Why Fr. Casey Cole is WRONG About the Bible and Homosexuality
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- Опубликовано: 5 июл 2024
- In this episode Trent responds to Fr. Casey Cole's video "What does the Bible ACTUALLY Say about Homosexuality?"
To support this channel: / counseloftrent
Original Video: • What the Bible Says (a...
00:00 - Intro
01:05 - No Definite Teaching?
02:30 - Sodom and Gomorrah
04:37 - Romans 1O Only about Adultery?
07:31 - 1 Cor. 6:9-10 and Child R*pe
11:25 - Leviticus Doesn’t Apply?
12:22 - Fr. Casey’s Flawed Plan B
15:23 - What he gets right 
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The problem is with assuming "how we understand homosexuality today" - as if any traditional understanding is anachronistic. This implicitly takes for granted that we are making real progress in understanding homosexuality. I wholeheartedly disagree that we have somehow gotten better at understanding this sinful behavior.
it's a really bad argument, ancient peoples put there pants on one leg at a time same as us
It's not sinful. That's really the point.
@@StudentDad-mc3pu Do you believe in sin at all? If so, what makes something a sin?
There is also this bizarre conflation going on between same-sex acts and "progress" as if giving into base physical desires without thinking is somehow the modern thing to do. It's a weird rejection of the reality that controlling one's body is the modern concept and simply giving into whatever feels good without thinking of the consequences or logical reasons not to is what humans were much more likely to do in ancient times.
You give me hope for your order. If only the vocal ones were as good as you.
The best way I have heard it. In the context of the red text argument, “But Jesus never said that.”
“The messiah had more important issues to address rather than rehash an already settled issue that was not in dispute in the antique near east.”
My response to the "Jesus never said that" argument would be to ask that person to read the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:31-32, Matthew 19:4-9, and Mark 10:3-12. Then I would ask them if they could gleam anything from those words in favor of anything outside of marriage between a man and a woman.
well first destroy any pretext of red text argument using the red text "It is right for us to meet all the Law's demands - let it be so now" "The scripture says" "I assure you that, while Heaven and earth last, the Law will not lose a single dot or comma until its purpose is complete." and then use Matthew 19:4-6 "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator `made them male and female,' and said, `For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh' ? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate.""
Sure, that would be an argument. But someone could simply say “but He was talking about divorce, not homossexual acts!”
This is why I’d strengthen this argument with the passages quoted above *after* having already discussed Leviticus and Romans in that order. Old Testament, then New so we establish that the moral Law hasn’t changed. Then discuss the Greek terms for men-bedders and effeminates, THEN finish with the Gospel of Mark and Matthew.
Yep, just like the issue of being allowed to beat one's slaves as long as they don't die in a day or two in Exodus 21:20-21 it was settled and Jesus agreed with it.
Our Lord never condemned Cock Fighting. I’m starting a new hobby.
As a Catholic who struggles, and battles, and wrestles with my homosexuality, my sin and my shame, its hard sometimes to hear the harshness of some of these words. But i must remember, it is not harshness, but the word of God.
Thank you for your videos... i hope one day i can find the peace i so desperately crave
Praying for you ❤️
@@bethanyann1060 Thank you, sister
Hopefully you can embrace yourself. Otherwise it's needless pain.
Please go see a therapist. You’re dealing with religious trauma. The gay community is ready to accept you with open arms when you are.
@@bethanyann1060Stop doing that. Your religious bigotry literally leads gay kids to off themselves every single year. Your ‘love’ is poison.
Glad to see you did this response, Trent. I'd like to give Fr. Casey the benefit of the doubt, but I often have concerns when I watch his content.
I am sure he means well, but I definitely have concerns with some of his content, based on the admittedly little I have seen.
@@marinanguish9928 - Cole CLEARLY does not mean well, his vids are very disturbing
It's not possible do watch more than 2 or 3 of his anti-Catholic videos and give Cole the benefit of the doubt.
@@marcokitepoor fella has swallowed modernism.
Brian, are you familiar with the channel "Scholastic Answers"?
Interesting how People who hate the bible ,
Are seeking it's validation day by day by misinterpreting it
The glass half-full view of this is that they still desire God's blessing. -Kyle
root of woke movement is secular humanism, and root of secular humanism is gnostics. and gnostics are sworn enemy to catholic church .
this is satanic mind, he mix 99% truth with 1% deadly poison.
@@TheCounselofTrentThe mystery is why more people can't see that it is calling a sin an identity is the central blasphemy here and double bind.
The consequence being you can't criticise an identity in an identitarian age, it's a "secular blasphemy"
Until 100+ years ago it was universally either a dominance ritual
or a fetish for the rich jaded semi potent.
This is true for most of the world, still, All the 53 African countries, not bowing under inhuman pressure, are doing all our work, again, and paying a financial price for their integrity.
Satan tempted Jesus by quoting scripture. Even demons are compelled to acknowledge the authority of God. *Not necessarily saying these people are under demonic influence.
@@veronica_._._._ The church used to have a problem with left-handed children. To the extent that they were punished and forced to used their right hands. They got over that. Forcing homosexual people to either: try and live a heterosexual lifestyle, or force them to be celibate is akin to this.
Trent Horn's rebuttals always personify 1 Peter 3:15 which says, "Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect".
^agreed, all too many videos these days are just mockeries and slanderous towards the other they refer to.
I have stopped watching Fr Casey’s videos. Maybe it is my personal reaction to a priest who says, no! He does not pray the rosary! 😱😳
@@majkomira he’s not praying the rosary doesn’t mean he doesn’t believe in it… he just have other preference on how to pray… do you pray the rosary everyday?
@@majkomira has he publically said he does not say the rosary ...oh dear....when and where can I see evidence of this
Stupidity remains stupidity however dished
I’ve seen a few videos recently of RUclipsrs covering other people. You are among the few that don’t mock and ridicule the other person in the video. Keep up the quality and respectfulness!
Even though I am an evangelical Protestant I enjoyed listening to Michael Voris on Church Militant. He had no use for people like me but his condemnation of liberals was good. It is sad that he fell into sin.
@@roberteaston6413 yep Amen.
I'm 2 mos sober yall! By the great mercy & grace of Jesus thru our Blessed Lady & His given 12 steps based largely on Sermon on the Mount.
Congratulations on a huge accomplishment! God bless and never give up.
fr casey is very strange sometimes he says good stuff and sometimes im wishing his superior had not let him have a youtube channel
Maybe people needs to write his superior in order to that.
@@DanyTV79I’m pretty sure his superior knows what he’s doing.
maybe he gay himself
He built a following teaching solid doctrine first, but in topics that weren't important or didn't contradict (in a superficial level) the views of his progressive agenda. Now that he's amassed a good enough following he's showing his true rainbow colors and leading as many people astray as he can.
And I'm sure he thinks wholeheartedly that he's doing good by modernizing the Church, not as some evil plan, but it's still evil.
Casey follows the same strategy as Fernandez with regard to traditional Catholicism: (1) state agreement with the teaching; (2) undermine and hollow out the teaching of any practical meaning. If someone criticizes (2), just point to (1).
I usually find Fr. Cole very interesting but it's great to see you correct him, Trent. He seems to be too soft on LGBT agenda.
The agenda of equality. You guys are psycho
What's the agenda?
@@Darkforest138 equality
@@MRdaBakkle all citizens are equal in the eyes of the law. There you go.
@@Darkforest138 the agenda that the Bible doesn't condemn homosexual acts
This is why Tradition exists. It prevents us from falling into the trap of thinking we “know better than those who came before” or that “this time is different”.
Would you say though that all traditions serve a good purpose?
@@BardicLiving Any Tradition built on serving God and His Truth, first and foremost, is the highest good that can be achieved.
@@DavGre It seems as if many conflicting traditions and laws have that as their stated purpose, though - e.g. when and how to observe the Sabbath, what kinds of food/drinks are acceptable, or when and how it’s appropriate to end a marriage.
Agreed. Let’s return to the tradition of slavery. It was good enough for the Old Testament, it was good enough for the New Testament, it had the approval of the Popes and Church Fathers and stood for thousands of years. Stick with tradition!
I think you unknowingly make a good point, the real authority is tradition, the bible is just there to justify it.
Few hundred years ago, the bible was used to justify slavery, because that was tradition, until it stopped, so people are now reinterpreting the bible as anti-slavery.
Red flags should go up when you hear “scholars argue”. In contrast, notice how trent actually cites his references.
Confusion is not of God. Fr. Casey needs to clarify and take a break from the click-bait, scandal causing videos
the clickbait titles make it all so much worse
Everyone does clickbait to some degree. Pope Francis, God bless him, got it in spades in the past on many conservative videos. It's shameful but they want the "clicks" and views
he doesn't control the titles, has said so many times. He is only with content.
Maybe he is homosexual himself
@@DarkAngel-cj6sx And if anyone was on this video or him or whomever, is that a sin?
I think a certain amount of blame here needs to be placed not simply on Father Casey, but on his Franciscan formators and superiors for peddling these arguments. Father Casey isn’t some self-taught pseudo-scholar; at some point, his Franciscan seminary instructors and formators solidified these positions and supporting arguments in Father Casey, which of course get turned into these videos. It’s like when he did that ridiculous “prison workers are actually chattel slaves” video, I was thinking to myself “this is absolutely a stereotypical modern Franciscan/Jesuit take, someone in the order had to lay this out at one point and Casey gravitated to it.”
Yes but Father Casey is not a mere puppet, he has a brain of his own. If he can't wrap his head around the fact that the bible is unambiguous on its views of homosexuality then he is not bright enough to do his job.
definitely agree with these thoughts. Someone needs to reform that seminary for "educating" this young man with such non-orthodox ideas. He is really a master at sowing seeds of confusion.
@@timcooper1321 Seminaries are closing. I think Ireland is down to 1. Suggestion is for the US to have 5.
Cardinal Dolan: The Catholic Church has too many seminaries.
"Some thoughtful observers have proposed we consider regional major seminaries, one for each of four or five geographic areas in the U.S. church."
He has 3,5kg of brain tissue perhaps he should start using it instead of repeating the lies of his convent
@@rl7012
It's true that he's not a puppet, whenever he talks about his influences outside of Catholicism he always mentions far left atheists and he has defended liberation theology which is heresy.
People gravitate to what they like.
Trent, thank you so much for your good work. Keep it up. You are a shinning example of charity and clarity.
Some will argue if God condemns homosexuality then why did he make it pleasurable, meaning why is it pleasurable for both partners. Horrible argument! The same argument could be made for drugs and a host of other sins. "Lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God." Pleasure becomes idolatrous.
In the words of Calvin Robinson "are we saying that we know more about (sexuality) now than God knew back then".
Calvin would make a great Catholic
@@jaqian He is: Anglican 🙂
Casey Cole does!
spot on
Um.. yes? We have an entire field of science from biology to genetics to psychology to sexology that has made tremendous progress in the understanding of human sexuality. Similarly, we also know a lot more about sex differences whereas up until some centuries ago women were understood to be mentally inferior to men and thus unsuitable for public life, hence the Bible's pronouncements on women having to 'submit' to their husbands and all that.
I'm an Orthodox Christian and I have to say Trent did a great job defending our common faith ground here. Give credit where credit is due. I believe Fr. Cole knows perfectly well what he's doing and is subverting Scripture by poking holes in its interpretation by the Church and getting a foot in the door for future "developments" (the plan B mentioned). We are all in a spiritual battle and must defend the true faith.
I'm with you on Fr. Cole knowing exactly what he's doing, yeah. If it's one thing I wish, its that my fellow Catholics would get on the ball about this because too many of them seem to have trouble wrapping their brains around the whole subversion thing calling those of us who talk about it, "rad trads".
And I get it, its beyond a lot of people to grasp just why anyone would do this, never mind how. Because we're all genuinely good people who'd never consider deconstructing anything out of spite or some sadistic desire to cause pain. Its hard to think that there are a bunch of people out there who vow to do exactly that - it still comes hard to me and I've been engaging in this culture war for over a decade, it still breaks my heart to think about this stuff. I wish I didn't know half of what I know.
But yeah, people need to wise up, although to be fair I think a lot of them are beginning to come around now. Thank you brother (or sister), and God bless you. 🙏
@@katydidd6321the issue here is that u guys are assuming without evidence that Fr Casey Cole has these malicious intentions, this is sinful to do
Exactly sir. Fr Cole knows what he is doing and it clearly goes hand in hand with the very sly and beat around the bushy way the Catholic higher ups are leading people into believing doctrines of devils.
At the end of the video, Fr. Casey says:
"Casting out people simply for how they were CREATED... (dramatic pause)... couldn't be further from the teaching of the Bible"
He obviously scripted the video and put emphasis on that part on purpose. He probably does have an agenda, but not the courage to be sincere about it.
@@justsomevids4541 The subversion of the Church for the purpose of coercing the masses to live contrary to the teachings of Christ the Savior is malicious acta non verba, and Trent Horn lays out the evidence in his videos quite succinctly.
Pax vobiscum.
Thank you for this response. It saddens me that Fr. Casey could be so effective at reaching younger Catholics, but instead seems to be (hopefully inadvertently) sowing more confusion at a time clarity is desperately needed.
He and his other channel, upon Friar Review are also good at building bridges w/ protestant Christians, and I even see a lot of comments from atheists that like that channel too. I'm a non Catholic Christian that was enjoying the channel, but I'm really disappointed w/ this softness and subversive teaching towards homosexuality and sexual sin in general. There are many of us wanting to raise a holy standard against all manner of sin. The subversion is in all the churches, and tragically, those w/ large public platforms and ordinations can peddle their subversive wares to the weak in faith, and those thinking of coming into Christianity.
I really fear that it is VERY 'adverdent' - I regret he knows what he's doing.
I have enjoyed Fr Casey's content but after a while I realized what he is doing. He says he follows Chirch teaching but then will subtly undermine the faith once for all delivered to the saints yet not in a way where he can be caught out
Thanks Trent! Love to see your channel is flying 🙂
Father Casey's video style is very similar to Buzzfeed and other left-wing outlets that try to promote deconstructionism and give it a positive feel by creating ambiguity.
That's what it reminds me of! Buzzfeed and that ilk! I couldn't put my finger on it but they always gave me that sense of familiarity but I couldn't quite pin it down.
Yes, he seems like an infiltrate/agent of the progressive left.
Well put.
He claims Johnny Harris is one of his favorite RUclipsrs, I'm not surprised he would emulate the style and content.
Harris is a former mormon turned Marxist atheist
That's right! 👍👍 I stopped watching him like 3 years ago, he's offbeat.
Trent defending the faith firmly once again!!!❤
A layman has to defend the faith against a priest? So much for unity.
@@littlerock5256 There have always been bad priests and there always will be. Only you can decide if you will let that disturb your peace. Judas disrupted the unity of the Apostles, and which Apostle left Christ because of Judas?
@@aretrograde7745 A bad priest is one who is personally sinful; distorting the faith is a whole other level of evil.
Cole has had a channel for some time now. Other commenters expressed concern over other things he has said. This isn't a one off.
Laymen correcting priests publicly is a bad look, at the very least. Cole's bishop should be dealing with this. As Cole's comments were public, the bishop's correction could and should also be public.
@@littlerock5256 Absolutely! Spot on!
True, how could God be love if those sodomites don't have to run around on burning sand with fire raining down on them from the sky for eternity (a la Dante). Where is God's justice if their skin is not seared off for a quadrillion years.
I have subscribed to Fr. Casey for a long time. I have found the way he covers some topics as not biblical.
I noticed Fr. Casey turned comments off on his video. You left your comments on. Bravo.
You gave a lot of clarity.
Yeah I used to watch Casey almost every day but now I’m having to step back and reassess his message
I believed he left his comments on in one of his videos covering homosexuality in the Bible. He had replied to someone in the comments to help them understand his conclusion which was "Homosexuality isn't sinful. But homosexual acts are." He's practically admitting homosexuality is sinful but he doesn't want to bring any harming feeling against homosexuals.
@@rudyisabot homosexuality is sinful and so are the acts but to be born that is not wrong if you are completely chaste in your life
@@JoeBuchanan1346 Yeah I know.
Used to watch him alot but these days avoid him. He's suspect
Fr. Casey did another video on lgbtq refugees and anyone who questioned homosexuality as wrong - he responded “BEING GAY IS NOT A SIN. BRING GAY IS NOT A SIN…”. I was completely shocked he responded to so many people asking questions and commenting in this immature manner. After seeing such childish response, I stopped watching him.
I used to love Fr Casey’s channel but it seems every video he shows his true modernist understanding more and more.
Same here. He's been saying similar things about woman priests.
Same here! I stopped watching him like 3 years ago, he started acting weird and putting out "gotcha" videos and saying weird stuff. And I sensed this dude is off his tracks! I didn't have time for his antics.
Yes, does he hate the Church? He always sounds like a very liberal Anglican.
@@marcokite I don’t think he hates the church. I think he’s lost his way. We must pray for all priests especially the ones that have lost their way. I think he has a good heart just bad theology.
Me too!
Stopped watching Fr Casey a long time ago!
I am glad someone finally called him out for his explicit ideological biases.
That's all we needed was one more Fr James, Martin
@@tomgjokaj Francis supports James Martin so he's likely support Cole as well.
@@littlerock5256 Lord please have mercy i'm not sure about Pope Francis, but somebody in the Vatican clearly likes fr James Martin, the spiritual, pervert
Remember when Fr Casey Cole stacked his ordination mass with women because his sister told him the Catholic Church was sexist? Just putting that out there.
@@tomgjokaj Francis has written personal letters to James Martin in support of him.
The good news is that God can free all homosexuals from a life of perversion. They just have to have humble hearts, and want to allow the Holy Spirit to redirect their lives.
Amen.
Oh, I imagine many folks enjoy their life of perversion. I live with a married women who is gorgeous and kind. Don't knock perversion. And I am as loved by God as yourself.
Do you not believe homosexuals also experience love?
@@Ryenrein Homosexuals experience lust!
@@stevensonrf I assume you you realise that heterosexual sex is also sinful: except in narrow confines of married couple having sex for procreation. That includes having sex using contraception device is sinful.
I was waiting for this. Thanks for clearing this up.
Trent is literally the Cavalry
Charitable and necessary. Great job, Trent!
Please stay on top of this channel, Trent. Thanks.
Thanks Trent. Father's video was definitely confusing. And while you did make a video on 1946 just before that, it was nice to see your rebuttal side by side with the argument.
Thank you for your videos. You're always very precise, and we appreciate it
Yes indeed. He's very 'precise', very 'nuanced', very 'intellectual' about his homophobia and bigotry. Really hope that makes you feel better. i bet you need that cause if were to realize that religious bigotry has led to countless of suicides of gay people you would probably not be able to sleep at night. Good riddance.
Fr Casey seems a little subversive
Huge respect from a Protestant for not looking outwards but first taking the plank out of your own camps eye we need more of this going around
Why dont you go to a protestant website? I am sick of protestants putting their two cents into catholic matters. Read Hillaire Bellocs book, The "Great Heresies". You are a Heretic of the catholic church. When I was a kid we were not even allowed to talk to protestants. And until around 60 years ago the churches official teaching on protestants is that you will not be saved. I think that may be true, because protestants mock the Blessed Mother, (Jesus' Mother) and Dont believe in the Holy Eucharist. How is thinking like that going to get you saved? First you tell Jesus you hate His mother, and then you tell Him (Jesus) that He is a liar by not believing that His Body Soul and Divinity is the Holy Eucharist. Read John 6:53 again. He never said it was a symbol.
I am a Protestant who has done volunteer work at two missions. We give food and clothing to poor and homeless people. Of course, we preach the gospel. Many of the people we help are Roman Catholics. Sometimes we win a person to Christ. I do not think that Roman Catholics have to worry about our mission work. Any "Roman Catholic" we win to Christ was not much of a Catholic anyways. They may have been born into a Catholic family and baptised Catholic but they have not been practicing Catholics for years. You know what Catholics say. Poor Catholics become Protestants and good Protestants become Catholic.
@@roberteaston6413 So why are you still Protestant?
You have a plank in your eye if you are protestant and reject the Holy Eucharist. Jesus never said it was a symbol. You dont know what you are talking about. Reread St Johns gospel 6:53, or read it for the first time.
I've watched a bit of Fr Casey's content and always get the distinct impression he years to promote strong progressive ideals (which conflict with Catholicism). His video "Abortion isn't THAT big of a deal" comes to mind.
Really? He actually did that video? Wow. Says it all really.
I always feel that he hates the Catholic Faith
@@lepterfirefall he did a follow up video in response to the STRONG reaction it got, clarifying his point, but it didn't help...
Thanks Trent. You are an invaluable gift to all of us.
Exceptionally well done. Thank you so much for this. May God bless you in your service to Him.
My first ever interaction with Fr Casey was a tweet where he said that the Bible was full of contradictions
He's a liberal heretic.
Isn't it, though?
@@blindflames227 no. No it's not
@@blindflames227No, it has what seem to be contradictions. But, when reading scripture fairly we can see how it is cohesive not contradictory. God bless.
@@blindflames227 The Bible is infallible in terms of morals and faith, but not on terms of historical records.
However, most people say the guiding on morals and faith are contradictory, but they are not. You need to read it as a whole and understanding how they connect and clarify each other. There is only one Truth!
Great video!
"People will argue, “we know more about homosexuality now than we did then” maybe so. But are you then suggesting God knew less than we do now? For either all Scripture is God-breathed, or it isn’t. Either we believe Christ, or we don’t."
-Fr. Calvin Robinson
What a great speech by Calvin!
God-breathed means it has the power to give life, it doesn't mean that God wrote it
Isn't that what Christians have done with slavery?
Tanks for adding clarity, Trent. You nailed it.
What in the world???😮 Good grief! Thank you, Trent Horn!🙏🏽
It's worth noting that the basis for condemnation of Sodom and Gomorrah was not mutually exclusive; to reason that because it was about oppression that it therefore wasn't about sexual immorality is to engage dishonestly with the text of Scripture.
“Greed and injustice” when they literally were trying to sodomize angels because they were so sexually depraved.
This is like saying the problem with strip clubs is that they have profits.
I think of this Bible verse regarding "Well, actually's"...where I think the first envious deconstructionist was the devil with his first words:
Genesis 3:1 "Now the snake was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made. He asked the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You shall not eat from any of the trees in the garden?”"
Great Point, it seems to be the root of the argument of every Bible verse. Truly, there seems to be a effort to completely revise the word of God.
@@thenewrenaissance4180 Thank you for your reply. Hope you and yours are having a nice week!
I believe you mean “AkShUeLLy”
@@EpoRose1 Well AkShUeLLy, *squirts saliva everywhere while unintentionally playing the "Do you like Seafood joke* I was making a distinct point about...lol Thanks!
A talking snake? And the snake is "the devil"? What?! A snake that is a "deconstructionist"? And what does a deconstructionist need to be "envious" about? What do you even mean? You ABSOLUTELY DO NOT KNOW THE BIBLE. You're WRONG THEOLOGICALLY AND HISTORICALLY! And you call yourself a christian??? Lol!
Much needed as my relatives got a little confused by Fr. Casey’s video. Thanks.
Man, Mr Casey Cole needs to repent
The roads to heresy are many, the roads to hell wide, the road to salvation straight and narrow
And only a few find the narrow path!
FEW!!!
@@john_from_eastcoast. Funny how a lot of Christians here think they are the ones on the narrow path, and no one else is, that they tell everyone else how to think.
Amen.
@@john_from_eastcoast. You better pray that you are one of them.
There was ALWAYS a power differential between ancient homosexual partners? Scripture actually has an answer to this claim too:
"What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun." -Ecclesiastes 1:9
Marxists see everything in terms of power. However this vice is about emotionsl erotic pleasure and narcissism and simply trade offs of I will give you this if you give me that etc. Ultimately its the means to get the ends but the ends is a perverse approximation of what nature, healthy instinct emotions and attachment are ordered to which is family and procreation. Heterosexuality is the norm or we would not exist.
I had to look up the definition of "power differential", I thought that was a mechanical part on a car axle. 😆
These modernist types are a weird bunch of people.
And a generational difference (Bearded/beardless)
It was was never a category identity either, the victim would carry all the shame (catamite, ingle...) and the aggressors would feel hypermasculine, having divided up the world of carnal opportunity into
1) adult bearded male
2) "objects" that can be used as if female.
Anthropology 101.
The biggest passage for me is not one that says "homosexuality is wrong" but the one in wich Jesus said that a man and a woman will be united to form one flesh.
It shows what God wants and has created for the union of two people in marriage to form a family
Then obviously a celibate priesthood is unnatural and against God’s law. I agree.
Best of luck, RC friends. The heat is only going to increase over these next few years.
Keep up the great work, Trent! I am an Anglican and regularly come to your videos to receive a strong, thoughtful Catholic take on issues.
Even where we disagree, I appreciate the steelman to challenge my viewpoints rather than just trying to find Catholic strawmen that do not align with the historical church's teaching.
May God bless you and your ministry in finding true faith in Him.
You can be LGBT and Catholic 👨❤️👨
@ddrse no it's a contradiction
Homosexuality is a natural healthy born sexual orientation with an evolutiionary meaning.
How shall homosexuals still take Christians for serious when they follow a man-made claim in the Bible and call it an abomination or a seduction of their satan?
Hell, I'm an agnostic, and I'm subscribed.
I'm the same, it's fascinating to watch this huge boom of catholic thought and a kind of revival happening. Given that so little theology is seriously debated in our church today or even by parishioners it's healthy to have exposure to both sides of the debates in an intellectually honest way with integrity and civility.
Let’s all say a decade for Fr Casey
While we’re at it, let’s say an entire rosary for all the bigots and mean spirited folks making derogatory and uncharitable remarks about Fr. Casey and gay folks.
@@OldMotherLogo Amen....geez, they don't know him or talk to him. Same with the Pope, they can bash as long as someone thinks he is wrong. If thousands of priests or bishops don't, they are wrong too. So much judgement. I've seen Fr Schmitt on some shows and they talk to him one way and then when he's not, the same topic is much less charitable. I've seen conservatives and not so conservative youtubers pander to the person on, but at least the priest is the same no matter what show or speaking engagement. If I heard them change, I'd be worried.
@@OldMotherLogoI see none of that here.
If Fr Casey supports the teachings, why does he feel the need to present that type of video?
@@OldMotherLogo yes, Social media gave us all much to much time to say nasty things about others. The more conservative the site, the more you see it. I guess it makes sense, but it must be lonely being right all the time.
Thank you Mr Horn. This is a response I was hoping for.
Trent, perhaps it’s a good time to have a dialogue with Fr. Casey Cole.
Fr. Casey has refused each time Trent has offered in the past.
I am open to it but he has consistently declined.
I appreciate the replies.
@@TheCounselofTrent That's pretty sad when goodwill protestants like Pastor Gavin Ortlund is willing to have a civil sit down discussion (plus do really civil debates), but a fellow Catholic friar is not. It seems you're more in line w/ a lot of protestant Christians in this this matter of the homosexual agenda. Catholic unity isn't as simple as being united under a pope. God bless, you have my continued prayers and support.
@@TheCounselofTrent: On quite another note, I think it’s useful to listen to Fr. Chad Ripperger, a psychologist and exorcist who talks in his online seminaries about the sources of the vice in question and even mentions the names of the demon who tempts men (men have one such) and two separate demons who tempt women (women have two).
His conferences are available on youtube.
So much for the “natural” provenance of this vice.
God bless you and your family🕊️
I saw Fr.Casey's video right after I had watched your video on the homosexuality documentary. Honestly, I felt upset and confused about what Fr.Casey told. I knew that he was wrong, but I also knew that you will make a video on that so I kept silent. Thank God I was not wrong.
Fr Casey is off the tracks.
Something about this guy rubbed me the wrong way! 😤😤😤
He keeps complaining about women not being priests. Huge red flag!
I don't think it's required to like the fact that women can't be priests. St. Therese, for example, seemed to at least wish at one point that things were different so she could serve. But of course she accepted it, at least by the time she wrote her book.
@@jdotoz Jesus Christ pan all these stupid people who want women to become priests. GOD SAID NO! That's enough! There's obviously true explanations. God didn't give one and doesn't have to. But that can be proven logically. Women, girls, females were given the role of becoming pregnant which isn't much of a choice but a good role of saints. Saint Monica had birthed men right saint Augustine tended to his mother bed. Granted reality she didn't became a saint after procreating with her husband, creating saint Augustine but she became a saint after so much praying for the conversion of her son and both were holy saints when decades close to death.
Yup. I really rail hard against people who thinks it's unfair there's no priests who are female. But I'm like LOL YOU FEMALES GET PREGNANT WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT? GOD GAVE YOU THAT ROLE NOW SHUT UP AND LIKE LOVE IT AND THANK GOD YOU CAN GET PREGNANT! AMEN and that's it kids weeehee happily ever after no more annoying woman to yell at! Oh and men too. Father Casey included. And then some!
Fr Casey is an admirer of Fr. James Martin. I m not surprised
I'm unsure why Fr. Casey keeps creating content that's purposely ambiguous and against patristics and Catholic teaching. He wants to play both sides. It's not possible. Cite the teachings of the Catholic Church, and stop citing "modern scholars". If it was up to these "scholars", the entire New Testament would be anonymous and the 2000 years of Christ's Church would collapse.
He's not playing both sides, silly, he's _allowed_ on both sides. There is a difference.
Thanks for the correction video! Breaking the Habit is a channel that concerns me and has for years.
Why isn't Cole's bishop correcting him?
@littlerock5256 Assuming his Bishop knows? The channel never goes full-on heresy, at least from what I've seen. And there may have been private corrections that we don't know about. Remember, the principle here is that going public is the last step in correcting a brother.
@@aaronvt9980 A public error needs to be publicly corrected. Horn is stepping in to do it when it is really the job of the bishop.
Are you suggesting that Horn contacted Cole directly, as well as Cole's bishop, and that was not sufficient, necessitating Horn going public?
Same here
@@littlerock5256 Two different things. Trent is rebutting an argument. A bishop would be chastising the brother, which should be done privately, at least the first time. Far more likely, the bishop has no idea the brother even has a RUclips channel.
Blessings, honour and respect Mr. Brent for clarifying a very ambiguous problem! ✝️🕊️📿❤️
I used to listen to Brother Casey's videos when he was in seminary. I haven't been able to listen to any of them for very long since I don't know when, at least since 2018, maybe earlier.
half the church has just gone off the rails on this subject...
Hey, St Athanasius would have loved those odds back in his day dealing with the Arian crisis! -Kyle
@@TheCounselofTrent I'm stealing this reply
St John chrysostom had some words for the people in this topic as well in his homily on Romans 1.
I appreciate the worldly nature of the Franciscans and their attempt to compromise with modernity but Fr Casey needs to afirm that a Catholic cannot compromise with sin!
Trent, great response video. Well informed and fantastic delivery.
However, you cracked me up at 1:26 talking about the Catechism and did the eyebrows just like Lumberg did while talking about TPS reports in Office Space 😂.
Since I was born, I was prepared for this world to be evil, but I wasn't prepared for it to be this gay and stupid too...
Thanks for the great video Trent! So important to guard the faith from people intentionally or unintentionally bringing these sins into a more palletable light.
Fr. Casey is this generation's Richard Rohr, only a hundred times more sneaky.
yeah and i know a lot of friends that simply wrote off the OFMs when discerning religious life because of these two, they aren't doing their communities any favors
Let's be more charitable, he surely and beyond any doubt deserves criticisms on his views, but let's not be hostile
Very insightful and articulate. It seems our thoughts are alike, but you were able to speak them out more articulate. 👍🏻
Thank you for making this video!
if anyone believes that the Church's teaching on homosexuality is correct and yet makes ANY argument that might lead people to believe otherwise, that person is committing a grave evil by leading souls astray. so the question is, what is Fr. Casey's motivation and goal here?
His goal is to be acceptable to the World, while still trying to be Catholic
@@stevedoetschVery Charitable.
he claims to be playing devil's advocate, in the hope that people will stop using weak arguments and switch to stronger ones. That would be a very good thing to do, if he were doing it. The problem is that he is doing the opposite, as Trent points out. Not sure if he is doing this intentionally and using "devils advocate" as cover for actually undermining the traditional teaching.
It is not the first time Fr Casey has done this. He's had other not-so-shining moments such as when he quoted Marx in a positive light or when he taught universalism. This is not one slip-up, it's a pattern of behaviour. He does seem to be intentionally subversive to the faith and it is dangerous because his channel is made to appeal to younger Catholics.
@@adrianmizen5070 Thomas Aquinas, he isn't
TFW your favorite right-leaning Catholic challenges your favorite left-leaning Catholic to spar with him…
Noah, you're my favorite leaning Catholic. -Kyle
@@TheCounselofTrent
Slide to the left
Slide to the right
Crisscross
Crisscross
Cha-cha, real smooth
m.ruclips.net/video/wZv62ShoStY/видео.html
@@TheCounselofTrentWho is Kyle?
G.K. Chesterton wrote an excellent essay called _About Shamelessness._ In the essay Chesterton describes what he believes to be the real underlying problem with modern-day hedonism. The issue is not just the sexual perversions themselves, but the complete lack of shame and disgust regarding them.
People in the past did these things, but they never wanted people to know about it. They understood it was wrong. The last thing on earth they would do is take pride in their perversion; or proudly proclaim it as some kind of "identity".
Chesterton (correctly I believe) links this degradation of shame and disgust to moral relativism. I strongly recommend this essay.
So people are less homophobic and ur mad about it? U can intellectualize it all u want but ur just trying to justify ur base prejudices. Should wr also return to the days where we looked at black ppl and race mixing with disgust? The author u mention was also deeply antisemitic. Seems like theres a pattern here of trying to intellectually justify bigotry. And btw, there’s nothing inherently hedonistic about homosexuality. Its not as if all homosexuals are primarily straight but have gay sex when they are bored with straight sex . Lmao
@@RationalistMH
"Its not as if all homosexuals are primarily straight but have gay sex when they are bored with straight sex."
Kleptomaniacs and Pyromaniacs may indeed be "born that way". That doesn't make what they do correct. And, no, I'm not making a comparison. I'm simply saying that being born with a desire to do something does not automatically make it right. If that were the case, "I was born this way" could be used to justify anything. There may be a genetic influence on all our behaviors.
Race mixing was considered immoral. I'm not sure if it was considered disgusting. It was not unusual to find white women having affairs with black men. Our sense of disgust is very different. People feel disgust when somebody does something bizarre or irrational.
For example, if I'm walking down the street and a guy grabs a woman's purse, I would get angry because it's an immoral act. But suppose that guy, instead of grabbing the purse, picked a large spider off the ground and started to eat it. That may not actually be immoral per se. Maybe the guy is starving. I wouldn't feel anger towards that person, but it would trigger my sense of disgust.
I should have made this distinction in my original post.
Thankful for this episode. Just this year (already) I’ve had two conversations with a theology degreed older woman and an older Sister who both talked about modernity, and a newer understanding on this subject. I’m in RCIA and coming in at Easter Vigil. I found this concerning and disappointing, so much so that I’ve selected a different sponsor and entering at a different parish. I’m older (64) and can’t easily be swayed by such propagation, but younger people could be. Keep fighting the fight, Trent. Your channel and book has helped me in my journey.
I’m sorry that was your experience. While I’m not calling them devils, his influence is everywhere, even within our very hearts.
How old were they?
@@Jerome616 They were both in their mid 70’s, I think. The Sister was the first Catholic I’d met with and the most recent conversation was when I invited her into my home for tea. She talked around the issue until I asked her point blank what her thoughts were. (My personality 😊)
@@terrykessinger4432 That's pretty disconcerting. Goes to show how deep the gay agenda infiltration is in all the churches now. You don't really expect elder women, who should be strong and conservative in the faith to be there to trip you up w/ the modern agenda, but there they are.
Yes, given their age, that's about what id expect from people in ministry who are about that age. Some during the early days after Vatican 2 really took the churches social Justice doctrine to mean "Jesus is the big nice guy in the sky, and he does not judge anyone". They then watered down the Gospel so much that many young Catholics in the next few generations wondered what even is the point of going to church. I'm glad that many of those entering the church today, including seminarians, are Othodox in their views of the Gospel. @@terrykessinger4432
Great video, Trent. It’s always helpful to not only have information clarified and made whole, but to also see and hear it done with charity and humility. I’m reminded today to be patient and kind with people I disagree with. Thank you.
Thank you for calling out false teachers
The question is, will the bishop of this false teacher rein him in or will he continue?
@@littlerock5256he'll probably continue. His higher ups are probably just as corrupt.
@@christmascat8076 I suspect the same as well.
It's a shame, I learned a lot from him as I went thru RCIA, didn't realize he was in error on such a crucial topic
☠️☠️
THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO!!!
So if god hates me because I'm gay why did he make me gay then?
We all have seemingly natural desires God asks us not to fulfill
@@wondergolderneyes but god could've chose not too, instead he made me this way on purpose knowing full well the consequences of doing so, god hardened the heart of pharaoh, god allowed satan to torture Job, God allowed for sodom and gamorra to be created just so he could destroy them, god created lucifer just so he could corrupt us, god created Judas knowing full well he would betray his "son" if god is all powerful and all knowing then humans have no free will and it dosent matter what I do, but if humans have free will then god cant be all knowing or all powerful. If god is real he dosent care about us and he enjoys watching us suffer
He doesn't hate you for that. There's so much to be said on the topic as an encouragement to you - would you like me to though? either way - hugs to you
@@wondergolderneyes homosexuality is natural
God didn’t make you gay, because it’s not part of his design. He also doesn’t hate you, he wants you to repent.
Sadly...and I really, really don't like saying this, but I find Father Casey wrong about more and more. I don't know what's happening there, but I am genuinely concerned for him. He could be doing quite a lot of damage to people's spiritual life and Soul.
I stopped following him and unsubscribed from him long ago. He's chop full of nonsense like this.
@@waybogus I concur completely, my blood pressure couldn't take listening to him anymore.
@waybogus I did too. I could tell where it was headed from the beginning, though I had hoped I would be wrong.
@@timcooper1321 Can't say that I blame you.
We have to pray for him, he probably genuinely thinks he's doing good by "updating" God's teaching. Still, he knows exactly what he's doing by undermining little by little the eternal right doctrine.
He's pushing heresies in small doses so he doesn't lose viewers in great numbers.
Thank you for uploading this
Great video, Trent.
Thank you for this. I watched Father Casy’s video and was thoroughly confused with some of his statements. I always thought Scripture was very clear about this, but some of his interpretation seems to imply different meanings based on the mores of people at that time.
We need a full investigation at how these men are taught in seminaries today.
Clearly there is a disconnect between the magisterium and the curriculum taught to candidates for priesthood.
Seminaries have been poisoned by homosexuals and Modernism for decades.
If only
oh yeah 10 uears of understanding theology and how to celebrate a mass so goodluck with that
For starters they ognore the science that contradicts the bible and start with the assumption it is divinely inspired without evidence
They are taught Modernism which deconstructs everything that is supernatural. Such naturalism is antithetical to Faith.
Thanks for making this response Trent. I appreciate it. Hopefully Fr. Casey will respond back in a constructive way.
I doubt that i'm afraid
Glad you made this video! I do prefer the black t shirt over the sharp suit if we see the mic on screen. If standing/lecturing, then sure the suit jacket makes sense : )
I’d also recommend highlighting the text instead of point an arrow. Pretty hard to follow.
Great video and very informative and helpful. Thank you!!!
Thank you Trent for this video. God bless you!
I knew for a long time that Casey was off the tracks.
Thank you. I was hoping for a rebuttal. Appreciate all the hard work.
Fr. Casey seems to barely keep his feet on this side of the "technically doesn't constitute heresy" line. It's like he feels the need to be apologetic for maintaining church teaching
PLEASURE seeking is the problem.... people have ALWAYS sought personal pleasure b4 all else.
God bless u brother. 👌 Do not stop correcting those who missed the way of the truth.
In the comments of the Father's video I made the same criticism that you do in this video. It's great that you are making this video.
Father Casey is gracious for comments and humble if he needs to correct himself and interacts at times. No one on this site or others is perfect. Our egos and need to do well with the platform sometimes creep in I'm sure being human. He still preaches though and I'm glad he isn't swayed by hatred or condemnation. I say try to get to know someone well as much as you can. I've watched many videos of priests and some I click with, some are too gruff or dry. I don't write someone off on a video or two. I've never heard Fr Casey say anything wrong. Compassion is needed in our world. You don't have to sacrifice your belief to be empathetic.
I wonder how did you do it, the comment section under Fr. Casey’s video is “unavailable”😅
@@workinprogress-ye5or: Well, the closing of the comments’ section under Fr. Cole’s video speaks volumes and not to his credit, unfortunately.
We need to pray for the clergy, from the very top to the very bottom of the hierarchy, the demands for the chosen sons are higher than for anybody else.
@@user-rz7cm2we3xIt was available when he released the video. What a pity that the comments are blocked. In the comments there were people recommending Trent videos, so that they could be better informed.
@@workinprogress-ye5orThe argument is criticized, not the people. The Father is a good person with good intentions, but perhaps the theological training by his order is not the best.
I think he very clearly articulated his point. The Bible is clear about homosexuality being abnormal because it never mentions it in a normal context.
This is a weak argument, he dismissed all good arguments to make us rely on a weak one. He knows that if we relied on his argument it wouldn't take much time for people to accept homosexual unions more in more in Catholic circles. That's his idea.
But then he also said that 'normal' homosexual relationships didn't exist in those times. Thereby giving a good reason not to expect this kind of relationship to be shown. And therefore defeating the one argument against homosexuality he gave in his video. And he used most of the video to tear down any other biblically based argument against the topic. While his counterarguments, as Trent has shown, are very weak.
So no, there's nothing orthodox about this video of Fr Casey.
@@CezzyHaag It's the usual attempt to weaken the church's and biblical stance against homosexuality. Trying to cast doubt that the new testament ever speaks clearly against it. It does.
@@CezzyHaag The bible is like a written history of the world. It not being in the bible and not being common at the time point to the fact that it was never normal. Obviously it's abnormal for two people of the same sex to be in union because the parts don't fit. The fact that the bible doesn't give it the go ahead is enough, people get the rest...
@@user-mu5ee6md8u "The parts don't fit"
So sex is exclusive to conceiving children then?
Never let yourself become so open-minded that your brain falls out.
🤣 Or let anyone put there anything they want (rubbish included).
Great video. Loved the clear and logical explanations.
Thank you Bro. Trenton for defending our Faith.
The Scriptures are very clear on this topic, and it is infuriating to see people who want to pretend that they are unclear.
Nope
no they are not, it says nothing about same sex love
I am so glad you made this video! I saw Fr. Casey’s vid and I knew (know!) that his heart is in the right place but clearly his head is in a different place. I started to respond but I don’t have your eloquence or platform so it wasn’t worth my time.
Glad you made this.
I initially thought he was a courageous young man trying to feed other young men spiritually, but it’s the second time (that I know of) that Trent calls him out on wrong teachings.. I hope it’s not intentional. Imagine having a confession with him, and receiving similar kinds of guidance. And the homilies he gives.. Fr Casey seems to be of the same school as that of Fr Martin 😢.
May God come to our aid. Thank you so much for your work Trent. You are very charitable.
It is very intentional. Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves (Gospel of Matthew 7:15, King James Version).
@@rl7012King James Bible is heretical. It does not hold the true teaching.
Casey Cole supports father, James Martin, 100%. This says it all. For the most part, it looks like Cole is not a real Catholic priest. But rather, a Freemason!! Casey Cole canceled me off his channel after I exposed him. Please be aware of this delusional man he’s not legit.
I very much regret that it IS intentional. Cole does this sort of thing a lot
While not wanting to create/further a scandal, I wish there was a proper platform for communicating these, in order to give the person a reasonable chance for correction, without discouraging him, or others discerning the priesthood.
Well said Brother Trent... Always fighting for the truth.
Though I'm a Protestant pastor, I love your channel Trent! Well done. Important conversation to be having, especially today.
The more I hear Catholics speak biblical truth, the more I like Catholicism. Feelings/tradition are good, but nothing stops a man dead in his tracks like the Word.
You should be Catholic 👍
@@Qwerty-jy9mj thanks for the invite, but no. I prefer sola scriptura. I don't think there's good evidence for the Catholic teachings on purgatory, the perpetual virginity of Mary, praying to anyone but God, and transubstantiation. But, if we can agree on the simple gospel of Jesus Christ, then that's enough for me.
@@dantheman909
The simple gospel implies obedience
Sadly Fr Casey is another James Martin