Lou, for the nacelle wiring you could use the brass tube itself as the ground return and save yourself a wire. Same principle as a car wiring loom, with the metal body providing ground to halve the amount of wire needed.
We model railroaders do that all the time when wiring up trackside signals. You end up with a prototypical look when one conductor is the brass signal mast tube, and the other conductor is a single wire running up through the tube and out of the top, curling into the back of the signal housing.
On the contrary, Lou, this part of the weeds is the sexy stuff. Knowing what goes into a model or even your thought processes surrounding the template and vinyl work-- it adds to the overall! For support, I would consider seeing if 1/2" black iron pipe would fit. There's a world of fittings and I think it would resist flexing a lot better than the threaded brass tubing. I do think you'll need something to help hold up the secondary hull spine. Just not sure what. I know you have access to a metal and welder person, that would do the trick. Or, maybe you need to re-think the support in acrylic (the Jim Key approach). Yes, it's harder to figure out the inner surface-- but maybe tabs that "reach up" from the sides will fill the gap. Certainly something like that for the secondary hull might work. As for getting light into those thin saucer edges-- I think you may have to bite down on that bullet and string together some 3mm LEDs and point them at the edge. The only thing wrong with LED strip is that they are wide when you least need it. You also might want to try some plastic paint adhesion promoter spray-- automotive shops carry it. Made by Duplicolor.
thanks for the tip on the black iron. I'll be sure to check that out. cutting it to length could be a bugger...I tend to favor lamp parts because I'm familiar with them. not always a good thing.
@@aztekdummy I think you'll be surprised. They already have some mighty short lengths all cut up (called "nipples"-- go figure). The only trouble is the "last inch" which is that doing what you need to do is made difficult by how tough that stuff is. Getting a low-profile shape that has an adjustable angle AND attach to black iron pipe may be impossible. The next Home Depot Department I would send you to is the electrical! The conduit fittings have a mind-boggling assortment of clamps, hooks and shapes. That might -- might -- do it. I recommend the black iron stuff because that's what the Greg Jein workshop uses! I hope you're putting your feet up this weekend-- that surface plotting stuff looks eye-strainey.
This is going to be another interesting build Lou. What a challenge! I've always loved the D Enterprise. I think I told you about the one I still have in a box with that little drill for all of that fiber optics! By the way, I took your advice and purchased the drill that Tamiya makes. Seems it's going to be a handy little tool. Looking forward to the next post.
Whew! This is going to be a beast of a build! I kind of wish the paint scheme on these ships was less complicated for us not- so- great model builders so we could at least make our models look nice. The crazy amount of different colored panels all over the ship is almost overkill especially since it wasn't even seen on screen.
Great start on the big D Lou,i have Don's Reliant to build was waiting for Eliot to make some nice photo etch parts for it,but not sure if that's going to happen yet,i may have to get on with the build in the New Year. As for lighting the front of the saucer i would recommend HD Modelworx they have some LED strip that is 2mm wide and is perfect for this installation. I would love to get this kit,shipping to the UK and customs charges makes it too expensive sadly.
Lou, for the support ring you are proposing, flat stock rather than rod may easier (and better) to use. Easier to get into the “ring” shape and for the end angles for bolts to attach. If you’re using brass, you need to probably anneal it. Just a comment. I KNOW you’ll have fun building this one. I’m gonna be glued to the channel to watch it arise from chunks of resin to a STARSHIP!!!
Lou, I am watching your videos with a great deal of interest, and I love what you're doing with the kit. Great idea about the lip on the bottom of the saucer. I hope to get a lot of pulls from the current mold but, when a new one is made, I'll be adding that lip. Sorry about the excess resin on the saucer bottom...since it's imperative that the window ring and area just above it have a perfectly clean edge when the fiberglass is laid out, there's extra material, meant to be removed, for the rough edge that will be left during the lay-up process. Unfortunately, as you can see, the area leading out to the edge on the bottom is flat...if it curved upward, you'd see what you saw on the saucer top, not much material to sand off. What you have is the very first saucer casting and one of the first things I've ever made with fiberglass...subsequent casts have a little less material, but they're all pretty much the same due to the nature of the mold and the process. Lastly, I have one suggestion: you mentioned small LEDs for the red and green lights at the rear of the secondary hull. Since that area is so thin, my intent was that the red and green lights be housed inside the hull and fiber optic strands be run off them and threaded through drilled holes in the hull, much like the window lights you see on big Star Destroyer models. This should give you tiny lights in scale with the ship. Fiber optics can also be used to run out to the saucer edges...embed the strand far enough in from the edge and the translucent resin should disperse the light effectively to not appear as a point light.
hey! thanks for the kind words!the super tiny smleds I've got planned for the nav lights are so small that I can drill out a dimple in the resin and then put the led in place and fill it back in with epoxy. just you wait and see. I have better luck with those than running Fiber. it always snaps on me and with the rest of the kit also being clear it would be doubly hard to isolate the fiber and keep the light spill down
Hi your ship is absolutely amazing. The enterprise D is my favourite ship ever. I've made so many over the years but this model is a thing of beauty. I'd love to add it to my collection but I bet it don't come cheap.
Hi I am thinking of you could use a metal brake line to use as your armature from a car or truck to support your saucer there easy to bend into the shape that you are looking for
My concern is how the Pylons will ultimately hold up. It seems the connections are very flimsy and fragile, and I am afraid that over time the weight of the nacelles will pull it down or not. I am fascinated by your process to make masks however. Having made my own masks for the 1/1400 D (4 color) it is educational to see how you do it.
Jeff, that is a very real concern. I can tell you that the pylons are made of solid sturdy resin. The real lesson here is to add as little weight to them with the lighting as possible. Pylons are the bane of any Enterprise build. making sure they don't bow or rack or twist. I can only build as is and trust the materials will hold.
The resin/resin joint where the pylon is glued to the secondary hull is not meant to carry the weight of the pylon/nacelle assembly...that's the job of the brass tubes cast inside the pylons. It doesn't show on the pics on my site but it does mention in the instructions that the tubes are extended about an inch beyond the base of the pylons...this extra brass is present so the tubes can be bonded (epoxy?) to whatever inner structure is used inside the sec hull. Having bent a lot of these tubes to fit them into the molds, I can tell you it takes more force than the weight of the pylons/nacelles to bend them. As Lou mentioned, the resin is pretty strong...the problem with resin isn't a lack of tensile strength, it's a tendency to deform over time under excess load....the brass tubes should prevent that deformation.
Good to hear. I have no doubt it has been engineered well, just me being paranoid from previous resin models :D That said, I hope I can swing one of these...
@@dbs314 I should have said that it is was a valid question, not a "real concerm". I'm not concerned that the kit as presented would have any problems, just that the pylon issue is always something to think about when building any enterprise kit
Always learning with your videos, thank you. I was wondering where did you find this kit? I only ask because I would love to build a full resin kit like this.
First - thank you for this video. Its nice to hear someone else's thought process. I am wondering a few things... Is an armature really needed at all? the thickness of that fiberglass looks pretty substantial, and at first look appears to be strong enough as long as there is not a lot of weight added... just a thought. i was also wondering if you have the original green blue pattern that was on the ship during the series run. I ask for selfish reasons as I was planning to paint my as it was during the series not the (way more complicated) generations pattern. Thanks again for doing this
Frank, the ship doesn't come with a stand, so you need to put it on something unless you plan on hanging it. You are correct that it is very substantially made which means that you are going to need some help keeping it upright. hence the armature
Frank, the fiberglass saucer may be strong enough on its own...and the nacelles/pylons should be strong enough on their own...but these things are connected to the neck and secondary hull which are not intended to be unsupported by an inner structure. Yes, the neck is very thick and strong but the weight of the saucer will apply a fair amount of continuous torque to the neck...over time, it will likely bend. You can see the pieces of the secondary hull...they are cast thin, mainly because of the thin, chine-like edge of this part of the ship. They're not designed for structural strength. As it says on my website, a simple inner structure is recommended. Basically, what you want is something inside the secondary hull to bond the pylon tubes and a mounting point (if desired) to. To this, I would bond a PVC tube or conduit to feed up the neck and attach to a disc made of strong material like plexiglass to support the saucer. The inner structure doesn't need to be super-strong to withstand beatings...it just has to provide some extra support.
Lou, are those pics of the 6' Enterprise D available somewhere online? They would be, as you so correctly pointed out, invaluable for reference when building and lighting this kit. I look forward to hearing from you. All the best !
Hi Lou, I've been working on my own version of this one off and on for a while, and one issue that I seem to have is that the saucer seems to be too flat where it meets up with the neck part. Did you have this as well? How did you manage to solve it?
@@aztekdummy (Oops.. I just saw that I left out one crucial word in my original post.) Yes, cut out the cured area in the lower saucer half, and it's a near perfect fit! My problem is in the top half of the saucer behind the main shuttlebay, where it connects to that curvy portion of the neck. The edge on the saucer seems to be too shallow, causing the neck portion to stick out.
@@armandoscherpenzeel4359 Yes, I had that same problem. My neck still sticks up a bit. I remember building that area up from underneath the top saucer part and trying to keep the top saucer level with the top of the neck, but because of my armature, i had limited success with it. I ended up with a gap there that i had to fill with apoxie sculpt.
@@aztekdummy Thanks, I think I might give that a shot. Seems like I've got my work cut out for me. Hopefully I'll be able to get a fit close to your build, I didn't even notice it in the later footage of your build!
A slow, but necessary start. I do plan on getting one of these kits in the near future, so I'll be watching with great interest. Do the phaser strips have the ribbed detail? They aren't smooth are they?
@@aztekdummy HA! Also FYI, there are smaller sized LED strips out there. Jerry over at HDA Modelworx has some. They might have a better chance of fitting into those tight spaces: hdamodelworx.com/LED-TAPE-0805-WHITE-DOUBLE-DENSITY-600-LEDs-5m-_p_192.html
Love watching how you build these kits. With this vid showing everything about how to construct models of this size and all the planning that goes into the kit and initial construction is great
@@aztekdummy It seems that this kit is not (no longer?) available for sale, according to donshoko.com. Do you know anything about this? It’s nice to see all these new 1/1000 kits, but they are incomplete without the D.
if by slightly, you mean a lot . ertl saucer is 13" across. this on is 19. ertl nacelle is 7.5 in long , this one is 9.5 in but the best part is that it is smooth without the raised aztek lines
Lou Dalmaso I always hated those raised panel lines. It has kept me from ever making this ship. Too much sanding for my taste. I’d be afraid I’d take too much off. How do you feel about the wallpaper decals you find from aftermarket companies? Although I’ve been watching enough of your videos over the years that I think I know your answer. Loving this build so far!!
HI Lou, this thing looks like a monster! I have a link to Probert's list of paints used on the filming model if you are interested. memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Galaxy_class_model
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Lou, for the nacelle wiring you could use the brass tube itself as the ground return and save yourself a wire. Same principle as a car wiring loom, with the metal body providing ground to halve the amount of wire needed.
AHHh! you're killing me! I was holding on to that trick in case I needed it and was going to try to sound so clever when I brought it up. Oh well.....
Oops, sorry I stole your thunder! Oh well, great minds think alike I guess.
We model railroaders do that all the time when wiring up trackside signals. You end up with a prototypical look when one conductor is the brass signal mast tube, and the other conductor is a single wire running up through the tube and out of the top, curling into the back of the signal housing.
On the contrary, Lou, this part of the weeds is the sexy stuff. Knowing what goes into a model or even your thought processes surrounding the template and vinyl work-- it adds to the overall!
For support, I would consider seeing if 1/2" black iron pipe would fit. There's a world of fittings and I think it would resist flexing a lot better than the threaded brass tubing. I do think you'll need something to help hold up the secondary hull spine. Just not sure what.
I know you have access to a metal and welder person, that would do the trick.
Or, maybe you need to re-think the support in acrylic (the Jim Key approach). Yes, it's harder to figure out the inner surface-- but maybe tabs that "reach up" from the sides will fill the gap. Certainly something like that for the secondary hull might work.
As for getting light into those thin saucer edges-- I think you may have to bite down on that bullet and string together some 3mm LEDs and point them at the edge. The only thing wrong with LED strip is that they are wide when you least need it.
You also might want to try some plastic paint adhesion promoter spray-- automotive shops carry it. Made by Duplicolor.
thanks for the tip on the black iron. I'll be sure to check that out. cutting it to length could be a bugger...I tend to favor lamp parts because I'm familiar with them. not always a good thing.
@@aztekdummy I think you'll be surprised. They already have some mighty short lengths all cut up (called "nipples"-- go figure). The only trouble is the "last inch" which is that doing what you need to do is made difficult by how tough that stuff is. Getting a low-profile shape that has an adjustable angle AND attach to black iron pipe may be impossible. The next Home Depot Department I would send you to is the electrical! The conduit fittings have a mind-boggling assortment of clamps, hooks and shapes. That might -- might -- do it.
I recommend the black iron stuff because that's what the Greg Jein workshop uses!
I hope you're putting your feet up this weekend-- that surface plotting stuff looks eye-strainey.
Thanks Lou! I love that you share all the concepts....it's not easy or fast but I think your solution is spot on!
This is going to be another interesting build Lou. What a challenge! I've always loved the D Enterprise. I think I told you about the one I still have in a box with that little drill for all of that fiber optics! By the way, I took your advice and purchased the drill that Tamiya makes. Seems it's going to be a handy little tool. Looking forward to the next post.
Whew! This is going to be a beast of a build! I kind of wish the paint scheme on these ships was less complicated for us not- so- great model builders so we could at least make our models look nice. The crazy amount of different colored panels all over the ship is almost overkill especially since it wasn't even seen on screen.
I know what you mean; I had enough trouble painting different coloured Pearl Panels on the 537 Enterprise-A.
You are right about Jim when you shake his hand, you know it!
Great start on the big D Lou,i have Don's Reliant to build was waiting for Eliot to make some nice photo etch parts for it,but not sure if that's going to happen yet,i may have to get on with the build in the New Year.
As for lighting the front of the saucer i would recommend HD Modelworx they have some LED strip that is 2mm wide and is perfect for this installation.
I would love to get this kit,shipping to the UK and customs charges makes it too expensive sadly.
Excellent work as always Lou. Look forward to following this build.
Super interesting and exciting, very much looking forward to see how you progress on this one👍
Your a brave man. Look forward to the result and some new REAL star trek soon on tv.
Lou, for the support ring you are proposing, flat stock rather than rod may easier (and better) to use. Easier to get into the “ring” shape and for the end angles for bolts to attach. If you’re using brass, you need to probably anneal it. Just a comment. I KNOW you’ll have fun building this one. I’m gonna be glued to the channel to watch it arise from chunks of resin to a STARSHIP!!!
Lou, I am watching your videos with a great deal of interest, and I love
what you're doing with the kit. Great idea about the lip on the bottom
of the saucer. I hope to get a lot of pulls from the current mold but,
when a new one is made, I'll be adding that lip. Sorry about the
excess resin on the saucer bottom...since it's imperative that the
window ring and area just above it have a perfectly clean edge when the
fiberglass is laid out, there's extra material, meant to be removed,
for the rough edge that will be left during the lay-up process.
Unfortunately, as you can see, the area leading out to the edge on the
bottom is flat...if it curved upward, you'd see what you saw on the
saucer top, not much material to sand off. What you have is the very
first saucer casting and one of the first things I've ever made with
fiberglass...subsequent casts have a little less material, but they're all
pretty much the same due to the nature of the mold and the process. Lastly, I have one suggestion: you mentioned small LEDs for the red and green lights at the rear of the secondary hull. Since that area is so thin, my intent was that the red and green lights be housed inside the hull and fiber optic strands be run off them and threaded through drilled holes in the hull, much like the window lights you see on big Star Destroyer models. This should give you tiny lights in scale with the ship. Fiber optics can also be used to run out to the saucer edges...embed the strand far enough in from the edge and the translucent resin should disperse the light effectively to not appear as a point light.
hey! thanks for the kind words!the super tiny smleds I've got planned for the nav lights are so small that I can drill out a dimple in the resin and then put the led in place and fill it back in with epoxy. just you wait and see. I have better luck with those than running Fiber. it always snaps on me and with the rest of the kit also being clear it would be doubly hard to isolate the fiber and keep the light spill down
Hi your ship is absolutely amazing. The enterprise D is my favourite ship ever. I've made so many over the years but this model is a thing of beauty. I'd love to add it to my collection but I bet it don't come cheap.
@@aztekdummy Can't wait to see how you do it!
@@gremlin8464 Thanks! Yeah, unfortunately, it's pricey.
@@dbs314 ball park figure?
Hi I am thinking of you could use a metal brake line to use as your armature from a car or truck to support your saucer there easy to bend into the shape that you are looking for
the support look like a desk lamp frame, so maybe use a old lamp frame! that will give you all joint needed!
“Bumfuzzled” says it all!
For those who are interested, details about the kit can be seen here: www.donshoko.com/next/index.shtml
well thasts big one lot stuff darn it fist will be seeing the vid on that kit as post
Lou, try a rubber maid tote container to to wash large model parts.
good idea. I need to get one of those tubs for storing xmas decorations.
Hi Lou - mind sharing the link to your friend Jim's site with the high-res photos he took of the 6ft model? Thank you!
My concern is how the Pylons will ultimately hold up. It seems the connections are very flimsy and fragile, and I am afraid that over time the weight of the nacelles will pull it down or not.
I am fascinated by your process to make masks however. Having made my own masks for the 1/1400 D (4 color) it is educational to see how you do it.
Jeff,
that is a very real concern. I can tell you that the pylons are made of solid sturdy resin. The real lesson here is to add as little weight to them with the lighting as possible. Pylons are the bane of any Enterprise build. making sure they don't bow or rack or twist. I can only build as is and trust the materials will hold.
The resin/resin joint where the pylon is glued to the secondary hull is not meant to carry the weight of the pylon/nacelle assembly...that's the job of the brass tubes cast inside the pylons. It doesn't show on the pics on my site but it does mention in the instructions that the tubes are extended about an inch beyond the base of the pylons...this extra brass is present so the tubes can be bonded (epoxy?) to whatever inner structure is used inside the sec hull. Having bent a lot of these tubes to fit them into the molds, I can tell you it takes more force than the weight of the pylons/nacelles to bend them. As Lou mentioned, the resin is pretty strong...the problem with resin isn't a lack of tensile strength, it's a tendency to deform over time under excess load....the brass tubes should prevent that deformation.
Good to hear. I have no doubt it has been engineered well, just me being paranoid from previous resin models :D
That said, I hope I can swing one of these...
@@dbs314
I should have said that it is was a valid question, not a "real concerm".
I'm not concerned that the kit as presented would have any problems, just that the pylon issue is always something to think about when building any enterprise kit
Nice where did You Purchase the model from
@woof359 says the kit isn't available :(
Always learning with your videos, thank you. I was wondering where did you find this kit? I only ask because I would love to build a full resin kit like this.
First - thank you for this video. Its nice to hear someone else's thought process. I am wondering a few things... Is an armature really needed at all? the thickness of that fiberglass looks pretty substantial, and at first look appears to be strong enough as long as there is not a lot of weight added... just a thought.
i was also wondering if you have the original green blue pattern that was on the ship during the series run. I ask for selfish reasons as I was planning to paint my as it was during the series not the (way more complicated) generations pattern.
Thanks again for doing this
Frank,
the ship doesn't come with a stand, so you need to put it on something unless you plan on hanging it. You are correct that it is very substantially made which means that you are going to need some help keeping it upright. hence the armature
I'm starting with a 2 color paint scheme but one that allows for more colors if you want to go nuts
Frank, the fiberglass saucer may be strong enough on its own...and the nacelles/pylons should be strong enough on their own...but these things are connected to the neck and secondary hull which are not intended to be unsupported by an inner structure. Yes, the neck is very thick and strong but the weight of the saucer will apply a fair amount of continuous torque to the neck...over time, it will likely bend. You can see the pieces of the secondary hull...they are cast thin, mainly because of the thin, chine-like edge of this part of the ship. They're not designed for structural strength. As it says on my website, a simple inner structure is recommended. Basically, what you want is something inside the secondary hull to bond the pylon tubes and a mounting point (if desired) to. To this, I would bond a PVC tube or conduit to feed up the neck and attach to a disc made of strong material like plexiglass to support the saucer. The inner structure doesn't need to be super-strong to withstand beatings...it just has to provide some extra support.
Lou, are those pics of the 6' Enterprise D available somewhere online? They would be, as you so correctly pointed out, invaluable for reference when building and lighting this kit. I look forward to hearing from you. All the best !
do a google search for "star trek christies auction" and you'll see them
@@aztekdummy thanks for getting back to me Lou. I really enjoy your channel !
Hi Lou, I've been working on my own version of this one off and on for a while, and one issue that I seem to have is that the saucer seems to be too flat where it meets up with the neck part. Did you have this as well? How did you manage to solve it?
Did you cut out the big curved area where the neck attaches?
@@aztekdummy (Oops.. I just saw that I left out one crucial word in my original post.)
Yes, cut out the cured area in the lower saucer half, and it's a near perfect fit! My problem is in the top half of the saucer behind the main shuttlebay, where it connects to that curvy portion of the neck. The edge on the saucer seems to be too shallow, causing the neck portion to stick out.
@@armandoscherpenzeel4359 Yes, I had that same problem. My neck still sticks up a bit. I remember building that area up from underneath the top saucer part and trying to keep the top saucer level with the top of the neck, but because of my armature, i had limited success with it. I ended up with a gap there that i had to fill with apoxie sculpt.
@@aztekdummy Thanks, I think I might give that a shot. Seems like I've got my work cut out for me. Hopefully I'll be able to get a fit close to your build, I didn't even notice it in the later footage of your build!
Looks like Don Shoko is not offering this kit anymore. Wish he was, have you heard why at all ?
Email me at aztekdummy@att.net
Email me at aztekdummy@att.net
We can't use Enterprise E..... Thanks Worf...
Where do you get that 1/100 resin kit? How much does it cost?
randall,
read down in the comments below . the answers you seek are there
A slow, but necessary start. I do plan on getting one of these kits in the near future, so I'll be watching with great interest. Do the phaser strips have the ribbed detail? They aren't smooth are they?
they are ribbed for our pleasure
@@aztekdummy HA! Also FYI, there are smaller sized LED strips out there. Jerry over at HDA Modelworx has some. They might have a better chance of fitting into those tight spaces: hdamodelworx.com/LED-TAPE-0805-WHITE-DOUBLE-DENSITY-600-LEDs-5m-_p_192.html
Lou.....when are you posting part 2?
tonight around 10pm
Still want to know where the t-shirt thing come from? :)
Love watching how you build these kits. With this vid showing everything about how to construct models of this size and all the planning that goes into the kit and initial construction is great
Omg I'm in love with that kit. The enterprise D is my favourite ship. Where do I order?
terry see the man above ^^^ No, not the Lord, send a PM to dbs314 ^^^
@@aztekdummy It seems that this kit is not (no longer?) available for sale, according to donshoko.com. Do you know anything about this? It’s nice to see all these new 1/1000 kits, but they are incomplete without the D.
@@germansnowman Yes, there was a cease and desist from a gent who got the license to produce 1000 scale replicas.
@@aztekdummy Thank you. Too bad.
So realistically speaking This kit is pretty similar in size just slightly larger than the Ertl/Polar Lights kit?
Lou! My husband loves your t-shirts! Where do you acquire them?
if by slightly, you mean a lot . ertl saucer is 13" across. this on is 19. ertl nacelle is 7.5 in long , this one is 9.5 in
but the best part is that it is smooth without the raised aztek lines
@@wafflezshanaham6330 mostly teefury. but the mattcon ones are exclusive to my buddy matt's gaming conventions
Lou Dalmaso Thanks Lou... we are now broke LOL!
Lou Dalmaso I always hated those raised panel lines. It has kept me from ever making this ship. Too much sanding for my taste. I’d be afraid I’d take too much off. How do you feel about the wallpaper decals you find from aftermarket companies? Although I’ve been watching enough of your videos over the years that I think I know your answer. Loving this build so far!!
Hi Lou ! Who produces this kit?
www.donshoko.com
HI Lou, this thing looks like a monster! I have a link to Probert's list of paints used on the filming model if you are interested. memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Galaxy_class_model