She's also terrible at PE and physical activities. She only learned fighting to help the group out. As her name says, she's more of a student council president type rather than a PE or delinquent type that most of the other characters are.
@@EwMatias Roshi is actually *really good* though. He's just not a goku or a bardock so he's a little hard to pick up unless you really want to invest the effort. His guard point assist is easily S tier though.
@@EwMatias he lacks super dash because roshi's the only character in the game who can't fly, its an awesome detail. Its also why his super jump sucks, he has no air control
@@EwMatiasI think Ginyu is more of a joke character. He was built intentionally to be dumped to the opponent initially with only one special when you did so. Roshi is mechanically weird like Videl, but I don't think he's a joke.
He just... Didn't want to pick garbage for 2/3 of his picks. Just goes "Ok, so here's Akuma." And then "Ok, next topic. Here's another good Street fighter character..." There are plenty of characters that were missed because of these picks.
Agreed- especially after he and Venom became friends, a double-header of those two in thr next season might ALMOST make people as hype as Jam and Slayer... possibly. Maybe.
I feel dan is a pretty interesting case. He was supposed to be pretty bad on alpha 1, with very limited chain routes compared to everyone else, fireballs that don't go anywhere and a shoryuken that have no invul. But on trying to make his tatsu more similar to art of fighting as a joke, they actually made that move insanely strong. On alpha 2 they "corrected" it by making the tatsu weak as intended (slow, - on block, whiffs on crouched chars). He was at his worse. But on alpha 3 they started to give him other tools to compensate for his flaws, so he was not bottom tier anymore. On sf4 he was actually pretty decent, on sf5 execution heavy but strong. They did keep his funny mannerism intact tho.
v-ism dan was exceptional at one point iirc. and yeah there was a time when dankukyaku was a great move. i hope he returns in 6 with some flashy stuff. dan should turn into a stance character with a taunt stance and be able to cancel into it.
He's absolutely right about people losing their shit about joke characters, nowadays. Speaking as a Tekken guy, that community probably complains more about any character that's not male and/or 120% serious than any other community. Just look at the venom spewed toward Panda and Kuma. Granted, the Bears were one character taking up two slots for 20 years.
@@sabbathjackal Tekken players don't even want female characters anymore unless they're super buff (but not Lidia) or a Williams without their usual antics with each other. Characters like Mokujin, Combot, and Dr. B aren't gonna be received nearly as warmly now that the Tekken community has decided the game has to be 100% about serious buff dudes beating each other up
Shaggy from MultiVersus might be in the running. He was built around the Ultra Instinct Shaggy meme and as a result he was able to power himself up, cause shockwaves and deliver powerful punches. He was really hard to fight as an Assassin class..
I feel like Dan from the end of Street Fighter 4 got to be in a good place where he was actually decent able to have some half decent gameplay and match ups with his Knee/Throw/Dash mix ups
Strongest joke character I can think of is probably Kusaregedo from Samsho 5 Special. He comes off like a pretty silly character (including throwing feces at people) that also looks like he shouldn't work, and his bio says he "was a kind man with an unfortunate habit of cannibalism, so he got turned into a demon" which is pretty hilarious. Still he's an undisputable top 2 character, generally considered to be the actual best character.
Some great joke characters that come to mind: 1. Phoenix Wright from MvC3. Although still bad and a joke, IHEARTJUSTICE's strat of going all in on his evidence actually performed pretty well. 2. Bo Rai Cho from MKX. In no means was he a top 5 character, but Bo Rai Cho certainly could contend in MKX. A true mid tier character that is drunk, falls to the ground and farts on everyone./ 3. Rangchu's Panda in TEK7 won TWT Finals. The character is still likely bottom 1, in both TEK7/8 but I mean... it won the biggest tournament. 4. Kuma in TEK8 is definitely a real character now.
I think Robo Fortune from Skullgirls is the strongest One of the strongest assist in the game, solid DHCs, solid keepaway chaarcter, hyper mobile, and she has a beam super Her only downsides are her waek-ish mixup game and she has one of the lowest damage outputs in the game, shes also meter hungry Fukua is also a good one
Ive been maining robo-fortune since she came out and i didnt know she was a joke character, she's such a good meter spender I never really thought about it lmao
It's hard to say whether I'd actually call him good or not (in fact, I did a whole video on the subject), but for better or worse, Servbot will always be an absolute staple in my MvC2 team.
I don't think being silly makes a character a joke character. Yoshimistu and Faust are both weird and funny but, are still solid despite unorthodox tools.
Ok but there's not a definitive notion. Because you might not have that opinion, but I find it totally alright that chars designed to look funny are called "joke chars". You will never be able to say that doesn't make sense. It makes more sense and it's more intuitive than the notion that "joke char" means solely and simply anyone who is a joke competitively... That's a very specific and unnatural meaning. But I'm not against that notion either way, it's also valid. In the end it will always be vague, and nobody can fix that situation by forcing a notion.
+r Axl is actually a war criminal because he has a faintable unblockable to make the opponent dance, full combos off of any throw or counter-hit, frame traps of off blocked or unconvertable hits, two plus on block forward advancing overheads that evades low profile attacks, a mid&high counter along with a low counter that lead into full combos. All of that is before you factor in his metered options.
Arcsys loves joke characters. Faust is practically their mascot, Robo-Ky is beloved, and I can't imagine a Blazblue without Taokaka. They just ballgame their joke characters and let them have plot relevant stories.
There are two families of joke character: "Intentionally weak as a joke" and "Funny but actually a fighter", and to avoid the "joke characters are a waste of a slot" thing generally we don't get the first one anymore... on the one hand I appreciate that as an enjoyer of fighting games, but on the other hand I think that "really bad on purpose" characters absolutely fill a niche for really casual players. Dan is probably the only one I can think of who has been both: He started as weak on purpose and became "funny but capable" in SF4 and on... and you could fill an entire fighting game with pre-existing characters that are pretty silly but still effective. Robo Ky, Faust in +R and XRD, Blitztank, that one car character that appears in some 3D fighters... there are so many.
@@gunchapred8933Yeah but it's totally valid and accurate to say Dan is a weak char, because in general he is weak and his moveset is essentially unrealiable compared to all other shotos.
Joke as "weak char". Or joke as "purposely funny". Also: not just anything funny but loaded with more jokes than usual. Because in the 90s and 00s fgs were much more humourous than today... So it's not just any joke but more jokes than usual.
definitely john yomi, name another character who has a cig taunt with a frame 1 hitbox, the fastest slide you've seen in your life, an aerial that teleports directly onto the opponent, a super where he throws a huge car and a raging demon that pauses the game for 15 seconds to play an arby's meme commercial on hit
When I think of "joke character", my mind goes to the way that character fights, being strong or not. Here's an example... Ran Hibiki (Project Justice). She uses her photo camera as a weapon (flashes, even a team up super where taking photos hurts the opponent), hits with a fan made of paper, her uppercut is basically her throwing newspapers, and one of her supers is pulling out a microphone to do an interview to the opponent only to knock him/her out in the end. Interesting fun fact: in one of her winning quotes, you can hear her saying the word "Saikyo". That's the name of Dan Hibiki's fighting style. If that's not a hint about them being relatives, then I don't know what it is.
In the end of the day this is a vague term and will continue this way, because different people pushed on different meanings and they are totally alright. Some say joke chars are the ones who are ridiculous for competitive play. And others say joke chars are the ones are clearly designed for comedy goals. Not just anything funny but when there are too many jokes around him. And sometimes that kind of char isn't weak. Like Dan is a joke char coincidentally from both sides. Because he normally (in most games) has ridiculous moveset and also is weak. But KoF's Chang is made to be funny but he isn't weak in general. Also Tekken's animal chars are all joke clearly, but not all of them are weak (I can't say in details because I'm not familiar with tiers of older games).
Cant wait for yall to do a part of this series with Lockdown characters like carmine or strivw/xrd bedman! A lot of unique characters in that archetype to talk about so im curious what you would pick and its also one you dont see that often!
I feel like the most recent joke character in the most literal sense would have to be sg peacock, in that most all of her moves are slapstick gags. But even then, she's a whole full character, it's just aesthetic. I think LK is right with taokaka in that same vein, these days we get real characters that are themed around being goofy silly guys, but are still competent. Jack-o and peacock and stuff like that, or even lumina neko arc.
Neco-Arc is a joke character from the original Tsukhime visial novel, so she wasn't a joke character created from fighting game purposes like Dan. As such, putting her in the fighting game was kinda natural cuz she already existed. Especially since Tsukihime wasn't originally a fighting game, so it didn't have a ton of characters shovelled in just so people can have variety, the characters actually had to have a fleshed out lore that fits the original visual novel story. Tsukhime is VERY well regarded for its story, unlike fighting games where characters were often just given half-as silly lore just so they have some lore.
The 2 highly underrated Bleach games developed by Treasure for the DS I remember having a lot of joke characters. The first game had seventeen characters and maybe four of them were jokes, and the sequel added twenty seven more characters and they tossed a few more jokes in there. That said, Yachiru was so bonkers quick and small I remember doing some real work with her so I kinda don't know if I should class her as a joke.
It's a bit of a stretch, tho. Some people actually play her and, unlike Boskonovich, she's not THAT quirky. I don't know if you could define her as a joke character.
Mech-Hisui is also a case of "is she a joke character if the only joke about it is the character itself and not the bad or funny moveset?" And normal Hisui is the opposite, her character is serious, but her moveset is based around in-game memes.
@@megamansoupreme7122 I don't think that's the case. While there're some similar moves between Robo-Ky and Mech-Hisui, the game where he's playable came out after the original MB. And as a bossfight in X Plus he has a different moveset. Japan just loves robots and turning people into robots so it's likely that both characters had an even earlier inspiration.
Yeah Crofts, I actually clicked and watched the video expecting by the title I would find a comprehensive (as usual) rundown on the joke characters in history, instead the first 20 minutes was about explaining archetypes. I liked the video, and left you this comment, but I was baited very bad. Anyway is good to see LordKnight throwing his knowledge and having a nice convo.
Project Justice is the most soulful 3D fighter there is and I love that there's a dedicated Chairperson main in tournaments that rocks the cosplay on top
Hey jmcrofts and LordKnight, here's a question I just realized I've never seen explored: what is the most impossible/difficult >specific< character vs character matchup in fighting games? (Ignoring cases where a character is so bottom tier they "just can't" since that's too obvious. Also, I'm not talking about general Archetype matchups either. I mean how certain characters would really struggle against certain other characters no matter how good the players are.) Is it some specific zoner vs grappler matchup in a game where there's just no mechanics the grappler can use to get in and the grappler just hasn't got enough tools to do anything? Is there something more specific and hidden, like if a zoner can't readily hit low to hit a short character? I'd love to know what you two think.
A common "natural enemy" matchup that was touched on briefly in this video is the two-step zoner vs. the buttons zoner. The two-step zoner gets forced into playing like a really bad rushdown character against a character who is good at checking sloppy rushdown. Testament vs. Axl is a good example of this, that matchup suuuucks
I think the most recent example on a series adding a joke character later on would probably be Dampierre from SoulCalibur. From my memory of SCV (didn’t play Broken Destiny) he wasn’t that great and he was definitely goofy enough to be considered a joke character.
regarding the NAC main guy he was one of my locals back in the day and I think I singlehandedly got him to never go to a local again. I was the only local guy who seriously played Melty so I got saddled with him. I think he played with like, some friends group and insisted NAC was good on forums a lot, then I played him with like basically every character I played and made him look pretty bad. I think he beat me when I was playing sacchin, idk. This was MBAC, unsure what became of him after but he never showed up to locals again. he was a really, really toxic person.
Truth be told I clicked faster due to Neko Arc. Honestly we should clarify "intentionally bad and silly characters" (early Dan being key example) and "silly but viable" (recent dan, Yoshimitsu, etc) Yeah there hasn't been a case of the former for a while. Chairperson in Project Justice is an interesting case as half the cast is "silly but effective" like the swimmer
Chairperson seems like the same kind of character as Captain Commando in Marvel; the utility is so strong it's worth playing with one less character slot to have it.
Jebailey from Divekick. He has the worst divekick in the game and whenever he wins a round his head inflates, making him a bigger target. However, the head inflation also changes his physics completely, actually improving his divekick significantly.
Best joke character is really hard, simply because a joke character has to be bad (or at least considered bad) for it to be a joke character, otherwise we just call those gimmicks.
Ball from Gundam Battle Assault 2 is my pick. He’s a servbot-sized fighter with some of the fastest jabs in the game, able to stunlock your giant robot and kill you over 1000 tiny hits.
24:14 that’s funny because they literally have Robo Ky which is kinda a joke character kinda not. But what would be the funniest thing would if they brought in Fake Sol from Xrd’s story and be the ultimate joke character for Strive.
C-Neco also has the corner tech trap combo, which makes you eat like 5k or more that loops, or you risk teching into the tech trap and eating another full combo. I'd actually say that's better than neco dempsey roll since it just straight up murders you. C-Necomech is the good one. F and H are really bad still. Only one dude still plays NAC, and I've never played him so I have no idea how good that character actually is.
I feel like with the way story modes are going these days there's plenty of room to make the NPC fighters you encounter in the story real playable joke characters. Thanks to the power of mods, in SF5 you can 100% play the NPC fighters and they make absolutely great "for fun" joke fighters: Peter is absolutely the true joke character of SF5.
@@chriswest6988 I think so, yeah. Admittedly the generic "NPC attack" list is bad enough that it could be classed as a joke character if we had access to it. Although now that I think of it, the true joke character if SF6 is probably the world tour avatar character. Still, let us play a fridge, Capcom. We all want it.
Most recent "new" joke character I can think of is Bad Box Art Mega Man from Street Fighter X Tekken. Other than him, most joke characters are legacy: Dan in SF, Bears and Dr. B in Tekken, Neko Arc in Melty... We really need studios to embrace the "low tier" characters more.
Sean were supposed to be a handicap pick in NG and 2I, yet they somehow messed up and made him top tier in the latter, so I'd say that makes him the strongest joke character, even if he didn't stay that way once 3S landed.
I legitimately use Servebot in Marvel 2. I use my other mains to build meter then swap Servebot when I have an opening and spam every super which fills the whole screen and does more damage on block then if it hits. Obviously, there are major downsides, but I find it hilarious and do win this way pretty often.
In my opinion it has to be Sean second impact that man was the meta and when the developers realised that Sean was broken they quickly made him the second worst character in the 3rd strike
I wasn't sure what was compared to what but here's my take: In my understanding - vortex is a mixup (or 50/50) that can go in an infinite loop, so if a character has strike/throw mix that goes into the same strike/throw mix it can be called vortex. Flowchart is a set of options that you choose as a response to opponents' actions or state of the game. Enemy in the air - hit anti-air, but if they are too far away - quickly crouch 5 times for moral damage. Setplay is just mix-up on opponent getting up that you make stronger by performing some kind of action (setup) Can either be a special move (projectile on top of the enemy) or a framekill (pressing punch after knockdown so that your next attack hits at just the right frame and now you're at biggest possible advantage)
Fukua is an amazing joke character in Skullgirls. She existed solely to dunk on Decapre, but is actually an amazing character to use for her zoning and mix-ups
I'm pretty sure the most recent joke character would be Fukua in Skullgirls, who was an April Fool's palette swap that the players petitioned to get added for real
Lowain fron Granblue is a super recent example of a joke character in fighting games AND an Arcsys games. It can be argued that hes like the high energy taokaka type, but he never wins an actual fight, all his victories are in his and his bros' imagination.
I like to think that a "joke" character doesn't necessarily mean that the character is garbage, but either has a goofy backstory or looks/fights strange. Id put Fang, Bedman, Rufus, Roger/Alex in that category. Just my opinion though!
Some good comments in here, just wanted to mention that they forgot about Lowain when considering new joke characters. Also Krillin, who is god like in the latest patch, and throws rocks at demons and aliens. We could argue that AKI is a bit of a joke as well. I think it's kind of odd that they are trying to discuss the strongest joke characters, but seem to be operating under the assumption that you have to be weak to be a joke character. Just because they're a joke doesn't mean they're weak, and there are new joke characters, I think JM is being kinda of a downer for no reason there. Still a great vid though, much love.
@@emperormegaman3856 This is the first time I've ever heard a distinction. That's interesting, but I've never heard of "comedic characters." I think I prefer to view it as making a move towards making joke characters viable, which I do feel is better game design in the long run. Personally the idea of having to learn Neco Arc specific combos is the main reason I won't play Melty Blood. I think it's fun to watch, but something about the idea of having to learn character specific combos has always left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm glad they patched that stuff out of Dragonball FighterZ. Yoda in Soul Caliber 4 comes to mind for similar reasons, very poorly designed character. I see what you mean though, Servbot is clearly meant to be useless, lol.
Shingo is a joke char. But that term never meant only a "weak char" anyways... It is, always has been and will always be a vague term. Because it's absolutely ridiculous (more ridiculous than all joke chars combined) to force the idea that a joke char is only someone who is weak in terms of gameplay and competition. Like, it makes no sense to focus on that competitive aspect, even when the char is obviously meant for comedy but happens to be viable competitively. Just like Chang and Choi are also funny... being specifically a comedy relief concept to contrast to Kim's classic serious hero stance... And both chars generally arent weak.
![Megan Thee Stallion - Roc Steady (feat. Flo Milli) [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HozPPyqW0dY/mqdefault.jpg)
part of the joke with Chairperson and why she's so bad is that she learned karate by mail order correspondence school from Dan Hibiki
Chairperson when she faces Tableanimal: ☠
She's also terrible at PE and physical activities. She only learned fighting to help the group out. As her name says, she's more of a student council president type rather than a PE or delinquent type that most of the other characters are.
I thought she's Chairperson because she hits people with chairs.
@@bobjones4469 So her name in japanese is iinchou?
@@AlexSander-jr9et It really is, in the Japanese version of the game
It absolutely would not be hard to add a joke character to dbfz, people would pop off for hercule
Isn't Rishi a joke character? I mean, it's not unplayable, but he lacks super dash and his moves are funny..
@@EwMatias Roshi is actually *really good* though. He's just not a goku or a bardock so he's a little hard to pick up unless you really want to invest the effort. His guard point assist is easily S tier though.
Hercule and/or Tao Pai Pai would be dope
@@EwMatias he lacks super dash because roshi's the only character in the game who can't fly, its an awesome detail. Its also why his super jump sucks, he has no air control
@@EwMatiasI think Ginyu is more of a joke character. He was built intentionally to be dumped to the opponent initially with only one special when you did so. Roshi is mechanically weird like Videl, but I don't think he's a joke.
reads title: Who is the strongest Joke Character?????
watches video: so anyway, here's SF4 Akuma
threw me for a loop for a minute there
yep, awoke that raging demon
He just... Didn't want to pick garbage for 2/3 of his picks. Just goes "Ok, so here's Akuma." And then "Ok, next topic. Here's another good Street fighter character..." There are plenty of characters that were missed because of these picks.
If you're a good player, then Neko arc
This is the SF where Dan is more viable than Akuma, I see.
JM: im gonna get so mamy clicks by just putting Neco in the thumbnail
Me: hahaha funny cat girl *click*
I kinda feel like the answer to this question has a lot more to do with how legitimate of a character can still count as a joke.
exactly, same question in my mind, like wtf, this title and the first character i see is fkn Akuma, lol
@@panterka.f they don't do joke characters until 2/3 through the video
Is Robo Ky not a joke character? They either don't consider him one or forgot about him.
“I don’t understand, I’m trying my best here: I keep on winning with this joke character, but nobody is laughing!”
I think Robo-Ky counts as a joke character and if Strive brought him back we'd lose our minds in a good way.
Agreed- especially after he and Venom became friends, a double-header of those two in thr next season might ALMOST make people as hype as Jam and Slayer... possibly. Maybe.
Nya nya nyaaa
I feel dan is a pretty interesting case. He was supposed to be pretty bad on alpha 1, with very limited chain routes compared to everyone else, fireballs that don't go anywhere and a shoryuken that have no invul. But on trying to make his tatsu more similar to art of fighting as a joke, they actually made that move insanely strong.
On alpha 2 they "corrected" it by making the tatsu weak as intended (slow, - on block, whiffs on crouched chars). He was at his worse.
But on alpha 3 they started to give him other tools to compensate for his flaws, so he was not bottom tier anymore. On sf4 he was actually pretty decent, on sf5 execution heavy but strong. They did keep his funny mannerism intact tho.
v-ism dan was exceptional at one point iirc. and yeah there was a time when dankukyaku was a great move. i hope he returns in 6 with some flashy stuff. dan should turn into a stance character with a taunt stance and be able to cancel into it.
The channel designingfor has a pretty good breakdown on the history of Dan as a character and how the joke evolved over time
You didn't mention that chairperson learned her fighting style through the MAIL by the main man, Dan Hibiki! (Aka the GOAT)
He's absolutely right about people losing their shit about joke characters, nowadays. Speaking as a Tekken guy, that community probably complains more about any character that's not male and/or 120% serious than any other community. Just look at the venom spewed toward Panda and Kuma. Granted, the Bears were one character taking up two slots for 20 years.
That's because the current Tekken community is fairly toxic.
If the bears can keep coming back, then bring back Roger Jr
tekken 3 had 4 joke characters. what happened?
@@sabbathjackal Tekken players don't even want female characters anymore unless they're super buff (but not Lidia) or a Williams without their usual antics with each other. Characters like Mokujin, Combot, and Dr. B aren't gonna be received nearly as warmly now that the Tekken community has decided the game has to be 100% about serious buff dudes beating each other up
@djsercy5879 I don't know azacena and reina got were well received in there reveal trailers
Sims drills can also hit low in ST ☝️🤓
what da
Shaggy from MultiVersus might be in the running. He was built around the Ultra Instinct Shaggy meme and as a result he was able to power himself up, cause shockwaves and deliver powerful punches. He was really hard to fight as an Assassin class..
I feel like Dan from the end of Street Fighter 4 got to be in a good place where he was actually decent able to have some half decent gameplay and match ups with his Knee/Throw/Dash mix ups
He was actually even better in 5
@Burger_pantsI imagine you have some skill to have consistently mained Dan from Day 1 and got up in ranked leaderboards with him.
Spinkicks yo
@@supervialentrandomaudio1007Danfinite was REAL. And the corner pressure that man had/has is NUTS.
@Supervialentrandomaudio10 Looks like he is getting progressively stronger over time, then. Imagine where he'd be by the time of SF6
I see Iincho, I click. Her assist is BUSTED
Strongest joke character I can think of is probably Kusaregedo from Samsho 5 Special.
He comes off like a pretty silly character (including throwing feces at people) that also looks like he shouldn't work, and his bio says he "was a kind man with an unfortunate habit of cannibalism, so he got turned into a demon" which is pretty hilarious. Still he's an undisputable top 2 character, generally considered to be the actual best character.
Throws FECES at you?! oh boy!!
Fun fact, he was also designed by Yasuhiro Nightow, the creator of Trigun
He's more of a horror character, though he have some things that sounds silly at a glance.
He is the game's mandatory Freak.
Lmao @@samfivedot
Gedo is most definitely NOT a joke character. He was designed to be gross and disgusting.
Very fitting how the saving grace of these joke characters is their ability to break basic game rules with super.
I'm so sad LK didn't show (or at least was edited out) that neko arc chaos' forward crawl has a hitbox.
Some great joke characters that come to mind:
1. Phoenix Wright from MvC3. Although still bad and a joke, IHEARTJUSTICE's strat of going all in on his evidence actually performed pretty well.
2. Bo Rai Cho from MKX. In no means was he a top 5 character, but Bo Rai Cho certainly could contend in MKX. A true mid tier character that is drunk, falls to the ground and farts on everyone./
3. Rangchu's Panda in TEK7 won TWT Finals. The character is still likely bottom 1, in both TEK7/8 but I mean... it won the biggest tournament.
4. Kuma in TEK8 is definitely a real character now.
I think Robo Fortune from Skullgirls is the strongest
One of the strongest assist in the game, solid DHCs, solid keepaway chaarcter, hyper mobile, and she has a beam super
Her only downsides are her waek-ish mixup game and she has one of the lowest damage outputs in the game, shes also meter hungry
Fukua is also a good one
Ive been maining robo-fortune since she came out and i didnt know she was a joke character, she's such a good meter spender I never really thought about it lmao
I thought Fukua was the only joke character. Didn't know they're were two.
@@pinksywedarnoc8017play robo fortunes story mode
Robo Fortune makes a lot of jokes, but she's not necessarily the joke character of the game. That'd be Fukua.
I play both of them and they're great
If having funny lore or dialogue makes someone a joke character, then literally every skullgirls character is a joke character
It's hard to say whether I'd actually call him good or not (in fact, I did a whole video on the subject), but for better or worse, Servbot will always be an absolute staple in my MvC2 team.
i saw the title and assumed it was SF4 Dan
I don't think being silly makes a character a joke character. Yoshimistu and Faust are both weird and funny but, are still solid despite unorthodox tools.
Ok but there's not a definitive notion. Because you might not have that opinion, but I find it totally alright that chars designed to look funny are called "joke chars". You will never be able to say that doesn't make sense. It makes more sense and it's more intuitive than the notion that "joke char" means solely and simply anyone who is a joke competitively... That's a very specific and unnatural meaning. But I'm not against that notion either way, it's also valid. In the end it will always be vague, and nobody can fix that situation by forcing a notion.
Love your collabs with the fgc friends ❤
+r Axl is actually a war criminal because he has a faintable unblockable to make the opponent dance, full combos off of any throw or counter-hit, frame traps of off blocked or unconvertable hits, two plus on block forward advancing overheads that evades low profile attacks, a mid&high counter along with a low counter that lead into full combos. All of that is before you factor in his metered options.
Chairperson has a mini launcher. It's her down-forward + heavy kick. She can then follow it up with a normal jump and do 5 hits max while in the air.
Arcsys loves joke characters. Faust is practically their mascot, Robo-Ky is beloved, and I can't imagine a Blazblue without Taokaka. They just ballgame their joke characters and let them have plot relevant stories.
25:00 this game has boxing kangaroo named roger, and a velociraptor named alex and he says dr.B. 😐
lordknight just sitting there all sleepy when its not his turn giving the occasional "mhhm😆
There are two families of joke character: "Intentionally weak as a joke" and "Funny but actually a fighter", and to avoid the "joke characters are a waste of a slot" thing generally we don't get the first one anymore... on the one hand I appreciate that as an enjoyer of fighting games, but on the other hand I think that "really bad on purpose" characters absolutely fill a niche for really casual players.
Dan is probably the only one I can think of who has been both: He started as weak on purpose and became "funny but capable" in SF4 and on... and you could fill an entire fighting game with pre-existing characters that are pretty silly but still effective. Robo Ky, Faust in +R and XRD, Blitztank, that one car character that appears in some 3D fighters... there are so many.
Isn’t Dan also supposedly really strong in the MVC series as well?
@@gunchapred8933Yeah but it's totally valid and accurate to say Dan is a weak char, because in general he is weak and his moveset is essentially unrealiable compared to all other shotos.
Joke as "weak char". Or joke as "purposely funny". Also: not just anything funny but loaded with more jokes than usual. Because in the 90s and 00s fgs were much more humourous than today... So it's not just any joke but more jokes than usual.
definitely john yomi, name another character who has a cig taunt with a frame 1 hitbox, the fastest slide you've seen in your life, an aerial that teleports directly onto the opponent, a super where he throws a huge car and a raging demon that pauses the game for 15 seconds to play an arby's meme commercial on hit
When I think of "joke character", my mind goes to the way that character fights, being strong or not. Here's an example...
Ran Hibiki (Project Justice). She uses her photo camera as a weapon (flashes, even a team up super where taking photos hurts the opponent), hits with a fan made of paper, her uppercut is basically her throwing newspapers, and one of her supers is pulling out a microphone to do an interview to the opponent only to knock him/her out in the end.
Interesting fun fact: in one of her winning quotes, you can hear her saying the word "Saikyo". That's the name of Dan Hibiki's fighting style. If that's not a hint about them being relatives, then I don't know what it is.
In the end of the day this is a vague term and will continue this way, because different people pushed on different meanings and they are totally alright. Some say joke chars are the ones who are ridiculous for competitive play. And others say joke chars are the ones are clearly designed for comedy goals. Not just anything funny but when there are too many jokes around him. And sometimes that kind of char isn't weak.
Like Dan is a joke char coincidentally from both sides. Because he normally (in most games) has ridiculous moveset and also is weak. But KoF's Chang is made to be funny but he isn't weak in general. Also Tekken's animal chars are all joke clearly, but not all of them are weak (I can't say in details because I'm not familiar with tiers of older games).
Cant wait for yall to do a part of this series with Lockdown characters like carmine or strivw/xrd bedman! A lot of unique characters in that archetype to talk about so im curious what you would pick and its also one you dont see that often!
I feel like the most recent joke character in the most literal sense would have to be sg peacock, in that most all of her moves are slapstick gags. But even then, she's a whole full character, it's just aesthetic. I think LK is right with taokaka in that same vein, these days we get real characters that are themed around being goofy silly guys, but are still competent. Jack-o and peacock and stuff like that, or even lumina neko arc.
Neco-Arc is a joke character from the original Tsukhime visial novel, so she wasn't a joke character created from fighting game purposes like Dan. As such, putting her in the fighting game was kinda natural cuz she already existed.
Especially since Tsukihime wasn't originally a fighting game, so it didn't have a ton of characters shovelled in just so people can have variety, the characters actually had to have a fleshed out lore that fits the original visual novel story. Tsukhime is VERY well regarded for its story, unlike fighting games where characters were often just given half-as silly lore just so they have some lore.
Guilty Gear has a joke character: Robo-Ky (and arguably XX era Bridget)
I think Faust too
I'm SO glad you made another! Truly amazing and interesting to learn about!
I love this video, just talking about just collective all fighting games and our favorites from fgs collectively.❤
The 2 highly underrated Bleach games developed by Treasure for the DS I remember having a lot of joke characters. The first game had seventeen characters and maybe four of them were jokes, and the sequel added twenty seven more characters and they tossed a few more jokes in there. That said, Yachiru was so bonkers quick and small I remember doing some real work with her so I kinda don't know if I should class her as a joke.
I think Lucky Chloe was the last joke character created to this day. Great video!
It's a bit of a stretch, tho. Some people actually play her and, unlike Boskonovich, she's not THAT quirky. I don't know if you could define her as a joke character.
@@ShendueShe is intended to be light hearted comic relief though.
There’s a bit of a distinction.
@@Shendue Yeah, she wasn't designed as a joke character. She's actually kind of insane in the right hands.
Lucky Chloe is much better than Azucena.
The coffee bit is old already and the game isn't even out lmfao
C-necomech, shes supposed to be 2 joke characters merged into one, but her gameplan is just so good that she's high tier
Mech-Hisui is also a case of "is she a joke character if the only joke about it is the character itself and not the bad or funny moveset?" And normal Hisui is the opposite, her character is serious, but her moveset is based around in-game memes.
@ViApp0 I mean, isn't she a reference to Robo-Ky too?
Legitimate question btw, not assuming anything
@@megamansoupreme7122 I don't think that's the case. While there're some similar moves between Robo-Ky and Mech-Hisui, the game where he's playable came out after the original MB. And as a bossfight in X Plus he has a different moveset. Japan just loves robots and turning people into robots so it's likely that both characters had an even earlier inspiration.
Dan will always have my heart and be my favorite joke character lol.
Yeah Crofts, I actually clicked and watched the video expecting by the title I would find a comprehensive (as usual) rundown on the joke characters in history, instead the first 20 minutes was about explaining archetypes. I liked the video, and left you this comment, but I was baited very bad.
Anyway is good to see LordKnight throwing his knowledge and having a nice convo.
Project Justice is the most soulful 3D fighter there is and I love that there's a dedicated Chairperson main in tournaments that rocks the cosplay on top
I love Rival Schools. Probably my favorite fighting games. So much of my youth was dumped in to both of them.
Hey jmcrofts and LordKnight, here's a question I just realized I've never seen explored: what is the most impossible/difficult >specific< character vs character matchup in fighting games? (Ignoring cases where a character is so bottom tier they "just can't" since that's too obvious. Also, I'm not talking about general Archetype matchups either. I mean how certain characters would really struggle against certain other characters no matter how good the players are.) Is it some specific zoner vs grappler matchup in a game where there's just no mechanics the grappler can use to get in and the grappler just hasn't got enough tools to do anything? Is there something more specific and hidden, like if a zoner can't readily hit low to hit a short character? I'd love to know what you two think.
A common "natural enemy" matchup that was touched on briefly in this video is the two-step zoner vs. the buttons zoner. The two-step zoner gets forced into playing like a really bad rushdown character against a character who is good at checking sloppy rushdown. Testament vs. Axl is a good example of this, that matchup suuuucks
Doing PW from UMVC3 dirty like that with no mentions.
I think the most recent example on a series adding a joke character later on would probably be Dampierre from SoulCalibur. From my memory of SCV (didn’t play Broken Destiny) he wasn’t that great and he was definitely goofy enough to be considered a joke character.
regarding the NAC main guy
he was one of my locals back in the day and I think I singlehandedly got him to never go to a local again. I was the only local guy who seriously played Melty so I got saddled with him. I think he played with like, some friends group and insisted NAC was good on forums a lot, then I played him with like basically every character I played and made him look pretty bad. I think he beat me when I was playing sacchin, idk. This was MBAC, unsure what became of him after but he never showed up to locals again.
he was a really, really toxic person.
Third strike Sean and SF4 Dan are pretty good "joke" characters
As pointed out in the video, Sean isn't really a joke character.
Oh LK, Guilty Gear already has Faust and Robo-Ky as joke characters.
LordKnight? 😴
"Today I'm going to talk about Litchi and Arcsys for the #245094th time"
Skip 13:00 for the actual video
Yeah click bait title Crofts 😢
So I definitely thought the implication was that Akuma is a joke character and it took me several minutes to catch up lmao
Truth be told I clicked faster due to Neko Arc.
Honestly we should clarify "intentionally bad and silly characters" (early Dan being key example) and "silly but viable" (recent dan, Yoshimitsu, etc)
Yeah there hasn't been a case of the former for a while.
Chairperson in Project Justice is an interesting case as half the cast is "silly but effective" like the swimmer
Chairperson seems like the same kind of character as Captain Commando in Marvel; the utility is so strong it's worth playing with one less character slot to have it.
Strongest Joke Character? FEATURING LORD KNIGHT - damn J... didn't have to do 'em like that!
I like the cute thumbnail
Jebailey from Divekick. He has the worst divekick in the game and whenever he wins a round his head inflates, making him a bigger target. However, the head inflation also changes his physics completely, actually improving his divekick significantly.
Gon in tekken 3 is sick
Anita in Marvel Super Heroes was ridiculous. Not even fair.
8:47 I'd also argue Earthquake from the new Samurai Shodown fits really well too
Great video. Genius to bring lord knight on this topic. He's just as good as you at presentations. Also sajam and Brian F.
Best joke character is really hard, simply because a joke character has to be bad (or at least considered bad) for it to be a joke character, otherwise we just call those gimmicks.
The most recent joke character I can think of is probably croagunk in pokken
Whenever that "FOLKS" hits, I get all jacked up. LFG
SFV Dan was a legit menace. Also I love playing Norimaru on PS1 JP X-men vs street fighter.
Ball from Gundam Battle Assault 2 is my pick. He’s a servbot-sized fighter with some of the fastest jabs in the game, able to stunlock your giant robot and kill you over 1000 tiny hits.
Love the collabs, keep it up guys
24:14 that’s funny because they literally have Robo Ky which is kinda a joke character kinda not. But what would be the funniest thing would if they brought in Fake Sol from Xrd’s story and be the ultimate joke character for Strive.
I'm surprised there was no mention of S1 Ferry for normals zoners. That character was cracked beyond belief
C-Neco also has the corner tech trap combo, which makes you eat like 5k or more that loops, or you risk teching into the tech trap and eating another full combo. I'd actually say that's better than neco dempsey roll since it just straight up murders you.
C-Necomech is the good one. F and H are really bad still.
Only one dude still plays NAC, and I've never played him so I have no idea how good that character actually is.
I feel like with the way story modes are going these days there's plenty of room to make the NPC fighters you encounter in the story real playable joke characters. Thanks to the power of mods, in SF5 you can 100% play the NPC fighters and they make absolutely great "for fun" joke fighters: Peter is absolutely the true joke character of SF5.
The standout possibility for SF6 has to be the fridge/server right?
@@chriswest6988 I think so, yeah. Admittedly the generic "NPC attack" list is bad enough that it could be classed as a joke character if we had access to it.
Although now that I think of it, the true joke character if SF6 is probably the world tour avatar character. Still, let us play a fridge, Capcom. We all want it.
Depending on what you call a "joke", Robo-Ky is a joke character basically.
That detuned "Holy Orders" gets on my nerves every damn time...
Most recent "new" joke character I can think of is Bad Box Art Mega Man from Street Fighter X Tekken. Other than him, most joke characters are legacy: Dan in SF, Bears and Dr. B in Tekken, Neko Arc in Melty... We really need studios to embrace the "low tier" characters more.
Pet Shop. End video, lol.
Shout outs to lord knight for introducing me to Neco Arc today. That’s like the coolest character ever 😭😭😭
Sean were supposed to be a handicap pick in NG and 2I, yet they somehow messed up and made him top tier in the latter, so I'd say that makes him the strongest joke character, even if he didn't stay that way once 3S landed.
"Strongest Joke Character"
(Starts the video with Akuma)
I legitimately use Servebot in Marvel 2. I use my other mains to build meter then swap Servebot when I have an opening and spam every super which fills the whole screen and does more damage on block then if it hits. Obviously, there are major downsides, but I find it hilarious and do win this way pretty often.
I’m so confused, why was the first thing he talked about Akuma
Akuma's first appearance was one shotting a dictator and now hes called a joke?
Because if you pay attention to the video you'll see that they're talking about different archetypes. The 'joke character' archetype comes up last.
I can't believe so many old schools sleeping on my baby Doctrine Dark.
In my opinion it has to be Sean second impact that man was the meta and when the developers realised that Sean was broken they quickly made him the second worst character in the 3rd strike
Never heard of setplay and vortex. When you described it, it reminded me of what people all "flowchart" and "fifty - fifty". Same things?
I wasn't sure what was compared to what but here's my take:
In my understanding - vortex is a mixup (or 50/50) that can go in an infinite loop, so if a character has strike/throw mix that goes into the same strike/throw mix it can be called vortex.
Flowchart is a set of options that you choose as a response to opponents' actions or state of the game. Enemy in the air - hit anti-air, but if they are too far away - quickly crouch 5 times for moral damage.
Setplay is just mix-up on opponent getting up that you make stronger by performing some kind of action (setup) Can either be a special move (projectile on top of the enemy) or a framekill (pressing punch after knockdown so that your next attack hits at just the right frame and now you're at biggest possible advantage)
Chairperson was in the Japan only Rival Schools 2 on PS1
Fukua is an amazing joke character in Skullgirls. She existed solely to dunk on Decapre, but is actually an amazing character to use for her zoning and mix-ups
Dampierre in soul calibur was a joke type character. I don’t remember how competitive he was. But I think he counts
Poppy in Samurai Shodown V and Kusaregedo in Samurai Shodown V Special are really good jokes characters (Kusa is top tier in his V Special)
Very surprised not to see Batgirl mentioned for vortex characters
I'm pretty sure the most recent joke character would be Fukua in Skullgirls, who was an April Fool's palette swap that the players petitioned to get added for real
Guilty gear has Robo-Ky, if he counts
How can you sleep on my boy Dr B from Tekken?
Norimaro - Marvel VS Street Fighter.
The last new joke character in a game is Murky in Heroes of the Storm if we're not limited to fighting games
10:50 love to see my main get some shine lol
Lowain fron Granblue is a super recent example of a joke character in fighting games AND an Arcsys games. It can be argued that hes like the high energy taokaka type, but he never wins an actual fight, all his victories are in his and his bros' imagination.
Dr Bosco came back in Tekken Tag 2.
I like to think that a "joke" character doesn't necessarily mean that the character is garbage, but either has a goofy backstory or looks/fights strange. Id put Fang, Bedman, Rufus, Roger/Alex in that category. Just my opinion though!
I loved playing as Hercule in DBZ Budokai, I think he would fit in DBZF2.
Some good comments in here, just wanted to mention that they forgot about Lowain when considering new joke characters. Also Krillin, who is god like in the latest patch, and throws rocks at demons and aliens. We could argue that AKI is a bit of a joke as well. I think it's kind of odd that they are trying to discuss the strongest joke characters, but seem to be operating under the assumption that you have to be weak to be a joke character. Just because they're a joke doesn't mean they're weak, and there are new joke characters, I think JM is being kinda of a downer for no reason there. Still a great vid though, much love.
You're thinking comedic characters.
"Joke character" generally carry the notion that the character isn't meant to be viable.
@@emperormegaman3856 This is the first time I've ever heard a distinction. That's interesting, but I've never heard of "comedic characters." I think I prefer to view it as making a move towards making joke characters viable, which I do feel is better game design in the long run. Personally the idea of having to learn Neco Arc specific combos is the main reason I won't play Melty Blood. I think it's fun to watch, but something about the idea of having to learn character specific combos has always left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm glad they patched that stuff out of Dragonball FighterZ. Yoda in Soul Caliber 4 comes to mind for similar reasons, very poorly designed character.
I see what you mean though, Servbot is clearly meant to be useless, lol.
When i think about joke characters my brain always thinks about Servebot.
Shingo Yabuki from KOF is the strongest joke character. He's so good players don't consider him one.
Shingo is a joke char. But that term never meant only a "weak char" anyways... It is, always has been and will always be a vague term.
Because it's absolutely ridiculous (more ridiculous than all joke chars combined) to force the idea that a joke char is only someone who is weak in terms of gameplay and competition. Like, it makes no sense to focus on that competitive aspect, even when the char is obviously meant for comedy but happens to be viable competitively. Just like Chang and Choi are also funny... being specifically a comedy relief concept to contrast to Kim's classic serious hero stance... And both chars generally arent weak.