*I was pleased with Trilene mono line **enjoyable.fishing** recommend performance (25 lb. test) because it offers smooth casting with no tangles/bird's nest in the spool. And, knots can be tied effectively with ease. I would recommend.*
Thanks Kelly - very informative video. You and the puppy are both delightfully real. Perhaps I should know better than to comment in such a knowledgeable crowd. But last time I checked it's ok as long as I say IMHO. I've fished both mono and flouro for many years in many different situations. Based partly on my experience and partly on the chatter I hear, I believe: The reason that flouro sinks quicker than mono is the greater density of the material, diameter for diameter. Getting something to float because it doesn't break surface tension is the big deal. Mono is just enough lighter that it is less likely to break the surface tension and sink. Yes, once they are both underwater, flouro's sink rate is probably a bit better than mono but not a big enough deal for me to get excited. I believe that new flouro is less visible because its refractive index is closer to water than new mono. Once it has strecthed just a bit because I've caught a few fish or snagged a few times, the flouro loses a significant amount of its transparency advantage. I'm pretty sure flouro has no advantage in how fast it gets dirty and that's a big factor in tippet visibility. When I chose my tippet for challenging situations I'm quite ready to ignore the cost difference between flouro and mono. Whatever it costs, to take a deep breath and tie on a new tippet. Few of us get so many chances at big, tough fish that we can base our tippet decision on whether a few feet of one kind cost $0.50 more than the other. The time and money to get to the fishing is always, for me, far more than the price difference in tippet. I find that the current flavors of flouro knot satisfactorily compared to mono. I am an obsessive knot tester. When I tie the tippet on, when I tie the fly on and if there has been any strain on the tippet (snagged on anything - fish, heavy weeds, bottom). It's been a very long time since I got a line back missing the fly and with a curly end. My break offs are normally in the knot. I already said it IMHO, IMHO, IMHO!!!!!
Mr. Kelly Galloup, I bought an 80 dollar Reddington classic trout from my local sportings good store, just because it was marked down to 80 bucks. I kept it for 3 years, not knowing of the joys, it would bring me. Not so much that particular rod, but fly fishing,nothing compares to a 17" smallie on a 6wt. rod tied with a "version" of a fly you tied, thank you good sir. Certainly I will catch more fish on a 2.5" tube, but nothing is more satisfying than a smallmouth on a fly rod, thank you
Great video, thanks. First video that I've seen on the topic that is not biased and put in black and white terms. Explanations made a lot of sense. Gotta love that puppy.
I may be wrong , but I use mono when fishing dries and fluorocarbon when nymphing . The main reason for me was because I was fishing the San Juan and started with tiny tiny nymphs the fish started hitting dries , again very very tiny bugs …. 22, 24 , 26 . The dries would stay on top for a short period and made fishing a bit harder . Switching my leader to mono made all the difference . Again that’s just me .
These are a great series of videos, thanks Kelly. Fluorocarbon has a refractory index that is close to water, but it is hardly invisible under the surface to fish. The fluorcarbon has a density that is nearly twice that of water, from 1.6 g/mL -1.8 g/mL depending on the manufacturer, this is important for "sinking" purposes or it's popularity with nymphing, however the better reason for having a higher density is simple physical properties. Because of its greater linear density than mono, it will transmit energy better and this means a more sensitive line to the angler, better hook sets etc.
I really like your videos, and I subscribe to your channel. The biggest issue for me regarding line material is biodegradability. I am under the impression that mono breaks down and fluoro doesn't really. So I throw out my mono spools after every season and check dates on the new packages. It only took one early spring where I lost a fish on the first day to teach me that lesson. I took out the spool and pulled on it, and the tippet came apart like 2 pound line. Also, I don't feel so bad if a fish ends up with my fly and tippet with mono, because it should break down over the season. And I make sure to keep mono out of the sun.
hello kelly. I want to add that when fishing deep stillwater with slip indicators (25+feet) we use pure florocarbon (i use 12lb) simple because it helps the rig to hang in tension over mono. since we are using 20 foot chunks, i dont use the premuim tippet material like trout hunter, instead i use a spool of Seagur from a gear fishing selection, besides the larger diameter on the spin fishing floro helps the bobber grip better.
The other application that I prefer for mono is for real small flies requiring 6x & 7x. I think mono is more supple and it lets the flies move more naturally both for nymphs and dries
Great video, No BS. So good for people getting into it and everyone telling u something different! I feel like i can trust Kelly cause he seems always about 1 second away from losing his cool and calling everyone else a know nothing f*** wit, with all the reasons why to back it up!
JD, I actually do that with my dry flies. I add 12 to 16 inches of Fluoro to the mono leader, this get the tippet under water and making a depression on the surface which is what the fish is put off by. Have to be careful on the really small stuff not to sink your fly but you figure that out pretty quick. As for the overall use I use it for my nymphing strictly for strength not for the visual reduction
I think this decision is incomplete without adding co-polymer into the mix. Because it sinks better than mono but is stronger than both in terms of tensile strength and better at taking abrasion .
Re: Wet Fly Drift Fishing It's not only that a heavy gauge wire hook, that the Davy Wotton's etc will explore in wet fly patterns and techniques - gets the wet fly down. Really, you can use these wet flies with heavier gauge wire in dead calm water too, over 'deep' holding pockets (where trout lying several feet below and not actively feeding, can be coaxed to respond to something far over their head). We run into that situation often with migratory species, that are 'shy' in the new freshwater environment in which they find themselves in, in sun lighted hours of the clock. The heavy gauge wire of the wet fly, turns a fly pattern, that can be fished on a lighter gauge wire hook, with more 'action' to it (sort of like the streamer that has an action). And what one can do, with the heavier gauge wire, is kill that action altogether, and that is what tends to provide the 'trigger' in the situation that I described. I don't know why that is, it just is.
You can get the same fly, and fish it down the same stretch, on a lighter gauge, and it's won't find anything in that water. I suspect that the heavier gauge wire slows the progress of the fly in the current (sort of like an anchor would so a drift of a boat). On the other hand, lighter gauge wire hook, on wet flies, allow it to get buffered by the current, and buffered sideways by breezes and stuff too, if the fly in in the top few inches of water. Like, you look at buzzer patterns, that are always fished in the top few inches, and the thickness of wire on hook, relative to size of pattern, is very exaggerated towards a thicker wire hook. That's intentional, so that on still waters, the buzzer pattern flows with the general drift of the water on the lake, and doesn't get pushed sideways, by too much surface disturbance that is owing to breezes etc. When you want to kill, that residual bit of action that the fly might present, from sideways breezes, the heavier gauge wire comes into play a lot.
What I'm actually leading up to here, is an augmentation of one of points, that Kelly made. About, a leader construction, where you want to exaggerate the difference between the butt diameter of the leader, and the tippet diameters. I.e. To get that 'step down' to occur really fast in the leader construction. I've tended to use that a lot, in my own leader design. I adapted single-handed saltwater fly lines ('punch' into in-shore shoreline breezes), and musky-pike heavy single-handed fly rods, to work for fresh water river migratory species. Everything in that tackle goes from 'fat' to really 'thin' really quickly. Like, the saltwater no. 12 lines, are super exaggerated from the thickest to thinnest parts. And I do the same with the leaders too, and I use actual large diameter saltwater type Berkeley (what 50 pound breaking strain?) monofilament, to attach to end of saltwater fly line head - stepping down rapidly over nine-ten foot leader, to X5 fluorocarbon. That's sinking tackle, and the Berkeley large diameter 'butt' part, acts sort of like a neutral density intermediate fly line extension, because it's such a large diameter.
For some reason, this set up, combined with flies that have really thick wire gauges, used in wet fly in either fast or slow waters, is a really good combination. Because you need something powerful to control a 'heavy' wire hook, in the casting. Especially, with a nine-foot Pike-musky fly rod, that has 'zero' action to it really. They whole tackle works well too, in contact with a migratory species such as salmon, where the 'deadness' of the entire tackle, and immediacy of contact with the 'weight' of the prey on the line, is helpful, when one is working with large fish on such small length rods. It's a kind of set-up that might work, in some saltwater or streamer situations. However, the problem with all of this approach (like with the large belly Skagit lines and rods), is there's a lot of retrieve and shooting of lines. Traditionally speaking, wet fly salmon and trout fishing, was a more graceful art than that - and that's where the less exaggerated tapers, lighter rods, and less tapered monofilament leaders, were a really nice set up.
There's one other comment on this - the idea of the 'heavy' hook, versus the 'lighter' hook gauge. When Kelly described the technique that has the 'stone fly' on the point fly, and the size 18 HE nymph as a dropper. This is a technique that has wide application, for a lot of rivers, a lot of species. One may be using the size 18 HE nymph to actually fish with, but the other hook is also playing a role in how the entire system operates in the water. I.e. You can use the stone fly below as an anchor to deaden some of the action out of the system, and still enjoy the benefit of having a quite small, 'active' fly on the same leader construction. This is a wickedly effective way to probe a lot of rivers, for a lot of other species other than resident brown trout in rivers. Things like black pennell wet's in sizes down to fourteen (one can go below 12 sizes normally used in wet fishing), when one uses that method that Kelly illustrated in one tutorial video here.
@@BrianOHanlon I like this interpretation, and sometimes I use ways that some look at as crazy or simplified and catch more fish consistently compared to if I try making them complicated as to the ways things are supposed to be done , in some circumstances
Great info Kelly! I like the point about dries needing a short section of submerged line. Oliver Edwards preaches the same thing but he goes so far as to degrease his tippet with dish soap/diatomaceous earth mix after applying floatant to the fly. This makes sure that the tippet will not sit on the surface. All good points and keep the puppy on the show! Although probably not so puppy anymore...
On sinking I think flouro tends to break through the waters surface tension versus the mono I think gets stuck in the tension a bit. Both are the same sink once they slip through the meniscus. Think emergergents the mono sticks in that layer more than the flouro.
Now that Ive accumulated so much stuff I keep both. Maybe it's all in my head (and it probably is) but I like Fluro for the clearer waters, otherwise I use mono a lot. I also find Fluoro to sink better. The price gap isn't that bad, but I don't think its worth going all to floro
Agreed, we fished short length of flouro to dry as described, used mono for sub surface nymphing in lakes as we think it slows the descent and you get takes on the "drop" , first generation flouro was brittle it seemed, many anglers fished a short section of stretchy shock leader, but that was mainly because rods were tip action (still are in a lot of cases) so a hook set with a poker would often snap the flouro, and, WF lines in my opinion added to the weight on the hook set, I fished bendy rods and DT lines and never had too many problems, I think todays flouros are much better??. Another thing we did was put a DT5 on a 7 rated poker rod, you looked a bit of a plank when working the line out at first, but then you once you weighted the the rod, you could get nearly 2 thirds of a DT 5 in the air and out on to the water. So did that catch more fish?-nope-but it put down all the fish in range of the double haulers to your left and right. When they moved on, we made a brew of tea,(I'm a limey), let the lake settle, and went back to fishing at 10-20' out. I do use flouro now-Trouthunter, because I euro nymph, but when you are chucking 3 weighted nymphs, your wine bottle cork is gonna sink LOL.
I fish for trout in Montana and Wyoming and fish saltwater in Florida in the Bahamas. After trying fluorocarbon for several applications I have no use for it. It is brittle, harder to use, and my visibility experiments in crystal clear Bahamian waters where I could see the fish below revealed absolutely no advantage to fluorocarbon. Frankly, I don’t understand why people think fish are smart enough to detect a mono line and reason that it might be tied to what they are about to eat, but remain oblivious or unconcerned about a hook protruding from it.
I have to disagree with you on the nymphing aspect, as least if not using split shot. I started czech nymphing with mono and later switched to fluoro; the difference in how quickly the fly got down was very noticeable in my experience. I'm fishing shorter drifts on small spring creeks, which might play a factor, but fluoro definitely helped me start catching more fish using the same flies.
Interesting theme, have you ever realy compared the visibility under water by yourself? i did, in an glass of water and on the river. on the same diameter, i can´t see a significant difference (stroft) not for the sinking ability, just the visibility under water...
Hi Kelly, I'll testify to the puppy / date factor 100%, but what about the stretch factor of both lines? I realize it's dependent on application, especially in longer lengths like in spin fishing, but something like lake fishing very deep with very long leaders? Or am I "barking" up the wrong tree 🌲🐕 ? Thanks, you gave a lot of useful common sense advice.
My thought as well. I believe that what the comparison is really about is between the two different materials, fluorocarbon vs nylon. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
Great video bud as always. Just curious as to why anyone would use mono at all for their leader or tippet given that it retains so much memory/coil spring. I use a 3 or 2 Line Fluro system from 15lb to 8lb down to 4lb for a nice straight leader & tippet. The short 15lb butt section of my leader has a decent diameter for my loop to loop connection so cuts down on abrasion to the fly line so quickly and the 4lb is great for both dries (with a little floatant) and/or nymphs and buzzers, the 8lb and 4lb lengths vary in length depending on what fly I’m fishing and time of year. Only time I’ve ever used mono (18lb) is when tying 8” by way of a nail knot to the fly line followed by a perfection loop for my Fluro leader.
The problem is that flourocarbon is expensive. To get 0.015-8X tippet for monofilament would cost only 55 dollars while buying the same amount of tippet for fluorocarbon would be nearly 200 dollars. The difference is a lot especially for me who is 16 and am only really able to work in the summer because of school. That’s about a week’s paycheck for me.
It’s the shank length.. … sometimes they are talking about the strength, but then they say 2x strong . That’s how thick the hook is and strength. But normally it’s the length of the shank and they are streamer hooks for the most part
Hey, on your drop shot nymph rig I’ve heard you say that the section after the 12lb gold stren was 3x fluoro. I wanted to know if the rest of it, including the droppers, is all fluoro too.
Got that 12 lb. on my line but should work better 8 wgt. on 7 wgt. 10 ft. rod. Thanx for sharing valuable advice. Should send pic of my Bear Dog (no longer have him) proud prancing around the kitchen as a pup with a steak bone sideways in his mouth long as he was....lol what hams they are.
What is your opinion on a mono vs fluoro leader? Is it really worth the extra $ to use a fluoro leader or just tie on fluoro tippet to the standard mono leader when needed?
I found a lot of Orvis Mono and Fluorocarbon line easily breakable and dried out. Anyone else have this problem? You never know how long the line has been on the shelf in the store. They should have born on dates like beer.
What about fluoro tapered leaders for still water streamer fishing with sink tip line where you want to get down to as deep as 15 ft? They're 5x the price of mono but worth the extra price in this scenario?
Your sink tip makes most of the difference mono vs floro might make 6 inches difference, plus taperd Leaders are unnecessary for streamer fishing I would recommend purchasing floro tippit and cutting of 4-6 feet and tying a perfection loop for your loop to loop connection and then tying your fly on way cheeper than taperd Leaders
Fluorocarbon line is a monofilament of a plastic known as PVDF or Poly-Vinyl-i-Dene-Fluoride. I just paused for a moment and went to the Sufix International web site and they describe it as a monofilament, see; sufix.fishing/monofilament-fishing-lines. I don't know if the machines they use to extrude the resin is any different, I do know that nylon melts at 220ºC and PVDF melts at 177ºC. I understand that people refer to it as fluorocarbon and refer to the nylon as monofilament for some reason, but they are both a monofilament. If you personally believe that it is a co-polymer or a multi-polymer or a braid, I simply wont challenge your belief.
Yes, they are a "mono (single) filament strand (or single strand) but mono, nylon and FC are three completely different materials (tho all 3 are polymer based), each having 3 different properties.
With the fluoro carbon, sometimes you can say in touch with a fly better, that's working the depths. Especially, where's there a lot of flow and current, and that 'signal' that you're receiving back in the finger tips from the line, of the rapid current flow, needs to get filtered out from the other signal. That one, that might be possible to detect, that tells you there's a fish interested, and a tightening might be appropriate. With the fluorocarbon, when you tighten those few initial inches, you might be in contact or not, and so if not, release the line again and allow it to continue. The fluoro carbon is a 'dead' line in that respect, and that dead-ness of it as a line can be used to advantage in one situation, as part of the overall leader construction.
The other situation that I find, and it depends on the fly fishermen. Some fishers are experts, it just a thing that comes natural, at being able to maintain a consistent rhythm of accurate and careful casting (on a slower moving 'surface' water situation), all day long. They're fishermen who have a more consistent style, that is useful to work around the problem, and incentive-ize a trout to get curious in a lure, over a prolonged time. From a point of view of casting 'lift off', and even the actual 'take' from the trout, the extra spring-i-ness of monofilament (even if the diameter of tippet/leader isn't as low), and even if braking strain isn't as high, is more than compensated for, by the way that those anglers are able to leverage that leader flexibility (and it becomes a component of their entire fishing method).
These second kind of fishermen by the way, don't have to furiously investigate a lot of different kinds of patterns, lures and baits. They may do very respectably as fishers, for decades, using a few simple patterns and this same technique, which is sort of like violin playing to look at. You just know, to look at them work down a river stretch, they're going to find trout in places, others wouldn't.
When a fish takes something on a surface of a water, like a 'wet dry' cast of flies maybe, a leader construction that is too dead, make come as a disadvantage. It might suit certain styles of fishing, to have a little more flexibility there, when that fish strikes hard on a line that might be pretty darn straight when the fish takes. You don't want to get a hard strike, that is so fast and strong, that you end up loosing contact with the fish having coaxed it, so skillfully. And a lot of guys I know, who still like monofilament leader construction, are these types of fishermen, who need the flexibility in the leader.
That's not to say, that you can compromise, and go for a little of both worlds too. If one wants to make a pretty decent dry fly (surface) leader, a compromise, between the flexibility and larger diameter of monofilament on the back-end of the leader - with the in-flexibility and dead-ness of fluorocarbon, with it's tiny cross section on the front end of a leader, isn't a bad combination at all. It still gives a little bit of flexibility, so when a re-cast is done, on the lift off the water, the leader is able to 'spring' just a little, because it's half-and-half monofilament. On a delicate dry fly rod, that bit of spring that the upper mono part of the leader provides, can be used also, to help to 'load' the tip of one's dry fly rod.
Everything is a part of the 'system' that working here, in a dynamic way, both in terms of casting across a time span of seconds, and a time span of hours in terms of fishing style over the entire day. The fishing style of the fisherman, the water conditions, the lure type, the depth of fishing, it all comes into the eventual choice of leader.
I want the elasticity that mono gives me when a big fish punches the fly............. 0.4% increased strength, really. By time knot strength is factored in its probably less than that.
Respectfully, fluorocarbon being slightly stronger is a marketing farce. I have tested both, on both tension strength and abrasion strength and mono every single time has won.
I respect your opinion but couldn't disagree more when it comes to good fluorocarbon. Give regular Rio Mono 4x or any other brand a test against Trouthunter, Cortland Top Secret, or Seaguar 4x and I guarantee it will be stronger. There are definitely some much weaker brands out there but if you test any of the above three I think you will see a huge differnce - John
I see the same. It’s the knot strength I see is way more brittle in flouro . Seaguar blue label was nicer feeling but it broke on big strong runs with steelhead at the knot so easily with 8 lb where I used 6 lb stren mono and had very little issues. The diameter was larger but it was too stiff if I went up to 10 lb flouro which matched a 8 lb mono
I agree. I'm no pro, but I use mono on flies where the trout strikes hard. Moreso if I am using a cheap reel that has more static friction than dynamic (in other words, it sticks before it gets going). I use mono on streamers because they hit hard. You can also rub fluoro with a candle to make it float, and pass mono through a surfactant to make it sink faster, though I'm way too lazy to do that.
@@Southguy42 , I dont think it makes much difference, and in some cases I like the dark tippet, I used the Maxima Chameleon for years and it is brown, I have seen times on dry flies where I thought it was an advantage when it is really sunny? KG
Smaller the number the heavier the line the bigger the number the lighter the line so 0x would be like 15-20 lb line where 7x is like 2lb test hope that helps
At 11 minuted into the video, from the sounds that pup is making.....Kelly, you should go see how much money "Bell" is chewing up in product! Likely a cork handle of a Sage, Loomis, Scott or Winston rod.
3x as much money. Lol. yeah if you're a chump who buys the tippet spools from fly shops. Lots of quality fluoro out there sold as spinning/casting line. Same stuff? I dunno, but it works well.
Kevin Kresowaty it's not the same. fc made for spinning reels is roughly 20 to 30 % thicker depending on the brand of tippet you use. Thicker line has some advantages but I feel the negatives out way them. Line diameter is the single most important factor for tippet. The thinner your line, the more natural the movement is in the current, the faster your fly gets down in the current with less weight, and with all the 4 k video underwater I have seen, thinner mono is less visible then even slightly thicker fc.
You have to compare sizes. The actual diameter is listed on the labels. If you buy line that is 20% or 30% thicker than what you want that is your own fault for not reading the labels. For example, 4lb PLine 100% Fluoro is as good as anything out there and more than thin enough to use with small flies. I've used it with flies down to #20 with fantastic success. Furthermore, if you looked in the boats of a lot of guides floating the Madison you'd see bulk spools of PLine and Seaguar. If you want to throw money away on 30 yard spools, go for it. I fish too much to spend $20 on a single tiny spool of a single size of tippet. Fly shop tippet ain't magic stuff.
I hear ya on that, I have used spiderwire fc on stocked trout in MD and PA. but when I drive 3 hours to the upper Delaware, I'm using the strongest thinnest line I can get. The trout there have masters degrees on how to not get caught. A trip last year, I used the spiderwire fc for half the trip, and then went to Rio fc for the second half the trip. My strikes went up double. Rio being the thinnest tippet per lb. Locals told me it matters, in that low clear water that week anyway. Every river/stream/creek is different. But if your out west, which I figure from your comment, with all due respect, you have no clue what fishing pressure is. Your most crowded days aren't even half as bad ours. I live a hour from the birthplace of American fly fishing. Trying to fish where 80 % of the population lives sucks, hunting is even worse. but it makes you better. Got to look for any advantage you can get.
Well, Spiderwire fluoro is junk... ...so there's your problem. I never said the cheapest fluoros are good. Pline is still around $20 a spool, but again you get 300 yards. Likewise, the Berkely and Stren fluoros are junk and the cheaper versions of Seaguar and PLine are not so hot either. Also, don't assume that trout out west are unpressured. That is true of smaller streams, but the fish on the Madison see plenty of flies. Ever heard of the Beaverhead? Well, you ain't seen pressure until you float the first couple miles below Clark Canyon dam. In fact, if you've never fished the west it's easy to be dissapointed when you see just how many people are on the water on the famous rivers. And one last thing, I live PA and often fish the popular limestone influenced streams in the central part of the state. They are as pressured as anywhere. PLine still works like a charm.
they are two different lines ! you can't even compare them in the same breath ! one is for one application and the other for another . one sinks and one doesn't ! it's not some great epiphany !
*I was pleased with Trilene mono line **enjoyable.fishing** recommend performance (25 lb. test) because it offers smooth casting with no tangles/bird's nest in the spool. And, knots can be tied effectively with ease. I would recommend.*
Shameful how stupid bots are
If you are getting birds nests in your spool on a fly rig you are doing something horrible and need higher a instructor
I find it interesting that the puppy barks and yips when Kelly starts talking about Spin Fishing.... that is some fine puppy training.
Kelly, you still in Ennis? Will have to stop in this next summer, if you are. Love your videos!
THIS
This guy is the only person I feel like I can trust on purchasing fly tackle
Brian from mad river outfitters seems like a pretty honest guy to me too. I have no problem with them selling stuff and making a profit.
Give the puppy a hug, for showing admirable restraint. Great talk on Fluorocarbon and monofilament, good grounding for me.
Thanks Kelly - very informative video. You and the puppy are both delightfully real.
Perhaps I should know better than to comment in such a knowledgeable crowd. But last time I checked it's ok as long as I say IMHO. I've fished both mono and flouro for many years in many different situations. Based partly on my experience and partly on the chatter I hear, I believe:
The reason that flouro sinks quicker than mono is the greater density of the material, diameter for diameter. Getting something to float because it doesn't break surface tension is the big deal. Mono is just enough lighter that it is less likely to break the surface tension and sink. Yes, once they are both underwater, flouro's sink rate is probably a bit better than mono but not a big enough deal for me to get excited.
I believe that new flouro is less visible because its refractive index is closer to water than new mono. Once it has strecthed just a bit because I've caught a few fish or snagged a few times, the flouro loses a significant amount of its transparency advantage. I'm pretty sure flouro has no advantage in how fast it gets dirty and that's a big factor in tippet visibility. When I chose my tippet for challenging situations I'm quite ready to ignore the cost difference between flouro and mono. Whatever it costs, to take a deep breath and tie on a new tippet. Few of us get so many chances at big, tough fish that we can base our tippet decision on whether a few feet of one kind cost $0.50 more than the other. The time and money to get to the fishing is always, for me, far more than the price difference in tippet.
I find that the current flavors of flouro knot satisfactorily compared to mono. I am an obsessive knot tester. When I tie the tippet on, when I tie the fly on and if there has been any strain on the tippet (snagged on anything - fish, heavy weeds, bottom). It's been a very long time since I got a line back missing the fly and with a curly end. My break offs are normally in the knot.
I already said it IMHO, IMHO, IMHO!!!!!
Mr. Kelly Galloup, I bought an 80 dollar Reddington classic trout from my local sportings good store, just because it was marked down to 80 bucks. I kept it for 3 years, not knowing of the joys, it would bring me. Not so much that particular rod, but fly fishing,nothing compares to a 17" smallie on a 6wt. rod tied with a "version" of a fly you tied, thank you good sir. Certainly I will catch more fish on a 2.5" tube, but nothing is more satisfying than a smallmouth on a fly rod, thank you
I've found Kelly's videos about a month ago and I've watched them all multiple times. I will take advice from Kelly over anybody, great information
G and T Outdoors REALLY?
Glad kelly is all you think he is ! A dick !!!
Why do you say that? Just curious because I just watched all these videos and find him very likable
He's correct. Wiggling a rod tells you nothing.
Laurie Harper I think you replied on the wrong video champ !!! lol
Great video, thanks. First video that I've seen on the topic that is not biased and put in black and white terms. Explanations made a lot of sense. Gotta love that puppy.
I know this is a few years old but I just found it and the information is still current. Thanks Kelly!
Love the puppy effect!!!! lol....great to see ya laugh ol friend!!!
I may be wrong , but I use mono when fishing dries and fluorocarbon when nymphing . The main reason for me was because I was fishing the San Juan and started with tiny tiny nymphs the fish started hitting dries , again very very tiny bugs …. 22, 24 , 26 . The dries would stay on top for a short period and made fishing a bit harder . Switching my leader to mono made all the difference . Again that’s just me .
These are a great series of videos, thanks Kelly. Fluorocarbon has a refractory index that is close to water, but it is hardly invisible under the surface to fish. The fluorcarbon has a density that is nearly twice that of water, from 1.6 g/mL -1.8 g/mL depending on the manufacturer, this is important for "sinking" purposes or it's popularity with nymphing, however the better reason for having a higher density is simple physical properties. Because of its greater linear density than mono, it will transmit energy better and this means a more sensitive line to the angler, better hook sets etc.
I really like your videos, and I subscribe to your channel.
The biggest issue for me regarding line material is biodegradability. I am under the impression that mono breaks down and fluoro doesn't really. So I throw out my mono spools after every season and check dates on the new packages. It only took one early spring where I lost a fish on the first day to teach me that lesson. I took out the spool and pulled on it, and the tippet came apart like 2 pound line.
Also, I don't feel so bad if a fish ends up with my fly and tippet with mono, because it should break down over the season. And I make sure to keep mono out of the sun.
hello kelly. I want to add that when fishing deep stillwater with slip indicators (25+feet) we use pure florocarbon (i use 12lb) simple because it helps the rig to hang in tension over mono. since we are using 20 foot chunks, i dont use the premuim tippet material like trout hunter, instead i use a spool of Seagur from a gear fishing selection, besides the larger diameter on the spin fishing floro helps the bobber grip better.
Great video , always wondered about the differences . Thanks for posting .
Ha ha. Adam on the Pine here.You sold me a drift boat (hyde) in Michigan. Friends with the Bonneys!Tight lines!
I use both and I had my doubts. Now it is much more clear. Wise advise¡ Thanks¡
The other application that I prefer for mono is for real small flies requiring 6x & 7x. I think mono is more supple and it lets the flies move more naturally both for nymphs and dries
wyomingtrout definitely with you there, a supple mono will let those small flies dance in the micro currents better than a stiffer fluorocarbon
Awesome content as usual, Kelly! Thanks for the helpful information!
Give credit where it is deserved. This and the comment connection keep me mindful of these great videos.
Love the puppy! Happy Puppy Day.
great video, like your puppy.Bell.
Great video, No BS. So good for people getting into it and everyone telling u something different! I feel like i can trust Kelly cause he seems always about 1 second away from losing his cool and calling everyone else a know nothing f*** wit, with all the reasons why to back it up!
Puppies are cool. Very helpful video with lots of things to think about.
I just learned more about lines and choices than I have in 45 yrs of fishing.
Takeaway: FC has "rarified" situations of value. As usual Kelly is cutting through the marketing. Love the lunchbox approach. Save your money.
Nice vid Kelly. I'll be at your shop in June to get stocked up on flys for the week.
JD, I actually do that with my dry flies. I add 12 to 16 inches of Fluoro to the mono leader, this get the tippet under water and making a depression on the surface which is what the fish is put off by. Have to be careful on the really small stuff not to sink your fly but you figure that out pretty quick. As for the overall use I use it for my nymphing strictly for strength not for the visual reduction
I think this decision is incomplete without adding co-polymer into the mix. Because it sinks better than mono but is stronger than both in terms of tensile strength and better at taking abrasion .
Re: Wet Fly Drift Fishing
It's not only that a heavy gauge wire hook, that the Davy Wotton's etc will explore in wet fly patterns and techniques - gets the wet fly down. Really, you can use these wet flies with heavier gauge wire in dead calm water too, over 'deep' holding pockets (where trout lying several feet below and not actively feeding, can be coaxed to respond to something far over their head). We run into that situation often with migratory species, that are 'shy' in the new freshwater environment in which they find themselves in, in sun lighted hours of the clock. The heavy gauge wire of the wet fly, turns a fly pattern, that can be fished on a lighter gauge wire hook, with more 'action' to it (sort of like the streamer that has an action). And what one can do, with the heavier gauge wire, is kill that action altogether, and that is what tends to provide the 'trigger' in the situation that I described. I don't know why that is, it just is.
You can get the same fly, and fish it down the same stretch, on a lighter gauge, and it's won't find anything in that water. I suspect that the heavier gauge wire slows the progress of the fly in the current (sort of like an anchor would so a drift of a boat). On the other hand, lighter gauge wire hook, on wet flies, allow it to get buffered by the current, and buffered sideways by breezes and stuff too, if the fly in in the top few inches of water. Like, you look at buzzer patterns, that are always fished in the top few inches, and the thickness of wire on hook, relative to size of pattern, is very exaggerated towards a thicker wire hook. That's intentional, so that on still waters, the buzzer pattern flows with the general drift of the water on the lake, and doesn't get pushed sideways, by too much surface disturbance that is owing to breezes etc. When you want to kill, that residual bit of action that the fly might present, from sideways breezes, the heavier gauge wire comes into play a lot.
What I'm actually leading up to here, is an augmentation of one of points, that Kelly made. About, a leader construction, where you want to exaggerate the difference between the butt diameter of the leader, and the tippet diameters. I.e. To get that 'step down' to occur really fast in the leader construction. I've tended to use that a lot, in my own leader design. I adapted single-handed saltwater fly lines ('punch' into in-shore shoreline breezes), and musky-pike heavy single-handed fly rods, to work for fresh water river migratory species. Everything in that tackle goes from 'fat' to really 'thin' really quickly. Like, the saltwater no. 12 lines, are super exaggerated from the thickest to thinnest parts. And I do the same with the leaders too, and I use actual large diameter saltwater type Berkeley (what 50 pound breaking strain?) monofilament, to attach to end of saltwater fly line head - stepping down rapidly over nine-ten foot leader, to X5 fluorocarbon. That's sinking tackle, and the Berkeley large diameter 'butt' part, acts sort of like a neutral density intermediate fly line extension, because it's such a large diameter.
For some reason, this set up, combined with flies that have really thick wire gauges, used in wet fly in either fast or slow waters, is a really good combination. Because you need something powerful to control a 'heavy' wire hook, in the casting. Especially, with a nine-foot Pike-musky fly rod, that has 'zero' action to it really. They whole tackle works well too, in contact with a migratory species such as salmon, where the 'deadness' of the entire tackle, and immediacy of contact with the 'weight' of the prey on the line, is helpful, when one is working with large fish on such small length rods. It's a kind of set-up that might work, in some saltwater or streamer situations. However, the problem with all of this approach (like with the large belly Skagit lines and rods), is there's a lot of retrieve and shooting of lines. Traditionally speaking, wet fly salmon and trout fishing, was a more graceful art than that - and that's where the less exaggerated tapers, lighter rods, and less tapered monofilament leaders, were a really nice set up.
There's one other comment on this - the idea of the 'heavy' hook, versus the 'lighter' hook gauge. When Kelly described the technique that has the 'stone fly' on the point fly, and the size 18 HE nymph as a dropper. This is a technique that has wide application, for a lot of rivers, a lot of species. One may be using the size 18 HE nymph to actually fish with, but the other hook is also playing a role in how the entire system operates in the water. I.e. You can use the stone fly below as an anchor to deaden some of the action out of the system, and still enjoy the benefit of having a quite small, 'active' fly on the same leader construction. This is a wickedly effective way to probe a lot of rivers, for a lot of other species other than resident brown trout in rivers. Things like black pennell wet's in sizes down to fourteen (one can go below 12 sizes normally used in wet fishing), when one uses that method that Kelly illustrated in one tutorial video here.
@@BrianOHanlon I like this interpretation, and sometimes I use ways that some look at as crazy or simplified and catch more fish consistently compared to if I try making them complicated as to the ways things are supposed to be done , in some circumstances
Maybe the best summary comparison of the tippet materials ever.
The puppy is a bonus.
Coke?!
Great info Kelly! I like the point about dries needing a short section of submerged line. Oliver Edwards preaches the same thing but he goes so far as to degrease his tippet with dish soap/diatomaceous earth mix after applying floatant to the fly. This makes sure that the tippet will not sit on the surface. All good points and keep the puppy on the show! Although probably not so puppy anymore...
On sinking I think flouro tends to break through the waters surface tension versus the mono I think gets stuck in the tension a bit. Both are the same sink once they slip through the meniscus. Think emergergents the mono sticks in that layer more than the flouro.
Now that Ive accumulated so much stuff I keep both. Maybe it's all in my head (and it probably is) but I like Fluro for the clearer waters, otherwise I use mono a lot. I also find Fluoro to sink better. The price gap isn't that bad, but I don't think its worth going all to floro
Pup under the desk sounded like he was about to go after your man bait..Great vid..
Agreed, we fished short length of flouro to dry as described, used mono for sub surface nymphing in lakes as we think it slows the descent and you get takes on the "drop" , first generation flouro was brittle it seemed, many anglers fished a short section of stretchy shock leader, but that was mainly because rods were tip action (still are in a lot of cases) so a hook set with a poker would often snap the flouro, and, WF lines in my opinion added to the weight on the hook set, I fished bendy rods and DT lines and never had too many problems, I think todays flouros are much better??. Another thing we did was put a DT5 on a 7 rated poker rod, you looked a bit of a plank when working the line out at first, but then you once you weighted the the rod, you could get nearly 2 thirds of a DT 5 in the air and out on to the water. So did that catch more fish?-nope-but it put down all the fish in range of the double haulers to your left and right. When they moved on, we made a brew of tea,(I'm a limey), let the lake settle, and went back to fishing at 10-20' out. I do use flouro now-Trouthunter, because I euro nymph, but when you are chucking 3 weighted nymphs, your wine bottle cork is gonna sink LOL.
I fish for trout in Montana and Wyoming and fish saltwater in Florida in the Bahamas. After trying fluorocarbon for several applications I have no use for it. It is brittle, harder to use, and my visibility experiments in crystal clear Bahamian waters where I could see the fish below revealed absolutely no advantage to fluorocarbon. Frankly, I don’t understand why people think fish are smart enough to detect a mono line and reason that it might be tied to what they are about to eat, but remain oblivious or unconcerned about a hook protruding from it.
I have to disagree with you on the nymphing aspect, as least if not using split shot. I started czech nymphing with mono and later switched to fluoro; the difference in how quickly the fly got down was very noticeable in my experience. I'm fishing shorter drifts on small spring creeks, which might play a factor, but fluoro definitely helped me start catching more fish using the same flies.
Haaahaaa....! Nice puppy.... :-) Your'e doing great. I'm now a member of your channel :-)
Interesting theme, have you ever realy compared the visibility under water by yourself?
i did, in an glass of water and on the river. on the same diameter, i can´t see a significant difference (stroft)
not for the sinking ability, just the visibility under water...
Hi Kelly, I'll testify to the puppy / date factor 100%, but what about the stretch factor of both lines? I realize it's dependent on application, especially in longer lengths like in spin fishing, but something like lake fishing very deep with very long leaders? Or am I "barking" up the wrong tree 🌲🐕 ? Thanks, you gave a lot of useful common sense advice.
Often when I try to use 7x tippet, I tie to a size 20 fly using a clinch not and tightened, the line breaks at the eye. What am I doing wrong?
I like the puppy's comments
Love the dog, keep it around
Isn't fluorocarbon a monofilament too?
monofilament
= a single strand of man-made fibre
My thought as well. I believe that what the comparison is really about is between the two different materials, fluorocarbon vs nylon. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
@ 2:25 "It doesn't knot as well..." And that was my experience, therefore I went back to monofilament. Too many knots unhinged.
Great video bud as always. Just curious as to why anyone would use mono at all for their leader or tippet given that it retains so much memory/coil spring. I use a 3 or 2 Line Fluro system from 15lb to 8lb down to 4lb for a nice straight leader & tippet. The short 15lb butt section of my leader has a decent diameter for my loop to loop connection so cuts down on abrasion to the fly line so quickly and the 4lb is great for both dries (with a little floatant) and/or nymphs and buzzers, the 8lb and 4lb lengths vary in length depending on what fly I’m fishing and time of year. Only time I’ve ever used mono (18lb) is when tying 8” by way of a nail knot to the fly line followed by a perfection loop for my Fluro leader.
The problem is that flourocarbon is expensive. To get 0.015-8X tippet for monofilament would cost only 55 dollars while buying the same amount of tippet for fluorocarbon would be nearly 200 dollars. The difference is a lot especially for me who is 16 and am only really able to work in the summer because of school. That’s about a week’s paycheck for me.
@@jacobstarr9010 just buy the big spools and make your own tippets from them . 3 spools of 300 years flouro will last SEASON after SEASON
@@stevensmith2085 I got a full variety (from 0.015” to 0.004”) of fluorocarbon tippet, so that’s no longer a problem. But good advice nonetheless.
@@jacobstarr9010 👍🐟
Kelly....can you please explain the differences between all the hooks out there. 1X...2X etc. and which ones do what and why?
Thanks
Don Rooney
It’s the shank length.. … sometimes they are talking about the strength, but then they say 2x strong . That’s how thick the hook is and strength. But normally it’s the length of the shank and they are streamer hooks for the most part
Hey, on your drop shot nymph rig I’ve heard you say that the section after the 12lb gold stren was 3x fluoro. I wanted to know if the rest of it, including the droppers, is all fluoro too.
You can have your pups in you videos all that you want. Their “playing” doesn’t hinder the audio content in the least little bit to me.
I do think that mono is more forgiving and has more stretch.
The puppy effect is fine!
Got that 12 lb. on my line but should work better 8 wgt. on 7 wgt. 10 ft. rod. Thanx for sharing valuable advice. Should send pic of my Bear Dog (no longer have him) proud prancing around the kitchen as a pup with a steak bone sideways in his mouth long as he was....lol what hams they are.
What is your opinion on a mono vs fluoro leader? Is it really worth the extra $ to use a fluoro leader or just tie on fluoro tippet to the standard mono leader when needed?
Euro nymphing. The conventional wisdom says that flouro cuts the water a bit better, and doesn't absorb or drift as much. Is that true?
I found a lot of Orvis Mono and Fluorocarbon line easily breakable and dried out. Anyone else have this problem? You never know how long the line has been on the shelf in the store. They should have born on dates like beer.
Both flouro and nylon are monofiliment. Kelly's saying "mono" but he means "nylon".
How do I know the manufacture date on Rio's tippets and leaders?
What about fluoro tapered leaders for still water streamer fishing with sink tip line where you want to get down to as deep as 15 ft? They're 5x the price of mono but worth the extra price in this scenario?
Your sink tip makes most of the difference mono vs floro might make 6 inches difference, plus taperd Leaders are unnecessary for streamer fishing I would recommend purchasing floro tippit and cutting of 4-6 feet and tying a perfection loop for your loop to loop connection and then tying your fly on way cheeper than taperd Leaders
Fluorocarbon line is also a monofilament!
not true.
Fluorocarbon line is a monofilament of a plastic known as PVDF or Poly-Vinyl-i-Dene-Fluoride. I just paused for a moment and went to the Sufix International web site and they describe it as a monofilament, see; sufix.fishing/monofilament-fishing-lines. I don't know if the machines they use to extrude the resin is any different, I do know that nylon melts at 220ºC and PVDF melts at 177ºC. I understand that people refer to it as fluorocarbon and refer to the nylon as monofilament for some reason, but they are both a monofilament. If you personally believe that it is a co-polymer or a multi-polymer or a braid, I simply wont challenge your belief.
Yes, they are a "mono (single) filament strand (or single strand) but mono, nylon and FC are three completely different materials (tho all 3 are polymer based), each having 3 different properties.
With the fluoro carbon, sometimes you can say in touch with a fly better, that's working the depths. Especially, where's there a lot of flow and current, and that 'signal' that you're receiving back in the finger tips from the line, of the rapid current flow, needs to get filtered out from the other signal. That one, that might be possible to detect, that tells you there's a fish interested, and a tightening might be appropriate. With the fluorocarbon, when you tighten those few initial inches, you might be in contact or not, and so if not, release the line again and allow it to continue. The fluoro carbon is a 'dead' line in that respect, and that dead-ness of it as a line can be used to advantage in one situation, as part of the overall leader construction.
The other situation that I find, and it depends on the fly fishermen. Some fishers are experts, it just a thing that comes natural, at being able to maintain a consistent rhythm of accurate and careful casting (on a slower moving 'surface' water situation), all day long. They're fishermen who have a more consistent style, that is useful to work around the problem, and incentive-ize a trout to get curious in a lure, over a prolonged time. From a point of view of casting 'lift off', and even the actual 'take' from the trout, the extra spring-i-ness of monofilament (even if the diameter of tippet/leader isn't as low), and even if braking strain isn't as high, is more than compensated for, by the way that those anglers are able to leverage that leader flexibility (and it becomes a component of their entire fishing method).
These second kind of fishermen by the way, don't have to furiously investigate a lot of different kinds of patterns, lures and baits. They may do very respectably as fishers, for decades, using a few simple patterns and this same technique, which is sort of like violin playing to look at. You just know, to look at them work down a river stretch, they're going to find trout in places, others wouldn't.
When a fish takes something on a surface of a water, like a 'wet dry' cast of flies maybe, a leader construction that is too dead, make come as a disadvantage. It might suit certain styles of fishing, to have a little more flexibility there, when that fish strikes hard on a line that might be pretty darn straight when the fish takes. You don't want to get a hard strike, that is so fast and strong, that you end up loosing contact with the fish having coaxed it, so skillfully. And a lot of guys I know, who still like monofilament leader construction, are these types of fishermen, who need the flexibility in the leader.
That's not to say, that you can compromise, and go for a little of both worlds too. If one wants to make a pretty decent dry fly (surface) leader, a compromise, between the flexibility and larger diameter of monofilament on the back-end of the leader - with the in-flexibility and dead-ness of fluorocarbon, with it's tiny cross section on the front end of a leader, isn't a bad combination at all. It still gives a little bit of flexibility, so when a re-cast is done, on the lift off the water, the leader is able to 'spring' just a little, because it's half-and-half monofilament. On a delicate dry fly rod, that bit of spring that the upper mono part of the leader provides, can be used also, to help to 'load' the tip of one's dry fly rod.
Everything is a part of the 'system' that working here, in a dynamic way, both in terms of casting across a time span of seconds, and a time span of hours in terms of fishing style over the entire day. The fishing style of the fisherman, the water conditions, the lure type, the depth of fishing, it all comes into the eventual choice of leader.
would you mind providing more specifics on your leader build? i heard 20 lb butt section then after that it wasn't clear to me. thank you.
Adam, It is a grizzly soft hackle patch from Whiting. Thanks for watching. Kelly
Adam, I use 12 inches of 20lb for the butt, and 18 to 36 inches of 12lb for the tippet. Thanks for watching, KG
Excellent informative video. I do have a question: Did Miguel come in to this country LEGALY? Was he born here? LOL
I want the elasticity that mono gives me when a big fish punches the fly............. 0.4% increased strength, really. By time knot strength is factored in its probably less than that.
Respectfully, fluorocarbon being slightly stronger is a marketing farce. I have tested both, on both tension strength and abrasion strength and mono every single time has won.
I respect your opinion but couldn't disagree more when it comes to good fluorocarbon. Give regular Rio Mono 4x or any other brand a test against Trouthunter, Cortland Top Secret, or Seaguar 4x and I guarantee it will be stronger. There are definitely some much weaker brands out there but if you test any of the above three I think you will see a huge differnce - John
I see the same. It’s the knot strength I see is way more brittle in flouro . Seaguar blue label was nicer feeling but it broke on big strong runs with steelhead at the knot so easily with 8 lb where I used 6 lb stren mono and had very little issues. The diameter was larger but it was too stiff if I went up to 10 lb flouro which matched a 8 lb mono
fly fishing, is thinking!
IT'S A LONG WAY AROUND THE BARN!!!
You didn't talk at all about stretch. Mono stretches, fluoro doesn't.
I agree. I'm no pro, but I use mono on flies where the trout strikes hard. Moreso if I am using a cheap reel that has more static friction than dynamic (in other words, it sticks before it gets going). I use mono on streamers because they hit hard.
You can also rub fluoro with a candle to make it float, and pass mono through a surfactant to make it sink faster, though I'm way too lazy to do that.
Fluoro actually has more stretch than mono, especially in smaller diameter tippet such as 4/5/6x.
Hey I got guru pulse “mono” line they said it sinks can I use it as a tippet
Jerrett, not sure what it is but if it is mono yes you can use it. KG
@@TheSlideinn thanks
Does it matter to use dark or clear tippet
@@Southguy42 , I dont think it makes much difference, and in some cases I like the dark tippet, I used the Maxima Chameleon for years and it is brown, I have seen times on dry flies where I thought it was an advantage when it is really sunny? KG
Hopefully we go fishing one day
3X fluorocarbon is not 4/10ths stronger, but 4/10ths of a pound stronger than 3X nylon....not a big difference in my opinion.
Love the straight shooing reviews.
what does ox mean
Ox is like 15-20lb test 1x is like 10-15lbb test 2x is less poundage and so on. 7x is like 2.4lb test
Smaller the number the heavier the line the bigger the number the lighter the line so 0x would be like 15-20 lb line where 7x is like 2lb test hope that helps
At 11 minuted into the video, from the sounds that pup is making.....Kelly, you should go see how much money "Bell" is chewing up in product! Likely a cork handle of a Sage, Loomis, Scott or Winston rod.
Fluorocarbon is able to break the surface tension of water
well... if you are in your twenties and heavily tatted ...buying $200 swim baits on $700 rigs... you simply MUST be into "fluoro" it's a must.
9
wow, I can't even finish watching this....
Don't let your brain make you pay for stuff ,you do not need . mono works great don't over think it is not brain surgery
Diet Coke Kelly?
Yes, junkie
3x as much money. Lol. yeah if you're a chump who buys the tippet spools from fly shops. Lots of quality fluoro out there sold as spinning/casting line. Same stuff? I dunno, but it works well.
Kevin Kresowaty it's not the same. fc made for spinning reels is roughly 20 to 30 % thicker depending on the brand of tippet you use. Thicker line has some advantages but I feel the negatives out way them. Line diameter is the single most important factor for tippet. The thinner your line, the more natural the movement is in the current, the faster your fly gets down in the current with less weight, and with all the 4 k video underwater I have seen, thinner mono is less visible then even slightly thicker fc.
You have to compare sizes. The actual diameter is listed on the labels. If you buy line that is 20% or 30% thicker than what you want that is your own fault for not reading the labels. For example, 4lb PLine 100% Fluoro is as good as anything out there and more than thin enough to use with small flies. I've used it with flies down to #20 with fantastic success. Furthermore, if you looked in the boats of a lot of guides floating the Madison you'd see bulk spools of PLine and Seaguar. If you want to throw money away on 30 yard spools, go for it. I fish too much to spend $20 on a single tiny spool of a single size of tippet. Fly shop tippet ain't magic stuff.
I hear ya on that, I have used spiderwire fc on stocked trout in MD and PA. but when I drive 3 hours to the upper Delaware, I'm using the strongest thinnest line I can get. The trout there have masters degrees on how to not get caught. A trip last year, I used the spiderwire fc for half the trip, and then went to Rio fc for the second half the trip. My strikes went up double. Rio being the thinnest tippet per lb. Locals told me it matters, in that low clear water that week anyway. Every river/stream/creek is different. But if your out west, which I figure from your comment, with all due respect, you have no clue what fishing pressure is. Your most crowded days aren't even half as bad ours. I live a hour from the birthplace of American fly fishing. Trying to fish where 80 % of the population lives sucks, hunting is even worse. but it makes you better. Got to look for any advantage you can get.
Well, Spiderwire fluoro is junk... ...so there's your problem. I never said the cheapest fluoros are good. Pline is still around $20 a spool, but again you get 300 yards. Likewise, the Berkely and Stren fluoros are junk and the cheaper versions of Seaguar and PLine are not so hot either.
Also, don't assume that trout out west are unpressured. That is true of smaller streams, but the fish on the Madison see plenty of flies. Ever heard of the Beaverhead? Well, you ain't seen pressure until you float the first couple miles below Clark Canyon dam. In fact, if you've never fished the west it's easy to be dissapointed when you see just how many people are on the water on the famous rivers.
And one last thing, I live PA and often fish the popular limestone influenced streams in the central part of the state. They are as pressured as anywhere. PLine still works like a charm.
Do you use P-Line Halo, Kevin?
gotta dump that diet coke buddy
dogpill
Sponsored by Diet Coke.
they are two different lines ! you can't even compare them in the same breath ! one is for one application and the other for another . one sinks and one doesn't ! it's not some great epiphany !
If you dont agree with his videos.. stop watching them. Simple
Kelly that’s why I carry both. Simple