I agree with the statement that its not fun when upgrades are pushed out of the game. I prefer running cool stuff too but rebel heavies and personnel are way overcosted lol
@nickknackety for sure. I hate that push is almost unplayable. Rebel heavies are still way too high for sure, but hopefully luke made your lists cheaper 😂
I think the change that Graeme suggested is valid to the Commander armor. My first games with Clone Commandos, not understanding the mechanics of it yet, that was how I played them and it makes it feel more decisive as you have more weight on that decision versus a get out of jail free card
I keep listening you all and I feel like you just speak my mind :) Just like this is all I agree with and I think about but I have no idea how to say it. This video is top and is very very close to what I feel> Very good job! Love you all! But please keep playing this game, so I can continue to listen to you all!
@kokozula for sure. You have to adapt, but we need amg to understand if they ignore the competitive players, they will lose the game. We may be small, but competitive players buy everything they can to build good lists while those casually playing only buy the smaller stuff they like. Plus ppl look to the competitive players for what works best. If amg loses them, this game will only go downhill into a boring, bland game
I really agree that this game and Star Wars in general is about heroes and names characters, not about flooding the table with 30 shoretroopers. And if you play against multiple big squads of b1's, they can literally body block you from reaching a POI since they are 14 minis and cohere AT range 1.
Yes, "never take naked core" is a true statement with which I lived with too, but now half the missions you just need to have a unit defending it, so why not a naked unit? I ended up scoring some POI with a full infantry unit plus medic plus dp-23 which never fired a shot. That was the moment I started taking naked core :)
@kokozula i guess it depends on how you're deploying and using your units. I know some naked units can be useful, but with the dice sizes, if one of those units gets exposed by a bigger unit, you're screwed. For example, even with mando saves, they still fall so quickly. I can only imagine a naked red save unit
@shadowscout0013 true, it may depend to the environment in which you play. At Worlds, those units are not safe, but in my experience with casual play, I score almost each game with a naked core.
I think Kylar had a good point about list spam. I wouldn't want the game to stop someone from building a list they want to build but spamming should be a fringe fun list and not in any way competitive or viable. And the game rules should guide you in this direction, and if it doesn't it is a nuts and bolts issue.
@@jogurt3726 I think they would be fine if there was a chess clock. Bc then that in itself would discourage it at the competitive level unless they're quick enough to play it. Maybe that could be a way to compromise
You guys are definitely being overly dramatic near the start with trying to say the republic can barely make 10 acts. Anakin quad arc quad strike can hit 11 acts pretty comfortably or 10 with some more beef to each unit. It's good that stuff needed to be trimmed from your lists. Republic is the faction that does most everything the best but you're supposed to be smaller in numbers. Absolute baloney that they were able to go act for act against the rest of the factions or even out act them without having to sacrifice quality on your units. Gotta put the salt aside and look at it objectively. If you guys are gonna complain, then complain about how competitive republic lists have been pigeon holed into either 501st or maybe Ani, Rex, and Bad Batch.
@shawnx17 youre not wrong. I think looking at how the points adjustments will affect gar in the next 6 months will give us a great view into how well the points adjustments were. It does give other gar lists a chance to break out though, so I am excited about that. And you gotta give credit to Graeme for being the most level headed the whole time
I agree we were fairly salty at the start, but I think the bigger issue that we were frustrated with in regards to GAR activations (and didn’t articulate as well) is that with the current gameplay and primaries focus being King of The Hill type gameplay, having less activations gives you a disadvantage like Kylar had mentioned when everything scores the same. GAR is a stronger army as a whole and needs to be balanced as such, but consistently being out acted by 2+ units outside of the 501st which everyone has a bad taste in their mouth about is a hard pill to swallow. IMO that’s one of the reasons why 501st sees so much play and could potentially be a rework for them to look at as far as raising the corps requirements
Nah you're wrong. GAR isnt nearly as elite anymore with cover changes. Even red saves die super fast and get chipped away super easy. Old Legion I can agree that having 8 Acts vs 10 was fine because all the GAR stuff had staying power. But the new rules its all about how many unit leaders are on the board now. So its not "overly dramatic" to say that when you make lists that are already thin even thinner, then you are basically making it impossible to hold POI vs the factions who bring 5 or more activations than you.
@Areys87 im not sure if he was just mentioning 501st, but hopefully gar isn't has handicapped as amg has tried make it. Maybe we'll see other gar lists start to stand out with higher acts. Hopefully the arf troopers start to turn things around
@@Areys87 You're also overreacting if you think GAR going down on average 1-2 acts suddenly means they can't play objectives anymore. I also think you just straight up don't know what you're saying if you're trying to claim red (often surging thanks to token sharing) go fast. Go play a white save army in the new edition against a gar meta list and then come back and tell me what you think has trouble remaining on the board. GAR is gonna be just fine like it always is nowadays. You got a steady amount of new units coming and we're supposedly getting more objectives, side objs, and advantages at some point. We're all looking at what is an incomplete picture thanks to AMGs decision to release 2.6 half baked. That's something I feel like everybody fails to keep in mind and I think it's one of the bigger reasons why we saw more people leaving the game rather than gar having a few needed points increases.
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Also, my list only went up 8pts 😅
@@paladinsas9078 you and your fancy list ideas 🤣
you knew something would happen, didn't you? :)) And you choose not to be dissapointed :))
@@kokozulaI've gotten pretty good at reading the tea leaves. Better to plan ahead and get a leg up
I agree with the statement that its not fun when upgrades are pushed out of the game. I prefer running cool stuff too but rebel heavies and personnel are way overcosted lol
@nickknackety for sure. I hate that push is almost unplayable. Rebel heavies are still way too high for sure, but hopefully luke made your lists cheaper 😂
@shadowscout0013 lol it helped a little for sure lol 😆
I think the change that Graeme suggested is valid to the Commander armor. My first games with Clone Commandos, not understanding the mechanics of it yet, that was how I played them and it makes it feel more decisive as you have more weight on that decision versus a get out of jail free card
@grants565 i like the get out of jail free tho. I also wish regular mandos had that kind of armor too 😂
I keep listening you all and I feel like you just speak my mind :) Just like this is all I agree with and I think about but I have no idea how to say it. This video is top and is very very close to what I feel> Very good job! Love you all! But please keep playing this game, so I can continue to listen to you all!
@kokozula for sure. You have to adapt, but we need amg to understand if they ignore the competitive players, they will lose the game. We may be small, but competitive players buy everything they can to build good lists while those casually playing only buy the smaller stuff they like. Plus ppl look to the competitive players for what works best. If amg loses them, this game will only go downhill into a boring, bland game
@@shadowscout0013 again, completely agree.
I really agree that this game and Star Wars in general is about heroes and names characters, not about flooding the table with 30 shoretroopers. And if you play against multiple big squads of b1's, they can literally body block you from reaching a POI since they are 14 minis and cohere AT range 1.
@@kokozula that's a giant brain move 😂
Yes, "never take naked core" is a true statement with which I lived with too, but now half the missions you just need to have a unit defending it, so why not a naked unit? I ended up scoring some POI with a full infantry unit plus medic plus dp-23 which never fired a shot. That was the moment I started taking naked core :)
@kokozula i guess it depends on how you're deploying and using your units. I know some naked units can be useful, but with the dice sizes, if one of those units gets exposed by a bigger unit, you're screwed. For example, even with mando saves, they still fall so quickly. I can only imagine a naked red save unit
@shadowscout0013 true, it may depend to the environment in which you play. At Worlds, those units are not safe, but in my experience with casual play, I score almost each game with a naked core.
@kokozula it will also really depend on skill level too of your opponents
I think Kylar had a good point about list spam. I wouldn't want the game to stop someone from building a list they want to build but spamming should be a fringe fun list and not in any way competitive or viable. And the game rules should guide you in this direction, and if it doesn't it is a nuts and bolts issue.
@@jogurt3726 I think they would be fine if there was a chess clock. Bc then that in itself would discourage it at the competitive level unless they're quick enough to play it. Maybe that could be a way to compromise
You guys are definitely being overly dramatic near the start with trying to say the republic can barely make 10 acts. Anakin quad arc quad strike can hit 11 acts pretty comfortably or 10 with some more beef to each unit. It's good that stuff needed to be trimmed from your lists. Republic is the faction that does most everything the best but you're supposed to be smaller in numbers. Absolute baloney that they were able to go act for act against the rest of the factions or even out act them without having to sacrifice quality on your units. Gotta put the salt aside and look at it objectively. If you guys are gonna complain, then complain about how competitive republic lists have been pigeon holed into either 501st or maybe Ani, Rex, and Bad Batch.
@shawnx17 youre not wrong. I think looking at how the points adjustments will affect gar in the next 6 months will give us a great view into how well the points adjustments were. It does give other gar lists a chance to break out though, so I am excited about that. And you gotta give credit to Graeme for being the most level headed the whole time
I agree we were fairly salty at the start, but I think the bigger issue that we were frustrated with in regards to GAR activations (and didn’t articulate as well) is that with the current gameplay and primaries focus being King of The Hill type gameplay, having less activations gives you a disadvantage like Kylar had mentioned when everything scores the same. GAR is a stronger army as a whole and needs to be balanced as such, but consistently being out acted by 2+ units outside of the 501st which everyone has a bad taste in their mouth about is a hard pill to swallow. IMO that’s one of the reasons why 501st sees so much play and could potentially be a rework for them to look at as far as raising the corps requirements
Nah you're wrong. GAR isnt nearly as elite anymore with cover changes. Even red saves die super fast and get chipped away super easy. Old Legion I can agree that having 8 Acts vs 10 was fine because all the GAR stuff had staying power. But the new rules its all about how many unit leaders are on the board now. So its not "overly dramatic" to say that when you make lists that are already thin even thinner, then you are basically making it impossible to hold POI vs the factions who bring 5 or more activations than you.
@Areys87 im not sure if he was just mentioning 501st, but hopefully gar isn't has handicapped as amg has tried make it. Maybe we'll see other gar lists start to stand out with higher acts. Hopefully the arf troopers start to turn things around
@@Areys87 You're also overreacting if you think GAR going down on average 1-2 acts suddenly means they can't play objectives anymore. I also think you just straight up don't know what you're saying if you're trying to claim red (often surging thanks to token sharing) go fast. Go play a white save army in the new edition against a gar meta list and then come back and tell me what you think has trouble remaining on the board. GAR is gonna be just fine like it always is nowadays. You got a steady amount of new units coming and we're supposedly getting more objectives, side objs, and advantages at some point. We're all looking at what is an incomplete picture thanks to AMGs decision to release 2.6 half baked. That's something I feel like everybody fails to keep in mind and I think it's one of the bigger reasons why we saw more people leaving the game rather than gar having a few needed points increases.