The Amazing Atheist Manhandles PSA Sitch and Adam Friended
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
- Thumbnail "Corn King" art done by Emperor Neuro
NewGrounds - emperorneuro.n...
Twitter - / emperor_neuro
Intro "Maizelbub" art by Dan Rossi
Website - danrossidraws....
Twitter - / danrossidraws
Catch all my streams LIVE at / actualjake
#Politics #Debate #Twitch
Wait why can’t gender dysphoria be both medical and cosmetic? Why can’t cosmetic procedures also be medical? Having teeth is considered by insurance companies to be “cosmetic” but if you lost all your teeth you’d suffer pretty devastating mental health issues that are going to effect your life.
And you'd have to change the way you interact with the world physically, chewing, drinking, singing and speaking would all be different at the very least. "Cosmetic" is such a cop out. If someone feels the way I used to with my dysphoria because they have a nose they really don't like and it pushes them to self harm and be depressive and shit then absolutely I want them to have as much access to deal with that as they can get.
Or cosmetic surgery for a burn victim.
These people who try to act like they're not transphobic because They treat Kim Kardashian 'the same' are full of shit
That's a great point and you don't even need to lose them. Adult braces and jaw surgery showed how horrible the world of constant teeth pain actually is.
Because it’s just vanity
Also iirc dentures are covered by dental plans
@@__-nd5qi What do you mean when you say "vanity?"
I understand it to mean that that way one looks is important to them.
Of course Adam, Irreligous people are obsessed with wealth.
Meanwhile the Vatican has something like 50 million dollars worth of gold furniture.
Didn't the pope get a private jet cost like $10-20mil recently too?
Yeah, weird argument that doesn't make sense when you consider the rampant poverty rn
Fun fact. Computer programming used to be a field dominated by women, while teaching and nursing used to be dominated by men. Programmers used to be called typists, and this was considered a less desirable menial job, hence more women ended up in that field. Teaching changed around the time of the Industrial Revolution, when men took on other jobs and so more women were encouraged to go into teaching. Nursing changed around the time of Florence Nightingale. So it has more to do with the ways in which society changed, and not that men and women are mentally predisposed to certain kinds of jobs.
I remember reading something that correlated the shift away from female programmers with the growth of the video-game market and its male-targeted advertising. Like a reverse of the 'Scully Effect'.
@@christophergreen6595Yup the first compiler was written by a woman. Which is something that takes written code and creates software. She was also an an army admiral. The first script was written by a woman 100 years before computers came out. Her name was Ada Lovelace.
@@christophergreen6595and ironically the reason women were so ahead on programming is because the first "programming" we ever had was for patterns in complex sewing machines. You would create a "program" by punching holes in a piece of square paper and where the wholes were indicated to the machine where to apply what kind of string and it would make beautiful patterns and such.
amazing atheist has had one hell of an arc, from like proto-gamergate shit to saying "yeah gender is 100% a construct" it's wild to see
I totally missed the arc. Last I heard of him he was still an anti-feminist edgelord, and now I'm in shock over what I just witnessed
Some people do become retarded
Gender is basically a description between the social and cultural differences in characteristics between men and women. In other words it's bunch of ways to describe that the average man is more masculine while having ways to describe that the average woman is more feminine based on biology to a certain extent.
True. He has a fine nose on agreeing with the current thing.
As opposed to, for example, Laci Green, who was an SJW during Gamergate, and started to show her understanding for conservative talking points when progressivism became a trend.
I am more in favor of independent thinkers like her, to be honest.
@CanalPSG I don't know if I'd say he just agrees with the current thing. Plenty of growth can happen in 8 years, and he is friends with plenty of progressive people, it's not out of the question that he has experienced a genuine shift in opinion
That being said, I haven't actively consumed his content in a few years, so I may not have the best read on how genuine it is
I’d like to address the “sometimes kids will lose their dysphoria once they go through puberty, and that wouldn’t have happened if they went on blockers”.
So, I knew I was trans when I was 4 years old, all the other kids at school would call me Chelsea(I loved That’s So Raven) and use she/her for me. Once I hit puberty that dysphoria “stopped”. Or at least it felt like it did.
I definitely suffered a lot of mental health issues afterwards, but they could have been treated with antidepressants, and I do believe that I could have lived the rest of my life as a man, and still have a fulfilling life.
I decided to go through with starting hormones a couple months before I turned 27, and with my mental health issues, the estrogens effect on my emotions definitely messed me up at times, my lows were definitely lower, but my highs were SO much higher, and most importantly, during my lowest of lows I no longer suffered “self harm ideation”(censoring a little bit just in case it messes with algorithm or something).
Over the months, I’ve been able to work with the doctors to get my dosage worked out after we found out that my estrogen levels were much higher than a cis woman’s is and I’ve never felt better. I am more confident than I’ve ever been, I’m more comfortable in my body than I’ve ever been, I’m just straight vibing now and I could never imagine going back. I am so fucking happy.
If a kid who would have been able to live a long and fulfilling life as a cis person with no issues decides to go on puberty blockers, and feels that transition is the right move for them, and they end up living an extremely happy life as a trans person… then who gives a shit? They could’ve been a happy cis person? Okay, they’re a happy trans person, so who gives a shit? Gender dysphoria can seem like it went away, they can live a “good enough” life as a cis person, but it doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t have been happier exploring those feelings and finding out what those feelings could mean for their identity.
TLDR; Sitch and Adam aren’t doctors
I would add, the study that they seem to cite every single time they make this claim was based on flawed methodology, where gender dysphoria diagnostic criteria were not as clearly defined as they are in the current DSM-5. This meant there were a lot of false diagnoses of proto gay boys who were gender nonconforming, because no distinction was made between gender expression and gender identity. Therefore they seemed to grow out of it as they got older, because they never had it to begin with. Furthermore, the study did not follow up with a significant percentage of the children, and simply assumed they grew out of it. There is no way to take the conclusions of this study and logically apply them to all trans kids.
Regarding your story, I had a very different experience, but could have ended up the same way had the information never been made available to me. I went for most of my life without even knowing I was trans, because I grew up without the necessary tools and language to describe what was going on. I was diagnosed with depression at the onset of puberty, and for many years I assumed that was the sole explanation for all my problems. It would later turn out this was either a misdiagnosis or correlation of gender dysphoria. Had I not taken the time to work these issues out, I could very well have gone the rest of my life living as my assigned gender and struggling with depression. It would be very uncomfortable and I would be unpleasant to interact with, but it might be possible, same as living with an untreated chronic pain condition.
I had somewhat similar experience, but in hindsight I think the dysphoria only dulled, didn't actually go away. I felt a sort of alienation from any authentic gender expressions, but learned to perform a male persona based on societal expectations well enough to be left alone. It helped that my native language is not strongly gendered (e.g. no gendered pronouns) so it was easier to feel distant about it. But the moment I experimented with anything femme the dysphoria started coming back. Weak at first, ebbed and flowed, but only got worse over time. Since I came out and I can be myself in daily life (except for official business, there is no legal gender recognition here in Hungary) I'm more happy and confident too.
I suspect without transition dysphoria can't actually trend down in the long run. It comes and goes, but it doesn't go away.
All that mucho texting is great and all but your loved experience is an anecdote and irrelevant at best
@@blah204 correct. My point wasn’t the anecdote, it was that even if someone would’ve been cis otherwise, if they end up happy as a trans person, then who gives a shit? My anecdote was more about the fear of it being “too late” if you don’t transition when you’re younger, and how a lot of us will live a much less happy life simply because of that. I like being happy, and I like when others are as well.
I saw my head chef throw out applications with 'black' names... and this was only a decade ago. I hate how maliciously ignorant these people are.
Yes, I know there's a study. I knew about it. Seeing it irl blew my mind.
This literally never happened.
@@markcollins2704 it literally did, and there are also numerous studies where the behavior is documented.
Are you one of those ignorant fooks that insists no one was racist anymore circa '66?
Bltch, I grew up hearing white kids who had never met a black person crack N-word jokes, and you wanna tell me a local chef in a 99%-white restaurant district wouldn't be just like them 20 years later? Gtfo, loser.
@Mark Collins and you know that because.... 😂
@markcollins2704 why do racists always try to pretend racism isn't real?
"Trans ideology?" It's an ideology now to want to choose your gender un-harassed?
It's just like religious people saying atheism or evolution is a religion. Somehow making it as bad as there religion
It makes it easier for the right to frame being lgbt as indoctrination while they try indoctrinating kids. Examples is prager u kids shit and the tactic of not letting kids see or learn of people of said hated group because it makes it easier to make shit up about them.
This one is a big anti-trans talking point. It's also a truscum/transmed one.
They claim that, because you're not the gender that was assigned to you at birth, you inherently adhere to the _ideology_ that gender and sex are different things.
I'm just waiting for them to start talking about the "redhead ideology." After all, people do dye their hair red, right?
Strawman.
@@exquisitedoomlapointe185 "strawman" never clarifies the strawman. I don't think you know what the word means because reactionaries are obsessed with harassing trans people. Trans people live rent free in their heads
"We got pride flags not because I'm trans, but because people require solidarity and Im gonna give it to them"
My man, I've been watching you for a while, but this quote sealed the deal... you have a new sub.
Thank you.
Everyone is clapping
The difference between trans people and Christianity that these people don’t get, is that prayer doesn’t work. Transitioning does.
TJ: I think you guys have an issue with with trans people because of your disgust response.
Adam & Sitch: Nuh-uh!
Also Adam & Sitch: The problem is trans people create this weird situation.
It is so weird, you can see it when they think a trans person is hot, like they think they are both hot and disgusting and you watch their brain turn to Jello. I thought I would never date a trans guy... then I found a hot trans guy and I was just like... well I guess I was wrong. He is still hot. I could feel the other side try to feel disgusted and it just never did.
Transgenders are kn average off putting looking some can look attractive as what their trying to present as but thats a plurality at most so their thoughts on that are correct.
Every month Adam Friendzone finds another daddy to lose a 2-1 debate with
😅😅😅
Don’t know if someone already said this, but the reason Philosophy Tube said she looked up the answers to the trans test is because the test was super strict, and basically looking for any reason to deny people healthcare for anything trans. Pretty straightforward really
How dare the healthcare system make sure you actually have cancer before giving you chemo. PT lied because he doesn't have dysphoria and is doing to pathetically try to crib contra's audience because he's an irrelevant moron.
1:10:20 - I was diagnosed with OCD at the age of seven or eight. A brain scan was not one of the tests done to diagnose me. Literally the only test was a verbal, in-depth discussion with my doctor at the time, after my mother told him that I had been behaving very strangely.
During that discussion, he asked me (in language I could understand at that age) what I had been doing and why. The more I told him about what I had been doing (which I now know were compulsive rituals) and why I felt I had to do them (which I now know were irrational obsessive thoughts brought on by a constant anxiety level I couldn't make rational sense of) the more my doctor realised I was exhibiting symptoms of OCD so strongly that I needed to get on medication.
I won't go into detail, but suffice it to say that the effects of OCD on my mind and body were not pretty at that time, and I still deal with the aftereffects of certain childhood rituals to this day. The doctor even told my mother that it was a good thing she'd already chosen to homeschool me, because, in his professional opinion, I would not have been able to handle the stress, social pressure, and rigid one-size-fits-all structure that public schools at that time were known for, due to how intense my symptoms were.
OCD is a legally recognised disability. I didn't need a brain scan or a blood test, I didn't have to get onto a waiting list, I didn't ever have to justify why I needed treatment. I just told a medical professional what was happening to me and how it was making me do things that were unhealthy on multiple levels, and how the results were making me feel afraid and trapped and powerless in my own life, and I was prescribed medication to help alleviate those symptoms.
I am also a transgender man. I started exhibited symptoms around the same age, but because I didn't know transgender identity existed, let alone was valid, I didn't come to terms with it and accept myself until I was 19 or 20. After that, I had to fight multiple battles on multiple levels just to be allowed the dignity of introducing myself the way I wanted to be known without social punishment.
I'm 30 now, and I had to fight to get an appointment with a gender care specialist at the start of this year. In that appointment, I still had to use very direct and uncompromising language to get the point across that I had, in fact, spent over a decade making sure that this was what I wanted. Multiple times, I had to remind the doctor how long I had wanted to transition, how long I had been socially transitioning both online and IRL, and how much I had already considered every possible side effect he brought up. Only then, when he finally said, "Well, you seem pretty sure and determined, I guess," was I able to get my prescription.
Even now, I might not be able to get my testosterone cypionate prescription refilled, because I have to go see yet another doctor to prove yet again that this is what I want. I'm fucking thirty years old, and I still have people, including everyone from medical professionals to complete strangers, asking me "aRe YoU sUrE tHo?" at any available opportunity.
Yet every time I've walked into a shrink's office and said, "I have OCD, these are my symptoms, can I get some therapy and medication for it please," they immediately do what they can to help, even if that medication also comes with potentially deadly or habit-forming side effects. I might get a verbal "oh fyi" from the pharmacist, but more often than not, the exchange is typically just, "Do you have any questions about the medication?" "Nope." "Okay, cool, have a nice day."
Make it make sense.
Your medical history story was fascinating to read. I struggle with getting the help I need for my mood disorder and a nerve condition, but I am privileged that I don't have to prove to anyone what I identify as.
Hang in there. Unfortunately, it's all we can do in the immediate.
@Vesta_the_Lesser Yeah, I absolutely hate that part of the US Healthcare system. I hope you're able to get your medication refilled ASAP! Get a PDF or printed copy of your medical records from the old office and take them with you when you go to the new office (or email them to the receptionist in advance). Doing that has helped immensely, and sometimes, it's just fun to have a physical reminder - like a stack of folded paper - for the new doctor, so they can't forget that a ton of work and investigation has already been done on this condition.
@Vesta_the_Lesser Good news and bad news about my T script btw!
The new doctor was super chill, but he may have been a little too chill. My dosage was finally raised, but that means the math doesn't math for the current script anymore (0.3ml x 4 (weekly injections) = 1.2ml a month, not 1ml!) I'm waiting to hear back from him about what I'm supposed to do next week when I only have 0.1ml left. dosage was finally raised, but that means the math doesn't math for the current script anymore (0.3ml x 4 (weekly injections) = 1.2ml a month, not 1ml!), so I'm waiting to hear back from him about what I'm supposed to do next week when I only have 0.1ml left.
In addition, my insurance is taking a nail-bitingly long time to approve the paperwork that will allow my local pharmacy to fully fill the prescription, which means I may not have a second vial of T to draw from in the meantime (I'm supposed to get three months' worth at a time, then get bloodwork done at the end of each three-month cycle to make sure my levels are where they're supposed to be and no surprises are happening, adjust the dosage as needed, rinse, repeat).
Again, I'm thirty years old! This isn't some opiate, it's a hormone naturally produced by the human body in varying degrees that is often prescribed to cisgender people with low testosterone levels! Why does this need to be treated like an "oh dear god they might sell it to their neighbor or OD for funsies" situation, especially when treating it like that is specifically *why* some transpeople with a surplus find it necessary to do that for less fortunate transpeople in their community?
I honestly which I knew where this magical country is that TERFs speak of, where T vials and E pills are passed out over the counter like Advil. I wanna go there, LOL.
First: all the best to you, with everything you shared here, and everything else.
Second: how did you find out you were a transgender man? Did you do some testing on your genes or on your brain, or is there another way?
Third: See "First." I just want you to do well.
@@CanalPSG
Genetic tests can only test for disorders and anomalies with the body's genetic material, and gender is not genetic. That could determine chromosomes or help diagnose an intersex condition, but not transgender identity. The most recent consensus from neurologists is that a brain scan is not a reliable means of testing either, as the differences that there may be between different-gendered brains are minimal at best. Like AA pointed out, we also know truly very little about how our brains work the way they do in general, let alone any hard and fast rules about how even a cisgender person's understanding of their gender relates to their sex relates to the state of their brains.
Like most transpeople you'll meet, I realised I was trans via a long process of trying everything else first. It started with recognising the discomfort I had toward my body and the dissonance between how I saw myself and how others saw me. I tested multiple different ways to ignore or manage how this dissonance affected me over the course of years, until I noticed that the only times this dissonance seemed to go away was when I was mistaken as or treated like a man. For example, when cosplaying male characters, or when a retail worker told my mother, "Wow, your son is so helpful," while I loaded bagged groceries into the cart.
When you tell this to a run-of-the-milll therapist - I first mentioned it to a therapist at the age of twenty-three, although I'd been presenting and dressing as a man since I was twenty, just to make sure I was sure - they will start to ask you a series of questions, like, "Do you see yourself being a father or a mother?" "What are your plans for the future?" "Where do you see yourself in seven years?" When I first went to a therapist, I essentially told her, "I think I'm trans. I want to be a father. A brother. An uncle. I can't ever see myself as someone's mother or sister or aunt. When I try, I don't see anything."
This is basically what therapists check for. Most transpeople struggle to actually visualize their future self as anything but their actual gender, as opposed to the gender they were assigned at birth (AGAB). Otherwise, they just can't visualize a future self at all (which, if I were to guess, may be another reason transgender suicidal ideation and attempts are so high. If you can't imagine a future self, or aren't allowed to pursue the future self you're able to see, it's difficult to find motivation to keep living).
This is what, in my experience, is the true identifying symptom, not specifically dysphoria or even euphoria. Even as a child at church, I remember playing House with the other kids and refusing to play a mother or sister, specifically saying, "No, I want to play the father, or I can be the big brother," before I knew anything about queer culture or gender identity. I just couldn't visualise myself as a mom, a career woman, a girlfriend, etc. I could act out those parts if I really tried, but we all know there's a difference between playing a character and finding a suitable role in society. It's hard to describe, but if you've ever LARPed, worn a Halloween costume, or worked in customer service, you might know what I mean.
By the time I applied for HRT, I was twenty-nine years old, and I never said I was transgender or saw anyone for it as a minor, mainly because I didn't have the vocabulary then. I can't tell you what questions are being asked and what barriers minors face before being clinically acknowledged as transgender. However, when I (finally) saw the doctor to discuss HRT, I was met with the same series of questions I was asked when I first identified myself as a possible transgender man - "Where do you see yourself in seven years?" "Do you plan to have children or think you might someday?" "Are you sexually active?" "How long have you presented as male?" "Do you have a history of trauma or abuse (that may have affected the way you see or present yourself)?" etc. Then I was told the risks and changes that may result, etc. asked a ton of questions about my physical and mental health, blood was drawn to check the levels of basically every chemical and protein known to the human body, and a safe starting dosage was derived from that.
To get that prescription refilled last month, I had to go through that same series of questions, get blood drawn again, get my levels checked, get asked if I was concerned or disappointed or uncomfortable with any of the effects, etc. The dosage was then adjusted as needed, paperwork was refiled with the insurance company for approval, etc. etc. Every three months, people on HRT have to go through through this same process.
TL;DR: The tests that are done (for adults) to determine whether or not someone is transgender, due to the fact that gender is psychosocial, not genetic or physical, are conducted via question and answer in a clinical setting. Your history of self-image, gender presentation and behavior from childhood to adulthood is also examined and taken into account. This is the same way most non-physical atypical conditions are diagnosed / confirmed, including depression, OCD, AvPD, and anxiety. Blood is also drawn to check for any possible level imbalances or disorders before HRT is prescribed, and the starting dose is usually very low.
"what about the children?"
Yes, what about the trans children whose parents are forcing their hetero gender ideology into them? Shouldn't they be *allowed* medical advice and hormonal treatment that enables their best self actualization? Are they *allowed* personal discretion so the other adults in their life aren't forced to narc to parents that might harm their child if they don't conform to their gender dogma?
Lol hetero isn't an ideology you radical dink. Neither is trans, although there is an ideology around that, but members of ideologies are blind to theirs, that's what an ideology does. The risk here is that children are impressionable, you show them superman then they think they're like him 5 minutes later, same phenomenon with trans especially if parents encourage it, this is how you get trans people without the dysphoria who later just grow up to cis again lol
TJ has been on fire the last few months. It's nice to see him pull it back together and give us the pre-gg TJ again! Amazing Atheist Redemption Arc
debating idiots with logic does not work. just point out what they said over and over and dunk on the speaker on their own platform. convince their viewers to not watch them. that's how it should be.
Nah fuck him, the dude is still a trash person.
Pre gg? What is gg?
@@ykalon GamerGate.
@@ykalon Gamergate, a huge online "discourse" shitshow that gave rise to anti SJW content in 2016/2017.
I remember people reacting to Anita Sarkeesian riffing on sexualized Videogame character and chuds making her public enemy no 1.
Funnily enough the same chuds do her shtick but in reverse with videogame characters that just look normal or are not white
TJ owned these guys so hard. Hard to believe anyone could watch this and think they made any good points lol
Their comments section seems to be full of vague affirmations of their general opinions while being very short on specific arguments.
Their chat is full of edgy guys that grew up believing that the "center" in any debate must be the correct opinion thanks to misunderstanding south park.
Confirmation bias is a hell of a drug
@@christophergreen6595 the lack of self awareness that you couldn't possibly be suffering from the same fate is mindbending. TJ had nothing this entire interview, he is not a well read academic and just fails in much the same way you guys would, perhaps that's why you see it as a victory.
@@Puerco-Potter Mind reading.
The amazing atheist
the incredible infidel
the bombastic blasphemer
The extraordinary excommunicated
The spectacular nonbeliever
woooow. Maybe TJ just didn't know this, but "women programmers" is a great example of how sitch is just *wrong* . Programming used to be a "woman's job", and there was a shift that pushed them out and it turned into a "man's job". This is just a fact, and if you go back in time far enough you can see a *lot* more women programmers.
Why might this be different today? Is it because "women just don't like to program", or might there be some kind of selection pressure outside of *biology* that might be involved here, ya dingdong?
Sounds made up. Citation needed.
@@exquisitedoomlapointe185 Look it up yourself. It's not difficult.
Jokes feel more like jokes in a society that doesnt feel like its antagonizing and marginalizing you
You can visibly see and hear them shrinking up when confronted with TJ's chad energy.
TJ knows his shit
Sitch’s response to everything is literally just “I agree with you too bad thats not possible”
I'm taking a STEM degree right now and there's only one female professor in the entire Physics faculty. My friends in other STEM degrees say the same thing. The aftermath of systemic inequality won't be going away any time soon.
Take at least another generation or two to start seeing any changes sadly.
I have a female friend in coding, late 30's... the ratio seems similar in that industry.
@@christophergreen6595 I'm a relatively recent CompSci grad, and had a front-row seat to some impressive casual misogyny by my classmates. The early courses were 30-40% women, but by the senior-level courses that was winnowed down to just around 10%.
It's almost like in a free country you're free to choose your occupation.
@@exquisitedoomlapointe185 its not really a choice if you feel you are not welcome and dont go for it because of that, or because you experience extra friction during the process.
I watched these two talk with Dylan Burns and it drove me nuts how dishonest they were with their framing. They also act like they don't cultivate a right wing audience, which I call bullshit.
Cultivating a right wing audience by categorically rejecting the rightoid stance on the war. Oh I forgot, the leftoids agree with them on this one because aMeRiCa BaD.
How do you know they're being dishonest and don't just honestly see the issues differently?
Also, I think they're well aware of having many conservatives in the audience. Half their comments are calling them too far left.
"Thin retinal energy" needs to be a meme now.
love when i happen to check my sub list seconds after an upload
"But then what about..."
This entire conversation
TJ has been ballin recently. He’s the left’s greatest thinker after all.
Has to be satire guys a mount know nothing brainlet
The best argument for the whole women in programming thing is "Ada Lovelace." The *woman* who invented the concept of programming Charles Babbage took credit since no one would believe that a woman had made anything.
Love how they described affirming a trans person’s gender identity as “sucking them off.” They have no real legitimate objections so they just scramble for ways to frame not being shitty to trans people as a bad thing.
Goddamn I wish I caught this live. Hopefully Jake will be on Tuesday night.
They mentioned how there were studies that showed there were monkeys that picked toys along gender lines and that’s not entirely true. I have more reading to do but from what I’ve seen the female monkeys didn’t have a strict preference and it was only the male monkeys that did.
Also, what monkeys do has little to no bearing on what humans do. We might share some genetic background, but we are not the same as each other. Humans slip into blind rages and tear each other's dicks off with their teeth significantly less frequently (although the frequency is probably less than zero, tbf). Even different monkey species behave differently from each other, have different social structures, different roles and habits and behavior patterns, etc.
And also, isnt that just more goalposting?
@@StargazerSkyscraper here for that Bonobo culture :p
@@christophergreen6595 bobobos had it right the whole time. When you have enough resources what should you do? Sex, all day, everyday with anyone and everyone.
Sitch infuriates me because you can tell there is intelligence there. However he focuses on incorrect frameworks and has this obsession with shoving things into boxes. And listening to him and then listening to TJ who is another quite intelligent person(and who almost intuits the correct positions) you can tell that this has to be either he has a high fear and disgust response. Or he is dishonest.
Agree. I think a fair amount of TJs problems is almost that he expects people to have thought about why they hold a position so he makes very crass jokes about them thinking nobody would ever seriously hold (X) stance for (Y) reason just because doing so is idiotic, but people are often idiots and so they do hold to that.
His political stances have barely moved from his "anti-SJW" days and even far prior to that, TJ has seen Democrats as right-wing likely since he started RUclips. It is funny to me when people think he was ever Right Wing when he has been as far left as Vaush and has been for at least thirteen years and has only gone further left.
I always thought Sitch was miles ahead of Adam. Adam is just a dumb guy.
It’s distrust / disgust
For instance he holds to the idea that nobody could claim to be for full gender equality yet also be a biological essentialist beacuse that is the stance of an idiot, those are not congruent ideas. He is right that is an idiotic stance but billions of people hold to it.
Hell just a few days a go my dad was screaming about how he is not angry, hardly the first time he has done this, it is pure idiocy but he does it all the damn time.
Citation fucking needed
not to be confused with our boy Adam Friedland
Good show Jake. Been watching/listening to you and Hannah since 2016
“God I don’t wanna talk about Hitler right now” - Jake 2023
The suggestion there aren't barriers to entry for women into software development is laughable to me. The stark treatment difference I had when I had long hair vs when I had a shaved head in school for software engineering was absolutely insane. I was treated as less competent specifically because I was fem presenting, and the moment I got rid of that, I got so much more respect
Also I like how this Adam Friended guy says he's not an anti theist but goes on to say how "trans ideology" and Christianity are the same thing....but is somehow anti trans and not anti Christian, curious 🤔
Simple, you strawmanned him twice, lol. He never said they're the same, he just pointed to similarities. He's not anti trans, he's anti trans ideology, giant ass difference, next time try to focus please.
@exquisitedoom Lapointe he is anti trans, he was arguing the entire time against them and throwing around a ton of shit that doesn't happen which is incredibly common in anti trans circles, he is taking shit directly from Matt Walsh my dude lol I am paying attention, I have heard hundreds of you dipshits talk and haven't been susceptible to your thinly veiled dog shit for years now. You portray trans people as p@dophiles, trying to indoctrinate children into taking hormones (something that doesn't happen by the way) in their white trans vans or some shit, you guys take every opportunity possible to paint them in the most negative light possible, but sure, you aren't "anti trans" not even centrists are buying this shit anymore dude lol
@exquisitedoom Lapointe man this is conservativism in a nutshell, say what you will about Destiny, I have my own problems with him myself, but he was absolutely right this one time where he was in a call with several right wingers and told them to their face there's almost no difference between them and the Muslim extremists they were railing against at the time, and that the only difference is they aren't killing people. He got laughed at for saying that "lol that's a pretty big difference there!" But it completely went over their heads, and is still probably going to go over your head that his point is that you guys set up all the necessary steps to paint the people you're railing against as fucking Satan incarnate and just fucking wonder like the dumbasses you are why all these radical extremists come out of your camp and do mass shootings in clubs. Stochastic terrorism in a nutshell and if you genuinely believe this dumb fucker you're defending right now isn't anti trans, you're their useful idiot.
@@exquisitedoomlapointe185 sigh debate bros...
Well Adam Befriended and PSA Stitch tend to be dickriders to Jordan B Peterson and Soygon of Akkad.
People fixate on dysphoria to an absurd extent. It's never about someome being their best self to these people, it's always "PROVE THAT YOUR PAIN IS REAL TO ME."
"People fixate on tumors to an absurd extent. It's always PROVE THAT YOU HAVE CANCER BEFORE I GIVE YOU CHEMO"
@@spaceman6821 How does it feel being so confident but never saying anything of substance? Rodent.
@@Noname72105 I'm sorry, was I supposed to give a substantive response to someone complaining that we diagnose people before giving them permeant life altering treatment? The fact that you have a problem with "fixating" on dysphoria implies that you don't believe it's real when it is the *sole* justification for transitioning.
@@spaceman6821 "I want to" is a perfectly valid reason. You have no right to say what someone can or cannot do with their body.
@@Noname72105 Having cancer is the only valid reason to get chemo and you legally cannot choose to have chemo just because you want it and if a doctor gives you chemo that you objectively don't need then he is guilty of medical malpractice and is going to prison. Further more, I don't believe for a second that you believe that the government can't or shouldn't regulate healthcare.
So yes, society does have a right to tell people they can't do things and more importantly society has a moral obligation to protect vulnerable mentally ill people from unscrupulous doctors that want to hurt them for money.
"why are you against someone checking to see if an injustice is done to somebody"
Because either he thinks the people complaining about injustice are liars, or because it would mean he would have to acknowledge that the little peace he experiences is an illusion.
The Lizard Man... Damn i was so jealous of him as a kid, especially the teeth and tongue
I remember when he grew out his facial hair and criticizing him for it lol, 10 year old me watching him during an interview
1:18:21 that's partly why many countries started introducing self ID in the last decade or so. There is no point trying to waste resources on evaluating adults based on criteria they can research themselves and so can make sure to adhere to during the evaluation. The same problem doesn't apply to evaluating kids - as everyone who have seen bad movies know kids can't act for shit.
I'd love to see Jake talk to TJ on the show, but I'd very much appreciate if the topic is brought up about when TJ suggested Hannah's transition announcement was maybe an attempt at staying relevant. I love TJ and watch him regularly, but that's always really bugged me about him.
I always somehow forget TJ still does stuff, but when I do he always shows up soon after
Jake the point you make at 14:46 is exactly how i feel. i don't really care what a person is, i care about who they are.
For a moment I thought the title said “Adam Friedland” and was wondering why everybody’s favorite center-left talk-show host is suddenly feuding with TJ.
"Women will be pushed into a lower skill league" - implying that women are inherently worse than men at sport, which is saying that women's league is *already* a lower skill league, and that's why it gets less attention
Getting rid of gendered restrictions would let women have the chance to play in the higher skill leagues.
It obfuscates why such leagues exist in the first place, because many women's leagues only exist not because of skill level, but because men didn't want to lose to women.
There's no skill-based reason for a women's league in chess; it's entirely to protect the egos of the men.
@Cdog Most men's league aren't men's leagues, they are are open leagues. Women don't make it into these leagues because all three things you said are true.
@@spaceman6821 In which case actual men are already taking women's places in higher tier sports leagues and nobody seems to care
Why does it always come back to children?
Because they don't have human rights in the USA under the nuclear family model.
Because poisoning children is bad and there are a bunch of insane people who want to poison children.
What do you mean by that?
I really hope you get TJ on your channel! I stopped following him halfway into his anti sjw phase, unfortunately I agreed with him during the first half. He has redeemed himself so I am back to following him. Now he's based
I just want you to know that I'm an old, old subscriber (from The Bible Reloaded days) who stopped watching because I fell into the alt-right pipeline and became cringe. But covid and growing up lead me to the leftist path instead. It feels really good to watch Jake again with a less stupid brain.
in your defense, Jake and Hannah would both admit they were cringe edgelords back in TBR days, just like a lot of the atheist youtubers at the time, and of those they're about the only ones (and TJ of course) that kinda grew some and actually stuck to their leftist ideals.
Either way though, glad you experienced some growth and moved leftward again. Welcome back!
@@Mike-zx6sl ChrisRayGun is a lefty now too.
1:33:42 y'know, it sounds kinda like Sitch just implied that trans people aren't informed or educated about their own existence.
How informed is a schizophrenic person about the nature of existence?
"Are you against puberty blockers for children?"
I want you to rethink that question
on more than one occasion a trans archeologist on twitter said when establishing a persons gender the archeologists dont depend on measuring bones but rather taking in the context of the burial so "female" bones would be clearly gendered male if surrounded by other men or surrounded by weaponry known to have been used by a certain gender that kind of thing
"the trans stuff" has a little the same energy as "the jewish question". were not at building camps level but this shit starts somewhere
"I cut my arm off."
"Uh, cool? I guess? Go you."
End of conversation.
Good to know TJ is doing well
58:47 so there is a conflation of two things that happened together as cause and effect. The affirmative care model was just one of the changes that was done to Kearns gender health care and specifically pediatric transgender healthcare in that update the other changes were changes in the diagnostic criteria and assessment process which made it way more accurate. The reason that we have West kids whose gender dysphoria thus appears is because we know not to put them on puberty blockers to begin and we know this bay using the updated criteria that come with the affirmative care model . We actually learned how to differentiate transcend gender non-conforming kids to a quiet high degree
I love how the two of them rail so hard against the equality of outcome red herring and then at the end argue against decoupling sports from gender with "but then all the women will be at the lower skill tiers"
when they go into cosmetic surgeries, it seems like what would have been a great example for TJ to bring up is breast augmentation. does it serve a purpose? not directly, but it makes the person getting the surgery happy. does it have risk? sure. have I ever seen a conservative cis het guy come out against silicone titties? nah, that's as American as mom, baseball, and apple pie
Breast augmentation doesn't destroy your entire body and give you cancer.
Its truly amazing how well AF articulates really stupid ideas.
_"That sounds like Pascal's wager"_ What drugs are you on and where can I get some?
Like... I get what he is trying to say but it is almost worst than a non-starter. It is like telling me that I just assume this is a comment I am making until I can scientifically prove it. No, this is a comment because... this is a comment, such is self-evident.
TJ seems to be blowing up again. Love to see it.
1:15. The 'other treatments', historically, involved electroshock, institutionalizarion, criminalization...
Bro sitch has fallen so far into right wing rhetoric is embarrassing. Also go amazing atheist with the 180 character flip
He's always been far right. He was a useful idiot
The entire 'argument' against trans people for me, boils down to "Does it negatively affect me? No? Does it negatively affect anyone other than the person making the decision? No? I don't give a shit then, do it."
So you aren't allowed to be concerned over the negative impact it has on the person making the decision?
@@spaceman6821concerned? Yes. Have that affect law? No. People are allowed to make mistakes. Should we outlaw smoking? That can fuck you up for life. How about cosmetic surgeries in general? They can go wrong
@@Yummypoison0 we literally force you to wear a seat belt on the off chance you make a mistake, your doctor is also not allowed to perform any number of procedures that are harmful to you. Disrupting your entire hormone profile and getting multiple invasive surgeries is nowhere near comparable to a nose job or smoking a cigarette (you can simply stop smoking).
Also yes we should ban smoking, multiple countries have already developed the perfect solution: banning it for anyone who’s currently underaged forever. Absolute freedom is bad actually, I know this is news to TJ and corn fans.
It's nice to be back to a world where Jake, Shives, and TJ are generally on the same side again.
Too bad about Greg.
Does this dude think the retina is part of the brain? The f did that have to do with anything?
Welp, I'm not a man in Jake's eyes. I can somewhat cook (better than Dave). Number 2 is a favorite pastime of mine. However, I only respect the 90's Detroit bad boys. Laker's all the way Jakie
You think s n a are bad faith?
They are, yes
Abso fucking lutely! Notice how when they get corrected they never go to the correct position and instead double down
@@1jake2ful That's just your opinion though. They're wrong and get corrected *in your opinion.* I don't think they are wrong, so... Here we are.
Is it logical to be in favor of a society that 100 percent provides for essentials but will put you to work if you want to attain luxuries? I know that's pie in the sky and that the word luxury can have a shifting definition. At one point the car was a luxury now it's a necessity for many in the workforce.
On the 44:52 -argument: would children be free to change themselves into lizards? Or shouldn't anyone care if a parent would turn his/her kid into a lizard?
I wouldn't care for adults doing what they want (see my response on CoH); I am not sure if I would agree for kids.
Great interview from TJ.
But at the end they mixed it up. The Nazis were pro capitalists. They fought (also physically) the communist/socialist parties in Germany. So by his difinition they would have still been right wing.
There were left leaning (relatively) Nazis-and they were all massacred in the Night of the Long Knives.
The first time I found a hot trans guy I was like _"Oh god, how do I do the sex good to the trans guy?"_ and it was funny because they realized this and they told me to just top and I was like okay. Still, that was the most subby I have ever felt. They also knew I was autistic and they liked that because it implied I was justifying that _I am_ attracted to them not _if I am_ attracted to them.
If I have to justify _that I am_ and find I am not (despite the fact I clearly am) then things go wrong so just accepting that from the jump means things do not go wrong. Just saying "Well I am now what?" ends us going home tougher.
can we even establish some behaviors are really dependent on your bodily composition when weve such powerful dogma surrounding strict stultifying gender norms? we cant measure outside of those at the moment-- if ever
TJ always does great when he goes up against these types. I'm gonna recommend this debate for Demon Mama to maybe react to because I think she'd have a lot of interesting things to say about this
That's the best thing people can realise, that their standards only cover them. I mean, if I used myself as the standard for stuff only four million of the entire population on the Earth would be able to live up to it and that's only judging people based on their biological traits. If mental traits and psychological phenomenology only I can live up to the standards.
completely random hot take on the trans sports thing: it should be normal for cis women to see an endochronoligist to get their t raised if they want to be stronger. Regardless of if we kept sports gendered or did the based thing and made it entirely based on performance, I'm pretty sure the numbers would flatten out between genders decently, and even if we didnt, cis women wouldn't be like completely incapable of winning. and again, wouldn't you think these people would ve fine if amab people just tend to be better at sports because of natural injustices? I thought women were supposed to be homemakers lmao
Here for the thiick retinas
@44:31 Is the part that makes me agree with Thorn's tweet about Gender Dysphoria. I have so often heard cis people use it to forcibly medcalize being trans. It feels like the goal they have is curing being trans and as an autistic person I don't trust people who have a goal of curing part of who I am or how I think. Where would you draw the line at curing core parts of people?
Do you not realize that illness is called illness because if you weren't afflicted you would be better in every way? The idea that someone who wants to cure you must somehow be a problem is farsical. I've hung out with trans people for a good decade, plenty of whom actually think they do have a mental illness and would love to be cured, what about those, oh right, they offend you.
These two like other conservatives have set conclusions and try to find anything to justify that conclusion. It’s
most often a mess of nonsense which reveals how disingenuous the conservatives are as a whole.
How awesome is it that TJ is on our side now! 🔥
1:02:22 That too, but there's so many more worse things with what that guy just said... like...
"People are openly talking about eradicating you? Have you ever thought maybe you should back off then?"
I have a feeling he's going to obfuscate the eradication talk too...
Sometimes i feel like the "x trapped in an x's body" was the worst simplification expressed to describe the trans experience. Like yeah, it nails the general feeing but boy do the cishets take it a little too literally and holds it against trans people.
Hell yeah, though TJ did great here. Good for him.
i just wish people would have a more nuanced view on gender in general. like man i dont know what makes people trans but why does that make us less real?
Let us put out some laws that won't let us talk to children about religion. That stuff can have life long consequences.
Refreshingly good takes from TJ.
(For context 1:10:36 )Healthy gamer just did a video on a meta study that looks at the link between gender dysphoria and autistic spectrum disorder, with that being said I don’t think it’s out of the realm of reality to say that it IS quantifiable. There’s your physical evidence.
even if you can show that autistic people are more likely to identify as transgender, that is only proof of what everybody already knows about autistic people, that they are less likely to just go along with societal norms that dont make sense.
or to put it a diferent way "plastic or neurotypical" people are much easier to convince to pretend they are not trans,gay, atheist or anything else then autistic people are.
that was fun. I'm gonna go find this TJ guy.
For a second I thought that TJ was talking with Adam Friedland Which would be insane
reads title ....
giggity
Adam, yes Christians feel that Jesus is real and guess what we don't legislate to eradicate Christianity.
TJ fucking rules
The core part that proves their bad faith is their insistence on demanding a medically defined component for someone's body dysmorphia. Every intro level college neurology class basically opens by telling you that it's a field with a fuckton of theories and comparatively little hard fact. Even diseases with measurable symptoms and observable brain changes like Alzheimers are shrouded in a massive amount of working conjecture, and that's been in the public consciousness for decades more than gender dysphoria, and received orders of magnitude more finding
Archeologists largely do not sex grave sites by skeleton.
Sometimes you get a fully preserved pelvis and it's easy to tell.
But mostly you just go by the gender-affiliation of the grave site.
If a grave is super interesting and you don't have a written epitaph you might try a DNA analysis or something. And there you sometimes have surprises when people have gene defects or an unexpected chromosomal sex.
But archeologists just don't run around trying to prove the gender identity of dead people wrong.
the muffin pan corn scar is real
TJ will pretty much talk to anyone who reaches out
I keep misreading his name as "adam friedland" and was expecting bug-based humor; disappointed
It’s so wierd hearing the amazing atheist, and idk what so amazing about being an atheist, say his gender abolitionist rhetoric because he used to say and spread very misogynistic messages. What does he actually think??
He’s also one of those “vica versa” ppl when it’s vice versa.
I’m also a woman construction worker and can confirm there is sexism in the workplace. There is no biological choice about it
I've followed TJ from the beginning and he has never been misogynistic from what I've seen. Some things maybe could be misunderstood that way out of context maybe.
That "whats so amazing about being an atheist" thing is a really old, lame joke. Its just a name like a magician name. Its a really good name too. I remember America being nearly theocratic at the time under George W Bush so a youtuber openly promoting atheism actually was pretty amazing to a southern teenager.
I'd buy the "trans = christian" argument if there was a massive political movement telling people they're not christian but actually they're muslim. But there isn't.
There literally is. There are Christians who believe all people are lying about not believing in God. It's a whole IDEOLOGY lmfao
You already have an in with TJ, so might be easier. Xan and Shark seem pretty legit. DM may be a good chat.
I imagine the right feels the same way about Sargon how I feel about TJ.
I dont usually imagine the right feeling much of anything but rage
Amazing Athiest is everything Lord of Dave wishes he was
Only thing Dave has up on TAA is the clock wall. THE WALL OF CLOCKS KNOWS ALL.