I have been doing electrical work, Commercial and Industrial, for 50 years and I still enjoyed watching this video. I have a few thoughts on it, I hope more of a little additional help for the youngsters just coming up. I think it needs to be stressed that when bending conduit the key is use heavy and constant foot pressure. 'Bending' is a misnomer because what we are really doing is 'rolling' a bend along the saddle, in other words stretching the half of the pipe outside the saddle. Keeping constant foot pressure on the pedal also keeps the conduit tight to the inside of the saddle as you stretch the backside and causes the bender saddle to roll back, dragging the conduit with it. Holding the handle and pulling back will raise the conduit out of the saddle and cause rippling or a kink if you don't have the proper foot pressure. The handle should be used more as a guide and a balance to help foot pressure than to actually bend. Also I teach my apprentices to 'halve' the conduit in their head when bending 90's. On a full stick of conduit make anything under 60" a 'take-up' bend, subtracting the proper take up for that pipe size and make the end you are measuring from the rising end. Anything over 60" make your mark exact and using the 'Star' turn your bender away from your measuring end and make the opposite end your rising end. In other words do what will always keep the longer end of your conduit the side that is always on the floor or behind you (as in airbends). And don't look down a conduit with one eye when doing an offset or saddle in the air... use both eyes. We don't use one eye to align them on the floor so why do it in the air. It's a little hard to get used to but when you have it down your bend will be so perfect you can take it to the fair.
Wow William thanks for the tips! Bending conduit well it a real art and I tell guys if you can bend conduit your value on the job just went up! Have fun Ron
Had the best coworker conduit bender. I had at least a hundred pounds over his shinny body. He always had trouble bending 90's in 11/4" EMT even with the better hand bender that had the fold out foot pedal. I found it easier even for a fat boy like myself to place one end of 11/4" EMT against the wall before applying steady heavy foot pressure. Also best to wear work boots rather then sneakers or jogging shoes when bending heavy conduit.
SUBTRACT the gain when you figure how long a piece of conduit to cut for a 90 degree stub bend. In Ron's whiteboard example....22 + 14 MINUS 2 1/2 = 33 1/2" will give you a conduit with a 22" tail and a 14" stub.
+Robert Blanchard Robert man I will double check that to make sure it is right. Thanks foe catching it I am always willing to say I'm wrong. Take care. Ron
+Robert Blanchard Robert you are right we need to subtract not add the Gain Amount. My bad.........I've added a annotation to the video stating that and I've added your name as well. Your the first guy to spot it and the video has been up for sometime. Nice job! I owe you can you send me your contact info? I'll figure out a prize of some sort for you. Ron ron.kipper@idealindustries.com
+arturo soto When bending an offset the overall length should shrink not get longer. I'm not sure what the answer to your question is. Send me a pic or video. Ron
From 2008 till 2009 I worked like an electrician helper in Miami and I learned a lot.by the way , I'm not an electrician right now, I'm a dumb...any ways.... but the science and the simplicity how you teach is astonished....and for those about to rock ( we salute you)
This is the best bending video that illustrates what the marks look like on the bender and line everything up from your point of view. Thank you for sharing.
Ron, you are up there in Ideal. Please tell the board of directors to start selling everything at home depot so the average guy can have access to them.
Hey BBQ Pitmaster believe me we would like to see everything at Home Depot but it is not that easy. We do have most of it online with them though. I hear yoo Ron
Tip for fellow older sparkies:.I sprayed painted heads of my benders with 2 coats of white paint then use a red & yellow paint markers over degree marks, notch & arrow. Makes it a lot easier to see in dimly lit areas. Still have my dad's Benfield maybe 16 page picket sized conduit bending Manuel.
Great instructional video. Thank you. You could use a permanent marker instead of a pencil, then use PVC primer/pipe cleaner to remove the mark. It makes a great 'eraser'. I'm an HVAC guy and use permanent marker on sheet metal and, if I make a measuring mistake, I just get out the acetone (PVC pipe primer/cleaner) and erase it.
Thanks for the very helpful video. The reason for gain with a stub 90 is because the bend cuts the corner a bit while the tail and stub measurements run along a hard 90 - correct? Or does distortion of the pipe contribute?
This is a great series; however, it is indeed prudent to check the stubb-offset on every bender. My $39 ideal cast iron bender turned out to be 4 3/4", instead of 5", this also impacts back-to-back bends, i.e., i have to add 1/4" to my "20 inch mark", making it 20 1/4" in order to get a 20" back to back bend. Offsets and saddles seem close enough to use the standard charts.
I use one mark on the pipe for box offsets. I use the end of the pipe as a substitute for the first mark and a mark down the pipe 2 1/4". I have been doing it that way for 24 years and have had no problems. It is much quicker if you are doing a lot of box offsets. Thanks, Russ, Journeyman electrician.
So if the gain amount is 2 1/2", are you saying that the pipe has somehow "stretched" 2 1/2" , which surely can't happen?? Thinking this through then, that gain is because the measurements you took included the width of the pipe twice, once in the horizontal measurement and once in the vertical measurement?
Ok - I was confused by the "GAIN"... as if the conduit was getting longer. The bent curve is cutting the corner, but it is measured as if it were a square 90.
James if there is a Home Depot or Lowes near you they stock and can order IDEAL products I also see a CED near you that would be able to sell you. Let me know if you need more help Ron
Ron, is the black conduit bender better then the metal color ... ? I need to purchased news tool since some of my tools were taken from my boss truck few weeks back. Conduit benders were a couple items lost.
Hey spyderx92 man a I hate to hear you guys got robbed. The black iron benders will last longer over the aluminum ones they also cost a little more. Good luck Ron
most common bend I think is "back of bend" ....amazing HOW MANY supposed "electricians" don't even know that the Star (NOT arrow or notch) on the Bender is the back of a bend ...(with the end in front of you Bender pulled toward you) .....The "stub" measurement often ends up being simply a matter of cutting conduit to fit where the "stub" is the final section of conduit ... the initial stub (assuming 90 degree) you just subtract the number given on bender
I am long retired .....I just feel for you youngins and want to assure you that you struggles are NOT unique! Keep at it people! You CAN do this! Focus! And KNOW that ALL THE REST OF US....DID struggle ALSO! Feel better?
The hardest thing about bending is judgment of "straight and inline" ....It takes some natural ability and a lot of practice...it is just plain and art to keep everything straight in relationship of one bend to another ...it is not simply math ....unfortunately ....It would be SO NICE if it were only math and making marks in the right place ....alas all those bends EVEN precisely measured and marked HAVE TO BE correctly judged relative to the other bends ... like a saddle? EACH bend HAS to be at the same vertical relationship ...and the degree of bends has to amount to EXACT relationship....much easier said than done ....takes natural ability AND practice....if you find this challenging? Join the fricken club! LOL
Any tricks in long but narrow back to back bends to overcome the fact the handle is in the same plane as the U? Typically when the U is narrower than the length of the bender handle, once bent past 45' the handle hits the other side of the U (previously bent stub). bending around it creates a dog leg which I then have to straight out on the floor, not always pretty.
Regarding offsets, I've never understood the use of the term "shrink". Nothing shrank. Take a piece of wire and bend it into a Z shape. You don't measure the length of that wire by measuring from the top to bottom (or side to side) of the Z. You also need to measure the middle part diagonally. Nothing "shrank" in the Z. Nor in the offset, appreciably. You're just choosing not to measure the diagonal part properly. I get it that you need a short word to use that fits on charts and that blue collar tobacco-chewing folks can understand. That's fine. But then when folks start explaining things on a white board they explain it like something really is being shortened. It's not.
Who doesn't cut conduit to fit 👀 that is how I was taught with emt now rigid is a different story you DO NOT cut to fit cause often times you can thread it 🤣 I'm only a 1st year apprentice but bending conduit is pretty much all I do other than mounting it and what not
Hi David I am always looking for a better way. This videos just try to show the basics and with conduit bending experience goes a long way. Have fun Ron
Vektr1 if you can do it right bending the offset on the ground then go ahead but usually we would recommend doing it they other way as shown have fun Ron
Hey sorry im not trying to offend you personally. No offense After 20 years i saw the light. drug addicts and drunks building buildings. Thing is, i was one of those guys. Then god found me and told me i was better and i no longer belonged building the buildings. Greener pastures with people who love me is all i will ever except in the workplace.
Im an Electrician; I bend it, and sometimes cut it to fit. Can be faster. when profit margins are razor thin, time is monies. All my bone piles are short stub pieces. Send me to jail i guess.
Hi pecker556 no problems! As you say time is money my main point is bending conduit takes practice to do without screwing up a piece of conduit once in a while. I know I can use the practice........kind of like my golf game! Ron
What would really be nice if you would step by step tell these things and do them and show them and leave all the explanations of what contractors may use them for because we already know all that crap just stick to the subject and do it logically and explain everything
@@RonKipperDatacomm1 im just a super beginner. I try to follow to understand but when the instructions take a sideline and deviate from the steps I lose my continuity. But thanks for your efforts!
All right this guy is just going on and on and jumping around you start to tell about making a band in the conduit you haven't said for what reason you haven't demonstrated it and you're already running off into some other thing about what you should Mark it with some people out here do have some brains
I have been doing electrical work, Commercial and Industrial, for 50 years and I still enjoyed watching this video. I have a few thoughts on it, I hope more of a little additional help for the youngsters just coming up.
I think it needs to be stressed that when bending conduit the key is use heavy and constant foot pressure. 'Bending' is a misnomer because what we are really doing is 'rolling' a bend along the saddle, in other words stretching the half of the pipe outside the saddle. Keeping constant foot pressure on the pedal also keeps the conduit tight to the inside of the saddle as you stretch the backside and causes the bender saddle to roll back, dragging the conduit with it. Holding the handle and pulling back will raise the conduit out of the saddle and cause rippling or a kink if you don't have the proper foot pressure. The handle should be used more as a guide and a balance to help foot pressure than to actually bend.
Also I teach my apprentices to 'halve' the conduit in their head when bending 90's. On a full stick of conduit make anything under 60" a 'take-up' bend, subtracting the proper take up for that pipe size and make the end you are measuring from the rising end. Anything over 60" make your mark exact and using the 'Star' turn your bender away from your measuring end and make the opposite end your rising end. In other words do what will always keep the longer end of your conduit the side that is always on the floor or behind you (as in airbends).
And don't look down a conduit with one eye when doing an offset or saddle in the air... use both eyes. We don't use one eye to align them on the floor so why do it in the air. It's a little hard to get used to but when you have it down your bend will be so perfect you can take it to the fair.
Wow William thanks for the tips! Bending conduit well it a real art and I tell guys if you can bend conduit your value on the job just went up! Have fun Ron
Had the best coworker conduit bender. I had at least a hundred pounds over his shinny body. He always had trouble bending 90's in 11/4" EMT even with the better hand bender that had the fold out foot pedal. I found it easier even for a fat boy like myself to place one end of 11/4" EMT against the wall before applying steady heavy foot pressure. Also best to wear work boots rather then sneakers or jogging shoes when bending heavy conduit.
SUBTRACT the gain when you figure how long a piece of conduit to cut for a 90 degree stub bend. In Ron's whiteboard example....22 + 14 MINUS 2 1/2 = 33 1/2" will give you a conduit with a 22" tail and a 14" stub.
+Robert Blanchard Robert man I will double check that to make sure it is right. Thanks foe catching it I am always willing to say I'm wrong. Take care. Ron
+Robert Blanchard Robert you are right we need to subtract not add the Gain Amount. My bad.........I've added a annotation to the video stating that and I've added your name as well. Your the first guy to spot it and the video has been up for sometime. Nice job! I owe you can you send me your contact info? I'll figure out a prize of some sort for you. Ron ron.kipper@idealindustries.com
+Ron Kipper Datacomm why when i tried to do a 30° it get to long
+arturo soto When bending an offset the overall length should shrink not get longer. I'm not sure what the answer to your question is. Send me a pic or video. Ron
👍
All youtube tutorials/teachers should be this good and clear. Thankyou.
Scott I really appreciate your comments makes it worth trying Ron
Love your whiteboard and math. The only one who explains the numbers. Thanks!
Cool glad to help Ron
Thank you but you missed your calling I would of loved to have you when I started out. Your a great teacher. God bless you and your family.
Thanks for sharing Ron
From 2008 till 2009 I worked like an electrician helper in Miami and I learned a lot.by the way , I'm not an electrician right now, I'm a dumb...any ways.... but the science and the simplicity how you teach is astonished....and for those about to rock ( we salute you)
Hi Jose thanks for being oiut there! Ron
This is the best bending video that illustrates what the marks look like on the bender and line everything up from your point of view. Thank you for sharing.
Hey man like your tag name! I am amazed this has become the #1 watched video on the channel. Hope it helped Ron
You are a master teacher! Thank You! 8 years later🤣
Hey man appreciate you being out there have fun Ron
This is fantastic! Now I need to go buy 1000 feet of 1/2" EMT and practice for the next month! Thanks!
Practice practice practice........have fun Ron
Ron, you are up there in Ideal. Please tell the board of directors to start selling everything at home depot so the average guy can have access to them.
Hey BBQ Pitmaster believe me we would like to see everything at Home Depot but it is not that easy. We do have most of it online with them though. I hear yoo Ron
I stumbled upon this video and I loved it, very well explained Sir!
Subscribed to the channel!
Oh, and I didn't even need to bend a conduit, lol!
Awesome, thank you! Ron
Tip for fellow older sparkies:.I sprayed painted heads of my benders with 2 coats of white paint then use a red & yellow paint markers over degree marks, notch & arrow. Makes it a lot easier to see in dimly lit areas. Still have my dad's Benfield maybe 16 page picket sized conduit bending Manuel.
John good to hear from you appreciate you watching Ron
great. thank you so much. I was looking this information for my project.
Wow you explained it perfectly.. I have been told the same thing a few times but you really hit it thank you
Glad to help Ron
Great instructional video. Thank you. You could use a permanent marker instead of a pencil, then use PVC primer/pipe cleaner to remove the mark. It makes a great 'eraser'. I'm an HVAC guy and use permanent marker on sheet metal and, if I make a measuring mistake, I just get out the acetone (PVC pipe primer/cleaner) and erase it.
Hey Rick good point glad you could use the info in the video take care Ron
Thank you for breaking everything down great video
Man I just appreciate you being out there have fun Ron
Great, easy to understand tutorial! Thanks
Nice to hear from you and thanks for watching. Ron
Awesome Video...excellent presentation!
Hi Anthony appreciate the feedback have fun Ron
Thank you for making this video for us. It is helpful. 😃👍
OK use the info well! Ron
Thanks for the very helpful video. The reason for gain with a stub 90 is because the bend cuts the corner a bit while the tail and stub measurements run along a hard 90 - correct? Or does distortion of the pipe contribute?
Great point!
Thanks for the video! it's really informative and well explained. It helped clear things up for me :)
Easy enough use the info well Ron
THANKS Ron,
Learned a lot.
You are welcome! Ron
Thank you professor Ron.
Hey appreciate you watching have fun Ron
This is a great series; however, it is indeed prudent to check the stubb-offset on every bender. My $39 ideal cast iron bender turned out to be 4 3/4", instead of 5", this also impacts back-to-back bends, i.e., i have to add 1/4" to my "20 inch mark", making it 20 1/4" in order to get a 20" back to back bend. Offsets and saddles seem close enough to use the standard charts.
I think that should be an "aluminum" bender head
Yes I mention it somewhere that any bender may be slightly off so making a test bend or two is a good idea. Ron
Excellent job .Thanks
Thanks for being out there Ron
I use one mark on the pipe for box offsets. I use the end of the pipe as a substitute for the first mark and a mark down the pipe 2 1/4". I have been doing it that way for 24 years and have had no problems. It is much quicker if you are doing a lot of box offsets. Thanks, Russ, Journeyman electrician.
Russ thanks for the tip I always love it when I get a good tip from a journeymen. Have fun Ron
So if the gain amount is 2 1/2", are you saying that the pipe has somehow "stretched" 2 1/2" , which surely can't happen?? Thinking this through then, that gain is because the measurements you took included the width of the pipe twice, once in the horizontal measurement and once in the vertical measurement?
just what i needed! thank you!
Glad to help Ron
Thanks Ron! I'm getting better buddy!
Practice practice practice man it just takes time. Have fun Ron
12:35 offset/box bend
Hi Forever Kenzie appreciate you being out there Ron
Ok - I was confused by the "GAIN"... as if the conduit was getting longer. The bent curve is cutting the corner, but it is measured as if it were a square 90.
could you show us how to do a 4 point saddle?
I will add it to the list of videdos to make have fun Ron
Ive been practicing 3 point saddles, following your steps for steps and Im always high over my obstruction and don't understand why
I love this video... thanks for u time
Cool glad to help Ron
!!!
Hello. Check 4:45! Isn’t got to be 2-1/2” less is it?!?! Not longer!!
EvGeny did you not see the text I put on the video? It is 2 1/2" shorter not longer? Thanks for the comment. Ron
To@@RonKipperDatacomm1: There is no text put on the video.
@UnReasoning Band His numbers show that is grew, not shrank.
Don't forget to use a pencil instead of a marker! All jokes aside this is a great video that has taught me a lot, thank you.
Hi Nate I get that a lot use the info well.
Ron
good Content, very visual....👍👍👍👏👏👏
Thanks man Ron
i live in homestead,florida.... do u have any stores near me that sell IDEAL PRODUCTS?
James if there is a Home Depot or Lowes near you they stock and can order IDEAL products I also see a CED near you that would be able to sell you. Let me know if you need more help Ron
Ron, is the black conduit bender better then the metal color ... ? I need to purchased news tool since some of my tools were taken from my boss truck few weeks back. Conduit benders were a couple items lost.
Hey spyderx92 man a I hate to hear you guys got robbed. The black iron benders will last longer over the aluminum ones they also cost a little more. Good luck Ron
most common bend I think is "back of bend" ....amazing HOW MANY supposed "electricians" don't even know that the Star (NOT arrow or notch) on the Bender is the back of a bend ...(with the end in front of you Bender pulled toward you) .....The "stub" measurement often ends up being simply a matter of cutting conduit to fit where the "stub" is the final section of conduit ... the initial stub (assuming 90 degree) you just subtract the number given on bender
I am long retired .....I just feel for you youngins and want to assure you that you struggles are NOT unique! Keep at it people! You CAN do this! Focus! And KNOW that ALL THE REST OF US....DID struggle ALSO! Feel better?
Hey Dougie good to hear from you. Have fun Ron
Is the gain amount always half the bend amount. IE was yours 2 1/2 inches because the bend accounts for 5"
Hi DS not sure what you are asking the 2 1/2" was the distance between the bends on the offset bens. Ron
Hello would you demonstrate a back to back offset?
Hey Mr James I will add it to my list of videos to do. I have not had much time recently to make videos and I appreciate you watching. Ron
@Danny Harris that's a back to back 90.
You mean a four point saddle? Back to back offset isn't a thing.
The hardest thing about bending is judgment of "straight and inline" ....It takes some natural ability and a lot of practice...it is just plain and art to keep everything straight in relationship of one bend to another ...it is not simply math ....unfortunately ....It would be SO NICE if it were only math and making marks in the right place ....alas all those bends EVEN precisely measured and marked HAVE TO BE correctly judged relative to the other bends ... like a saddle? EACH bend HAS to be at the same vertical relationship ...and the degree of bends has to amount to EXACT relationship....much easier said than done ....takes natural ability AND practice....if you find this challenging? Join the fricken club! LOL
Hi Dougie you are right it takes practice! Ron
Any tricks in long but narrow back to back bends to overcome the fact the handle is in the same plane as the U? Typically when the U is narrower than the length of the bender handle, once bent past 45' the handle hits the other side of the U (previously bent stub). bending around it creates a dog leg which I then have to straight out on the floor, not always pretty.
Hello not that I know of hopefully someone will see your question and have a better answer. have fun Ron
really helpful
Glad to help Ron
Regarding offsets, I've never understood the use of the term "shrink". Nothing shrank.
Take a piece of wire and bend it into a Z shape. You don't measure the length of that wire by measuring from the top to bottom (or side to side) of the Z. You also need to measure the middle part diagonally. Nothing "shrank" in the Z. Nor in the offset, appreciably. You're just choosing not to measure the diagonal part properly.
I get it that you need a short word to use that fits on charts and that blue collar tobacco-chewing folks can understand. That's fine. But then when folks start explaining things on a white board they explain it like something really is being shortened. It's not.
Who doesn't cut conduit to fit 👀 that is how I was taught with emt now rigid is a different story you DO NOT cut to fit cause often times you can thread it 🤣 I'm only a 1st year apprentice but bending conduit is pretty much all I do other than mounting it and what not
Hi stickboybones you are right you can always cut it to length as well and better than being short! Have fun Ron
New SUBSCRIBER👍👍👍
Hello thanks for the sub Ron
thank you very much
Thanks Ron
I would say measure offset needed say 15 inchs bend 1st bend at 30 ' and than the 2nd bend you use the STAR on the bender hello too easy ...
Hi David I am always looking for a better way. This videos just try to show the basics and with conduit bending experience goes a long way. Have fun Ron
You subtract the gain!
James thanks for pointing that out I mad a note on the short version of this video about that years ago and will do the same to this one. Thanks
Ron
Thanks!
Have have fun Ron
I really need those benders, but my budget .......
Buy an aluminum headed bender they are a lot less than the iron benders. Ron
Mkay!
Thanks
Welcome
It would be nice if he would slow down and walk through the numbers slower and a couple more times for people that are green.
Hey that is why you can rewind the tape! Have fun Ron
"Box offset bends are done in the air, not on the ground"
Who came up with that rule?
Vektr1 if you can do it right bending the offset on the ground then go ahead but usually we would recommend doing it they other way as shown have fun Ron
@@RonKipperDatacomm1 How would you do it with a full length 1" EMT? It just seems to me it's overly hard to balance it in the air.
1" is kind of tough to bend no matter how you bend it good luck with it Ron
how do you know you're at 90? use a magnetic level
Hi Erik most guys use there eyes to know they are at 90. You could try the level Ron at ron.kipper@idealidustries.com
Not another constituent complacent know-it-all in disguise.
Hey Anthony I had to look up what constituent meant.............have fun Ron
Hey sorry im not trying to offend you personally.
No offense
After 20 years i saw the light.
drug addicts and drunks building buildings.
Thing is, i was one of those guys.
Then god found me and told me i was better and i no longer belonged building the buildings.
Greener pastures with people who love me is all i will ever except in the workplace.
Ideal worker using Klein tools marker🤫
Might be....Ron
music too loud pls!
OK I will look at lowering it!
Ron
Yea whatever Mr. Garrison... mmmkay
Have fun Ron
Mmmm k
Hi Michael have fun Ron
Im an Electrician; I bend it, and sometimes cut it to fit. Can be faster. when profit margins are razor thin, time is monies. All my bone piles are short stub pieces. Send me to jail i guess.
Hi pecker556 no problems! As you say time is money my main point is bending conduit takes practice to do without screwing up a piece of conduit once in a while. I know I can use the practice........kind of like my golf game! Ron
What would really be nice if you would step by step tell these things and do them and show them and leave all the explanations of what contractors may use them for because we already know all that crap just stick to the subject and do it logically and explain everything
Heard ya
@@RonKipperDatacomm1 im just a super beginner. I try to follow to understand but when the instructions take a sideline and deviate from the steps I lose my continuity. But thanks for your efforts!
No problems just glad you are watching out there good luck Ron
Gahhh very confusing
Practice baby...............Ron
All right this guy is just going on and on and jumping around you start to tell about making a band in the conduit you haven't said for what reason you haven't demonstrated it and you're already running off into some other thing about what you should Mark it with some people out here do have some brains
Hey VG stuck a nerve with you I guess every time I think I know something someone shows me maybe I don't have fun Ron