Carbon Fiber vs Titanium Guitar Neck Reinforcement
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- Опубликовано: 14 окт 2024
- Let's compare carbon fiber and titanium as a way to reinforce a guitar neck.
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Steve from Maximum Guitar Works did a pretty in-depth video talking about the differences and he agreed with you on carbon fiber. It's a stiffening rod, so best to use the material that does the best stiffening at the best price I think. Everyone knows unicorn bones sound the best but who can afford those?
My opinion is that sustain is one of those weird things we focus on for no reason. Whether a guitar sustains a note loud enough to hear for 15s or 20s, what difference does it make? If you want a note to ring out at a constant volume for several seconds, thats what compression/sustainer pedals are for. Or a loud amp and feedback. Or a sustainiac/ebow. Verifiable, consistent options.
@@pigjubby1 Agreed. Funny thing, even for that one, the way the beatles did that was by pushing up the faders on the board as the sound died out.
Too much sustain can be a pain in certain situations.
That was very interesting about the use of carbon fibre stiffing rods. My last telecaster build, I put two carbon rods in the neck, but I haven't put any strings on it just yet, so hopefully, these two rods will work well. Thanks for your videos too.
@@robinjones6692 any update on this neck?
Hi there. You may not be directly answering my question, which you answered to my satisfaction a few days ago. Regardless, thank you. This is exactly the in-depth analysis I could have hoped for. As for resonance and sustain, there are far too many variables that, collectively, would affect the outcome - wood type, construction (bolt-on vs set neck vs neck-thru), pickups etc. ad infinitum. Even string brand and type, string-thru or top mount, and so on and so on. I use a zero fret on all my builds so control of relief is critical. Probably Titanium is better for me. Anyway, I've been watching you for some time now and have come to rely on you and Texas Toast (your friends I believe) for definitive advice and example. Thanks a lot.
really good video, I agree with you about CF. I've also recently added a CF bar into the back of a guitar headstock because it's a part of the guitar that can bend under string tension too, and it's hidden under a veneer.
Thanks for the great content you're offering
Right on!
I will watch later, I have business to attend to. I may try to watch on my phone if I’m driving home.
Don't watch the video while driving! I want you here for the next episode.
Fascinating ! I would go the three similar guitars experiment and take the results as a guide only. Cheers !
That would be huge waste of time and money.
Nice, the test as you described is virtually impossible, but are there any scientific studies that demonstrate which materials transmits more audio frequencies, and or affects resonance? What about the old Martins that didn't used Truss-rods? The wood was different back then, and didn't shift like today's stock.
As always, great info and insight.
How difficult of a job would it be if someone wanted to completely hot rod their 20 year old Fender P Bass with Carbon Fiber Rods and a new two way truss rod? Is that an impossible job consodering that the luthier would have to take off the fretboard or are there luthiers who have the right technique and experience to do that?
Great video. Thank you for putting these together. Do you have a preference for which glue to use when installing the carbon fiber rods? From other resources I have seen either fish glue, cold hide glue, or epoxy.
Epoxy.
It makes sense as Carbon fiber rods are carbon fibers impregned with epoxy resin. This choice of glue will create a seamless integration. I have a neck reset on a Kay 39 archtop, but want to straiten the neck and reinforce it while I have the neck off and the fretboard lifted. Thank you for helping me formulate my plan.
My Titanium bike with Titanium cranks and fork was tooo flexy and springy. 3 inches of flex side to side.
Switched cranks to aluminum. Forks to carbon. Rides like stiff lightning :)
I had the same experience with a titanium bike. The frame was way too wobbly. I went with all carbon fiber and was blown away by how light and stiff the bike was. That's probably why there are hardly any bikes made from titanium anymore.
Interesting, I’ll try carbon fiber rods for the first time in my 7 string build next week.
Really great topic and subject. I love CF necks like my trusty Steinberger.
I've never used titanium because without knowing the alloy and temper it may not be the right choice. Carbon fiber works nicely in my experience.
Saying that, I generally use hardened steel as it is stiffer than any of the CF stiffening rods I've tried of the same size, and yes the hardened steel weights more.
I do want to find CF of a similar stiffen to the steel I use as I don't have much more of it.
What CF rods are you using?
You wouldn't need to use hardened steel, normal steel should work just as well
My goal is not to eliminate bow. I only want to reduce it. CF is lighter than steel and plenty still for what I need. I get my rods from DragonPlate.
@@HighlineGuitars Thanks. I need to try Dragonplate.
I mainly do bass necks and really prefer really stiff neck for those, especially fretless.
Thanks again.
@@themechanix393 I have some hardened steel available from years back that was 1/4" x 1/8". Not sure of a similar grade as it was one of several experimental runs of tool steel we did at my old job. Super stiff and bends less than mild steel or stainless. Same size as the Warmoth stiffening bars with less flex.
@@sunn_bass The Youngs Modulus/Material Stiffness of different steel alloys doesnt differ noticeably. Thus, Hardened steel is just as stiff as mild steel of a similar dimension.
I use both - carbon fibre rods + titanium truss rod, saving me the worrying about which one is better.
Like the shorter hair Chris.
HIGHLINE, I think EVH used 2 carbon fiber reinforcement rods in his necks and the baking progress was an art & science he said which took many years to get done correctly. You didn't mention or explaining in this video lesson about using 2 carbon fiber rods instead of only using 1 carbon fiber rod and what the advantages are. Try making another video part#2 but I think it has something to do with the baking processes and the strength of materials used of the carbon fiber. EVH guitars kept changing the neck production each year because they were experimenting with the baking processes and strength of materials used and use 2 carbon fiber reinforcement rods.
As I have shown in past videos, I use 2 rods, one on each side of the truss rod. In my next build, I will use 3 carbon fiber rods and no truss rod. I don't make my own carbon fiber rods so I don't know anything about the baking process whatever that is.
@@HighlineGuitars This video you said to remove the truss rod and only use 1 carbon fiber reinforcement rob using NO truss rod?
@@waynegram8907 Where did I say that?
@@HighlineGuitars I thought you said that you're using NO truss Rod and only use 1 carbon fiber or you're using what type of Truss Rod and the Truss Rod material? and only using 1 carbon fiber reinforcement rob on the upper strings part G-B-E or using the carbon fiber reinforcement rob on the lower strings part D-A-E?
@@waynegram8907 I don't know where you heard that, but it wasn't in my video.
I would have thought that Titanium would be less effective.
Given that the polished surface of Titanium would not bond as well to an Epoxy like Carbon Fiber would ??
Per Stewmac's website: "Unlike carbon fiber, titanium requires no epoxy or glue to install. Simply rout the channel and insert the rod."
im doing one wth aluminum and epoxy right now
Ruf guitars uses an engineered urethane(?) compound which is supposed to have similar resonant characteristics to traditional "tone woods" to build their bodies and necks. So it would be possible to use three necks to see if either stiffening rod material had any noticeable effect vs one without. Since all of the necks used would be materially/dimensionally identical, any results would be valid... for their compound at least.
Still, it would be a lot of effort at a very high cost for a minimal outcome.
If the reinforcement is such that it becomes very difficult to even induce relief, and you (as a player) don't want relief, is there an argument to say in that case that the truss rod is unnecessary? I think I've seen somewhere an old guitar without a truss rod being fixed by removing the fretboard, getting the neck straight and inserting carbon fiber, but no truss rod, and putting the face on. Would it be reasonable to build a guitar that way from the start?
Stay tuned for my next project! Hint, hint, wink, wink.
Ive done it, and in perfecr co ditions that works. However if your building for a customer who doesnt climate control the room or takes the guitar on stage or on holiday ( hot car, high_low humidity swings) that wont work. The wood will move and therefore the setup as well and now you cant do anything to correct it except take the fretboard off.
a pergunta simples, é se empena ao tempo, facilmente ou não... com esses reforços, seja quais forem
Can you make a video on how to do the fretting and gluing of a fretboard while ensuring that the neck will not backbow ? I had that problem with a bass neck (wenge purpleheart laminate and ebony fretboard). I need to remove that fretboard and make a new one 😢
This video explains how I do what you are asking for. I think: ruclips.net/video/0MBcJ75zhjM/видео.html&feature=shares&t=595
@@HighlineGuitars thank you 🙏
Good joinery will make the most difference in my opinion.
IMO, it’s all about the pickups.
@@HighlineGuitars Yes, very good point.
Would prestressing the neck help when adjusting with CF reinforcement? Saw Dan E. do a video about doing that on particularly difficult necks.
Yes. But it really shouldn't be necessary. A decent truss rod will bend a neck even with carbon fiber reinforcement.
Have you ever tried to use a carbon fiber rod to correct a twisted neck?
No.
in my opinion mass density will inevitably have an effect on resonance and tone, but thats not to say its a negative effect, or an audible particularly noticeable difference, like you said.
tho i remember seeing some carbon fiber tone rods made by a european company ( i can drop the name if anyone wants it ) that DING when you drop em cos they were naturally resonant, which intrigued me
All of that is nonsense though...
Tone rods 🤦
Counterpoint: It's an electric guitar, not an acoustic. The only thing that affects tone is the interaction between the strings and the pickups, which is affected by how the player frets and and picks the strings. The idea of "tone wood" seems insane in an electric guitar.
Where can I please get and buy these carbon rods, thank you.
Here is a paid Amazon Affiliate link to the rods I use: amzn.to/4aeWZmW
@@HighlineGuitars I am from the Czech Republic, thank you very much.
@@HighlineGuitars Thank You.
Carbon fibre: I am a cyclist and ride a high end carbon fibre frame bicycle. A feature of such a bike is that carbon fibre Absorbs and cancels high frequency vibration and less is absorbed by the human body. And it does !
Why put a carbon fibre, vibration absorbing structure in a guitar ?
Carbon fiber oriented in certain directions is highly resonant. That's why carbon fiber acoustic guitars sound so amazing.
Carbon fibre resin matrix inherently is excellent at generating heat that dissipates the vibration energy. This is totally separate from orientation
Just get an aluminum guitar from Hoxey Guitars.
My channel is for people who want to make their own guitars as a hobby project or as a small business. Most of my viewers can't make a neck out of a block of aluminum. Even though I could make my own aluminum necks, I still prefer wood as it is lighter, easier to machine, better looking, and more serviceable.