Gonna be honest, having every year be make or break for Destiny is getting tiring at this point. I’m tired of this cycle of building up Destiny then it crashing on the Golden Gate bridge.
Fr last time I gave d2 was right when they dropped vespers host so I grinded the quest in hopes of getting a god roll chill inhibitor. Then they gave it away for free which was good but still made it pointless for me to grind it anymore. We leaving d2 in 2024 fr
@@ShantoShmento Warframe was such a breath of fresh air after the limitations of build crafting in Destiny. They encompassed the power fantasy and sure it means that end game is less difficult but it also means that you can create awesome builds with ALL the 60+ warframes
The "we're so back -> it's so over -> we're so back -> it has never been more over -> we've never been more back" cycle is so draining. I want Destiny to stop having these disastrously low moments and just be GOOD.
Echoes was such a massive self report on how minimum they wanted their viable product to be that this episode being worse just sealed the deal. They know how to make good seasons, season of the Witch proves that. I'm just done being lied to about how they say they definitely learned from the good only to be lazy and see how much they can force us to tolerate the bad.
Because DE gets rid of unnecessary spaghetti code. Steve built the game for the intention of it needing updates, and the devs having an easier time to work on the game.
To be fair they're made entirely different, one relies on procedural generation whilst the other being handcrafted along with better texturing, that's just one example.
@@Free_RayneExcept even warframe supports hand crafted areas. It's not entirely procedural. Also warframe has better textures lately. (Anything past sacrifice. And especially including and after duvri will start showing that) The catch with warframe is that because it doesn't really delete content. And the devs prefer to push forward. They don't always often comeback and update older stuff. This means that sometimes (hello archwings) it can be loaded with jank. Functional and visual. However. Because the developers put so much focus on things the game can't already do. They put a lot of time into the engine and the game, and making sure to keep it expandable/sustainable. Destiny 2 just can't. The engine wasn't meant for what they're throwing at it. And they have so much code debt that it be too much work to try to fix it Also warframe is absurdly optimized. It's not even fair.
They knew it was a game that would need to last indefinitely from the start, D2 was always intended to be thrown away after a few DLC(honestly forsaken might have been the original end of D2)
the fact they had a higher up explain that they were purposefully not meeting expectations, when the whole point of being a entertainer, which are what game developers are, is to meet and especially EXCEED expectations!?!!
Warframes biggest advantage was laid out by Steve the CEO in a documentary awhile back. The game started really small, but the game was built to be able to be updated and expanded easily. Steve knew at the time if Warframe was going to survive it had to be able to be updated easily on a regular basis. The game has had it “engine” overhauled twice that I can remember. The game is on its third iteration of damage, melee has been reworked twice, guns have been reworked twice. Etc. From all accounts I’ve heard Destiny is a total pain in the ass to work on in comparison. Thats why Warframe has been able to add dojo’s and now 4 customizable living spaces, 2 ships, one you can control, companions, 3 open world spaces and now a romance system.
Exactly. D2 has attempted to build a wide MMO on top of the narrow foundation of a looter. WF has built a Looter on top of the wide and secure base of an MMO since the beginning.
The map editor had to be loaded up overnight and staff returning to office the following day hoped that it didn't crash. At least that's for Destiny 1. They mentioned they've updated their tools and stuff but there's only so much they can do with the same engine.
The problem with Destiny's engine is that it's over 2 decades old with slow improvements and is proprietary. Meanwhile Warframe uses Unreal Engine which is THE industry standard and everyone knows how to use it. Not to say there aren't engines that aren't old. Call of Duty's IW Engine is so old but it's on version 9.0, and has been around since the beginning of Call of Duty which is NUTS. But thats just one example. Destiny needs an engine overhaul like a Tiger 2.0 or something to make the game easier to work on.
@@chaoschaoforever warframe uses the Evolution engine which is proprietary to Digital Extremes, the developer. Steve Sinclair, one of the DE founders, did work on Unreal Tournament which was the genesis of the Unreal Engine but that is owned by Epic
Its trhiving far better than Destiny, and they respect their player base far more than bungie ever is going to. And funny thing you dont need to pay for expansionsthe size of a smal game with the priceof a big one.@@lazyvoid7107
Eh I don’t really agree. I think what’s unhealthy is this expectation that any game can or should be played 24/7. Taking a break from D2 to play other games while the team cooks up new stuff is HEALTHY. All games should be like this. I absolutely hate this new business model where games try to keep you busy forever. Sure, I like D2. I also like Path of Exile and Factorio. I like having time to play other games. A sustainable game as a service title SHOULD have lulls in player population. As long as those players are excited to come back when the next cool chunk of content drops
@@lazyvoid7107 meh or not its still 100 times better than Destiny at this point. plus Warframe has been one of if not THE top f2p game since its release
Destiny was always supposed to be a 10 year plan, now years 1-3 (D1) is stuck on 8th gen consoles, and bungie removed years 4-5 content entirely, making the new or returning experience bad, then just kept nickle-and-diming everything they can, they fumbled the bag.
01:41 Why would I touch Marathon after seeing how they handled Destiny? I used to have 2 dozen friends I could hop on and play Destiny with and not a single one of them still plays now, and their sentiment on Marathon ranges from apathy to derision due to feelings of betrayal.
I remember having a good clan of 20 people to play with. This year, the clan was reduced to 2. I miss them and the Preservers Of The Grind, but we disbanded once there was nothing to preserve. Me and my last guildie are Bullet Smack now.
THIS! He's huffing paint or something if he thinks most D2 players will try it. We know the abuse that comes with new Bungie, I'm not signing up for another round. Plus extraction shooter market is over saturated with already good established games. The only bonus to Marathon is the gunplay on a Bungie game is actually good.
Every year bruh. For 10 years. Nothings changed drastically in the games design, but just enough to keep us playing. Somehow Bungie's been able to coast off the fact there's only one 'Destiny'
I respect his optimism about it, even though the reality of it says otherwise. there’s a saying that comes to mind. *”hope is the first step on the road to disappoint.”*
Bungie doesn’t realize that most of the player base of marathon will just be destiny players checking the game out. After a week or 2 I guarantee marathon will flop.
My last straw was the last round of layoffs. I'm sick of these giant companies laying people off to improve their bottom line. Then expecting less employees to make a quality product, while the executives still get their massive paychecks. Been playing desinty since the very beginning. Sadly, I'm over it.
I’ve been one of the biggest defenders for the longest time of Bungie and Destiny. I can’t do it anymore. It’s so tiring, hell even my friends have uninstalled and don’t even wanna play it anymore. It will always have a place in my heart but I can’t support with how badly this year after TFS has been in so many ways shape or forms.
D3 would've done nothing for the franchise...except be another Destiny 2: Mediocre campaign, lack of end game content, etc until a massive expansion like Taken King or Forsaken.
They weren’t making enough money. And the way it’s going they would’ve had to sell destiny 3 for 120 bucks a copy. The standard edition. Diablo 4 was about 90 bucks. Sure you could’ve gotten it for 70 but most people got it early and enjoyed the couple extra skins. And let’s not pretend destiny 3 would’ve been any different. And where they are now they would have to sell way more than 300k copies to be successful. And 300k copies is about 15 times more players than are currently in the game.
Maybe not D3, I feel the story of "destiny" is over. People have seen the conclusion and are done. But they should have had a "Next game" cooking, something that could be a successor to destiny that built off what people liked from the game but with a new story and universe. Or maybe a new story set in the far far future of the current destiny universe
Like I said before, if they consistently delivered a quality product, didn’t constantly reskin or recycle, were more innovative, focused on bugs, didn’t try to nickel and dime their fans, weren’t so lazy, and avoided getting into controversies they wouldn’t be in this situation. Like the balder gate ceo, treat your customers with respect and they’ll be more lenient.
Exactly, the lil sneaky things that they call “mistakes” after the community discovers it, from xp throttling to perk gateing all to make people play longer, hell even the “god rolls” that were given to us seems like a sneaky way to get people to buy and play the dungeons they don’t care to buy
People told them 2-3 years ago that this was going to happen when they first started the dungeon model. Then they layered that on top of the seasonal model and it got to a point where I started comparing the game to old Warcraft subscriptions and determined they were now charging more fees than Warcraft did back in the day and I also determined that they probably had no right to do so. And this is the result of trying to be Warcraft w out the infrastructure or the content. It doesn’t help when you do that on top of literally deleting major chunks of playable story content people already paid for. They’re literally just making Ubisoft type mistakes at this point. And while it didn’t happen over night people knew this dungeon model was eventually going to kill the game. When your friends are online doing a dungeon and the first conversation you have to have is whether or not you feel like taking 20 bucks out of your wallet to join them that becomes an increasingly more difficult conversation. Especially when millennials/ gen z are the brokest generation and they’re the ones financing your game.
I agree with everything you said 100%. Bungie needs to look in the mirror and see what they're currently doing is not going to work anymore. Need drastic changes the overall game of Destiny 2. They've become complacent.
@@Venomx-nb1jr you have FRIENDS that play this game? Lol all of mine moved on a long time ago, I literally just run solo pvp, and onslaught then i hop off, havent done a raid or dungeon in literal years, i just dont get the same feeling or have the same drive
People saying "same thing every year" you are right but wrong at the same time. This has been the lowest and the future doesn't look bright at all. Yall need to accept this time is really dying
It died when Activision and high moon the studios who actually put effort and worked on most things, left. 80% of forsaken was made by high moon. Taken king and most of D1 was made by high moon and Activision.
@Ligmanuttz like headless chickens 🤦♂️. But this time finally is looking that jot many people aren't that hype for D2 and Bungie. The returning number wouldn't be that high compared to other years
Warframe really proves just how bad of a developer bungie is. Trading, chat, recruiting, customizing ships, clans, clan housing, fair monetization, so many weapons, great story, and no sunsetting. Warframe proves that all the stuff bungie says can’t be done are entirely possible. Digital extremes isn’t perfect, but they’re trying. And they genuinely like their players. Bungie is just greedy. And i genuinely believe bungie hates their fan base.
Warframe is good, I've been playing it quite a bit lately. But the combat and gunplay are just straight-up garbage. The guns feel horrible and the enemies are boring as hell and just damage sponges. It's a cool game and all, but comparing the combat and gunplay to D2.. it's not even close. Warframe isn't even in the same realm.
Plus you also have to understand Warframe existed years before destiny 1 so a good piece of the as to why a lot of it exists due to it's age and longevity tbh. Could Bungie have done better of course.
@@beeman4266 there are so many different types of guns that there's bound to be one you enjoy, if you're complaining that all the enemies are "damage sponges" then you aren't modding your weapons or frames. This is the game where it's completely normal to nuke a room full of enemies in less than a second and already be through the door to the next room
@@beeman4266 Destiny...a game where bullet magnetism and aim assist constantly needs to be babysat by programmers so players FEEL good firing guns that are becoming less and less relevant. Warframe...a game where it actually takes skill to pop headshots while hurtling through the air at a million miles an hour. You're right, they're not in the same realm. Destiny players are still pushing the lie that Destiny gunplay is good, when it hasn't been in years. Or ever.
the developers at bungie are in no way bad, if they were permitted to make all of that, they would. the higher ups just limit everything possible for more money.
@@WaveOfDestiny Can't be one of the best games considering it doesn't have all its content. Also are you counting it now or over time because we all know the game has bounced between 3/10 to 8/10 repeatedly
This is true, same thing happened to a lot of people during the WoW exodus during Shadowlands, you get used to eating stale crackers that you don't think steak is good anymore.
The first time he watches a Warframe Devstream, this toxic relationship with Bungie will end, having a developer that cares about its players and the community is priceless
I’m waiting for that time and I’m telling you, cross’s eyes are going to open up and how human the devs are instead of mindless husks and scripted nonsense that every d2 dev stream is
If Destiny wants to survive, they must undo all the vaulting they did. Bring back everything they cut, and make the past Seasons' content accessible (get rid of FOMO). That way they'd turn things around. Sadly it's more likely their ceo would rather expand his car collection than to save the game.
Exactly. Warframe is a perfect example to show people who bitch about “content bloat”. Warframe HAS content bloat, it’s honestly overwhelming but I prefer having too much shit to do versus none.
I believe you nailed it. I've been trying to get some of my friends to play D2 by showing them all my weapons, skins, ornaments etc. Watching them get excited and amped up. Only to tell them they may never get'em and I watch the light in their eyes slowly fade 🤣😂
Would be so fucking huge if all the story missions from seasons were playable along with the old campaigns so people could do it all in order. Im a 2000 hour player but I started in Beyond Light, would be cool to do it from the beginning
This game has ups and downs, but no matter what this game has got me thru shit in life. Ive never had such a connection to a game. I want it to be good again. I know its far fetched, but I at least wanna see whats up for the future first
This was me before, ironically, I started warframe full-time. When I played d2 daily, it felt like I had no time for anything else til I got bored. With wf, ik for a fact I have time to do anything I want and my weapons will still slap after a year. Played consistently from launch to Lightfall
Yeah, I get you. I only joined around Forsaken but it still means a lot to me. I don't want the game to die. I want them to get good, really good, like ACTUALLY good.
Definitely not playing Marathon. Bungie's lack of concern for PvP in D2 shows that the game is DOA. It'll be the next Concord. The OG Halo days Bungie is long gone and the current team just doesn't have the respect for their players to make anything take off.
Wanting Marathon to fail and cause Bungie to go bankrupt, because you're salty about the state of Crucible, is like hoping your pilot crashes plane that you're still riding on.
I was more disappointed when they told us that D3 was never in development. They had 10 years to create something and for them to say we was never working on it is heartbreaking.
I always felt like Destiny was at its best when it focused mostly on gunplay and movement rather than pure ability usage. I noticed myself play less and less when subclass 3.0 dropped until I finally dropped the game during lightfall. I guess it really was because abilities were oppressively strong in pvp when we upgraded our subclasses. Power creep went to such an insane level to the point where I didn’t enjoy the game anymore. Checkmate was a decent attempt to mitigate this… but then Bungie just gave up on it? I don’t see myself coming back to Destiny without significant reworks to subclasses or a new release. Or maybe Destiny now just isn’t for me anymore.
@@robertbelbin9183 Destiny has never had a whole year that's been good. It always has the 4-5 months surrounding an expansion release where things are great and then the player numbers begin to fall off before reaching their lowest around where we are now, and then they start pick up again once the hype machine for the next expansion starts.
I think GTA 6 is such a huge issue for bungie if numbers don’t improve before that game comes out player numbers could literally flatline…there’s nobody I know that won’t be playing that when it releases
I have solved the issue. It's so simple. Just come out with another raid that only 5% of who's left will play, another dungeon that players have to queue up for and search the internet and figure out how to actually complete it then proceeded not to do it because it looks like too much trouble and not fun, then let's bring back Destiny 1 year 1 weapons because that's not lazy, let's have warlock looking the same for 10 years, let's have primaries still be so crap compared to special slot weapons, and make sure that the rules for all of the copy and paste weapons that drop are not the ones that players want so that they quit before even getting to their goal. And then top it off with a New Year's Day activity that's really a cut and paste from a garbage activity nobody cared about from 4 years ago and call it reprised. THAT'S how you kill oops save DESTINY
Expansions alone won’t keep the game alive. If they don’t fix the core issues that the make the experience for new and old players alike not enjoyable, the player count will continue to look like a heart monitor.
Yep, what happens is bungie makes a good DLC, brings back lots of players, then makes not as good expansions later or worse content that pushes others away, then repeat the cycle.
the thing about warframe is it doesnt hit the same as destiny, yes it has features destiny needs, but it isnt destiny, that isnt to say its a worse game
I literally flip flop on the games I hyper grind since I'm a solo player for the most part because I dont get the luxury of having a super maxed dojo I build it from my blood and sweet but lord does grinding shit like cryotic suck
@@rast.always bro i know that feeling, its like playing subway surfers but doesnt hit the same feel compared to when i played temple run when it first came out 😮.
1) 3rd Darkness Subclass (Life Steal, Fear [Overload], Ability Damage and Regen Increase Verb [Barrier]) 2) Possible Kinetic Subclass (Tremor, Bleeding, Ricochet, Shrapnel, Max Shield and Shield From Zero to Full Increase Verb) 3) Clan Housing - Clan Members can use their Glimmer, Enhancment Cores and Golf Balls to buy things for the House 4) New Armour System and Perks (Incoming) 5) Mass Exotic Weapon and Armour Buffs and Re-Vanp 6) Space Battles 7) A Power Level Revamp where its SLOT based and Removal of Upgrade Modules 8) An Accendancy Type Skill Tree within the Subclasses where you can choose a certain Passive Increases Within your chosen Subclasses to make unique builds 8b) New Fragments, Aspects, Melee, Grenade and Super Options for all Subclasses 9) New Major and Elite Enemy types like when they introduced Wyverns to mix up combat 10) If they want to make weapon drops mean something -= Do a Crafting and Red Border Overhaul = Get a weapon drop and you Unlock a Barrel, Mag, Left and Right Column perk and you can then Craft THOSE perks. Collect more weapons and Perks to unlock them in crafting - When All options found and unlocked you can ENHANCE that crafted weapon or just enhance the one you find and you can change its Barrel and Mag Perk 11) Keep Promises they make
Destiny is a 1993 Toyota corolla and bungie keeps putting a new coat of paint with reupholstered seats every few years, only to keep selling it as a new car. Yet it's so full of rust and decay that the frame could come apart in one fender bender like a mr. bean
I am really sad about it, but the good days of Destiny are behind us. Considering the Bungie team is getting smaller each day. Even if the game were in a good position, I don't think it can recover. It can get better but trust is not something easy to come by in gaming space these days.
Since Aztercoss is doing a bit of we not in the bizz call lying some more info about the whole "extraction shooter were very hot at one time". The really hot his is referring to was the end of 2020 to begging of 2021 where their was this massive spike in content creators really pushing tarkov and its genera as the successor to BR(which at this point had really settled into Fortnight, Warzon eand Apex) / We also have to remember thats this was just a year after Ninja was paid some 20 million dollars to stream on Mixer, showing just how much it could be worth to be one of if not the biggest names in content creation in the most popular genera. So we have this perfect storm for single boosting a game/genera as hard as possible and developers that are hungry for the next big things, becasue in spite of the constant crying about how everyone is abandoning BR now they have only grown to the point Minecraft and Tetris are the only games bigger then Fornight. So you have this issue where content creators sold and shucked a product to viewers and developers that has never really materialized. Sure Extraction have their fans and the most popular one did grown (87k more monthly payers from its low 2m monthly estimates) but no where close enough to even mach BR back in 2020 where the biggest one had close to quadrupled in monthly player number to some quarter of a billion players. Marathon is a game that is chasing a trend that honestly never really existed to being whit.
I’ve completely given up on destiny after playing since the early days of D1 all the way to final shape. I’d be happy to see it turn itself around and return to its glory days but frankly I just can’t see it happen. I’d love to be proven wrong though.
Destiny's fall didnt start in Final Shape or Lightfall, it started in Witch Queen. Thats the moment they began to stretch out the content and deliver less and less, though most of it was still good enough to be considered worth playing. But Lightfall was the point where they tried to deliver a truly subpar product and the point I knew Destiny was probably done, especially given the seasonal activities and communications from Bungie. Final Shape was the attempt to bring the player base back, but they didn't actually have a real plan to retain those players and they still dont. If you want to look at the future of Destiny, simply look at what their priorities are, its developing games other than Destiny. Its a shame that this game went from my favorite game to a cautionary tale, I don't think its coming back and ill miss it terribly.
Absolutely correct. That year Which Queen came out in 2022 is also when that GDC was as well. That's where a guy in Bungie's management also gave that epic,"Don't want to over deliver, and or the,"Gotta treat a game like a train station", which are just a few of them golden nuggets of horse crap. It's a damn shame
I would say it's been the leadership and management that have really fucked up this game. Gameplay wise, Destiny is still pretty top tier. I consider it an RPG lite. It aint as complex or grindy as other RPGs but it's a good intro into the genre for noobs and casuals. The devs want to deliver an amazing product but leadership forces them to deliver crap. Lightfall was suppossed to be the finale but they said there was to much content to pack in and they needed more time so they divided it into the final shape. I think most players started reaching the burnout after the first 2 seasons of witch queen. I did. I still play destiny from to time but no one i know plays and the clan im in has maybe one to 3 people online if it all
Completely agree with your views, while the Witch Queen itself was and still one of the greatest DLC in D2 along with Forsaken (it can even be considered as "The Taken King" of the D2), the problem lies behind the layers of the DLC. They are already testing out the water before it by releasing a paid standalone 30th anniversary dungeon and looks to be received very well by the community, so they stretch it out even more in Witch Queen by adding more already-confusing paid bundle. Looking back further more to Beyond Light, it didn't have a dungeon released along with it since Prophecy was free, and I think that started the idea of having a separate paywall just because they gave one for free. It slows and well-planned strategy to squeeze even more money from the players and it shows in the GDC presentation they did a couple years ago.
I think Into the Light and The Final Shape was an excellent setup for a reinnsance era for the game. Unfortunately they followed it up with Echos and Revanant
the thing holding us all to this game is admittedly how beautifully made it is, no game compares to the combat, movement and flow of destiny 2 and ill die on that hill they have this advantage over every other game and blow it somehow
Yep i agree on that my only problem is that when i say this to a friend and tries D2 he agrees on that subject but the new light experience is so crappy that makes a new player to stop after a few days because they cant connect to the game because there so much missing from the game. Not to mention that after a few days when he tries to play a nightfall and i say oh yeah you need to buy that.. and this ... etc hehe
D2 wins on shooting, movement, skill based gameplay, mechanics like raids, back in the day was also good at buildcrafting, power fantasies, art, music, immersion, lore, lore, LORE, lore masterfully weaved to connect all the elements of the game toghether seamlessly, poetically, philosophically, metaphorically, morally. One of the best games that ever existed honestly. But unfortunatelly too much time has passed. Playing such a game non stop every year, is bound to start feeling old. A new weapon dropping literally has no purpose anymore, we already defeated the witness, we already defined our favourite builds and playstyles, we are not going to need it, there's no reason to waste time on it. We needed a true sequel, a Destiny 3, which doesn't just reshuffle the cards on the table, but completely changes the deck. With new mechanics, tons of new abilities, new buildcrafting methods, new missions, like in depth veichles or ship battles, new modes, locations, exploration features. Something feeling fresh, a new journey that you know will last longer than the end of the season. The best time i've ever had in this game will always be at the beginning, everything was there to discover, to know, to try, to experiment, to explore. Everything was possible, everything seemed like a threath. We need that feeling of adventure and awe again.
It’s broken already. The trust is not there. we’ve been on this vicious cycle for 10 years and now that the cycle is finally over people are gonna be reluctant if they wanna get back on the hamster wheel bungee needs to communicate what they want the future of the game to be and some people don’t care the stories officially over for them and they’re moving on
Destiny was broken years ago. But by the time the cracks can no longer be ignored, it's far too late. All that we see now are the final steps of a man who doesn’t yet realize he is already dead.
I think one of the biggest issues for D2 is the fact that it is SO daunting for new lights. Like, unless you've been following along, you're looking at dropping ~$300 for all the DLC when you may not even want half of it. This means that there's a severe lack of an influx of new players to bolster the numbers. I genuinely wonder if they were to add a subscription option that gave access to all of the DLC, old, new, upcoming, if that would make it easier for new players to get involved. Like, $10/m is about the same as an expansion + season pass, but would make it easier for new players to try things out and potentially enjoy the game. It would also give Bungie a more stable source of income rather than it being a massive paycheck at the beginning of the year that has to be rationed for the entire year. It's probably too late to do it now, but it's a question I've had since Witch Queen. They don't have the number of new players to keep things alive. It's just vets and the vets are getting tired of the same things. Adding new blood would give them a fresh source of income and would provide much needed player count.
D2 could survive if it didn't delete all of the game content. Straight ripped us off for what we paid for, and it ruins new player experiences without it. How are new players supposed to enjoy d2 without that content?
Yeah this is a huge issue for me, I've had a lot of friends over the last few years consider trying destiny 2, but not being able to play the older story for yourself in game is just a deal breaker for most of them and would be for me if I hadn't played it all myself previously. So I ended up advising them not to play it.
They have to know marathon is going to be DOA. Between marathon trying to be a hero shooter when the genre is declining (with the exception of marvel rivals), the fact that they’re chasing after a small and dedicated extraction shooter fanbase, early reviews from those streamers bungie invited said they didn’t want to replay it, releasing a few months before GTA 6, and bungie’s horrible reputation of greed, incompetence, and laziness scaring off potential customers, they have to see the writing on the wall but I wouldn’t be surprised if bungie buried their heads in the sand like they always. I’m predicting marathon flopping, not as a bad as concord but probably lasting around a year, which forces Sony to reach their breaking point and absorb the company.
There's little that hasn't been said about the difference between WF and D2, but regardless of how you feel about either game, numbers don't lie, WF is as lively as it's always been, while D2 is agonizing, which warrants the question "what has WF done right that D2 hasn't?" and in my humble opinion, this question has two answers: 1-innovation WF not only expanded upon core game loop, but also added tons of side activities and mechanics, such as archwing, necramechs, railjack, fishing, steel path, night wave, sisters of parvos, clans and so much more, while D2 chose to stay largely the same game it always was. 2-human side: think what you will about the game, but there's no denying that Digital Extremes is the most humane and caring game developer when it comes to their game's community, most WF players know what the CEO looks like, what their developers names are, what their philosophy is, and overall, how their game is being run and where it's headed, and just to give you an example, just look up "warframe devs end stream after learning totalbiscuit died" here on youtube, and then perhaps you'll understand what I mean by humane.
I took a break prior to Final shape due to the delay caused by the first round of layoffs, but quit a week after the second round after finding out about Pete showing the car collection. At this point, if people haven't quit yet, then they are never quitting. I've played since Forsaken, and honestly, I can't imagine wasting my disk space reinstalling this game.
I would really like if Bungie just completely licensed out the IP to another development studio & let them build D3. That would be the most hyped I'd be for anything Destiny related in a while
Man, its just days after Christmas, and looking at the player trends, Destiny didn't gain any new players from the "Christmas surge". Everything is also discounted by 50% or more right now and not one player gained... 2025 may very well be the final nail in Bungie's coffin.
The problem with Destiny is that 95% of it's endgame content forces you to play with other people and forces you to use the crappy matchmaking system. Other big games have plenty of solo contents for endgame and that's why they last longer. Majority of gamers play with themselves and Bungie doesn't understand that.
Biggest problem is they haven't really gotten into any information on what the next saga will be. Just it's outside of Sol and we'll learn more about it toward the end of Heresy. That's it. Without the draw of what the new story will be or what the new big bad will be, we have nothing. For almost a decade "Darkness" was the big bad, but it turned out Darkness itself wasn't, but a wielder of the darkness. Now that the Witness is gone, we don't have a "Big Bad" except people talking about the Winnower, but....No? We need Bungie to stop playing their cards so close to their chests right now. They need to give us actual info to keep us intrigued and they need to do it sooner rather than later. I can count on my hands how many times I've played D2 since Revenant started and it's almost over. I don't see myself even starting Heresy until the dungeon is released in February because that's all I've cared about was playing through Vesper's Host. I really want more info before I decide to dedicate another decade of my life to a story that just isn't delivering right now.
Destiny isn't even a bad game at the moment, it's just gotten stale because the stuff they've been doing to change the game hasn't really felt like much of change in comparison to what it should feel like
Destiny 2 is objectively a bad game at the moment because of how technically broken it is. Entire destinations, including the pale heart, have been borderline unplayable for months now.
I'm a 60 year old Destiny OG (since D1 Beta).... I actually loaded up D1 on my PS4, and actually had a good time. The problem with Destiny is that it's just same recycled crap. The only way Destiny would recover is a complete make over and introduction of Destiny 3. That's the ONLY way. Destiny content is "tired". Nobody is playing because there is nothing to look forward to. We guardians have done it all. There is absolutely nothing Bungie could add to Destiny to make players come back. What would be the reason for them to come back? Crota needs to nuke all the planets, the traveler, and we start over from the stone age. Maybe find some nuked traveler fragments that help us build up new classes. Build cities and economies and armies (pve). Declare war on our neighbors cities, with fireteams (pvp). Recover golden age tech to forge new never seen before weapons (ok ok, the pocket infinity would be cool). Clans could join each other to increase the size of our territories and armies. Create the Citizen Patrol League made up of solo players (lone wolves) who protect the citizens, but are more deadly than a fireteam of 3 because they would be afforded unique class abilities. You could have the "Mafia" lead by Driftor who's only out for themselves. Throw in some hot babe NPC's and a good storyline... and viola! Destiny 3 !!
Warframe doesn't really do it for me but you are correct about how it has features that need to be in D2. I honestly think Bungie needs to set D2 aside, focus on marathon entirely and bring destiny back with a D3 (Sony would be supportive as they picked up Bungie specifically for the Destiny IP). Feel like the world of Warcraft went through a similar dormancy period and us just recently starting to make moves again.
Not only does Warframe have a number of features that Destiny should have (customizable ships, spaceships battles, pets, clan spaces, trading, etc), but Warframe is roughly half the size of Destiny 2, and never had to rescind paid sections of the game.
Honestly this does sound like the best option at this point. Just supporting D1 and D2 as live games borderline crippled Bungie when they had far more money and almost double their current headcount. There's just no way for them to reasonably support Marathon and D2 as live game simultaneously. One of the games is going to have to be supported less and D2 has been declining year on year. I think even if Frontiers is a banger it's going to be a send off before D2 gets put into maintenance mode out of sheer necessity.
its not only warframe as it is just another game, but its the bunch of new games releasing in 2025 that will compete with d2 and games already doing, marvel rivals ow2 cs2 valorant fortnite for pvp and for pve pick your poison there's a lot of mmo if raids, arpgs for loot piñatas... with how d2 is right now, i dont see it evolving to grab your attention for more than a month with 1 expansion and to experience raids/dungeons idk what it is im not a dev or game designer but they gotta figure it out
"one cannot simply reach across the black and claim dominion over 1,000 stars with 10,000 arms, if they die here and now with only 2.." -somewhere in the Destiny lore
08:50 a slimmer destiny went over so well with vaulting..... How about you just stop make a complete destiny 1-2 co-op game? Id buy it again just to play the highlights beginning to end.
As an Destiny 1 and 2 veteran. I can honestly say the game has been dead a long time ago. Warframe pulled me out and helped me see the what could be achieved. But me being a Destiny player I kept wasting my money on it for no improvements. Just new content and no fixing old and or standing issues. Let Destiny die at this point it’s all about money not the player.
They just need to take off the training wheels for prismatic and give us all the options even if it breaks the game balance because we need something fun 10:04
I agree with this entirely it will open up so much for build crafting and open help expand some classes from just basic builds that don't change until a year later.
Destiny 2 2025 “We hear you, your feedback is important to us, just give us another 99.99 & weeks promise we’ll make it better”………sounds familiar right?
Tried getting into destiny 2, learned about all the legacy story content removed (Red War, warmind, forsaken, curse of osiris) and just went with playing Destiny 1 on the PS4, never looking back, so damn solid. Got a warlock to light level 380 and played all the story missions and strikes, then max leveled a Titan right after that. Despite all the quality of life downgrades I'd rather just play a coherent experience i can start and finish from scratch like Destiny years 1-3.
@1:39 "I think most of us are probably going to play [Marathon]." I haven't heard anything yet that's made me want to play Marathon. I'll try it if it's free or if there's a demo, but I don't play extraction shooters, that format doesn't interest me. I primarily like D2 for the loot and build crafting; do extraction shooters have loot and build crafting?
Bungie said that they are giving 2 expansions per year but if anyone understands how business or contracts actually work then there is a high possibility that the double expansion per year is a requirement from Sony to Bungie to 1 see if they are a good investment long term, 2: see if Bungie can operate and deliver decent quality content in a high demand scenario, and 3: to see if its worth maintaining funds to Bungie.
They were already delaying final shape. And as far as I’m concerned final shape was the first quality dlc they made since beyond light. I don’t know what the time between those expansions was but I can tell you that all they’ve done since then is cut employees. So I can’t imagine that timeframe miraculously getting shorter. And I wouldn’t take any bets that those dlcs don’t come out half baked unless Sony brings in a team to help.
@ okay so this is just you saying you know nothing of business or contractual obligations then. Good to know. And just to be informative delaying of dlcs rarely have anything to do with contracts.
This may just be me but Destiny 1 felt more sci fi an Destiny 2 feels more fantasy. I really miss the sci-fi feeling Destiny 1 had that still maintained some sort of realtiy grounded in realism
10:30 thank you, i feel so vindicated, ive only been a fairly new subscriber (2? 3? years?) but every time i reccomended warframe to yall (you byf, and the others) it was because as someone who started out on d1 like yall AND warframe at the start we just wanted to share another amazing game
Sure it will, because they will scale back server infrastructure and queues will be there as a result on releases even if the numbers are lower. Theyll penny pinch.
I just stopped playing recently. More than a week clean now. Have to admit I feel RELIEVED! As if I escaped from a toxic relationship. Best decision of me in gaming so far. Anyway I will never stop watching Cross' content ❤️
I've been clean since the end of season of the deep. I still don't even know how it all ended and I couldn't care less! It's sad that a game I enjoyed so much was completely ruined by brain dead, heartless exes, but it is what it is. I've moved on. Only stay subscribed to this channel for the other content like PoE and Warframe.
to me it's even crazy to think about playing this game for years without ever stopping for more than a couple weeks. Sounds like torture. Even when the game was in its prime and i loved it like not much else, i would always just put the game off and play something else entirely, then return to the game after weeks. Variety and freshness is important. Why are certain people so glued to certain games i will never understand, especially if with the money to buy a couple skins they could instead buy another amazing game on sale or something.
I never thought I’d detest Prismatic as much as I do. In fact I was super excited for it. The other subclasses have an identity in my head. Like I think differently when I’m playing Arc Hunter vs Solar Hunter. Especially since Radiant and Amplified work differently. The whole gimmick with Prismatic is that it *doesn’t* have an identity. Not only that I feel like I’m nerfing myself if I don’t run it. So I’m pretty much never coming back
If you really think prismatic doesn't have an identity then you just simply haven't paid any attention to literally any story bits over the last 10 years. The entire identity of prismatic is that we are what we are supposed to be in the story, a master of light and darkness using both together in harmony. Also if you think there are no good builds that don't involve prismatic then you simply haven't tried hard enough
I am still playing my Titan Bubble class and I am having fun. You dont have to use the strongest meta build you know. Look at it as being a challenge to beat the higher tier content with a weaker class.
Prismatic is something that in all honesty should have never been put in the game, at this in this scale. The 3rd darkness subclasses would have been better to wrap up the final shape while still maintaining identities
I've watched your content on and off over the years for help on Destiny 2 (played from 2021-2023). Watching you be happy as you game in something like Warframe has been very refreshing and a great watch. You look like you're having fun again :)
We need to accept and admit that Bungie is not the same studio anymore. The people who made it great are gone. Its just a popular name being puppeted by corporate. The magic is gone. Set those expectations low boys.
I know Destiny is finished because for the first time in 10 years, I'm not happy or angry at Bungie. Instead I feel nothing (apathy) and haven't played in 5 months. It's definitely over.
I dont even mean this as a hater. But there's nothing bungie can do to convince me to play destiny again and I'm steering far clear of marathon. I wish bungie luck because I know I'm not alone with my sentiment
How long does a thing get to be tiring? People keep saying that they’re tired of the “make or break” and I’m just anxious about when the actual community wide “I’m done” is gonna hit.
@@thehieromancer2795 pretty big destiny 2 youtuber talk abaut destiny 2 failing point... Like he done befor... But now from warframe... So i will say it is a change, and fact that feame fix slowly it evry erly and end game problems one by one when destiny do oposite not helping... It may not be last time but we almost there
I mean considering D2’s numbers right now I’d honestly say the community wide “I’m done” has already happened. It’s mostly the hardcore players sticking around atm.
@@astracontritus1209im a hardcore but i refuse to play until they announce something worthy of my time, and thats what everyone should do, dont okay for the sake of it
I know I’ll be playing d2 forever lol. Of course I’ll take breaks to play other games like I did for elden ring and getting the platinum for it, but I always come back to Destiny 2 because their simply isn’t anything like it and it’s just fun.
Yep. The gunplay and feel of combat is absolutely unmatched, it's ruined other fps games for me. Idk how bungie does it but for all their faults they're the best in the business when it comes to gunplay and general combat. The original Halo games felt the same way.
One thing that gives me high hopes for marathon is , in my opinion, destiny has always nailed the actual combat , weather the content for that year is bad or not is another thing , the shooting and abilities in destiny have always been extremely satisfying to use , and the gunplay is fun and fluid , so Atleast we can hope they will make marathon combat good aswell
I just don't think people care enough about extraction shooters. The interest just doesn't support the required numbers. Even if the game was free it wouldn't bring in enough numbers.
Get your playtime in now Because once Marathon drops that’ll be it for Bungie. There is no universe where that game isn’t DOA and becomes a massive loss for Bungie/Sony. You think the game is in a rough state now? Just wait. There is little to no chance Destiny 2 survives Marathon dropping. Once it flops Destiny will unfortunately follow soon after as Bungies cash cow isn’t making them enough as they’re completely reliant right now on Marathon being successful.
They should give the players the full prismatic experience. Buildcrafting has been such an important feature of D2 that by having access to all subclass supers, abilities, fragments, etc., it would invite more engagement and bring genuine fun back to the game. This would probably break the game, but I feel like Bungie needs to push things further for the gamers who’re still dedicated to the game.
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Gonna be honest, having every year be make or break for Destiny is getting tiring at this point. I’m tired of this cycle of building up Destiny then it crashing on the Golden Gate bridge.
Literally
The “it’s so over - we’re so back” cycle is getting stale
To be fair, this is after the final shape and the story is over for a lot of people so I think this is different.
Gonna be honest, it’s tiring seeing comments like this every six months from people who continue to play the game lol
Nobody cares, shut up and stop trying to be known 😂
This is the first time I genuinely don't care about destiny in over 10 years, I feel free.
Fr last time I gave d2 was right when they dropped vespers host so I grinded the quest in hopes of getting a god roll chill inhibitor. Then they gave it away for free which was good but still made it pointless for me to grind it anymore. We leaving d2 in 2024 fr
You don't realise how good it is until you are free and clear out of fomo grinds
same, I have moved onto warframe and I am currently addicted just 2 days in.
@@ShantoShmento Warframe was such a breath of fresh air after the limitations of build crafting in Destiny. They encompassed the power fantasy and sure it means that end game is less difficult but it also means that you can create awesome builds with ALL the 60+ warframes
Cringe
The "we're so back -> it's so over -> we're so back -> it has never been more over -> we've never been more back" cycle is so draining. I want Destiny to stop having these disastrously low moments and just be GOOD.
they aren't making anything new that is as big as an expansion so, what's the point?
Echoes was such a massive self report on how minimum they wanted their viable product to be that this episode being worse just sealed the deal. They know how to make good seasons, season of the Witch proves that. I'm just done being lied to about how they say they definitely learned from the good only to be lazy and see how much they can force us to tolerate the bad.
You want that, but Bungie doesn't even want that, or Destiny would've been GOOD.
Unfortunately, that's utterly impossible.
It’s more likely to be just over…
It makes me wonder how Warframe has every QoL thing that Destiny needs and is still has substantially less storage requirements.
Because DE gets rid of unnecessary spaghetti code. Steve built the game for the intention of it needing updates, and the devs having an easier time to work on the game.
To be fair they're made entirely different, one relies on procedural generation whilst the other being handcrafted along with better texturing, that's just one example.
@@Free_RayneExcept even warframe supports hand crafted areas. It's not entirely procedural. Also warframe has better textures lately. (Anything past sacrifice. And especially including and after duvri will start showing that)
The catch with warframe is that because it doesn't really delete content. And the devs prefer to push forward. They don't always often comeback and update older stuff.
This means that sometimes (hello archwings) it can be loaded with jank. Functional and visual.
However. Because the developers put so much focus on things the game can't already do. They put a lot of time into the engine and the game, and making sure to keep it expandable/sustainable.
Destiny 2 just can't. The engine wasn't meant for what they're throwing at it. And they have so much code debt that it be too much work to try to fix it
Also warframe is absurdly optimized. It's not even fair.
@@Free_Rayne The rooms in the levels themselves are all handcrafted. The only thing done procedual is how they connect to each other.
They knew it was a game that would need to last indefinitely from the start, D2 was always intended to be thrown away after a few DLC(honestly forsaken might have been the original end of D2)
Remember when they say they were "over delivering" with Lightfall? They're not gonna make it any longer if that mentality is still their credo.
That was Forsaken.
@@vruxdrossgaming No, they literally said they would be saying screw it and overdeliver in one of the reveals.
@@Free_Rayne I doubt it. This is Bungie, the king of false promises.
the fact they had a higher up explain that they were purposefully not meeting expectations, when the whole point of being a entertainer, which are what game developers are, is to meet and especially EXCEED expectations!?!!
Warframes biggest advantage was laid out by Steve the CEO in a documentary awhile back. The game started really small, but the game was built to be able to be updated and expanded easily. Steve knew at the time if Warframe was going to survive it had to be able to be updated easily on a regular basis. The game has had it “engine” overhauled twice that I can remember. The game is on its third iteration of damage, melee has been reworked twice, guns have been reworked twice. Etc. From all accounts I’ve heard Destiny is a total pain in the ass to work on in comparison. Thats why Warframe has been able to add dojo’s and now 4 customizable living spaces, 2 ships, one you can control, companions, 3 open world spaces and now a romance system.
Exactly. D2 has attempted to build a wide MMO on top of the narrow foundation of a looter. WF has built a Looter on top of the wide and secure base of an MMO since the beginning.
The map editor had to be loaded up overnight and staff returning to office the following day hoped that it didn't crash. At least that's for Destiny 1. They mentioned they've updated their tools and stuff but there's only so much they can do with the same engine.
10 years of stealing from people they should have make a huge step by now.
The problem with Destiny's engine is that it's over 2 decades old with slow improvements and is proprietary. Meanwhile Warframe uses Unreal Engine which is THE industry standard and everyone knows how to use it.
Not to say there aren't engines that aren't old. Call of Duty's IW Engine is so old but it's on version 9.0, and has been around since the beginning of Call of Duty which is NUTS. But thats just one example. Destiny needs an engine overhaul like a Tiger 2.0 or something to make the game easier to work on.
@@chaoschaoforever warframe uses the Evolution engine which is proprietary to Digital Extremes, the developer. Steve Sinclair, one of the DE founders, did work on Unreal Tournament which was the genesis of the Unreal Engine but that is owned by Epic
Idk man talking about destiny being in a make or break situation while your playing warframe kinda tells me the break is already here lol
Warframe is meh
Its trhiving far better than Destiny, and they respect their player base far more than bungie ever is going to. And funny thing you dont need to pay for expansionsthe size of a smal game with the priceof a big one.@@lazyvoid7107
We'll see. But it's funny seeing him getting so involved in that game.
Eh I don’t really agree. I think what’s unhealthy is this expectation that any game can or should be played 24/7. Taking a break from D2 to play other games while the team cooks up new stuff is HEALTHY. All games should be like this. I absolutely hate this new business model where games try to keep you busy forever. Sure, I like D2. I also like Path of Exile and Factorio. I like having time to play other games. A sustainable game as a service title SHOULD have lulls in player population. As long as those players are excited to come back when the next cool chunk of content drops
@@lazyvoid7107 meh or not its still 100 times better than Destiny at this point. plus Warframe has been one of if not THE top f2p game since its release
The fact they confirmed they arent working on destiny 3 was the death nail for me.
Knell*
@@cousinrolf871 He means the last nail in the coffin. Stop trying to be smart.
@@SomebodyYouUsedToKnowI think you missed the joke.
@@SomebodyYouUsedToKnow actually no, knell is an applicable word to use instead of nail, you stop being weird and alpha in youtube comments
Destiny was always supposed to be a 10 year plan, now years 1-3 (D1) is stuck on 8th gen consoles, and bungie removed years 4-5 content entirely, making the new or returning experience bad, then just kept nickle-and-diming everything they can, they fumbled the bag.
01:41 Why would I touch Marathon after seeing how they handled Destiny? I used to have 2 dozen friends I could hop on and play Destiny with and not a single one of them still plays now, and their sentiment on Marathon ranges from apathy to derision due to feelings of betrayal.
I remember having a good clan of 20 people to play with. This year, the clan was reduced to 2. I miss them and the Preservers Of The Grind, but we disbanded once there was nothing to preserve. Me and my last guildie are Bullet Smack now.
THIS!
He's huffing paint or something if he thinks most D2 players will try it. We know the abuse that comes with new Bungie, I'm not signing up for another round.
Plus extraction shooter market is over saturated with already good established games. The only bonus to Marathon is the gunplay on a Bungie game is actually good.
the fact that Bungie has almost double the employees Digital Extreme has is crazy considering the difference in the state of the 2 games.
Feels like we always have this conversation
Yep it's never ending
Execpt now player count is at an all time low so its kinda different @@djjorge87
Yet the more we continue this conversation, the conclusion keeps getting worse.
Pretty much every year at this point now yeah
Every year bruh. For 10 years. Nothings changed drastically in the games design, but just enough to keep us playing. Somehow Bungie's been able to coast off the fact there's only one 'Destiny'
Dude said alot of us will play Marathon 😂😂
Count me out
Literally 🤣
I respect his optimism about it, even though the reality of it says otherwise.
there’s a saying that comes to mind.
*”hope is the first step on the road to disappoint.”*
Bungie doesn’t realize that most of the player base of marathon will just be destiny players checking the game out. After a week or 2 I guarantee marathon will flop.
@@kjenriquez16 joke of the year 2024
If marathon ain’t free I ain’t playing it that’s for sure
$40
I wouldn't play it if it were free.
If someone gave it to me as a gift I'm suing.
@@JustSway yea another “free”bungie game just sounds like a dumpster fire
Ok brokie
My last straw was the last round of layoffs. I'm sick of these giant companies laying people off to improve their bottom line. Then expecting less employees to make a quality product, while the executives still get their massive paychecks. Been playing desinty since the very beginning. Sadly, I'm over it.
I’ve been one of the biggest defenders for the longest time of Bungie and Destiny. I can’t do it anymore. It’s so tiring, hell even my friends have uninstalled and don’t even wanna play it anymore. It will always have a place in my heart but I can’t support with how badly this year after TFS has been in so many ways shape or forms.
They fucked up by not having D3 in the oven.
D3 would've done nothing for the franchise...except be another Destiny 2: Mediocre campaign, lack of end game content, etc until a massive expansion like Taken King or Forsaken.
They should just rebrand Frontiers as Destiny 3
They weren’t making enough money. And the way it’s going they would’ve had to sell destiny 3 for 120 bucks a copy. The standard edition. Diablo 4 was about 90 bucks. Sure you could’ve gotten it for 70 but most people got it early and enjoyed the couple extra skins. And let’s not pretend destiny 3 would’ve been any different. And where they are now they would have to sell way more than 300k copies to be successful. And 300k copies is about 15 times more players than are currently in the game.
Maybe not D3, I feel the story of "destiny" is over. People have seen the conclusion and are done.
But they should have had a "Next game" cooking, something that could be a successor to destiny that built off what people liked from the game but with a new story and universe. Or maybe a new story set in the far far future of the current destiny universe
What would D3 even do?
I dunno how you can be a Destiny enjoyer and not absolutely resent Marathon's existence.
Agreed.
I cant stand PVP play thats how
Using the word resent in the same sentence as a video game is wild
2 totally different games… why would I care about an extraction game when I don’t play them…
Because developmental focus was shifted from D2 to Marathon and as a result D2 is starving @@MyDailyRoutinee
Like I said before, if they consistently delivered a quality product, didn’t constantly reskin or recycle, were more innovative, focused on bugs, didn’t try to nickel and dime their fans, weren’t so lazy, and avoided getting into controversies they wouldn’t be in this situation. Like the balder gate ceo, treat your customers with respect and they’ll be more lenient.
Exactly, the lil sneaky things that they call “mistakes” after the community discovers it, from xp throttling to perk gateing all to make people play longer, hell even the “god rolls” that were given to us seems like a sneaky way to get people to buy and play the dungeons they don’t care to buy
People told them 2-3 years ago that this was going to happen when they first started the dungeon model. Then they layered that on top of the seasonal model and it got to a point where I started comparing the game to old Warcraft subscriptions and determined they were now charging more fees than Warcraft did back in the day and I also determined that they probably had no right to do so. And this is the result of trying to be Warcraft w out the infrastructure or the content. It doesn’t help when you do that on top of literally deleting major chunks of playable story content people already paid for. They’re literally just making Ubisoft type mistakes at this point. And while it didn’t happen over night people knew this dungeon model was eventually going to kill the game. When your friends are online doing a dungeon and the first conversation you have to have is whether or not you feel like taking 20 bucks out of your wallet to join them that becomes an increasingly more difficult conversation. Especially when millennials/ gen z are the brokest generation and they’re the ones financing your game.
I think one of the biggest problems was the seasonal model.
I agree with everything you said 100%. Bungie needs to look in the mirror and see what they're currently doing is not going to work anymore. Need drastic changes the overall game of Destiny 2. They've become complacent.
@@Venomx-nb1jr you have FRIENDS that play this game? Lol all of mine moved on a long time ago, I literally just run solo pvp, and onslaught then i hop off, havent done a raid or dungeon in literal years, i just dont get the same feeling or have the same drive
People saying "same thing every year" you are right but wrong at the same time. This has been the lowest and the future doesn't look bright at all. Yall need to accept this time is really dying
It died when Activision and high moon the studios who actually put effort and worked on most things, left. 80% of forsaken was made by high moon. Taken king and most of D1 was made by high moon and Activision.
Nah lol they can make the bare minimum then here comes all the fans running back
@Ligmanuttz like headless chickens 🤦♂️. But this time finally is looking that jot many people aren't that hype for D2 and Bungie. The returning number wouldn't be that high compared to other years
Them prioritizing an extraction shooter hoping on nostalgia bait was truly one of the dumbest ass moves this company has ever long-term planned.
The first Marathon game came out in 1994 - 30 years ago. If they're trying to capitalise on nostalgia, they're doing it badly. Which tracks
But you're okay with Bungie selling you nostalgia for Destiny?
Warframe really proves just how bad of a developer bungie is. Trading, chat, recruiting, customizing ships, clans, clan housing, fair monetization, so many weapons, great story, and no sunsetting. Warframe proves that all the stuff bungie says can’t be done are entirely possible.
Digital extremes isn’t perfect, but they’re trying. And they genuinely like their players. Bungie is just greedy. And i genuinely believe bungie hates their fan base.
Warframe is good, I've been playing it quite a bit lately. But the combat and gunplay are just straight-up garbage. The guns feel horrible and the enemies are boring as hell and just damage sponges.
It's a cool game and all, but comparing the combat and gunplay to D2.. it's not even close. Warframe isn't even in the same realm.
Plus you also have to understand Warframe existed years before destiny 1 so a good piece of the as to why a lot of it exists due to it's age and longevity tbh. Could Bungie have done better of course.
@@beeman4266 there are so many different types of guns that there's bound to be one you enjoy, if you're complaining that all the enemies are "damage sponges" then you aren't modding your weapons or frames. This is the game where it's completely normal to nuke a room full of enemies in less than a second and already be through the door to the next room
@@beeman4266 Destiny...a game where bullet magnetism and aim assist constantly needs to be babysat by programmers so players FEEL good firing guns that are becoming less and less relevant.
Warframe...a game where it actually takes skill to pop headshots while hurtling through the air at a million miles an hour.
You're right, they're not in the same realm. Destiny players are still pushing the lie that Destiny gunplay is good, when it hasn't been in years. Or ever.
the developers at bungie are in no way bad, if they were permitted to make all of that, they would.
the higher ups just limit everything possible for more money.
Once you break the habit of playing D2 you really see how bad it is
This!!! You just said the cold facts for everyone. Destiny players are addicted, they can't see this even If they try. Most are blinded by nostalgia.
i'd argue that Destiny 2 is one of the best games ever, but the toxic relationship with the players has made them feel like its flaws are unbearable
@@WaveOfDestiny Can't be one of the best games considering it doesn't have all its content. Also are you counting it now or over time because we all know the game has bounced between 3/10 to 8/10 repeatedly
This is true, same thing happened to a lot of people during the WoW exodus during Shadowlands, you get used to eating stale crackers that you don't think steak is good anymore.
@@ThenchreslethFACTS i left and haven’t looked back
The first time he watches a Warframe Devstream, this toxic relationship with Bungie will end, having a developer that cares about its players and the community is priceless
And/or Prime Time. Hearing Cross play with Megan or Rebecca on a stream would be hilarious.
I’m waiting for that time and I’m telling you, cross’s eyes are going to open up and how human the devs are instead of mindless husks and scripted nonsense that every d2 dev stream is
Franklin, that's EXACTLY how I felt the first "Letter From the Producer" I watched for Final Fantasy XIV showed me a dev team I wished Destiny had.
@@RedShadowOfSaturn I feel like Cross and Megan would spend an entire prime time sharing the same braincell and it'd be a hoot
he watched a devstream, thats what made DE sponsor him for the first vid and now he plays the game regularly
If Destiny wants to survive, they must undo all the vaulting they did. Bring back everything they cut, and make the past Seasons' content accessible (get rid of FOMO). That way they'd turn things around. Sadly it's more likely their ceo would rather expand his car collection than to save the game.
Exactly. Warframe is a perfect example to show people who bitch about “content bloat”. Warframe HAS content bloat, it’s honestly overwhelming but I prefer having too much shit to do versus none.
I believe you nailed it. I've been trying to get some of my friends to play D2 by showing them all my weapons, skins, ornaments etc. Watching them get excited and amped up. Only to tell them they may never get'em and I watch the light in their eyes slowly fade 🤣😂
Bungie isn't gonna float by bringing back old campaigns.
Would be so fucking huge if all the story missions from seasons were playable along with the old campaigns so people could do it all in order. Im a 2000 hour player but I started in Beyond Light, would be cool to do it from the beginning
That might actually work. Bring back all old activities, with some updates, make all their loot craftable, then just let us grind
When the entire game's future hinges ENTIRELY on another game, its fucked.
This game has ups and downs, but no matter what this game has got me thru shit in life. Ive never had such a connection to a game. I want it to be good again. I know its far fetched, but I at least wanna see whats up for the future first
This was me before, ironically, I started warframe full-time. When I played d2 daily, it felt like I had no time for anything else til I got bored. With wf, ik for a fact I have time to do anything I want and my weapons will still slap after a year.
Played consistently from launch to Lightfall
I understand you brotha
I'm in the same boat with ya man
My sentiments exactly.
Yeah, I get you. I only joined around Forsaken but it still means a lot to me. I don't want the game to die. I want them to get good, really good, like ACTUALLY good.
Definitely not playing Marathon. Bungie's lack of concern for PvP in D2 shows that the game is DOA. It'll be the next Concord. The OG Halo days Bungie is long gone and the current team just doesn't have the respect for their players to make anything take off.
Yapping
@@lazyvoid7107 not wrong tho
Facts destiny sucks it dosent take a lot to know this game been flopped Been knew this for a long time
@@lowkey_yayo5344a game that been running for years with dlc dropping every ear. They have had a good run similar to rainbow six siege.
Wanting Marathon to fail and cause Bungie to go bankrupt, because you're salty about the state of Crucible, is like hoping your pilot crashes plane that you're still riding on.
The amount of money Bungie would have made from announcing and releasing a Destiny 3 as a follow up to final shape is actually heartbreaking.
the amount of announcement streams we all hoped for a destiny 3 just to be disappointed is disappointing in itself
Nah the announcement would kill d2 further since people wouldn't have a reason to grind
@@pecador-torr they already don’t have a reason to grind… also that didnt happen in d1
They would’ve taken that money and pissed it away on other failing projects.
I was more disappointed when they told us that D3 was never in development. They had 10 years to create something and for them to say we was never working on it is heartbreaking.
Aztecross, Warframe RUclipsr, Another Week Boys, another Dev Livestream
“Another stream boys and another prime tiiime” Thats what I wanna hear from cross and im going to be so excited. When that time comes
I always felt like Destiny was at its best when it focused mostly on gunplay and movement rather than pure ability usage.
I noticed myself play less and less when subclass 3.0 dropped until I finally dropped the game during lightfall. I guess it really was because abilities were oppressively strong in pvp when we upgraded our subclasses.
Power creep went to such an insane level to the point where I didn’t enjoy the game anymore. Checkmate was a decent attempt to mitigate this… but then Bungie just gave up on it?
I don’t see myself coming back to Destiny without significant reworks to subclasses or a new release. Or maybe Destiny now just isn’t for me anymore.
i swear you have this video for every year
Every Destiny youtuber does. I don't think the game has had a good year other than when forsaken came out.
@@robertbelbin9183 Don't forget The Taken King
@@robertbelbin9183 Destiny has never had a whole year that's been good. It always has the 4-5 months surrounding an expansion release where things are great and then the player numbers begin to fall off before reaching their lowest around where we are now, and then they start pick up again once the hype machine for the next expansion starts.
and you will watch it every time
Gotta $$$ the drama.
There’s so MANY good games dropping 2025, grabbing player’s attention destiny REALLY needs to drop something heavy
Dw, they’ll be dropping more employees once destiny and marathon inevitably flop.
And an extraction game isn't it
@@hehehsham5013 Also don't forget that Pete will buy more cars
What games are coming? Honest question 🤔 I live under a rock.
I think GTA 6 is such a huge issue for bungie if numbers don’t improve before that game comes out player numbers could literally flatline…there’s nobody I know that won’t be playing that when it releases
Happy new year Aztecross
I can’t believe I was the first comment! Maybe this day won’t be complete shit 💩
New year, more “Will Destiny survive” videos!
I have solved the issue. It's so simple. Just come out with another raid that only 5% of who's left will play, another dungeon that players have to queue up for and search the internet and figure out how to actually complete it then proceeded not to do it because it looks like too much trouble and not fun, then let's bring back Destiny 1 year 1 weapons because that's not lazy, let's have warlock looking the same for 10 years, let's have primaries still be so crap compared to special slot weapons, and make sure that the rules for all of the copy and paste weapons that drop are not the ones that players want so that they quit before even getting to their goal.
And then top it off with a New Year's Day activity that's really a cut and paste from a garbage activity nobody cared about from 4 years ago and call it reprised.
THAT'S how you kill oops save DESTINY
Lightfall set me free, I genuinely don't give a f*ck about a game i've spent thousands of hours on
Expansions alone won’t keep the game alive. If they don’t fix the core issues that the make the experience for new and old players alike not enjoyable, the player count will continue to look like a heart monitor.
The heart monitor simile works so well lol.. literally on life support 😂
Don't we say this every year?
Yes, yes we do.
Not only every year, but same time every year lol
Its said year after year and it's slowly gotten worse. The question really is going to be is this the last time we have this discussion.
It's different this time considering the main story is over and people are moving on from the game including myself
Yep, what happens is bungie makes a good DLC, brings back lots of players, then makes not as good expansions later or worse content that pushes others away, then repeat the cycle.
I’m so glad across has finally realized that WF has every single thing he has said he wants in D2
I've been telling Destiny players that for a long time, and for Cross to just straight up say it is really satisfying.
the thing about warframe is it doesnt hit the same as destiny, yes it has features destiny needs, but it isnt destiny, that isnt to say its a worse game
Been screaming this for awhile lol Shit had me wanting to smash my head into the wall.
I literally flip flop on the games I hyper grind since I'm a solo player for the most part because I dont get the luxury of having a super maxed dojo I build it from my blood and sweet but lord does grinding shit like cryotic suck
@@rast.always bro i know that feeling, its like playing subway surfers but doesnt hit the same feel compared to when i played temple run when it first came out 😮.
1) 3rd Darkness Subclass (Life Steal, Fear [Overload], Ability Damage and Regen Increase Verb [Barrier])
2) Possible Kinetic Subclass (Tremor, Bleeding, Ricochet, Shrapnel, Max Shield and Shield From Zero to Full Increase Verb)
3) Clan Housing - Clan Members can use their Glimmer, Enhancment Cores and Golf Balls to buy things for the House
4) New Armour System and Perks (Incoming)
5) Mass Exotic Weapon and Armour Buffs and Re-Vanp
6) Space Battles
7) A Power Level Revamp where its SLOT based and Removal of Upgrade Modules
8) An Accendancy Type Skill Tree within the Subclasses where you can choose a certain Passive Increases Within your chosen Subclasses to make unique builds
8b) New Fragments, Aspects, Melee, Grenade and Super Options for all Subclasses
9) New Major and Elite Enemy types like when they introduced Wyverns to mix up combat
10) If they want to make weapon drops mean something -= Do a Crafting and Red Border Overhaul = Get a weapon drop and you Unlock a Barrel, Mag, Left and Right Column perk and you can then Craft THOSE perks. Collect more weapons and Perks to unlock them in crafting - When All options found and unlocked you can ENHANCE that crafted weapon or just enhance the one you find and you can change its Barrel and Mag Perk
11) Keep Promises they make
Destiny is a 1993 Toyota corolla and bungie keeps putting a new coat of paint with reupholstered seats every few years, only to keep selling it as a new car. Yet it's so full of rust and decay that the frame could come apart in one fender bender like a mr. bean
That must be a custom car now 🙂
Fun fact I was ridding in a 1993 Corolla when I read this comment
Never forget the train analogy that bungie is operating. We have already been through this for a decade.
That "Train station" analogy was terrible. Definitely didn't want to over deliver for sure.
Train wreck more like
Holding onto Destiny 2 is like holding onto rotting corpse and screaming "it's alive".
what
@@eleminatus in warframmer it work xd
It's like staying with a partner that hurts you everyday but u still love them 😂
I am really sad about it, but the good days of Destiny are behind us.
Considering the Bungie team is getting smaller each day.
Even if the game were in a good position, I don't think it can recover.
It can get better but trust is not something easy to come by in gaming space these days.
The fact that most, if not all the original devs from d1 to the earlier days of d2 are no longer working on d2 content further proves this point.
Since Aztercoss is doing a bit of we not in the bizz call lying some more info about the whole "extraction shooter were very hot at one time".
The really hot his is referring to was the end of 2020 to begging of 2021 where their was this massive spike in content creators really pushing tarkov and its genera as the successor to BR(which at this point had really settled into Fortnight, Warzon eand Apex) / We also have to remember thats this was just a year after Ninja was paid some 20 million dollars to stream on Mixer, showing just how much it could be worth to be one of if not the biggest names in content creation in the most popular genera. So we have this perfect storm for single boosting a game/genera as hard as possible and developers that are hungry for the next big things, becasue in spite of the constant crying about how everyone is abandoning BR now they have only grown to the point Minecraft and Tetris are the only games bigger then Fornight.
So you have this issue where content creators sold and shucked a product to viewers and developers that has never really materialized. Sure Extraction have their fans and the most popular one did grown (87k more monthly payers from its low 2m monthly estimates) but no where close enough to even mach BR back in 2020 where the biggest one had close to quadrupled in monthly player number to some quarter of a billion players.
Marathon is a game that is chasing a trend that honestly never really existed to being whit.
I’ve completely given up on destiny after playing since the early days of D1 all the way to final shape. I’d be happy to see it turn itself around and return to its glory days but frankly I just can’t see it happen. I’d love to be proven wrong though.
Destiny's fall didnt start in Final Shape or Lightfall, it started in Witch Queen. Thats the moment they began to stretch out the content and deliver less and less, though most of it was still good enough to be considered worth playing. But Lightfall was the point where they tried to deliver a truly subpar product and the point I knew Destiny was probably done, especially given the seasonal activities and communications from Bungie. Final Shape was the attempt to bring the player base back, but they didn't actually have a real plan to retain those players and they still dont. If you want to look at the future of Destiny, simply look at what their priorities are, its developing games other than Destiny. Its a shame that this game went from my favorite game to a cautionary tale, I don't think its coming back and ill miss it terribly.
Absolutely correct. That year Which Queen came out in 2022 is also when that GDC was as well. That's where a guy in Bungie's management also gave that epic,"Don't want to over deliver, and or the,"Gotta treat a game like a train station", which are just a few of them golden nuggets of horse crap. It's a damn shame
I would say it's been the leadership and management that have really fucked up this game. Gameplay wise, Destiny is still pretty top tier. I consider it an RPG lite. It aint as complex or grindy as other RPGs but it's a good intro into the genre for noobs and casuals. The devs want to deliver an amazing product but leadership forces them to deliver crap. Lightfall was suppossed to be the finale but they said there was to much content to pack in and they needed more time so they divided it into the final shape. I think most players started reaching the burnout after the first 2 seasons of witch queen. I did. I still play destiny from to time but no one i know plays and the clan im in has maybe one to 3 people online if it all
@jesseritchie9282 The Fact he went on stage and said that with a straight face is borderline insane.
Completely agree with your views, while the Witch Queen itself was and still one of the greatest DLC in D2 along with Forsaken (it can even be considered as "The Taken King" of the D2), the problem lies behind the layers of the DLC. They are already testing out the water before it by releasing a paid standalone 30th anniversary dungeon and looks to be received very well by the community, so they stretch it out even more in Witch Queen by adding more already-confusing paid bundle. Looking back further more to Beyond Light, it didn't have a dungeon released along with it since Prophecy was free, and I think that started the idea of having a separate paywall just because they gave one for free. It slows and well-planned strategy to squeeze even more money from the players and it shows in the GDC presentation they did a couple years ago.
Season of the Plunder......pepperidge farm remembers.....
Let's be real, if TFS wasn't able to save it, there's no universe where frontiers will.
The only thing that could save this franchise is D3
Even then unfortunately i doubt that would do us any good at this point
I think Into the Light and The Final Shape was an excellent setup for a reinnsance era for the game. Unfortunately they followed it up with Echos and Revanant
@@ErrorTechxbecause it was all nostalgia bait. ITL and FS were good, but they were just campaigns. The CONTENT sucked.
@@8milestudioI disagree, I think ITL was good in content and mid in campaign.
It won't because d3 isn't fucking needed
the thing holding us all to this game is admittedly how beautifully made it is, no game compares to the combat, movement and flow of destiny 2 and ill die on that hill
they have this advantage over every other game and blow it somehow
Yep i agree on that my only problem is that when i say this to a friend and tries D2 he agrees on that subject but the new light experience is so crappy that makes a new player to stop after a few days because they cant connect to the game because there so much missing from the game. Not to mention that after a few days when he tries to play a nightfall and i say oh yeah you need to buy that.. and this ... etc hehe
D2 wins on shooting, movement, skill based gameplay, mechanics like raids, back in the day was also good at buildcrafting, power fantasies, art, music, immersion, lore, lore, LORE, lore masterfully weaved to connect all the elements of the game toghether seamlessly, poetically, philosophically, metaphorically, morally. One of the best games that ever existed honestly.
But unfortunatelly too much time has passed. Playing such a game non stop every year, is bound to start feeling old. A new weapon dropping literally has no purpose anymore, we already defeated the witness, we already defined our favourite builds and playstyles, we are not going to need it, there's no reason to waste time on it. We needed a true sequel, a Destiny 3, which doesn't just reshuffle the cards on the table, but completely changes the deck. With new mechanics, tons of new abilities, new buildcrafting methods, new missions, like in depth veichles or ship battles, new modes, locations, exploration features. Something feeling fresh, a new journey that you know will last longer than the end of the season.
The best time i've ever had in this game will always be at the beginning, everything was there to discover, to know, to try, to experiment, to explore. Everything was possible, everything seemed like a threath. We need that feeling of adventure and awe again.
It’s broken already. The trust is not there. we’ve been on this vicious cycle for 10 years and now that the cycle is finally over people are gonna be reluctant if they wanna get back on the hamster wheel bungee needs to communicate what they want the future of the game to be and some people don’t care the stories officially over for them and they’re moving on
Destiny was broken years ago. But by the time the cracks can no longer be ignored, it's far too late. All that we see now are the final steps of a man who doesn’t yet realize he is already dead.
I think one of the biggest issues for D2 is the fact that it is SO daunting for new lights. Like, unless you've been following along, you're looking at dropping ~$300 for all the DLC when you may not even want half of it. This means that there's a severe lack of an influx of new players to bolster the numbers. I genuinely wonder if they were to add a subscription option that gave access to all of the DLC, old, new, upcoming, if that would make it easier for new players to get involved. Like, $10/m is about the same as an expansion + season pass, but would make it easier for new players to try things out and potentially enjoy the game. It would also give Bungie a more stable source of income rather than it being a massive paycheck at the beginning of the year that has to be rationed for the entire year. It's probably too late to do it now, but it's a question I've had since Witch Queen. They don't have the number of new players to keep things alive. It's just vets and the vets are getting tired of the same things. Adding new blood would give them a fresh source of income and would provide much needed player count.
There new bundles that are way cheaper than 300 usd. Just saying. I agree with everything else you said
@@carlosflores4179 Admittedly, the last time I did that calculation was about 2 months before Final Shape. Lol
@@iotajones1311 that makes sense, I believe those bundles went live with final shape
D2 could survive if it didn't delete all of the game content. Straight ripped us off for what we paid for, and it ruins new player experiences without it. How are new players supposed to enjoy d2 without that content?
Yeah this is a huge issue for me, I've had a lot of friends over the last few years consider trying destiny 2, but not being able to play the older story for yourself in game is just a deal breaker for most of them and would be for me if I hadn't played it all myself previously. So I ended up advising them not to play it.
They have to know marathon is going to be DOA. Between marathon trying to be a hero shooter when the genre is declining (with the exception of marvel rivals), the fact that they’re chasing after a small and dedicated extraction shooter fanbase, early reviews from those streamers bungie invited said they didn’t want to replay it, releasing a few months before GTA 6, and bungie’s horrible reputation of greed, incompetence, and laziness scaring off potential customers, they have to see the writing on the wall but I wouldn’t be surprised if bungie buried their heads in the sand like they always.
I’m predicting marathon flopping, not as a bad as concord but probably lasting around a year, which forces Sony to reach their breaking point and absorb the company.
There's little that hasn't been said about the difference between WF and D2, but regardless of how you feel about either game, numbers don't lie, WF is as lively as it's always been, while D2 is agonizing, which warrants the question "what has WF done right that D2 hasn't?" and in my humble opinion, this question has two answers:
1-innovation
WF not only expanded upon core game loop, but also added tons of side activities and mechanics, such as archwing, necramechs, railjack, fishing, steel path, night wave, sisters of parvos, clans and so much more, while D2 chose to stay largely the same game it always was.
2-human side: think what you will about the game, but there's no denying that Digital Extremes is the most humane and caring game developer when it comes to their game's community, most WF players know what the CEO looks like, what their developers names are, what their philosophy is, and overall, how their game is being run and where it's headed, and just to give you an example, just look up "warframe devs end stream after learning totalbiscuit died" here on youtube, and then perhaps you'll understand what I mean by humane.
I took a break prior to Final shape due to the delay caused by the first round of layoffs, but quit a week after the second round after finding out about Pete showing the car collection.
At this point, if people haven't quit yet, then they are never quitting.
I've played since Forsaken, and honestly, I can't imagine wasting my disk space reinstalling this game.
I would really like if Bungie just completely licensed out the IP to another development studio & let them build D3. That would be the most hyped I'd be for anything Destiny related in a while
Really ya let another team take hold of d3 baking while they focus on fixing
If the two expansions in frontiers give us actual missions like rise of iron I’m all in.
What do you mean by 'actual missions'
Man, its just days after Christmas, and looking at the player trends, Destiny didn't gain any new players from the "Christmas surge". Everything is also discounted by 50% or more right now and not one player gained... 2025 may very well be the final nail in Bungie's coffin.
Because no new player wants to pay 300$ just to play the last 1/3 of a 10 year story arc that's already ended.
The problem with Destiny is that 95% of it's endgame content forces you to play with other people and forces you to use the crappy matchmaking system. Other big games have plenty of solo contents for endgame and that's why they last longer. Majority of gamers play with themselves and Bungie doesn't understand that.
Play ff14 and warframe or even wow and then discuss how destiny 2 is behind the times
Wish we had a forge mode. We’d build our own content. Imagine creating personalized crucible, gambit, or onslaught maps. It’d be great.
Our own tenno-gen
@@The_Sap_Lord so.... Halo
@ forge mode was a reference to halo, yes. The halo’s forge is phenomenal.
Biggest problem is they haven't really gotten into any information on what the next saga will be. Just it's outside of Sol and we'll learn more about it toward the end of Heresy. That's it. Without the draw of what the new story will be or what the new big bad will be, we have nothing. For almost a decade "Darkness" was the big bad, but it turned out Darkness itself wasn't, but a wielder of the darkness. Now that the Witness is gone, we don't have a "Big Bad" except people talking about the Winnower, but....No? We need Bungie to stop playing their cards so close to their chests right now. They need to give us actual info to keep us intrigued and they need to do it sooner rather than later. I can count on my hands how many times I've played D2 since Revenant started and it's almost over. I don't see myself even starting Heresy until the dungeon is released in February because that's all I've cared about was playing through Vesper's Host.
I really want more info before I decide to dedicate another decade of my life to a story that just isn't delivering right now.
Destiny isn't even a bad game at the moment, it's just gotten stale because the stuff they've been doing to change the game hasn't really felt like much of change in comparison to what it should feel like
Destiny 2 is objectively a bad game at the moment because of how technically broken it is. Entire destinations, including the pale heart, have been borderline unplayable for months now.
ive had no issues 🤷♂️
Destiny prequel when? Ahamkara, Twilight Gap, Iron Lords, rise of the last city eras sound so much cooler than what we have right now
This is the mobile game, destiny rising. pretty sure they're doing something similar. au but pre d1
One thing that Bungie could do is rerelease vaulted content from red war to forsaken bringing it all back on a separate game type
In other words giving destiny the Disney remake treatment
I'm a 60 year old Destiny OG (since D1 Beta).... I actually loaded up D1 on my PS4, and actually had a good time. The problem with Destiny is that it's just same recycled crap. The only way Destiny would recover is a complete make over and introduction of Destiny 3. That's the ONLY way. Destiny content is "tired". Nobody is playing because there is nothing to look forward to. We guardians have done it all. There is absolutely nothing Bungie could add to Destiny to make players come back. What would be the reason for them to come back? Crota needs to nuke all the planets, the traveler, and we start over from the stone age. Maybe find some nuked traveler fragments that help us build up new classes. Build cities and economies and armies (pve). Declare war on our neighbors cities, with fireteams (pvp). Recover golden age tech to forge new never seen before weapons (ok ok, the pocket infinity would be cool). Clans could join each other to increase the size of our territories and armies. Create the Citizen Patrol League made up of solo players (lone wolves) who protect the citizens, but are more deadly than a fireteam of 3 because they would be afforded unique class abilities. You could have the "Mafia" lead by Driftor who's only out for themselves. Throw in some hot babe NPC's and a good storyline... and viola! Destiny 3 !!
Warframe doesn't really do it for me but you are correct about how it has features that need to be in D2.
I honestly think Bungie needs to set D2 aside, focus on marathon entirely and bring destiny back with a D3 (Sony would be supportive as they picked up Bungie specifically for the Destiny IP).
Feel like the world of Warcraft went through a similar dormancy period and us just recently starting to make moves again.
Not only does Warframe have a number of features that Destiny should have (customizable ships, spaceships battles, pets, clan spaces, trading, etc), but Warframe is roughly half the size of Destiny 2, and never had to rescind paid sections of the game.
Honestly this does sound like the best option at this point. Just supporting D1 and D2 as live games borderline crippled Bungie when they had far more money and almost double their current headcount. There's just no way for them to reasonably support Marathon and D2 as live game simultaneously.
One of the games is going to have to be supported less and D2 has been declining year on year. I think even if Frontiers is a banger it's going to be a send off before D2 gets put into maintenance mode out of sheer necessity.
its not only warframe as it is just another game, but its the bunch of new games releasing in 2025 that will compete with d2 and games already doing, marvel rivals ow2 cs2 valorant fortnite for pvp and for pve pick your poison there's a lot of mmo if raids, arpgs for loot piñatas...
with how d2 is right now, i dont see it evolving to grab your attention for more than a month with 1 expansion and to experience raids/dungeons idk what it is im not a dev or game designer but they gotta figure it out
"one cannot simply reach across the black and claim dominion over 1,000 stars with 10,000 arms, if they die here and now with only 2.." -somewhere in the Destiny lore
Bungie needs to make a choice between Marathon and Destiny. They clearly can't handle both without both suffering because of it.
08:50 a slimmer destiny went over so well with vaulting..... How about you just stop make a complete destiny 1-2 co-op game? Id buy it again just to play the highlights beginning to end.
As an Destiny 1 and 2 veteran. I can honestly say the game has been dead a long time ago. Warframe pulled me out and helped me see the what could be achieved. But me being a Destiny player I kept wasting my money on it for no improvements. Just new content and no fixing old and or standing issues. Let Destiny die at this point it’s all about money not the player.
They just need to take off the training wheels for prismatic and give us all the options even if it breaks the game balance because we need something fun 10:04
I agree with this entirely it will open up so much for build crafting and open help expand some classes from just basic builds that don't change until a year later.
Destiny 2 2025
“We hear you, your feedback is important to us, just give us another 99.99 & weeks promise we’ll make it better”………sounds familiar right?
Tried getting into destiny 2, learned about all the legacy story content removed (Red War, warmind, forsaken, curse of osiris) and just went with playing Destiny 1 on the PS4, never looking back, so damn solid. Got a warlock to light level 380 and played all the story missions and strikes, then max leveled a Titan right after that. Despite all the quality of life downgrades I'd rather just play a coherent experience i can start and finish from scratch like Destiny years 1-3.
@1:39 "I think most of us are probably going to play [Marathon]." I haven't heard anything yet that's made me want to play Marathon. I'll try it if it's free or if there's a demo, but I don't play extraction shooters, that format doesn't interest me. I primarily like D2 for the loot and build crafting; do extraction shooters have loot and build crafting?
Bungie said that they are giving 2 expansions per year but if anyone understands how business or contracts actually work then there is a high possibility that the double expansion per year is a requirement from Sony to Bungie to 1 see if they are a good investment long term, 2: see if Bungie can operate and deliver decent quality content in a high demand scenario, and 3: to see if its worth maintaining funds to Bungie.
They were already delaying final shape. And as far as I’m concerned final shape was the first quality dlc they made since beyond light. I don’t know what the time between those expansions was but I can tell you that all they’ve done since then is cut employees. So I can’t imagine that timeframe miraculously getting shorter. And I wouldn’t take any bets that those dlcs don’t come out half baked unless Sony brings in a team to help.
@ okay so this is just you saying you know nothing of business or contractual obligations then. Good to know. And just to be informative delaying of dlcs rarely have anything to do with contracts.
This may just be me but Destiny 1 felt more sci fi an Destiny 2 feels more fantasy. I really miss the sci-fi feeling Destiny 1 had that still maintained some sort of realtiy grounded in realism
Destiny 2 feels like the cheap new mcu while destiny 1 feels like cpt america the winter soldier
10:30 thank you, i feel so vindicated, ive only been a fairly new subscriber (2? 3? years?) but every time i reccomended warframe to yall (you byf, and the others) it was because as someone who started out on d1 like yall AND warframe at the start we just wanted to share another amazing game
Fam… We’ve had this conversation all the time… I’m here till the wheels fall off. I can’t wait to see what’s to come.
I don't believe destiny 2 will ever bounce back to a point where there will be server queues when a new season drops. Which is fine by me
Sure it will, because they will scale back server infrastructure and queues will be there as a result on releases even if the numbers are lower. Theyll penny pinch.
I just stopped playing recently. More than a week clean now. Have to admit I feel RELIEVED! As if I escaped from a toxic relationship. Best decision of me in gaming so far. Anyway I will never stop watching Cross' content ❤️
I've been clean since the end of season of the deep. I still don't even know how it all ended and I couldn't care less! It's sad that a game I enjoyed so much was completely ruined by brain dead, heartless exes, but it is what it is. I've moved on. Only stay subscribed to this channel for the other content like PoE and Warframe.
to me it's even crazy to think about playing this game for years without ever stopping for more than a couple weeks. Sounds like torture. Even when the game was in its prime and i loved it like not much else, i would always just put the game off and play something else entirely, then return to the game after weeks. Variety and freshness is important. Why are certain people so glued to certain games i will never understand, especially if with the money to buy a couple skins they could instead buy another amazing game on sale or something.
I never thought I’d detest Prismatic as much as I do. In fact I was super excited for it. The other subclasses have an identity in my head. Like I think differently when I’m playing Arc Hunter vs Solar Hunter. Especially since Radiant and Amplified work differently. The whole gimmick with Prismatic is that it *doesn’t* have an identity. Not only that I feel like I’m nerfing myself if I don’t run it. So I’m pretty much never coming back
If you really think prismatic doesn't have an identity then you just simply haven't paid any attention to literally any story bits over the last 10 years. The entire identity of prismatic is that we are what we are supposed to be in the story, a master of light and darkness using both together in harmony. Also if you think there are no good builds that don't involve prismatic then you simply haven't tried hard enough
I am still playing my Titan Bubble class and I am having fun. You dont have to use the strongest meta build you know. Look at it as being a challenge to beat the higher tier content with a weaker class.
So you’re just bad at build crafting? 😂 just say so. Watch some guides and read some Lore. Prismatic is Destiny
Honestly I respect this opinion.
Prismatic is something that in all honesty should have never been put in the game, at this in this scale. The 3rd darkness subclasses would have been better to wrap up the final shape while still maintaining identities
I've watched your content on and off over the years for help on Destiny 2 (played from 2021-2023).
Watching you be happy as you game in something like Warframe has been very refreshing and a great watch. You look like you're having fun again :)
We need to accept and admit that Bungie is not the same studio anymore. The people who made it great are gone. Its just a popular name being puppeted by corporate. The magic is gone. Set those expectations low boys.
I know Destiny is finished because for the first time in 10 years, I'm not happy or angry at Bungie. Instead I feel nothing (apathy) and haven't played in 5 months. It's definitely over.
Warframe did for me in 3 months what destiny couldn't do in 10 years
At this point, every year is a make or break for Destiny.
Its been broken and glued back together so many times, sometimes you gotta just appreciate the time you had and throw it away
I dont even mean this as a hater. But there's nothing bungie can do to convince me to play destiny again and I'm steering far clear of marathon. I wish bungie luck because I know I'm not alone with my sentiment
Looking at it now 2025 looks like it’s going to be the best time for gamers in the last 10 years
If you haven't already moved on you really should. Sony and Bungie are working on micro transaction filled games that no one wants 🤷
How long does a thing get to be tiring? People keep saying that they’re tired of the “make or break” and I’m just anxious about when the actual community wide “I’m done” is gonna hit.
@@thehieromancer2795 pretty big destiny 2 youtuber talk abaut destiny 2 failing point... Like he done befor... But now from warframe... So i will say it is a change, and fact that feame fix slowly it evry erly and end game problems one by one when destiny do oposite not helping... It may not be last time but we almost there
I mean considering D2’s numbers right now I’d honestly say the community wide “I’m done” has already happened. It’s mostly the hardcore players sticking around atm.
@@astracontritus1209im a hardcore but i refuse to play until they announce something worthy of my time, and thats what everyone should do, dont okay for the sake of it
I think that time is now, I know it was for me after I finished what I wanted to do with the final shape. Haven't played in months
If people were as willing to leave CoD as they have been to leave Destiny, that franchise would actually be able to become good again.
Ff16 active time lore is amazing
I hope they bring back the old content for 2025. That'd make it better.
lol
What a joke
I know I’ll be playing d2 forever lol. Of course I’ll take breaks to play other games like I did for elden ring and getting the platinum for it, but I always come back to Destiny 2 because their simply isn’t anything like it and it’s just fun.
Yep. The gunplay and feel of combat is absolutely unmatched, it's ruined other fps games for me. Idk how bungie does it but for all their faults they're the best in the business when it comes to gunplay and general combat. The original Halo games felt the same way.
what? an actual mature and realistic response...clearly a bungie shill smh
One thing that gives me high hopes for marathon is , in my opinion, destiny has always nailed the actual combat , weather the content for that year is bad or not is another thing , the shooting and abilities in destiny have always been extremely satisfying to use , and the gunplay is fun and fluid , so Atleast we can hope they will make marathon combat good aswell
I just don't think people care enough about extraction shooters. The interest just doesn't support the required numbers. Even if the game was free it wouldn't bring in enough numbers.
Get your playtime in now Because once Marathon drops that’ll be it for Bungie. There is no universe where that game isn’t DOA and becomes a massive loss for Bungie/Sony. You think the game is in a rough state now? Just wait. There is little to no chance Destiny 2 survives Marathon dropping. Once it flops Destiny will unfortunately follow soon after as Bungies cash cow isn’t making them enough as they’re completely reliant right now on Marathon being successful.
They should give the players the full prismatic experience. Buildcrafting has been such an important feature of D2 that by having access to all subclass supers, abilities, fragments, etc., it would invite more engagement and bring genuine fun back to the game. This would probably break the game, but I feel like Bungie needs to push things further for the gamers who’re still dedicated to the game.