Haha I was looking around at all my chillers the other day and thought.. I should make this video, but glad you did and it was fun to see your perspective. Overall, I hate chilling no matter what I use
Well said, as there are several chilling methods from immersion to plate, to even a glycol chiller. It really is a matter of your brewing preference, what you are looking to accomplish, and what your investment is at the time. Thank you for sharing this helpful overview. We appreciate your insight and thank you for the shout-out on the Therminator™.
Nice analysis. I use immersion chillers in my 3 kettles but I recirculate the water through a big blue barrel of ice water with a dedicated pump and manifold setup. I can use the valves in the manifolds to slow down the flow and maximize chilling efficiency. When done chilling, I can reuse the chiller water to fill more 2L bottles to freeze for the next brew day.
I use an immersion chiller when the groundwater is cold, and a second one in an ice bucket to lower the groundwater temperature when it is warm. I freeze large chunks of ice and also 2 L bottles to float in the bucket to keep from melting quickly.
Slowing down the melt defeats the purpose. The phase-change from the melt is where you get your cooling. It takes 80 calories of heat to melt 1 gram of ice without even raising its temperature. That is the amount that would otherwise otherwise raise that gram of water by 80ºC or 133.3ºF. The faster that ice melts into your cooling water, the faster it takes the heat from the wort.
I use a JaDeD Cyclone counterflow chiller and love it. It has all the benefits of a counterflow chiller, plus you can disassemble it for cleaning with a brush.
Great video, AB! I have a Clawhammer Supply system so I use a plate chiller. It chills pretty fast but I’ve had hop particles get in there and I have to flush the pc a lot to make sure I get them all out.
I'm a fan of immersion chillers because they're easy to clean and that's doubled by not requiring a pump. Nothing to wash out,saves me so much time and hassle.
I've been doing no-chill for a few months now. I live in Canada and i brew outside so i just leave my kettle out there over night. I'll get back to using my wort chiller in the spring once my outside tap is thawed.
Southeast Ontario, here. Especially using an all-in-one electric in an apartment condo, I've just brewing outside on the patio. I also want to do more keg fermentation, so chilling it the rest of the way in the kegerator would be viable and sanitary.
Australia here, also summer, My tap water is too hot to effectively chill, it was 42c here 3 days ago and this is the first day under 35c in over a week. I use no chill bags from kegland, cheap as and they work a charm. When I chill I use the immersion chiller with the recirculation pump running
Great video! A chiller (no matter how basic) makes a huge difference! When i first started brewing, I had to pour from gallon buckets back into the boiler to try and speed chilling. That worked much better than just waiting but sucked greatly. The incredibly basic stainless steel immersion cooler I have now is such a crazy game changer. Getting just basic chilling makes a vast difference in the time and quality of the brew.
Great stuff. And thanks for speaking to our GRiST home brew club the other night! A club member gave me his old immersion chiller, so this video will be helpful. I've been doing the ice bath until now.
Love the video !! Your content has been entertaining and informative!! For my chilling method , I use an immersion chiller and have had great results .. but to save water and reuse water I built a recirculating chiller system .. - COOLER /w submersible pump - attached to immersion chiller .. first pass I save water and use for cleaning later .. then after water is lukewarm , I just replenish ice while the water recirculates! Saves more water in the end and reuses the HOT water that flows thru for the cleaning ..
Nice Video. Question for you: I usually transfer almost all of my contents of the kettle into the fermenter. You stated that the debris or gunk at the bottom is not fermentable and was trub. I thought trub was the by-product after fermentation. Either way- if trub, it sounds like i should stop placing into the fermenter. Is this correct? If so, learned something new. Thanks for any comments.
Trub is a byproduct of the brewing process not the fermentation. Some trub will still usually show up in the fermenter as the wort settles though. The only byproduct of fermentation that drops out is spent yeast. It's not going to adversely affect the beers flavor if trub stays in fermentation it just absorbs liquid and makes you get less at the end of the process
Steve, great job, and I love the breakdown! I'm sticking with BBQ Larry on this one as we both prefer Jaded Scyclla Chillers as they are like 3 high-quality copper immersion chillers in one and are capable of chilling to within 10 degrees (Fahrenheit) of your tap water in about 5 minutes with agitation (assuming you don't restrict the flow with a skinny hose). (Plus, if you are concerned about water waste, all three options could include using a sump pump in a pot or large bucket with reusable frozen cold packs.) My only significant concern with the counterflow and plater chillers is that I can't see what is inside them from previous use and cleanings. Like STDs, you don't know you have a problem until it is too late. Plus, never use a plate chiller when using phantasm powder in a whirlpool; it's absolutely the worst nightmare I've ever had cleaning a plate chiller.
JaDeD chillers are ones I have yet to try but I've heard nothing but praise. Unfortunately I'd need to figure out a false bottom or something in my system because of the exposed element
I have regular immersion chillers Recently got a Used CUSS one same design as Jaded. In Az winter weather I chill to 70F in usually 10-12 minutes. So, maybe this summer will take 20??? We will see. Good video as usual Steve
After figuring out a process, I really like the Blichmann Therminator. Throwing pellet hops directly in the kettle was too much and cooling would suffer. Never had a clog, but it would slow down. Switched to using a suspended hop bag (think of BIAB for hops) and it's so much better. After the brew day, I hit it with a garden hose each way, then blow out with compressed air. If I feel the need, I'll fill up a Home Depot 2.5 gallon bucket with hot water and PBW then let the Therminator sit in that for a while. That gets it super clean and, basically, no work needed.
A great way to improve chilling speed with immersion chillers is half fill with water to a large bucket and the rest with ice and use a submersible pump and recirculate. I do that after hitting a target temp of 40-35°C. Brings the wort temp down really quick.
I use an immersion chiller. Stainless steel and it is compatible with the Hozelock (garden hose) fittings system here in the UK. Simply push-click the input and output on and off. Runs off my outside tap. It does use a ton of water but I try to recycle that into two water butts in the garden (fine in the summer, not so much this time of year!). It chills a 19-23 litre batch in 30 mins.
This is awesome info!!! We use Exchillerator counterflows on our 1bbl herms and our 12 gallon propane system and we use a stainless immersion on our all in one pilot brew system. The plate chillers always worried us with making sure they are clean for the next brew day so we have avoided them.
I have used a Hop Spider and Plate chiller for 8yrs now. Never had a single clog, or any infections. Key to the plate is to flush water through the plate, opposite of the flow of wort, HOT water. Also is to put the plate chiller in line when you start the whirlpool so it will get heated to over 160f for 10 minutes. Compact, durable, better water usage, and cheaper than counter flow chillers.
Good timing. Have been looking at new chill solution. I do no-chill and have a immersion chiller. In a brewzilla you can circulate the beer while chilling so that is simple. However, my water is not terribly cold so cooling slows down quite a bit and takes a while. I collect the water and pour in the garden so I don't waste, but I'd rather be done faster. I have a bunch of old gear laying around and am toying with the idea of using an old 7 gallon cooler in a jockey-box type setup. But instead of the output being for serving, it would output to the fermentor.
Good video. After using a great immersion chiller i found my desire to get a counterflow chiller to almost vanish. I can chill a batch in 12-15 min. That's likely not much more time than using a counter flow considering it needs to be flushed and cleaned.
@@TheApartmentBrewer I would almost consider "cheap" vs "great" immersion chiller as different categories... But I guess that's the same for everything!
I use a stainless steel immersion chiller. I also use it during fermentation. I put my fermenter in a large cooler of water with the immersion chiller next to it. I have an aquarium pump in another smaller cooler of ice water (frozen 2l bottles) hooked up to the immersion chiller. An Inkbird temp probe is taped to the side of the fermenter. When it gets over the set value, the pump kicks on circulating ice water through the chiller, which cools the water the fermenter sits in. It's an easy way to get pretty precise temperature control, especially when fermenting lagers. I had everything laying around the house, so it is very cheap. I just need to swap the 2 liter bottles for frozen ones twice a day. I'll buy a dedicated refrigerator eventually, but for now, this works great.
I have used an immersion chiller with the pump recirculating ice water from a bucket. Worked really great and used a fraction of the water I normally use.
Awesome content as usual. Is there a product you know of that breaks down grain and hops? I have a plate chiller that blocks constantly. I've spent over an hour some days flushing water back and forth in both directions and still getting grain and hop residue coming out. It's never truly clean so It'd be handy if there was a product that would break these organic materials down and allow the plate chiller to be flushed clean more effectively.
I've always had great results with flushing my system with hot high-concentration PBW. It won't necessarily break down organic material but it's very good at unsticking it from the metal.
Currently using a SS immersion chiller. It was adequate for my 5gal kettle, but not sure it will work as well in the 10gal electric kettle I built with the element in the kettle and false bottom. Been thinking about a counterflow; do you need a pump to move wort through (like in a plate chiller), or would it work gravity-fed? Thinking of putting a valve on the chiller wort-out to regulate flow through the chiller, and a cooler of ice water with a small aquarium pump to recirculate cooling water through the chiller and cut water usage. I’d be interested in the collective experience of the group on this plan. Thanks!
Jaded brewing hands down. I use it with 40 pounds of ice and my chilling times are down from boiling to pitching ale temps in like 7 -10 mins. On a colder day I can use less ice as last time I brewed on a cold day I used 14 pounds of ice. Best investment in breeding I have made in a long time.
1)My biggest con against immersion chillers is that they may be heavy and when rested on the heating element, they may damage it. I had to by a raised false bottom, but that was an added cost. BUT they are great if you use a burner. 2) I clogged my plate chiller on the second run so I threw it away. 3) I got the Spike counterflow and last night was able to chill my wort from 201F to 55F in one pass. I recirculate from a 44 qrt cooler with ice to preserve water. This technique is usable up to 10 gallon batches.
I just used some copper tubing to make 3 "arms" on the two vertical pipes on my immersion chiller to keep it sitting just above the element in my 15 gallon solo. Whirlpooling with the IC definitely increases the chilling speed.
@@TheApartmentBrewer I've seen people on some of the forums claim they rest their ic on the element without problems, I'm skeptical though. Definitely getting a cfc at some point but until then my ic with the arms I made to keep it off the element seems to do the job.
I just got a Jaded Scylla and I doubt I'll ever use anything else. I chilled from boiling to 57F in 13 minutes with a ground water temp of about 52F. And when I got done I rinsed it off and put it on a shelf to dry. I recently tried a counter flow chiller but found that with the additional cleaning required it actually added time to my brew day, which was part of my reason for wanting to switch it up from the basic immersion chiller I've been using for years.
When i first started i used to just move the 5 gal pot into the sink with iced water, it used to take about 40 mins to lower the temp. In an effort to shorten my brew day, i started to use a home made immersion chiller i made. I moved and now i noticed that using the immersion chiller it takes me to 84-80 degrees but struggles to get any lower ( Florida tap water @ 76-78). I was originally set on a counterflow, now considering a a pump pushing ices water or even a plate chiller (which i have avoided for the same reasons mentioned here)
I brew mainly lagers and no-chill is working like a charm for me. So nice to just put the lid on and call it a day. But I wouldn't recommend it for more hop forward beers with large late hop additions. For those I use my immersion chiller.
I have used all except a platechiller, and the counterflow is the process in my brewing that saves the most time out of all so yeah I put my money were it counts, into saving time.
Yeah, and for lagers I do several passes thru the brewkettle for even colder temps. The groundwater temp here in Sweden is around 4 degrees celsius around winter time.@@vruychev
I have linked together two immersion chillers together for my setup, one i got when i first started brewing, the other I got off of FB marketplace where someone sold it as a set with some other items. I got some worm clamps and clamped the smaller one inside the ring of the other one, and then cut some tubing to link them together. It really increases the surface area which does great to cool off a 5 gallon batch. At some point I would like to get a counterflow, but for right now my the two immersion chillers do great.
Thanks!@@TheApartmentBrewer I had to look up the Jaded Chiller but I guess I did put together a DIY version. It was much cheaper than a Jaded one, but is not nearly as fancy.
I've played around with a lot of different methods. I've made solid brews with the no chill method but don't particularly like it. IC is fine in the winter but can take a while in the summer (TX), and I waste a lot of water. I've tried IC connected to a sump pump sitting in ice-cold water. Can actually get my beer down to lager pitching temps, but it's a headache to set up and the flow rate is super slow. My current method is a CFC. Worked in about 20 minutes this weekend, but the groundwater is cold right now. If I had a pump that was worth a damn, I think this method could work great in the summer. It also takes a bit of prep as I have to run boiling water through it before and after brew day. There is no perfect method I suppose
I have a Jaded Hydra immersion chiller and the Exchillerator counterflow, I find myself using the immersion chiller way more due to less things to clean(hoses,pumps, etc). That being said I don’t love using the immersion with my Clawhammer system, but hooking it to a pulley helps keep the weight off of the element.
I’ve got all three. Nine times out of 10. I go for the counterflow chiller! The other time I’ll reach for my jaded Hydra immersion chiller. Cheers, Steve.
@@TheApartmentBrewer sometimes I like to brew old school with no pumps and that would be when I use it. Most of the time I use the CFC though and love it.
You can use less water in an immersion chiller if you lower the flow and stir quickly. At max flow, i can get down to 75 in about 6-7 minutes. You do have to stir an immersion chiller or it will take >30minutes. This is where the heat-resistant BIAB gloves come in handy. Also, you don’t need a pump which is nice.
A con to the immersion chiller and probably the counterflow as well is that if you haven't properly drained it, you risk it bursting if you store it in an unheated area and it freezes.
I just use the one that came with my Anvil and then let my fermentation chamber get the wort down the rest of the way over an hour or two to be honest. With AZ tap water temps there’s only so much I can really do lol. I’ve tried the pump with ice water method and it worked well but I’m so lazy at this point in my homebrewing that I don’t usually bother
I use an immersion chiller at the moment. I figured it to be a waste to just dump the water and I intend to buy a barrel for rainwater where I'll dump in my cooling water as well. I'm already spending money on an important resource, I might as well get multiple uses out of it.
I have been brewing for about 3 years. I started with the ice bath in the sink, that took 45 minutes or so . I bought an immersion chiller 2 years ago, dropping it in the kettle and running water took about 35-45 minutes. One day I grabbed the out tube and moved it up and down, and it almost burned my hand so I grabbed the in tube And started moving it up and down. Now it takes me 10-15 minutes to chill to 68 degrees. I don’t know if that is bad in some way but it’s fast
I have the Clawhammer plate chiller, is that what you use and if so, you can chill your wart strait from the kettle to fermenter in one pass? It didn’t work for me…I was only able to chill down to 90 degrees. I’m on Long Island and water is very cold this time of year.
When I used it I was able to get close to pitch temps but it usually landed around 80 F or so. Try slowing down the rate at which the wort travels through the chiller
I have done over 200 batches with no chill method, wort is left overnight in boil kettle with lid on. Never had an infection or a problem. You need some practice and few batches to adjust hop additions, whirlpool, etc. I won quite a few homebrew awards and medals. You can do all beer styles with no problem
How long do you leave the wort in the kettle? I was thinking of using this method, finishing a brew around 10pm and then transferring to a fermenter the next evening. So maybe 20ish hours later. Would that be too long?
After 3 years of brewing, I'm still using the crappy (not much copper) immersion chiller that came with my starter kit. SMH! But, I do like using an immersion chiller. I have my eye on a "HYDRA" chiller from JadDeD.
I've been making Belgian tripel beers. It's a little on the sweet side but the clove esters are unbelievable. Any advice on helping with head retention?
A little trick that always helps is to add 5-10% wheat malt to the grist. Does wonders for head retention. If you have the ability to step mash that helps as well
I am a newbie at brewing, only done it a couple of times, but this year I would invest in a real brewkettle, and I was thinking of using an immersion chiller, but instead of using tapwater I was thinking of using a powerfull pump and pumping rainwater from the citestern through it and back to the cistern. Would that work ?
You mentioned chilling helps precipitate out the solids, but it wasn't clear to me what you do after that. I'm still not totally sure how you'd get the trub out.
Hi i use the immersion chiller. Would like ti uograde to a counterflow. Just a quick question do you leave the hop spider in the wort during chilling or do you remove when the boil timer is finished? Thanks
One of the biggest drawbacks with both Plate and Counterflow Chillers is the need for a pump to circulate the wort. This is not a problem with Grainfather, Blickman, etc. type kettles. However, I have a Braumeister kettle which does not have such a pump, unless I modify the plumbing significantly. So unfortunately, it is an Immersion Chiller for me. To conserve cooling water I have a Cooling Water Pump that circulates my swimming pool water through the chiller via a couple of hosepipes
I have [and have] used each chiller that you have mentioned . Like you mentioned, they each have there strengths and weaknesses. My setup is better equipped for a counter flow chiller. Why I say that is I use a lot of whole cone hops because of our hopyard. I use a hop rocket as kind of another way to filter the beer while sending it on its way to the wort chiller while adding hops to the end of the brewing process. I don't use whole cone hops in every beer style, but I do use them in quite a few of the beers that we make. The amount of fresh aroma hops that we grow. I needed something that I know wasn't going to get clogged. We Brew out on the hop farm and we have well water with a storage tank and sometimes in the summer it is warmer than we like. I use a pre-chiller on the way to the counterchiller. Basically, it's a submersion chiller in a 5 gallon bucket with ice in it. (It's my old submersion chiller) Chilling out the well water before it hits the counter chiller. It works amazing on those hot days where it would take quite a bit of water and time to chill a large batch of beer. Sometimes I make up to 50 to 100 gallons just depends on the style i'm making. Just a thought that even though you have a chiller that you don't use. It could still be useful brewing equipment.
Your brewing setup sounds like a ton of fun especially with the fresh hop brews! Prechilling is absolutely a great strategy that a good number of folks use.
There is a much simpler way to chill your wort that costs nothing and requires no equipment. I typically end up with about 3 gallons of wort in my brew kettle, which I transfer to my 6.5-gallon bucket fermenter. Meanwhile, I have two 1-gallon jugs of water in the freezer, where they are frozen solid. After rinsing these jugs off with sanitizer, I let them bob around in the wort, which quickly cools it down, just like ice cubes in a cocktail. When the water in the jugs is melted, I simply pour that cool water into the wort, which brings me up to my target volume of 5 gallons. This simple process consistently cools my wort down to 75-77 degrees in less than 10 minutes. I live at high elevation, where water boils at just 198 degrees. At lower elevations, you might want to keep a third jug of water in the freezer. Also, do not use jugs shaped like standard plastic milk jugs, which are basically square, because you cannot fit two of these in a bucket fermenter. Instead, use the taller narrower jugs that are used to package many brands of spring water. I like the ones with a plastic handle around the neck, so I can bob them around in the wort, and easily pull them out when it is time to empty them.
I’ve used and owned all three. The immersion chiller works well but is a hassle. The plate chiller clogged no matter how often and long I cleaned it. I bought a counterflow chiller 7 or so years ago and called it a day. Save yourself the headache and go with a counterflow chiller.
Hey. Just curious. What was a hassle about the immersion chiller? I personally found it pretty good compared to the plate chiller. Even considering if it wouldn't clog and easy to clean.
@@MatBarbe I have my counterflow chiller mounted in position and never need to unhook or move water hose fittings. With an immersion chiller that isn’t an option given you need to boil first and then chill. Lifting and burning yourself or dropping scalding wort isn’t much of a thing when using a counterflow chiller. If you want to use a hop spider while trying to whirlpool, it’s in the way during trying to sterilize the immersion chiller. It works well for chilling, I just found the counterflow chiller to check all the boxes and the immersion chiller didn’t.
That is not the preferred method of cleaning. Sanitizer will absolutely skew the reading (starsan has a pH of like 1.5). Just rinse with distilled water and store in the appropriate storage solution
Put into the boil 10 minutes before shut off without hoses attached. Then, after you're done chilling wort and have transferred to fermentation vessel, I'd place hot water in the brew vessel you're going to clean anyways and scrub. I go for removing hop debris and residual sugar before storing. I'd use cleaner, but it could damage the chiller depending on the material.
You say that the plate chiller is hard to clean but wouldn’t counter chillers also have places for mold to hide too? I’m confused why it’s not the same.
So I use for just the second time using my Clawhammer system and brewed a beer so heavy in hops, that it clogged my bazooka kettle screen so bad it wouldn’t pass through the plate chiller. Used 9.5 oz of hops plus three hop shots totaling 15ml. I had to drop some of the hops straight in as the hop spider couldn’t hold any more. That has been the one complaint I’ve seen on their system.
@@Hannes_Lind yes and I wasn’t thinking. I’m still trying to get use to the system. First time out I had no issues. I like the plate chiller over the immersion one. Would like to try the counterflow at some point.
@@BellofattoBrews that’s how we learn, the hard ways. But that’s not by brewing is so fun it’s a continuous learning process. I have been brewing for 7 years and it like a few slices of cheese from a huge block. The rest is still to learn.
What a divided subject. I have all 3 types of chiller but I like my plate chiller because I can leave the lid on and recirculate. I have never let my hops run freestyle so clogging has never been an issue. Immersion chillers always seem like a contamination threat to me without the lid on.
Love videos like this. I don’t have any friends that brew. Like most I don’t have unlimited cash, so pro and con videos help a lot.
Very glad these kinds of videos are so helpful to you!
Haha I was looking around at all my chillers the other day and thought.. I should make this video, but glad you did and it was fun to see your perspective. Overall, I hate chilling no matter what I use
Do it anyway!
Well said, as there are several chilling methods from immersion to plate, to even a glycol chiller. It really is a matter of your brewing preference, what you are looking to accomplish, and what your investment is at the time. Thank you for sharing this helpful overview. We appreciate your insight and thank you for the shout-out on the Therminator™.
Thank you!
Nice analysis. I use immersion chillers in my 3 kettles but I recirculate the water through a big blue barrel of ice water with a dedicated pump and manifold setup. I can use the valves in the manifolds to slow down the flow and maximize chilling efficiency. When done chilling, I can reuse the chiller water to fill more 2L bottles to freeze for the next brew day.
Nice technique!
I use an immersion chiller when the groundwater is cold, and a second one in an ice bucket to lower the groundwater temperature when it is warm. I freeze large chunks of ice and also 2 L bottles to float in the bucket to keep from melting quickly.
Nice!
Slowing down the melt defeats the purpose. The phase-change from the melt is where you get your cooling. It takes 80 calories of heat to melt 1 gram of ice without even raising its temperature. That is the amount that would otherwise otherwise raise that gram of water by 80ºC or 133.3ºF. The faster that ice melts into your cooling water, the faster it takes the heat from the wort.
I use a JaDeD Cyclone counterflow chiller and love it. It has all the benefits of a counterflow chiller, plus you can disassemble it for cleaning with a brush.
Thats awesome!
Great video, AB!
I have a Clawhammer Supply system so I use a plate chiller. It chills pretty fast but I’ve had hop particles get in there and I have to flush the pc a lot to make sure I get them all out.
I'm a fan of immersion chillers because they're easy to clean and that's doubled by not requiring a pump. Nothing to wash out,saves me so much time and hassle.
I've been doing no-chill for a few months now. I live in Canada and i brew outside so i just leave my kettle out there over night. I'll get back to using my wort chiller in the spring once my outside tap is thawed.
I live in Alabama so no-chill is usually not an option for me. We may have 4 weeks total per year where the temps go low enough to do this.
Southeast Ontario, here. Especially using an all-in-one electric in an apartment condo, I've just brewing outside on the patio. I also want to do more keg fermentation, so chilling it the rest of the way in the kegerator would be viable and sanitary.
Australia here, also summer, My tap water is too hot to effectively chill, it was 42c here 3 days ago and this is the first day under 35c in over a week. I use no chill bags from kegland, cheap as and they work a charm. When I chill I use the immersion chiller with the recirculation pump running
It helps if you live in such a cold place!
Great video!
A chiller (no matter how basic) makes a huge difference! When i first started brewing, I had to pour from gallon buckets back into the boiler to try and speed chilling. That worked much better than just waiting but sucked greatly. The incredibly basic stainless steel immersion cooler I have now is such a crazy game changer. Getting just basic chilling makes a vast difference in the time and quality of the brew.
Agreed!
Great stuff. And thanks for speaking to our GRiST home brew club the other night! A club member gave me his old immersion chiller, so this video will be helpful. I've been doing the ice bath until now.
My pleasure! You guys were a great crowd and I really enjoyed our conversation!
Love the video !! Your content has been entertaining and informative!! For my chilling method , I use an immersion chiller and have had great results .. but to save water and reuse water I built a recirculating chiller system .. - COOLER /w submersible pump - attached to immersion chiller .. first pass I save water and use for cleaning later .. then after water is lukewarm , I just replenish ice while the water recirculates! Saves more water in the end and reuses the HOT water that flows thru for the cleaning ..
Glad you enjoyed the video! Very interesting technique!
Nice Video. Question for you: I usually transfer almost all of my contents of the kettle into the fermenter. You stated that the debris or gunk at the bottom is not fermentable and was trub. I thought trub was the by-product after fermentation. Either way- if trub, it sounds like i should stop placing into the fermenter. Is this correct? If so, learned something new. Thanks for any comments.
Trub is a byproduct of the brewing process not the fermentation. Some trub will still usually show up in the fermenter as the wort settles though. The only byproduct of fermentation that drops out is spent yeast. It's not going to adversely affect the beers flavor if trub stays in fermentation it just absorbs liquid and makes you get less at the end of the process
Steve, great job, and I love the breakdown! I'm sticking with BBQ Larry on this one as we both prefer Jaded Scyclla Chillers as they are like 3 high-quality copper immersion chillers in one and are capable of chilling to within 10 degrees (Fahrenheit) of your tap water in about 5 minutes with agitation (assuming you don't restrict the flow with a skinny hose). (Plus, if you are concerned about water waste, all three options could include using a sump pump in a pot or large bucket with reusable frozen cold packs.) My only significant concern with the counterflow and plater chillers is that I can't see what is inside them from previous use and cleanings. Like STDs, you don't know you have a problem until it is too late. Plus, never use a plate chiller when using phantasm powder in a whirlpool; it's absolutely the worst nightmare I've ever had cleaning a plate chiller.
JaDeD chillers are ones I have yet to try but I've heard nothing but praise. Unfortunately I'd need to figure out a false bottom or something in my system because of the exposed element
@@TheApartmentBrewer jaded makes an electric chair for use in the clawhammer system
I have regular immersion chillers Recently got a Used CUSS one same design as Jaded. In Az winter weather I chill to 70F in usually 10-12 minutes. So, maybe this summer will take 20??? We will see. Good video as usual Steve
That is very impressive!
After figuring out a process, I really like the Blichmann Therminator. Throwing pellet hops directly in the kettle was too much and cooling would suffer. Never had a clog, but it would slow down. Switched to using a suspended hop bag (think of BIAB for hops) and it's so much better. After the brew day, I hit it with a garden hose each way, then blow out with compressed air. If I feel the need, I'll fill up a Home Depot 2.5 gallon bucket with hot water and PBW then let the Therminator sit in that for a while. That gets it super clean and, basically, no work needed.
Great stuff, that chiller is a beast!
A great way to improve chilling speed with immersion chillers is half fill with water to a large bucket and the rest with ice and use a submersible pump and recirculate. I do that after hitting a target temp of 40-35°C. Brings the wort temp down really quick.
I use an immersion chiller. Stainless steel and it is compatible with the Hozelock (garden hose) fittings system here in the UK. Simply push-click the input and output on and off. Runs off my outside tap. It does use a ton of water but I try to recycle that into two water butts in the garden (fine in the summer, not so much this time of year!). It chills a 19-23 litre batch in 30 mins.
Great move repurposing the chiller water!
I've used them all. A counterflow chiller is without a doubt, the best option I've ever used.
I'm in complete agreement!
This is awesome info!!! We use Exchillerator counterflows on our 1bbl herms and our 12 gallon propane system and we use a stainless immersion on our all in one pilot brew system. The plate chillers always worried us with making sure they are clean for the next brew day so we have avoided them.
They work like a charm!
I have used a Hop Spider and Plate chiller for 8yrs now. Never had a single clog, or any infections.
Key to the plate is to flush water through the plate, opposite of the flow of wort, HOT water. Also is to put the plate chiller in line when you start the whirlpool so it will get heated to over 160f for 10 minutes. Compact, durable, better water usage, and cheaper than counter flow chillers.
They are effective if you keep up the maintenance and cleaning!
Good timing. Have been looking at new chill solution. I do no-chill and have a immersion chiller. In a brewzilla you can circulate the beer while chilling so that is simple. However, my water is not terribly cold so cooling slows down quite a bit and takes a while. I collect the water and pour in the garden so I don't waste, but I'd rather be done faster. I have a bunch of old gear laying around and am toying with the idea of using an old 7 gallon cooler in a jockey-box type setup. But instead of the output being for serving, it would output to the fermentor.
That is a very creative solution, it might just work!
Good video. After using a great immersion chiller i found my desire to get a counterflow chiller to almost vanish. I can chill a batch in 12-15 min. That's likely not much more time than using a counter flow considering it needs to be flushed and cleaned.
Good points!
@@TheApartmentBrewer I would almost consider "cheap" vs "great" immersion chiller as different categories... But I guess that's the same for everything!
I use a stainless steel immersion chiller. I also use it during fermentation. I put my fermenter in a large cooler of water with the immersion chiller next to it. I have an aquarium pump in another smaller cooler of ice water (frozen 2l bottles) hooked up to the immersion chiller. An Inkbird temp probe is taped to the side of the fermenter. When it gets over the set value, the pump kicks on circulating ice water through the chiller, which cools the water the fermenter sits in. It's an easy way to get pretty precise temperature control, especially when fermenting lagers. I had everything laying around the house, so it is very cheap. I just need to swap the 2 liter bottles for frozen ones twice a day.
I'll buy a dedicated refrigerator eventually, but for now, this works great.
Thats a really creative technique!
I have used an immersion chiller with the pump recirculating ice water from a bucket. Worked really great and used a fraction of the water I normally use.
Nice!
Awesome content as usual. Is there a product you know of that breaks down grain and hops? I have a plate chiller that blocks constantly. I've spent over an hour some days flushing water back and forth in both directions and still getting grain and hop residue coming out. It's never truly clean so It'd be handy if there was a product that would break these organic materials down and allow the plate chiller to be flushed clean more effectively.
I've always had great results with flushing my system with hot high-concentration PBW. It won't necessarily break down organic material but it's very good at unsticking it from the metal.
Currently using a SS immersion chiller. It was adequate for my 5gal kettle, but not sure it will work as well in the 10gal electric kettle I built with the element in the kettle and false bottom. Been thinking about a counterflow; do you need a pump to move wort through (like in a plate chiller), or would it work gravity-fed? Thinking of putting a valve on the chiller wort-out to regulate flow through the chiller, and a cooler of ice water with a small aquarium pump to recirculate cooling water through the chiller and cut water usage. I’d be interested in the collective experience of the group on this plan. Thanks!
Jaded brewing hands down. I use it with 40 pounds of ice and my chilling times are down from boiling to pitching ale temps in like 7 -10 mins. On a colder day I can use less ice as last time I brewed on a cold day I used 14 pounds of ice. Best investment in breeding I have made in a long time.
1)My biggest con against immersion chillers is that they may be heavy and when rested on the heating element, they may damage it. I had to by a raised false bottom, but that was an added cost. BUT they are great if you use a burner. 2) I clogged my plate chiller on the second run so I threw it away. 3) I got the Spike counterflow and last night was able to chill my wort from 201F to 55F in one pass. I recirculate from a 44 qrt cooler with ice to preserve water. This technique is usable up to 10 gallon batches.
I just used some copper tubing to make 3 "arms" on the two vertical pipes on my immersion chiller to keep it sitting just above the element in my 15 gallon solo. Whirlpooling with the IC definitely increases the chilling speed.
@@Frozenwinter84 that's a cool idea, definitely better than what I did haha
Damaging the element is a very real possibility with an IC!
@@TheApartmentBrewer I've seen people on some of the forums claim they rest their ic on the element without problems, I'm skeptical though. Definitely getting a cfc at some point but until then my ic with the arms I made to keep it off the element seems to do the job.
I just got a Jaded Scylla and I doubt I'll ever use anything else. I chilled from boiling to 57F in 13 minutes with a ground water temp of about 52F. And when I got done I rinsed it off and put it on a shelf to dry. I recently tried a counter flow chiller but found that with the additional cleaning required it actually added time to my brew day, which was part of my reason for wanting to switch it up from the basic immersion chiller I've been using for years.
JaDeD makes phenomenal ICs!
I use an immersion chiller hooked to submersible pump in an ice bath. After the initial heat dissipates, I pump back into the ice bath.
When i first started i used to just move the 5 gal pot into the sink with iced water, it used to take about 40 mins to lower the temp. In an effort to shorten my brew day, i started to use a home made immersion chiller i made. I moved and now i noticed that using the immersion chiller it takes me to 84-80 degrees but struggles to get any lower ( Florida tap water @ 76-78). I was originally set on a counterflow, now considering a a pump pushing ices water or even a plate chiller (which i have avoided for the same reasons mentioned here)
I brew mainly lagers and no-chill is working like a charm for me. So nice to just put the lid on and call it a day. But I wouldn't recommend it for more hop forward beers with large late hop additions. For those I use my immersion chiller.
I have used all except a platechiller, and the counterflow is the process in my brewing that saves the most time out of all so yeah I put my money were it counts, into saving time.
Absolutely agree. Immersion chiller can take 45 mins, whereas with counterflow I can do 10 gallons in 15 minutes in one pass.
Yeah, and for lagers I do several passes thru the brewkettle for even colder temps. The groundwater temp here in Sweden is around 4 degrees celsius around winter time.@@vruychev
Agreed!
Such a chill vid.
Chill vibes only
I have linked together two immersion chillers together for my setup, one i got when i first started brewing, the other I got off of FB marketplace where someone sold it as a set with some other items. I got some worm clamps and clamped the smaller one inside the ring of the other one, and then cut some tubing to link them together. It really increases the surface area which does great to cool off a 5 gallon batch.
At some point I would like to get a counterflow, but for right now my the two immersion chillers do great.
You basically just created your own jaded chiller. Thats awesome!
Thanks!@@TheApartmentBrewer I had to look up the Jaded Chiller but I guess I did put together a DIY version. It was much cheaper than a Jaded one, but is not nearly as fancy.
I've played around with a lot of different methods. I've made solid brews with the no chill method but don't particularly like it. IC is fine in the winter but can take a while in the summer (TX), and I waste a lot of water. I've tried IC connected to a sump pump sitting in ice-cold water. Can actually get my beer down to lager pitching temps, but it's a headache to set up and the flow rate is super slow. My current method is a CFC. Worked in about 20 minutes this weekend, but the groundwater is cold right now. If I had a pump that was worth a damn, I think this method could work great in the summer. It also takes a bit of prep as I have to run boiling water through it before and after brew day. There is no perfect method I suppose
They definitely all have pros and cons, its just a matter of finding what works best for you and what tradeoffs are worth it
I have a Jaded Hydra immersion chiller and the Exchillerator counterflow, I find myself using the immersion chiller way more due to less things to clean(hoses,pumps, etc). That being said I don’t love using the immersion with my Clawhammer system, but hooking it to a pulley helps keep the weight off of the element.
Definitely pros and cons too each of these options!
I’ve got all three. Nine times out of 10. I go for the counterflow chiller! The other time I’ll reach for my jaded Hydra immersion chiller. Cheers, Steve.
Nice! Any particular reason why you'd go for the IC specifically?
@@TheApartmentBrewer sometimes I like to brew old school with no pumps and that would be when I use it. Most of the time I use the CFC though and love it.
You can use less water in an immersion chiller if you lower the flow and stir quickly. At max flow, i can get down to 75 in about 6-7 minutes. You do have to stir an immersion chiller or it will take >30minutes. This is where the heat-resistant BIAB gloves come in handy. Also, you don’t need a pump which is nice.
A con to the immersion chiller and probably the counterflow as well is that if you haven't properly drained it, you risk it bursting if you store it in an unheated area and it freezes.
Or, when you put it in the kettle to sterilize it boiling water comes out of the hose connections. Ouch.
I just use the one that came with my Anvil and then let my fermentation chamber get the wort down the rest of the way over an hour or two to be honest. With AZ tap water temps there’s only so much I can really do lol. I’ve tried the pump with ice water method and it worked well but I’m so lazy at this point in my homebrewing that I don’t usually bother
I use an immersion chiller at the moment. I figured it to be a waste to just dump the water and I intend to buy a barrel for rainwater where I'll dump in my cooling water as well. I'm already spending money on an important resource, I might as well get multiple uses out of it.
repurposing that chilling water is a big deal!
No chill, but planning on going for an immersion chiller soon
I have been brewing for about 3 years. I started with the ice bath in the sink, that took 45 minutes or so . I bought an immersion chiller 2 years ago, dropping it in the kettle and running water took about 35-45 minutes. One day I grabbed the out tube and moved it up and down, and it almost burned my hand so I grabbed the in tube And started moving it up and down. Now it takes me 10-15 minutes to chill to 68 degrees. I don’t know if that is bad in some way but it’s fast
Chiller burns are no fun, but circulating the wort around the chiller is not an issue
I have the Clawhammer plate chiller, is that what you use and if so, you can chill your wart strait from the kettle to fermenter in one pass? It didn’t work for me…I was only able to chill down to 90 degrees. I’m on Long Island and water is very cold this time of year.
When I used it I was able to get close to pitch temps but it usually landed around 80 F or so. Try slowing down the rate at which the wort travels through the chiller
I currently use an immersion chiller, but I am looking for a counterflow chiller.
I'm in agreement
I have done over 200 batches with no chill method, wort is left overnight in boil kettle with lid on. Never had an infection or a problem. You need some practice and few batches to adjust hop additions, whirlpool, etc. I won quite a few homebrew awards and medals. You can do all beer styles with no problem
Thats awesome!
How long do you leave the wort in the kettle? I was thinking of using this method, finishing a brew around 10pm and then transferring to a fermenter the next evening. So maybe 20ish hours later. Would that be too long?
After 3 years of brewing, I'm still using the crappy (not much copper) immersion chiller that came with my starter kit. SMH! But, I do like using an immersion chiller. I have my eye on a "HYDRA" chiller from JadDeD.
JaDeD chillers are the best ICs in the business!
I've been making Belgian tripel beers. It's a little on the sweet side but the clove esters are unbelievable. Any advice on helping with head retention?
A little trick that always helps is to add 5-10% wheat malt to the grist. Does wonders for head retention. If you have the ability to step mash that helps as well
I am a newbie at brewing, only done it a couple of times, but this year I would invest in a real brewkettle, and I was thinking of using an immersion chiller, but instead of using tapwater I was thinking of using a powerfull pump and pumping rainwater from the citestern through it and back to the cistern. Would that work ?
That might work if you have cold enough water in the cistern but I don't see why not
You mentioned chilling helps precipitate out the solids, but it wasn't clear to me what you do after that. I'm still not totally sure how you'd get the trub out.
Great video, thanks for always helping me improve, I (and more importantly my friends and girlfriend haha) appreciate your help!
Glad to help!
Hi i use the immersion chiller. Would like ti uograde to a counterflow. Just a quick question do you leave the hop spider in the wort during chilling or do you remove when the boil timer is finished? Thanks
I usually don't use a hop spider, my hops remain in circulation while I chill on the way to the fermenter.
One of the biggest drawbacks with both Plate and Counterflow Chillers is the need for a pump to circulate the wort. This is not a problem with Grainfather, Blickman, etc. type kettles. However, I have a Braumeister kettle which does not have such a pump, unless I modify the plumbing significantly. So unfortunately, it is an Immersion Chiller for me. To conserve cooling water I have a Cooling Water Pump that circulates my swimming pool water through the chiller via a couple of hosepipes
This is a good point, they can function in a gravity setup, but having a pump makes them significantly more user friendly.
I have [and have] used each chiller that you have mentioned . Like you mentioned, they each have there strengths and weaknesses.
My setup is better equipped for a counter flow chiller. Why I say that is I use a lot of whole cone hops because of our hopyard. I use a hop rocket as kind of another way to filter the beer while sending it on its way to the wort chiller while adding hops to the end of the brewing process.
I don't use whole cone hops in every beer style, but I do use them in quite a few of the beers that we make. The amount of fresh aroma hops that we grow. I needed something that I know wasn't going to get clogged.
We Brew out on the hop farm and we have well water with a storage tank and sometimes in the summer it is warmer than we like. I use a pre-chiller on the way to the counterchiller. Basically, it's a submersion chiller in a 5 gallon bucket with ice in it. (It's my old submersion chiller) Chilling out the well water before it hits the counter chiller. It works amazing on those hot days where it would take quite a bit of water and time to chill a large batch of beer. Sometimes I make up to 50 to 100 gallons just depends on the style i'm making.
Just a thought that even though you have a chiller that you don't use. It could still be useful brewing equipment.
Your brewing setup sounds like a ton of fun especially with the fresh hop brews! Prechilling is absolutely a great strategy that a good number of folks use.
There is a much simpler way to chill your wort that costs nothing and requires no equipment. I typically end up with about 3 gallons of wort in my brew kettle, which I transfer to my 6.5-gallon bucket fermenter. Meanwhile, I have two 1-gallon jugs of water in the freezer, where they are frozen solid. After rinsing these jugs off with sanitizer, I let them bob around in the wort, which quickly cools it down, just like ice cubes in a cocktail. When the water in the jugs is melted, I simply pour that cool water into the wort, which brings me up to my target volume of 5 gallons. This simple process consistently cools my wort down to 75-77 degrees in less than 10 minutes. I live at high elevation, where water boils at just 198 degrees. At lower elevations, you might want to keep a third jug of water in the freezer. Also, do not use jugs shaped like standard plastic milk jugs, which are basically square, because you cannot fit two of these in a bucket fermenter. Instead, use the taller narrower jugs that are used to package many brands of spring water. I like the ones with a plastic handle around the neck, so I can bob them around in the wort, and easily pull them out when it is time to empty them.
I’ve used and owned all three. The immersion chiller works well but is a hassle. The plate chiller clogged no matter how often and long I cleaned it. I bought a counterflow chiller 7 or so years ago and called it a day. Save yourself the headache and go with a counterflow chiller.
Hey. Just curious. What was a hassle about the immersion chiller? I personally found it pretty good compared to the plate chiller. Even considering if it wouldn't clog and easy to clean.
@@MatBarbe I have my counterflow chiller mounted in position and never need to unhook or move water hose fittings. With an immersion chiller that isn’t an option given you need to boil first and then chill. Lifting and burning yourself or dropping scalding wort isn’t much of a thing when using a counterflow chiller. If you want to use a hop spider while trying to whirlpool, it’s in the way during trying to sterilize the immersion chiller. It works well for chilling, I just found the counterflow chiller to check all the boxes and the immersion chiller didn’t.
Hey! What is the ideal time to cool down a 20 l batch of wort?
As quickly as possible is the "ideal" time. Under an hour is a good target but its not the end of the world if it takes a few hours
hey steve i just bought the apera ph meter. my question is can i dip it in starsan to clean it? not sure if you do but i cant find info about it.
That is not the preferred method of cleaning. Sanitizer will absolutely skew the reading (starsan has a pH of like 1.5). Just rinse with distilled water and store in the appropriate storage solution
got it! thank you. now off to brewing another lager. using only hallertau hopefully its good just like the last@@TheApartmentBrewer
Scrapped my super clogged blichmann plate chiller and bought an exchillerator in 2021. I have not looked back.
I definitely love mine!
How would you go about cleaning an immersion chiller? Should I just remove the hoses and boil the whole thing?
Put into the boil 10 minutes before shut off without hoses attached. Then, after you're done chilling wort and have transferred to fermentation vessel, I'd place hot water in the brew vessel you're going to clean anyways and scrub. I go for removing hop debris and residual sugar before storing. I'd use cleaner, but it could damage the chiller depending on the material.
Just cant stop myself from blowing out the wort in my counterflow with my mouth. No way im losing 2 or 3 beers if i can help it. So far so good
The best chiller is CH from homebrew for life. I just dunk him in the wort and it’s immediately chill, no matter wut.
Chill vibes 4 life
You say that the plate chiller is hard to clean but wouldn’t counter chillers also have places for mold to hide too? I’m confused why it’s not the same.
They do, but the channels inside a plate chiller are a lot easier to have residual debris get stuck in vs a large bore pipe
Would a hop spider help with over-bittering for the no-chill method?
If you no chill you should adjust your hop schedule. For example, a 60 bittering addition you may want to adjust to 45 minutes.
It might have some effect but I agree, I think its just easier to change the time or IBU
So I use for just the second time using my Clawhammer system and brewed a beer so heavy in hops, that it clogged my bazooka kettle screen so bad it wouldn’t pass through the plate chiller. Used 9.5 oz of hops plus three hop shots totaling 15ml. I had to drop some of the hops straight in as the hop spider couldn’t hold any more. That has been the one complaint I’ve seen on their system.
Isnt that why they got the whirlpool arm for collecting the hops in the middle of the kettle?
@@Hannes_Lind yes and I wasn’t thinking. I’m still trying to get use to the system. First time out I had no issues. I like the plate chiller over the immersion one. Would like to try the counterflow at some point.
@@BellofattoBrews that’s how we learn, the hard ways. But that’s not by brewing is so fun it’s a continuous learning process. I have been brewing for 7 years and it like a few slices of cheese from a huge block. The rest is still to learn.
I'd recommend getting rid of that bazooka screen to be honest. Whirlpool the hops correctly and you are unlikely to clog the chiller.
@@TheApartmentBrewer i know I see you do that in all your videos. It was a donkey move on my part especially knowing the amount of hops I was using.
I use the plate chiller that came with the Clawhamer system, no clogs yet…
Now I have a compelx about having mold lol
@@hardcoredegree I know right, I’ll be doing double pbw washes , baking and anything else I can think of to ensure cleanliness 🤣
I use an old keg bucket and a salted ice bath. Gets chilled in like 30 minutes
Both the plate chiller and the CFC require a pump. Adding cost and maintenance
This is true, although they can function in a gravity setup, but not nearly as well as with a pump
High gravity brew adding ice works for me. Note: I'm super lazy
What a divided subject. I have all 3 types of chiller but I like my plate chiller because I can leave the lid on and recirculate. I have never let my hops run freestyle so clogging has never been an issue. Immersion chillers always seem like a contamination threat to me without the lid on.
The major issue I’ve seen with plate chillers is cleaning and sanitization
Eu gasto 20l de agua e consigo resfriar de 90 para 12.C.. Portugal
No matter what, i don't recommend any copper materials to be used if touching the wort. It doesn't stand highly oxidative sanitizers or acid cleaners.
The answer in this video better be a Jaded Scylla. I just spent a chunk of change on one. 😂
One of the best ICs out there
Plate chiller is the best way to get bacteria in your final beer.
Bacteria, unlikely. Mold on the other hand is very possible.
@@TheApartmentBrewer 100% correct, my mistake.