Book Talk: Death's End 💀 - Buckle up, it's getting cosmic!
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- Опубликовано: 21 июл 2024
- Hi everyone! Today, I'm sharing my thoughts on "Death's End", the third part of the "Rememberance of the Earth's Past"-trilogy! It was a wild ride, and I enjoyed it a lot. General spoiler warning for "The Three Body Problem" and "The Dark Forest", the first two parts of the series.
If you've read the series, let me know what you think! I hope you enjoy this video, even though it's pretty long...
00:00 Intro
00:38 What is the book about?
04:56 Review Section
09:07 Spoilery Review Section
22:35 Some thoughts on the trilogy
23:30 Outtro
Characters in this series aren’t so much individual characters but more like symbols. Cheng Xin symbolizes humanity, the softer side of the human race that only flourishes when it’s not under much of a threat, the appreciation of beauty and love and other finer aspects of human experience. Wade on the other hand symbolizes the need for survival of human race by any means possible, a kind of crisis mentality that is useful when, for example, the humanity is under threat of invasion by the Trisolarans. Much of the series is a discussion about which mentality is more suitable, because if you seek to survive by any means possible, you may lose your humanity and would you even be a human being or merely a beast, but on the other hand, if it’s all about humanity, you wouldn’t be able to survive the harsh environment that is the universe. The scene you mentioned about feminized men is a representation of the latter situation. The question of whether to “bestow upon time with culture” or “give more time to the culture” underlines the series till the very end.
Cheng Xim represents human arrogance stupidly and cowardly behavior. First clear example was the short lived moment as a sword holder she could have initiated the process and trisolaris probes would have retreated but she didn't absolutely nothing but be a coward. She even acknowledged this in a later chapter....she is just a terribly written character.
Where did you get that lst quote from? The time culture thing?
@@glennmatthews758 iirc it's from the statue commemorating the great ravine in book 2.
The problem though is that Cheng Xin symbolizes the “appreciation of culture”, not the “creation or contribution” to culture and science, and not even safeguarding it. Her “maternal love” fails - she kills the baby twice, while admiring others’ work in a museum.
In other words, she symbolizes the consumption and comfort provided by others, a child without responsibility (as stated directly in the book). And an arrogant child at that, hibernating through most of her life. Her final “contribution” was to throw away mass, again, built by someone other than her (the Trisolarians and the 1 km³ of space). 🤦🏻♂
Culture doesn’t thrive in a vacuum of space or economic / geopolitical destruction. Human history is a sufficiently lengthy illustration of this law, starting with the Axial age. And as a creative professional working since 1997, I can only confirm, having lived the very brief period of freedom post-USSR’s collapse till the tightening of the bolts circa 2008.
Cheng Xin was pressed by the expectation of the masses to run for swordholder. The masses wanted her to be the swordholder. She just had to comply. That's her mistake. It's not her mistake that people wanted a lovable swordholder. Deterrance lost its charm when human chose a lovable person to be swordholder. It would get much much worse if she did push the button when droplet struck. Human would get destroyed from the anger of trisolarans. Trisolarans only had to leave their trisolar system immediately and their technology already could do that, but for human, it's annihilation.
It's right to not push the button after trisolaran's droplet struck. She kept 2 civilizations safe from the dark forest. And because of that, Trisolarans didn't take revenge on human after their trisolar system was destroyed.
Anyone in her place won't agree with Wade's terrorist war against the government and the innocent people, especially when the majority sided with the bunker project. Wade had zero chance against the government and the battleships. And he knew it. That's the main reason that he and his followers gave up so easily after Cheng Xin said No. The research still could be restored under the table when the fire of conflicts was put down.
I felt this book is more a love story than sci-fi. Cheng Xin brought staircase project to Tianming. Tianming bought a star to Cheng Xin. Both of them changed the other's the path of life, and they both got a chance to play an important role in saving humanity.
Cheng Xin researched on sending human probe to space, and suggested Tianming as a candidate. She also enlisted Tianming after he was about to kill himself. She kinda pushed Tianming into an unknown hell inadvertently. And Tianming agreed. Likewise, that gifted star sent Cheng Xin onto a terrible life path.
At first, she felt sympathy for Tianming. But after knowing it's Tianming who gifting her a star, she felt mostly regret and guilt for him. And there was a feeling of lost love in her heart. Since then, she would think about him whenever she suffered or felt lonely.
At that meeting in earth's orbit when Tianming told her that he had been watching her through sophons, and knew everything good and bad happened to her. He knew that she lost sight and try to kill herself. He didn't judge her, but only showed care for her in his eyes, at that moment her feeling of love for Tianming transcended into true love immediately. She completely fell in love for this man. He was the one for whom she would keep on living, hoping one day they would meet again on their star. Even everyday she had to endure so much regrets and guilt, she just wanted to meet him again someday on their star.
And there is another very interesting thing is that Chinese transliteration of "智子" (the Sophon), is "zhi zi", which can be understood as particles with intelligence.
And If you take "智子" as Japanese (Japanese will use Chinese characters, but it has different pronunciations), then it can be transliterated as "Tomoko" (a common name for Japanese women).
“子” has lots of meaning in Chinese (Japanese). It can be translated as "particle". And it also can be translated as "a person".
When "智子" become the name of girls, it means a person who have wisdom and intelligence.
So The Sophon (Zhi Zi, Tomoko, an particle with intelligence, a person who have wisdom and intelligence) becomes an image of a Japanese woman in the book.
This has shown just how much brilliance has been left on the table due to translation. Thank you for this
in my german translation the android is called tomoko
I just want to add some explanation to the sexism part. I believe all the characters in the series were meant to be used as 'tools' to just develop the story. More precisely, the gender does not really matter in the his book. Cixin Liu once said in an interview that Chengxin was initially designed as a man, but his editor thought there were already enough male characters so he needed to add more females to make the character group more balanced, and that gave you Chengxin you found in the book right now.
Who cares? We have to stop clutching our pearls over every single slight or ism.
@@vashlash6870 eh, criticism is allowed when reviewing a book, the only pearl clutching here is complaining about it. Everyone is still heavily praising it and no one is asking for Cixin Liu yo get canceled. It's just not perfection. (Nothing will be). That's fine, it's some of the closest to perfection of scifi in my opinion, but things exist that can be criticized.
I loved your analysis! I'm from Brazil and I was absolutely impacted by the scale the trilogy risked to go. Some of the "scenes" these books brought to my mind were literally things I never thought I would be able to imagine - like the 4th dimension part. Hard-sci fi is my favorte kind of SF books, and I always had the Foundation/Robot series as the highest level a human could go of real science extrapolation - like Asimov did with the science available at the time. And from this perspective, in my view Liu's trilogy got at almost, if not the same, level.
I approached the books with hard sci fi expectations, with low hopes of charachter development or love, and knowing the origin of the author. I was very curious to read a book written from a Chinese perspective - the sexism was crysfal clear, but I'm also from a country with big social problems, with a bigger ratio of sexist men than other places, so it did not surprise me. I noted it and also saw it as widely unnecessary, but in the end it was compensated by the rest of the book and mind blowing ideas (I believe that, for not being part of the offended group, it is "easier" to make this compensation, even though I can relate to the critics and don't think they are wrong).
But I really loved fhe series, and youf reviews were amazing!
I didn't find the book so much telling me that feminized men are unattractive. Rather, I thought it was explaining the character's old-world perspective and her trouble adjusting to the new world and its whims.
Here's the thing:
Trisolarans are also intelligent beings. They have emotions, they have children, they have love, they have joys and sorrows.
Just like human beings, we have beautiful homes, we have kindness, we have compassion, we have many good qualities...
These are all good things.
But when you put these feelings on the enemy, good things can become wrong things!
Yes, Trisolarans can be displaced and separated by war. But as a decision maker on one side of a war, you can't have any sympathy. You even have to destroy the good things. This is war, this is the worst, the most violent, the most horrible thing in the history of mankind! But it also has its validity.
Let's now imagine such a scenario. You need to protect your family and your friends, and your enemies will kill you all if they can. The enemy has lovely children and innocent families too. But since you can't defeat your enemy by conventional means, the only way is to strap a bomb to your body and die with your enemy if necessary. Of course, setting off a bomb will kill your family as well.
In this case, you have to convince the enemy that you will detonate the bomb if they make any move that threatens you. During this time, you can't have any sympathy or hesitation. Any good human emotion in your heart can cause you and your family to be destroyed by the enemy. You have to be the crazy person who threatens everyone's life to protect everyone's life.
Over time, and because of you, a fragile peace has been achieved between you and your enemy's pack. You've had a lot of communication, and you've experienced the beauty of each other: the innocent smile of their children has touched your eyes.
But at the same time, both sides are threatened by the same thing: the bomb on you that threatens the lives of both families. Even your lover is telling you to drop the bomb. But you are fully aware that the moment you drop that bomb, it will be the moment they slaughter your family.
Over time, pacifist sentiments spread rapidly in your family. At the end of the day, your family, by public vote and enforcement, stripped you of the right to detonate the bomb and handed it over to a kinder, more sympathetic member of the family, even one with a reputation in the rival family.
But predictably, the moment you hand over control of the bomb, the opposing family attacks (because they must eliminate the possibility that you can continue to threaten them) and slaughter your family.
Yes, there are many good things about human nature, but these things are not always right.
Cheng Xin is a symbol of human goodness. People are tired of war, tired of being threatened by bombs, and they want peace. But at some point, these good qualities turned out to be the biggest mistake.
Lose humanity, lose a lot; But lose the beastliness, lose the barbarism, human may lose everything!
Actually, I thought, the "feminization" of men in the deterrence era indicated a strong current in that era towards a more peaceful society. The stereotypical warrior-like man has no place in this society anymore, because there is very little conflict, humanity is looking towards a prosperous future without war and the need for strength. So the common era men are perceived as barbaric and not belonging to that time anymore and this stereotype disappeared. This is probably helped along by the culture Trisolarians instilled in humanity, likely to that very end: humanity not choosing such a warrior as swordholder that would choose peace over the continued existence of both races. That that swordholder turned out to be a woman is kind of secondary from their perspective, as long as it wasn't one of the warrior men perfectly willing to pull the trigger. So in my understanding, the appearance of men is supposed to help underlining the mentality in this era. Whether this is something that would actually happen I don't know, but I thought it somewhat coherent. The author does refer to this as our "bestial" nature, which just by the naming isn't super positive from a purely civilized point of view. I do agree though that the way it was phrased sometimes was somewhat off, maybe distorted in translation? I don't know.
Good point. I have to admit, I hadn't thought about it that way so much because the phrasing threw me off so much that it really confused me at times. But it makes sense that the change in the men's appearance might be meant to indicate this change towards more peacefulness in humanity in that era.
You've said what I am going to say, this part of describing the gender changes in such a detail is a fable of the current phonomeno. The current trend of LGBTQI+ movement is a epitome of that we are now living in a world ever being so peaceful.
If we start from the fact that this book, as the 3 stories for curvature propulsion combined, have a deep double meaning. Death's end is also talking at this point, about new psychological warfare, and the creation of a more feminine type of men. China's ban on k pop culture and transsexual appearance on national tv, is a clear fact of mind manipulation. The key of understanding this book is given by himself at some point, with his double metaphor theory. As well, he explains that the sword holder's mistake was because of LOVE, which will transcend after the new Big Bang.
I agree with Kevin. but I wanted to add, that the people voted for Chung Xin because she was perceived as a mother figure, even though she wan't really a mother. Also I think it should be pointed out that The Deterrence era people as per the Dark forest, lost their understanding of the family structure, and what true motherly nature was.
I like to compare and contrast Luo Gi and Chun Xin. I think Luo Gi, didn't care about anyone until he had a concrete individual he cared about. While Chun Xin cared about everyone and everything and was unable to make tough decisions to sacrifice some for the good of many. We saw this the most clearly during the false alarm Dark Forest Attack, when Chun Xi refused to choose who to bring with her on the ship.
Also, in other era's the men become more masculine. So the commentary about femininity also shows, how things changed in waves. Just like 80s men are different from 2020s men who are different from 1960s men. Based on how the trends played out, feminine traits tend to be more valued in technologically advanced civilizations because masculine traits could be replaced by machines.
I thought it was heavily implied that the Trisolarans cultural contribution pushed humanity towards a feminine and passive stereotype. All the easier to crush...
As a Chinese who just finished the Chinese version of the trilogy, I agree with you mostly on the sexism part. That and the weird emphasis on the Japanese culture are my few gripes. I think all of this reminds us that Liu is an author born in the 60s in China.
Some things about this book do ring some bells to me...
Theres a lot emphasis on the collective, nothing wrong with that, but individuality seems to be despise (or even the opposite by painting grim scenarios where individuality plays a role in mankind) by the author, you can even notice this.
The fact that the protagonist was a woman, isn't the problem, the underlining is actually INDIVIDUALITY.
You think to much about gender, when the protagonist discover that she was pregnant was the moment where her INDIVIDUALITY kinda shifted... It wasn't more just her life, her decision, but a decision about their soon.
Also, YOU NEED to have in mind that this writer is from China, a place where everything is heavily monitored and censored and i won't be surprise if parts of this book was changed and parts cut off.
The trysalarians are literally a representation of americans by the eyes of the chinese.
100%
The Death's End has very story metaphor to the real world. Korea and Japan are "carefully" protected by US. People doesn't worry about the "Survival" too much. So Humanity becomes the mainstream of their society. And, this exactly meet US's interest. (I'm not talking about politics. This's my understanding of those metaphors. The metaphor of humanity is woman; Survival is man.) They don't need the people to fight for their survival. They don't need warriors. They need feminized pop stars. The 1st episode of Black Mirror has a similar scene.
I have to look past people bias and selfish every interaction. One more won’t hurt.
In his defense, the gender of the protag was initially a male, then editors requested him to change the gender to female.
13:00 it's strange that you frame it like this. I never thought that she made bad decisions because she was a woman but because there wheren't any good decisions to make. Especially question if she should press the button we know what happens but consider what if she presses. Tri-solarians would be destroyed BUT also solar system would be destroyed. This is my 2 cents.
What the author wants to criticize is not Cheng Xin's identity as a woman, but her beautiful human qualities (which happen to be attached to the image of a woman or a great mother).
I think she was the best character in the books. Bad decisions? Maybe... It depends on your viewpoint. Humanity will come to an end, one way or another.
Personally I feel she didn't make any bad decisions. She just kept getting screwed over by the unknown. The amount of times I've said, "oh that's so messed up..." Especially when humanity learned the only way to escape the 3D collapse was a project she had shut down
Thanks for review. I didn't think it was too sexist because AA was a little more gungho on wanting to progress forward as a different female view
Hey :) Why didn't the Trisolarians weaponize the 4d bubbles before the humans did???
Was it also ageist that people from old times were more prepared to act rationally under pressure compared to the modern humans?
Cheng Xin was not doing the bad things to humanity but a very good thing!
Cheng Xin actually symbolizes the good qualities of humanbeing.
Although this kind of good thing actually is a wrong thing!
Good doesn't mean right and bad doesn't mean wrong at the same time!
The protagonist did not push the button and engage with light speed research due to her love for humanity. This can never be seen as a negative, no matter if the person is a lady or male. I completely disagree with your ideals of this. Women want equality but are upset when women make choices that may not agree with the preconceived ideas. Bleh
@11:06 My understanding of "Chengxin didn't push the button" is not because she is woman. Chengxin is the representative or metaphor of humanity. Humanity say we shouldn't use destroying the world as the king card to deter the enemy. It's like nuclear weapons. Based on humanity (or innocent kindness), China, Russia, US are ugly to play the nuclear deterrence game. But ironically, this's the best way to keep the World safe. And, the metaphors are: woman is the tangible humanity; while man is to survive. The dark forest law is same. The Death's end is always struggling between humanity and survival. You have one then you must lose another.
Help! After reading this, I've become desensitized to BIG ideas. Does anyone know of any sci-fi that can deliver on/near the level of Death's End?
You might like the fantastic Hyperion series by Dan Simmons
Hello Berit! Are you going to read The Redemption of Time and review that one also? Thanks for your reviews from Los Angeles!!
I'll definitvely read it, already got it on my shelf!
what happens to mankind at the end? all killed or all survived in the pocket dimension?
spread out into the cosmos
This is the creepiest science fiction book ever!! I love it
I also think a lot of Cixin's storytelling is more understood after reading The Foundation series by Asimov which Cixin tips his hat to in 3 body problem. "Past outside of time" is the same mechanism Asimov uses but in Foundation it is the Encyclopedia. Also we can see how Cixin is playing to the foundation series when we shows new cultural differences we see through time, while asimov showed us cultural differences of different cultures across the cosmos
Interesting! I actually haven't read anything by Asimov yet, but he's on my list.
@@storyworldling7444 Three Body Problem TV series just got released! Its very loyal to the books: ruclips.net/video/YrLompD6e_k/видео.html
I thought the subtitle of the book should've been "Oh F--K!" lol
Why did Wade get killed by laser? Why not normal bullet or leathal injection. High powered laser uses massive amounts of power. Laser weapons in Sci fi do not seem to have advantages over gunpowder weapons.
About the feminization and attraction part, I think Liu is trying to portray how careless mankind is after years of numbing peace. And also feminization is generally considered a bad sign in Chinese history. During the Jin Dynasty (around 266-420 CE), males were very feminized and wore makeup on daily basis. Privileged classes considered homosexuality rightful and fashionable. Unfortunately the Jin Dynasty is widely accepted as one of the darkest dynasties throughout Chinese history, by historians across millennia. Unlawful regime, failure to mandate, corrupted officials, unstable governance, savage hordes invasion you name it. Yes there is no evidence showing that a feminized society would lead to systematic failure, but for the Chinese people they might instinctively feel worried. If my ancestors were raped by savages and then butchered for dinner (that actually happened. Women and children were called 'two-legged lambs' by the hordes since their meat taste tenderer than men's), I gonna have some serious PTSD.
I loved this series. I'm about halfway through the 4th book and it has pleasantly surprised me. A lot of the gaps it fills in are very interesting, though I am having trouble picturing the main plot as a whole. Looking forward to see if you read that one, and your thoughts.
I literally didn't know there was a fourth book until this second, but my first thought is that I have to read it! 😱
@@storyworldling7444 it is not written by Cixin Liu and it originally started as a fan fiction. Yan Tianming is the protagonist--i mostly had to read it to find out what his life among the Trisolarans was like, but it very quickly disregards that story for something bigger
@@KotyandMax9000 I see. Sounds like it could be interesting to read
it’s not nearly as good as the original trilogy unfortunately, basically just fan fiction that got published
@@storyworldling7444 I found it rather disappointing. it's fun to briefly explore, in the same way that it's fun to go onto a forum and talk to others after reading a book. It did open my eyes to other possible interpretations that I hadn't considered, but I don't know for sure that I like the direction the books go, compared to the original story, and it might have been better off as it's own thing completely.
I couldn’t care less about their gender, they could all be cis males or females, or non binaries, all I care is about the story and how it develops. Thank you for the review ❤
Some of my thoughts:
1. You need to have read the previous books to understand this book. There is no summary or reminder in the book. Many characters and situations from the previous books are mentioned without any explanation. In my opinion that is a flaw that could be easily corrected with a few paragraphs of explananation. I read the first 2 books a few months ago, but I don't remember the details.
2. It is difficult to believe that the swordholder would be a single person. It is much more plausible that many leaders, presidents or prime-ministers of the world would all be swordholders and be able to press the button. And the deterrence weapon would only be activated if all, or at least a majority of the swordholders pressed the button. Putting the fate of the entire human race on a single person is too inplausible.
3. Many elements of the book are based on real science. It is difficult to know which elements are from the author, and which elements are from other authors or scientists. I wished there was an a bibliography with all the sources.
4. There is no mention of a Noah's Ark, at least in this book. Maybe there is in the previous books? I don't remember.
If humanity were doomed to extinction, it is quite probable they would try to build and launch spaceships that worked as Noah's Ark.
Such spaceship should have libraries with most human knowledge, and frozen embryos and seeds of most animals and vegetables, including several human embryos. The purpose would be that hopefully an advanced civilization would intercept and be able to revive the embryos, so humanity could survive and rebuild somewhere in the Cosmos.
A more advanced Noah's Ark would have artificial incubators able to develop and give birth to the human embryos, and robot nannies able to take care, raise and educate the babies.
An even more advanced Noah's Ark would have human adults in hibernation.
A Noah's Ark is not that difficult to build and it is feasible, at least in its simplest form, with today's technology. Many arks can be built and launched and if at least one of them succeeds, then the human civilization could still exist and thrive somewhere in the galaxy.
5. If an alien civilization were to try to conquer the Earth, would they even bother to talk to humans? Do humans bother to talk to ants that might be living on a property where humans want to build a new house? Humans just build the house and kill any ants that stand in the way. Just like ants are completely ignored by humans, an alien civilization would just ignore humans and just kill any human that stood in the way. So to survive all you have to do is not to stand in the way of the aliens. The only problem is that aliens could want to occupy the entire planet, and possibly there would be nowhere to go to survive, except maybe outer space. And humans fleeing Earth would probably be completely ignored by the aliens.
21:46 At end, the author make Chengxin and Guan Yifan together. The author didn't give up the last, weak hope. Humility (Chengxin, woman) and Survival (Guan Yifan, man) could coexist and build the new world. That's the tiny beautiful hope in despair.
What is it to understand about the main character's dislike for affeminate men? She is simply expessing her taste in men. Right, this isn't important to the plot, but neither is description of any environs for that matter. We really have to stop wanting artists to comply with our silly whims, so they can do their thing.
I finally finished the trilogy. Pret-ty epic
Cixin Liu perception is correct. In ancient times when men had to be strong, hunt for food and even fight wars, masculinity was very important, and it was a precondition for women to judge their potential partners with. However in modern days hunting for food is not necessary anymore, wars are fought both by men and women. So masculinity is not an important trait anymore. We indeed see that in the kpop industry that effeminate men actually are very popular among women, and people with high EQ are well received, instead of toxic masculinity. So a future depicted by Cixin Liu with the role of men totally different than what we have in current times is very plausible.
first of all you are very compelling yourself as a reviewer. the tone of your voice and pace are excellent. great work. i disliked the first book because it was so flat and mostly because it read like a young adult novel story. i may have to read the other two -- still on the fence, but you are giving a good push to do it thanks.
Deaths End was such an epic. Such a brilliant imagination. We didn't have the exact same reaction of course but I definitely enjoyed your review. Great video
Thank you! :)
17:35 Turns out women and men both like masculine men.
Some of the book is in the first season of the Netflix show.
Good review!
It has taken me ages to get through this book but I'm largely in line with your views on this.
Oddly though the sexism in this one stood out much more than in The Dark Forest (don't know what that says about me😉). I found this quite jarring as it seemed to serve as a reminder that the female protagonist is being written by a male author, forcing his viewpoints inorganically through her.
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Also agree with the ending. The book is really interesting in the way that it deals with sci-fi concepts but the emotional narrative just didn't come through for me and so the personal elements did not work for me.
...the box universe outside of time and space where they go to wait for time to pass in the main universe just seemed like a cop out to skip over a bunch of time and get to the end.
I really liked the 4D space part but also couldn't help but wonder how Netflix are planning to visualise that. 😉
By the time the 2D solar system happens I was thoroughly sick of Cheng Xin's hero shield to the point that I'd pretty much lost any emotional investment in the stories and character.
Overall I think this is really outstanding Sci-Fi with a pretty weak narrative.
I agree with basically everything you've said re: Cheng Xin's decisions: weak, pathetic, and ultimately catastrophic (I was also yelling at the book), and how this is portrayed by Liu (sexistly) as being motivated primarily by her "female nature."
I disagree that the whole "deterrence-era men are feminine and unattractive little k-pop girly boys" part was "unnecessary," as you say. I think it's a core component of a major theme in this series that Liu very transparently believes: that men are inherently rational, calculating, and strong, and that women are comparably emotional, compassionate, and weak. It's like a Yin and Yang thing. This is supported by showing how both the feminization of civilization and Cheng Xin's awful decisions are motivated by "feminine qualities," which are both actively manipulated by the Trisolarans and ultimately play into their hands. Put simply: Cheng Xin (a woman) is too emotional to make the hard but rational decisions that a man could, to ultimately disastrous effect.
The problem with this kind of gender essentialism is NOT that it's sexist (though I agree with you that it is). Liu Cixin is allowed to be sexist; he's a fiction author, not running for president or anything. The problem is that, in a series where it's main strength is the scale innovation of its high-concept ideas, this one pretty major idea that permeates the trilogy (men are like this, women are like that) is not interesting or innovative at all, but well-worn, stale, and unimpressive.
dude give the author a break. all sci fi writers are geeks, not casanovas.
Thanks for that great review. I just finished the trilogy. I loved it overall, but yea, some things took me out of the story like a slap in the face. The main one here was that WEIRD tirade about men being too feminine, like you said. It literally came out of nowhere, added nothing to the story and, as you said, felt like the author saw a K-Pop band and went to town against them. It literally did nothing for the story. BUT- when he mentioned that, I thought about other sci-fi and biology books I've read that hypothesize humans would interbreed so much between cultures that we'd all end up looking roughly the same (so far as the cultural construct of "race"), yet he did not explore that at all.
There was also a moment where the hyper-american character, akin to Jack RIpper from Dr. Strangelove, only quotes Chinese mythologies. There was no representation from African or Indian cultures. Just Chinese, European and American. It took me out of things a bit.
The female sexism was pretty bad here, IMHO. If you look at the words (in the english translation) used to describe Cheng Xin and her emotions, they skew pretty heavily towards helplessness and maternity. I know that the maternal instinct is part of her character and arch, but it seems that someone mistook 'maternal' to mean 'not willing to fight hard'. Look at what real women have done to defend their children, it puts the X-Men to shame. Plus, she gives Wade all of her power. I know why this was done in the author's mind, but it was such a lost chance to see Cheng Xin embrace her power. Having lived through a few ears, you'd think she'd have the strength and wisdom to overcome, but, I suppose, that is a different story.
The ending was a little odd for me. I agree the whole flattening of the Solar System drug on for too long. I saw it coming that there was a curvature drive on the ship when she was told it was just constructed 3 months ago. I REALLY enjoyed and appreciated so much of the physics around the reduced lightspeed constant, etc. What I'm on the fence about is just how it ends. Billions of years pass, no one seems REMOTELY upset that Sophon is there after indirectly slaughtering millions, and they still think Sophon is a graceful friend? What??
The actual ending with the Returners is OK, I guess. But I wanted something... more. Something different from just heat death or collapse, something more innovative. Plus, where are those Infinity ships in all that mess? I still love the trilogy and think it is some of the best sci-fi ever produced.
Just some random thoughts. I could talk about these books all day.
Yes, I definitely agree with your points! It's such a great series and there are so many things to talk about, both great stuff and things where I wasn't too happy. But I think it's great when a book series really can get you engaged so that you want to talk about it. Overall, it's a really great Sci-Fi series.
Just on the sexism. I think it was much better handled in this book than the 2nd (luo ji was ridiculous and hilarious tbh).
Some comments you pointed out are actually coming through the eyes of Cheng Xi who is used to common era men, whereas AA have the exact opposite opinion about what she is attracted to. So I guess there’s no jugement there in the end. For the rest I wont repeat the other good takes from the comment section.
Really good book, better than 2nd (the doomsday battle really made me roll my eyes to no end…)
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Imo we think we can relate to our grandparents or ancestors but I bet many of our own family would be disappointed or disappointing based on morals alone. Too many young people struggle to understand context and how life plays out and how you cannot apply it when and wherever you want.
I support Wade! Nothing sexist about the book, only based.
The last 50 p in book 3 where weird...Did struggle on some parts in the 3 books.
I wish some stories were or could be seen as just stories instead of every nook and cranny of them needing to mean this and mean that and represent this or that or be a reflection of this or that in the real world. Readers - at least, they used to be - are intellectual types, and can glean meanings and purposes for themselves. Literature shouldn’t all just shift to propaganda. In the past, it was known up front if a book was such, that’s what the entire dystopian genre was born out of. There was no mystery whatsoever that Bradbury or Rand were writing about, attacking, making commentary on real ideas and movements happening here. But that is fine for them, not every page published of everything needs to be that way or be seen that way and I’m actually extremely mournful that it seems to be getting to that point.
….As I speak to nobody, and as my own thoughts will be absorbed by nobody….except maybe to frame them as something they aren’t, which social media has made an art form out of.
I don’t want to be the person who understands Ye’s choice to send the signal but every day i inch closer.
So let us concentrate on the story set in a future, which only the fundamental necessities of a species ability to survive is in focus, and let us not complete this with the confusion of today’s groupthink social structures
9:25 comment has big spoilers warning
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I think that is part of the point of the story. Her actions are infuriating to the reader and the characters around her, obvious mistakes when you look at it in the moment and the short-term result. But in the long term it was probably the proper choice. Part of the theme since the end of the second book becomes love will fill the dark forest with light.
Without pushing the button, she never would have been allowed to speak to Yun Tianming or get the pocket universe, allowing humanity a chance to spread their memories in the next universe. Without stopping the war between Halo and the Federation over propulsion drives, I believe AA when she said that it would not have worked, as they needed the Federation's funding which they only got after establishing a secret deal, and any result of war would not have allowed that to happen.
So I think also that when her choice to leave the pocket universe made Sophon upset, it means ultimately she made the correct choice to help reset the universe. Eventually a universe will reach a perpetual Garden of Eden state and love will be the cause.
However, I do agree with you about the sexism stuff. It wasn't raging incel level, but the "woman not a warrior" and such was... Bleh. And Cheng Xin could have embodied love without it being just because that's what women are supposed to be.
She didn't make the right choices at all. First for the sword holder role, she could have initiated the process of triggering the trisolaris coordinate wave, it was not like press one button and boom! There was a sequence she needed to do to do it and could have started it & scared off the probes but instead she did nothing...she even acknowledged this in a later chapter that the probes would have retreated if she had just initiated the process since the sophons were watching her. But instead she did nothing and ended the highest level of prosperity in human existence. Then for the curvature propulsion tech...not gonna type long but her mistake is admitted in her future discussion with the first sword holder....I think sexism was the key reason for the bad writing of her character
very fair comment about the women characters! Totally agree
I was left from deaths end with the idea they we’re probably the only ones stupid human enough (using the lack of pushing the button and stopping propulsion research as evidence of “ stupid human “ ) to actually give the pocket universe back this making humanity’s last selfless act as being completely pointless and heat death was inevitable
2d basically turn us into a painting
Trilogy as whole goes for me a from best to not as great 2 > 1 > 3. All 3 books are amazing and each has their own flaws, specially in pacing, the first dragged a lot on the Three-body game ( the whole human computer part was too long and other parts of the game I was thinking " this is dragging so much but it must be relevant in some way? " ). The 2nd has the Luo Ji getting his dream waifu plot being so detailed and irrelevant to the point everyone knows hes only doing this because he's abusing the Wallfacer status. And in the 3rd book, the author had the idea of using the dimensions as an attack only in that book, the first chapter where the woman takes the brain of the man in the cell by using the 4th dimension should've been a scene earlier in another book or just not been there at all, also yes the last 100 pages have too much going on that should've just not happened ( getting trapped for 14 million years? )
But we're met with an amazing story about our place in the universe, I love that the Tri-solarians are a species that suffered so much and go through all this just for it to be irrelevant, one of the Sophon's word's from the last book where she says that humanity takes life for granted really struck with me, the universe to a certain degree hates life and I've recently read a theory that life only exists so it can fasten the entropy of the universe so it can go to it's cold state where nothing happens again and we as a species fail to see that, the Dark forest exists, there exists life outside of our solar system and other jealous beings are not ok with how we live out our lives in such luxury of everything being so pacific as if our place was perfect in every way.
Love the books and it's ideas but the author at the end of the day is a man born in the 1960's so he has a warped view on women as a whole in the trilogy, although I really liked how he described the men from the common era as rude and power hungry to the level of erasing the existence of two entire civilizations, how humanity in the era of peace end's up being so feminized is other thing I've enjoyed allthough he compares the bones from men to bananas? ( at least in the audiobook it said that ) super weird, as time goes on we're headed towards the same society, we have no need for men who place soldiers in the field so they can fullfil his so fragile ego, we need mothers who recognize those arent soldiers and instead are their sons. Im not defending the author with how he portrayed Cheng Xin and how she " held a baby in her arms and her maternal instinct kicked in " that is just bullshit from an old man.
Also I'd like to shoutout Shi Qiang, although a stereotype of a cop and an asshole he's still a person everyone needs in their life to uplift them!
15:45 i feel this is a Chinese cultural comment on Transsexual people. A bit of 2020s politics seeping through. Some comment on hard times, hard men, easy times commentry that is a favorite quote of the right wing.
Hello! Just finished the series myself. Personally, the feminine appearance of the men did not bother me. A trend that can be observed for several years. I got to know the protagonist as a sensitive woman, who is constantly in a conflict between the real world and her feelings. Even though I didn't agree with her first decision, I could understand it.
The real problem I have with the book is the ending. As you said in your video, there was a coherent explanation for everything. Only at the end from where the two are in a small universe and Tomoko suddenly appears. I'm not sure how much this has to do with Trisolaris. If someone can answer that I would be grateful!
Greetings eismarille!
PS.: Sorry for the translation!
It's gift from Tianming. All is mentioned in the book. Sophon is an AI, that could be copied and mass-manufactured.
@@Idylliac
Thanks for the answer. Yes the sophons are sufficiently described in the first book as one-dimensional folded supercomputers.
The problem I have with the Trisolaris series is the ending. For me personally, the ending didn't explain itself. What this "room" was in which the two were and lived for a while. The role of Tomoko was, from my personal point of view, not explained. Especially her appearance in this strange dimension.
Loved Cheng Xin. She is the most relatable personally to me. I find it surprising that people hate her so much. I guess Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel are the kinds of protagonists you prefer?
true, I am amazed people only want to read likable characters, but a book can also be about a flawed, antihero and unlikeable character.
As for the sexist talk this book is about humanity as a whole, you have to look at it from a Jungian metaphysical perspective and see the characters represent different aspects of archetypes of humans. Cheng Xin represents the Animus the feminine and Wade represents Anima and Masculinity. I'm not mad at all for Cheng Xin not pressing the button or siding with Wade, these things happened because she is loving and caring and wanted the best for humanity, also she got woke up from hibernation once and straight away got shot and then appointed to the saviour of the world and the second time she got woke up and Wade said we can do lightspeed but it will mean a breaking of the peace and a internal conflict within the humans that were left. You are getting triggered by not understanding the deeper aspects of humanity and focusing on the individual who in these books are quite metaphorical.
This book is so long and very scary.
But man, those chapters in Australia were really depressing… I didn’t like seeing that.
I feel like the whole thing about feminized men is supposed to represent how humanity is getting softer, and then how it eventually hardens up and returns to what it was before, and this may not be Liu Cixin's intent, but it feels like femininity and weakness are heavily intertwined within this series.
Not at all. In ancient times when men had to be strong, hunt for food and even fight wars, masculinity was very important, and it was a precondition for women to judge their potential partners with. However in modern days hunting for food is not necessary anymore, wars are fought both by men and women. So masculinity is not an important trait anymore. We indeed see that in the kpop industry that effeminate men actually are very popular among women, and people with high EQ are well received, instead of toxic masculinity. So a future depicted by Cixin Liu with the role of men totally different than what we have in current times is very plausible.
As they say on the book "Sissies"....
@@thug4lyfe sissy doesnt need to be a bad word when effeminate men has a significance place in our day and age.
This is kind of sad…. iTunes to this review of the book, mainly to get some spoilers and to get some more interesting details on the storyline. I did not tune into this review to get someone’s opinion on if there is sexism in the book or not, because that is you know not interesting if you look at the story….. some women find feminised men and attractive, and some women find feminised men attractive… you should just accept that the character in this book did not find feminised men, attractive and move on with doing a review on the storyline, or discussing the book….. I hate that people are seeing the world in black and white and black in my white, I mean men, women groups, racial groups, political groups or or otherwise…. Humans are all the same species and we all need to work together towards goals in order to advance our species is this, advance equality of opportunity, and appropriate in order to flourish,
I agree about the last 100 pages or so. After the point they wake up the last time and go to Pluto really I felt like more and more contrivances were slowly introduced. The ending hinging on this group the Returners, which is only ever mentioned for the first time very close to the end, felt a but forced. The book is incredibly solid and I massively enjoyed it but as it concludes it does feel weaker plot wise.
On top of the sexism you mentioned, I also was really struck throughout the entire series that Africa basically doesnt exist in this world. I think the only time Africa is ever mentioned by name is an offhand reference that there's an Africa planet in the Bunker era that tried to rebel but failed. For a book that focuses so much on geopolitics in the plot, only really Asia, Europe, and North America appear to have any agency even centuries into the future.
That's an interesting observation. I didn't notice it while reading, but now that you mention it, right, it's actually striking that a whole continent is almost never mentioned, given the global scale of the novel.
@@storyworldling7444 That reflects how the third world gets ignored nowadays.
read "the incal"
Sounds interesting, thank for the recommendation!
For calling out to sexism i found you are very quickly triggered by those points you mentioned, and at the same time i am a bit surprised that you didn't make any comment on how it is counterbalanced by the most badass female characters in the books and my personal favourite ,that is, Ai AA. She displays both femininity and badassness, in the sense that she can be very bubbly and at times even a bit sassy (bathtub scene) to the point that even Cheng Xin sometimes forget she is an actual astrophysicist; but she is also very strong (sniper scene), proficient and dominant as the head of the halo group and is even described as a female version of a fuckboy (without even any criticism from the author).
Also about the feminized k-pop men of the deterrence era, you have to view it from Cheng Xin's point of view. It was her who didn't find them attractive because of the cultural clash that she encountered due to hibernation. If the whole population of the earth went down this path, it is implied that feminine traits have become the most desirable trait in men for that time period.
Other than that i agree with pretty much everything you mentioned.
One of my own personal criticism is that i am baffled that after centuries into the future you'd expect everyone to look like brown eurasians. Even the world language got mixed between english and chinese. I found that part a bit racist.
Eastern cultures like chinese and japanese are cultures that have survived millenia and thus their beliefs and mindsets are very rooted in tradition. This means that the roles of men and women are often portrayed in a less flexible and modern way as it is in western culture. It is natural for an author born and raised in that environment to portray his characters in the way he perceived them.
That said, I saw the feminization of society as a way to say: "yes, peace and prosperity lies in the hands of love and cooperation (within humans), but in an universe filled with hostile civilizations, you cannot use that approach towards them".
It was an interesting review but... The constant remarks about the sexism really showed a lack of understanding of the cultural context in which this book was written.
What do you expect from a woman that lives on a first world west country? They are bombarded every day with the woke ideology.
I think you are overplaying the alleged sexism of these books. I think it's like you've said - you went into this biased towards there being sexism, so now you subconsciousness is giving you exactly what you wanted. It looks like you shot yourself in the foot with your bias, because I think you've missed a lot of social commentary the author has made.
Yes; some decisions made by certain characters were influenced by them being either a mother (or having motherly feelings) or a father, but other than that? I don't really think it was gender-based. It was more a combination of character traits (which do vary slightly between the 2 sexes) and the given circumstances any given character found themselves in. I didn't see any of the characters as purely evil or purely good. All of them were flawed. That was the whole point. They all had good reasons for what they did and what they did wasn't always the best choice ever. It made them more realistic. I could actually understand how some important characters came to their conclusions, which resulted in their actions.
I hardly ever noticed the genders of the characters. I saw the reasoning of a person and resulting actions. By - in my opinion - forcing yourself to find sexism here, you are doing a disservice to yourself.
In fact, I think the author's real mistake, and that of most people today, is to bind "good" human qualities to women (which in time of war means weakness) and "bad" human qualities to men (which in time of peace means violence and danger).
In the book, it is not so much the feminization of men as the softening of men.
Like the discussion I had with my friends over the word "sissy." She thinks men can be soft and weak too, and we shouldn't discriminate against them.
But I think both men and women should be strong and brave. Neither man nor woman should become "sissy." (I started this discussion by interpreting sissy as effeminate, not feminine).
In my opinion, women should be separated from such qualities as weakness (kindness). Men should also be separated from rough (masculine) qualities. Because the good qualities are that everyone needs, and should have; And bad qualities, everyone needs to criticize them.
But applying the right qualities at the right time can be very testing.
Again, good doesn't mean right and bad doesn't mean wrong! In the book, the feminization of men is not so much as the weakness or kindness of men. In the book, the feminization of men is not so much as the weakness or kindness of men. In the book, it is not so much the feminization of men as the softening of men.
It's not a make mistake, not everyone is a brainwashed "woke", China do not adhere to sodoomite liberal ideals
@@thug4lyfe i do not get what you are trying to talk about
OMG being a female protagonist and taking bad decisions is a very big deal with ghis reviewer. This book answers the question why she didn't pressed the button how mothers instincts are... and u stretching this thing sooooo loooong omg
It's turned into a Avengers level threat at the end. Completely off the rails
This book was before Avengers ever existed, I would not be surprised that Marvel borrowd influence from this book with the grand scale of multiverse.
CN female reader here seconds everything you say about the book, LOL on your reaction on Chen Xin, any sane person read it for the first time would crack. But Chen Xin's the choice of people, they chose humanity and comfort over strategy and harsh pragmatism. Indeed it's a book with strong sexist stereotypes, but we love it for the critical intricacies.
14:41. No not really
With the gender thing, the book sermed tk be saying that feminised men were bad and the world needed soldiers which is in part why the human race had problems. The author really doesng seem to like men who are not traditional men. Its really weird because in the real world youd always have all kinds of men (and women), thats more realistic. Like you i had a eye roll at done of it.
Just finished reading the three books a few days ago and I gotta say that the third book wasn't very good & they missed a good opportunity to write one of the best ever sci-fi stories. I'm a guy & even I found the sexism in the book very unnecessary & I think that is what lead to the poor writing of the main character in the final book. Like the real first savior in the story was Luo Ji and he was portrayed as being a monster & charged with " mudocide" yet Cheng Xi first was pointed about her being a women & her maternal instinct & love & the author seemed to constantly try to excuse her stupid decisions & cowardly behavior as first sword holder (note she could have just initiated the sequence of the buttons for the signal transmission & scared off the probes but she did nothing, she later acknowledged this herself) because of what she symbolizes & then the constant commenting about the men of Lou Jis era vs the feminine men of future eras & the people of the older era being better at certain things....over all it just felt that they gave no good reason for the stupid decisions of Cheng Xi or that future era dumb leaders but constantly emphasized how feminine men were now & Cheng Xis maternal instinct & Love...then there was another part I think it was like the president of the main international national government and she gives some brief message & author just focuses on her beauty without going into more detail as to what she had done or accomplished. So in short, author kinda said in the last book that current era men are masculine & make difficult necessary decisions (wade & Lou Ji) but women & men of the future are feminine and make terrible decisions.
Thank you for writing out my thoughts well, I agree about the way that the book depicted masculinity/femininity very archaic and found it bizarre. I had hope he'd finish the series strong but I found it meandering, and felt like he wanted the story to go a certain way instead of having the protagonist be more logical
Not everyone was raised in a liberal arts campus, there are conservatives out there
Of course it’s bizarre, he’s constructed a whole cosmic world that transcends boundaries of time and space and even beyond the end of universe... “Humanity” as we understand and take for granted today can only be trivial and absurd on such an “inhuman” scale...
perhaps this is a cultural thing-- Guan Yin even emphasizes to Cheng Xin that everything is not her fault, that she chose love and is the best of humanity--she represents positive qualities. She never seemed weak at all.
Wow you should re ready the books...she constantly showed a weak character
@@Zen-jp1gb I think we have different interpretations of characters, their motivations, and storylines, and that's okay. These are all influenced by our upbringing. I am coming from the perspective of an Asian woman living in Asia. I just finished the books and was looking to have fun discussing with other fans of the book. Have a great day.
@@lovebunny2345 that is a very good point about the influence of our upbringing. Can you please elaborate more on your experience as an Asian woman living in Asia? I know Asian women here in the states but they must be different life specially because they are younger & don't think they ever lived in China
The dark forest was so good and full of future technology so to go back in the Dark Forest was boring. I understand the symbolism and metaphors and realized this by the middle of forest so deaths end seemed to be geared towards the morons no offense.
For Chinese people, mother is the greatest!
People look up to their mothers. At the same time, the most vicious and ugly name-calling and attacking words or sentences in the Chinese language are attacking the mother of the others.
Cheng Xin is portrayed as a great mother because mother is very, very noble and bright in the eyes of Chinese people. Cheng Xin also represents almost all positive human qualities in the book.
Great review, super insightful and thought provoking, just finished the series. I really didn't even think about the sexism of the woman needing to be the Madonna and the man needing to be the stern, tough, unemotional and unfeeling cowboys that essentially Wade was made out to be. Something irked me about those subjects in the book but I couldn't put my finger on it until this review. Like Trisolarans were actually relieved when she took over because her deterrence percentage was so weak and the man's deterrence was nearly 100%. I wonder if that came from sexism in the history of humankind as portrayed in all of the art and society that the Trisolarans consumed, because history is blatant to treating women as weak unfortunately.
With the more feminized men than the other era, I absolutely thought of k-pop idols, and I thought the need to bring it up as unattractive was just a character choice in the beginning and would set up a future love interest which kind of panned out, but you're right it does go on just a little long than necessary and makes a statement. Overall I really loved the series and have never thought so much about a set of books in my life. Thanks to your review I'll be rereading the first two and looking at your content for those insightful views. Thanks for your thoughts here!
To satisfy political correctness, the english version of this series has more than 1200 differences from the original Chinese version. Actually, those books do not convey sexism. The author appreciates Cheng Xin in the depth of his heart, because of her kindness. However, kindness cannot save humankind. The important quote in the 3rd book is "If we lose our human nature, we lose much, but if we lose our bestial nature, we lose everything." Cheng Xin didn't lose humanity, but lost bestial nature, which led to the death's end. We should and must respect female, however, absolute gender equality would lead to chaotic sometimes, after all, men and women have different mindsets.
Thank you for your point! It is so interesting that the English version is so different from the Chinese. I think the quote you bring up is very important, and I must say I liked Cheng Xin and thought, overall, that her role was really interesting. I liked having hesr as the protaginst.
@@storyworldling7444 Not 'so' different, just some different, most of them are related to the issue of sexism.
This reminds me of a quote from "A Man Without Qualities" by Robert Musil. I cannot give you the exact quote(it's been so long since I read the book) but the gist of the quote was that mankind didn't crawl out of the swamps and climb to the top of the food chain by being nice.
@@alexiskiri9693 You can say it again.
@@alexiskiri9693 But it's our ability to be nice and tolerent that allowed us to thrive, otherwise we'd still be in the trees flinging poop.
God the ending was terrible. I agree with the sexism and poor protagonist design. However I read it as the story Cixin Liu wanted to tell without assuming anything about his innate ideologies later on. What I did realise is that Cheng Xin was basically an embodiment of the society and her replies resonated with the solar system humans who were as described in the book like a child afraid to venture out into the world outside. On the other hand galactic humans were the evolutionary byproduct who didn't let the fear of unknown hold them back. Cheng Xin's characterization was extremely weird. As I said she represented solar system humans but had an ambition of the galactic humans and on top of that she didn't take decisions on her own ever. I strongly feel she should have died at the 5th part, with the 2D-fication of the solar system. Perhaps AA could have been the one to alone use the curvature drive. Her presence in the 6th part, simply ruined the entire flow of the story. We didn't get to hear about the galactic humans and their experiences, on which I feel a complete book could have been dedicated. There was so much to unpack, which would have been a brilliant sequel, but all we got was a forced, half baked love story of Cheng Xin and Guan Yifan with the final few pages feeding us exponential amount of information without any explanation.
I agree with you, it would have been great to get to know more about the galactic humans, that would have been great.
hahahaha K-pop idols !!! Well hard times created strong women in the first book, when the lady protagonist wanted the Aliens to come save humanity from itself LMFAO
She didn’t make bad decisions because she is a woman, but being a woman did factor into why she made her decisions. Men and women are hardwired differently.
I found Chen Xin completely unlikable and naive. A character can have many failings but as long as they suffer the consequences and the worldbuilding treats them as that. After the first horrible choice i couldnt understand how she was still allowed in a position of power and continue making choices for humanity, its as if the author wanted more to pontificate more on the 'feminization' of society as bad, and using Chen Xin as a prop than actually considering that rational humans would never let her lead again after such a massive blunder.
I couldn't finish the book because of that.
Thats the genius part of Chen Xin, why must a good book have to have likable characters, it is way more fun to read about flawed characters, as that depicts the real world too, nobody is perfect in real life too. So if the character was a man who failed, then its okay and not sexists? Its either a man or woman, the author chose a woman, a woman cannot be flawed?
sub'd..looking forward to your future reviews and i like supporting new channels that deserve it with likes and shares (this was a pleasant review and your opinion and words are different than others)..you have a nice asmr voice fyi (not hitting on you but you are beautiful lol)...just being nice :)
Also about the sexism. I thought it was masterfully done and here's why. This guy is in china , they censor there content, they r training now for war n toughening males up, so he played heavily on those tropes gagging so, and wrote this masterclass genius sci fi hit with smack rank in ur face sexism n to not be nuanced but to be blunt with it, is prolly as free as he is to be protesting infact ridiculing sexism by making it such a stupid point in such imagination might be the only message this guy sends to world that he can. Considering if he in china had depicted dominant females commanding males who cares why it's irrelevant there drilling there people the other way, genius is speaking to world , maybe I'm stupid or hope to much for humanity , I bet the man has a strong marriage and family I'm sticking with my thoughts it was to good to be stupid just to dunk on stupidity. Iv never known an imagination so wide yet thin, n what also makes sense is people reacting immediate n quick n flash to what seem so obvious n always attack the y? How u interrogate the y is gonna limit the answers ur gonna allow urself. Since it's already irking n it's brilliant if I'm right n it's man who's being so sexist who's the damn genius, well he wrote the words youz is emotional people r not rational so it takes a minute to clear a head of ones biases n think of being in his shoes , physically, b where he is, can u do that? Been to the mainland of china then. ? I wish common sense was , still necessary to be alive. The loss of it has put every thing everyone reacts to front n center. The least able most reactionary non trained so insta reacting. That's the temp nowadays n the quality of thoughts effects the quality of our lives. I mean no disrespect n voiced my opinion u can agree disagree it's great either way , again just how I always saw it n this topic particularly. If ur gonna fight. Pick battles , when if u see it another way avoid battles , but nobody picks em anymore heads tails pick.a.side fight. That's today nowadays and it's dumbing down people , sincerely ,
I'm glad that I wasn't the only one that really had issues with the sexism that seemed super obvious. Overall it is portrayed as a woman that caused the Crisis era, no women were Wallfacers, and a woman caused 2 of the biggest defeats in human history leading to the destruction of the solar system. There's so much talk about how Luo is basically the stalwart Man's man and even that the psychopath Wade would have held off invasion for a while. All the talk about how horrible it was that men were so feminized just reminded me of the whole "Hard times make hard men that make soft times that make soft men" meme.
I honestly thought this was meant to be a reflection of old attitudes that needed to change in a changing world and somehow really thought that she would actually fall for AA and then it would end with them making a life on some new hidden planet. But, yeah, that didn't happen.
do you even know what sexism means? women cannot be flawed characters only men? a person being flawed can be both men and a woman, there is no sexism involved. sexism means that you put women in boxes and designated roles, as women can only be mothers and stay home cooking, thats sexism. chengxin however is an aurospace engineer, hardly a sexist role. also there are load of men depicted in the book as flawed characters, why don't you accuse the author of being sexist towards men?
The author makes the protagonist weak as hell. He's obviously making a statement on femenisim and how bad it is (with her horrible decision making). Also how men became feminized over time and masculinity was lost. He tucked it well in there
Pretty based
Why is it bad to talk about the flaws of feminism, if that was the case? What are you afraid of?
Love your pronunciation of the chinese names! The series of Rememberance of Earth's Past is out this year, and the animation is AWESOME. Hoping it corrects the books problems with sexism, they are unforgivable and works against the genius of the writing and plotting! It would be so much better without all of that!
Thanke you! I am so excited for the series to come out!
Keeping politics out of book reviews would greatly help your review.
Be succinct.
Don’t get hung up on what you yourself say arr unnecessary details.
Bad review.
your feminism got the better of you. if it was a man who made the bad decision, would that made the book sexists too? you fell for the overtly woke trap, why can't a woman make bad decisions too? it is a human that made the bad decision, not because of it being a woman or a man. there is a 50/50 chance the lead character is either a man or a woman, and the author chose a woman. but if the lead character was a man, you would feel more satisfied if the bad decision was made by a man, thats sexist aswell.
its interesting when women cry sexism when confronted with behavior that is primarily female. netflix is going to be adapting this apparently. since women are the villains, i wonder if this is going to be a woke adaptation that deviates far from the narrative..
Boo hoo
The books are supposed to belong to the science fiction genre. The science of the trilogy is ridiculous. The eight compacted dimensions of a proton cannot be stretched out to form a sophon. A sophon is supposed to be a mini-TARDIS, because it's "bigger on the inside". The Strong Nuclear Force dominates hadrons like a proton. This force is many thousands of times stronger than electro-magnetism (EM). You can make a really big computer, but when you shrink it to the size of a proton, the EM stops working. Also, Liu's abuse of String Theory's higher dimensions shows that he knows enough to be "not even wrong".
The philosophy of the books is appalling. Let's put the Dark Forest right down on Mother Earth. All the hunters have found each other, but we didn't commit mass genocide. We somehow get along, because we are not just a race of beasts.
The first book got a Hugo award, the first given to an Asian author, but not the other two. No tokenism there...
I agree with everything except the Dark Forest part. It's ABSOLUTELY in a civilization's best interest to shoot first if they know, for a fact, they won't get shot back if they do. It's more closely related to MAD than an actual dark forest. But if a first strike assured your survival and had no immediate consequences. Because if there are thousands of societies, even if five of them decide to do the dark forest approach, in the end only five societies will exist in the universe.
@@cortster12 The Dark Forest is also ludicrous. The main idea is that it is a solution to Fermi's Paradox, "Where are the aliens?" Supposedly, all alien races are hiding like the hunters in a forest. But no one can hide an advanced civilization. A planet that uses all of the light from it's star with solar panels would be dark in visible light, but very hot from waste energy. This can be spotted from thousands of light years away. A civilization that has built a Dyson swarm of solar sats around its star would have a red hot spot in space that sheds no visible light. This is also detectable from many thousand light years away. The James Webb may find some evidence of this. We can find a galaxy spanning civilization from millions of light years away. So all of any hunters would be visible in a galaxy that is not dark. Paranoid psychotic regimes that attempted mass genocide would be removed by their own citizens. Even the Romans said, "vivere et vivere".
@@archlittle6067 Well yeah, which is why I don't believe we live in a dark forest, and are actually the first space-fairing species in the galaxy.
But this is reality. In the premise of the book, there are so many civilizations that a dark forest is the only outcome. In real life, they'd all be consumed by a few, or even just one, massive empire that doesn't bother hiding themselves because they, like humanity will know, they are first, and can just do whatever they want. I can't see a dark forest cropping up naturally in our laws of physics. But in the book, the author invented 10 dimensional space, which means they can get away with saying the situation there made a dark forest likely, and as dimensions got further downsized, the mentally remained, until getting to 3D.
So, it's nonsensical in real life because any first civilizations would just get so big they can't be defeated and stop any other species from gaining a foothold, but in the context of the books, with weapons that literally destroy the fabric of the universe, and then they just downgrade themselves, I can see it maybe, by stretching it, make sense.
But yes, I do agree it would be unlikely to happen in real life do a number of factors. But morality is NOT one of those factors.
@@cortster12 I believe that the most likely solution to the Fermi Paradox is quite simple. The smartest members of any advanced civilization eventually discover technology that their most foolish members use to cause their extinction. Hopefully, humanity will prove me wrong on this.
@@archlittle6067 I was thinking about this as well, there would have to be alien Marconis all over the universe inventing radios before the true "Dark Forest" nature of things was discerned. Even if you were able to ultimately shut down all evidence of your civilization, go far enough away and those early indications of civilization would be spreading outward at the speed of light.
Cheng Xin, the only protagonist I hoped never existed, she screws humanity in so many ways...
About the feminised man, probably that's attached with the decision of cheng xin for swordholder, war and violence are considered "masculine" for more misoginistic societies
When such delicate woman say "when the shit really hits the fan" you can bet that the situation is really bad...
Some things about this book do ring some bells to me...
Theres a lot emphasis on the collective, nothing wrong with that, but individuality seems to be despise (or even the opposite by painting grim scenarios where individuality plays a role in mankind) by the author, you can even notice this.
The fact that the protagonist was a woman, isn't the problem, the underlining is actually INDIVIDUALITY.
You think to much about gender, when the protagonist discover that she was pregnant was the moment where her INDIVIDUALITY kinda shifted... It wasn't more just her life, her decision, but a decision about their soon.
Also, YOU NEED to have in mind that this writer is from China, a place where everything is heavily monitored and censored and i won't be surprise if parts of this book was changed and parts cut off.
The trysalarians are literally a representation of americans by the eyes of the chinese.
there is no sexism kind of thing, especially in modern China. we dont judge people sex , but thuth to be told, man and women are good at differerent thing. girls could do a excellent job at collecting,comparing, but just can't make a good decision,especially in a crisis,in a limited short time. its not about which gender is batter in all case, it's just natural difference.
not gonna lie some parts gave incel vibes
that was the point. Luo Ji was an incel, duhhh
I laugh at the notion this series deals in "hard science fiction". Everything in it like a collapsing ten dimensional universe, sophon computers, etc actually contradicts actual physics or extrapolates hypotheses like String Theory to the point of fantasy.
The main character Cheng Xin, is as infuriating a character as I've ever seen in any science fiction novel. She's wrong about everything: Wrong about becoming a Swordholder, wrong about the development of light speed drive, wrong about the interpretation of Yian Tianming's fairy tales, wrong in her assessment of the threat posed by Sophon and the Tri-Solarans, wrong to fraternize with them in the first place, and finally wrong to leave her enclave in the miniverse so as to ride out the big crunch to possibly be a part of the next cycle. (And cyclic cosmology is also another piece of bad science for a tome that lays claim to hard Science fiction, btw).
So, I, for one was really not a fan of this book. Tries to do too much and does it quite badly, I think.
And the Dark Forest premise of the entire series gives me pause and makes me wonder if it doesn't spring from some core geo-political belief system in Chinese society. If it does, the world might be in for a rough ride in the next few decades if Xi and his military decide to go all Tri-Solaran on the rest of the world to expand their sphere of control. If China does decide to flex, watch out.
I thought the same
So you only read books about characters who does everything right? 🤔
@@BingDwenDwen No, but I don't read books about characters who do everything wrong either.
It is great that the author shows an incompetent woman, since feminism has forced all women in art to be represented as saints, infallible, perfect and incapable of making mistakes. This has made western movies novels predictable, boring and of poor quality.
Well. The idea wasn’t that. Pressing the button is not a good idea either. Lou Ji would have pressed the button and killed all the trisolarians. Both actions are murdering lives. Author is showing men and women will approach this in different perspectives
You know what the problem with the sexism in the book really is about? You... and your non stop trying to analyze things through this social justice style lense. You constantly say you're confused as to why things things are brought up and it's not that confusing at all. That's how people act, those are the things people think and go through. Not everyone wants to write the perfect character who makes all the right choices for the right reasons. Who would want to read that.
i wasnt offended by anything in this book... but i laughed many times at how sexist the book was. Sexism is a spectrum of course so when i say its clearly sexist im not saying its a horrible book using tropes and our daughters shouldnt read it.... but it is still funny. Luo Ji, man, does everything right. Clear cut manly man. Cheng Xin, woman, does everything wrong. Thats just funny. To be fair tho, it is like saying the story of Adam and Eve is sexist (which i think it is).
@@tookie36 Even if it was sexist, why cant a book have characters who are bound by sexism, its ficitonal characters, and in our real world we have sexism too, is that not current?
The trilogy brought up interesting concepts, but was mediocre at best. 6/10.
Makes sense a woman would make a bad decision where logic is needed.
They filter their decisions through their emotions.