. Especially the bit about how there is no effect when shooting north/south at the equator. Almost no one gets that, even after you explain it to them.
right but just how there is very little effect while shooting north/south at the equator, there is NO effect from Coriolis while shooting east/west no matter where you are.
What if I told you that you can make gun videos without rock music.
mind. blown. :D
Texas would tell you to fuck off 🙄🤣
@@dickjohnson8636 Tell Texas to fuck off. The rest of us have grown past the age of 14.
you are stupid as shit hahaha
Bruce Evans what does that have to do with rock music?
You are correct about the bullet impact due to the Coriolis effect. The science is with you. Disregard the contrarian comments. If you had said Eötvös effect, you would also be correct, because Eötvös effect is a special case of Coriolis effect of a projectile motion only in the Earth's latitude direction. Good luck.
Coriolis effect does not occur when shooting east-west. That is Eotvos.
Eotvos is simply the fact that shooting with/agaisnt the spin of the earth will effect its velocity relative to someone watching from a stationary spot in space (on the surface of the earth the velocity seems the same). It is this velocity from the perspective of a stationary spot in space which will determine the bullet drop, because earths gravity doesn't care about our perspective on the surface.
Coriolis is North-South. If you are on the north pole, your angular velocity is small. But if you are on the equator it is large. If you try an shoot from the north pole to a target on the equator you'll miss.
You are 100% correct.
What about shooting NE or SW or something. I have yet to seen any real world circumstances where the target happens to be exactly north, south, east or west.
LordDakson the more you are aiming N or S the bigger the effects gets. Technically it starts as soon as you deviate 1 degree to N or S, but then the effect is very small. I guess the effect grows like a sine function with respect to the degree of deviation
I looked up the Eotvos Effect and it seems to do with the resulting felt force of gravity comparing east to west moving objects. Or: "a phenomenon in which two objects, one at rest and the other moving relative to the earth, have different values of the acceleration of gravity at the same point." So, I would like to see more of how the curving earth will raise or lower a target and it's point of impact by the eastward or westward moving target. It certainly will not effect the mainstream citizen as they will not be doing TOO much hunting at 1000+ yards or defending self and home at those ranges either.
44sharpshooter You are right, and Sphere is right. Think rocket physics (which is much easier to think about in terms of objects in orbit rather than objects on the earth's surface.) The power of gravity remains constant, however the velocity affects the path of the object around the sphere. When an object is in orbit, it does not use any fuel to maintain its orbit. Its velocity is instead at the right speed and direction that when the force of gravity pulls it towards the center of the sphere, it cannot pull with enough force to bring it down, only to bend the path into a never-ending circle. If the speed decreases in the direction of orbit, the force of gravity doesn't increase or decrease, but the speed that pulls the object away from earth is lower, therefore the arc returning to earth is sharper. If the speed in the direction of orbit increases, the speed pulling the object away from earth also increases, so the arc returning to earth is more shallow.
A bullet flying around the Earth is similar, except with near instantaneous changes in speed, and a starting speed equal to the speed of the Earth rotating at that point. So, when the bullet is fired against the rotation of the Earth, that is like an object in orbit lowering its orbital speed. When it is fired with the rotation, it is like increasing its orbital speed. Most planes and cars don't travel fast enough to really show any effect here, since orbital velocity is damn near 18,000 miles per hour, and even at the equator, the Earth barely tops 1,000, a speed fast enough to make you feel maybe a pound ighter at the poles than the equator (and faster than the speed of sound, but the air travels at the same speed, so no sonic boom), while cars and planes have land speeds slower than sound (most of the time). A bullet from a rifle, especially one that can accurately hit a target over a thousand yards, actually has a muzzle velocity closer to 2,000 mph, meaning that firing at the equator, the bullet actually has an initial "orbital" speed of 3,000 mph (1,000 + 2,000) in one direction (west to east), and an initial orbital speed of 1,000 mph (1,000 - 2,000, since its fired against the speed of rotation) in the other direction (east to west). Since one is 3 times the orbital velocity of the other, and even the lower one is 1/18th true orbital velocity, then if there were no air resistance to slow it down, the two would have drastically different arcs. Even with air resistance, the arcs are different enough to cause a noticeable drop over distances as small as even 500 yards.
tl;dr, but still mind blowing... imagine if you launched a rocket exactly straight up at the equator, so that when it reached orbit, its orbital speed would be exactly the same as our rotational speed on the surface of the Earth. When it finally reached orbit, it would be one million miles up, 1% of the distance to the sun and almost 5 times farther away from the earth than the moon, and while we would travel all the way around this pretty spinning marble every 24 hours, that rocket would make one complete orbit of the earth in more than 270 days. Meanwhile, a rocket orbiting the earth at the equator at the same speed as a bullet fired to the east would be only 130,000 miles high (a little more than halfway to the moon,) and orbit the Earth once every 11 days. THAT is the difference the speed of a bullet makes.
Actually the Coriolis effect is active when shooting north and south because speed of the equator is spinning fast than a point closer to a pole because it covers more distance in a certain period of time because the radius of the circle it rotates with is larger. So when you are shooting northward the target is moving slower than the eastward momentum of the bullet so the bullet will hit to the right of the target. Shooting south ward the bullet will hit left.
Sean Kyle B. someone understands at least, this whole video got it wrong lol
even then, when you shoot from 1km below the equator to a target 1k above the equator it shouldnt make a difference, right?
Cause bothe the shooter and the target are same distance from the equator and thereby moving at the same speed.
Same should apply to the north and south pole.
Not correct, you will hit to the right whether shooting to the north or the south if you are located in the northern hemisphere. The reason is because when shooting south, the target is moving faster than the shooter, so it moves left faster, which means you hit right of the target.
Respectfully… This comment is incorrect as worded… In the Northern hemisphere, horizontal deflection due to Coriolis is always to the right relative to the shooter and always the same amount to the right regardless of shooting direction. In the Southern hemisphere it is always to the left relative to the shooter. The amount of horizontal Coriolis deflection is greater at the poles, lesser at the equator so to calculate horizontal coriolis deflection you need your latitude but you don’t need your azimuth of fire.
Vertical deflection due to coriolis is different… anywhere on the earth it is zero when shooting due north or due south… and is maximum up shooting east and maximum down shooting west. So vertical coriolis depends on both latitude and azimuth direction of fire. Vertical coriolis deflection is zero at the poles and maximum at the equator.
Unfortunately, the majority of the civilian shooting community has coriolis understanding wrong in one way or another… but fortunately the aviation and meteorological communities have it right… if they didn’t, airplanes would not arrive at their destination. The military artillery guys are definitely on point with their understanding of coriolis effects on projectiles.
A good way to help people visualize the Eötvös Effect is to think about orbits - if you're orbiting the planet at a very fast pace you'll start to leave the earth and if you stand still you'll plummet towards the earth. Shooting with the earth's rotation increases the bullet's orbital speed relative to the center of earth mass (helping it exit the earth's gravity pull) and shooting against it decreases the bullet's orbital speed relative to center of earth mass (making it harder to exit the earth's gravity).
In other words, we're constantly being spun around on the surface (centrifuge) which reduces our perceived gravity, just like the spin on a merry-go-round tries to make us exit its surface (albeit horizontally).
This is why your odds of getting pee on yourself if you pee into the wind while facing westward are better.
Ok that makes more sense thanks.
Most retarded & ridiculous foolishness I've yet heard, next to the gender pronoun lunacy
Fascinating - thanks! But what about north-south? Will there be a similar displacement, west of the bullseye, due to earth's rotation?
I was hoping for shots in all 4 directions too.
@@larryscott3982 I'm sure that I read somewhere about a snipers ballistic computer that used angle to target in its computations, so I'm assuming that there must be an effect. I'd just like to know for sure. I think these guys might know. Then I'll be able to sleep at night! rofl!
@@apxpandy4965
Coriolis correction for long range artillery is azimuth, latitude, and range sensitive.
I was curious if in his location it would be as apparent as E/W shooting
The Royal Navy in the 1890s developed a mechanical computer for long distance naval firing. In the First World War it was used to calculate the drop, rise and the Coriolis affect for the shells , over 20 miles and the direction of fire , also to compensate for the wind as well. Bombsight from high flying aircraft need similar correction.
Hi Gunwerks team, thank you for all the videos and information. Just a slight correction on your video/title, what you are referring to is the Eötvös effect which affects the vertical component of the bullet trajectory in your example, your example is otherwise perfect. The Coriolis effect will give you a horizontal deviation depending on your latitude, Ciao, L
You are so correct, Lancelot! Also, Coriolis Effect only effects objects traveling far enough and slow enough to experience the effect (like weather systems moving from South to North (in the Northern Hem.). Bullits are moving too fast and for too short of a distance to experience the "Effect."
Hi Kirk, nice to finally read someone who has an open mind and/or is educated on the subject. The effects of Coriolis "laws" (vertical such as Eötvös effect and horizontal such as Coriolis proper) are there all the time but as you mentioned, for short distances/fast bullets, the results are negligible. When you look at hitting a target over 1,000 meters, depending on your theater of operation: latitude, direction of flight to target, size of target, weapon used (cannon vs. bullet vs. nuke ;-)!... you start making calculations. The sniper team works that on their hand-held computer and charts. Ciao, L
+Kirk Crewdag Wow!
Actually, Kirk, snipers are adjusting for the coriolis effect. In long range shooting the bullet can deviate about half an inch roughly.
However, you are correct in that this video is about the Eötvös effect!
🖐🤗🤚 🖖 question. What about the other 2 directions do I need to aim a little to the left and a little to the right?
Yes ! Then you correct port or starboard
to make it easier just make sure to always take your 1000yd shots aimed due south from 500yd north of the equator
@@saleplainsI just laughed way too hard at that.
This is actually called the Eötvös effect. The Coriolis is a result of firing North or South.
Because of differences in rotational speed as you go further North or South of the equator, less ground is travelling under the bullet so it travels to the side.
I.E. A bullet fired directly North from the equator has an Eastern momentum of about 1,000-mph. If the ground below it is only rotating at 500-mph then the bullet will be travelling East at 500-mph making it appear to be travelling North-East.
Of course, the rotational speed difference would never be that drastic with modern weapons because a bullet would have to travel from the equator to about halfway across Greenland more than 5,000-miles away.
Despite the difference in rotational speed in mph, each part of Earth is rotating at the same number of degrees per hour, which is why if a person at the North Pole and a person at the equator could see each other through a telescope they would remain centered in each other's view no matter how much time passed.
This is basically a 3D representation of a fan blade. The outer edge of the blade has more distance to travel than the inner edge so the outer edge has to travel at a greater mph to maintain the same number of degrees per hour and hold its position relative to the inner edge.
Also, having read another explanation and after thinking on this one more, this doesn't make sense.
Why this explanation doesn't make sense: imagine a basketball-sized Earth in front of you with the South Pole facing you and the North Pole away from you. With an Eastern rotation the "top" of Earth is rotating to your right/clockwise. When firing East or West from the "top" of Earth the bullet wants to go in a straight line; however, gravity pulls that line down until it hits an object. In relation to that straight line's original point, yes, the East is rotating "down" from it and the West is rotating "up" towards it; however, that line is also rotating East with the planet so both the East and West targets should remain at the same relative elevation in comparison to the line.
Now for the other explanation: at the equator you are moving about 1,670-kph East. A .50-cal bmg has a mass of 42-grams and a velocity of about 4,680-kph. When fired West, the bullet is travelling 3,010-kph West so it experiences about 0.47-grams of centrifugal/upward force. When fired East, the bullet is travelling 6,350-kph East so it experiences about 2.09-grams of upwards force. The greater upwards force on the bullet when firing East results in less drop so it hits higher than when firing West.
How to butcher both the pronunciation and getting the definition/explanation wrong all in one vid.
Leave it to those 2nd amendment solution folks.
Every language has dialects. Maybe you should travel more...
well, if he had gotten his explanation correct, we'd be more lenient about having mispronounced it :)
follow up question, at what height do I need to hover above the earth for an hour and then return straight down and find myself a thousand miles from where I started. physics only please.
Sorry but that's not how physics works.
When you lift off from the earth you have the same momentum as the earth's rotation. SO you will continue moving in the same direction that the earth ws rotating. SO you will set back down in the same spot.
@@stuartgray5877 But the insrtuctor in the video just said that it does.He said at 1:10 that the earth rotates out from underneath the bullet after it leaves the gun or contact with the earth.
@@tammyhayden56 - "that the earth rotates out from underneath the bullet after it leaves the gun or contact with the earth.
"
But only if you shoot north or south.
Then the momentum of the bullet when it leaves the barrel will NOT match the linear rate of the ground as it moves away from the gun.
If you shot the gun straight up it will maintain the same momentum and hit in the same spot it was launched from (neglecting wind and assuming a perfectly "Plumb" aiming)
You need to stop your rotation on this merrygoround, but it will get 1000 mph winds, so wear sun glasses 🕶️
@@stuartgray5877 If the bullet is already moving with the constant speed of the earth then it is already in sink with the earth and no rotatation of the bullet is to be expected. Wind and atmosphere would be more of a factor at these ranges than some undetectable effect that practically no one allows for. You said that the bullet is independent of the earth when it leaves the the barrel only when shot north or south so how does shooting straight up make any difference if there is a rotation of the earth? If you noticed in the video this guy changed his direction and his point of origin by at least 6 feet when he turned the shooting table. That alone would give differnt impacts on target at 1000yds.
This is the Eötvös effect.
The Coriolis effect influences left/right curve. It will curve the bullet right in the northern hemisphere and left in the southern with greatest effect at the poles.
The Eötvös effect accounts for the drop difference east to west with greatest effect at the equator.
Wow someone knew this. Coriolis effect is N-S. Bravo sir.
That’s not correct at all.
Where did you get that idea?
The Eotvos effect relates to how the Earth’s rotation affects an object’s gravity
Head and tail wind will give at least that much variation, also the velocity variation from round to round could add to the wind effect and give even more elevation spread.
I'm with the wind on this week ass test,, feels dirty like myth busters,, no wind measurement equipment out there.
I too am wondering about the wind speeds on that day. Obviously it wasn't blowing but I did see the grass moving and the gunpowder smoke blow away rather quickly. Even a few knots of wind can cause several inches of drop. (depending on the load and its drop table)
@@lxxsxxx7845
Yes, Coriolis adjustment is your last concern, unless the conditions are pristine and the distance and flight time extreme.
The vertical effect on the bullet is called the Eotvos Effect. The Coriolis Effect is the effect on the horizontal movement of the bullet.
So if you are shooting East or West it affects elevation. Than when shooting North or South it will affect windage. Right?
No, it's a physics effect.
Yes it will affect the windage. Bullet would drift right in teh northern hemisphere and left in the southern.
+Rafael: No, the rt/ft veer is exactly the same no matter which direction the object is moving. This veer is caused by the earth rotating underneath a moving object. Obviously the earth is rotating under it whether it is moving north or east. Lol, also obviously a Foucault pendulum rotates the same no matter which direction it swings.
Large numbers of very intelligent sounding utube experts cannot visualize this matter, so they commonly make this error. One of these is Justin Green, and it would be interesting to know at what point he becomes embarrassed at some of the things he says.
It is very easy to visualize mathematically Coriolis in the north direction, and more difficult to visualize it in the East/west direction. This is what causes this mistake, which curiously has almost gone viral on utube.
Wouldn't the Coriolis effect cause lateral motion of the bullet if shot North or South? I know this isn't important in measuring drop.
Yes you're right
Is the corialis effect similar to the coriolis effect?
HA!
@@BFFsEngineer Cory Alice!
@@caatabatic Cory O'Liss, he's Irish. Or she. It. They/them. Whatever.
When we were shooting 4.2" Mortars and doing the calculations manually, Coriolis effect was an additional calculation if you wanted to be more accurate on the first shot. 81MM and 60MM did not have enough range to make a difference
Motars do not have a flat trajectory so I believe what you say. cheers
@@trickeydick5024 even "flat trajectories" have to correct for earth rotation. Parabolic paths have longer "hang time" so the effect IS greater.
Great post, for over the horizon (artillery) this is important.
For a line of sight weapon (rifle). Not so much.
I was in Afghanistan is 2006 10th mountain mortar team helped us out in Kandahar op Apollo smashed them we did a dm found mush legs and arms
@@stuartgray5877 The earth is flat. Guy can't shoot straight.
We understand these unseen forces in physics & probability. This is why we get as close to the target as possible. It is however valuable to know these no matter how minute they may be because it is very entertaining to bring these things up at a beer joint during hunting season.
I don't understand what he is saying at 3:47 Pretty stiff morage?
@4:25 I believe you forgot to divide by 2. Your total difference was 11 inches, but that's between targets that are 2000 yards apart. You only shot 1000 yards. So you can only take half the difference. So at 1000 yards, the effect is only 0.5 minutes.
Reminds me of Jeep people that say they went from 35's to 37's and got 2 more inches of clearance. Umm, No. The axle only raised 1 inch.
you are incorrect.
the distance from muzzle to target is still 1000 yards.
the same 11 inches would have shown up if he had put two target 1000 yards apart and set up shooting positions next to each target and faced the other one 1000 yards apart not 2000 yards apart from a central shooting location.
Hay one inch lift still gets them around town. Lol
We need wind measurement at 5 points on both sides, and elevation.
So the fact you're shooting on what appears to be uneven ground doesn't effect your calculations? The earth curves roughly 8 inches every mile, put that at roughly half a mile (1000 yards) you're at 4+ inches + the uneven ground would put you at the 8 inches off the center like you were. Your other shots were high like you said the coriolis effect would cause them to be, however, that could also be a result in uneven ground. Respect for the work but I wouldn't call this a legit experiment
How it AFFECTS!!! THE EFFECT IS WHAT AFFECTS...WOW.
youre are only confusing people who were already confused..
Lol I love you.
then the overthinker in me wonder... how about when shoot north to south and vice versa abit to the right and left ?
There's a small effect there too, since you are moving slightly faster the closer you are to the equator, the horizontal momentum applied to the bullet is slightly different than the speed that the target is moving. At distances over 1000 yards, it does have a small effect.
Do pilots take the Coriolis effect when landing?
How about if I hover in a helicopter 10,000 feet at the equator. Do I land 1,600 meters elsewhere in an hour?
I cannot answer on plane landings, but you would land somewhere else, if you were to hover in a helicopter for a long time.
+gateway833 Yes except people tend to forget that the atmosphere is also moving with the earth. When I jump, I still move with the earth and its atmosphere. It's like tossing a ball in a moving car, because the car is not accelerating, the ball, car, and air within the car move along with the car, the ball does not shoot to the back of the car at 60 mph.
@@gateway833 No you don't dumb fuck. The Earth is not a spinning ball.
If that were true all the planes going to Europe would fly opposite the Earth's spin to get there faster. They say the Earth spins at 1000 miles per hour.
@@gateway833 hahaha yeah right…earth aint spinning and you know it!
Pilots adjust trim constantly. Remember newtons laws. And remember, that you.. the craft.. the device you are measuring with.. the fluid you are breathing and flying in.. *are all rotating the same direction and speed.* Have you ever ran in a pool with a bunch of people (around the edge) making a whirlpool? When you stop running. You feel like you are in smooth water, but you are traveling around the edge of the pool. You can make short movements... but you are still traveling with that water. _This is what the Helicopter is doing too_
Air is so thick, that it weighs down on you.. at 14 POUNDS per square inch. Thats crazy immense. More like a liquid.
BUT.. you are thinking right.. the _difference_ in atmospheric density the higher you go.. has a huge impact.. just like 2 storm fronts moving at different speeds makes a tornado.. these different air layers (moving at different speeds due to altitude and density) is where we get hurricanes.
Youre on the right track.. just not considering all the variables. (or if you are a conspiracist.. you are dismissing variables because it would mean giving up the conspiracy)
So shooting North/South you aim left or right so the target spins into the bullet?
They just make stuff up. So sure
@@timsmith7351 In the northern hemisphere you aim left (west) shooting north because you are moving east faster than the target. Still in the northern hemisphere, you aim left (east) because the target is moving faster than you. In the southern hemisphere, you aim right for the same respective reason when shooting along a longitude line. But most people can't hit a man sized target at sufficient range for this to matter, particularly under emergent conditions.
@@digitalnomad9985 just shhhh you sound silly
@@timsmith7351 ND asked the question, I answered the question. Your opinion is surplus to requirements.
@@digitalnomad9985 the earth is still and motionless. You and your 5 senses know it, but your mind believes something that has no bearing in reality. It's infuriating to find out all that you are led to believe is fantasy. It'll take time. Good luck
what you explained is not the Coriolis effects taught in physics
Yes, it is. It also affects vertical moviments. Thins falling straght deviates from vertical. This is also call Coriolis.
The effect is the coriolis effect even though his explanation is was incorrect
@@erikydelauritsen3973 Coriolis Effect depends whether the object is in the northern or southern hemisphere. The effect explained in the video doesn't depend on that. Therefore, it can't be the Coriolis Effect.
@@rogernevez5187 .
If the direction of the movement isn't parallel to the axis of rotation, then the coriolis acceleration is non-zero.
That's about it.
Independent of north, south, east west, equator or hemisphere.
All this is simply semantics. Coriolis is simply the apparent displacement of an object as it moves over a rotating plane. The plane does not necessarily need to be parallel to earths surface. For instance, on the equator the object does not displace in the horizontal plane, but does in the vertical plane. Both cases are 4 all practical purposes coriolis,
Can group over water, no wind, calm sea at 12 - 1300 meters with consistency. Rarely over land. Thermals? 300 Win Mag I reload and fiddle a bit. Down Here, our concrete trucks and rifling spin the other way !! The Coriolis effect is important when throwing a Boomerang. Cheers, from Adelaide
Cheers mate, I hope you're all doing well down there 🍻
@@jegr3398 We are Trying our Best. Have a blessed day. Respect; Adelaide. S.A.
are the elevations at both target location equal?
I would need to see wind measurement at 5 stations on both sides of this test. And we can go further out sat 2000yds in all 4 directions.
Why do I have this backwards? It seems if you are shooting east the target is trying to move further away and the shot would be low. If I were shooting west I'd think the target is approaching the bullet and it would hit high. This is reverse of what you've demonstrated.
Same here.
So, if your shot is Eastbound, your target is definitely moving away. Instead of picturing that your target is moving just further ahead; picture it as its on an atlas/globe/earth. Its moving away as its moving lower as well. So as its moving further and lower, your cross hair is now targeting the higher portion of the target.
For westbound, its the opposite. Imagine your target being on a globe. As it is moving close to yourself; its also raising in height. (Remember its on a globe). So if you had aimed your crosshair at the center of the target; as the target is getting closer AND RAISING; you shot will hit the LOWER portion of the target. I hope I was able to convey my point. :)
Banjo Playa Okay, THAT makes sense - I was thinking about movement but wasn't thinking about the actual curvature of the earth. Thanks!
The way the question is put together is the failure. The target is NOT moving toward or away from you. The target is effectively moving UP or DOWN not forward and backward.
Banjo Playa Great explanation. Thank you.
Is anyone going to point out that when he's shooting west 2:57 he's actually just shouting uphill and at 3:19 shooting east its just downhill.
Hector Lozada I was just gonna post this.
@Hector Lozada It's not quite that simple, although the effect is similar. In essence, when you shoot towards the East (either hemisphere), the movement of the earth 's rotation moves the target further away from the bullet as it flies. This results in a longer flight time, and so the bullet hit's the target lower in it's trajectory path, and so there is a low strike. And obviously the reverse when shooting towards the West. Shooting uphill or downhill is about the gravitational force not applying a full value to the bullets flight. Exactly like having a half value wind because it is at 45% to the bullets path, not at 90%.
@@andrewlongfield3102 it is simple. The effect in the video is that he is just shooting uphill one direction and downhill in the other.. Its easy to spot since I put the period of time in the comment so you can go back and forward and see the difference
@@andrewlongfield3102 The only thing shooters ever have to worry about when it comes hitting a target is wind speed and bullet drop. Based on how good the bullet Is some may have more FPS than others.
@@andrewlongfield3102 if this was true then every runway for airplanes would face east to west..
So If I understood correctly: the bullet travels through time and hit the target in another dimension. Right ?
"As you can see, every time I jump into the air, the Earth rotates out from underneath me and I can travel from Texas to Australia in just one giant leap for mankind."
+simon wyatt This was good, +1
+simon wyatt LOL!
+Yudha Krakata I wish you spoke English well enough for me to understand what you've just said, sadly I don't speak hee haw hee haw.
+Yudha Krakata go to bed.
+kidmosey so it's gone from a great joke to scoffing, incredible.
FYI: I dug this info out of my old scout sniper school notes.........General Reference: The earth circumference is 24,901.5 miles at the equator. The earth makes a rotation every 24 hours. The earth moves 1,037 feet per hour, 17 feet per minute and .28 feet per second. Rough estimate finger math for Marines that's 1 foot every 3 second (give or take). So if I bang out a .338 or .50 at 1500 yds and have a 4 second flight time muzzle to impact depending on my direction of shot my point of aim might move 6-12 inches before point of impact. This is rough math and differs based on where you are at and the direction your shooting and your elevation compared to target. A lot to compensate for in rifle shooting but artillery guys will probably understand quickly. Most rifle shooter will just shake their heads and fog over at this point but there are some ballistic nerds who really get into this for accurate shots and just a few more yds of range......like me..:) ANYTHING in the quest for that one perfect exact extreme long range "one" cold bore shot. Ohh Rahh Semper Fi!!
1093 miles per hour maybe how you got even feet?
Rd Dn Your correct, I had to go back and re-read my old notes. My apologies, I wrote them in the 1970's...:)
Its 1037 Miles of travel in 1 hour which is 17 miles per minute and .28 miles per second. So a 3 second flight time to target from muzzle the earth will move 3/4 mile in rotation again moving the target up or down based on direction. But again this is only a variable in extreme long range shooting.
+MrAzrancher show link to training manuals......notes LOL
scott merrow I have no "links" I have my old issue green military notepads with hand scrawled notes taken in field classes during the scout sniper course.......way before computers and ipads were ever thought of. I saved everything I have ever done shooting related as well as my manuals and books and find myself going back to them at times because good shooting data is always in style....:)
MrAzrancher
That's nice.....break out the notes and SHOW US...is there ANYTHING in ANY army training manuals related to "the Coriolis effect" published BEFORE flat earth became popular...say from the 30's or 40's or 50's or 60's? Did your teacher talk about this with you without referring to manuals? It should be easy for you to PROVE the armed services took this "effect" into account by showing exactly where it's talked about in sniper and artillery training MANUALS. I can't wait to see your PROOF that the military EVER took this "force" into account. Your WORD and supposed "notes" aren't good enough evidence. You'd think you would have SHOWN the notes up close and readable. How do you think other snipers would feel about you if they ever watched this video? This topic seems important enough for you to make a video about, so why not get the man who trained you to come on video and confirm he taught you about Coriolis and explain it further? After all, the number of "dummies" who think the earth is flat is growing daily...
Hullo, what about shooting northward and southward? not very clear.
The planet is still turning so look for shots to be left or right of your placement, wind of course also has to do with placement as well as humidity. Imagine what a shot at 2500 meters which have been done en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Hathcock
Amazing is the only word I have for that kind of shot.
The reason he did not go into North and South is because the Coriolis effect does not affect your shots in those directions.
Alex Cardosa The Coriolis Effect still applies when shooting North/South. This video is about bullet DROP. Shooting West/East will affect your medial grouping, whereas shooting North/South will affect your lateral grouping.
Shooting nort south would require leading left or right wouldn't it?
Yes
What's even more amazing is that guys with with a Swiss rifle from the fifties can shoot farther, with open sights , and they hit bang on no scope. No corialis no bs
If you always shoot at the same location in the same direction and you adjust your shots for there, yes you can disregard the effect, regardless of what you are shooting with.
This effect only becomes visible when shooting in different directions. Otherwise you will not notice that your sights need to be zeroed differently depending on shooting direction.
and no proof.
So if theres a rain cloud over atlanta, the rain should fall in Birmingham. Gotcha.
Shhhh. You're using logic and reason vs. "settled consensus Science"
Hilarious. To these globeheads, everything shows “coriolis effect” unless it doesn’t and then it’s “gravity”.
@@joeltunnah Oh, a flat Earther, awesome! While you're here, could you briefly explain what causes the line drawn by a Foucault pendulum to rotate?
What are you saying, Bob Knodel? You're picking up a 15° per hour drift? Oh, sorry, Joel Tunnah. Bob beat you to the punch. But you can still explain why, for the pendulum, the rate of drift depends on the latitude. (Well, you can't, because of too much density, but could you try, please? I'm getting some popcorn in the meantime.)
+Joel: Lol, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. I am sure your irrational idiotic world view is about you "believing in God", rather than you being insane. I wonder what God thinks about his best creation making such a fool out of itself?? All in some vain attempt to get Gods attention.
Attempts to get Gods attention is not going to ever work. You are obviously worshiping a religion, based on things you think you get out of an old set of books. Worship of religions, and worship of old books is not worship of God, and is indeed blasphemous. You are supposed to be witnessing the Gospel of Christ, but in witnessing this rubbish, you are causing any sane impressionable mind to reject your stupid message, and likely the real message along with it. You are making Christians look like morons to the world.
The fact is, there is not a thing in science today that conflicts with belief in God. But science surely DOES conflict with a whole lot of stupid religions dogma, and should.
Correction, it would be better for you if you were doing this because you are insane, rather than because you "believe in God.".
@@basedbear1605 Do you know what logic is? Think about his statement again and how logical it actually is.
This entire video is an excellent demonstration of the Corona effect, that 4.8% alcohol sure affects the brain after a half dozen bottles or so in quick succession.
How did you verify the altitude of the targets in relation to each other?
Not very relevant unless the elevations varied quite a lot. The difference would be somewhat proportional to the cosine of the angle off the horizontal. If one target were even 80 yds yards above the other, the angle would be only 0.25degrees. The cosine of that angle, 0.99999976, while the cosine at level is 1.00000000. No practical difference. This was not done for utmost exactitude, it was done for demonstration. But my complaint is that he did not do it several times. I fear that he may have, and then selected the one which he liked the best. That is not an honest experiment.
I would need to see wind measurement at 5 points on both sides. And elevation. I would like to see it done right with 5 5 shot groups in all 4 direction and wind data
What's he talking about, the earth is flat and doesn't move.
@4 :13 Illuminati confirmed
Geniooooooooo jajaja sos un maestro. tenes razonnnn 666 illuminati a full
The Coriolis effect *affects* bullets' trajectory; it doesn't *effect* them.
You are correct, of course. I guess the affect does have an effect. JK.
effect affect further farther. We need people like you to keep us on our toes!
We are not amused. JK.
swissgunner Language is ultimately an arbitrary opinion. It's funny you say it's not a joke when I laughed at that assertion about the Queen's english. To disagree is to misunderstand the nature of language and the evolution it constantly is going through, albeit slowly to our perceptions.
swissgunner what? The second amendment is guns. The first amendment is speech.
I’m wondering also we’re the two targets at the same height off the ground? It looked to me the first target was higher in elevation than second target.
I would need wind measurement equipment at 5 points on both sides also.
i remember traininng on the lee enfield 303 many moons ago and being told about this. Also somethng about the barrell twist to compensate for northern hemisphere?
Brace yourselves
People that know jackshit about physics are coming
hahahhaha
Brace your self the flat earthers are coming
The gods of physics do not permit violations of the laws whether anyone knows it or not.
+Haowei Shi u were right
Here you go: This is not Coriolis effect, that happens shooting south or north. This is centrifugal or something alike.
I just learned that also that you are technically lighter traveling east and airplanes are about .9% lighter when traveling east, quite fascinating
Solace2 Vsauce. That video also seems to contradict the existence of the Coriolis effect, but I'm obviously missing something.
different effect. the up/down movement shown here is not coriolis effect. if you shoot at a target to the due east, then the earth is spinning at the same rate when you fire as it is at the target, same if you shoot due west.
it's the same as thinking that if you jumped upwards on a moving train the train will continue on underneath you. no, you don't notice the train move ahead as soon as you jump because you are moving with the train at the same velocity.
@@jhanks2012 Inside the train or on the roof?
You are claiming Coriolis effect kicking in to a substantial amount at a (mere) 1000 yards? I am very skeptical. The wind, spin drift, and even atmospheric pressure are all going to be screwing with your POI versus your line of sight a LOT more than Coriolis is at 1000 yards, enough so that Coriolis is practically a negligible consideration compared to them. If you are pinning down Coriolis effect to this fine degree, then how much spin drift are seeing with this gun at this distance ?
At 1000 yards it is 2.125 inches up or down drift for a bullet at equator level flying 1.1s long. At lat 45° N the effect results in exactly 1.5 inch up or downdrift.
I agree that wind, temperatur, moisture, ... might have a bigger influence here!
and your altitude above ground, breathing and the myriad of other problems which face a real sniper
Quadrant14 All other issues are added to this effect. In many situation the shooter and his equipment produce much worser results than this effect is able to. Then it would be negligible, but it's still there.
The effect has no practical! impact for a pistol shooter at 10 Meter, it has small impact for a long range shooter but it has extreme impact for artillery, as they have a minimum of possible "shooters problems" and maximum ranges.
lupuszzz true I was speaking as a former Australian SF Sniper who did long range , high angle/altitude shots, so many factors my friend but in essence pistol is of nought impact, but for rocketry and Arty it is very very important indeed
Plugging in the numbers for the Coriolis effect in the worst case for up/down drift (worst at the equator), and assuming the bullet travels at 3000 fps, there would be EXACTLY (to within the number of decimals of accuracy shown) 10.47 inches total combined up/down drift between targets 1000 yards east and west. At a latitude of 45 degree (a bit south of Seattle), it would be EXACTLY 7.40 inches. Assuming the shooter was at a latitude more in the middle of the lower 48 states, his 8 inch estimate is spot on. As you head to the poles, the Coriolis effect starts to manifest itself in left/right drift. At the pole itself, the left/right drift would be the same value as the up/down drift at the equator. Unfortunately for the shooter though, shooting in ANY horizontal direction will drift
If they actually had to take the corialis effect into consideration with bullet trajectory they would have to take it into effect with planes landing also. A PLANE CANT LAND ON A RUNWAY SPINNING AT 1000MPH CAN IT?
It's called course correction
They do it all the time, so yeah.
Navin Johnson Everything is in motion. The plane landing at the equator is also moving at 1000mph to an relatively stationary observer in space. So there is no problem.
Bs, there is too much room for bias here. You literally just said that you shot at a mirage. The wind could have had strong influences on your accuracy, not to mention that nobody shoots perfectly. AND you only showed two targets. This experiment could not have been more bias. This prooves absolutely nothing. Funny how you say this affects bullet travel yet it literally has zero affect on planes. I find that to be hilarious.
The coriolis affect does in fact affect airplanes... it's cheaper to west to east.
That is due to the jet stream caused by wind not rotation.
If the earth is spinning, shooting against the rotation would just cause the bullet to fall to the ground (or at least greatly reduce range if the bullet travels faster than this supposed revolution), like throwing a ball out the back of a moving vehicle it just stops and falls.
THE DECEPTIONS ARE REAL, WAKE UP!
Christian Ewing
Look. All parts of the equation are valid as reasons for any variance found in your results.
If the wind speed, etc is relevant to shooting or flying. Then surely the other, less important, factors at play have just as much to do with variance as anything.
It's also true that this is an invalid test, as he simply shot rounds without the slightest regard for verifying the angle of departures.
Christian Ewing you must be one of those flat earthers?
It has alot of impact on planes. Due to their time in the air. Granted the changes are barely noticeable, in comparison to weather.. but it does happen. Like rotating a water bottle with something floating around in it.
1:03 hahahah as I jump up I'm leaving surface of the earth, that is spinning under me xD So all I have to do to travel west is just jump up, or better "get to the choppa" and just hover over spinning earth. Dude the gravity still affects the bullet (btw the atmosphere=air too) that is why it will eventually hit the ground and not fly into space.
He's right about hitting low/high, he just did shitty job explaining it.
No, man.
The bullet tends to follow a straight line because it has a initial velocity. The gravity has its role, but it is not the responsible for the effect we saw on the video. Gravity always curves the bullet down, not up. And the velocity of the bullet is different from that of the earth, so even under the effect of gravity, its trajectory will not follow the curvature.
From Physics, in the Circular Motion, the trajectory will depend on the centripetal force (gravity) and on the velocity. For example, sattelites only follow the curve of the Earth because of gravity, but it has to be at a specific velocity. That is not the case for a bullet.
The curvature of the eath has a drop of about 10 cm for 1000 m. That is the vertical correction for Coriolis on ballistic charts. Because when you shut, it takes a time to the bullet hit the target, but the target will move with the velocity of the earth in that time (depending on direction east-west).
Even a falling object deviates from vertical due to the rotation of the earth, and that is also call Coriolis Effect. So when you jum, you don't fall back at the exact point where you was, theoretically.
Actually 7.9 cm. But when we talk about the results of this shooting test we are talking about much more than how far the surface drops off the tangent at a given distance. Are you actually implying that that is all the calc is? The calc involves much more than that, for instance your latitude is going to be in the calc.
Of course jumping and shooting at incredible speed is the same thing, of course...
Wow! This video has been up for eight years and nobody understands how wrong it is?
Amazing how much bad information is on the internet. That's why it's better to read a book.
So hmmm... How does this effect windage shooting north/south then? And let's say for arguments sake you are right on the equator.
If you are on the equator shooting north/south, then there is no effect because the bullet would be traveling parallel to earth's axis of rotation
This is a good demonstration of a bad experiment.
Coriolis effect is most noticeable when shooting north or south. The explanation in the video is not correct. The effect is due to the fact that the surface of the earth is rotating faster at the equator than at any other latitude, as can easily be demonstrated by imagining yourself standing at the exact north or south pole, where your speed (relative to the center of the earth) is zero. That is why satellites are launched in an easterly direction at low latitudes. A rocket launched due east at the equator takes full advantage of the speed of rotation of the earth, requiring less thrust per pound to achieve the same orbit (see Sea Launch).
The Coriolis effect on a bullet is the same Coriolis effect that acts upon winds moving north or south from the equator. Winds (or bullets) moving north appear to turn to the east. This is because the wind (or the bullet) retains the angular velocity it had at the equator as it moves northward (law of conservation of angular momentum). However, the land under the bullet travels slower than the bullet the farther the round travels north, and so the bullet appears to turn east. Proper computation of Coriolis effect is essential for accuracy with long-range artillery and is well documented.
The Coriolis effect has no bearing at all upon the point of impact in the vertical direction. As a thought experiment to prove this, consider that when firing due east or west as in the example, both the shooter and the target have the same angular velocity at the instant of firing. There is no relative difference in motion of either the rifle or the target due to the rotation of the earth, since both are at the same latitude. This is equivalent to the case where there is no angular motion at all. If the earth stopped rotating, the relative speed difference between shooter and target would still be zero.
I suspect that if the same experiment were carried out in carefully controlled conditions, and that several hundred rounds were fired at least, the data would most certainly lead to a different conclusion from that propounded in the video. I suspect that the real cause of the results have more to do with human error in the hold, and a forgone conclusion (wishful experimentation). In fact, the effect of a zero-value full headwind or tailwind of only a few miles per hour could easily explain the results obtained when shooting at that range.
You are absolutely correct. I am a marine sniper and have never once adjusted for the "rotation of the earth" out to 1000. Artillery and other longer range weapons would need to adjust.....not a man behind a gun.
Absolute perfect description - unfortunatly I saw you comment after doing the calculations and writing my long comment ;-)
The statements about relative direction are true. A target to the east is moving "down" relative to a line between the shooter and the target. And to the west the target is moving "up" relative to that line. I think the question would be whether it's moving fast enough relative to the duration of the shot to make a noticeable difference.
My concern with the video is there seems to be as much variation within the grouping as there is from target center. I definitely think you would need more shots and more precision to measure this effect empirically.
Navel gun targeting solutions include the curvature of the earth, coriolis, and Eötös effect. Here is a much better explanation than I can give.
mathscinotes.com/2017/12/earths-curvature-and-battleship-gunnery/
And in a life or death situation when someone is shooting at me I sure would like the best shooting solution I could get to shoot back at them. I sure hope the ones shooting at me are using some flaturds calculations.
This is not the Coriolis effect.
Martin Klimenko since there is no such thing, you're correct.
unfuckingmaker The Coriolis effect is certainly real, but it only has to do with change in position North and South. The earth is spinning faster at the equator than it is at the poles, so things tend to "curve" when moving through the air North and South. It's even seen in air flow within weather, it's most certainly real.
Mark Vorndran no, it isn't.
unfuckingmaker. It's apparent that you don't even have a moderate understanding of Physics nor the scientific method. The good thing about facts though is that they don't change based on your opinion.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriolis_force
It might be Eotvos Effect that they are demonstrating here.
I flew 53s in the Navy so let me pose the question in a slightly different way. The surface velocity of Earth is about 1000 miles per hour due to it's rotation. If I wanted to fly 1000 miles west, couldn't I just pick up into a hover and hover for an hour. Then after landing an hour later, I would be 1000 miles west of where I started the hover This would be one fast helicopter wouldn't it at 1000 miles per hour? Everything that starts on the ground is moving with the surface of the earth including helicopters, bullets and people. We're all moving at about 1000 miles per hour. You would start seeing a difference with balloons over a significant amount of time compared to bullets but for the scope of this conversation, I hope I made my point. MC
8=====D
Alex Swaggsalot
my gosh. I hope never ride in ANYTHING you are piloting. Effing socialist.
Not necessarily, hypothetically it works but you would need to reduce the velocity of the plane or helicopter because when you take off you are moving at about 1000 mph, earths rotation, in reference to earth your not moving, but chose another reference point and you are moving with the earth, so once you reduce your speed to 0 mph from the non earth reference point, then you will eventually get there however, from the reference point of earth you will be moving at 1000 mph which is not hovering.
I think that would work if the earth had no atmosphere, but you have to take into account the atmosphere. It moves with the earth otherwise we would have 1000mph winds all the time. You don't move when on the surface because it is solid, but with gases you can move through it a lot more freely, so you would slowly move but not very much.
Go on a train traveling 100 mph. Jump. Land on the same place? Yes. You and the train have the same velocity. Now try this on a fast merry go round. Jump...oops you go off on a tangent. The merrygoround spins under you. It’s velocity is changing and you have the velocity (speed and direction) at the time of your jump. Rotation is different.
Your explanation is correct for another effect called Spin Drift hitting up or down. Coriolis affects bullets flying to the North or to the South, hitting left of right the target.
This guy has no idea what he's talking about and it shows.
@@ragnose1 No he's flat wrong [at the start at least ..didn't watch further]
@@redberries8039 what is wrong with what he's saying other than using the incorrect name for the effect?
@@camurgo It is to do with rotation, not due to the bullet 'not rotating' as it leaves the gun. That would be like saying you wouldn't be moving if you jumped off a high speed train. It's because the speed of rotation of the Earth increases as you move toward the equator.
I said he's 'flat wrong' and not mis-naming because as soon as he says 'bullet isn't rotating' he isn't talking about any real effect at all, since the bullet is rotating.
@@redberries8039 I understand, thank you for the clarification.
if your not on the equator of the earth, east vs west will not be simply higher or lower. there will be a slight left/right component as well depending on your location
I get 5 minutes to sight my rifle and 2 sighting shots on the mound. As my rifle is actually sighted for the target I do not worry about Coriolis effect. On the other hand if my first shot was my only shot I would do the calculation .
I wish you shot the targets at other compass directions so we could see what happens then also.
Shooting south to north, the ballistic would impact east of the aim point.
EOTVOS EFFECT!
north and south will also have an effect, left and right.
It will. But it's an up and down positioning not a left and right positioning.
TopherFM if you're shooting north the earth is spinning east, your round will drift west.
+Stefan F. Weirdly this is not true. Note that his shots drifted to the right both for East and West targets.
In the northern hemisphere, your shots always drift right, regardless of direction of fire. In the southern hemisphere they drift left.
The drift becomes zero at the equator and grows as you move toward the poles.
He is in Wyoming, U.S.A. I think, judging by the nothingness we see in all directions.
I just learned this today. Even though I just read some really good explanations of why, I still don't understand it. :)
bogushavis the east target might actually be in the direction of north- east in the video ?
@@stefanf922 If you shoot north the round will appear to hit further EAST. (In the US).
This is not a demonstration of the Coriolis effect.
Why not?
@@jeffhawkins420 I'm cutting at pasting this from another post because I doubt I could explain it any more succinctly.
*This isn't actually due to Coriolis, and he did not properly explain the Coriolis Effect anyway. The Coriolis Effect is due to a difference in the speed of rotation of the Earth at two differing points of latitude. The rotation speed of the Earth is greater at the Equator than it is at the poles. The Earth isn't rotating beneath the bullet. The rotation of the Earth is imparted to the bullet. Conservation of momentum. The bullet shifts because the Earth is rotating more slowly, or more quickly, at the destination latitude than the firing latitude.*
@@scale_e That makes more sense
He should have spun the earth 🌎 faster to really show it.
@@DANTHETUBEMAN Don’t be silly. The earth is flat, it doesn't spin.
Why are you schooling on Eötvös Effect that occurs in east-west shooting angles and calling it Coriolis which effects north-south shooting angles? Coriolis requires a windage change in aimpoint and Eötvös requires an elevation change in aimpoint.
Eotvos is another name for coriolis
@@jimsagubigula7337 You have been misinformed. It is best to get your information from a highly reliable source such as Lapua. Their opinion is as follows - Often the Eötvös Effect is considered to be part of the Coriolis phenomenon, but it is in fact its own separate phenomenon.
@@johnnybarbar7435 Yes, it is, but they both happen for exactly the same reason. Like, honestly, giving them different names is stupid
There is very good reason for them to have separate names. They are basically names that correlate to left right and up down corrections and calling it all the same would be like saying windage and elevation adjustments are the same. Written and spoken language is used to convey a specific thought and lumping both together muddies the waters of communication.
@@johnnybarbar7435 Hmm, from this perspective you aren't wrong. Although it's important for people to understand it's basically the same phenomenon. The math is the same
I just flip the Coriolis switch to off until I'm done shooting.
Don't do it you will mess up ally stuff,,, do you want another deluge, because that's how you get another deluge!!!
Finally something useful in my recommended.
Coriolis effect doesn't affect movements that are parallel to the equator.
Wrong. The Coriolis effect is not just north/south shots. The shots parallel to the equator, latitude, effects the the vertical impacts, the shots will be high or low, where as the shots that are parallel to the lines of longitude effect horizontal impacts, the shots will be to the left or to the right. The shots not parallel to neither longitude nor latitude will have impacts that are mixed in combinations. Good luck
@KKKn50cal I don't dispute the definition. The fact is, Earth is not flat but a spheroid and the bullet moves along the curvature of Earth. While the English word definition of Coriolis effect(force) is good, a mathematical definition is better. Namely: the Coriolis component is the vector cross product of 2 times Earth's rotational velocity and the bullet velocity. This means that when bullet is traveling in the east to west or west to east direction, the earth's rotational velocity is perpendicular to the bullet's velocity, because the earth's rotational velocity is along the spin axis, south to north direction. High or low bullet impact is confirmed by the shooter in the video. Some claim that the shooter demonstrated the Eötvös effect and they are correct. Eötvös effect is a special case of Coriolis effect when the direction of travel is only in east-west or west-east direction. I hope this helps. Good luck.
@KKKn50cal OK. I misunderstood your point of view when you cited the definition of Coriolis effect, which had little to no relevance to east-west and west-east shooting, in the video. I wish you no offense. Good luck.
The earth does not sit on its vertical axis upright but rather tilted to the left at the top and spins from West to East (left to right). Ignore the bullet moving but rather as static and imagine the target moving. So if you are shooting East the target moves away/lower from the bullet and from right to left. And if your are shooting to the West the target moves closer/higher and from left to right. Also if you are shooting North the target moves from left to right and away/lower. And if your shooting South the target moves closer/higher and from right to left. Does this make sense? Hope so....
Is he shooting on a level surface west and east? Sounds like BS to me.
Nolom Ebal Yeah I noticed that too. He doesn't seem to go in too deep into the specifics of his elevation relative to the targets, and if you use him and his table for scale, the first target is either on a hillock or in a basin of some kind. Second target seems to be fairly low to the ground.
+Anthrolithos over 1 kilometer a slow dip in elevation would have to be equalized by a small hill. It makes very good sense that one of them was on something like that, because the chances of getting level ground without one are much lower.
In this age it's easy to verify the elevation. There's all sorts of tools to do it. The simplest method I could imagine would be simply using a laser and a level. done. To think that he would be so incompetent not to do such a simple and critical thing is absurd.
How can the earth spin when it's flat? ;-)
+Craig Blackmer Well, frisbees are relatively flat, and they spin just fine. :P
+Anthrolithos yes, there seems to be a lot of controversy on this theory I don't shoot much at a thousand yards but I do at 400 so next time I miss at 400 I think I will use this as an excuse even if its not avaiable hypothesis. my shooting range is set up north and south so I don't know if I shoot north instead of South if the effect is the same but I'm going to say it is if I miss. unlike most people if I can blame it on something other than shooter error I will take advantage of that
First it's not the Coriolis effect but only the horizontal component known as the Eotvos effect, when shooting east/west. The surface of the earth (at the equator) is moving 1050 mph or 1540 fps. The bullet speed from Gunwerks info sheet is about 3100 fps. Firing East, with the rotation of the earth, these too are additive meaning the bullet is moving 4640 fps, and firing West, against the rotation, the bullet loses velocity and is moving at 1560 fps. This is based on the inertial frame of reference. Gravity is constant regardless of speed. At muscle velocity of 3100 fps, the bullet will take just over 1 sec to reach the target, either way. The rotation of the earth in 1 sec is approximately 0.292 miles. The earth's surface curves about 8 inches per mile, so in one second, the earth drops off to the east or rises to the west by 2.3 inches, that certainly is part of the error, but the rest lies in the difference in centrifugal force which fights the pull of gravity. This change is due to the inertial frame of reference speed of 4640 fps firing West, and 1560 ft firing East. Take into account the velocity of the bullet drops after leaving the muzzle and that air resistance is NOT linear. Now...is everyone thoroughly confused?
This is all figured at the equator. All earth variables will vary at different latitudes.
Are you serious? Is that true?
It doesn't matter, because the bullet sees the earth as a stationary reference.
Since we're counting on earth's gravity, the frame of reference is from a singular 3D point in spacial orbit so the rotational speed most definitely figures onto it.
@@borismikoyan3022 because it is stationary
Isn't the North / South direction even more important?
First line of google: _"The Coriolis effect is most apparent in the path of an object moving longitudinally."_
It should be like accounting for windage.
Yes, but he was talking about a drop chart where left or rigt deviation is neglectable.
Son of a Zombie Longitudinally = east / west
no, longitudinally = north/south. yes, for coriolis effect, it is north/south movement which is important. the effect due to east/west movement depicted in the video is mistakenly referred to as Coriolis effect but it is something else entirely
well what is it?
Eotvos effect
What I wanna know is if the toilet swirls in the opposite direction in Australia.
I Depends, Left or Right Handed toilet. Respect, from the Festival State. The City of Churches.
@@michaelpercival7981 Thank you. I learned of a new place:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelaide
Littlebit wrong on explanation of the Cori-o-lis effect there buddy... :P Never heard of this cori-al-is effect you speak of.
His definition of Coriolis is completely wrong. The bullet leaves the barrel with the velocity of the earth rate. This means that a notherly shot in the northern hemisphere will land to the right of the target, a shot to the south will land to the left. Coriolis tis why low pressure weather rotated counter-clockwise in the northern hemisphere.
Probably the most unscientific method way to measure a result done by someone who has no understanding of a subject that they have confused with another phenomenon
@Cooper Bradford Yes this is exactly what he is doing, but he knows that all the cool gun guys talk about 'Coriolis' , so he wants to be cool. Except that for his initial discussion of vertical dispersion when shooting either towards East, or towards West, he has things completely ass about. I bet you he has no idea about Eotvos effect at all, actually the vast majority of rifle shooters don't. There is actually a third effect that is even smaller which has to do with the diameter of the earth increasing till it hit's maximum at the equator, and which alters a gyroscopic precession force that acts on the bullet in flight. I have never seen this force mentioned in a shooting article, but it's part of what makes the equation very complex to calculate properly. You can usually tell as soon as they start speaking because they all fail to accurately and adequately define all directions and forces, and in doing so they confuse one thing with another. However I have noted, and I have had this discussion with a couple of well accredited shooting gurus, every explanation of the Coriolis and Eotvos effect (there is no actual force being applied, it is simply an observed effect due to being within the rotating system), quoted in rifle shooting, gets at least half of it backwards. I have actually spent months trawling through scientific articles on tracking weather systems (the main use for the equations), and artillery theory (because by and large every article I have ever found written by a shooter has parts that are not just inaccurate, but they are actually incorrect, a different thing entirely). My mathematics isn't strong enough to follow the equations through (didn't do 3 years of pure mathematics at university), so I have never found the actual source of the error, but my best guess is that at some stage in an early article on rifle ballistics (ie, in the 30's, or 40's), someone inadvertently moved a value from one side of the equation to the other, hence giving the inverted data that so many well researched rifle ballistic documents quote. My guess it was a well intentioned, and probably knowledgeable rifle writer trying to make sense of transposing meaningful data from a complex article on calculating artillery flight paths, where the theoretical math equations were too complex for him to follow and understand properly. In no way am I having a go at this person, because, as I said, I've spent months dragging through scientific papers, and increasing, what i realize is that i am not understanding the whole thing. If you don't have a good working understanding of the way the equations work, then you can't understand what each part, or value does, and so I can completely see where it would be possible to leave seemingly unimportant bits out for the sake of simplifying things to a level where ordinary folks can have a chance of understanding things, but in doing so you actually leave a critical cog out (because you don't understand the importance of it's function), and the equation becomes reversed for one set of values. I constantly hear the reversed deviations given for East-West shooting, and often reversals given for shooting in the southern hemisphere, although sometimes both hemispheres are given with reversed values, and sometimes reversed values are given when the direction of shooting is changed from North To South. The one thing I have never actually found in a rifle article, blog, clip etc, is a complete set of correct directions/ deviations quoted. That's pretty weird isn't it. The clearest way to refute these reversed values is to have a hypothetical bullet path that has it's origin point in the Southern hemisphere, traveling along a path towards the North, and observe (hypothetically), what happens to the bullets flight when it crosses over the equator as it travels along it's flight path. If directions of divergence changed from Northern to Southern hemisphere, then this hypothetical bullet would be swinging perhaps towards the West while traveling in the Southern hemisphere, then once it crossed the equator into the Northern hemisphere it would in order to 'obey' the law of this particular system, need to instantaneously reverse it's direction of horizontal deviation (swing), to the East. Obviously no real physical system can do this because the physics involved would actually not obey the laws of physics, like conservation of momentum, where a body traveling in a certain direction will continue to travel in the same direction unless-acted on by an external force. This brings us neatly back to the point where we said that this is an observed effect, there is no actual force being applied to the projectile. In fact, at all times regardless of observations (restricting the discussion to theoretical observance of pure Coriolis/ Eotvos effects, within a frictionless frame, also unaffected by gravity), the projectile conforms to a completely straight path. Any deviations are observed only, not actual. So simply, the bullet cannot turn one way, then turn the other as it crosses the equator, which it would have to do if directions were reversed from one hemisphere to the other. In fact the supposed change from curving leftwards, to curving rightwards, if you reverse your shooting direction from shooting Northwards, to shooting Southwards, is in this case just a visual trick. The direction of East-West dispersion when shooting along a North South axis (facing either direction), is ALWAYS towards the West. The reason for this is that the earth rotates in the same direction regardless of which direction you are facing, or which hemisphere you are standing in when you take the shot. And because both the Coriolis effect, and the Eotvos effect are related to observations of a projectiles flight path observed in relation to the spin of the earth, then for all these values it's easy to see that East-West dispersion from a North-South trajectory can only ever be to the West, and a projectile fired towards the East will only ever strike low, just as a projectile fired towards the West will only ever strike high regardless of which hemisphere the shot is taken in. There are other complex forces taking place, but their values compared to environmental values (wind, temp. pressure humidity, etc.), are extremely small and for shots where the flight time is under a couple of seconds, they are pretty much irrelevant. For a 300 WinMag at 1000m, at a temp of 100F, the horizontal dispersion when firing on a North South line is something like 0.08 inch. In all honesty, when it's common enough to have a wind value that can be 20 inches, or larger for that flight time, I cannot see how anyone can observe the actual dispersion caused by Coriolis. Obviously it can be calculated, but i think that anyone who says they can see the dispersion from the Coriolis effect is kidding themselves, unless they are shooting at extreme ranges (2500+), or with a very slow round, or combination of both. Even then values will never be large and are likely to be in the order of 100th magnitude of the winds value. There was a thumbnail on the right hand side of this page for a channel called Mark and Sam after work, where Mark is shooting a 375GIBB out past 5000yards. I've chatted to Mark on this subject (fellow Aussie), and they are great guys and very knowledgeable about all this stuff. I can tell you that he calculates Coriolis effect for these distances, and that it would be a large enough value at these ranges to affect accuracy, but he still explains Coriolis in a way that gives an inverted value for some directions, and I have seen time and time again, first shots at extreme ranges that can be off the target by a couple of target widths (they spot hits as 1 target high, 2 targets right, etc, using the target dimension as a measurement), and then Mark walks his shots onto target by adjusting his point of aim (hold off point often at that range, as a single click on the turret could be 3 target widths), and sending another projectile down range. Realistically a value of '2 targets left', which is then interpreted as being slightly off on the wind doping, could just as easily be an inverted Coriolis value, it's probably about the right value for the sort of ranges they are shooting at, but there is absolutely no real way of verifying if it is an inverted Coriolis value, or an incorrectly judged wind value. If you reversed the Coriolis value, and took the shot again, you're just going to offset the impact point against the wind value again anyway. For real world rifle shooting, I honestly think that Coriolis is probably just a bit of a waste of time to bother calculating, especially if you can 'walk' the shot onto target. Where first shot cold bore hits matter at extreme ranges, then either make sure you're calculating the value correctly, or what's probably easier, learn to incorporate it in your wind doping, so that it becomes instinctive. To hit anything at those extreme ranges anyway, you need to virtually be shooting every day, as the skill set for evaluating environmental inputs and giving them a usefully accurate estimated value, is extremely perishable, and would erode very rapidly if you stop shooting, even for a couple of days, or a week. Sorry if I've banged on a bit, it sounded like you actually know something about this stuff, unlike most internet commenters, and i thought some of my conclusions might interest you. Also apologies for long winded technical nomenclature, but it is just so easy to get wires crossed as to what is actually meant unless you use complete definitions, and then everyone winds up thinking everyone else is an idiot.
@@andrewlongfield3102 wall of text confirmed.
+Andrew: With all due respect to your tedious manuscript, you are wrong in some things. The 0.08 veer you assert for a Win300 Mag at 1000yds would be one. You suggest you aren't great at the math. This can be very closely accomplished with some relatively ad hoc math. But quite obviously your visualization of the problem is not too strong either, and basically that is the biggest thing in conquering this problem. Or any problem as Einstein pointed out.
Lets assume a shot that takes 1.4 second, at the 45 latitude I live on. The veer to the right due to coriolis would be a tiny bit under 2 inches. That is a whopping 25 times than your "0.08 inches". (-; Do I REALLY need to calculate that for you? The exercise would be good for you to tackle.
But the thing that really makes us smile is your naïve assertion that 'the E/W dispersion of a N/S shot is always to the west, no matter whether which direction you face" really DOES take the cake! In the N hemi, the veer is always to the right. So shooting N it veers E, and shooting S it veers west. If you do insist that it always veers to the west, your visualization of the issue is really infantile.
Fact is it will veer to the right no matter which direction you are shooting at all, but it seems like basically all the utube "experts" seem to fail on that concept.
So if you do not even have such simple concepts in hand, you should really not be presuming to teach on this subject.
But hey, thanx for your effort.
I'm wondering if it would be possible for the force of gravity to cancel out the eastward Coriolis effect? Would there exist such a distance of shooting that would cancel out the impact area of the bullet so it would land right on the target? To clarify, since gravity would lower the impact area under the target, and the eastward Coriolis effect would raise the impact area of the target, wouldn't there be such a distance from where the sniper shoots that would make this possible?
No, gravity is always much stronger than this effect.
The explained mechanic of coriolis-effect is wrong here. The bullet is still confined to the earth's reference frame by the atmosphere. This would be called "wind" or air drag. Coriolis-effect really is an effect of the earth's curvature. Places near equator are spinning with faster velocity than those closer to the poles. The bullet retains the amount of sideways motion of the place where it leaves the barrel and drifts eastward when shooting away from the equator (to the right when shooting north, left when shooting south) and westwards when shooting towards the equator. The effect is stronger at the poles (you shoot almost in direct angle to the axis of rotation) and extremely weak at the equator.
Interestingly the down- up- effect is the most pronounced at the equator.
Vsauce just did a video on it. For me, at least, it was a good explanation.
MVHiltunen , actually No, he bullet path is always straight with the exception of windage, drag and gravity drop. Tossing a ball between two convertibles driving down the highway does not cure the path of the ball, it travels in a straight line from one moving target to the other moving target. Just ask Albert Einstein. Cheers,
samesaw Well yes that is true, but my point stands also. The path of the bullet is straight but the path of the earth isn't. If your convertibles are driving directly east (or west) at the exact same speed, one of them will gain slowly, since the the path around the world is different in length at different latitudes. One convertible gains slowly, and you have to throw the ball in angle accordingly; hence coriolis effect.
samesaw Essentially: what you described stands for two cars driving at parallel straight lines. At Earth's surface, this is never the case.
Why do people think this is a real thing? Simple math shows that if you were at a spot on earth that was spinning 900 MPH (15 miles per minute/.25 miles per second) and you had a target to your North or South, you'd have to adjust a quarter mile to the west for just 1 SECOND of bullet travel time. Nobody does this because it's laughably absurd.
You'd have to apply it to anything that leaves the earth's surface, which means helicopters/blimps could never hover or they'd lose their position, sports would be hilarious to watch as a golfer has an average drive hang time of 6 seconds which would give make any North or Southward shot travel 1.5 miles off course. This is serious brainwashing that's been going on for generations.
The target at the West looked like it was sitting at much higher elevation.
That is your imagination. It would be totally impossible to tell that from this vid.
@@ronalddump4061 no it's not he's obviously shooting more uphill to the west and it's more level to him from the east.
@@tbonebugam1 You could easily test whether a person can accurately determine the levelness of a line going directly away from your eye. One way would be to take a 20 ft 2 x 4 into an area w/o a sea horizon or any buildings or water bodies in sight. Put your eye on one end, sight along it, and with hand motions have a friend move the other end around till you think it is level. You wont do well in the test. There is nothing in that vid to alert you to the things you are claiming
Secondly, a little bit out of level will do frightfully little to the shooting results. The difference will be proportional to the cosine of the angle. If it were level, the angle is 0, so the cosine is 1. Out there 3000 ft, if the target were out of level a whopping 100 feet, the cosine would be 0.99944. There is no practical difference between those cosines. For differences to be relevant the out of level angle will need to be VERY much larger
What is being demonstrated here is indeed due to the rotation of the Earth, but it is demonstrating the Eötvös Effect; which makes projectiles fired due East or West "drift" above or below the intended location, respectively.
The Coriolis Effect makes projectiles fired towards or away from the equator "drift" East or West, respectively--from the perspective of the person firing the projectile. This is due to the fact that, although the rotation is a little over 360⁰ per day) everywhere on the Earth, the *lateral* speed depends on your distance from the axis of rotation. Thus, while the *lateral speed near the equator is close to 1000 miles per hour, the lateral speed near the poles is close to 0.
If a person is firing in any direction between the four directions mentioned, then the result is some combination of both effects.
This is not because of coriolis effect!!! Coriolis effects will be if you shoot north or south and the bullet went to the right/left. If you will shoot north(on northem hemisphere) the bullet will fly a little bit right. If you will shoot south it will fly left. (opposite on southem hemisphere).
Have no idea if there is difference in right/left on 1000 yards or 5000 yards... So you can try...
they all are coriolis... all 4... north south shoots right left east west shoots up down...
Yes if you shoot North and South the Coriolis effect will change the horizontal impact on the target. Shooting East to West has the effect of changing the vertical component of impact, because in one direction the earth is moving away from from the bullet, and in the other direction the earth is toward the bullet. This changes the time it takes for the bullet to hit the target thus making the bullet hit at different heights.
frederickhf241 (*Read edit below.. changed my mind*) Conservation of momentum, the bullet's speed relative to the earth does not change shooting east vs shooting west. The bullet is already moving with the earth (as are you and the rifle) no matter which direction you're shooting. That momentum doesn't just disappear when you fire the bullet. A better demonstration of how there *isn't* a "Coriolis effect" firing east/west would be to set up a bullet chronograph and fire through it each direction and show that the muzzle velocity is the same (within normal variations) in each direction.
EDIT:
Actually now that I think about it a little more, there will be a difference shooting east vs shooting west. Whether it's measurable I'd have to do some calculations on... it doesn't have to do with the earth coming towards or going away from the bullet, but if you think about it from an orbital mechanics perspective:
To make the math easier, let's just say you're at the equator. In that case you're traveling roughly 1040 miles per hour, or ~1522 feet/second. The speed necessary to be in a circular orbit about the earth at the surface (~2.1X10^7 feet from the center of the earth) is V=SQRT(2.1*10^7*32.08) = ~26,000 feet/second. So if you're facing east and fire a bullet, it'll be going about (let's say for a .308 round) 2700+1522 feet/second = 4222 feet/second (relative to the center of the earth, not the surface). This is actually a sizable fraction of the 26,000 feet/second. Shooting west the orbital speed of the bullet will be 2700-1522=1178 feet/second, which is obviously smaller than 4222... so the total "downward" (towards the earth) acceleration will be greater shooting west than east. Turns out 4222 takes our total acceleration from 32.2 feet/second^2 to about 31.36 ft/s^2. 1178 takes us down to about 32.13 ft/s^2. Difference of about .8 ft/s^2, firing at 1000 yards, let's just say bullet flight of about 1.5 seconds... could be a difference of 1.2 feet! This is a rough estimation since the bullet doesn't actually travel at 2700 ft/s relative to the earth's surface for the entire flight, but as a proof of concept I guess it shows that there could be quite a difference.. Interesting!
Matthew Brown To make things clear - this does not happen in real life - the bullet is shot from a rifle, the rifle is being held by a person, the person is standing on the earth. This means that the person is spinning together with the earth due to static friction and the rifle is spinning with the person as well as the bullet inside of it. - all of them in the same speed the earth is moving. now, when the bullet is fired from the rifle he has speed both in the direction of the spinning of the earth ( even if it is not in a specific direction as north or south - the speed in the direction of the earth's spinning can be described as a complicated vector) and in the direction it was fired and because there is no external force applied on the bullet (except of friction and gravity) it will keep moving straight ( and downwards because of gravity) and it wont deflect or move right left or up and down due to it being not connected to the earth. This was described long ago in NEWTON'S FIRST LAW OF MOTION - the earth and the bullet act as inertial reference frame and the bullet is only going straight relatively to the earth. " When viewed in an inertial reference frame, an object either remains at rest or continues to move at a constant velocity, unless acted upon by an external force".
this phenomenon described in the video simply does not exist because we are looking at it from our earth - our own inertial reference frame and therefore the bullet is only moving in a "free fall" (parabola).
Thanks for reading - ( this is high school stuff ) :)
Meron Bridge
Grade school if you are in Korea or Russia :) yes you are mostly correct. the external forces are acting on the bullet you will find a miniscule difference in speed of the bullet leaving the rifle if you fire it east as opposed to west. again MINISCULE as in inches per minute! not nearly the difference they showed in this video. my previous post was just pointing out there would be a miniscule difference because of the math Matthew came out with.
Before you explain the Coriolis effect in layman's terms you should try pronouncing it in layman's English.
It hurts to hear. He didn't even explain it correctly
"All Ghillied up"
I think you mean the Carbonaro effect....
by your explanation the bullet traveling west has to only travel 540 yds as the one going east travels 1460yds. earth rotating at 460yds( actually meters so we loose 3in./yd) per second. or the bullet traveling west has a transit time to target of approx .72 seconds while the bullet going east has a transit time to target of 1.95 seconds. is that right? Since the bullet is flying independent of the earth. Assuming a projectile velocity of 2250ft/sec
The bullet has the same rotaional speed as the earth since it is on it and inside its atmosphere.
Just like when you jump in a train, you still have the same speed as the train even while in the air. Otherwise you would go splat on the back wall of the wagon. Newtonian laws of motion 101.
This is hilarious. Its wrong for the same reason that airplanes don't need to adjust for Coriolis.
Wind is effected by Coriolis and therefore planes are.
+D Bradford: An airplane is effected by coriollis. ANY moving object, even you, are effected by coriolis. The effect on an airplane is so tiny that the many other variables effecting that plane completely drown out the coriolis effect. You do not seem to realize that a cannon shell is a ballistic object, and a plane is not. A plane flies upon the atmosphere and steers around in that atmosphere. A cannon shell does not steer to its destination. And yet, at all times corriolis is slightly affecting an airplanes flight path.
The fact that an effect or a thing is tiny does not somehow prove the effect does not exist.
If we would calc the amount a tossed ball veers as it moved 100 feet, here on the 45th latitude, the answer would literally be in the thousandths of an inch.
@@37rainman Oh so its gravity that isnt real i get it.
+Adam: So you got that out of my comment there??
Callow clown.
D Bradford a pilot adjust/flies/pilots the plane, bullets do not have the luxury of guidance
"I'm the Great CORNHOLIO!!!"
I need TP for my bunghole!
Thanks...it's been a bad day...I needed that
wow amazing. at ranges that far I'm pretty sure you are battling air density and movement. not the spin of the earth that nobody on the planet can feel except for weather.
And long pendulums. And swimming pools of water.
but you are right in that other things like wind will probably have a larger effect
The spin of the Earth absolutely has an effect. A measurable effect, in fact.
I have a question? Shooting north to south, or south to north. What effect does it have on the bullet, if any? Which it should, because of the earth rotation.
Wait, the earth is round?
No. Well, round maybe, not a ball.
"the target moving up and TOWARDS you" or "down and AWAY from you"???? You are at 1,000 yards....that will always be the distance regardless of what direction you are shooting. The rotation of the earth cannot make a target distance shorter or longer. I total understand the Coriolis effect he simply didn't explain it correctly.
This "test" is extremely flawed.
Today I learned that the rotation of the earth actually stretches it.
So if the earth is in a constant rotation and if as you say that rotation stretches it.....when does it come back to 1000 yards? Because it would have to eventually or else the world would just keep getting bigger and flatter.
I get it....the earth turns while the bullet is in flight. However...the target does NOT get closer or further....it can't.
Well of course it does....the bullet once fired has to get closer to the target regardless of shooting east or west....that's a given...it cannot ever get further away....I am not even arguing whether 1000 yards is far enough to have the coriolis effect have an affect on the point of impact..... But lets get back to the original point....the man says as the world rotates shooting in one direction the target moves closer and the other direction the target moves away.....?????