ARTURIA ASTROLAB // Reality check after the hype
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- Опубликовано: 9 апр 2024
- The ARTURIA ASTROLAB Avante Garde STAGE KEYBOARD was released yesterday and I made an enthusiastic reaction video about it. But after having had time to research and digest the information I have some concerns and critique that I would like to share to give some balance.
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a few more thoughts after reading your feedback, thank you for all the comments. I will add to the list as we go:
- Analog Lab is currently $200, although it does go on sale from time to time
- Unfair to directly compare price of AL and Astrolab. You need to factor in price of midi controller, PC and audio interface
While true, I suspect most people who purchase Analog Lab, already have their home studio/bedroom set up
Agree, for most people into music production, or in a band they already have a computer, midi controller, and audio interface. The incremental price of obtaining the AstroLab is its retail price minus buying AL, not starting at $0. That is not a realistic apples to apples comparison to buy everything from having nothing.
1 ke with vcollection inside of it would have been perfect and 4 parts :)😊 even if i already have vcoll and arturia keyboard, i think i could have buy this not to have computer anymore
I agree I dont really see the benefits of not using My computer, the keyboard has a Linux computer inside it, so basically replacing My main laptop and midi keyboard with a keyboard computer with a tini screen.
I think only midi controller is a change, everyone needs a pc and audio interface anyway
Yes, do a video on keybeds! Looking forward to it already!
+1000 , since most midi controllers have terrible keybeds, only few have good key-beds but they cost over $1k
Yeah, I'd be all about that.
Me too!
That’s all I’ve been searching for on RUclips. Not enough nearby music shops stocking higher end keys to allow me to play everything myself, and any insight would helpful for when I do run across any candidates.
This is one of the main reasons you're one of my favorite synthfluencers. You're honest. Also, +1 for they keybed analysis video. God bless you and yours Woody!
Let’s name and shame all of the inferior key beds… This is long overdue & and Woody we all support you on this mission!
i really would like that!
They say that the PPG Wave got its name when they looked at the keybed after a session of intensive playing. On the other hand, their PRK FD keyboard controller featured an original --Steinberg-- (Steinway & sons, of course!) keybed with original wooden keys and adjusted hammer action, which was great.
Regarding keybeds: the problem you encountered with the old keylab essential is a typical one for the older models. These use Huaxin keybeds that copied the old Fatar mechanics but instead of having the bushings sit on a cut-out and bent part of the metal frame, they use a inserted piece of cheap plastic for that, and it breaks easily, that is exactly what happened to you in your video snippet. I can tell you that this was one of the reasons for Arturia to change their manufacturer to MIDIPlus, and you can feel the difference if you compare the MKII versions of the Minibrute to the first one (just as an example). MIDIPlus built the first M-Audio Oxygen keyboards (silver ones, MKI/MKII). DSI/Sequential also used these Huaxin keybeds in P08, P12, Pro2, Mopho X4 before they switched to Fatar for their entire line. These Huaxins use plastics that are not reistant to UV light and get yellow very fast when constantly exposed to sunlight, BTW. They look very much like Fatar built-in, but they have sharp edges and the weights are blank metal glued-in whereas Fatar has them encapsulated. Your Korg PA-5x uses a Fatar TP/8SK keybed, which is deeper than the standard versions and so the hinges dont sit at the upper end, but a bit behind, so you can press the black keys at its edge comfortably. The mechanics are the same as the TP/8O versions used in Nord Electro 5D/6D with 61 keys and Nord Wave, only the keys are different at the front (waterfall instead of synth type).
Regarding the side panels of the Astrolab I hope this is not Bakelite - one of the oldest "plastics" ever, mainly used in electrical installations like sockets, light switches and switchboards. This is not elastic and does break very fast. Some of these bakelite switches and sockets are still there in basements of older buildings and are hazardous pieces.
BTW: If you ever do a video on keybeds and need some background and detailed information I would be glad to help.
I was so glad when Sequential switched over to Fatar actions. Think of how much better an experience it would have been if the Prophet 12 had a keybed like the Rev 2. Arturia makes great synthesizers and they deserve to have a better playing keybed. Even the current ones they use in the Matrix and PolyBrute feel flimsy and bottom out in an unsatisfying way compared to the Fatar in my Rev 2. That said, their aftertouch response IS decent.
@@peterkadarmusic9728 Sequential/DSI used Fatar before, like in the Mono Evolver KB, Poly Evolver KB and Mopho KB
@@microbug3487 I think the only Fatar they used before was on the Poly Evolver. All the rest of their keyboards had the same feel as the other instruments described above.
Another problem I had with the old DSI keybeds is that the black keys consistently put out a higher velocity than the white keys. If you midi'd into a Kronos, Motif, Integra, and played an electric piano patch, the difference was very noticeable.
In any case, I'm glad that Sequential improved that component in their instruments; my Rev 2 feels better than the older DSI instruments I've owned over the years. It's too bad they didn't do that for the Prophet 12 because otherwise that would have been a great instrument to play.
@@peterkadarmusic9728 Mono Evolver Keyboard also uses Fatar, but I was wrong about the Mopho Keyboard, this is Huaxin as in P08, sorry for messing that up.
@@microbug3487 All good. Their quality has gotten a lot better over the years, from the choice of keybed to their encoders.
Appreciate the honesty! The price is absurd for what it is. Should be half AT THE MOST.
V2 of hardware will be rectangular display in a circular keyboard :>
LOL, i would totally dig that! and make the keys red whilst at it :)
Yip , Don't know what they thought giving it a circular display!!
And make the keyboard rotate through the octaves
Heheha! Perfect!
Thanks for your reality check, Woody! As for me, I disliked that keyboard the very second I saw the first picture of it. The ugly knob thing in the middle - which is supposed to be a display - looks more like a medical instrument for a dentist's lab or an eye clinic or something. And in fact it makes the whole keyboard look sterile, cold and downright ugly. It's an insult to the eye. Kudos to you also for focusing on the keybed. I feel that in general synth youtubers put too little emphasis on keybeds which might be why some manufacturers seem to feel that it's perfectly fine to slip us some cheap mediocre toy keybeds, while adjusting the sales price upwards...? Keep up the great work, Woody! Love and light from sunny Thailand ❤
The hype reminds me of the recent Korg Kaoss Replay. I wake up and my entire feed is on fire with videos showing love. 6 months later no videos on using it in studio or live, gig rundowns, extended tutorials, nobody making patch packs, no one has it on their desktop or immediate side table indicating use.
Sadly, when I see something on day one videos in the hands of select prominent "Geartube" reviewers (those who do not create or release music or gig at all have little credibility with me) I watch from time to time I am immediately suspicious that it won't live up to expectations. Words in the video title like "Wow" "Exceptional" and anything being described as a "KILLER" have my antennae up immediately.
That is cause many RUclipsrs nowdays are the PR part of these companys. So I usually never watch those reviews.
The whole "blah blah blah killer" argument or title is stupid in all contexts. Even if something is better, it doesn't make the other thing die. Therefore, it's a killer of nothing, just another competing device, be it better or worse.
I hate the unneeded and overused use of combative language in media, be it competition of devices or products, or in politics. "So and so DESTROYED so and so in debate!"
Oh yeah? That other person no longer exists? They're destroyed.?
Ridiculous and pointless.
@@CaidicusProductions Everything has to be louder than everything else.
@@brhodes0 What a shame, uh?
Not hyping up gear but just honest reviews or reflections! Thanks woody! We need more of that.
What we need is a full on standalone keyboard capable of installing any VST plugins!
Yes, I agree.
I think it's better to use hardware for creating the sound, because it will hard to compete with computer CPU level, so rather than having an inferior product comparing to a laptop, better use hardware engine so sound presets will load faster and possibly warmer (if adding some analog stages)
There have been several attempts by various manufacturers, who created exactly that but they all went bankrupt after a couple of years, mainly due to their high asking price.
@@straighttalk2069 yeah, most of which did so before hardware prices came down exponentially. There's no good reason a manufacturer couldn't offer this in a 61 key model for $1k to $1500 USD nowadays.
@@keefazstudio Exactly 👍
Thanks Woody can’t wait for the bad keybed review !! This is sorely needed
Kaybed is the MOST important feature in a keyboard BY FAR
Not to the Unison Chordpak crowd.
Hey Woody, you're not a snob, exactly the reason why I watch and trust you. I am done with all these influencers and cured in terms of GAS. Music comes from your mind and not from gear. Too many companies and products, trying hard to sell and make money, while we most likely already own what we need 😊
100% well said, I myself though have noticed that it is gear videos that usually get the most views, so that's another reason why we like to cover new products, if I release a musical performance or some theory topic, nobody hardly watches... :(
So true! Especially if you know that nowadays even a premium keybed (Fatar for example) isnt a cost factor at all for any manufacturer, it is clear beyond a doubt that any decision to release a product with an inferior keybed is a deliberate marketing decision and a slap in the face of every piano player.
right on well said
Although Fatar is the dominant manufacturer of keybeds, I wouldn’t call most of them “premium”.
Even for a non-piano player, it's quite a blow to see such a short-hinged keybed. Disappointing indeed.
Also, the keyboard IS a cost factor... Fatar invested in a lot of manufacturing tech (check out the Dr Mix Fatar factory tour) and seems to factor that in to their prices. That being said, I think this type of keyboard should use the better of the Fatar options, or the equivalent (such as Korg's in-house keys they use for the Pa5x). On a cheap lightweight plastic synth, sure, then use the cheap light keys.
The Arturia essential line is just the cheap Fatar beds, and even their better keybeds isn't even that good. But you get what you pay for. For what this costs its a failour from the start. It honestly is 3x too expensive. to even get foot inside betwen the competition. I'd honestly rather buy a keylab and the V-collection and use a notebook, which can do much more poliphonic even for cheaper notebook. Ya if its made correct you have the benefit of as little latency as possible if you use an analog scannerboard for the keybed and connect it directly to the computeboard they use. I don't think its worth the money they want for it, I can buy 3 Korg softsynths of the "Premium" ones that is not included in their retro kit bundle for the same price.
This take means a lot. Glad you decided to post 👍👍👍
Such a missed opportunity. Arturia could have really gone to town with their V collection technology and software and come up with a fabulous controller and synth. Instead we seem to have a Nest thermostat stuck on a fairly basic controller keyboard and costing very premium pricing. Pretty sure most live musicians would rather a laptop, V-collection and a decent controller keyboard (which you could probably get for the same price as this keyboard).
I think people would be a lot more excited if this had had:
1.) a large touchscreen for a full editing experience
2.) more knobs and a set of sliders/drawbars
3.) at least 4 parts, if not more
yep, that would shut people like me up :)
it would become a Japanese workstation then.
I'm glad they did something different, simple and yet powerful.
@@TrueMeHowNord keyboard is a workstation ?it s a stage keyboard with several parts ,) not the same price i agréé but the rnd of vcollection is not amortized ?for the new synth,maybe not to add them all ok,à sort of legacy vcollection to justify the payment of à new one in soft in parallèle...Just thinking ,) and some smooth transition of course as it s a stage keyboard. As it s a stage keyboard, not.needed to have à lot of sliders and knobs
And.vcollection inside of it and that would be perfect for 1.6 ke
Agreed.
I don't really think there is any "hype" for this synth. Since yesterday we see all the usual youtubers making their ads for this synth but nobody care. I was not even aware they were releasing a new synth. This is the same probmem with all others brands now, when all the youtube videos are sunndenly talking about a new synth, people can think this is the new must have but in fact this is only the official "advertising date" when all youtubers have permission to publish their "testing" videos (I say testing and ads because since a long time ago I stopped trusting guys with many subscribers doing test, we all know this is a kind of paid test even if it's not.I understand they can't tell badthings because the brands will then refuse to send them their new stuff...)
all that is true, speaking as somebody who sometimes participates in such launches! but refreshing not to be involved this time and in position where I can freely speak my mind. synthfluencer launch videos are always paid promotion, even if no money changes hands, the free gear has significant value.
I have purchased 20-ish synths / controllers / modules in the last 5 years, tried them out, kept what I liked, and sent the others on to a better home. (Funny as it is regarding this video, I had the JD-08, Wavestate, and Maschine - all of which have been passed on to new owners). My main DAW controller is an Arturia Keylab 61 running Ableton 11 and 8 VSTs simultaneously for my preferred sound. (I had the 88, but hated the feel and controller issues / glitches). The Keylab 61 is perfect for me. For my live set, I use a Yamaha YC-73 and a Roland A-800 (controlling Ableton 11 as a VST player). I had a Novation SL 61 Mk 3 which I loved, but it simply had too many things on it I didn't need (value lost on me), so I sent it on to its next home and stayed with the Roland. I prefer hardware keys when playing live, versus laptop + software + controller systems, due to glitches, crashes, and the like. But when composing / producing in the box, I use a computer + VSTs + a controller for everything. That all being said, I settled on the YC-73 for live play (Electric piano, and piano sounds - lower rack placement) and the A-800 (Strings, pads and shimmer sounds - upper rack placement) for very specific reasons. My style of live play requires 2 keyboards, and I switch between the two to create dynamics and tonal shifts in the music. It's very hard to compare stage keys to DAW controller keys, as they really are two different things. If you're writing at home and you clip the CPU running 18 VSTs plus 20 FX, no big deal; just reboot. The YC-73 and the A-800 was the minimum amount of hardware I could reduce to while still retaining glitch proof stage performance. IF the computer goes down, the YC-73 can cover everything I need instantly. For me, mistakes and glitches are simply not acceptable when playing live. To reduce the song end / song start gaps between songs, I now use an SP-404 mk2 for all backing tracks (I mix all the backing tracks I need for live performance down in Ableton to an mp3 file, then export and assign it to a key on the Sp 404. That way, any song is available instantly and the hardware playback is rock solid). It has taken years and tens of thousands of dollars in switched out gear to finally figure out this system for myself. Even as an Arturia Keylab advocate, I don't see where this product changes anything for me, or anyone else. Personally, I'd buy a good used laptop and a Keylab 61 instead. You'll have A LOT MORE polyphony, unlimited multi timbral access ( based on CPU power), and infinitely better control options. If you're looking for a $1500 stage keyboard, just buy a Yamaha (CS, CP, or YC line). That is the best you can buy in that price range. When playing in live environments, I have never found I needed access to 1200 different sounds. You really only need an EP, Piano, Organ, and pad. That's it. I play live through a Soundcraft Digital board and all Turbosound i300 sound columns + subs. Sound quality is insanely important to me, and yet, I cannot find a use for all my 32,000 vst sounds I have access to. They all get lost in the mix when they have to be played live, even through the best sound system. GAS ( Gear Acquisition Syndrome) is a real thing. It's easy to fall in love with the newest thing. But if you are at the point where you are paying $1500 plus for hardware keyboard systems, there are better options than this thing. I think Arturia RnD just said lets make a hardware synth based on our keyboard / VST collection. In the end, they made something I simply don't think anyone will really want use in lieu of what they already have.
You nailed it with your comment. Did they ask their Keylab 61 and 88 users if this would be a game changer? I think the feedback would be if I have the Analog Lab preset crippleware for free why would I buy this when I own 100% of the functionality for 20% of the cost. Oof!
@@scott21113 I agree, keyboardists have it THE WORST in a live band. The cost to add keys / strings / organ / pads, and to get them to play seamlessly and reliably, simply equals MONEY! With dwindling interest in writing and performing music anymore, you need very specific instruments that have impeccable sound, intuitive and well laid out controls, unmatched build quality, and unerring live play reliability. My YC-73 is damn near perfect for that. I love it. But I NEED to layer strings / pads / shimmers at times, and that require a VST player. I've tried everything from the JD-XA, to the JD-08, to the Wavestate, to a Kyra. All sounded good, but NOTHING came close to a laptop running stacked VSTs. And considering the Kyra was $1700 (used), and the JD-XA even more than that, at some point you get tired of throwing $1000 in the trash every month searching for the optimal rig. You know when you find a mind-blowing device that makes you open your wallet and forget you have to eat hotdogs and drink water for 2 months to afford your dream rig. This ain't it.
the first long comment i’ve not skipped ina while, and quite good - thx!
@@russ254 Sorry I'm rather long winded, but sometimes, taking 3 minutes to read a paragraph can save a few thousand dollars in 'well, I'll just try it out myself'. I prefer to take the hit in the checkbook, in hopes someone else can use that information to save money themselves.
Well said! Agree on your suggestion for stage keyboards, the Yamahas are rock solid.
My humble apologies to Arturia for the Auto ‘Corrupt’ miss spelling, turning it into ‘Arthurian‘. I’m still struggling but at this stage, providing that Modal Electronics actually make it, I think that the Modal Carbon synth will win out. Thank you for revisiting the new Arturia Astrolabe.
This is why I love your channel, get to hear synths from a performer. You're correct, most reviewers can NOT play a keyboard masterfully. Some are so bad at it they can't show me what the synth can do with big two handed chords, or any two handed complex phrases. Instead I get one note played and sequencer blips for a poly synth. Then the control of the keybed as it is connected to the sound engine, this has to be almost perfect to perform on it; along with what you mentioned, controllable pressure.
I bought an Arturia controller a long time ago, the KeyLab25 which has a metal case and plays okay with synth tones that come with Analog Lab. I get 50% discount offers on the fully editable V-Collection which is a very good price. BUT...I hate software instruments, hating because of turning knobs and pushing sliders with a mouse is physically sickening for me, to slow, no muscle memory, no joy. The Arturia controller sliders and knobs were used for different functions for every synth in the collection. ARRRGGG!!
I have asked these manufacturers why they don't sell a controller that precisely matches the synth on the screen, every synth engine of the entire V-Collection can have the same hardware interface instead of making it look like the original vintage synth. There could even be an industry standard of this controller box with for example: 4 sets of ADSR sliders, 16 buttons, 16 knobs, or whatever fits on an interface box that is the length of a computer keyboard. Then if the software instruments have deeper editing, a second screen image and controller could be added. Now we have a standard and all the physical controls are in the same place and matches whatever synth is displayed on the screen. More complex synths like the Omnisphere will need some mousing, but could be kept to a minimum.
During and after your review I kept saying to myself "it's a rompler". But I can see it as a stage software synth that doesn't require a computer, just edit your V-Collection with your computer and download the patch to the Astrolab...if we can do that? But that places a tremendous priority on the keybed...so??? For the price I would expect at minimum all the standard subtractive controls on the surtace of this so you can tweak while on stage, but again, no???? And another set of physical dedicated buttons for a set list. Arturia is a great company, making great hardware synths, which I own, but this????
It’s (mostly) not a ROMpler-the bulk of these are either virtual analog, FM, or physical modeling instruments.
That said, you make lots of good points and suggestions!
@@JeffPalmer83 Maybe what I think of a rompler is wrong. My definition is a digital keyboard that has little to no editing of the factory waves/patches/tones. Which is true of this keyboard unless you own the V-Collection then it is fully editable. I own a Yamaha MX49 I call that a rompler because the only sound design is a few controls for filter/resonance and amp ADSR.
Hi Woody, it's excellent that you have done this 'rethink' video now you've had time to think about the item. Thank you for honesty and thoughtful approach.
mate this is a bot.
@@j-b-l8147
Who is a bot and why do you think so!?
@@roggyo look at this, "Paul's" comment and tell me that it isn't a pointless and redundant response made by chat gpt.
@@j-b-l8147
I don’t think so. Half of the comments under the majority of videos are similar. His YT channel is 10 years old and he actually has some content on
YT channel. There certainly are bots on the internet, but why would they use them to comment on Woody’s YT videos?
@@roggyo I'm not accusing him of using bots, I believe that there are just thousands out there, interacting randomly with internet media.
Like if you read the comment it says the same thing twice, and yet says nothing, its literally just summarizing the most simple point of the video. And the way it says, "this item".
It's all to impersonal and doesn't sound like human speech.
Oh dear, are we getting an ArturiaGate after the EP-133SliderGate and the mpc-keys-61 influencer war? Anyway, if I buy an expensive keyboard I don't expect to pay for licenses to change settings for synths that came with my keyboard. What's next? Paying a monthly subscription to enable aftertouch?
yeah that's a good point. i would hope in the future for v-collection discounts if you own the hardware and vice-versa.
After seeing the price, for a gigging musician a MODX7 would be around the same price, more variety of sounds and way more polyphony
I can't see many of these showing up on anyone's keyboard rig who plays out in a band. 90% of the time I generally only have space for two boards on a double riser stand. It's much easier to have a keyboard with multiple splits and layers so I can play multiple patch tones as the song rolls along. It also needs to be easy to hook up if I need it to control another board and send program changes if it has to serve as a controller. Just my perspective as a "stage" instrument my Fantom 06 just has greater utility value per dollar of cost. Of course everyone can have their own preferences, but I evaluated buying an RD-88, a Grandstage, a Nautilus, and a PX-560M alongside each other and the Fantom 06 came out the winner for me. Even though the keys are not piano action I love the weight savings and portability over an 88 key hammer action bed. I am satisfied that all the sound editing capabilities of the Zencore engine exist on the actual Fantom 06 unit via the touchscreen and knobs/sliders and I am not forced to buy Zencore Pro for $299 to edit my presets. Plus let's be honest - in what context would I be playing a split or layered Buchla/Fairlight patch live?
Lastly, Woody I have not met many gigging players worried about the laptop PC on the side while playing live in the last 5 years - It's pretty much universally accepted now that a gigging or worship keyboard player might have a MacBook running MainStage and or Ableton on the side at a show - whether you're a bar band or playing a stadium show.
I appreciate your opinion about the keybed most reviewers don't have a clue what they are talking about when it comes to the keybed and that is one of the most important factors on a keyboard or synth. That design display is also not very practical.
Yeah really bummed about the screen, but it's not something I would get anyways. Still waiting for that Keylab mk3. Also please make that deeper dive on keybeds, that would be really helpful.
Should i consider this or Artuira mk3 essential 88keys ?
If i don't mind about laptop or require time with Daw ?
why u're so rude to reply
?
what does it mean 《 take conversion out of this platform 》?
u sucked.
The whole hype is totally overboard.
For a home user who isn't technical it's a great way to get all the familiar sounds and some excellent synth sounds so the price is pretty good for what's on offer.
Great idea about the key bed video will watch that, definitely an interesting subject. We need more high end midi controllers.
@@maccagrabme eh, for home use you could buy any midi controller and then just analog lab pro software and you are good to go. 300€ for a midi controller + 200€ for analog lab pro and you have the same sounds. Of course if you don't have a computer, then it might be a different story.
what mac said, for a home user the software is perfect, save you 1500 bucks and no extra gear taking up space, and clutter!
people like arturia stuff and the overwhelming feedback is "it's not for me". and apparently it's not great for the people it's actually for too (stage keyboardists who use arturia plug ins). A 88 key is coming maybe it will suit more people like Woody.
Thank you for posting this after thinking about how much this thing is all sizzle and no steak. Makes zero sense in the studio and what gigging pro would ever go with this when a "good enough for live" set of sounds and pro keybed and control surface of their choice can be had?
I really enjoy your videos - I am neither a techno-buff nor a synth purest so your direct and no-nonsense approach chimes with me…also great to see enthusiasm for those great products. Many thanks!
What would someone recommend for a keyboard/synth/daw set up, where I can still practice piano, etc. ideally 61 keys…
It looks interesting, but we'll have to wait for more details.
I found the Arturia Keylab Essentials to have one of the worst keybeds I've used, so let's hope it's a lot better.
Is this keyboard limited to only two splits? And what if they were edited on the computer instead of directly?
I'm so happy with my Nektar LX88+ .. a $300 marvel 🙂
my kinda guy!
I have one of these as well and love it.
Does it come with all the V Collection upgrade free each year? If not I can’t see the value in this.
Just to let you know, you need more than Analog Lab Pro to tweak sounds. At least that's what I gathered from watching reviews. I believe you need the V Collection.
I personally love that they made this synth. I ordered one as soon as I seen they were available. I own all of Arturia's plugins, so I'll be able to create presets, for everything in the synth. I love the idea of having everything standalone. It beats being tied to my PC, if I'm working with other hardware. I like not having to run cables from my interface, to process sounds through outboard gear, too. I also like the hi-res screen. I know it looks like a new age thermostat, but at least it's one of the cool thermostats. It beats the screen that I have on far more expensive synths, like the OB-X8, for example. I realize that the knobs on the OB, make up for the small screen, but complaining about the screen is kind of hating, unless you're blind. If that's the case, use your phones Bluetooth, or tweak in your computer, and then send your work into the synth. I guess it's not for everyone, but I'm excited for it to get here on Saturday. I also had a code for Perfect Circuit, and got 10% off, so that was a bonus. I'm also excited to see what updates they'll be dropping. I imagine that it's only going to get better. I imagine that they're going to use the money they make on the drop, to invest back into firmware updates. I'm crossing my fingers for an 8+ track sequencer, and sampling/chopping. Even if you have to do it through software, and then import it, I would be cool with it. I'm guessing that sampling with pigment, should be a workaround. I would prefer being able to import one-shots. If they offer one-shots, and a sequencer, with a decent polyphony, it will be a great workstation.
Thanks for this ☺️ you listened to your community ❤
I cxl'd my order for this Astrolab after watching your clip 😛 I made a dumb mistake and ordered this Astrolab yesterday after watching loopop. Not his fault, was an impulse/itch/G.A.S thingy 🤪 Glad YT bought this up on my algo. After watching your clip and Bo-Beats (Had guest Piano player who said the $1600 keyboard was just "Ohkay"). Plus I got the new 61 Keylab MkIII (Analog V Software came free) Which is a ton of fun running on a budget Mini PC & touch screen. PS: Woody, My wife thanks you 😊
I feel everybody felt excited with the curious knob screen thing. Then we all realize that it's inconvenient. But, I'm really interested in your nee gear. I want to see how you manage the synths without a computer. Good video
Thanks for your honesty! The small screen initially seemed cool, and I would understand it in a mini keyboard where space is issue. But here? Why wouldn't you just have large screen and controls next to it. There is so much empty space it makes no sense to have this complex tiny screen/controller combo.
Good points Woody. The Astrolab looks amazing! But ultimately I think it's aimed at the live performance - the onboard sounds with (hopefully) no latency must be a huge plus factor - even if you're confident in your computer connection, it must be peace of mind to know that all your sounds are there, easy to call up and play.
However, thinking about this particular user, they'd also want a good, fast keybed, some more performance controls, and a good display to quickly recall things. The knobs look great, but maybe your live performer will want some faders? Although there is space there to put some (e.g. I have Monogram CC controls) - if the keyboard allows MIDI controller input.
For me, I've got the Komplete Kontrol MK3. They keybed is good for what it is (not proper piano, but great as MIDI input device and synth playing), the display is lovely, there are DAW controls (admittedly that's not what your Astrolab user wants). There are no faders, but lots of space to put my Monogram and other controls (e.g. a Stream Deck) on. Also four footswitch connectors...
...and lastly, pitch and mod wheels to the side, not up above (I guess it's an acquired taste) - you could take the KK on tour and it costs just over a 3rd of the price. Hmm!
Yes, it is a GIGGING keyboard. Arturia were pretty clear about that in their intro video. I think a lot of people missed that point.
Like you, I'd be happier with Astrolab/Analog Lab supporting 4 simultaneous instruments. The ability to swap seamlessly between patches is nice, but not a substitute.
you're right, interestingly nearly all gigging pros are running vsts and mainstage these days anyways :) good call on the seamless transitions, forgot to mention that, this is almost becoming a standard feature on instruments of this price.
Gigging board must have a proper keybed.
@@oupahens9219 We all have our opinions on what constitutes a proper keybed. For instance, I can’t stand a Bosendorfer. I think it borders on unplayable, and much prefer a Yamaha or better yet, a Kawai. Woodie doesn’t care for Arturia’s keybed, yet the one on my Polybrute doesn’t feel any harder to play at the back of the than the front. And, according to my Juliard-trained piano teacher, you’re not supposed to be playing the keys that way anyway, since you don’t have proper control there, regardless of the keybed.
People whining about this are bedroom wannabee producers people who praise it are accomplished musicians 😊
Not exactly seamless transitions from what I saw. The sample based instruments took quite a few seconds to load. Also 61 keys for a stage keyboard is rather small. You only get Analog Lab and not the V instrument collection. So it's a preset player with middling features and construction. Yes they were very clear this is for the gigging musician. It will be interesting to see how that market share reacts. Again, 61 key Nautilus for $1700 seems to me a far better option.
If they had included the complete V-Collection X, a significantly larger touchscreen, and some way to interact with all the instrument controls to create patches from scratch without needing a computer, I would find it to be an interesting product. I'm not sure if, due to cost issues, they ended up with such a small screen or fewer controls, but it's not cheap. As you said, the screen was designed with a more visual approach rather than a practical one. I understand the focus they had on a stage keyboard, but I think they aimed too specifically at a particular segment. Great video; I'll be looking forward to the one on keybeds!.
Do they have one at a local music store where you could try one out?
I’ve never played or owned a Arturia but I’m so tired of Roland deep dive menus.
Seriously looking to try the astrolab.
yes, i will have opp to try one soon
Great you updated your stance after yesterday’s video. I think version 2 with a larger screen, the full V collection and being able to install other soft synths at this price would make it a lot better. Yes they should after a big discount for existing v Collection owners!
wow you really opened my eyes about keybeds.....now I really wanna feel a good one
Display is cool but too small... even my new glasses won't help. It seems like everyone at Arturia have 100 percent vision! And please do a video on keybeds!
video on keybeds would be great
You should ask Arturia to design a sampler, or you could be chief designer and make it 24 bit, because we all need 144 db of samples right?
As a stage keyboard it fails in so many areas and if you’re doing your own material on stage you’re stuck with presets. It falls between the cracks of two worlds
I have ordered it!!! arrives end of April - sold out everywhere - can't wait. Don't need to reach over to a computer and use a mouse!!!
I can't believe 😮 you have all my favorite synths in front of you on the desk, we are perfectly tuned 😂👍🏻
wow, that is indeed pretty awesome!
I'm with you on the Keylab keybed. It is the weakest point of the Keylab. I have the 61 and Mine breaks just leaving it alone. I don't use it that often but when I need it, a key will have popped up. I've had it open 3 separate times so far and they were all different keys. It's an easy fix with some super glue but, the keybed never looks even. However, I still do like it as a midi controller. The knobs and faders are good.
Got to say, now living in a smaller apartment, the Novation Launchkey Mini 3 doesn''t bring me back to my family's Steinway Grand but for doodling it's been perfect and when I'm in the mood for a larger setup, I turn on my Yamaha MODX6, granted the keyboard isn't premium but it's what I have at the moment.
For $2200 CAD (which is the price here):
Basic MacBook air- $1200CAD
Keylab essential 61 $369
Arturia MiniFuse 2 Audio interface $200
Remaining $431 (but arturia software on black friday). LOL
Arturia are generous with reductions for new products if you are already a customer, and the upgrades to Pigments have all been free of charge- these updates have greatly enhanced that product such that it is absolutely one of the best software synths in the business. I do agree with you that perhaps those customers who already own the V Collection might have been offered an enticing discount to purchase Astrolab - I am a gigging musician, but can certainly see why someone not in that position who already owns the V Collection would see this product as being either superfluous, or unnecessary for their purposes. Similarly, I feel less gushing about the Astrolab today relative to yesterday!
Hi Woody. I really enjoy your channel, your hands on experience of gear and reviews are really valuable, especially where the gear is on the premium end and therefore not easy for me to get a hold of and test myself. My personal opinion, a reaction stream is perfectly valid, you aren't expected to have all the information and answers to hand. It's supposed to be a little raw. A reaction video to the internet reaction however feels a bit odd. Especially reacting to the internet synth community which unfortunately can be on a good day lacking balance and on a bad day unhinged. The reaction to this product from people who haven’t touched it is frankly nuts. I think it would have been really interesting to see you get hold of the piece of gear further down the line and valdiate your initial thoughts. Or if you determined that you didn’t want to get the synth after all, it doesn’t make your initial thoughts any less valid. Just my two krona's worth, keep up the good work. I'm loving the interstitial clips and "reactions" by the way.
If they put out a AstroLab Mini with slim keys, I might get one. I do my music work on the iPad, and I’m envious of the V Collection. So I’ve considered getting a portable PC to run it and treat as a hardware synth. And I really wanted to get a KeyLab, but I don’t like “full size” keys, and the only KeyLabs with slim keys are two octaves or less. So a slim key version of the AstroLab would tempt me. I keep dreaming of a day (that may never come) when I have a decent 61-key slim-key MIDI 2.0 controller and Arturia and Roland have ported their softsynths to the iPad (along with the Korg ones we’re still missing) with MIDI 2.0 support too. And…yeah…the AstroLab’s wheel-screen is definitely a case of “we forgot that good design is not just how it looks but how it works”. That said, I don’t think it’s so bad that it would keep me from getting one…if it wasn’t for the big keys.
I can feel you on the keybed. I bought a keylab essential and gave to a friend because I couldn't stand the keybed. Interesting choice talking about bad keybeds with a wavestate in front of you :D
haha, that's a funny point. :D but then again, nobody has ever claimed that the wavestate has a great keyboard, nor does it cost 1600!
@@WoodyPianoShack Indeed Wavestate and Opsix have awful keybeds. One of the reasons I sold mine.
Really enjoy your videos. I"ve been reluctant to work with a computer and midi controller. So I would be really interested to learn what is the minimum requirements to run plug ins.
The main thing i'm curious about is how easily the knob screen could be replaced, if it really is same tech as a nest thermostat the connectors on the back can break pretty easily. Covering the screen when turning is was less of a concern, you turn it from the side like theremostat, or roll with one finger.
I was going to say it looks like they tacked a NEST on the front panel and called it good
Hi from Conwy, N Wales. Woody, thank you so much for your content. I really look forward to watching your videos. I love how you decided to follow up with a second video after feeling that you may have been a bit too enthusiatic in hindsight. I really respect your view and I have based many buying decisions on your opinion. Your knowledge and charisma is fantastic. Let's get you to >100k subscribers.
nice one, appreciate the kind comment, thanks!
thanks for educating the masses woody on keybeds . priceless video !!!!!!!
Yep, interesting concept for live performance, but even there I'm a bit skeptical on tiny screen and knob and fader controls on the right side of the keyboard - wouldn't it make more sense having them on the left since usually the right hand is more likely busy on the keybed...?
The last live show I've attended (admittedly, very not mainstream bands) one of the band's keyboardist was using an Arturia MIDI controller keyboard and a Razer laptop on stage.
I like the concept of having the VSTs baked into one instrument (no laptop/iPad, no audio interface, no extra cables) but I agree with your concerns about the tiny screen and the questionable keybed/action. Arturia is almost there...
One of the reason I use a Korg Trinity still is the key bed , feels better than a lot of synths and still sounds great :-)
I saw you comment in the original video about having second thoughts. Thanks for keeping things real and grounded! If you are the target for the AstroLab, you’ll know. I feel everyone else will feel like they paid too much for a jumped up MIDI controller. I heard the term “stage piano” thrown around and this definitely does not fill that description. Perhaps a “leave your computer with loaded Arturia VST’s at home stage synth”. Fascinating but niche.
My thoughts exactly. I’m not going to hate on Arturia as so far they have been excellent and very generous with their plug ins, prices and updates. They’ve obviously had a few artists in their ear looking for a gigging keyboard so they’ve delivered, well kind of - the keybed is important if you’re on stage playing live I guess. It’s just that 99% of their customers are more likely home producers or pros in a studio. So it’s been a miss on that front.
I would have liked to see a groove box like the machine plus or maybe a desktop synth controller with knobs and faders. Most folks have probably already got a keyboard nowadays and their controller line has got you covered Tbf.
As an owner of the V Collection since v.4, I've been happy, mostly, with every upgrade. But...I've had issues with load times for the various instruments when playing 'live'. Several seconds isn't a problem between songs, but it's definitely a problem when changing instruments within a song. Also, while it's not a BIG problem, latency in fast passages in a solo can be a bit of a problem. So, as you've pointed out, a gigging musician may want to consider the new astrolab, even if they do already own V Collection software. Since I play synths as well as piano, I don't mind the short radius of the keys as much, but it would be nice to avoid it. And, I TOTALly agree that a discount for long-time licensed users would be appreciated. (Maybe there'll be a Christmas special offer...50% off?)
As a package it is solid or at least good enough.
But as mentioned in your earlier video this competes with Phantom 06 (€1249) and Nautilus 61 (€1799).
Polyphony and multitimbrality sorted. Definately two synths to contemplate as well.
The Arturia is a modern/different take on the Roland Jupiter 50.
Excellent point, this is going up against some strong mid-price workstation synths.
I think Arturia Origin it was a better concept than Astrolab. Also a "VST - Player" but with much more Knobs and control.
yeh odd there's blank area where a set of organ faders coudl be.
A part of me feels like we, as consumers, are so spoiled by options and such that we easily forget to try to use and experience such things as they were designed. We spot any and all aspects we see as shortcomings and bad things, without realizing that real people made this thing a reality, made such decisions in the designing and manufacturing of said thing, and that they didn't maliciously cut corners everywhere when they were making it. They made it, they're proud of it, and it's easy enough to find people who just use and enjoy it, even at this early stage.
And yet, for any thing that comes out and COULD be great, there are still movements against these things that create content or comment about how horrible and bad that thing is.
If one attempted to just use and enjoy this keyboard, without nitpicking everything and attempting to spot all of the aspects that could be considered bad, could one not just see it as good? I'll have to get my hands on it and see how I feel about it for myself.
I feel like, no matter how much I like or dislike anything, if I WANT to dislike something, it'd be easy enough to find convincing content that meticulously describes why I'm right to hate it. Even the things I'm certain I like, RUclips often attempts to through content at me that wants nothing more than to convince me how bad it is, how bad the makers of it is, etc.
What a weird time we live in...
I did not feel that way here. I look upon in the buyers perspective. I am the one who will spend the money to get what I am looking for, therefore my opinion and yours and her and his opinion. That is a good thing.
@@mickec5245 I agree, one should absolutely consider how they feel about the thing they buy.
However, not everything is made for everyone, and I feel like that should be ok. Instead, we have individuals capitalizing on the effectiveness of creating content that rips on things because they're not perfect in some way.
"they didn't maliciously cut corners everywhere when they were making it"
They do. Korg, Arturia, NI, Roland, Yamaha... All of them. Profit over quality.
Should have polyphonic aftertouch (it has mono) and should include a V Collection with eternal license for upgrades (until a new keyboard replaces this model), activated via usb authentication. And should also have at least 4 audio outputs (for surround or different live mixing channels for the splits).
More assign customization would be nice but that might be possible with firmware changes.
I almost went out and bought an Astrolab but now I am a bit reluctant. Might wait a bit
That round controller/screen thingy looks a bit delicate. It's a disaster waiting to happen, especially in a live/touring situation.
Astrolab has the potential to become a much sought-after collector's piece. The aesthetic design sets it well apart from its competitors. As a synth it doesn't make a compelling case, but as a pleasing, quirky object I can see it winning over common sense.
Can't believe they didn't include more than 1 actual layer. (Main +1) . I have an 11 year old Casio PS-5X. With hex layers it will do 12. I've always been careful with it and it is amazing. Can't imagine what Arturia was thinking.
Oh Woody, I didn't know you restarted your channel, I was sad to see you say goodbye quite a while ago and follow you moving somewhere in the north of Sweden. I'm glad to see you back full of energy. I think you are a little bit of fresh air in this somewhat stuffy sector.
Hi Woody, Arturia is clearly competing with synthesizer manufacturer legends like Roland and Korg with the AstroLab. That's what I call a tough sell, cause Roland and Korg know what they're doing. And then Arturia is competing with itself, cause many people might say, I can buy a Keylab for like 300€ and have all the sounds I need. I just need a laptop for computing power.
I don't want to put down Arturia, I have a Keylab Essential 61 myself. Let's call the AstroLab a bold move, further venturing into hardware territory.
I have to agree, Arturia should lend you an AstroLab, so you could make a test video and put it in perspective. 🙂
Synthfluencer! ❤
Mostly agreed; it’s reasonable to judge the AstroLab based on Arturia’s claims, not on what we want (that’s the feedback!). But you’re right on with the keybed, especially since Arturia market this as a stage keyboard. That pic where you highlight the key angle looks like a compound fracture. Makes me wince just thinking about it!
I was also highly amused that there was so much immediate love for the AstroLab (which _is_ gorgeous, don’t get me wrong!) whilst the Jupiter/Juno-X (which are actual full synthesizers, not just rompler tone sculptors!) still gets so much hate.
BTW I recently did a gig wearing a meta quest 3 passthrough to my computer so I literally had three huge virtual screens around my keyboard, analogue lab was on one, omnisphere on the other and Equator2 on the other. 😊
How did it work out for you ?
@@fazegregpaul3152 it was awesome 😎 I was able to run through the entire set without seeing the audience lol 😆
That was a quick turnaround
For me it hits the mark. I would have loved to have seen a 'Morphee' controller so you could crossfade with the present sounds and control Polybrute sounds if included at a later date. I already have a Keylab 88 and the Astrolab would be perfect for playing Hammond or synth as a top keybaord on stage as playing Hammond on the 88 is not ideal.
Thanks Woody I’ve lived my entire life without thinking about black keypress angles and now it’s my new obsession.
I was hoping that yesterday's announcement was going to include the mk3 update to the KeyLab models. Although I no longer live gig, I'd go with a MacBook running MainStage before I'd give the Astro a second look.
Arturia about 14(?) years ago released a product called Arturia Origin in both a desktop sound module and keyboard version that had a very strange design with screen and controls in a hinged section that would close over part of the keyboard. I wasn't impressed at the time when I got to try one at some sort of music show. I had all/most of the virtual instruments they had at the time... It appears for past few years Arturia have been pretending it never existed, but technically this is their second attempt at putting their plug-ins actually in a standalone product, but with a more conventional package... Having only 2 part multi-timbrality is a bit limiting for a "stage" instrument... It's a very nice looking thing and even just seeing it made me think "I need another keyboard" but I quickly decided to give it a "probably not" rating after only a few minutes...
Didn't watch yesterday's video. I only took a glimpse at Arturia's official intro. Later that evening, I realised what Arturia are asking for this more or less sleek stage keyboard and I was shocked to a certain degree. Today, this video with the catchy subtitle caught my attention amongst all of the usual (influencial?) praise brought to you by your usual suspects.
But who am I to judge? No stage performances, no need for the AstroLab. As you pointed out, there are viable alternatives/better options for (home) studio use. Being able to choose the keybed to use with your synths according to your personal taste is ... alright: key.
BTW: A good idea to put the archetype of an inferior keybed centre screen 😊 I own a wavestate OG myself and I really love it, but the best decision KORG made with the plugins-with-controllers-attached MK2 synth series was to finally release the desktop version (module).
NB: I had the same problem with a key poking upward after unboxing a Modal ARGON8 whose Fatar keybed has a notoriuosly good reputation. Even had to pay for the repair (ironically performed by the KORG service over here in Germany ...) myself. Experience turns out to vary 🥴
That JD-08 boutique engine comes with the Fantom EX expansion, effects and all.
Fantastic thank you so much!
How to spot a bad keybed video would be so appreciated !
I'm only interested in stage use. Now, however, my concern is the polyphony: my Alesis Ion only has 8 voices, but it's 4 part multi timbral, which is a waste if producing large sound scapes is a goal, so to hear that this isn't any better, yikes. I was hoping for at least 16 voices. The other point I'm concerned about is aftertouch, which i didn't appreciate until I did.
Nowadays we all carry a big screen with us, I mean smart phones/tablets. We can fit them quite nicely on the left side of the ASTROLAB. Good thing they left that side clean!
yes, perhaps that is the end goal here, the full UI is on your connected mobile device, placed on the control panel.
I've been waiting to hear comments on the Astrolab keybed as it would be a deal breaker for me. I have an Arturia Polybrute I never play because the keybed is so awful. Keybeds I do like, Moog, Sequential, Roland and my new favourite, the UDO Super Gemini.
Woody, did you pretty much commit yourself to using Omnisphere 100%, or are you still using other VSTs as well?
i don't use any vsts frequently pr regularly, only really testing them out and making silly yt videos!
@@WoodyPianoShack Okay, gotcha.
They obviously want you to buy BOTH the Astrolab and the VST licenses, since they don't allow you to edit the instruments unless you have these VSTs. So yeah nah a discount for VST owners is probably not what they're looking for.
For many of the keyboards, they have picked the plain cheapest keybed possible. The Keylab 88 is a bit of an exception coming with a Fatar, which is fine and lasts for a while without breaking and is pretty much a standard with several other instrument brands, but it's also a little on the stubby pivot side.
Wooden end cheeks could be made out of hardwood that is very difficult to damage, and if you do end up damaging them, making new replacement ones isn't that much of a struggle. I don't think plastic "real fake wood" sides will hold up particularly well, especially being hydrographically painted, and if you do end up needing to replace them, well good bloody luck. I don't think they're solid thermoset resin, i'd rather bet when people really look into it they find a hollow ABS piece maybe 3mm thick if you're lucky. The shape does look like it's made to allow it to be moulded like that. Would be particularly hilarious if they end up only 1.6mm thick though. However they make them, odds are, they won't split neatly along the grain unlike wood but shatter in numerous tiny shards, and because they're obviously surface painted with that wood texture, any sort of scratch is bound to reveal the underlying material colour, which might even end up being random regrind colour.
“Synthfluencer” 😄 I love it!
its ok woody, i did the same thing, i had a REALLY enthusiastic tweet, then when i saw it was $2000 and you needed a pc to edit the sounds, i cooled like liquid nitrogen. It's ok to get the hype and regret it. And you coming out and admitting it is something i never seen ANY other youtuber do. You got character and integrity Woody, you rule :3
hey thanks for that and interesting to read about your reactions!
I do think there's something to be said for the DAWless argument of playing music while not having to mess around on a computer. For most people, playing music is just a fun hobby, and if moving away from a computer makes it more fun, then that's valid. Even if it's not particularly cost affective. I personally started switching also because my DAW mac mini became too slow to work, which meant I had to start all over again on PC and loose everything I was used to.
... or maybe I'm just trying to justify my collection of modern roland gear LMAO.
I admire your honesty.
Yes it looks good but that screen is a worry. Having to rotate the outer ring and then press the centre down to select a patch??..........accident waiting to happen I think.
I thought I heard that to deep dive into a patch/engine you have to pay for the editor per synth engine??
NO........if true, disgusting given the price of the keyboard itself.
Well done Woody I would/will trust your opinion over YT baggers who get freebies all the time. Upset the company with a 'bad' review and no more things sent no doubt.
I have a Tech Guru friend who was on TV and radio shows. He gave an honest review on a famous product, now they don't send anything to him.