Detailed Meditation Instructions
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
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I am neither a Buddhist nor a zen practitioner but I really enjoy this channel because you are unpretentious and I find your topics always interesting and thought provoking.
why arent u a buddhist? Dont you agre with the four seals? Or with the three at least?
@@fofufa I don’t agree with the third seal (anatta). Without resorting to massive mental gymnastics or pure faith it is nihilistic and impossible to explain why this is liberating
@@MrBalthazar78 so... do you believe in an immortal soul?
@@fofufa Atman / Brahman. Consciousness is not compounded. It is fundamental.
@@MrBalthazar78 why would say that? Consciousness depends on a subject and an object.
This was probably the best zazen instruction I have heard from Brad. Just figure it out for yourself 😊
@@xlmoriarty8921
Or just lazy teaching 😂
And 21 mins for it.
Nisargadata may have summed it up best in simply saying to “leave the mind alone”.
In saying it this way, he is making it absolutely clear that you are not the mind and the mind is like an apparition that you need to just not get caught up in at all.
Our fundamental identity is consciousness. Which is brain and nervous system activity. So "we" actually are an aspect of mind.
@@wthomas5697 Nisargadatta also differentiates between consciousness and *awareness*. I think both he & most Zen teachers would say there's no fixed identity. And that's important, because belief in a fixed identity is the cause of many of our problems.
@@hoogreg Our basic identity is consciousness. What the hindus refer to as brahman. It's not a belief, you can observe this for yourself. Absent consciousness, as far as we're concerned, we don't exist. When we're considering what we are, we're identifying. It's what our brains do. Awareness would be the act of being conscious of some thing.
@@wthomas5697
Our brain is just an instrument of consciousness. Not a creator of consciousness. This long held belief of consciousness came from a measly brain is what causes chaos in the world first place.
@@k14michael Wrong. Anesthesiologists can turn consciousness on and off at will. They do it by targeting the area of the brain that generates consciousness.
It's always amusing to hear people make the claim you are making. I'm guessing you're someone who wants to believe your consciousness flies off into the atmosphere and hangs around waiting for another body to inhabit upon the death of the brain. No...? If so, you might want to ask yourself why you want to believe such nonsense.
For me personally, when I started reading about Dogen's shikan taza, it really made everything that I always felt was kinda "lacking" from meditation click and fall into place. I was always trying to "get into" 4th jhana, and was always comparing my current state with my expectations, and that inevitably caused a loop: "NOW Im finally not thinking, I must be on 4th Jhana... oh damn I just thought that, so Im not!" That and the whole deal about the "breath nimitta" always threw me off... Shikan taza and the Mahayana attitude of No-gain just cuts right though that particular confusion, and it felt like a breath of fresh air when I finally "got it". Also, Uchyiama's coined phrase "opening the hand of thought" made it even clearer
Weirdly, meditation instructions make us more square than liquid, more rigid than free...
Thank Brad for the clarification about DIY Zen
I agree, ultimately you have to figure it out on your own.
But for those who want clear instructions, I find the following most instructive:
Open the hand of thought
Let go of thought
Just sit without expectation
Sit with beginners mind
Pick one that resonates
Thanks, Brad. Frustrating, but true. It made me think of a parting remark my zen teacher once told me as I was leaving dokusan feeling extremely lost: "I hope this has been of no help." Which of course helped, though I didn't realize it until later. Another time a teacher told us that basically you can't have somebody else's enlightenment. I remember thinking that I would take whosever damn enlightenment I could get, second-hand or otherwise.
"The witness is the last refuge of the ego." Ken Wilber
Ken Wilber is one of those guys who get in the habit of overexplaining everything and missing the mark while doing so. Still he has some valuable insights though
I agreed with you. But we have to use the language of the ego to point away from the ego. If you know a better language then let me know.
The best language is just silence but most of the time that is not ideal.
Words are just pointers. Don’t get stuck on the words but look to see where they’re pointing to.
"To speak is to lie, but to remain silent is to be a coward"
it servers you to honour that you bring this letter up
I find that the absence of thought, (withdrawal), accumulates the energy that is typically spent processing and reacting. An abundance of energy can be "rapturous", to say the least.
I prefer the minimal, "figure it out for yourself", involvement. I raised my kids that way, and they are doing well. If necessary, ask a question, but pay close attention to the answer. Most answers I received from competent teachers was, "Zazen. More zazen." Why? It's the only way to learn how to deal with all of the mental detritus we create consciously and subconsciously (dreams, etc.). So, zazen! Viva Ziggy!
The Chinese Zen (Chan) does give you detailed instructions, although it acknowledges you need to get less dependent on them with time.
Thanks Brad very much , as always
I found that vipassana added more thoughts to the thinking. Also, Buddha never never said that the Satipatthana was gospel. It was simply his observation. “Be a light unto your selves”, he said. Zen is, as Brad always says, “centuries of research and development.”
Vipassana is goal oriented. You only end up grasping at duality.
You are going to hurt yourself, and possibly others, if you lift the heavy weight without proper posture. How else are you going to walk upright in the world.
There are different paths for different abilities. You would not allow someone (without any instructions) to try to lift a 300 lbs weight. Vipassana is more structured at first, but later on after you learn to calm your own mind a bit then you can switch to Zen. But taking a person right off the street and tell them to sit still for 20 minutes without moving is just plain torture. There are studies where people actually choose to give themselves small electric shock than having to sit still and do nothing other than to watch their own mind. 😂
Thank you so much for your reply. It’s wonderful to share the dharma. I am currently writing a reply to your comment. I’ll be back shortly…
@@k14michael I agree with you 100%! There are different paths for different abilities. I also agree that structure, form, discipline, and posture are paramount to practicing Buddhadharma. And yes, only an imbecile would try to lift 300 lbs right off the jump. You have to learn proper posture before you can lift anything.
The brilliance of the Buddha’s teaching is that he asks us to follow the Path of the Middle Way. The Middle Way beyond delusion, beyond duality.
He encourages us to live our lives with complete selflessness.
To do this, however, we are urged to drop all attachments - that is, all mistaken views.
I began my Buddhist practice with vipassana. And I am forever grateful for it. The problem, however, was all the mental noting, all the doing, all the efforting. It felt as though I was moving all the trash from one part of the room to the other. I wasn’t letting go of anything, I was just doing more doing. More thinking about thinking. And at the very least, was asked to bring attention back to the breath. It seemed to encourage subject and object dichotomies.
In terms of vipassana being more structured, I don’t think it’s more structured than zazen, I think it has more suggestions on things to do during meditation than zazen does, but that’s not structure. Vipassana and zazen share the same structure, the meditation posture.
Zazen is asking you to sit in the meditation posture. Vipassana is asking you to sit in the meditation posture. The subtle simplicity of zazen is that it urges you to stop right there! At the posture. Let go of everything else. Everything else is extra. Everything else is mental. Try to stop being “you” for a change. Get out of your own way and allow Buddhadharma to fill you.
The structure of meditation is the sitting posture. Zazen. Seated meditation.
I don’t separate my vipassana practice from my current zazen practice. Every step I have taken has led here.
Also, It seems apparent to me…
(and I am not saying this with any form of ill-will)
… that there is an entire tradition of Buddhist teachers that are asking those who endeavor on the Way too do exactly what it is you call “plain torture.” That is, “to sit still… without moving.”
The tradition remains because countless generations continued this practice.
Know that the Buddhas and Ancestors are not saying “don’t move”, we have to adjust our posture, they are simply urging us to drop all outward activity, all movements of body-and-mind, and simply sit in the meditation posture. Allow zazen to be zazen. Allow the dharma to be the dharma. To sit and practice getting out of your own way allows you to get out of your own way when it matters!
When the Buddha resigned himself to just sitting his attachments fell away and he became awakened.
How could it be any other way? What else is there to add?
There are those that would rather be shocked, this is true, but that speaks to your opening bit about different paths for different abilities.
The Buddha Way is not difficult. Simply avoid picking and choosing. This is “just sitting” shikantaza!
Shoaku Makusa
@@G.Mondragon
Well said, thank you for your deep insight and taken the time to explained it to me.
@@k14michael Nah, thank you! I appreciate you helping me to clarify things.
Drawing more parallels between human (kid) and dog psychology...sounds like Ziggy has found a sure fire way to get you to consistently fuss over him every night...just a theory!
Great video. I like both the "hands-on" detailed instruction and the "hands-off", no-instruction approach depending on where I'm at in life. I like Shinzen Young's stuff, he has a super systematic approach to vipassana but then also has a technique called "Do Nothing", where the only instruction is "If you notice the intention to control your intention...drop that intention". And that's it. Michael Taft talks about simply "Dropping the ball" which is cool too. I don't know if either is really anything like Zazen but it's something I've found useful maybe a nice middle ground for anyone frustrated with the two ends of the "instruction-spectrum"
Peace 👽✌️
When you’re realized that there’s no need to realize anything then that’s the time to do nothing. But if you haven’t realized that then it’s fine to struggle, it all lead to the end eventually. 😊
There's a guitar that you didn't buy?
Pshh,
Once, when I was in the forest, sitting in meditation under a tree, Vimalakīrti approached me and said,
‘Śāriputra, you do not have to sit to meditate. What is meditation? Meditation is not to manifest body or mind in any of the three realms. Meditation is to remain in the samādhi of cessation of sense perception and cognition while engaging in the activities of everyday life. Meditation is to live the life of an ordinary person without abandoning the practice of the Path. Meditation is when the mind neither settles within nor without. Meditation is to remain unmoved by views while cultivating the thirty-seven factors of awakening. Meditation is to enter nirvāṇa without severing the afflictions. Whoever can meditate like this will receive the Buddhas’ seal of approval.’
The Vimalakirti Sutra: A Bilingual Volume with Cross References between English and Chinese - Translated from the Chinese of Master Kumarajiva (p. 44). Buddhist Text Translation Society. Kindle Edition.
Putting beginning instruction in a RUclips comment is literally insane 🤦🏽😂 Super happy for him that he has it figured out, though.
Superhost yes! In recent years I attended a wedding and there 2 tables over was Lil’ John!
I am not worthy!!!
* I would never have been able to begin Zazen practice if the strictest adherence to a full-lotus position were compulsory.
You might work your way to it, and that's great but sitting cross legged on a zafu is fine.
That is an interesting quirk Ziggy has. Maybe he wants to guard the doors from all the cats. Maybe its dark when you go up at night. Maybe he's just tired and likes to be spoiled.
How many people actually achieve the following?:
"Stop the driving movement of mind, will, consciousness.
Cease intellectual consideration through images, thoughts, and reflections.
"
- Nishijima's translation of the Fukanzazengi
(It doesn't say let your thoughts come & go.)
They do it by letting thoughts come and go.
@@HardcoreZen Your answer reminds me of this answer given in the Diamond Sutra:
"If a disciple were to speak as follows, 'I have to create a
serene and beautiful Buddha field’, that person is not yet truly
a disciple. Why? What the Buddha calls a ‘serene and beautiful
Buddha field’ is not in fact a serene and beautiful Buddha field.
And that is why it is called a serene and beautiful Buddha field.
Subhuti, only a disciple who is wholly devoid of any
conception of separate selfhood is worthy of being called a
disciple."
But I'm afraid the last sentence is also true.
- Translation of the Diamond Sutra above is by Alex Johnson
Thank you for your answer. I’ve not pursued the jhanas, and I’ve not experienced them. I suspect that Chan meditation practices such as silent-illumination or zazen actually skirt them, attempting to ‘enter the state of Chan’ more directly: “Sudden awakening,” as it has been called since the time of Huineng, the Sixth Patriarch of Chan Buddhism.
Here is a quote from one of my favorite authors: Master Sheng Yen (2001) “Hoofprint of the Ox”, from its chapter on silent-illumination:
“Question: What is the difference between Mahayana and Hinayana samadhis, and how might this difference relate to silent illumination?
Answer: The principal difference between the two kinds of samadhi is that time, space, the external environment, and mental activities disappear in the deeper Hinayana samadhis, whereas in true Mahayana samadhi, all of these-except defiled mental activities-remain. For example, a person experiencing deep Mahayana samadhi could converse or discourse lucidly. Because the mind is eternally still, one would respond without any mentation at all. The Hinayana meditator, however, would experience mental activity and affliction whenever he or she departed from samadhi. …”
He means, you're not directly engaging in the thought stream. Hence, let them come and go (visualize Shunryu Suzuki's swingin door metaphor). One thing about Zazen which becomes clear --crystal fucking clear--is nothing is that crystal fucking clear or solvable (like a Rubrik's cube). There's no QED in zazen. And if you're a completist type personality, this will drive you crazy or you'll stop practicing and look for some other shiny new object to play with.
@@CharlesLamb-bw1hq Good explanation.
But I still question if the approach of letting thoughts come and go really leads to: no-thought, mu-shin (no mind) or no-self?
Look up: "Shohaku Okumura on Buddha's awakening & Dogen's zazen: Enlightenment Day (2023)" at 42:28. He says that thoughts keep arising: "when we let go of thought. It is there, but in the next moment we again start to think and our mind separates into subject and object. So we have to keep practicing this endlessly." And by the 'It that is there" he means: "we let go of this permanent self, then things are just happening."
Dainin Katagiri Roshi says in "Each Moment is the Universe"
"When the moment [of thinking] begins, all sentient beings temporarily appear as particular beings in the stream of time and seem to have their own separate existences.
When the moment [of thinking] ceases, all sentient beings disappear, but they do not go away; they are interconnected smoothly and quietly in timelessness. …“
I've come to the conclusion (which might be wrong) that they are both talking about the same effect: A continuous shift back and forth between thinking & non-thinking.
I have been to a water park, but I have had fear of doing a water slide. I didn't have the courage to do it. How could I handle this irrational fear and irrational fears in general?
Love zen but can we get a ziggy talk?
Just follow your breath. It keep the mind from thinking and calms it.
Whenever I sit, my leg falls asleep and the pins and needles are quite painful afterwards. I can just barely manage the half-lotus position, and I haven't been flexible enough to sit in full-lotus since I was a teenager. Please discuss the right technique for half lotus/full lotus sitting.
@@mttpgn Actually these days I sit in Burmese posture. I used to sit Full Lotus but I started having knee trouble. It’s not necessary to sit in full or half lotus. My teacher said that Burmese posture is a variation of half lotus.
dogs hate to go downstairs and its not healthy for their bones. it hurts
Looked everywhere and never found any instructions. Kinda gave up on it 🤷♂️
Ah so that’s what dokusan is for. Thank you 😅
Nishijima Roshi describes how to practice zazen:
ruclips.net/video/nsFlrdXVFgo/видео.html
Thanks! I saw this many years ago. Simple, & straight to the point.
Thank you for clarifying the difference between zazen and Vipassana. I wonder if another reason why little guidance is given on states of mind is that detailed instructions would be predicated on the assumption that each person's mind works in the same way.
No persons have the same mind even if you’re twins. Since your perceptions of life experience cannot be the same. But there are some basic teachings that are universal that can help you as a beginner.
I don’t think to tell a beginner to “just sit straight and figure out how your mind works” is a good teaching tools for beginners.😂
One small correction: Rob Lowe isn't famous.
He used to be. Didn't he?
Dogen clear details instruction on what to do with the mind in your citation -- although you did not cite such.
Such is pointed out in the Platform Sutra as well; the instruction is often over looked and rarely practiced therein lost in antiquity.
Because this practice is not recognized in American Zen; American Zen has become nothing other than imported Bonsai Zen.
Alas, I wonder what such a practice is ....
Why is Dogen the benchmark of zazen instruction? So you do it how it is handy for your brain not to freak out.
Speaking of novelty songs, remember Ray Stevens classic from 1974, The Streak? I do.
I should do that one!
comment
Zen mind advice: just buy Prince's cloud guitar... duh!
Wake up and smell the stink of Zen!
The sense of being a witness is buddha nature? Bollocks - surely its just another self experience projected by the brain.
I do not want to always get into arguments in the comments sections or write long novels but that is important so I'll chime in again about the jhanas. For anyone who has explored them even slightly, it is clear you do not grok jhanas. First off, jhana and zen are not the same thing. The etymology is correct but I suspect that this only suggests that back in the day it might have been a given that students were having at least some basic competence in the jhanas. In my view, in the unfolding of the mental factors associated with the 4th jhana is where zazen begins in earnest and that is where the word zen came from. Around the 4th jhana, the mind begins to open up by itself for effortless, panoramic choiceless awareness and you see clearly the hilarity of the situation and that the idea of doing something is absurd at this point. Also in my view, this is where gyoji begins for real because whatever you do is ceaseless practice. Washing dishes or taking a shit, it does not matter. Otherwise, it is just a talk. The mind begins to be stable as a rock and glued to the present by itself and there is nothing you can do or not do. If the jhanic factors associated with the 4th jhana are not developed very well, the mind will always wobble. I may be wrong but it seem to me many Zen students confuse this wobbly mind with the idea of impermanence (of the monkey mind) and that states are just random occurrences that come and go instead of seeing clearly the predictable sequence they unfold when the practice begins to deepen.
Secondly, you keep on recycling the same argument about the jhanas but that does not make it true or real and that is just utter intellectual BS, pardon my French. Why would it be any different than zen training? Go to a competent teacher, study the jhanas or the corresponding nanas with him/her, and figure them out from experience instead of confusing people with strange ideas.
Finally, my opinion about the lack of clear instructions in Zen begins to settle more and more and it seems to me that this is truly devastating for the quality of the practice for the majority of the people who learn to chant in Sino-Japanese instead of recognizing what is access concentration and getting it on demand. To be more specific, I consider that many Zen students I am aware of struggle with the 8th pillar of the path - Right Concentration. If one begins to master this step, there will be no confusion about what are the jhanic factors, how to recognize them and not consider them just some sci-fi descriptions of olden dudes who wanted to fuck around because there was nothing better to do. I may sound confrontational but I really just try to make a strong point that seems important to me. Peace
The dhyanas are just mundane states of mind that can be induced by meditation. And while the clarity of mind of the dhyanas may be useful for contemplation, vipassana they are by no means necessary for insight and in my experience are probably more of a distraction.
If you look into the long history of Chan (Zen in China) you see virtually no mention of the practice of the jhanas. Of course you see them in the translated Indian Sutras, but not in the Chan tradition. I suspect this is because of the prior Taoist influence.
But if you can find the practice of the jhanas in Chan, please post a reference to it?
@@SaxonShore Basically, it sounds like you don’t know how to do it.
Ah, I see! You're trying to achieve something! Good luck with that.
don't go confusing people with strange ideas you say? 🙄 sorry man but i've read your comment about 6 times and can't make heads or tails of what concept(s) you're trying to communicate here.