I don't know if you realize just how much of a great resource your channel is for us just starting out as board game designers, Adam. I am confident that because of watching your videos, when I do decide to finally focus and finish a couple of my games, they won't suck (or at least not as much) and that's a direct result of changes I've implemented after watching certain videos like this one. I have learned so much already, so thank you (once again).
Thanks Penguin - and for your continued support of the channel. My recent video about updated mechanisms has seemingly brought in a ton of new viewers - so it’s nice to still get comments from familiar names! :)
@@AdaminWales I am really glad to hear that. hope your channel keeps growing healthily moving forward, as you deserve. I'll be here to see it, for sure.
Having experiencing pitching TV shows, it's interesting to learn the similarities and differences in pitching game designs. I only design games casually for my friends and game groups and haven't had any aspirations to go wider, but it's good to hear these tips in case I do someday decide I have a design worth pitching to publishers.
Such great advice Adam and professionally presented to boot. Thanks for sharing resources available in the UK. Looking forward to creating some momentum with my game concept
Is there any video of the game that tanked beyond friends & family? I think it would be interesting to watch something a designer has high hopes of but turns out to be false.
Adam, sorry to hear about that little embarrassment, but your choice to take your prototype back was the best thing you could’ve done in that situation. Darn!
Great video! Though now I am worried about all my games not being tested enough 😉 Also, I believe LaunchLab can do 1000 copies now, at least for the card games I've been designing that is an option.
I've had the idea for my first boardgame for about 6 years now. I've gone on spurts of working on it but end up taking long breaks after hitting a wall or when my day job demands too much of my time. So happy I've found your channel, which has reinvigorated my passion for completing the project. Do you do, or would you consider, consulting work?
Thank you very much for this video, and all your other ones as well! Tons of great info. You mentioned that one of your games went out of print and the rights reverted back to you. Did the publisher have the right to renew and decline? Was this a shelf-space/finance type issue? Were you simply interested in self-publishing future versions? It would be interesting to hear more about this kind of topic. Thank you again
Sadly most games have a single print run and then go out of print. The publisher generally retains the right to continue producing copies, but if they cease to do so for a prolonged period, the contract terminates (or the designer can give notice of their intent to terminate). Basically if a game doesn’t sell as well as expected, publishers will frequently allow the designer to take the rights back because they have no intention of doing further printings of the game.
I feel like this advice applies to light or single concept games. I would like to know when to pitch a medium or heavy weight with multiple hooks and a variety of mechanisms.
I don’t think the principle is all that different. The more mechanisms at play, the more difficult it will be to balance a game. So more playtests will be needed. But otherwise, the same as for lighter games. I strongly feel that a designer should value their (unpaid) development time. So I think much of the balancing work should be done AFTER a game is licensed (and appropriately remunerated). Sadly, this rarely happens. I would pitch such a game as soon as I felt it was relatively balanced and providing a consistent enjoyable experience to the players - but make publishers aware that I’m open to doing more development work (within reason) after signing a contract.
Great video as always and love your honesty and willingness to share your own experiences, the good, the bad and the ugly. Hoping to get to UKGE this year, work permitting.
In regards to play testing I think there’s a lot to be said about variety of playtests. You might playtest solo, in-person, blind, with gamers, or at different player counts. You learn a lot more from those than from just playing many games with your friends.
Great video! Remember- playing and play-testing are 2 different things! Too many people confuse the concepts- sometimes the “dog and pony show “ for your game may also give you a higher level of confidence in your pitch-
This blind trading is interesting. When I've talked to people about my game idea (and other ideas!) they're often very concerned that if I don't keep it close to my chest that someone might steal it! But instinct seems to be unfounded, and is in fact, a great way for your game to never see any kind of publication!
It depends on the complexity of the game. For a game with any degree of interwoven mechanisms, realistically nobody is going to steal the concept. It takes a lot of work to understand the complexities of a design - the game balance - etc. And plagiarists (who are rare) are probably too lazy to put in the work. But I do think designers of very simple games (kids games, party games) should be cautious. Those concepts are vulnerable. Generally speaking, if you work with people you trust you’re fine. You’re absolutely right that if you’re overprotective you’ll never get the game in front of the right people and you guarantee it will never be made.
You should do a video on deduction games, like Clue, Suspicion, Mystery of the Abbey, and Deception, murder in hong Kong. I feel like it’s a genre that has a lot of inherent issues, but can be fun if executed correctly
A rather newbie question here - how can you be sure that the publishers you've pitched the prototype to won't take advantage of what you've presented? What's preventing them from basically making an identical game after hearing your idea? Is there a way to protect your intellectual property on a product that is still in its development phase?
You can't ever be sure but that makes no sense as a publisher to do ever. You rely on having good designers sign games to you so you can then reap the fruit of their ingenuity and labor for many games to come. If you start scamming those promising people, i would suspect you wont go far as a publishing business.
I don't know if you realize just how much of a great resource your channel is for us just starting out as board game designers, Adam. I am confident that because of watching your videos, when I do decide to finally focus and finish a couple of my games, they won't suck (or at least not as much) and that's a direct result of changes I've implemented after watching certain videos like this one. I have learned so much already, so thank you (once again).
Thanks Penguin - and for your continued support of the channel. My recent video about updated mechanisms has seemingly brought in a ton of new viewers - so it’s nice to still get comments from familiar names! :)
@@AdaminWales I am really glad to hear that. hope your channel keeps growing healthily moving forward, as you deserve. I'll be here to see it, for sure.
Having experiencing pitching TV shows, it's interesting to learn the similarities and differences in pitching game designs. I only design games casually for my friends and game groups and haven't had any aspirations to go wider, but it's good to hear these tips in case I do someday decide I have a design worth pitching to publishers.
Such great advice Adam and professionally presented to boot. Thanks for sharing resources available in the UK. Looking forward to creating some momentum with my game concept
Is there any video of the game that tanked beyond friends & family? I think it would be interesting to watch something a designer has high hopes of but turns out to be false.
No, there’s no video of it. I’ll keep it in my wardrobe full of old prototypes in case one day I think of some solutions to the problems! 🙂
Adam, sorry to hear about that little embarrassment, but your choice to take your prototype back was the best thing you could’ve done in that situation. Darn!
Great video! Though now I am worried about all my games not being tested enough 😉
Also, I believe LaunchLab can do 1000 copies now, at least for the card games I've been designing that is an option.
Thanks for the video! Now I need to playtest much more.
I've had the idea for my first boardgame for about 6 years now. I've gone on spurts of working on it but end up taking long breaks after hitting a wall or when my day job demands too much of my time. So happy I've found your channel, which has reinvigorated my passion for completing the project. Do you do, or would you consider, consulting work?
I’m afraid I don’t do consulting work due to a lack of time. But hopefully you’ll find plenty on my channel to answer most of your questions :)
Thank you very much for this video, and all your other ones as well! Tons of great info.
You mentioned that one of your games went out of print and the rights reverted back to you. Did the publisher have the right to renew and decline? Was this a shelf-space/finance type issue? Were you simply interested in self-publishing future versions? It would be interesting to hear more about this kind of topic. Thank you again
Sadly most games have a single print run and then go out of print. The publisher generally retains the right to continue producing copies, but if they cease to do so for a prolonged period, the contract terminates (or the designer can give notice of their intent to terminate).
Basically if a game doesn’t sell as well as expected, publishers will frequently allow the designer to take the rights back because they have no intention of doing further printings of the game.
Adam, love your channel! Are you willing to work privately with folks on helping with tips for developing their games?
I’m afraid I don’t have enough time to do that outside of public Playtest groups.
I feel like this advice applies to light or single concept games. I would like to know when to pitch a medium or heavy weight with multiple hooks and a variety of mechanisms.
I don’t think the principle is all that different. The more mechanisms at play, the more difficult it will be to balance a game. So more playtests will be needed. But otherwise, the same as for lighter games.
I strongly feel that a designer should value their (unpaid) development time. So I think much of the balancing work should be done AFTER a game is licensed (and appropriately remunerated). Sadly, this rarely happens.
I would pitch such a game as soon as I felt it was relatively balanced and providing a consistent enjoyable experience to the players - but make publishers aware that I’m open to doing more development work (within reason) after signing a contract.
I tried to spot you at the UKGE but had no luck 😅
I got some vital feedback there on my prototype, well worth the trip!
Unfortunately I was unable to attend this year, last minute. Sorry I missed you. Glad you got helpful feedback though!
Great video as always and love your honesty and willingness to share your own experiences, the good, the bad and the ugly. Hoping to get to UKGE this year, work permitting.
In regards to play testing I think there’s a lot to be said about variety of playtests. You might playtest solo, in-person, blind, with gamers, or at different player counts. You learn a lot more from those than from just playing many games with your friends.
Great video! Remember- playing and play-testing are 2 different things! Too many people confuse the concepts- sometimes the “dog and pony show “ for your game may also give you a higher level of confidence in your pitch-
This blind trading is interesting. When I've talked to people about my game idea (and other ideas!) they're often very concerned that if I don't keep it close to my chest that someone might steal it! But instinct seems to be unfounded, and is in fact, a great way for your game to never see any kind of publication!
It depends on the complexity of the game. For a game with any degree of interwoven mechanisms, realistically nobody is going to steal the concept. It takes a lot of work to understand the complexities of a design - the game balance - etc. And plagiarists (who are rare) are probably too lazy to put in the work. But I do think designers of very simple games (kids games, party games) should be cautious. Those concepts are vulnerable. Generally speaking, if you work with people you trust you’re fine. You’re absolutely right that if you’re overprotective you’ll never get the game in front of the right people and you guarantee it will never be made.
You should do a video on deduction games, like Clue, Suspicion, Mystery of the Abbey, and Deception, murder in hong Kong. I feel like it’s a genre that has a lot of inherent issues, but can be fun if executed correctly
Adam, I mean this with the utmost kindness and sincerity: you could be a very capable Michael Rosen impersonator.
Someone else said that recently so it must be true! :) I hadn’t heard of him but I looked up some clips and he seems pretty great 👍
Hopefully see you at UKGE again this year. Thanks for so much great advice and content.
See you there! :)
A rather newbie question here - how can you be sure that the publishers you've pitched the prototype to won't take advantage of what you've presented? What's preventing them from basically making an identical game after hearing your idea? Is there a way to protect your intellectual property on a product that is still in its development phase?
You can't ever be sure but that makes no sense as a publisher to do ever.
You rely on having good designers sign games to you so you can then reap the fruit of their ingenuity and labor for many games to come.
If you start scamming those promising people, i would suspect you wont go far as a publishing business.
It will destroy their reputation - it's a niche product, they live and die by their reputation