The Stan Lee comment was not actually "dogging" on the versus community. He was discussing comics themselves, because someone asked him who would win in a fight between (if I remember correctly) Thor vs Hulk. SO MANY people take that quote out of context. It has nothing to do with versus debates.
THANK YOU And yeah it definitely was Hulk Vs Thor since those debates eventually went out of control Like, yeah if you're discussing Goku Vs Superman, who the heck is the author? No one
@masterbeast-sz1yq Not every version is canon, just Golden and Silver age, Pre and Post Crisis and Rebirth, and New 52 versions of Superman are the ones that are canon and fall under the same being the same Superman, 1 million prime is All-Star Superman
if you took their powers away Superman would still win, his advantage in raw strength is that big. Goku's not even a more experienced martial artist, but he IS absolutely more skilled in it. It's just, taking all their powers away does not make that the only factor left. And even if that was the case, like they said, Superman's been stripped of his powers and defeated master martial artists like Goku anyway. and yeah like everyone said, that was not Superman 1 Million lol, they made it very clear at the start which versions would be in use. Superman does charge up that fast in the sun, there are tons of examples of this. 1 Million was something entirely different
28:11 He was able to shoulder press the weight of the earth for 5 days straight with barely dropping a sweat. one he did this without using Yellow Sunlight which increases his power back and two that wasn't even his limit that's only scratching the surface of his strength.
This Superman is the current mainline "Infinite Frontier" which is a explict canon composite between every previous mainline version. Superman Prime wasn't used but outright mentioned as an elseworld which they wouldnt be focusing on here. That Golden Superman is just his Sundipped Form
Ultra instinct IS a technique but one that is not supposed to be used by mortals. Gokus' saiyan biology changes it to a transformation to help his body adapt to the power. So, it is both a transformation and a technique.
3:21 I can tell you the reason behind that. Besides the fact writers don't want the earth to blow up with every attack it's also that the characters don't want the same thing. So the ki or energy stuff you see 8s concentrated into itself so only the damage is in the blast itself and nothing outside of it. Like how a nuke with same amount of power is less deviating in space than it would be on earth. Less interactions with the environment and all that. Except the characters can control that factor and any damage to the environment wr do see is usually ether because the character can't fully control said effect because their own power was outside their own expectations/ control to a degree. The resulting effect being from a knock on effect the power itself had( such as a character being blown back by the power or something )or again the character trying not blow up the planet but potentially get an advantage at debris flying about. Thus the term ki control. Ultra instinct doesn't mean you can't get hit no matter what. It means you get maxed dodge stats relevant to your powerlevel. Basically think of it as an rpg stat where even if you got max side stats but are level 1 you'll still get owned by level 100 with max side stats. Mostly because the higher overall stat compounds the effect of the side stats regardless if they are maxed out themselves to begin with.
A couple things. Yes, i can see why the heroes would care about restricting themselves to prevent earth from getting destroyed, but what does earth's destruction mean to the villians? Vegeta, Cell, Buu, Freeza, And Beerus all at some point actively wanted to destroy the earth and made an attempt to (Beerus changed his mind after his fight.) So why would they care to control their Ki? Also, the Ultra Instinct thing is inconsistent. It's not strictly based on your power. Roshi in the manga uses a type of Ultra Instinct to dodge Jiren. In no universe is Roshi's power level close enough to Jiren to allow him to dodge his attacks, even for a second. So, the fact that he was dodging him means power level is not a factor. You can chalk all this up to plot. But, it's still bad and inconsistent writing.
I won't deny inconsistent writing. In the end, that's up to the creators vision of the story. We, the ones who pick up on things that the creators missed or didn't focus on as part of the narrative, may never agree on a consensus. Just know if you're going to enter death battle, you're going to see some unpleasant things. From the comments anyway. These are characters people cherish usually.
Also, sorry for coming off as hostile if I did. Just want to say I appreciate you responding. I know that isn't exactly a big deal when you're still a small creator comparatively, but the effort is what matters to me and potentially many others who watch your channel.
@@DJ-LD I feel you, I am a bigger DBZ fan than a DC fan. But, I just hate the bad writing during the Super series. Z had some issues, but it was nothing compared to Super. I get they want to shift from raw power to technique, but it goes against what's already been established. And no hard feelings. I like debating, and sometimes I can get "passionate," lol. But as long as no names are being thrown around, or my argument is being straw-manned, I'm not taking offense.
@@RedLordOfAlagaddaI do wonder if Saitama would be able to creep in power eventually. It depends what happens when he fights god - he's already doing up goofy shenanigans like somehow kicking portals in the manga adaptation lol, he's not even that far off from toonforce anymore
Bat 🦇 Man 👨 is so insane right now in The Current DC Universe. He can defeat Cyclops- a guy who can literally shoot Super Man 👨 levels of Death 💀 Lasers out of his eyes 👀, The Kingpin- a guy who literally gets beat down by Spider 🕷️ Man 👨 and gets run 🏃♂️ over by cars 🚗, Gambit, Beast- Super human Strength, Speed, Agility and Durability and Intelligence, Luke Cage- basically Power Man 👨, The Punisher, Moon 🌙 Knight e.t.c. He’s gotten too O.P. For a human!
I don’t understand Goku fans. Goku gains a new ability every arc, but reactors who are Goku fans always complain that Superman is overpriced. Goku also has no weaknesses.
14:55 Super is better more consistently than GT but GT hits highs that Super can only dream of. Plus, SS4 makes more sense. Edit: that being said, Beast Gohan is probably one of my favorite things in all of Dragon Ball.
When it comes to saitama he just isn't that strong in comparison to the rest of fiction. Like at all. He's around galaxy level. Which is impressive for his world but a large amount of fictional characters are far, far above that. For example, both Goku and Superman would defeat him in a single shot.
Can u please react to Seth’s how strong is saber vid she belongs to the strongest franchise in fiction with their base abilities giving them immeasurable speed. & my power scaling subscriptions r all the proof we need, my other subs also prove it has the best written characters in anime.(which I made a playlist for) Like generic anime channel’s shirou vid. It’s billion$ budget & ufotable even come together to give us peak animation like u never seen before.
I could be wrong, but I don't think Superman's limits are because of his body or strength. His limits are more mental. He has mental blocks that prevent him from using his full power. Now if he trained as hard mentally as Goku does physically, then he could become truly OP.
They use hyperbole statements as feats, and a hipotetical composite Superwank by death battle version. They ignore coherency and anti-feats, and nerf CC/Xeno/DBS Goku feats. They ignore Jump Force Goku version and God Fusion Goku version. Jump Force Goku beats Prometheus (He >>> all franchises manga and real world). God Fusion Goku breaks the fourth wall by being the only fusion method in which a Dragon Ball character can merge with real-life people. Composite all Goku versions beats all Superman versions.
@SpenceJS87 LMFAO true. The neglect of being able to stand to shit like the World Forger and Dr. Manhattan is insane, not to mention bringing in non canon shit like JF
@@SpenceJS87 They said that Superman has no limits, now they say that he does have limits and yet now they consider Superman more powerful than before. xD Not even they themselves have clear ideas. Now they talk about a hypothetical and supposed Superman merged with his old versions based on a hyperbole statement that says "all stories will be remembered" (it doesn't even mention the word fusion, equivalent to Goku 100 years later). Using this as an excuse to fuse 5 or more versions of Superman against 3 versions of Goku that they haven't even analyzed properly. Reducing Goku to the universal level when Goku in the beginning of DBS already far exceeded the universal level, while he and Beerus were playing in a friendly fight. This is a joke.
@type-pro3907 you realize that they have a very clear idea what they're doing and have acknowledged their previous logic to be faulty? That was the point of this episode, to do it right and give the characters their due. You are just *yapping*.
The Stan Lee comment was not actually "dogging" on the versus community. He was discussing comics themselves, because someone asked him who would win in a fight between (if I remember correctly) Thor vs Hulk.
SO MANY people take that quote out of context. It has nothing to do with versus debates.
THANK YOU
And yeah it definitely was Hulk Vs Thor since those debates eventually went out of control
Like, yeah if you're discussing Goku Vs Superman, who the heck is the author? No one
They didn't use Prime 1 million. They only used main Superman
Plus, every version of suprman is a main. So guko will choose his way in death with ez 😂
@masterbeast-sz1yq Not every version is canon, just Golden and Silver age, Pre and Post Crisis and Rebirth, and New 52 versions of Superman are the ones that are canon and fall under the same being the same Superman, 1 million prime is All-Star Superman
@@masterbeast-sz1yq this is just false, not every version of superman is main lol
@@kaku4434 the ones they mention are main continuity, that being earth 1 main canon superman. So those are main Superman
@@kaku4434 Superman prime one million, injustice superman, red son, earth x Superman are not main continuity and not applicable.
That wasn't Superman prime 1 million, it was Sun-dipped Superman
if you took their powers away Superman would still win, his advantage in raw strength is that big. Goku's not even a more experienced martial artist, but he IS absolutely more skilled in it. It's just, taking all their powers away does not make that the only factor left. And even if that was the case, like they said, Superman's been stripped of his powers and defeated master martial artists like Goku anyway.
and yeah like everyone said, that was not Superman 1 Million lol, they made it very clear at the start which versions would be in use. Superman does charge up that fast in the sun, there are tons of examples of this. 1 Million was something entirely different
28:11 He was able to shoulder press the weight of the earth for 5 days straight with barely dropping a sweat. one he did this without using Yellow Sunlight which increases his power back and two that wasn't even his limit that's only scratching the surface of his strength.
This Superman is the current mainline "Infinite Frontier" which is a explict canon composite between every previous mainline version. Superman Prime wasn't used but outright mentioned as an elseworld which they wouldnt be focusing on here. That Golden Superman is just his Sundipped Form
This wasn’t there first fight on death battle that’s why they seem like friends
Ultra instinct IS a technique but one that is not supposed to be used by mortals. Gokus' saiyan biology changes it to a transformation to help his body adapt to the power. So, it is both a transformation and a technique.
3:21 I can tell you the reason behind that. Besides the fact writers don't want the earth to blow up with every attack it's also that the characters don't want the same thing. So the ki or energy stuff you see 8s concentrated into itself so only the damage is in the blast itself and nothing outside of it. Like how a nuke with same amount of power is less deviating in space than it would be on earth. Less interactions with the environment and all that. Except the characters can control that factor and any damage to the environment wr do see is usually ether because the character can't fully control said effect because their own power was outside their own expectations/ control to a degree. The resulting effect being from a knock on effect the power itself had( such as a character being blown back by the power or something )or again the character trying not blow up the planet but potentially get an advantage at debris flying about.
Thus the term ki control.
Ultra instinct doesn't mean you can't get hit no matter what. It means you get maxed dodge stats relevant to your powerlevel.
Basically think of it as an rpg stat where even if you got max side stats but are level 1 you'll still get owned by level 100 with max side stats. Mostly because the higher overall stat compounds the effect of the side stats regardless if they are maxed out themselves to begin with.
51:53 well. Now you have to see beerus vs sailor galaxia.
A couple things. Yes, i can see why the heroes would care about restricting themselves to prevent earth from getting destroyed, but what does earth's destruction mean to the villians? Vegeta, Cell, Buu, Freeza, And Beerus all at some point actively wanted to destroy the earth and made an attempt to (Beerus changed his mind after his fight.) So why would they care to control their Ki?
Also, the Ultra Instinct thing is inconsistent. It's not strictly based on your power. Roshi in the manga uses a type of Ultra Instinct to dodge Jiren. In no universe is Roshi's power level close enough to Jiren to allow him to dodge his attacks, even for a second. So, the fact that he was dodging him means power level is not a factor.
You can chalk all this up to plot. But, it's still bad and inconsistent writing.
I won't deny inconsistent writing. In the end, that's up to the creators vision of the story. We, the ones who pick up on things that the creators missed or didn't focus on as part of the narrative, may never agree on a consensus. Just know if you're going to enter death battle, you're going to see some unpleasant things. From the comments anyway. These are characters people cherish usually.
Also, sorry for coming off as hostile if I did. Just want to say I appreciate you responding. I know that isn't exactly a big deal when you're still a small creator comparatively, but the effort is what matters to me and potentially many others who watch your channel.
@@DJ-LD I feel you, I am a bigger DBZ fan than a DC fan. But, I just hate the bad writing during the Super series. Z had some issues, but it was nothing compared to Super. I get they want to shift from raw power to technique, but it goes against what's already been established. And no hard feelings. I like debating, and sometimes I can get "passionate," lol. But as long as no names are being thrown around, or my argument is being straw-manned, I'm not taking offense.
Saitama is actually weak when it comes to comic characters but strong in anime.
Comics have more broken feats than manga/animes overall
You look good with your head shaved. Props to a fellow of the same glorious skull shape, not all are blessed we are.
Popeye>saitama 😊
You take that BACK!
@@DevonDaVinci heheheheh
@@DevonDaVinciGo watch the fight. They did a Death Battle on it.
True. Neither are really that strong, but Popeye is definitely stronger than Saitama.
@@RedLordOfAlagaddaI do wonder if Saitama would be able to creep in power eventually. It depends what happens when he fights god - he's already doing up goofy shenanigans like somehow kicking portals in the manga adaptation lol, he's not even that far off from toonforce anymore
Bat 🦇 Man 👨 is so insane right now in The Current DC Universe. He can defeat Cyclops- a guy who can literally shoot Super Man 👨 levels of Death 💀 Lasers out of his eyes 👀, The Kingpin- a guy who literally gets beat down by Spider 🕷️ Man 👨 and gets run 🏃♂️ over by cars 🚗, Gambit, Beast- Super human Strength, Speed, Agility and Durability and Intelligence, Luke Cage- basically Power Man 👨, The Punisher, Moon 🌙 Knight e.t.c. He’s gotten too O.P. For a human!
Captain america vs the nationl dept
I don’t understand Goku fans. Goku gains a new ability every arc, but reactors who are Goku fans always complain that Superman is overpriced. Goku also has no weaknesses.
Friday night dinner has a season 6 on Netflix
14:55 Super is better more consistently than GT but GT hits highs that Super can only dream of. Plus, SS4 makes more sense.
Edit: that being said, Beast Gohan is probably one of my favorite things in all of Dragon Ball.
Luv you ❤
Why do the lanterns stick to only the visible light spectrum?
They don't. There was a recent story about this.
37:57
Warch saitama vs popeye its a fun one.
51:43: One of us! One of us! XD
Supermsn but ghe nearest star is encased in a dyson sphere
Dolly madison vs little debbie
فيه مقطع من قناه اسمها ديث باتل سوا مقطع عن سوبرمان ضد غوكو تامقطع نزل قبل 5 شهور اتمنى تشوفه وتنزل رياكشن عليه
R.I.P the goat Akira Toriyama 😭😭😭
The goal posts keep getting moved, because Toriyama was not that great of a writer.
have you stopped reacting to british shows now?
Too bad. RUclips has deleted my suggestion for new history reactions... 😩
They're a coming
When it comes to saitama he just isn't that strong in comparison to the rest of fiction.
Like at all. He's around galaxy level. Which is impressive for his world but a large amount of fictional characters are far, far above that.
For example, both Goku and Superman would defeat him in a single shot.
Galactus vs Boots Void
Can u please react to Seth’s how strong is saber vid she belongs to the strongest franchise in fiction with their base abilities giving them immeasurable speed. & my power scaling subscriptions r all the proof we need, my other subs also prove it has the best written characters in anime.(which I made a playlist for) Like generic anime channel’s shirou vid. It’s billion$ budget & ufotable even come together to give us peak animation like u never seen before.
❤️
Imagine suprman starts training like guko 😂
I could be wrong, but I don't think Superman's limits are because of his body or strength. His limits are more mental. He has mental blocks that prevent him from using his full power. Now if he trained as hard mentally as Goku does physically, then he could become truly OP.
Superman doesn't need to he was already combat trained by Batman and wonder he also learned kryptonian martial art's
Batman vs Bathermaphrodyte
Superman is pretty much just plot armor, same as goku. Blue star, yellow star, 100x gravity training, super sayan all the same lazy wrighting.
They use hyperbole statements as feats, and a hipotetical composite Superwank by death battle version. They ignore coherency and anti-feats, and nerf CC/Xeno/DBS Goku feats. They ignore Jump Force Goku version and God Fusion Goku version. Jump Force Goku beats Prometheus (He >>> all franchises manga and real world). God Fusion Goku breaks the fourth wall by being the only fusion method in which a Dragon Ball character can merge with real-life people. Composite all Goku versions beats all Superman versions.
🧂
@SpenceJS87 LMFAO true. The neglect of being able to stand to shit like the World Forger and Dr. Manhattan is insane, not to mention bringing in non canon shit like JF
@@vick7868 Xeno and CC are non-canon and they bringing this.
@@SpenceJS87 They said that Superman has no limits, now they say that he does have limits and yet now they consider Superman more powerful than before. xD Not even they themselves have clear ideas.
Now they talk about a hypothetical and supposed Superman merged with his old versions based on a hyperbole statement that says "all stories will be remembered" (it doesn't even mention the word fusion, equivalent to Goku 100 years later). Using this as an excuse to fuse 5 or more versions of Superman against 3 versions of Goku that they haven't even analyzed properly. Reducing Goku to the universal level when Goku in the beginning of DBS already far exceeded the universal level, while he and Beerus were playing in a friendly fight. This is a joke.
@type-pro3907 you realize that they have a very clear idea what they're doing and have acknowledged their previous logic to be faulty? That was the point of this episode, to do it right and give the characters their due. You are just *yapping*.