I played Aeronautica Imperialis so I wanted to build a pure vehicle army for Solar Auxilia. After setting up my army with 4 Thunderbolt, 8 Avenger and 4 Marauder, 10 Leman Russ Vanquisher, 6 Malcador and a full Baneblade detachment I added a few Veletaris and Bastion and... then I began hearing about how broken the precise thing I had come up with is...
It's still very early in the game cycle. I think people are throwing the "broken" phrase around way too much. Yes, they are high efficiency, but not without flaw or needing strategy.
You missed the biggest factor in air v air. Overwatch. 4 SA fliers with the skyfire missiles in overwatch will kill a max squad of enemy flyers reliably. It's really really bad. SA flyers going first area deny a bubble of 30 inches. Even a thunderhawk squadron cannot tangle with that overwatch. This overwatch thing makes the avenger and t bolt the WORST AA flyers because their guns are too short range and they only get a single skystrike compared the the double skystrikes on the lightning and marauder.
Thanks for pointing this out. Our local players had not played around with the Marauder or Lightning on overwatch in the middle of the map. It definitely makes the Lightning better, and seems to be one best aircraft uses. Thanks for the info.
For space marines you need at least 3 storm eagles to transport the compulsory units. I load 16 assault marines in two thunderhawks and 2x4 core of tacticals in stormeagles. Would it be better to upgrade the stormeagles into 2 more thunderhawks for +100pts and the ability to add missile launchers to core groups. Compulsory: - HQ: Legion Command Squad (1), 25pts - Core: Legion Tactical Detachment (4), 35pts - Core: Legion Tactical Detachment (4), 35pts - Support: Legion Assault Detachment (8), 54pts 4 Additional Assault Marines Optional: - Support: Legion Assault Detachment (8), 54pts 4 Additional Assault Marines - Air Support: Legion Xiphon Interceptor Squadron (1), 95pts - Dedicated: Storm Eagle Dedicated Transports (2), 200pts 1 Additional Storm Eagle - Dedicated: Thunderhawk Dedicated Transports (2), 300pts 1 Additional Thunderhawk Gunship
I have been playing a White Scars Aerial Assault and have two opinions. Thunderhawks are great for holding a single full detachment dedicated to assaulting,with Terminators or Assault Marines. What I do find is that the formation needs more infantry somewhere to not be assaulting, for the sole purpose of increasing the formation breakpoint. Sticking Missile marines and rapier on an objective are my preferred ranged option for this. I haven't edited decided what is best for the mandatory tactical and commander and usually just stick them in one Storm Eagle. The rest of an army's points I use for other Legion Formations.
You are absolutely correct! I must have accidentally overlooked them. They are actually #6 at 8.44 Firepower rating. Interestingly, the Marauder assault cannon should also be on that list at 5.60.
People throw out the "Broken" term too easily. Only two things i think are actually broken is Leman Russ Vanq weapons shouldnt have Armorbane (even without armorbane its superior to the other gun in every single way, anti-tank is not a negative worth paying attention to) and Infiltrate offers complete board control too easily. SA fliers are strong, im not denying that. But theres a difference between "perhaps a bit too good" and "wtf that is busted" - i think they just need to go up 10-15pts. I think the biggest reason people freak out about SA are beter than Marines is simply the Marine simps going "We arent near autowin unless completely swarmed wtf is this crap!" - this game is supposed to be fairly evenly numbered, SA have more infantry bases typically but the vehicles are about the same more-or-less. SA hit on 4s, but Marines have Accurate flippin' everywhere and a lot of their stuff also hits on 4s anyway. Every game ive played so far ive only eek'd out a victory, never a total stompfest like people are acting like SA cause.
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I played Aeronautica Imperialis so I wanted to build a pure vehicle army for Solar Auxilia. After setting up my army with 4 Thunderbolt, 8 Avenger and 4 Marauder, 10 Leman Russ Vanquisher, 6 Malcador and a full Baneblade detachment I added a few Veletaris and Bastion and... then I began hearing about how broken the precise thing I had come up with is...
It's still very early in the game cycle. I think people are throwing the "broken" phrase around way too much. Yes, they are high efficiency, but not without flaw or needing strategy.
@@BattleWagon2467 I had one match, albeit with a smaller variant of this. It was a massacre. They need to fix solar auxilia flyers.
How big was the game @@Argosh
You missed the biggest factor in air v air. Overwatch. 4 SA fliers with the skyfire missiles in overwatch will kill a max squad of enemy flyers reliably. It's really really bad. SA flyers going first area deny a bubble of 30 inches. Even a thunderhawk squadron cannot tangle with that overwatch.
This overwatch thing makes the avenger and t bolt the WORST AA flyers because their guns are too short range and they only get a single skystrike compared the the double skystrikes on the lightning and marauder.
Thanks for pointing this out. Our local players had not played around with the Marauder or Lightning on overwatch in the middle of the map. It definitely makes the Lightning better, and seems to be one best aircraft uses. Thanks for the info.
For space marines you need at least 3 storm eagles to transport the compulsory units. I load 16 assault marines in two thunderhawks and 2x4 core of tacticals in stormeagles. Would it be better to upgrade the stormeagles into 2 more thunderhawks for +100pts and the ability to add missile launchers to core groups.
Compulsory:
- HQ: Legion Command Squad (1), 25pts
- Core: Legion Tactical Detachment (4), 35pts
- Core: Legion Tactical Detachment (4), 35pts
- Support: Legion Assault Detachment (8), 54pts
4 Additional Assault Marines
Optional:
- Support: Legion Assault Detachment (8), 54pts
4 Additional Assault Marines
- Air Support: Legion Xiphon Interceptor Squadron (1), 95pts
- Dedicated: Storm Eagle Dedicated Transports (2), 200pts
1 Additional Storm Eagle
- Dedicated: Thunderhawk Dedicated Transports (2), 300pts
1 Additional Thunderhawk Gunship
I have been playing a White Scars Aerial Assault and have two opinions. Thunderhawks are great for holding a single full detachment dedicated to assaulting,with Terminators or Assault Marines. What I do find is that the formation needs more infantry somewhere to not be assaulting, for the sole purpose of increasing the formation breakpoint. Sticking Missile marines and rapier on an objective are my preferred ranged option for this. I haven't edited decided what is best for the mandatory tactical and commander and usually just stick them in one Storm Eagle. The rest of an army's points I use for other Legion Formations.
Surprised the Fire Raptor Tempest rockets didn't make it into the list of good AA weapons
You are absolutely correct! I must have accidentally overlooked them. They are actually #6 at 8.44 Firepower rating. Interestingly, the Marauder assault cannon should also be on that list at 5.60.
great breakdown thanks
My pleasure!
People throw out the "Broken" term too easily. Only two things i think are actually broken is Leman Russ Vanq weapons shouldnt have Armorbane (even without armorbane its superior to the other gun in every single way, anti-tank is not a negative worth paying attention to) and Infiltrate offers complete board control too easily.
SA fliers are strong, im not denying that. But theres a difference between "perhaps a bit too good" and "wtf that is busted" - i think they just need to go up 10-15pts.
I think the biggest reason people freak out about SA are beter than Marines is simply the Marine simps going "We arent near autowin unless completely swarmed wtf is this crap!" - this game is supposed to be fairly evenly numbered, SA have more infantry bases typically but the vehicles are about the same more-or-less. SA hit on 4s, but Marines have Accurate flippin' everywhere and a lot of their stuff also hits on 4s anyway.
Every game ive played so far ive only eek'd out a victory, never a total stompfest like people are acting like SA cause.
Great analysis. Giving the static anti-air (deredeos etc) less range than the aircraft certainly was a choice!
Yes, as we get into playing more games, that design decision is one thing I would hope is addressed.