Brilliant. from someone who does watch other YT vids, you have 3 original YT thoughts on the toss.... target, (not rocket science but no one else has said it) low toss, and blind serve. Very useful and look forward to trying them. Thanks
The bird release. Great lesson. Your comment brings an old lesson full circle. After playing with a partner in Mexico City, I commented to my old coach in L.A. that he tosses with a cocked wrist. As a trained kinesiologist, he said that it's amazing how this cocked wrist positively affects the toss, and the whole serve (he didn't mention a bird). Your comment about releasing a bird positions the wrist in a cocked position, maintaining the index finger horizontally level as if enabling a bird to perch on it. It works for me. Thanks.
This is the one ! Serving with your eyes closed is an amazing tip ! In fact, if we manage to throw the ball and serve with our eyes closed, we go to another level.
Love your vids. I've learned quite a lot from you, especially helped by your lesson about hitting groundstrokes more open stance when possible to increase body coil rather than hitting from more neutral or closed stances. Not sure I agree with the low ball toss on the serve. I think low tosses can do three bad things, 1-hiting in the net, 2-hitting serve long over the back of the service box, and 3-lack of power (unless you're Nick Kyrgios). The serve involves a windup not unlike a baseball pitcher, and no the serve is not a throwing-a-ball motion, but the wind up is similar. This windup takes time and does involve coiling the body and legs in preparation for rotating with more power into striking the ball. Also, getting the feet into proper starting position with the toe of the back foot lined up approximately with the heel of the forward foot is another key. Too many rec players stand with shoulders too square to the net and this lack of rotation kills power. I find using some on court points of reference help with controlling the toss. With the feet in the proper position and the racquet and ball held in front of the body in whatever position feels comfortable,. Rather than cradling the ball in the palm, or holding it with fingertips, hold the ball with fingers wrapped around the sides of the ball much the way you would hold a wine glass. Start with the tossing arm straight with the ball toss hand at waist level or lower. As the racquet drops down and back into the backswing, aim the tossing arm and hand toward the net post. Raise the tossing arm up, keeping it straight (no elbow bend allowed) and release the ball from your wineglass grip at about eye level or slightly above. The next part involves practice repetitions to get the feel and execution right. Toss the ball high enough to allow the racquet to move up from it's low backward swing and to rise up over the shoulder and begin to travel behind the head and into the racquet drop with the racquet head on edge (no waiter tray). The correct height of the toss (and this is what takes practice) is to have the ball dropping down into the contact point so the racquet arm is fully extended and pronated as the racquet face strikes the ball and follows through and down. The proper depth of the toss into the court is subjective, but should result in the feeling of slightly leaning forward into the serve in such a way as to carry the person serving one or two steps into court after striking the ball, but no so far out in front as to create a feeling of chasing after the ball to be able to strike it (again, practice).
#1 and #2 contradict each other, which one is it? #3 I can name plenty of players with high tosses who have crap serves, can think of very few low tosses on the tour where their service is bad. JJ Wolf comes to mind these days as a great example. Vic Braden said the higher the toss, the more things can go wrong ie timing, hitches, wind, etc.... and I agree.
@@jacobhansen8965 Dear JH, maybe you have not experimented with your serve much and I never said my post was a one size fits all thing, as why I referenced Kyrgios as an example of an awesome serve with a relatively low toss. In general...and I repeat...in general...the greatest servers of all time have had a high toss...but height is a relative thing. I never said toss the ball up to the moon. I just said I would not recommend an intentionally low toss and I will stick to my opinion that this is worse than it is better. What is BEST is the toss height that works for the individual player. I hope we can agree on that.
@@jacobhansen8965 I think #1 can happen because you hit the ball lower than you should, mainly due to being late on contact. #2 can happen if you feel rushed and you compensate by being early on contact, leaving an up angle on your racket head at contact. I do believe these things can happen with a low toss, however, with some patience and a lot of practice, these issues could be lessened.
@@twinwankel You could say that about any stroke then. A high toss will make you early because you're waiting for the toss to come down, but then it will also make you late because the ball moves downward at a faster rate. Kind of an asinine comment, which was my point, to begin with.
Perfect and ingenious as always, great advices Tom. Serving with the closed eyes just the scoop! One minor advice from my side, though. Most amateurs toss too low, then too high. And for a reason. Control. They try to maximise control. The result is clumsy awkward motion instead. What you are saying about, the problems with the toss too high are 100% true. Still for most amateurs for the sake of control they got into this trap of control, hence they might wrongly interpret your advice and start tossing even lower...omg...please try to balance your analysis 😊
I think saying that most pros use a j-toss is an exaggeration. IMO, most pros don’t use a j-toss, especially not those who step up. Kyrgios, Isner and Serena being prime examples of a near ideal standard toss.
I feel there is no straight toss. All toss are J toss. Only diff is larger J or smaller J. Federer starts his toss from inside his left knee. Djokovic starts his toss from outside his left knee. Federer's tossed ball has more vector moving inside the court while Djokovic tossed ball moves more straight up and down. Djokovic tossed ball definitely not straight up and down. Both of their tossed ball moves left ward. I think Djokovic toss has more error margin. I also experimented both and feel so too. The down side of smaller J is that, it's against how you want to burst your force to hit the ball (a little). I also found Sarapova's toss is very straight up and down. I cannot figure out how she could do that.
Brilliant. from someone who does watch other YT vids, you have 3 original YT thoughts on the toss.... target, (not rocket science but no one else has said it) low toss, and blind serve. Very useful and look forward to trying them. Thanks
The bird release. Great lesson. Your comment brings an old lesson full circle. After playing with a partner in Mexico City, I commented to my old coach in L.A. that he tosses with a cocked wrist. As a trained kinesiologist, he said that it's amazing how this cocked wrist positively affects the toss, and the whole serve (he didn't mention a bird). Your comment about releasing a bird positions the wrist in a cocked position, maintaining the index finger horizontally level as if enabling a bird to perch on it. It works for me. Thanks.
This is the one !
Serving with your eyes closed is an amazing tip !
In fact, if we manage to throw the ball and serve with our eyes closed, we go to another level.
Super, 4.5 nearly 73yo; really improved quality of serve and this way does not break down!! Thanks
Great thinking, Tom. With a lower toss it becomes more of a placement of ball rather than a throw. Excellent point! Thank you.
No nonsense indeed. It’s brilliant actually!👍
Great tips and analysis
Love your vids. I've learned quite a lot from you, especially helped by your lesson about hitting groundstrokes more open stance when possible to increase body coil rather than hitting from more neutral or closed stances. Not sure I agree with the low ball toss on the serve. I think low tosses can do three bad things, 1-hiting in the net, 2-hitting serve long over the back of the service box, and 3-lack of power (unless you're Nick Kyrgios).
The serve involves a windup not unlike a baseball pitcher, and no the serve is not a throwing-a-ball motion, but the wind up is similar. This windup takes time and does involve coiling the body and legs in preparation for rotating with more power into striking the ball. Also, getting the feet into proper starting position with the toe of the back foot lined up approximately with the heel of the forward foot is another key. Too many rec players stand with shoulders too square to the net and this lack of rotation kills power. I find using some on court points of reference help with controlling the toss. With the feet in the proper position and the racquet and ball held in front of the body in whatever position feels comfortable,. Rather than cradling the ball in the palm, or holding it with fingertips, hold the ball with fingers wrapped around the sides of the ball much the way you would hold a wine glass.
Start with the tossing arm straight with the ball toss hand at waist level or lower. As the racquet drops down and back into the backswing, aim the tossing arm and hand toward the net post. Raise the tossing arm up, keeping it straight (no elbow bend allowed) and release the ball from your wineglass grip at about eye level or slightly above.
The next part involves practice repetitions to get the feel and execution right. Toss the ball high enough to allow the racquet to move up from it's low backward swing and to rise up over the shoulder and begin to travel behind the head and into the racquet drop with the racquet head on edge (no waiter tray). The correct height of the toss (and this is what takes practice) is to have the ball dropping down into the contact point so the racquet arm is fully extended and pronated as the racquet face strikes the ball and follows through and down.
The proper depth of the toss into the court is subjective, but should result in the feeling of slightly leaning forward into the serve in such a way as to carry the person serving one or two steps into court after striking the ball, but no so far out in front as to create a feeling of chasing after the ball to be able to strike it (again, practice).
#1 and #2 contradict each other, which one is it? #3 I can name plenty of players with high tosses who have crap serves, can think of very few low tosses on the tour where their service is bad. JJ Wolf comes to mind these days as a great example. Vic Braden said the higher the toss, the more things can go wrong ie timing, hitches, wind, etc.... and I agree.
@@jacobhansen8965 Dear JH, maybe you have not experimented with your serve much and I never said my post was a one size fits all thing, as why I referenced Kyrgios as an example of an awesome serve with a relatively low toss. In general...and I repeat...in general...the greatest servers of all time have had a high toss...but height is a relative thing. I never said toss the ball up to the moon. I just said I would not recommend an intentionally low toss and I will stick to my opinion that this is worse than it is better. What is BEST is the toss height that works for the individual player. I hope we can agree on that.
@@jacobhansen8965 I think #1 can happen because you hit the ball lower than you should, mainly due to being late on contact. #2 can happen if you feel rushed and you compensate by being early on contact, leaving an up angle on your racket head at contact. I do believe these things can happen with a low toss, however, with some patience and a lot of practice, these issues could be lessened.
@@twinwankel You could say that about any stroke then. A high toss will make you early because you're waiting for the toss to come down, but then it will also make you late because the ball moves downward at a faster rate. Kind of an asinine comment, which was my point, to begin with.
@@jacobhansen8965 "Heavy Sigh" SMH
Another great video!
Innovative lesson and entertaining as usual.
Perfect and ingenious as always, great advices Tom. Serving with the closed eyes just the scoop! One minor advice from my side, though. Most amateurs toss too low, then too high. And for a reason. Control. They try to maximise control. The result is clumsy awkward motion instead. What you are saying about, the problems with the toss too high are 100% true. Still for most amateurs for the sake of control they got into this trap of control, hence they might wrongly interpret your advice and start tossing even lower...omg...please try to balance your analysis 😊
Thank youuuu I was looking for videos with j toss involved
_Hahahahahaha_ lovin' the faux Yankee accent (3:11)
Tennis AND comedy!
Thanks for the great tips! I really like your 3:14 lateral "J" toss. 🤣🤣🤣
Billy found this video helpful
I think saying that most pros use a j-toss is an exaggeration. IMO, most pros don’t use a j-toss, especially not those who step up. Kyrgios, Isner and Serena being prime examples of a near ideal standard toss.
u dont watch tennis utoob vids...😅
Nah. I’ll go down the rabbit hole and before you know it they’ll have me hitting next gen forehands and I’ll be missing every shot. Haha
i like the shoes
Thanks. That’s what’s most important
😂
If you haven't released a baby bird, you haven't lived
I feel there is no straight toss. All toss are J toss. Only diff is larger J or smaller J. Federer starts his toss from inside his left knee. Djokovic starts his toss from outside his left knee. Federer's tossed ball has more vector moving inside the court while Djokovic tossed ball moves more straight up and down. Djokovic tossed ball definitely not straight up and down. Both of their tossed ball moves left ward. I think Djokovic toss has more error margin. I also experimented both and feel so too. The down side of smaller J is that, it's against how you want to burst your force to hit the ball (a little). I also found Sarapova's toss is very straight up and down. I cannot figure out how she could do that.
baby bird my butt. I'm using Roddick serve (slower, obviously) because my left hand will be in a cast for six months this fall.
like
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