I think other elements of railway history deserve a film or TV series on them. Imagine a movie about George Stepehenson and the Rainhill Trials, or a Gresley film which culminates in Mallard’s record breaking run. There’s an untapped goldmine of storytelling that I think could be interesting.
@@RailwayManiaNet Would be a good way to get Gresley's claim that it didnt run at 126mph out in the public too. He never accepted it, and as most academics note, even 125 is problematical.
"The Life Of J.G Robinson". I can see the Oscars already! (And a biopic of John Farquharson McIntosh actually really would be really cool, because the poor guy lost a hand!)
Interesting idea but I don’t think a remake would be good what would like see however is a sequel like the book 📖 of thunderbolts last run by Thomas young that would make a good homage to the original 🎥 wouldn’t it what you say
A really fun deep dive into a classic, mate! Personally I'd like to see the townsfolk acquire more rolling stock or even another loco- as heroic as thunderbolt is, backup motive power is always going to be needed
I think I'd have a scene at the beginning showing Sam and Ollie on the last train on another line. Introduce the fact that they're both clergymen (perhaps a gag where it turns out most of the enthusiasts present are clergymen?), but not their respective ranks. They part, and Sam heads home (perhaps his journey is the opening credits). We see him arrive at Titfield, and as he leaves the station, we see the closure notice go up. I'd also add a subplot about Sam worrying about neglecting his duties as a vicar, which gives him reason to be worried about a bishop showing up (this is mentioned in the original, but it's resolved as soon as it's brought up). Perhaps this self-doubt causes him to assist in the reconciliation of Harry and Joan.
I like the sound of that, plants the seed right at the top of the story. Although I can’t get the idea that Sam’s journey to Titfield is shot in the same way as Sgt. Angel’s trip to Sandford out of my head…
I always felt the unexpected appearance of the bishop to be very fitting. There were after all several very prominent bishops among railway enthusiasts at the time, and his appearance is an appeal to the broader enthusiast community.
and modern film makers tend to ruin whatever classics they try to 'remake', just take a look at anything Disney has decided to re-make in the last decade as examples.
As much as I’d like to see a remake of Thunderbolt, I don’t think it would work 70 years later. The setting has changed, the context has changed, there’s little mainline steam, and the behaviour of the characters would be dramatically altered to fit the modern world, which could affect the simple nature of the story. That being said, I think Jim Broadbent would be a good Mr. Valentine.
I think you are right regarding the change of the modern world. The film worked at the time because people still love the railways whereas now, as many railway museums and heritage lines are finding, the general public are largely bored with trains and, if they think about them at all it is usually because they are in the news again for some strike or some issue that will effect their commute
An old friend played one of the kids waving at the train. The man from the ministry at the enquiry is David Niven’s friend Trubshawe. As well as getting him in some movies Niven would try to have Trubshawe mentioned in the script somewhere. In Wuthering Heights his name is on a tombstone. At least one Trubshawe movie has a character called Niven.
The original film is a time-capsual, into a lost British culture. It has gone now, but we still have the original film to remind us, or educate following generations; a remake would be just a pail imitation.
An idealised version of British culture. How Britain wanted to see itself in 1953, Coronation Year. Not how Britain really was. Idealised and senimental. Doesn't really speak of the horrors recently endure in wartime; or that rationing was still a thing; how cities were still in ruins from the Blitz; no Windrush generation... or the casual racism, sexism and homophobia.
I think the speed limit plot twist is a bit underwhelming, it is essentially a throw-away joke that's also doing the heavy lifting for the resolution. If a twist is going to be crucial for resolving the plot it should be foreshadowed. It works (as a gag) insofar as the Titfield crew believe they're behind schedule, and then *twist* they're not. But that should not be the final link in their chain to success. At the very least, the tension could've been ramped up if the characters played the bit a little differently. Vicar Weech seems resigned to failure before they get to the platform. If he had acted through the final leg of the journey with determination to make it on time no matter what, and only deflated as they pulled into the station realizing that they had definitely lost despite giving it their all - then the warning about not going faster would've been a much better joke! Even though that'd make it play better as a gag, it'd still be a weak plot twist. Perhaps the real problem with the 3rd act finale is that their only enemy by that point is the rule book and a coupling. Even their museum locomotive performs without a hitch (no pun intended), although this could've been a great source for both humor and conflict. As for the Bishop's appearance, I think it works as is. The problem of not having a fireman is not treated as an end-all-be-all problem, and explaining the appearance of the Bishop would probably just slow the story down. Recently had a bit of discussion about what locomotive would have been used had Lion not been available. Shannon perhaps? Stretch the timeline a little, and maybe the Caledonian single?
I've been reflecting this for some time, but if there's one thing that I think "The Titfield Thunderbolt" could have taken advantage of more was its options for referencing railway history and operational practices; something that it fairly skims over to get to the heart of the story, but it undermines some depth in the process. A lot of the finer details of the film - like the locomotives used - were choices made after the script had been written. This is something I felt even as a kid, who happened to be exposed to a lot of railway material, and it highlights to me how relatively classified the interest for railways is among general society. Cars get a lot of the mainstream attention, in total irony of one of the key moments of this film; that of course being the Squire's speech. I wrote a treatment where I used the real-life survival of the 1848 locomotive 'Fire Queen' - which was left in a shed for decades after retirement - to justify the endurance of the titular locomotive. Imagine if the scriptwriters had thought that one. To sum up, the movie was expecting to accomplish more than what it did. That's what interests me about how it could be done better. Regards, Samuel Farris.
I first saw it on general release. That first shot of Midford Viaduct stayed particularly in my memory and I travelled on the S&D later on. That little Westbury 0-4-2 tank has its rubbed out/painted over GWR initials still obvious to the eye.
Climax: Just outside the junction for the branch, an express train has stalled, and they can't get the diesel started. The express's guard flags them down, and the driver goes to the back. They're impressed at seeing an old 0-4-2, and ask Sam how much she can move. Sam gives an answer that's roughly the same weight as the express. The inspector was leaning outside his window, listening to the commotion. He makes a note unseen to us. Cut back to Thunderbolt, Sam and the diesel's driver shake hands. The driver runs back to the express, hoping to release the brakes, and the guard motions Thunderbolt forward. Sam drives her forward and she buffers up. Epic wheelslip shot, and Thunderbolt eases the train to Mallingford. Just as they stop at the platform, she pops her safety valve. The Inspector remarks "...And helping another train and their passengers? Don't think I've seen enough of that lately. Very well done." And then the ending of the movie is Sam writing down the story, and giving it to his grandkid.
One of my favourite Ealing Comedies along with Passport to Pimlico and Maggie. There are a few odd facts about the film, It is one of the only times is not the only time two locomotives of the same type and class bore the same number, the Metro Class 1401. The reason being being as it was filmed on the Midsummer Norton branch line there wasn't facilities to turn the loco round and the makers wanted the train moving in both directions. So two locos identical locos were used but facing in opposite directions. Most people know that the scene where Thunderbolt is moved from the museum and driven to the track it is in fact a lorry dressed us to look like Thunderbolt and very briefly you can see the lorry tyres. It certainly doesn't detract from the charm of the movie. Coincidentally I am building a working steam 1/8th scale model of the 1400 class 0-4-2 locomotive.
For an inspiration for a series concept (on going challenges) just take almost ANY preservation railway or railroad museum, and fictionalize its early history. There are MORE than enough internal/external conflicts and plot items with running the railroad to make a season easily.
It’ll be pretty difficult to pull off these days, unless the budget is there to recreate the line seen in the film, let alone making a 14xx prop for the crashes. Not to mention Thunderbolt herself. I’m sure a mixture of live action and CGI could work, heck even making it through a train simulator
I think if this was remade, I'd have the ending be this way: The whistle celebration is kept, and the camera fades to the Thunderbolt's name plate. There is then a crossfade to one month later. The camera pulls out to show that the Thunderbolt now rests as a static display in a glass shed/repurposed greenhouse at Titfield, just as a new steam engine rolls into the station with new rolling stock, hinting that the railway has thrived still. We see where everyone is now; Sam is enjoying the work but it's clear he's better suited to being a pastor rather than an engine driver. Harry and Joan talk about renting the train for a wedding procession in the next coming week, which Sam says he'd be honored to have that be his last day as an engine driver, and he mentions how the squire (I forget his character name) is working his way from guard to engine driver. Marples makes an appearance at the end by parking his car near the station parking lot in an area that's heavily marked as "LOADING ZONE ONLY, NO PARKING." He comes up to Sam and is pleasant in front of the passengers before he turns and says "You won this one, but this silly little branchline will be erased from the face of the earth. I'll make sure of it." Suddenly CRASH!!! the camera cuts back to Marple's car being squashed by an ex-Pierce & Krupp delivery lorry. Sam smirks, Marples leaves to throw a fit at the lorry driver, but a nearby constaple is there to write a few tickets to Marples for knowingly parking in a no parking area. Marples looks down and sees a discarded ticket reading "The Titfeild-Mallingford Light Railway." In his anger he crushes it under heel and leaves the scene. The train blows its whistle and it slowly leaves Titfield as the camera slowly rises up before we get the end card saying "The End... for now"
After Dan & Mr Valentine stole a locomotive from BR they can't get another '1400' class. They also refuse when Rev Weech & Mr Valentine show interest in a Scottish locomotive by the name of 'Ben Alder', to Sam's disgust. Mr Blakeworth finds the Ministry of Supply have some low-mileage Hunslet 'Austerity' 0-6-0ST's for sale.... Dan is seen whistling as he applies a fresh coat of Brunswick Green paint as one sits in Titfield goods yard underneath the Dutch barn 'shed'. The wedding reception of Harry & Joan is supplied with game by Dan's poaching To placate Mr Coggett, Dan, Sam & Squire Gordon have become card-carrying members of the National Association of Railway Workers.
To be honest, for Thunderbolt , it’d make sense to Use a currently operational old engine or one in good mechanical condition, for example , Furness No.20, and it was said Stirling Single No.1 was in good mechanical condition.
personally, remaking titfield in any way would run the risk of spoiling the original. We have a book which ties most of the ends up called 'Thunderbolts Last Run' and rapido have also added fictional histories to their wagon pack which is coming out in the new year
Maybe perhaps an LNWR Cornwall or Bloomer for the old engine from the museum and an LMS Jinty, GWR 14xx or a BR Standard Class 2 for the engine running the line.
As 'Thunderbolt' we could use the replica 'Planet' type. The locomotive theft does not happen as all they can find are brand-new Class 08 shunters, which Dan knows nothing about. They get chased off-shed by the railway police.
I always thought the joke ending subtly implies that the inspector is actually secretly pulling for them. Given the idea of having Ernest Marples as an antagonist, perhaps the inspector could appear in the background during the government setup scenes and be frustrated by Marples in small but definite ways. Too professional to defy him outright, perhaps he drops an explanatory hint about the speed limit-or some other detail-giving the villagers the chance they need; perhaps, also, he needs their application to be truly flawless since Marples himself is determined to see them fail .... I really liked this thought experiment!
I think that a remake could be set in current times. It could be one of the preserved railways facing either a take over by a theme park and the associated tacky developments that would effectively obliterate the old railway and the story could be the efforts of the existing heritage volunteers against the corporate theme park buying up shares etc. Or it could also be about a conflict between a heritage railway and property developers buying up huge chunks of desirable rural land and therefore squeezing out the heritage railway. Something similar has been happening in recent years to general leisure aviation where some of the smaller airfields have been bought up for housing estates and flying clubs have been displaced and had to close down.
I like how you handled this. Heres a question for you. What would a Sequal of Titfield Thunderbolt be? Also your point about story set later and government officials incl' Beeching were the thing to threton the railway, that would be a good film similar to Titfield Thunderbolt.
Excellent film analysis. Please, not Netflix unless you follow the Beeching/Marples line. Incicentally, I think Beeching needs redeeming as the real crook was Marples who used Beeching as the fall guy. I have thought about this a lot. The Beeching story could be a Netflix series on its own.
Beeching did an awful lot of good, eg Freightliner, InterCity. If anything, Beeching kept far more lines open that it had been hoped to axe. Plus from 1923 to te 1960s more lines were closed than under Beeching. Several thousand miles went before WW2 as they were not economic and were a historical legacy of the unplaned, laissez-faire capitalist approach to the British railway network which was massively wasteful in terms of money and track mileage.
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory I agree, up to a point. The point being that his brief was how to stop the railways losing money. The obvious answer to that was to close the whole lot. (and there was a strong political movement for just that) That he managed to finesse things so that any railways remained open at all was pretty smart and, indeed he did that by arguing to keep a mainline freight and passenger service. However he made some broad assumptions which were not correct... and then Marples appeared on the scene. However, I guess that isn't for here as I'm hi-jacking the space of Railway Mania
An American or German remake would unfortunately want me to have too many long lists of non operable locomotives I would see running in the movie. Virginia Truckee's J.W. Bowker being one however she would need a new boiler and the William mason would need a new firebox, although the Grand Trunk Western 0-8-0 that once ran in revenue service till 1980 on display at the Illinois Railway museum would need a full restoration but as a more "modern" steam engine and having been run and maintained till the end of it's life and being 99% complete, and with several surviving locomotives of the same class and not a one of a kind artifact and you could probably restore it to operation in 3 years.
Calling Beeching Marples' crony is doing him a misjustice. Beeching produced the report that he was tasked with making, Marples studied it, adapted what he saw fit and then presented it to Parliament for approval. The road lobby was in full swing by then, so there was little that could have been done anyway to reverse the historic problems faced by the railways.
the more i have watch the film the more it seems that the railway inspector might have been trying to sneakily 'help' the villagers. He looks at his watch and his notes, almost as if he is working out timings, and then decides that it is the perfect time for an emergency brake test. And somehow does not notice that the sound of the engine has vanished and the coach is barely moving later......... He also does not question the fact that the water stop, from the perspective of those in the coach, is bloody short. As in, train stops and is ready to go again less than a minute later....... And if it was not for his impromptu brake test (and the issues that came along after that) they would have breached the 25mph limit........at least as far as timings were concerned.
I really love the idea of the remake as a mini series, and ending with the set up for more challenges. Perhaps an adventure to Barry Island to acquire a suitable supplement for the Thunderbolt? Personally I’d love to see the inspiration for The Titfield Thunderbold, Railway Adventure adapted. L. T. C. Rolt’s story has several cinematic images, such as Mr. Rolt walking along the entire line after Dolgoch failed.
The real star of this film, is the Lion. This locomotive is in the Liverpool Museum, at Pier Head. I am sure that you will not be able to do a remake, unless you can build a copy of it, as has been done with the Rocket.
The first-part description of the idea for a '60s version sounds an awful lot like the American TV sitcom series "Petticoat Junction" (1963-1970), wherein the main antagonist in the first couple of seasons is a stickler railway executive during modernization who is trying to shutter an administratively forgotten branch line in rural America (which was cut off decades earlier from the mainline) that is still running an 1890s steam locomotive (staffed by lovable misfits and served by a quaint bed-and-breakfast) long after the rest of the world has switched to streamline diesels or semi-trucks. Small-town rustic hilarity, city-folk-vs-country-folk, and general yesteryear nostalgia ensues. [ASIDE: the locomotive was played in distant shots by Sierra No. 3, which amongst many other roles was the loco in "Back to the Future Part III".]
Come to think of it, have you seen the 1959 film It Happened to Jane? A lobster merchant gains legal title over a steam locomotive after the railroad refuses to compensate her for damaged goods (a freight of lobster left to die on a siding through an administrative screw up). One thing leads to another and the town decides to run the train themselves...
I think Netflix have it wrong, as a viewer i prefer stand alone programs but then i only watch "live " broadcasts not catch up or "box sets", oh and a ton of RUclips.
For the Serenity Ending, One Month Later. It absolutely should not be "Thunderbolt" on the train. It's done its job, back to pride of place in the Museum. Retirement well earned. Instead something more modern in its place - a proper railway not a trainset of bits and bobs. That's what the villagers wanted. Their railway, and part of the mainline. It's all very cutesy to think about them carrying on with "Thunderbolt" and whatever, but just wouldn't be workable. Railway saved, part of network, modern passenger stock.
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory I did do a quick photoshop of a 14xx in T&MR livery but I think my haste did not do it justice. Either that or it was too OTT....
Interesting! But can't assume the livery on Thunderbolt was the original livery of th engine or that adopted by the Light Railway......am I thinking about this too hard?@@RailwayManiaNet
Personally speaking, leave it alone! So much of the film's charm is due to the era it was made, celebrating a world and an England that was already on the verge of dieing. You couldn't recreate it. A teacher friend was discussing the film with his class after it had been on TV, and told me that his 1980's teenagers couldn't believe that a world where only one person had a car, the only tv was in the pub, and the community was wholly dependent on public (rail) transport had ever existed. The innocense of the villagers' world is unbelievable now....... and we've become immune to corruptuion of the Beeching/Marples variety. This, apparently, is called 'progress'.............
For me, Ealing and Titfield have always represented something so very quintessentially English. Parochial? A time when attitudes, manners and sense of community were so very different to today. Not something I believe a "modern" audience would expect or understand in the same way sadly. By the time corporate entity and equality committees were through with "suggested" changes to ethnicity and gender equality we may end up with a film that was almost unrecognisable and lost it's heart (for me anyway). Having said that, I do wonder if there is an opportunity to make some sort of follow-up storyline??? "Return of the Thunderbolt"? "Thunderbolt Strikes Again"? 😊
The ethnicity factor can be easily fixed even in context of the time. All you need is a character who used to drive or maintain old steam engines in the Caribbean before coming to an English village. There were for a long time steam trains on sugarcane plantations. The character would obviously be a more sincere Christian than many of the villagers, leading singing in the church.
@@DavidNewmanDr indeed. Very true. Maybe a worker from the railways of India? There was that great character in North West Frontier who drove the engine. I like the idea. :)
It does sound like an excellent idea, though you can’t use the original Titfield Thunderbolt line since that line had been turned to roads. Best option now is to find a new location that could fit.
I consider your projections to "remake" Thunderbolt are spurious - there is no need to update a classic, let alone engage in the production of a miniseries; it is as Led Zeppelin's 'Stairway To Heaven' - covers have been attempted, but they fall flat, primarily due to the fact that you cannot re-invent or re-imagine anyone other than Page, Plant, Bonham & Jones playing that seminal piece - indeed, if one goes into a musical instrument store, there's an unwritten rule of thumb - 'No Stairway To Heaven' to be recited on the premises - rigidly enforced by the store employees. I'm all for living in the here & now, but to deny an audience a dalliance with the past, somehow goes against the grain....Thumbs up for a polished presentation, Andrew.
hehehe - really it's just a prompt to look at how storytelling and audience expectation has changed over the years, a sneaky Trojan Horse for some rambling!
Some interesting thoughts🤔👍✌️ Didn't Beeching et al have shares in Road Haulage organisations that they transferred to their wives et al🤔 Modern government have shares in big pharma and have chucked big sums of money at the Industry to build new factories etc, so this kind of thing goes on. Your thought processes are excellent, however for me, the Titfield Thunderbolt and its nostalgia? Needs leaving alone, too many things are being rewritten these days, rewriting history. Eg look at the terrible CGI flying representation in "Pearl Harbor" (sic) plus the sickening love story. Even with cognitive dissonance (suspension of disbelief) thats a hard watch. But if the CGI were improved and the love story element rewritten, not a half bad film😉😳😀 Although older looking, Tora, Tora, Tora is arguably the better film🤔 Thank God that The Battle of Britain was filmed when it was - real aircraft (albeit some were Spanish with GB engines).
![Gunna - HIM ALL ALONG [Official Visualizer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HiCxoDeo0hc/mqdefault.jpg)
I think other elements of railway history deserve a film or TV series on them. Imagine a movie about George Stepehenson and the Rainhill Trials, or a Gresley film which culminates in Mallard’s record breaking run. There’s an untapped goldmine of storytelling that I think could be interesting.
You could have Gresley, Stanier, Collett and Bulleid as the stars. Call it 'The Big Four'.
@@RailwayManiaNet Would be a good way to get Gresley's claim that it didnt run at 126mph out in the public too. He never accepted it, and as most academics note, even 125 is problematical.
What about Richard Trevitick.???
"The Life Of J.G Robinson". I can see the Oscars already! (And a biopic of John Farquharson McIntosh actually really would be really cool, because the poor guy lost a hand!)
Interesting idea but I don’t think a remake would be good what would like see however is a sequel like the book 📖 of thunderbolts last run by Thomas young that would make a good homage to the original 🎥 wouldn’t it what you say
A really fun deep dive into a classic, mate!
Personally I'd like to see the townsfolk acquire more rolling stock or even another loco- as heroic as thunderbolt is, backup motive power is always going to be needed
I think I'd have a scene at the beginning showing Sam and Ollie on the last train on another line. Introduce the fact that they're both clergymen (perhaps a gag where it turns out most of the enthusiasts present are clergymen?), but not their respective ranks. They part, and Sam heads home (perhaps his journey is the opening credits). We see him arrive at Titfield, and as he leaves the station, we see the closure notice go up.
I'd also add a subplot about Sam worrying about neglecting his duties as a vicar, which gives him reason to be worried about a bishop showing up (this is mentioned in the original, but it's resolved as soon as it's brought up). Perhaps this self-doubt causes him to assist in the reconciliation of Harry and Joan.
I like the sound of that, plants the seed right at the top of the story.
Although I can’t get the idea that Sam’s journey to Titfield is shot in the same way as Sgt. Angel’s trip to Sandford out of my head…
I always felt the unexpected appearance of the bishop to be very fitting. There were after all several very prominent bishops among railway enthusiasts at the time, and his appearance is an appeal to the broader enthusiast community.
Don't mess with the titfield thunderbolt ! ,a light-hearted comment,you cannot improve on perfection
and modern film makers tend to ruin whatever classics they try to 'remake', just take a look at anything Disney has decided to re-make in the last decade as examples.
a magical era of britain that could never be repeated
Magical except if you were gay, black, a woman or anything other than straight and white
Fantastic video. Great ideas and detail. Problem is, a remake is never better than the original, unless you haven’t seen the original.
Yes, leave it alone. You will never recreate the past like the past.
Well he did see it.
@@levelcrossing150 Yeah sadly we all know that.
As much as I’d like to see a remake of Thunderbolt, I don’t think it would work 70 years later. The setting has changed, the context has changed, there’s little mainline steam, and the behaviour of the characters would be dramatically altered to fit the modern world, which could affect the simple nature of the story.
That being said, I think Jim Broadbent would be a good Mr. Valentine.
Maybe Matthew Baynton as the antagonist or Collin Firth for one of main characters?
Also perhaps have David Humphrey as Taylor.
I think you are right regarding the change of the modern world. The film worked at the time because people still love the railways whereas now, as many railway museums and heritage lines are finding, the general public are largely bored with trains and, if they think about them at all it is usually because they are in the news again for some strike or some issue that will effect their commute
Well, for a start... The special effects would be amazing!.
🤩
An old friend played one of the kids waving at the train.
The man from the ministry at the enquiry is David Niven’s friend Trubshawe. As well as getting him in some movies Niven would try to have Trubshawe mentioned in the script somewhere. In Wuthering Heights his name is on a tombstone.
At least one Trubshawe movie has a character called Niven.
2 excellent pieces of trivia!
What would be the headcode for dairy trains, cattle trains, or a well wagon with an engine on it be?
The original film is a time-capsual, into a lost British culture. It has gone now, but we still have the original film to remind us, or educate following generations; a remake would be just a pail imitation.
An idealised version of British culture. How Britain wanted to see itself in 1953, Coronation Year. Not how Britain really was. Idealised and senimental. Doesn't really speak of the horrors recently endure in wartime; or that rationing was still a thing; how cities were still in ruins from the Blitz; no Windrush generation... or the casual racism, sexism and homophobia.
@@AnthonyDawsonHistoryit,s still here and the Racism will only get worse ,so many illegal immigrants coming in.ps discounting Blitz and Rationing 😂
Titfield Thunderbolt is one of my favourite films too, if memory serves it was last shown on TV on Christmas night 2015.
I think the speed limit plot twist is a bit underwhelming, it is essentially a throw-away joke that's also doing the heavy lifting for the resolution. If a twist is going to be crucial for resolving the plot it should be foreshadowed. It works (as a gag) insofar as the Titfield crew believe they're behind schedule, and then *twist* they're not. But that should not be the final link in their chain to success. At the very least, the tension could've been ramped up if the characters played the bit a little differently. Vicar Weech seems resigned to failure before they get to the platform. If he had acted through the final leg of the journey with determination to make it on time no matter what, and only deflated as they pulled into the station realizing that they had definitely lost despite giving it their all - then the warning about not going faster would've been a much better joke! Even though that'd make it play better as a gag, it'd still be a weak plot twist.
Perhaps the real problem with the 3rd act finale is that their only enemy by that point is the rule book and a coupling. Even their museum locomotive performs without a hitch (no pun intended), although this could've been a great source for both humor and conflict.
As for the Bishop's appearance, I think it works as is. The problem of not having a fireman is not treated as an end-all-be-all problem, and explaining the appearance of the Bishop would probably just slow the story down.
Recently had a bit of discussion about what locomotive would have been used had Lion not been available. Shannon perhaps? Stretch the timeline a little, and maybe the Caledonian single?
I agree - the resolution isn't really linked to anything else in the film, the great set-up has more or less been resolved by that point.
Only thing missing is the MCU ending with an after credits scene hinting at the Beeching initiative
There is a sequel but it's in book form and the book is called Thunderbolts last run
Great film, new version ..... yeh why not👍
I've been reflecting this for some time, but if there's one thing that I think "The Titfield Thunderbolt" could have taken advantage of more was its options for referencing railway history and operational practices; something that it fairly skims over to get to the heart of the story, but it undermines some depth in the process. A lot of the finer details of the film - like the locomotives used - were choices made after the script had been written. This is something I felt even as a kid, who happened to be exposed to a lot of railway material, and it highlights to me how relatively classified the interest for railways is among general society. Cars get a lot of the mainstream attention, in total irony of one of the key moments of this film; that of course being the Squire's speech.
I wrote a treatment where I used the real-life survival of the 1848 locomotive 'Fire Queen' - which was left in a shed for decades after retirement - to justify the endurance of the titular locomotive. Imagine if the scriptwriters had thought that one. To sum up, the movie was expecting to accomplish more than what it did. That's what interests me about how it could be done better.
Regards, Samuel Farris.
Wow, after years as a school boy I'm seeing it again.
I first saw it on general release. That first shot of Midford Viaduct stayed particularly in my memory and I travelled on the S&D later on. That little Westbury 0-4-2 tank has its rubbed out/painted over GWR initials still obvious to the eye.
Climax: Just outside the junction for the branch, an express train has stalled, and they can't get the diesel started. The express's guard flags them down, and the driver goes to the back. They're impressed at seeing an old 0-4-2, and ask Sam how much she can move. Sam gives an answer that's roughly the same weight as the express. The inspector was leaning outside his window, listening to the commotion. He makes a note unseen to us. Cut back to Thunderbolt, Sam and the diesel's driver shake hands. The driver runs back to the express, hoping to release the brakes, and the guard motions Thunderbolt forward. Sam drives her forward and she buffers up. Epic wheelslip shot, and Thunderbolt eases the train to Mallingford. Just as they stop at the platform, she pops her safety valve. The Inspector remarks "...And helping another train and their passengers? Don't think I've seen enough of that lately. Very well done." And then the ending of the movie is Sam writing down the story, and giving it to his grandkid.
One of my favourite Ealing Comedies along with Passport to Pimlico and Maggie. There are a few odd facts about the film, It is one of the only times is not the only time two locomotives of the same type and class bore the same number, the Metro Class 1401. The reason being being as it was filmed on the Midsummer Norton branch line there wasn't facilities to turn the loco round and the makers wanted the train moving in both directions. So two locos identical locos were used but facing in opposite directions. Most people know that the scene where Thunderbolt is moved from the museum and driven to the track it is in fact a lorry dressed us to look like Thunderbolt and very briefly you can see the lorry tyres. It certainly doesn't detract from the charm of the movie.
Coincidentally I am building a working steam 1/8th scale model of the 1400 class 0-4-2 locomotive.
In a series, the line should close and reopen as a heritage route.
For an inspiration for a series concept (on going challenges) just take almost ANY preservation railway or railroad museum, and fictionalize its early history. There are MORE than enough internal/external conflicts and plot items with running the railroad to make a season easily.
It’ll be pretty difficult to pull off these days, unless the budget is there to recreate the line seen in the film, let alone making a 14xx prop for the crashes. Not to mention Thunderbolt herself.
I’m sure a mixture of live action and CGI could work, heck even making it through a train simulator
Someone suggested claymation!
@@RailwayManiaNetperhaps stopmotion. maybe thats what they meant?
Yes that's right
Miniature effect can still be a thing nowadays. Christopher Nolan for example with “Batman Begins” and “Dunkirk”.
@@Nick-zp3ub Also the Swanage Railway and the Wensleydale Railway.
I think if this was remade, I'd have the ending be this way:
The whistle celebration is kept, and the camera fades to the Thunderbolt's name plate. There is then a crossfade to one month later. The camera pulls out to show that the Thunderbolt now rests as a static display in a glass shed/repurposed greenhouse at Titfield, just as a new steam engine rolls into the station with new rolling stock, hinting that the railway has thrived still. We see where everyone is now; Sam is enjoying the work but it's clear he's better suited to being a pastor rather than an engine driver. Harry and Joan talk about renting the train for a wedding procession in the next coming week, which Sam says he'd be honored to have that be his last day as an engine driver, and he mentions how the squire (I forget his character name) is working his way from guard to engine driver.
Marples makes an appearance at the end by parking his car near the station parking lot in an area that's heavily marked as "LOADING ZONE ONLY, NO PARKING." He comes up to Sam and is pleasant in front of the passengers before he turns and says "You won this one, but this silly little branchline will be erased from the face of the earth. I'll make sure of it." Suddenly CRASH!!! the camera cuts back to Marple's car being squashed by an ex-Pierce & Krupp delivery lorry. Sam smirks, Marples leaves to throw a fit at the lorry driver, but a nearby constaple is there to write a few tickets to Marples for knowingly parking in a no parking area. Marples looks down and sees a discarded ticket reading "The Titfeild-Mallingford Light Railway." In his anger he crushes it under heel and leaves the scene. The train blows its whistle and it slowly leaves Titfield as the camera slowly rises up before we get the end card saying "The End... for now"
After Dan & Mr Valentine stole a locomotive from BR they can't get another '1400' class. They also refuse when Rev Weech & Mr Valentine show interest in a Scottish locomotive by the name of 'Ben Alder', to Sam's disgust.
Mr Blakeworth finds the Ministry of Supply have some low-mileage Hunslet 'Austerity' 0-6-0ST's for sale.... Dan is seen whistling as he applies a fresh coat of Brunswick Green paint as one sits in Titfield goods yard underneath the Dutch barn 'shed'.
The wedding reception of Harry & Joan is supplied with game by Dan's poaching
To placate Mr Coggett, Dan, Sam & Squire Gordon have become card-carrying members of the National Association of Railway Workers.
@@NJPurling ohh also nice details! I like it!
To be honest, for Thunderbolt , it’d make sense to Use a currently operational old engine or one in good mechanical condition, for example , Furness No.20, and it was said Stirling Single No.1 was in good mechanical condition.
personally, remaking titfield in any way would run the risk of spoiling the original. We have a book which ties most of the ends up called 'Thunderbolts Last Run' and rapido have also added fictional histories to their wagon pack which is coming out in the new year
Who wrote the fictional histories for the wagons? ;) hehehe
What loco would play Thunderbolt, would it still be a 14xx and Tramcar? Do we still have a engine stolen from the yard? We need more answers……
Maybe perhaps an LNWR Cornwall or Bloomer for the old engine from the museum and an LMS Jinty, GWR 14xx or a BR Standard Class 2 for the engine running the line.
Watch closely around the 30s mark ;P
There are plenty of working preserved locomotives you could use, and a number of working replicas of engines even older than Lion.
As 'Thunderbolt' we could use the replica 'Planet' type. The locomotive theft does not happen as all they can find are brand-new Class 08 shunters, which Dan knows nothing about. They get chased off-shed by the railway police.
I always thought the joke ending subtly implies that the inspector is actually secretly pulling for them. Given the idea of having Ernest Marples as an antagonist, perhaps the inspector could appear in the background during the government setup scenes and be frustrated by Marples in small but definite ways. Too professional to defy him outright, perhaps he drops an explanatory hint about the speed limit-or some other detail-giving the villagers the chance they need; perhaps, also, he needs their application to be truly flawless since Marples himself is determined to see them fail ....
I really liked this thought experiment!
I think that a remake could be set in current times.
It could be one of the preserved railways facing either a take over by a theme park and the associated tacky developments that would effectively obliterate the old railway and the story could be the efforts of the existing heritage volunteers against the corporate theme park buying up shares etc.
Or it could also be about a conflict between a heritage railway and property developers buying up huge chunks of desirable rural land and therefore squeezing out the heritage railway.
Something similar has been happening in recent years to general leisure aviation where some of the smaller airfields have been bought up for housing estates and flying clubs have been displaced and had to close down.
"the recent train pack we made at work" - wait; you work at Rapido?? How did I not know this? That's really cool :))
yep - dream job :)
I like how you handled this. Heres a question for you. What would a Sequal of Titfield Thunderbolt be?
Also your point about story set later and government officials incl' Beeching were the thing to threton the railway, that would be a good film similar to Titfield Thunderbolt.
Thanks mate! If you are interested, Wild Swan have published a sequel book called 'Thunderbolt's Last Run' - might be worth a look!
Excellent film analysis. Please, not Netflix unless you follow the Beeching/Marples line. Incicentally, I think Beeching needs redeeming as the real crook was Marples who used Beeching as the fall guy. I have thought about this a lot. The Beeching story could be a Netflix series on its own.
Yes I agree there. You can just picture the montage of the multiple branch line visits!
Beeching did an awful lot of good, eg Freightliner, InterCity. If anything, Beeching kept far more lines open that it had been hoped to axe. Plus from 1923 to te 1960s more lines were closed than under Beeching. Several thousand miles went before WW2 as they were not economic and were a historical legacy of the unplaned, laissez-faire capitalist approach to the British railway network which was massively wasteful in terms of money and track mileage.
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory There's the hook right there - in a similar vein to the recent 'Cruella' film we can rehabilitate Beeching's legacy!
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory I agree, up to a point. The point being that his brief was how to stop the railways losing money. The obvious answer to that was to close the whole lot. (and there was a strong political movement for just that) That he managed to finesse things so that any railways remained open at all was pretty smart and, indeed he did that by arguing to keep a mainline freight and passenger service. However he made some broad assumptions which were not correct... and then Marples appeared on the scene. However, I guess that isn't for here as I'm hi-jacking the space of Railway Mania
@@RailwayManiaNet Either that or remake Beeching in Drag. (all I can think of is the Simpsons's "see my vest. Send help)
An American or German remake would unfortunately want me to have too many long lists of non operable locomotives I would see running in the movie. Virginia Truckee's J.W. Bowker being one however she would need a new boiler and the William mason would need a new firebox, although the Grand Trunk Western 0-8-0 that once ran in revenue service till 1980 on display at the Illinois Railway museum would need a full restoration but as a more "modern" steam engine and having been run and maintained till the end of it's life and being 99% complete, and with several surviving locomotives of the same class and not a one of a kind artifact and you could probably restore it to operation in 3 years.
First change: Mr.Valentine is played by 16 rats in a trench coat.
Nice, save on the catering bill, good shout
Calling Beeching Marples' crony is doing him a misjustice. Beeching produced the report that he was tasked with making, Marples studied it, adapted what he saw fit and then presented it to Parliament for approval. The road lobby was in full swing by then, so there was little that could have been done anyway to reverse the historic problems faced by the railways.
the more i have watch the film the more it seems that the railway inspector might have been trying to sneakily 'help' the villagers. He looks at his watch and his notes, almost as if he is working out timings, and then decides that it is the perfect time for an emergency brake test. And somehow does not notice that the sound of the engine has vanished and the coach is barely moving later......... He also does not question the fact that the water stop, from the perspective of those in the coach, is bloody short. As in, train stops and is ready to go again less than a minute later....... And if it was not for his impromptu brake test (and the issues that came along after that) they would have breached the 25mph limit........at least as far as timings were concerned.
Remembering that almost all of those locos in the film were scrapped
Except lion
Lion was in working order in the 1980s: I have ridden behind her.
Live action Ivor the Engine in a fantasy North Wales.
I really love the idea of the remake as a mini series, and ending with the set up for more challenges. Perhaps an adventure to Barry Island to acquire a suitable supplement for the Thunderbolt?
Personally I’d love to see the inspiration for The Titfield Thunderbold, Railway Adventure adapted. L. T. C. Rolt’s story has several cinematic images, such as Mr. Rolt walking along the entire line after Dolgoch failed.
Yes I agree. I wonder if such a film would follow Rolt's narrative (he was a jolly good storyteller) or possibly be a bit more even-handed?
@RailwayManiaNet I hope it would follow his book closely. The way he told it was stunning, and hard to top.
How many Thomas books and none cartoon tv episodes have there been? An they only show a few of the many loco classes.
The real star of this film, is the Lion. This locomotive is in the Liverpool Museum, at Pier Head. I am sure that you will not be able to do a remake, unless you can build a copy of it, as has been done with the Rocket.
The first-part description of the idea for a '60s version sounds an awful lot like the American TV sitcom series "Petticoat Junction" (1963-1970), wherein the main antagonist in the first couple of seasons is a stickler railway executive during modernization who is trying to shutter an administratively forgotten branch line in rural America (which was cut off decades earlier from the mainline) that is still running an 1890s steam locomotive (staffed by lovable misfits and served by a quaint bed-and-breakfast) long after the rest of the world has switched to streamline diesels or semi-trucks. Small-town rustic hilarity, city-folk-vs-country-folk, and general yesteryear nostalgia ensues.
[ASIDE: the locomotive was played in distant shots by Sierra No. 3, which amongst many other roles was the loco in "Back to the Future Part III".]
Come to think of it, have you seen the 1959 film It Happened to Jane? A lobster merchant gains legal title over a steam locomotive after the railroad refuses to compensate her for damaged goods (a freight of lobster left to die on a siding through an administrative screw up). One thing leads to another and the town decides to run the train themselves...
alternatively..just follow the follow up book ..think the idea of traction engines coming over the hill will be a fascination in its self
I think Netflix have it wrong, as a viewer i prefer stand alone programs but then i only watch "live " broadcasts not catch up or "box sets", oh and a ton of RUclips.
For the Serenity Ending, One Month Later. It absolutely should not be "Thunderbolt" on the train. It's done its job, back to pride of place in the Museum. Retirement well earned. Instead something more modern in its place - a proper railway not a trainset of bits and bobs. That's what the villagers wanted. Their railway, and part of the mainline. It's all very cutesy to think about them carrying on with "Thunderbolt" and whatever, but just wouldn't be workable. Railway saved, part of network, modern passenger stock.
and then..... PACERS!
@@RailwayManiaNet suitably branded in Titfield & Mallingford Light Railway colours, sure. why not? buzz buzz. ting ting.
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory I did do a quick photoshop of a 14xx in T&MR livery but I think my haste did not do it justice. Either that or it was too OTT....
Interesting! But can't assume the livery on Thunderbolt was the original livery of th engine or that adopted by the Light Railway......am I thinking about this too hard?@@RailwayManiaNet
8:08 Poor Northiam...
If it was re-made today, it would have a bus replacement service in place, somewhat demolishing the original plot me thinks!
Hahahaha true - run by FirstPearce & Crump
How can I find titfield thunderbolt and we’re can I find it
I think it's on amazon prime, sometimes BBC iplayer, it's also available on blu-ray
Personally speaking, leave it alone! So much of the film's charm is due to the era it was made, celebrating a world and an England that was already on the verge of dieing. You couldn't recreate it. A teacher friend was discussing the film with his class after it had been on TV, and told me that his 1980's teenagers couldn't believe that a world where only one person had a car, the only tv was in the pub, and the community was wholly dependent on public (rail) transport had ever existed. The innocense of the villagers' world is unbelievable now....... and we've become immune to corruptuion of the Beeching/Marples variety. This, apparently, is called 'progress'.............
For the series, it could be that the goverment gets involved and sambotages coal transports and what not maybe?
For me, Ealing and Titfield have always represented something so very quintessentially English. Parochial? A time when attitudes, manners and sense of community were so very different to today. Not something I believe a "modern" audience would expect or understand in the same way sadly.
By the time corporate entity and equality committees were through with "suggested" changes to ethnicity and gender equality we may end up with a film that was almost unrecognisable and lost it's heart (for me anyway).
Having said that, I do wonder if there is an opportunity to make some sort of follow-up storyline??? "Return of the Thunderbolt"? "Thunderbolt Strikes Again"? 😊
Someone suggested that the fan-made sequel 'Thunderbolt's Last Run' by Wild Swan would make a good subject for a follow-up.
@@RailwayManiaNet Was not aware of this book, so thank you for mentioning it. Now on order :)
The ethnicity factor can be easily fixed even in context of the time. All you need is a character who used to drive or maintain old steam engines in the Caribbean before coming to an English village. There were for a long time steam trains on sugarcane plantations. The character would obviously be a more sincere Christian than many of the villagers, leading singing in the church.
@@DavidNewmanDr indeed. Very true. Maybe a worker from the railways of India? There was that great character in North West Frontier who drove the engine. I like the idea. :)
It does sound like an excellent idea, though you can’t use the original Titfield Thunderbolt line since that line had been turned to roads. Best option now is to find a new location that could fit.
I consider your projections to "remake" Thunderbolt are spurious - there is no need to update a classic, let alone engage in the production of a miniseries; it is as Led Zeppelin's 'Stairway To Heaven' - covers have been attempted, but they fall flat, primarily due to the fact that you cannot re-invent or re-imagine anyone other than Page, Plant, Bonham & Jones playing that seminal piece - indeed, if one goes into a musical instrument store, there's an unwritten rule of thumb - 'No Stairway To Heaven' to be recited on the premises - rigidly enforced by the store employees. I'm all for living in the here & now, but to deny an audience a dalliance with the past, somehow goes against the grain....Thumbs up for a polished presentation,
Andrew.
hehehe - really it's just a prompt to look at how storytelling and audience expectation has changed over the years, a sneaky Trojan Horse for some rambling!
Indeed, RM - a not-so-subtle "Trojan Horse" 😉
@@andrewtongue7084 A Trojan 'Thunderbolt' perhaps!
Quite so, RM 🙂
The film was fine as it was, leave it alone.
How on Earth can you remake classics like this. How about Genevieve? Mouse that Roared? Nup, can't see that happening.
The Ladykillers? ;)
@@RailwayManiaNetThey did remake it Diabolical.don,t look at it.
Some interesting thoughts🤔👍✌️
Didn't Beeching et al have shares in Road Haulage organisations that they transferred to their wives et al🤔 Modern government have shares in big pharma and have chucked big sums of money at the Industry to build new factories etc, so this kind of thing goes on.
Your thought processes are excellent, however for me, the Titfield Thunderbolt and its nostalgia? Needs leaving alone, too many things are being rewritten these days, rewriting history.
Eg look at the terrible CGI flying representation in "Pearl Harbor" (sic) plus the sickening love story. Even with cognitive dissonance (suspension of disbelief) thats a hard watch. But if the CGI were improved and the love story element rewritten, not a half bad film😉😳😀 Although older looking, Tora, Tora, Tora is arguably the better film🤔 Thank God that The Battle of Britain was filmed when it was - real aircraft (albeit some were Spanish with GB engines).
There’d probably be a bit of stuff in this movie that would be seen as offensive by today’s standards.
You mean Sid James?
Corbs you have too much time to think 🤣🤣🤣
This is true
I don’t think you can improve an original.