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BLEACH FANS ARE TOXIC...
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- Опубликовано: 3 авг 2024
- In this video I discuss TotallyNotMark’s first BLEACH review titled: BLEACH: A Second Chance | Substitute Shinigami Arc (Ch 1-70). I discuss the reaction of BLEACH fans to TotallyNotMark’s latest video, as well as discussing the state of BLEACH haters, and the toxicity of the BLEACH fandom.
Timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
1:09 - TotallyNotMark's History With BLEACH
3:30 - My Critiques of BLEACH & Kubo's Health
11:45 - Why BLEACH Fans Are Jaded...
21:34 - Reaction to TotallyNotMark's BLEACH Review
#BLEACH #Bleach2022 #BleachAnime
People are already making excuses without watching the full video lol.
Damn that’s pretty sad 😢 there not doing that before watching this video
Yeah
Fr 💀
You damn right lmaoo we know we toxic
I find diehard Ichiruki's and also people who hate on Bleach without watching or watching the first arc and dropping the series toxic as hell
After the disrespect Bleach received all these years…the fans have become like a over protective parent 😩
Yeah, we've been made bitter by the barrage of people attacking our personal tastes sadly.
Right
And nobody likes an annoying overprotective parent
@@Elzzaw especially one piece fans on Twitter
people diss bleach? such as?
People seem to forget how much hate Bleach got in its heyday, so yeah fareweather fans are always off putting
I can understand this completely. Enduring years of people want to disqualify it as one of the Big 3 can make you jaded. And then seeing people jump on the bandwagon when they previously bashed it could be infuriating. But we cant kick out people who genuienly want to give it a fair chance. Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt.
DBZimrans " ruined reputation" video was really spot on...
@@machine1685 benefit of the doubt, yes; compete open forgiveness, no.
Now I'm not saying that people saying Bleach isn't for them, as there's no offense, but people who claimed the Bleach was bad, but now say it's good, much contrition is needed.
Facts. I've been a fan since monthly shonen jump, even got the first data book, hell I even like the vampire filler arc. Bleach has that bebop feel of being very heavy so I can see how the mood swings threw some off
I member....
I think people have been "toxic" because of the sudden shift Bleach is getting positively. It's a great thing to see on one hand but throughout the years prior, Bleach was getting basically bullied. From SuperEyePatchedWolfs Bleachs downfall, to the usual "Ichigo is a bad Main Character" comments, and "Bleach should've ended with Aizen", it rubbed people the wrong way. And if you weren't a fan before, it put a target in your back.
Unfortunately people take all stated above too far with their feelings. I love Bleach, I'll defend that shit when needed, but we gotta control ourselves.
But surely a shift in perspective is a good thing. Some critiques for something you love are ok. Not everyone has to love all aspects of something you love. I enjoy bleach, I dislike Ichigo as a MC and that's fine. This is coming from a fairy tail fan and hell if people suddenly started loving it I'd nerd out and welcome them all. More who like what you love then you'll get more of that specific thing as this is all business. Bleach lovers enjoy the time in the sun and don't devolve into a toxic fan base like many before
Exactly. When someone insults a VERY AMAZING underrated anime like bleach and you know that they think they're the smart ones and looking cool, No can't blame us bleach fans for simply correcting their mistake and responding in a similar tone.
@@Aquayoru Did you just call one of the big 3 shounen that dominated an era of fans underrated 😂. Maybe you weren't around then but during its heyday nothing was touching Naruto, one piece or bleach. It does get unnecessary hate now but to call it underrated is just a lie. People called em the big 3 for a reason. That's like saying the Lakers are an underrated basketball team
Edit: for reference bleach has sold over 130 million copies in circulation worldwide as of 2022, making it the 7th best-selling series of all time from Weekly Shōnen Jump.
@@kylekgh you didn't even understand what I meant...
@@kylekgh This is how I see it. Bleach was the first anime I got into, and the first manga I read. The hate it got felt bad when I saw it online, but I love that people are giving it a shot and coming away with positive impressions now. I can't understand being vindictive and trying to getekeep my favorite anime from potential fans, even if they used to be haters.
Every anime fandom is toxic but honestly man, The Bleach community has taken so much shit and hate over the last years (especially after that Supereye patch wolf video) that it’s so unfair, the manga has flaws of course, But at some point being a bleach fan was the same thing of having a target at your back.
So what will it be when the first 2 episodes will air this month?
right, tell a One Peace fan that you don't like their series and see how fast your told you have trash taste, your opinion doesn't matter, and your parents don't love you... There series isn't even disrespected anywhere nearly as much as Bleach is.
no, it really isnt. noone with enough maturity need the validation of any soul on this planet to keep enjoying something they love. you dont need to be super defensive whenever someone dislikes the series, and certainly you dont need to be overly defensive towards equally as toxic people. theres no excuse, no justification, theres is only immaturity when faced with any type of opposition.
@@samuraibeluga3749 Basically
@@aidensnow5017 its also not as good as people make it seem lol its just been going on for so long that its literally become a part of people's identity at this point.
I know why the toxicity exists; Bleach has been called the red headed step child for a long time and other remarks like that make the rounds, etc. I don't agree with the toxicity from the Bleach fans or the toxicity towards the Bleach fans.
The toxicity exists because some people like to shit on others. Period.
@@louisrobitaille5810 to get to the point yes.
@RJ nahh OP fans are the most annoying lol
and now the red headed step child has won the lottery all of a sudden you have all these "friends" and "family" who were mean/rude to u most of ur life, shitting in ur face or behind ur back, and now are all being real nice to u cuz they they think themselves entitled to that money too...
no the toxicity exists cause every fanbase has toxicity it isnt cause people hated it
I love bleach but it does have its flaws however the things I do love in the series outweigh the negative ones. Always love your videos and one of my favorite RUclipsrs! Thank you again for the great content!!
Took the words right out of my mouth 👌
Ppl just love to complain bleach is awesome and every anime,movie etcc.. has flaws nun is perfect
man all animes have some flaws ok not Code Geass but almost all of them Sword art online just another Harem Attack of Titan i dont even know why anyone likes that shit
@@XicorVT code geas got flaws too dont even try tht but yea lol
@@XicorVT you speak facts. Code geass is great and aot is just overrated af
let's be real here, every anime fandom is toxic
Major cap theirs different levels to toxicity
Hunter x hunter dragon ball and one punch man fanboys are by far the most toxic fanbases
@@Daviyah_yisrael OP fandom is the same level of toxic that DB is
@@Daviyah_yisrael he meant in some way most of the people in fandom is toxic in whatever level 🧍♂️
@@BBK113 bleach fandom is slowly getting there if there continue being gatekeepy
@@justtheguywiththewavecheck6244 I'd rather they gatekeep from the people who just hate for the sake of hating than the fanbase just to hate on anything that isn't bleach like the One Piece fandom does because "goda" made the most sold manga of all time
Yeah, let's not Forget Kubo was FORCED to revert Byakuya death because some freaks literally we're sending him death threats over it, and literally stalking him and creeping around his apartment. This is beyond fucked.
Source?
@@lulcy95 There's Interview with Kubo on weekly shonen jump, and he confirmed it. 50th Shueisha anniversary edition.
Wait...stalking him!!! Just for something like this!!!!???
@@KONSACZ is it on twitter or youtube?
Not only him…Isyama gets lots of hate from AOT fans, and poor Togashi. Togashi is sick and ppl are STILL giving him heck about HxH.
Yer damned if you do and yer damned if you don’t.
When is enough, enough? Someone has an idea, they put t on paper and ppl like the idea, they become a fan, then they begin making demands to change what they were a fan of, suddenly not a fan bc everything changed.
I'll just copy+paste my comment from Totally Not Mark's video:
It is of course nice hearing people praise the stories you like, and be disheartened when they are dismissed. Not everyone can like same things as you do, and that's fine.
However, what bothers me typically is when people talk down on things I like for reasons that aren't true or real. I love Bleach and Shield Hero, especially their main characters. It's fine if you don't like them. But if you say they are bad characters because of some false facts, which makes me wonder if we read the same series, I'm going to call you out. Opinions are opinions, but falsehoods aren't opinions.
respect!
The main reason I do not like Ichigo is simply because, speaking from the view of an Anime viewer, I am annoyed at how he's just all the races in the show, Human, Hollow, Shinigami and Quincy. I found that to be pretty bullshit. Also, I think his emotions are pretty one-dimensional and yet somehow still less hot-blooded than other typical shounen protagonists, like for example, when Natsu, Luffy or Naruto gets a rage boost or like angry their friends are hurt, I feel their rage and their need to hurt whoever hurt their friends, like Luffy's walk towards Arlong Park, Naruto's Kyuubi transformation against Pain or Natsu against anyone really.
Now I am not saying that the animes are better or worse, I am just comparing what I felt when I watched them and in terms of protagonists alone, Ichigo is not that good for me. I keep getting the feel like he's being emo or acting cool and doesn't have enough outbursts? He's more like a Sasuke or Grey in terms of personality for me. Maybe he's supposed to be more mature than the regular muscle-brained shounen protagonist but I also don't feel that enough, especially when he fights like them, he rarely uses strategy and gets bailed out by his hack power one time too many for me. I do like the other characters though, Urahara, Kenpachi and even Chad, but Ichigo and Inoue I don't really vibe with.
@@Jay9966 Well he is more of a western (Super)hero than a shounen protagonist (kind of like guts, in a very different way) , given that a lot of Kubo's inspiration comes from western underground music and litterature. And i personally feel like Him being all the races of bleach connect him with his ennemies: the shinigamis of soul society, the hollows of hueco mundo, the fullbringers and quincys. It makes him less detached from the world arround him as he isn't just a shinigami against the completelly alien enemy.
@@Jay9966 Cool story
@@ununun9995 I don't think so, in term of your point of him being part of all races. Especially the hollow part, and it is so damn weird that Quincys are so much different from their original setting, Human bow users that use their arrows to destroy Hollows, don't get me wrong I think the fights in the TYBW arc were cool but I hated that Quincys were the ones to pull it off. Also, despite having all races' powers, Ichigo never actually used them as tools to understand each of the races, especially Hollows and Quincys, his Hollow mask was just a power up and so was his true Bankai. Not only that, connecting Ichigo's power to Yhwach for no reason is also annoying, Uryu should've been the one for that not him, and also, it didn't make sense that his original Shikai and Bankai were NOT Shinigami powers but instead Quincy powers, like does that mean an Espada can also yell "Bankai" and go into their Resurreccion? And that no one, not even Mayuri that dissected Quincys and claimed that he had learned all he needed to about them was unable to tell the difference between a Shinigami and Quincy's power?
Not only that, he never bonded with other races through similarities in power, only through his fights did he bond a bit with Grimmjow and Ulqiorra and those connections were forged through battle, not because they share some Hollow powers.
I think it’s just that we’ve waited and endured the mocking for this long it kinda hits different when some that used to slander Bleach try and slither they’re way in
It’s not gate keeping. It’s exposing fake hypocrites
Exactly
Yea pretty much
Trueeeeee
What's hypocritical? Do people have to be die hard fans of a series to review it?
@@KirinDave no they don't. Kids are gonna be kids. Don't expect them to make sense lol
As a Bleach fan, I can confidently say that the toxic fans aren’t the majority.
They’re just the loudest.
It's funny Bleach gets disrespected by so many people on the daily and when Bleach fan's clap back suddenly we're toxic it's hilarious how that works
Shows how fucking weak modern society is
u clearly didn't watch the video
Ikr
@@D_OwoIt's a whole video. That's like a long time.
@@evoxghiretti if u can’t bother to watch the video then I see no reason as to why u have to complain in the comments
DBZimran and MrTommo 🔛🔝
You’re a person of good taste
@@BardockObama5 Why thank you
Both are goated!
@RJ great guy and great bleach fan but honestly he is more of a OP channel
@RJ You're right
It's the "the art had declined" line critics give that gets me. I mean, are we looking at the same manga written and drawn by Kubo?
The art declined? Did they read the first hundred or so chapters of the manga or not!?
Personally, I think Mark is genuinely giving it a second chance but he shouldn't be surprised about being called out from what he said and then start praising it when the anime is only a month away.
Why though? Isn't it just logical for him to give the series another try when everyone else is hyping up the revival of the anime? Like if I hadn't already finished it years ago and only stopped at the anime or didn't even finish the anime, now would be the time I would even try to pick it back up though?
To little to late
Bleach fans stay defending bs.
@@Jay9966 Logical to get those views and money
@@GammaRingHunter So he shouldn't make a video about his experience and make money with his job just because toxic fans are salty?
“Bleach fans are toxic”
DB fans running to tell you that you’re favorite anime is trash and Goku solos the verse: 🏃🏼♂️💨
I think all anime fandoms are pretty toxic 🤣
This video is an example of why I consider DBZimran the top Bleach content creator....in depth analysis, well thought out points and, most importantly, the ability to look at things thru an objective lens.....keep doing what you do, I'm looking forward to your analysis of the upcoming chapters and your take on the new anime
Saw this comment under a video about bleaches foreshadowing, the person complained about putting such nuances in the series and why not just tell people. And this really shows how SOME people talk about not wanting stories to be spoon fed to them but still on the level where they need everything to be explained to them.
100% agree. Being Bleach fan was the equivalent of a death sentence in the anime community in the late 2000's/early 2010's.
God forbid you like Bleach more than DBZ, FMA, OP, Naruto etc...
Those of us who actually enjoyed Bleach were always defending ourselves and being told " it's ok to have bad taste. Someone has to keep them employed".
Just like back then it was almost a taboo to like anime in general. Those that liked anime (and stated so publicly) were regarded as weird, needs, geeks. We were put into the undesirable categories because of our passions. Now, it seems like everyone watches anime and it feels almost like a trend.
"Bleach is the weakest of the Big 3"
Idk, out of the Big 3, Bleach has a better technical grasp of the narrative and story. Bleach's story seems more well thought out than the others, with revelations like Zangetsu being H.Ichigo being foreshadowed as early as Ichigo's very first fight with Renji. As a whole, I like the story of Bleach the best because the writing to me is the strongest and more well thought out than the other 3.
But hey, if Iearned anything about the anime/manga community as a whole it's that the majority lacks reading comprehension. Like, you can really tell who reads a chapter once and that's it, when you rarely are able to pick up everything on the first sitting. Bleach's story really flourishes upon multiple read throughs. You miss on small and subtle clues and hints laid out by Kubo. But nah, people skip doing book reports in school but want their critical opinion on literature to be taken seriously. Lol.
Bleach is the best Shonen and a utter masterpiece imo. Its complexity and depth amazes me unlike any anime/manga. Also the badass and epic nature just solidifies it for me. There are few anime/manga I would put up next to Bleach in my personal opinion.
Idk Man. Not all people have to be Genue critics to have opinion they want to share.
I get your point, and you're right when people try present opinion as facts.
But what if it just opinion ?
"Bleach is the weakest of big 3"
If its opinion then thats just that.
Also this short sentence may mean many things when it is just that.
It may mean that someone didn't liked it as much as naruto.
Or according to him bleach is less intresting as story than other two, to him.
So its a normal thing.
I would say people have to be more precise and cerfull when they chose to share opinion. Coz by doing that they invite you to discussion.
People should be clear about whan they want to say. And people who respond should adress that opinion without attaching to it some hidden meaning that may not be here.
But humans are emotional beings afterall, and i think its hard to hold back when you have your own interpretation of someones opinion instead of seeing it for what it is. Thats all my opinion of course.
According to you what should person do to be able to share criticism ?
What with sharing opinion?
For example if you write review thats includes criticism should you be objective? Coz review is subjective by nature.
Don’t tell me OP isn’t thought out. Excellent world building and story progression.
@@obinator9065 This is exactly what I'm talking about when I talk about the average anime/manga fans reading comprehension. I said nothing about One Piece not being thought out. I didnt say that, although I will say One Piece's world building and writing are overrated. It's good, sure. But not as good as people would have you believe.
I'm not saying One Piece isnt thought out. But theres elements in the story that stands out to being last second additions or just plain come out of no where. For example, Gear Second and Third just...happened. No explanation of when Luffy learned them. He just got em. Just like Asura and Diamble Jambe. On the world building aspect, you mean to tell me that Zoro is the ONLY person aiming for Mihawk? No one else in the world is aiming for that title? On top of that, the other Supernovas are Supernovas because the story says so. What has Kidd and Law done of note? What effect have they had on the world that warrants that title? The world and story circulates too much around the Strawhats and their friends.
Story progression is okay, but I also have issue with it. Some of the arcs are incredibly formulaic, being able to fall into specific arc boxes that the series recycles. Then theres the fake out deaths of the crewmates that everyone knows arent going to stick.
I love One Piece. I own all 4 manga boxsets. But the series is incredibly overhyped. It has its fair share of flaws and contrivances that gets ignored by fans at large.
@@dark-xh7fs I think theres a difference between "Bleach is the weakest of the big 3" and "I think/feel that Bleach is one of the Big 3."
When it comes to being a critic and reviewing something, you need to be able to balance objectivity with subjectivity. If a series you like does something bad, being objective would be pointing out the flaws (objective flaws in this instance would be plot holes and inconsistencies). For example, if I was to do a review of Bleach, a series I love, I would point out how Byakuya not having his haori would be inconsistent with later interpretations. Is it a big deal? No. But it IS inconsistent.
Using One Piece, Luffy's Gear 3rd had the flaw of shrinking his body. It was a cool drawback that he loses in the timeskip. I prefer it with a draw back, but that's subjective. If I'm being impartial, I cant let my personal taste dictate the overall quality of the story I'm critiquing.
"Gear 3rd is better with draw backs" comes off as I'm trying to pass it as a fact, when its not. Same applies for "Bleach is the weakest of the big 3." If you say that, I'm going to expect evidence based on objectivity. But if you think/feel it's the weakest and preference your argument with that, I cant refute or rebuke it. Only ask for your rationale.
Even with it's flaws and how rushed the ending was, Bleach has always been my favorite of the big 3. I didn't even realize that the series was so dogged on until recently. I had read through to the end of the series and patiently hoped the anime would one day finish, then heavily got into the community after the anime was confirmed to be returning thanks to channels like this and MrTommo.
I'm so glad to see this video pop up. I always knew you would stick up for Mark after that unwarranted controversy. Bleach fans need to be less paranoid and not try to conjure up bad narratives to demonize influencers who want to get into Bleach, especially when Mark never called Bleach trash and just suddenly pretended to be a Bleach fan all along because it's convenient now. He's simply giving it another go, and the timing of the review series is the only ammo the gatekeepers can use against him, which doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.
There have been fakesters on the internet, but Mark isn't one of them.
Thank you so much for this video.
It's so interesting how he offered up a preemptive defense of himself warning fans to be nice, and that lead directly to some LOUD fans not being very nice at all.
Humans are sadly predictable.
I mean, can you blame them? Bleach's series and community has been getting bullied almost as much as the DB community only difference being DB fans getting bullied makes way more sense as that community is far more toxic than a nuclear weapon testing site. Bleach fans on the other hand have been getting lambasted for decades just for simply existing and the series has been getting negative videos because people are either too stupid or too lazy to understand the undertone layers of Bleach's story. All of a sudden Bleach is getting positivity and it only makes sense that now, only now, that Bleach is FINALLY getting ANYTHING positive towards its light of course those constantly abused fans are going to get a little stir crazy once perceived negativity shows up again. Not justifying anything, I've got no love for any fandom or community these days in general, I'm just saying I get where they're coming from. For me personally, Bleach is gonna get bashed regardless if the anime is actually good or not. It's tradition by people that are, again, either too lazy or too stupid to understand the depth of Bleach's undertones are going to trash on the series. It's sorta tradition in the anime community at this point. It's a stigma Bleach fans are just gonna have to live with. Which is why I don't care about other people's opinions or views on a series. I just wait for new content and deem for myself it it's good or bad. The only thing I want is for Tite Kubo to succeed and make money. He deserve is more than most mangaka authors that's for damn sure.
same.
Kubo needs more name, fame & money.
How he conncected the story, he deserves what he should get and much more.
Yes you can blame them
@@KiwiHavok777
No you really can’t.
@@truthcrusader360 yes you can
@@donzzeee2317
That’s just willful ignorance then.
Bleach Fans: "We've been mocked about Bleach's return for 10 years. People calling the series trash by hearing false information online. I'm just so sick of it."
Me being a Bleach and Ichihime Fan for 15 years: "Hold my beer!"
I personally have 0 tolerance for any toxic fans in any media, and while I understand that the Bleach fandom has reasons to be defensive, since for years the manga and anime, Kubo, and us the fans have been the punching bag of the anime community as a whole. That's still no excuse to be shitty towards anyone, if people who were critical or dismissive of Bleach (or any media) wants to give it another chance for whatever reason, that's great, even better if they do end up liking Bleach.
Agreed 100%, but I'd be a little more reluctant to accept someone who bashed bleach without any real reason like eyepatch wolf. People like Mark don't fall into that category, people need to understand that difference.
@@divijkhaitan1619 eyepatch wolf really left a bad taste in that vid
@@Ajuicy twice
@@divijkhaitan1619 I get it, I'm pretty jaded myself and yes, the complete 180 from "the worst of the Big 3" to "TYBW HYPE!" by the anime community is frankly obnoxious and disingenous, but I'm also so tired of the cycle of "Twitter discourse". And not just from Bleach.
@@ununun9995 oh yeah forgot he deleted the first
Honestly considering the amount of slander the bleach fans had and still have to go through, I can’t even exactly blame some of the protective bleach fans or the toxic ones, sorry that’s just how I see it this wouldn’t have started if people weren’t so relentlessly hating on the series/fans, spreading constant misinformation and also antagonizing the community. The gate keeping of the anime is quite understandable the more you think about it, i’m not saying it’s right but it’s understandable. In my opinion go watch or read bleach if you want to get into the series, but in my other opinion if you’re someone who’s hated on the series for absolute no reason and no valid points while also antagonizing the community, and just riding the hype train for clout or being on the bandwagon, than you can stay the fuck away from our anime/manga and out of our community cause in that case we will gate keep
💯💯💯
the ammount of apologetics in this comment section is staggering and frankly dissapointing. who cares about how much slander bleach got? why in the holy fuck do you need validation of ANYONE? for years bleach got shit on and bleach fans knew to keep themselves mostly on their lane and for the most part not engage in pointless wars, only now with the resurgence of the anime you see a surge of toxicity from our side, shitting on other series, and becoming aggressively defensive and gatekeeping. toxic behavior should not be excused, period. toxicity is EXPECTED unfortunately, but it is not understandable or welcomed. like do you have magnifying glass on peoples minds or keep a tab on every single person that has trashed on the series to be able to determine that the same people that were once hating it are now hyped? or could it be that the surge could be just people who when the series was off air, went away, and now return with the new announcement. like aside from individuals, you cant really determine that as a whole. why would you be mad for people adding to the hype? even if their motivations arent out of love, wich again you cant determine for sure, they are spreading positivity for it, not negativity, so now only "true bleach fans can hype the return? it feels like you just want to keep bleach niche, because that will preserve your sense of feeling special.
@@samuraibeluga3749 seriously dude. I never even knew bleach got this much hate. I watched it when I was a kid-teen. I didn't engage in discussions online nor did I really even care about bad things said about it whenever I heard it. People act like they've kept those negative comments or criticisms inside of them. Like they've made it a part of themselves. Like they've allowed it to fester in them and create a complex. IT'S JUST CRITICISM, AND TOWARDS AN ANIME. How do people act like their anger is justified by that? When they've allowed themselves to be mentally infiltrated by simple words online. You don't identify as a fan of bleach, like you've imparted a section of your being into a fandom. You're a person, a human. That's unhealthy. It's a Shonen Anime. A cool work of fiction. Be a fan, but don't be so engrossed, to the point you act like you're entitled to this piece of fiction.
Seriously. Have these people heard of the phrase, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me." They shouldn't even hurt you in the first place. Sure, you're a part of the fandom but grow some thick skin or be more open-minded and learn to stop being so offended.
People can't even make criticisms of the episodes without first saying "I love bleach, don't get me wrong." If they don't include that, they just get downvoted a ton.
I love Bleach but I'm still going to point out or notice, address/discuss things I find iffy or not to *my liking*. But people don't understand that. They think if you love something, it has to be a 10/10. Like, there's no room for criticism. I Love Bleach but I'd say it's a solid 7, maybe 7.5/10(the older Bleach). Not *everything* about it has to be a 10/10 in your mind for you to love it.
sheesh.
@@Divionist it wasnt simple criticism all the time. there was legitimate unwarranted hate coming preety much every single week on comment sections on chapters, especially in the last arc.
but generally yeah, the bleach fandom has over the years made their martyrdom their identity, and quite frankly its what drove me from engaging with it as much as i used to. it gets sickening after a while.
not only that but it kinda has become a bit too cultish to my taste. a loooot of people just treating kubos word and decision making like its the bible. now its common to dismiss any criticism towards the anime as "kubo is on the helm, this is the way he intended" as if hes actually making every single decision there, and as if his word is absolute and no criticism can be directed at it just because hes involved.
im seeing a lot of the complete opposite of the spectrum where people just blindly praise and treat criticism as a form of hate, when in reality its actually a form of showing how much you like something, its because i like the manga so much the way it is that i dont want to see things removed, or that i want the anime to make impactful moments, actually impactful, for example.
i engaged with the community in the first two episodes, i have stopped since. just been enjoying the anime so far on my own. i have fun either way, dont need people to validate my opinions anyway.
@@samuraibeluga3749 I see. Even so, people that are letting those toxic comments directed towards a work of fiction, be ingrained into themselves to the point of saying something along the lines of "My over-defensiveness is justified" don't realize how mentally weak they are when they say that. Again, they're making this a part of themselves when it was really something Kubo made for everyone to enjoy and view. They've essentially made it personal when it wasn't supposed to be personal. i.e., gatekeeping.
Just let the nay-sayers say their piece.
Just let the fire the trolls tried to start, die out.
Just let there be differing opinions in the comments section. It's a comment section for crying out loud. You don't have to influence every comment with your presence; an upvote/downvote or a reply.
If you are going to engage in one of those, types of comments, "engage to disengage."
It's disappointing seeing every unpopular opinion(comments that aren't praising the anime) on the anime site I watch get downvoted, seeing them get replies that tell them they're wrong and seeing people acting out defensively like someone's insulted someone dear to them, or being offended in place of Kubo.
People need to learn to use the word, "Whatever" more. Maybe not out loud, but in their minds. You're neither submitting nor defending. You're acknowledging but also dismissing. Or just say you agree to disagree. And if they don't then just say whatever.
But yeah, I've also stopped after the 2nd ep.
I'm not the type to be bothered by "negative" comments towards an anime I enjoy, but when I do see these "negative" comments and their replies and downvotes and the upvotes for the people calling out that negative comment... It's just disappointing.
By, "Negative" you know; Criticism, nitpicking.
Even when there's a toxic comment. People just feel the need to engage.
We have the power to block. the Power to block a user. If someone toxic has an aim of garnering attention, don't even downvote them to give them recognition. Again, we have the power to BLOCK users(at least in disqus). Just block these actual toxic people. But, no. People would rather gang up on them, tell em they're wrong, give them attention, feel good about how right they are, and how utterly wrong this troll or toxic person is. Take out some of their frustration and even develop more frustration because of this. And in the end. It's come to this. These gate-keepers who say their actions are justified. I'm sure Kubo would feel mixed feelings about how his fans have slandered Bleach(at least in the west). He would feel grateful for how loyal and defensive they are; the opposite as well.
If you notice, weekly breaks are far more common for weekly mangakas in recent years. JJK had a month break. Black Clover had a 3 month break before beginning their final arc. Oda took many through the final chapters in Wano
In my experience Bleach fans aren't that toxic compared to other shounen fandoms. Usually they're a bit touchy and defensive when it comes to criticism but it's understandable due to the undeserved hate Bleach gets.
Some fans will completely dismiss or rationalize any criticism but honestly I've seen worse if we're talking toxic fandoms
I agree bleach got shit on for no real reason hell when Naruto was ending how story became ninja Jesus an alien moon rabbit just pop out nowhere somehow bleach last arc still bad? What there some flaws but it didn't go full naruto
@@gamercow4297 that's why it's unfair and I completely understand bleach fans
@@gamercow4297 what u essentially did was oversimplify the naruto part lmao ur acting like it was some kind of asspull when it rlly wasn't if u payed attention u would know that it was foreshadowed since pre time sip naruto so idk what ur on abt when u say 'it didn't go full naruto' as if bleach didn't have more flaws then naruto
I do see why they get so defensive but as someone who hates toxic fanboys I can't really say that the bleach fanboys for being toxic is justified.
@@Godzilla-jr5gi toxic is toxic tho
I remember taking major issue with the way Kubo used empty space in his paneling towards the end of the seriese and being really disappointed that every week i'd wait with such high anticipation for 15-18 pages that were mostly white space. it really left me with a bad taste after having followed the series for so long. after a few years i came back and re-read the series and somehow everything kind of clicked in my mind and now i have such huge respect for Kubo's artistic choices at the end and how beautifully he used the emptiness to emphasize what was taking place in the moment.
Kubo unfortunately was in a bad state during the tybw but art wise I definitely couldn't tell
So glad someone is talking about this. I put in a comment about being a new fan and being frustrated seeing all the hate and feeling bad for the older fans how have been shit on over and over. I like Mark but this makes bleach fans seem like the bad guys when it's totally not true.
Let me tell that if Mark decided to not put his "message to anime community" at the end of his video this situation would look much less toxic ;)
Bro as new fan you are lucky you never got deal with shit like old fan man everyone shit on us
@@gamercow4297 I know that's why I'm annoyed at Mark because I read it in like June and just saw how much hate it was getting and I was like wtf? Then I saw it was going on for like 10 years. Bleach fans got shit on for no reason and no are made out to be toxic when they experienced the toxicity of the whole anime community.
I'm glad people are finding and falling in love with the series. Makes a long time fan like me happy. But Yea we've had to deal with so much shit from the general anime community that it shouldn't be a surprise if we're a little prickly and clap back at people back peddling now just to jump on the hype band wagon. There's giving an anime a chance and watching it due to the hype and as a content creator suddenly doing a 180 on your views as a content creator just to get hype views. The majority of anime media consumers fall in the first category by a large margin.
@@thelostone2694 That's not true lol. This didn't stem from his video because the backlash came before the review even came out.
Well... I'm going to be honest. I'm supposedly one of these *"toxic"* Bleach fans but I'll explain below. Bleach hasn't been the most popular of the big 3 (well in the West Bleach is more popular than One Piece) so it gets a lot of flack. You'll usually see even on the Bleach chapter reviews some hate comments about the material or Kubo himself. I was one of the fans defending Bleach if it is justified looking at it both sides.
As soon as the anime ended, *EVERYONE* was saying Bleach ended/got canceled because of the low TV ratings and declining popularity due to how bad it was. It was never coming back... or it should have ended with Aizen (I'm sure Bleach fans have seen these comments). I retaliated by saying based on the sources, the anime caught up with the manga and a filler was recently made 17 episodes ago so it would be a waste of resources. Leaving it on hiatus was the best option. I got laughed at being called delusional or a Bleachtard for saying such things. I was debating so many people on SuperEyePatch's "The Fall of Bleach" regarding how wrong he was on certain scenarios and the people there were just showing ignorance calling me a fanboy. When the manga ended abruptly, Bleach was constantly getting picked on and we fans just held on with hope.
*Fast forward 10 years later:*
Bleach is back... and suddenly these people are acting like they've been a fan despite saying otherwise or showed no attention to it.
As a writer and someone with general poor health, the fact Kubo had a torn shoulder for the last year is…disheartening.
Here is a conjecture. There is no general, ‘good’, reason for fans to engage in para-social, honestly glass-house nitpicking critiques. Weekly Serialization is just tough. No ifs ands or buts. I personally love Weekly Shonen the most serialized and lengthy genre.
And the industry is killing manga artists. Its is a 70+ hour workweek and it is often tedious yet meticulous. Any break could impact Serialization. In fact, I sometimes contrast Kubo to Oda who has taken regular breaks and is basically working 19 hours a day,
I mean, I love manga. I have a Shonen Jump subscription and I read alot, not just manga. I love reading.
But if we have to sacrifice a shoulder tendon, one mans way of life or the overall artistic fatigue of the story, is it really a sustainable and ethical model for mangaka?
I don’t think so. And yes, you know what Imran. I absolutely think the Manga is much better in my opinion. I think the anime tainted my opinion on overall pacing as I was overly critical of aspects that really are not meant to be there. It has some great moments when it adapts panel to panel, and imo it has the best music. I love Shiro Sagisu, he also did music for one of other my favorite shonen, Magi.💜
I am a firm believer the original work is almost always better. Adaptations are hard, but I think great ones are notabley rare. Especially since I am a fantasy and sci fi reader, and I can get stuff like the Wheel of Time Amazon Series, which is okay (good in some parts, but it changed and streamlined stuff.) but also the Expanse, (which is great, but not much different in some areas and streamlined for the better then others from the original books, which I own.)
Because of course it is. It is an adaptation. But sometimes, I think we really should treat the whole process more as a ‘copy and paste’ while following adding less is more. I actually love some of the filler and some movies. I still think Bleach has among the best worldbuilding and power systems even if I think the filler, while sometimes fun reallllly pushed my patience of the series. (I think I sort of like Amagi, loved the Second and Third Movies….I know, I am contrarian 😉 but honestly everything else was tiring. Bounts were key to me. Interesting in concept, but it dragged when It felt like it split attention away from my glorious god and savior, Aizen-sama.)
Finally, yeah it had its issues, but I blame the industry and the organization in general. Without Regular breaks and health maintenance makes me worry Kubo cooould be the next Miura if the industry doesn’t wisen up to the fragility of human life. I mean, for god’s sake, the overall industry needs to change.
After years of being mocked and Bleach regarded as the inferior of the SJ's big trio, I can totally understand how Bleach fans can point out harshly the hipocrisy of the ones who bashed Bleach in the past and now are doing the opposite, since Bleach is now in spotlights again. Some dishes are best served cold, if you get my point. it's not okay for me, sometimes people do exaggerate, but it's well deserved. Still, all I hope everyone gets aboard the train, get along and watch together the last arc. There's a lot to love in Bleach, and if Bleach deserve a second chance, so does the "haters".
Now that I've actually watched the *entire video before commenting* here's my opinion. The problems with the reception of bleach stem from several issues. 1: Bleach was featured on adult swim and not Cartoon Network or tunami. Obviously madimg it harder for younger and casual fans to watch the anime. 2: Unlike Naruto's continuation through Naruto shippuden, It's been years and years since we've Gotten the more mature and brutal continuation of the story. Let's be real, we have original naruto, naruto shippuden and boruto naruto next generations and over 1000 episodes of One Piece. 3: Shonen Jump and it's crushing pressure on Kubo almost destroyed bleach. They could have had a much better product if they had treated Kubo with some sense of humanity instead of the famous Japanese work pressure. Japan has even invented a term for being worked to death "karoshi".
The final arc being animated will hopefully solve the issues. Let's hope we get weekly episodes and simulcast. Or bleach will never have been given a fair chance.
To me, the Bleach fandom has become the epitome of those anime fans who say "You can't like anime because it's mainstream now. You're not an anime fan unless you got bullied for wearing a Naruto headband to school!" and it's sad that creators like Clyde and Jaymes have perpetuated this idea that Mark is only doing it for clout or because its the new hotness.
It's funny how the series has been disrespected by literally everyone and the moment we get defensive because we've stayed in the shadows for so long and are happy the bleach anime is returning we get slack for it, absolutely ridiculous lmfao 🤣
I enjoyed Mark's review overall. He's very fair as a reviewer, so I wouldn't hold it against him if later on he doesn't enjoy somethings to the same degree.
I understand the fandoms "protectiveness" or "gatekeeping" after all, Bleach has been the punchingbag of the animanga community for many years and alot of people have had to deal with their series being piled on, slandered and have disinformation spread and regurgitated year after year.
I think its important to be kind and allow people to have a change of heart or give things a second chance. I for example didn't like One Piece when I was 12, the 4kids version of it was way too corny even for my 12 year old self. But I came back and give it a second chance through the manga many years later as an adult and totally fell in love wit it.....so people opinions or taste can change. What they may have disliked years ago, they could end up enjoying viewing it through different lens or in a different headspace.
There are just certain people like forneverworld who justifiably deserve all of the backlash and hate for making Bleach content.
he is a bleach fan he was reviewing the series every week when it came out lol
@@driplord7286 Please introduce me to the rock you've been hiding under.
@@MrInternetMan not hiding under a rock when the anime first stopped streaming in 2012 in his videos he was praising TYBW advocating that the anime needs to come back immediately he’s a bleach fan
@@driplord7286 He's a bleach fan? Don't make me laugh.
@@MrInternetMan it would seem I’m under the same rock. what he do?
I have not watched the video, I don't intend to watch it right now but since I got the notification so I might as well say this. Yes, a ton of bleach fans (including myself) can be toxic, but deservedly so. I have watched this series that I love so, so dearly with all my heart get trashed, laughed and made a mockery of consistently throughout the years.
But now that the anime gets the chance we all knew it deserved, a ton of the people who actively trashed on bleach just get to have a 'sudden change of mind' and we are not allowed to call them out on it? I dunno, it just doesn't sit well with me.
this. just this. is it so bad if we call them out for their hipocresy? i don't understand.
Bad take in this case. If you think in the course of like 10 years, your opinion can't change, then you're just close minded and being a gatekeeper for a show you claim to love.
even if they change their minds, it doesnt really matter the reason to me, i prefer that change instead of speaking crap about a series other people may like. also they can dislike the series at the start, after all bleach changes its tome significantly after ichigo loses his substitute soul reaper powers.
@@Fro00ot0 Oh believe me, I love Bleach more than you can imagine. Enough to have a full sleeve dedicated to Bleach alone.
We got this far without them. As a matter of fact, we got this far with them constantly shitting on us.
I struggle to see how it can be good for Bleach to let the same people who shat on it on a daily basis also benefit from it.
“Deservedly so” doesn’t sit right with me. Is there ever a justified reason to be toxic?
A series having a formula isn't a bad thing too. This is why structure exist. One huge counterpoint to this is One Piece. One Piece, outside of minor cases is a formulaic series with a repetitive structure, but it's still considered an enjoyable series. In fact, a lot of ongoing narratives follow a structure for their arcs but it's curious that Bleach is regarded negatively as a repetitive series because of one arc that was a mirror by design while the contents of this arc is ignored.
I think its more if the same narrative beats are repeated. Persok is kidnapped, training segment, cold and heartless enemy is shown and foreshadowed to have a human side at the end, savage enemy to fight half way through, transformation is unlocked to beat the final enemy. I can see why bleachs formula is hated on but I still enjoy it
@@Mr.Murphy2802 that isn't Bleach's formula though. Only Orihime and Rukia have been kidnapped. The Xcution Arc has none of this, and what happens in Quincy Arc was done willingly and wasn't a kidnapping. The training and transformation segments are just post-dragonball era classic shonen.
Bleach's main constant outside of the guaranteed shonen format of training and transformation is that Soul Society will be the cause of the issue and you're guaranteed to meet an organisation of people loosely based on an existing culture, and that Mayuri will always find a new way to troll everyone and still come out on top.
There is nothing unique about any fanbase regarding "toxicity". All fan bases have a vocal minority what people deem to be "toxic".
It’s just that those people tend to be the loudest
I find so funny that with the comeback of the anime a lot of people is giving a second chance and seeing how unfair was the criticism. It’s all about narrative.
Which is crazy cuxx I watched bleach way late and loved it (anime only) so i nvr understand the hate
I think that's normal. People taste may change with time.
Anime return is just the trigger i think.
It been a painful decade of the Bleach slender, but doesn’t excuse for ANYONE to come after anybody for trying to give praise and support for the series that we love. Let people give Bleach a second shot. Yes, there’s fake people who bash the series and now saying they highly recommend it. But now we’re finally getting positively and it feels so refreshing. Bleach fans… We have to be open for people to get into the series rather they’re old or new.
The hard thing for me is that there was definitely a point where I loved Bleach and found it the best of the big 3. It was right when I’d really tired of filler and switched to manga for a lot of stories.
Over time what wore on me was just the cycle of new character designs that felt more design than character. Bleach is far from alone in this, but each group felt a little less defined. I’ve also felt that way about the background complaint. Less the actual background art but each new world explored feels increasingly empty to me and with it, the characters that inhabit them are harder to care about.
I personally lost interest somewhere in the middle of the last arc. I kind of bled out my interest during the Fullbring arc, but the mortal wound for me was the Aizen fight. I’d spent so long wondering how Ichigo would avoid the hypnosis and when it’s used in the fake town so beautifully I was ready for something really clever, but instead it’s just a new monster form vs a new super form finisher and done.
And yet, I get why people love Bleach. It’s so so cool and iconic and easy to dream about beyond the confines of the story itself. Its worth loving for the aesthetic and characters alone, even if for me, the story wasn’t enough to carry me across the finish line.
Not to kick someone while he's down, but I feel Super Bunny Hop shouldn't talk about Bleach anymore, not even on Twitter. He has done so much damage and even though he apologized, it would be better for him just not to talk about it anymore. Mark is a different story imo. SBH turned people toxic, not Mark. I personally re-watched all of Bleach a month ago without the filler arcs and I found myself binge watching it again. Can't wait for TYBW.
Anyone can share their opinion. Fuck censorship.
@@Fro00ot0 Only governments can censor. The rest is agenda or opinion. Bunnyhop spread factually wrong information about the decline of Bleach that partially caused this "toxic attitude" due to people defending Bleach. I'm not for censorship; I'm just saying Bunnyhop is not a credible source anymore and anything he says of Bleach should be taken with a huge grain of salt. The attitude of dogpiling on Bleach was partially cause by Bunnyhop and now the TYBW anime is coming we see these heel-turn-face attitudes.
@@Exciya Sure, but not giving people a chance to change their opinions over time like Super Eyepatch wolf has is also awful, and discouraging him to speak is textbook censorship.
Also, is Bunnyhop a second channel of his or something? Or do you have the wrong person there?
@@Fro00ot0 No I'm talking about SBH and this entire comment is just my opinion. I don't feel every comment needs to be started with "this is just my opinion, but", but maybe it should considering your reaction.
@@Exciya no I just think in the long term. People vote in government officials and wanting to silence a person bc of a mistake theyve owned up to and tried to repent for is a new thing bc of social media and i dont like it personally. Also, it was super eyepatch wolf not bunnyhop that made the fall of bleach video, and the man credited for its bad reputation nowadays. Its telling you dont even know the name of the channel, i doubt youve watched the video in that case.
I had no problem with Mark trying out Bleach again, I watched his video and it's very good imo. Not because it's overwhelmingly positive, but because he really did put in the work and did his research right to be as thorough and fair as possible. (although it was a lil' bit recap-y at times)
But I gotta be honest, that SuperEyePatchWolf tweet to Mark ticked me off.
After all he did, once AGAIN, he just couldn't help himself but to double down on "Bleach falls off" in his tweet.
At least this time he did make it clear it was his opinion, but it still looked A LOT like he was fishing for Mark's validation on that opinion and he wasn't really allowing Mark to go in blind without preconceived notions.
Love your content, and I know you have at least some degree of respect for SEW now, but I really didn't like his apology video (it really wasn't genuine at all) and now he does this... Sorry, but to me he's still a hack.
The thing I love about Mark’s content the most is that it’s always clear everything he says is his own thoughts and not something he’s been stirred on to believe. When he first said he was reviewing Naruto, I’ll admit I was about as anxious as everyone is now with him reviewing Bleach. Naruto is a series with characters and themes that mean a lot to me, and I already knew the general consensus within the anime community about how they perceived it, and was worried that Mark would follow suit with the same opinions. Of course it still would’ve been his opinion and I would’ve respected that, but I had really wanted him to like this series. When he did finish it, almost everything about his review surprised me. I was particularly nervous about how he’d interpret the Indra and Ashura stuff, worrying that he’d say the typical “Neji was right” thing I head way too often, but no. He had his own take, and I couldn’t have been happier.
I think what I’m trying to get at is that Bleach fans should be in for a good time with Mark’s reviews. His thoughts are always 100% his and he tries his best to be as elaborate with his criticism when needed.
The first 3 minutes of your video should have been answer enough. Mark has a history of saying he’s not interested in bleach. But now when comes time for bleaches resurgence he makes a review series to capitalize on the hype like a lot of RUclipsrs. He didn’t seem to like it then, but does videos now when it’s profitable, even if he has done videos on the Big 3. Yes bleach isn’t perfect. Yes bleach has toxic fans. But let’s keep it one thousand about everyone’s motives here.
jaded watch the section about bleach fans being jaded lol
@@DBZimran and by the way I’m not knocking mark for making the series. I think it’s good for new bleach fans and a way to get them caught up with the existing anime story before the tybw comes out. But it does just seem like a smart business move on top of the actual hood thing about the series.
Bleach is the least toxic fandom I ever saw! Even in twitter which is a complete hub of toxicity
I never saw many Bleach fans arguing about some stuff
It's always onepiece or Attack on titan fans arguing
Bullshit
I think We kinda traumatized after so much people shitting on the series without even paying attention to Its peak writting moments.
Like, I can't help but getting a bit salty when I see someone saying "Ichigo has no goal like Naruto" or "Writting in bleach is dogshit... cool fights tho" or "Ichigo's transformations are all asspulls with no build up" lmao. Criticizing is one thing, but people claiming things that are straight up not true is what personally pisses me off.
No way I'm harassing someone for not enjoying the series though, that's for sure.
You know when I was watching Totally not Mark in 2022.I began to love watching his videos especially on Naruto and I gotta say the youtuber was amazing at it but what I didn't notice was that the Man had been told by his fans to make a review about Bleach even though he has never really liked the anime,so with that logic.I always assumed that Mark did not care about the series since he only watched 35 episodes of the series.But in the due time as he was making his videos I got a breath of revelation that someone among the youtubers,the diamond in the rough actually likes Bleach.Which got me happy and it solidifies the unnecessary hate that it got just from existing.Knowing for well that no one understands what makes the series iconic.But enoughs enoughs about peak or should have ended instead of fighting among ourselves we should be praying for Kubos Health and his determination to push the series to its end in Hopes that Bleach will get the love and respect it deserves.Now!!! Who's with Me.
I don't know what it is, but almost all the videos you present as analysis of character's, and even this video talking about Tite Kubo, I kinda get emotional lol 😆 you manage to target some emotional soft spot and in turn make your videos genuinely high value. I appreciate your enthusiasm.
Being a Bleach fan back then really made me keep it low profile since people only focused on the first arc then called the rest of the story trash. Some of the fan bases are disgusting but they expected us to be nice now that it's coming back in october
Never understood Bleach falling off after SS arc. Like Arrancar saga is my fav. It might be unpopular opinion but to me, Arrancar arc is where Kubo's unique storytelling shines the most. SS arc, while I enjoyed it very much, always felt as a setup arc from Kubo where he is trying his hands on how he want to write and panel. After it, Arrancar arc, Fullbring and TYBW just turn it up to max with Kubo feeling super comfortable with getting good in paneling, artstyle, narrative and character writing.
We should never gatekeep anyone from the series. As much as it sucks that we've took so much crap as Bleach fans over the years, gatekeeping people from the series is just gonna harm Bleach in the long run. Yeah, the fakers (not saying Totally Not Mark is one) hopping on the bandwagon for RUclips profit sucks, BUT, if it brings in more fans I can overlook it. At the end of the day, my love for Bleach is stronger.
Whether someone is a casual, hardcore or diehard fan of the series, as long as Bleach thrives, that's all that matters.
I'm happy Mark is giving the series I love a second chance. I always liked the anime despite its flaws, but going back and (re)reading the manga made me love it even more. I really liked the parallels Mark drew between Dragonball and Bleach, because both are such easy reads, for me.
It saddens me to hear Kubo went through so much adversity with his physical and mental health. It's why I don't get onto Togashi for going on long hiatuses. When your body passes its prime, it's always gonna be difficult if not near-impossible to sustain the gruelling, torturous schedule of Weekly Shounen Jump
atleast BLEACH fans are the least toxic TBH
Yeah that's isn't an excuse mate.
Nah
@@lucky4d725 I agree...but just dont take anything seriously...everyone has diff opinions....
@@harisharvind7118 don't say to me mate but to the toxic fans. I don't care about others opinions when it comes to entertainment media as long as it's not toxic.
@Xbox One read my comment again. Saying other fandoms are toxic is not an excuse. Literally same thing the mha Fandom started saying in their early days.
Considering that for the last decade bleach fans have been made to feel like Morons for enjoying something, I can see the overprotection, but let’s stop pretending is perfect. There’s great and there’s terrible stuff in this story, Grimmjow and Ulquiorra are fantastic characters, but fake Katakura town drags too long. The way Coyote Stark is used in the story is phenomenal, but Ichigos close freinds barely get enough screentime. The designs, weapons, powers and action sequences are generally some awesome, series defining stuff, but the constant recapping in the second half of the story is immersion breaking. It has its ups and downs, but people like me like to acknowledge the work that Kubo put into this world regardless of the bad. In conclusion, if you love bleach, be open to talking about it’s problems, if you hate bleach, keep your mouth shut and let people enjoy the vibe that is this work.
I'm very protective cos people have been talking shit about Bleach for years yet now that it's hot, people are rushing to it.
How does this help anyone tho? Shouldn't you just be happy more people are interested in the thing you enjoy? Damn I wish fairy tail could take bleach 's blessing of getting positive light because y'all damn well don't want it. When you get protective over fiction it just makes potential new fans not wanna get involved as they'll partially judge the show based on its fan base. Rick and Morty is a prime example of this imo. A good show with perceived crazy "I'm smarter than all fans" which makes people who never seen it just not interested
Bleach is still not a masterpiece
Just letting you know
@@kylekgh I agree
@@kylekgh Bleach has a huge enough fanbase as is, a huge fanbase who throughout the years has been forced to endure a lot of shit from all sort of anime fans, all kind of content creators and just the average viewers. What's so wrong about calling some of these creators out? I don't think Totally Not Mark is deserving of this, but what's wrong about, for example, calling Fornever World out? Someone who actively trashed on Bleach a lot.
What's so bad about fans being protective of the series? I don't understand. I really think these sort of takes 90% of the time come from new fans who really didn't experience just how much Bleach got trashed in the past.
@@youthinkso2695 fornever world literally review bleach while it was going he likes bleach he just didn’t believe the anime would come back there was even die hard bleach fans who thought this
Thanks for this video. I am tired of this bullcrap
Damn I ignore toxic fandoms like the Sonic, DB, Star Wars and Naruto ones. Anytime I meet other fans, they are chill.
I understood their were Bleach haters and detractors for years, but it wasn't until recently that I found out that their is a crazy amount toxic crap out there.
I go to conventions like Momocon and every Bleach fan I meet is chill.
I watch TotallyNotMark and he just revisited Bleach, he is liking it so far and I am glad he is. Bleach got me through some tough times so I'm happy he is enjoying it.
Oh hell nah, the naruto's fandom toned down over the years, one piece's on the other hand.. became worse
@@mounada4098 I honestly barely hear about the One Piece fandom.
@@mandalorianhunter1 oh nah you can see them in every fma , naruto and aot posts hating on these shows and praising their anime
I don't think you can have a fandom of anything (sports team, movie series, manga, etc) that gets trolled, attacked, lies spread about, all of it, and when it starts to get popular again expect those fans who stuck through it all to play nice with everyone. It doesn't make it right, but I understand Bleach fans being protective of the series. I was part of nonpublic Bleach fan pages that ended up getting shut down cause people would join just to bash and attack people on there. People are still doing that and making videos with false negative content. Some people are committed to the idea "Bleach has to fail" and is a "bad series" and everyone needs to think that way. Bleach's fandom is passionate and that is why the TYBW arch is being animated. So, the people who have openly gone after the series in the past even if they are truly trying to get into and promote the series are going to get criticism for it.
The thing that pissed me off wasn’t Mark reviewing it it was that literally every comment underneath his announcement was “Get ready for the fall off” so it seems like all the supposed “demand” for the series wasn’t actually there
Bleach is like the manga version of nickelback, everyone hated it for no reason, but whenever someone watches it or read it they enjoy it.😂
Just watched the Patrick cc video of it , found this funny
Every fanbase of every big anime has a strong fanbase to defend, Bleach never had that and just got battered with hate to people thinking wrongly about Bleach, Let people defend they're favourite anime with valid points and we don't welcome hypocrites
It's really hard being a Bleach can because we went through a lot of shit for the past 10yrs.
Plenty of people criticise things in bad faith and that is awful, but assuming that all people who criticise something are doing so in bad faith is equally awful.
People has been shitting on bleach for years and we tired of it
This video title is toxic.
Oh cool you read my comment lol. Im looking forward to Mark's journey through Bleach and have been glad to see so many new fans. Mark's goal to explore the series to such a serious degree and also hoping to make new fans is a nice thing, its just refreshing.
Toxic fans exist everywhere unfortunately, they're even more tightly wound then ever with the release looming around the corner. For a show I always hoped would be finalized, all the sour grapes kinda dull the enthusiasm a touch. 😓
As a fellow bleach fan is can say that it's cuz of all the hate bleach got back in the day
I agree
TNM says in his review itself that a reason for reviewing it now/giving it another chance now because the anime is around the corner. My only issue was on Twitter they were tryna say that the anime return wasn’t a factor at all. That was disingenuous and my only complaint. But he fixed it by saying what he said in his review.
Great video man this was very much needed.
I'm really glad he's giving it another chance and reading the manga this time thank god also dope to see you cover his vid
I’m glad that Mark decided to give the manga a shot because that was my first experience with the show and while personally I find Naruto, Dragon Ball and One Piece more enjoyable to watch/read Bleach is still easily in my top 10 of favorite series of all time and I could empathized with Mark’s bad first impression because I tried giving the anime a shot but it just didn’t work and if that was my first impression I might’ve downright hated the series and would’ve never give the series a shot(even Mark admit in his video that if it wasn’t his profession he wouldn’t have give Bleach a second chance either) so it’s nice to see Bleach gets the appreciation it deserve.
Every fandom is toxic 😑
Wrong, most fan bases are not toxic, but they are protective. Toxic would be saying one cannot be a fan because *insert unrelated noun or adjective*
I have rarely seen fans saying certain cohorts cannot participate, outside of a few selective political zealots
@Xbox One all of them, unless you are going by the rule of guilt by association.
Though I will add an actual toxic subset of fans, as I'm not included with these nutters, but Babylon 5 is my favorite show, of all time; quite a few Trekkies and Babylon 5 fans would not allow cross fandoms participants, even during its (B5) orginal airing, and to try and stop the idiocy, JMS asked Majel Barrett to guest stat in an episode, to unite the fan bases, it failed, but the toxic fans got bored and went to ruin another IP, while the rest gush over the show's glory and argue bitterly as to the rankings of its failures.
I understand the jaded-ness of other fans especially after 10 years of dealing with bullshit claims and misinformation from people who either didn't pay attention to the story, expected it to be just like Naruto and One Piece, or went in wanting to dislike because they were told it was bad. But you're also right when you say we should trust that Kubo's work will stand on its own and not tear down others for their opinions. Bleach fans have had a toxic relationship with the anime community but fighting back by being just as toxic isn't the wave
Bleach is amazing. The problem was that Bleach fans kept insisting that the series was somehow on par or even better than the other two when it clearly wasn't. That caused the entire internet to mock them mercilessly and rip them to shreds. And strangely enough the fans are still salty after all these years. Even Narutards and One Piece thumpers grew up.
@@bendover7841 There is literally nothing wrong with praising a series you love as the best. People do that all the time and do not deserve to be mocked for it...
I "met" Bleach in 2008/09 and it's been my favourite anime/manga ever since. I felt some up and downs with the series along the years but i know that it will always be the best to me and i'm truly truly grateful that it's back. Let's just enjoy it, week by week and show has much love for Tite Kubo as possible, he absolutely deserves it!!
And DBZ, you're Bleach content is great. thanks for sharing your perspective!
The new video from eyepatch wolf wasn't all that better either. Other than accepting his shit takes on Bleach's art decline and the whole ToC rankings stuff it was the same old video. The issue is his shit takes have become the benchmark sticks of slandering bleach. Bleach is by no means a perfect story, it has flaws and shortcomings especially towards the end due to Kubos health problems. After 2016 his video paved way to a narrative that had completely glossed over the strengths and positives of bleach until 2020. Bleach wasn't all loved before 2016 either but the slander reached a whole new level after. Many don't even know about Kubo's health issues and just say bleach manga was cancelled and it was a failed series. Mark didn't deserve to get the slander and he was certainly right in asking not to be toxic but he also needs to know why bleach fans have become so defensive. With Gigguk making the switch and all the drama with ProZD it's obvious the community isn't welcoming towards opportunity/views/paycheck seeking fakers.
It’s justified given how badly the series has been treated over the years
This vid is officially in my top 25 RUclips vids great video
If it wasn’t for your channel and the Ruined Reputation video I might have never gone back to rewatch Bleach. I watched Eyepatch Wolfs video and I remember wondering if that’s what really happened before stumbling on your video. I dropped off around the arrancar arc because I was caught up on episodes at that time and got busy with life. Very thankful to be caught up and excited for the new arc!
I've enjoyed your videos for a few years and I hope you don't mind me saying this but I do feel before your tone was a little more toxic and as time has gone on I've thought you've softened that and it turned me from someone watching your videos to subscribing and what not. Now I look forward to every release.
I think the filler was fine if it was a separate season and injected between canon arcs. The ones that really hurt were the ones between various parts of the arrancar saga. I guess on wikipedia they are seasons 9 and 13.
We all grow and mature over time, I definitely think I was more hostile in the past and should have been better.
I actually remember enjoying the bount arc not the main villans of it the how the mod souls got more screen time and that there was a new race
You made a well response to this I don't think many could see or know about especially with your analysis videos.
You're analysis videos if not have to be the most (Peak) thing I have seen related to Bleach and some other animes I like very a lot.
Well not exactly. TotallyNotMark lied and said he never bashed the Bleach series saying it was bad but he has. People have posted screenshots of him bashing the series a few years back on his Twitter. Bleach fans are upset that people have been shitting on their favorite series for years but now that the TYBW Arc is getting animated and the anime looks phenomenal, all the people who were talking shit are now praising the series saying that they never stopped liking Bleach. TONS of Anime RUclipsrs were caught doing this. KOL & Forneverworld are prime examples.
For the longest time I genuinely believed the bount arc was canon I only recently discovered it’s actually filler.
....But then the fullbringers wouldn't have a fancy mansion in the woods.
Yeah its so weird. I think for one episode they are cannon or maybe 2 but it's right before the espada ark if I remember correctly. I've only watched bounts once about 10 years ago lol. Everytime I rewatch I make sure to skip because it's so bad lol.
I indeed am toxic
Great take, and awesome video as usual. My take on this entire matter is that it's time for bleach fans to stop the gatekeeping now. Like we've got our anime back, we "won the war". People who watched bleach in the past and newcomers to anime will wanna check out bleach once it hits their trending pages. The anime will speak for itself. However I do get where the hate comes from. Like you mentioned in the video die hard bleach fans were getting shat on from basically both sides just for liking something others disliked. But as a fanbase is it really a wise decision to portray ourselves as a fanbase full of gatekeepers and people who think bleach is literally the be all and end all of the entire industry? That's just gonna turn people away from the series without even giving it a chance to "talk the talk and walk the walk" for itself. Like when did we as a fanbase unanimously decide we don't want our favorite series to reach a wider audience?
Another thing I wanna discuss is the Eyepatch Wolf video. His video did a lot of damage to the reputation of bleach, I do understand that. But he made various mistakes in his first video, which he then later corrected in a separate video. Granted his video should've come out years before it did but better late than never I guess. I saw various replies under his tweet he made to Mark where it was just him getting bashed and slandered for basically liking aspects of bleach. But if a guy genuinely doesn't like something, why are we trying to force him to like bleach. In his follow-up video to his bleach video he outlined exactly what he disliked, which might differ from our opinions but so what, he's a great content creator and makes some really awesome videos. Its not fair to crucify him for formulating an opinion on something.
Thank you for making videos like this, also your voice makes for great commentry.
Ngl I did enjoyed the fullbringer arc 😂😂 it was so different and unique for bleach
Mark makes my favorite anime analytic reviews and I like his ability to break down the technical side of manga.
To be honest,I can’t really blame the bleach community for being toxic,they got so much hate for enjoying a series,like seriously,what did people expect,if you shit on a fan base for years,of course they’re gonna retaliate.
As a fan of both you and totally not mark I have to admit that I love this response video. People get stuck in certain ways of thinking, and I completely respect your views here and Mark's breakdown of Bleach. I just wish more of us in the fan base would spend time understanding that we're all here for the same thing, the love of anime/manga.
I can see why people would think that mark was just hopping on the bleach bandwagon (still not justifiable) but I'm glad he gave it a second chance, of course of he didn't like the anime but loved the manga, and that's ok I mean for me I watched the HxH (2011) anime and I didn't really like it but I read the manga and watched 1999 and I loved it and then gave the (2011) anime a second chance and... I didn't like the first arc but liked the other arcs, I don't think mark was milking or using bleach for money, I think it was all coincidence, for me, Bleach is my favorite from the big 3, but yeah I don't think people people should gatekeep it but it does show how people who hated and suddenly started to enjoy bleach would like and hate on anything and it's annoying tbh but I don't think gate keeping would help, as a bleach fan, I'm honestly glad that people are enjoying it now, for me, bleach is a good manga and anime, it has its flaws like every manga and anime and that's ok, it's still enjoyable nonetheless
Rare to see a HXH 1999 fan but im glad
Of course
Title : Bleach fandom is toxic !
Dragon Ball Fandom : Let us introduce ourselves !
I loved early Bleach, and my big issue is that Kubo built such a great universe and it was only based on a small area. I'd love Bleach spins on souls that were born in multiple countries. And my best ending in my own mind was a time skip where at the end the captains welcomed a new captain or set o captains as soon as our main characters entered Soul Society.
This is no different than politics. People wanna push their agenda on others to the point where your message gets lost in the processing
Unfortunately almost any media like film and tv shows are trending off of that and the people are now realizing the problem. It’s ok to agree to disagree, but it should NEVER be personal. Mark reviewing Bleach is honestly a good thing no matter how you look at it. I’m a Bleach fan too and I really do not understand the hate at all, it’s unjustified. I enjoyed all the Big 3 shonen titles. One Piece is favorite, Bleach is second, and Naruto is third. Bleach for me holds a place in my soul for introducing me to the story and great characters for the most part and I can’t wait to see what Mark goes deep into the next story arcs in the series.