Hey James I still have 2yrs 8 mo’s left on my warranty Porsche told me spacers will void my warranty this is the information he gave me Installing wheels spacers is common within the tuning scene. They are a cheap and easy way to improve wheel fitment and increase the track width of your car. However, they are also a fast and easy way to ruin the geometry of your car and can badly affect your handling. The main issue with a wheel spacer is that it moves the wheel to a wider position whilst the rest of the suspension arms remain in the same place. In particular, the king pin inclination axis remains in the same place. Therefore, fitting a wheel spacer moves the wheel outboard and alters the scrub radius of the car. It is important to know whether your car currently has negative or positive scrub radius and ideally how much it has. Fitting a wheel spacer will increase the positive scrub radius at the front wheels which has some unfavourable consequences. If your car already has a bit of positive scrub radius then the wheel spacer will increase it. An increase in positive scrub radius increases the forces on the steering rack under braking conditions. Any bumps in the road will also be amplified through the steering wheel, making the steering jerky and more unpredictable. Twitching wheels when braking can cause the tyre to lose grip and ultimately can cause the wheels to lock up and slide. An increase in positive scrub radius also causes the wheel to gain positive camber when the wheels are being turned, reducing grip in corners on the front wheels and producing understeer. If your car has the more favourable set up of negative scrub radius then installing a wheel spacer can cause bigger issues. The outward movement of the wheel can make a negative scrub radius become zero. This is the worst position for it to be in. A zero scrub radius can cause squirm. This is where a scrubbing action occurs on both front tyres in opposite directions which can create unpredictable handling in corners and can lead to understeer too. Secondly, installing wheel spacers on a car increases the leverage on the wheel bearing. The larger the spacer, the larger the leverage becomes. This reduces the life of the wheel bearing as they are not made to take leverage forces and can therefore wear faster, increasing rolling resistance and power loss of the car. Finally, the wheel spacer moves the wheel further away from the damper mounting point. This means that the wheel will have a larger effect upon the damper and will act upon it with more leverage. This effectively makes the spring and damper softer and less effective on the wheel. This means that the car can roll more on corner entry and exit and feel generally softer out on track or road . Porsche told me if I wanted to fill in the wheel wells better Buy bigger tires is one way Or buy a different offset rim , I went with tires Front 265 35 20 orig 245 35 20 Rear 315 30 20 Orig 305 30 20 But what got my nickers in a bunch was DISCOUNT TIRE WiLL NOT DO CENTER LOCK WHEELS . Had to take off at home , take them to discount tire for the tires, mounting and balancing the go home to install I hate that 600 lb torque wrench it’s huge really huge but I need 443 ft - Ibs
It is not wise to install spacers. I would not do that as Porsche engineers have perfected the handling. Changing to different tire diameter will give wrong speedometer reading and not sure what other problems it might cause.
I think the color of your car looks great as is and I personally wouldn't change it. My car has a similar color Meteor Grey and I love it. If you can get your car close to 400HP that would be a huge achievement. We're rooting for you James!
Hey James, without a doubt improves the look. But, I've read different remarks in regards to spacers. Have you noticed any change in performance with spacers as supposed to without?
Well done James! I can see the difference in the rear wheels better than in the front, but it's still noticeable. I'm looking forward for the video at the dyno!!
You inspired me to place my spacer order today. Decided on a 10/12 setup for my C2S, which also happens to be Agate Grey : ). Can’t wait to see your wrap - my guess is Miami Blue, but maybe Orange. I’ve recently taken a liking to gold wheels and was thrilled to see Mario’s done up that way, looked great!
Total bad ass look. I have the same setup on my 997. The question is does it make the car handle better? I think it transfers the grip to the resr tires. who knows great car!
I like the look and I would not go out any farther. If you were to go father out, you might end up with rubbing problems. I've run spacers in the past and they worked perfectly. I just would recommend checking the lugs every time you do any maintenance on the car for peace of mind.
Same spacers as mine. I next installed BC Racing coilovers and lowered the stance about 1-1/4" and it really finished the look and performed great at the track. About $2200 installed not a bad price for so much bang! Can't wait to see the wrap🙌. Also your tune is gonna cost me money. I'm in!!!
Tx. Few weeks ago I have also orderd 7mm front spacers and for the back 10mm because I have the wide body with 305. Next week I will install the spacers.
Do you have any rubbing when going over rough roads? I had spacers on my M5 and it sounded like crap every time that went over a bump or dip. I don’t want the same thing on my 991, but they look so damn good.
Love your vids James. One thing I am curious about. Maybe you could do a short video or add to your next one about how you determined how thick of a spacer you needed (or could get away with).
Hey thanks!! Good question, I'll try to remember to address this in one of my videos. The answer directly though is that it was the product of lots of web research. A few folks went as far as 20mm but the tires were then pushing out beyond the body. 15mm has them almost precisely on the line of the rear wheel arches. I think I could probably get away with 10mm on the front, but the 7mm looked so good on my 997, I decided to do the same on my 991.
Love your videos and your Mods are following my own natural progression. Couple of things.1- PLEASE wear closed toe shoes when working on car. 2- Please do not bend down and pick up, pull out heavy items like wheels. Sit on a stool and try not to put much weight on your back. It doesn't take much to damage your back for ever. looking forward to your videos. Thanks
You mention in your video sun coast parts for the 15mm rear spacers. I called them and they only carry a set of 4 5mm spacers. Could you suggest a place to purchase QUALITY 15mm spacers for 2010 Carrera 4S? Thank you
Looks good James. I really want to do spacers on my 4S because of the wider rear arches, but I am concerned about the advice I was given not to run them by my mechanic. Which is weird because so many people in the Porsche community use spacers. I think some cars even come factory standard with them. Very confusing.
Thanks Ali! I’m not sure about lowering the car. I need all the ground clearance I can get with the pitch of my driveway and the snow here in MN. I think it would look awesome though.
Great video. I have a 991.1 with 20in wheels. Why did you do 7mm in the front and 15mm in the rear? I’ve read some Porsche forms and they have the reverse set up. I’m trying to figure out what to do on my car. What set up would you recommend for my car?
I did 7mm/15mm because I liked the staggered look and it helped my narrow body car look a little wider at the rear end. To be honest at the time I also think I couldn’t find anything else in stock. Ha!
James, I think it looks better with the spacers for sure. I've heard that spacers can cause additional stress on the lugs as they are now further out from the hub. Any concerns with that or is that really a non-issue? Also, I recall you did spacers on your 997 but I can't recall the spacing used on that so would you remind me? Thanks!
Hey Chris! I had 15mm / 7mm on my 997, just like I’ve now done on my 991. I’m not worried about the lug nuts, but I’m reaching over to the table to knock on wood. Haha.
It’s one of those changes that don’t shout out loud but when you see the car somehow it’s gaining presence and a more taut stance. Like it’s just ‘ready’ to go. Do you have to make any changes to the suspension settings afterwards? I’d guess you might feel a bit of difference in the steering as well as a more stable feel in corners. But whatever it’s on the money looks wise.
Thanks James! No changes necessary for the suspension but you do notice a little bit of a difference with the handling of the car at slower speeds, like parking in a car park or taking a left or right turn at a stop light. At speed it all feels the same to me.
The Negatives The main issue with a wheel spacer is that it moves the wheel to a wider position whilst the rest of the suspension arms remain in the same place. In particular, the king pin inclination axis remains in the same place. Therefore, fitting a wheel spacer moves the wheel outboard and alters the scrub radius of the car. It is important to know whether your car currently has negative or positive scrub radius and ideally how much it has. Fitting a wheel spacer will increase the positive scrub radius at the front wheels which has some unfavorable consequences. If your car already has a bit of positive scrub radius then the wheel spacer will increase it. An increase in positive scrub radius increases the forces on the steering rack under braking conditions. Any bumps in the road will also be amplified through the steering wheel, making the steering jerky and more unpredictable. Twitching wheels when braking can cause the tire to lose grip and ultimately can cause the wheels to lock up and slide. An increase in positive scrub radius also causes the wheel to gain positive camber when the wheels are being turned, reducing grip in corners on the front wheels and producing understeer.If your car has the more favorable set up of negative scrub radius then installing a wheel spacer can cause bigger issues. The outward movement of the wheel can make a negative scrub radius become zero. This is the worst position for it to be in. A zero scrub radius can cause squirm. This is where a scrubbing action occurs on both front tyres in opposite directions which can create unpredictable handling in corners and can lead to understeer too. Secondly, installing wheel spacers on a car increases the leverage on the wheel bearing. The larger the spacer, the larger the leverage becomes. This reduces the life of the wheel bearing as they are not made to take leverage forces and can therefore wear faster, increasing rolling resistance and power loss of the car. Finally, the wheel spacer moves the wheel further away from the damper mounting point. This means that the wheel will have a larger effect upon the damper and will act upon it with more leverage. This effectively makes the spring and damper softer and less effective on the wheel. This means that the car can roll more on corner entry and exit and feel generally softer out on track or on the road.
James, are the spacers just cosmetic or do they improve road handling too? It looks great, though hard to see a big difference. Have a great weekend, don’t film too much. 😉 Cheers, Irwin
James.. looks awesome, think I well do the same on the 997. It boggles the mind how you keep that car so clean even winter driven. Kudos to you bro, will we be seeing Ruthie anytime soon.. cheers mate.
Thanks Roy!! Ruthie has been in Florida for a week running a half marathon at Disney (!) but she and another girl friend are hopefully going to be making a new video soon...! :-) Watch this space!
Hey James I still have 2yrs 8 mo’s left on my warranty Porsche told me spacers will void my warranty this is the information he gave me
Installing wheels spacers is common within the tuning scene. They are a cheap and easy way to improve wheel fitment and increase the track width of your car. However, they are also a fast and easy way to ruin the geometry of your car and can badly affect your handling.
The main issue with a wheel spacer is that it moves the wheel to a wider position whilst the rest of the suspension arms remain in the same place. In particular, the king pin inclination axis remains in the same place. Therefore, fitting a wheel spacer moves the wheel outboard and alters the scrub radius of the car. It is important to know whether your car currently has negative or positive scrub radius and ideally how much it has. Fitting a wheel spacer will increase the positive scrub radius at the front wheels which has some unfavourable consequences.
If your car already has a bit of positive scrub radius then the wheel spacer will increase it. An increase in positive scrub radius increases the forces on the steering rack under braking conditions. Any bumps in the road will also be amplified through the steering wheel, making the steering jerky and more unpredictable. Twitching wheels when braking can cause the tyre to lose grip and ultimately can cause the wheels to lock up and slide. An increase in positive scrub radius also causes the wheel to gain positive camber when the wheels are being turned, reducing grip in corners on the front wheels and producing understeer.
If your car has the more favourable set up of negative scrub radius then installing a wheel spacer can cause bigger issues. The outward movement of the wheel can make a negative scrub radius become zero. This is the worst position for it to be in. A zero scrub radius can cause squirm. This is where a scrubbing action occurs on both front tyres in opposite directions which can create unpredictable handling in corners and can lead to understeer too.
Secondly, installing wheel spacers on a car increases the leverage on the wheel bearing. The larger the spacer, the larger the leverage becomes. This reduces the life of the wheel bearing as they are not made to take leverage forces and can therefore wear faster, increasing rolling resistance and power loss of the car.
Finally, the wheel spacer moves the wheel further away from the damper mounting point. This means that the wheel will have a larger effect upon the damper and will act upon it with more leverage. This effectively makes the spring and damper softer and less effective on the wheel. This means that the car can roll more on corner entry and exit and feel generally softer out on track or road .
Porsche told me if I wanted to fill in the wheel wells better
Buy bigger tires is one way
Or buy a different offset rim ,
I went with tires
Front 265 35 20
orig 245 35 20
Rear 315 30 20
Orig 305 30 20
But what got my nickers in a bunch was DISCOUNT TIRE
WiLL NOT DO CENTER LOCK WHEELS . Had to take off at home , take them to discount tire for the tires, mounting and balancing the go home to install I hate that 600 lb torque wrench it’s huge really huge but I need 443 ft - Ibs
It is not wise to install spacers. I would not do that as Porsche engineers have perfected the handling. Changing to different tire diameter will give wrong speedometer reading and not sure what other problems it might cause.
I think the color of your car looks great as is and I personally wouldn't change it. My car has a similar color Meteor Grey and I love it. If you can get your car close to 400HP that would be a huge achievement. We're rooting for you James!
Cheers Vincent!!
Really fills the gap, looks great
Thanks Jose!!! 👍🔥
Hey James, without a doubt improves the look. But, I've read different remarks in regards to spacers. Have you noticed any change in performance with spacers as supposed to without?
Well done James! I can see the difference in the rear wheels better than in the front, but it's still noticeable. I'm looking forward for the video at the dyno!!
Looks great!!!! ordering mine now!!
Niiiice!!
You inspired me to place my spacer order today. Decided on a 10/12 setup for my C2S, which also happens to be Agate Grey : ). Can’t wait to see your wrap - my guess is Miami Blue, but maybe Orange. I’ve recently taken a liking to gold wheels and was thrilled to see Mario’s done up that way, looked great!
Nice one!! 🤩🙌🙌🙌
Ooh yea, finishes off the stance nicely, and you know I LOVE those wheels! Don’t change them for gold ones when you do the wrap!! 😮
Hahaha. No way!
Total bad ass look. I have the same setup on my 997. The question is does it make the car handle better? I think it transfers the grip to the resr tires. who knows great car!
I like the look and I would not go out any farther. If you were to go father out, you might end up with rubbing problems. I've run spacers in the past and they worked perfectly. I just would recommend checking the lugs every time you do any maintenance on the car for peace of mind.
Another great video. I'm thinking I may need to do something similar to my 987.1. And I particularly liked the OSHA-approved footwear.
Looking great!! Love the revised stance.
Cheers Nino! 🥳🥳🥳
I’m guessing your wrap is maybe blue of some sort James? The suspense is killing me. Haha
Definitly looks more flush with those spacers on.
Same spacers as mine. I next installed BC Racing coilovers and lowered the stance about 1-1/4" and it really finished the look and performed great at the track. About $2200 installed not a bad price for so much bang! Can't wait to see the wrap🙌. Also your tune is gonna cost me money. I'm in!!!
Would you mind sending me a photo?? autoamateurblogger@gmail.com. Would love to see what it looks like! Nice one!
Tx. Few weeks ago I have also orderd 7mm front spacers and for the back 10mm because I have the wide body with 305. Next week I will install the spacers.
Nice!! Enjoy!
Do you have any rubbing when going over rough roads? I had spacers on my M5 and it sounded like crap every time that went over a bump or dip. I don’t want the same thing on my 991, but they look so damn good.
I haven't noticed any differences to be honest, for better or worse. As far as I've experienced, it's purely a visual change.
Doing this ordering those today 👍👍
Whooop!!
Alot better mate awesome
Thanks David!
Love your vids James. One thing I am curious about. Maybe you could do a short video or add to your next one about how you determined how thick of a spacer you needed (or could get away with).
Hey thanks!! Good question, I'll try to remember to address this in one of my videos. The answer directly though is that it was the product of lots of web research. A few folks went as far as 20mm but the tires were then pushing out beyond the body. 15mm has them almost precisely on the line of the rear wheel arches. I think I could probably get away with 10mm on the front, but the 7mm looked so good on my 997, I decided to do the same on my 991.
Looks great. Needed the 7mm at least. Anything less would have been too small in my opinion. Can’t wait for the wrap video 👍
Cheers Paul! Me neither!!
Love your videos and your Mods are following my own natural progression. Couple of things.1- PLEASE wear closed toe shoes when working on car. 2- Please do not bend down and pick up, pull out heavy items like wheels. Sit on a stool and try not to put much weight on your back. It doesn't take much to damage your back for ever.
looking forward to your videos. Thanks
Thanks so much!! You don’t think flip flops and cars go together in the garage? 🤔😆👍
Looks great! By the way, a yellow wrap would look phenomenal on your car!
Looking good sir
Thanks!! 🙌🤩
Looks amazing! Can’t wait to see the wrap, I’m going to guess a green, a deep evergreen!
Capital Exotics I’m thinking a shade of green too, lizard?
My lips are sealed...! :)
You mention in your video sun coast parts for the 15mm rear spacers. I called them and they only carry a set of 4 5mm spacers. Could you suggest a place to purchase QUALITY 15mm spacers for 2010 Carrera 4S? Thank you
Hey Roxanne! Yeah, they stopped selling them recently for some reason. Try Pelican Parts?
Looks good James. I really want to do spacers on my 4S because of the wider rear arches, but I am concerned about the advice I was given not to run them by my mechanic. Which is weird because so many people in the Porsche community use spacers. I think some cars even come factory standard with them. Very confusing.
Porsche, itself offers 5mm spacers all around from the factory.
Looks great, James! Any plans on lowering it? Set of H&R or Techart springs would finish off the aggressive look.
Thanks Ali! I’m not sure about lowering the car. I need all the ground clearance I can get with the pitch of my driveway and the snow here in MN. I think it would look awesome though.
Do you notice more stone chips or dirt down the side of the car ? And spray out the back?
Great question!! I haven't noticed a difference on my 991, but I did with my 997 a little. Dirt mostly. No stone chips.
Any wheel wobble using these non hub extending spacers ?
Great video. I have a 991.1 with 20in wheels. Why did you do 7mm in the front and 15mm in the rear? I’ve read some Porsche forms and they have the reverse set up. I’m trying to figure out what to do on my car. What set up would you recommend for my car?
I did 7mm/15mm because I liked the staggered look and it helped my narrow body car look a little wider at the rear end. To be honest at the time I also think I couldn’t find anything else in stock. Ha!
James, I think it looks better with the spacers for sure. I've heard that spacers can cause additional stress on the lugs as they are now further out from the hub. Any concerns with that or is that really a non-issue? Also, I recall you did spacers on your 997 but I can't recall the spacing used on that so would you remind me? Thanks!
So, basically what 991 991.2 Turbo S said below, which I failed to read before my post! Sorry.
Hey Chris! I had 15mm / 7mm on my 997, just like I’ve now done on my 991. I’m not worried about the lug nuts, but I’m reaching over to the table to knock on wood. Haha.
It’s one of those changes that don’t shout out loud but when you see the car somehow it’s gaining presence and a more taut stance. Like it’s just ‘ready’ to go. Do you have to make any changes to the suspension settings afterwards? I’d guess you might feel a bit of difference in the steering as well as a more stable feel in corners. But whatever it’s on the money looks wise.
Thanks James! No changes necessary for the suspension but you do notice a little bit of a difference with the handling of the car at slower speeds, like parking in a car park or taking a left or right turn at a stop light. At speed it all feels the same to me.
The Negatives
The main issue with a wheel spacer is that it moves the wheel to a wider position whilst the rest of the suspension arms remain in the same place. In particular, the king pin inclination axis remains in the same place. Therefore, fitting a wheel spacer moves the wheel outboard and alters the scrub radius of the car. It is important to know whether your car currently has negative or positive scrub radius and ideally how much it has. Fitting a wheel spacer will increase the positive scrub radius at the front wheels which has some unfavorable consequences.
If your car already has a bit of positive scrub radius then the wheel spacer will increase it. An increase in positive scrub radius increases the forces on the steering rack under braking conditions. Any bumps in the road will also be amplified through the steering wheel, making the steering jerky and more unpredictable. Twitching wheels when braking can cause the tire to lose grip and ultimately can cause the wheels to lock up and slide. An increase in positive scrub radius also causes the wheel to gain positive camber when the wheels are being turned, reducing grip in corners on the front wheels and producing understeer.If your car has the more favorable set up of negative scrub radius then installing a wheel spacer can cause bigger issues. The outward movement of the wheel can make a negative scrub radius become zero. This is the worst position for it to be in. A zero scrub radius can cause squirm. This is where a scrubbing action occurs on both front tyres in opposite directions which can create unpredictable handling in corners and can lead to understeer too.
Secondly, installing wheel spacers on a car increases the leverage on the wheel bearing. The larger the spacer, the larger the leverage becomes. This reduces the life of the wheel bearing as they are not made to take leverage forces and can therefore wear faster, increasing rolling resistance and power loss of the car.
Finally, the wheel spacer moves the wheel further away from the damper mounting point. This means that the wheel will have a larger effect upon the damper and will act upon it with more leverage. This effectively makes the spring and damper softer and less effective on the wheel. This means that the car can roll more on corner entry and exit and feel generally softer out on track or on the road.
James, are the spacers just cosmetic or do they improve road handling too? It looks great, though hard to see a big difference. Have a great weekend, don’t film too much. 😉 Cheers, Irwin
There is a minor improvement in handling on corners, but it’s more cosmetic than anything else. Cheers!
Where did you order your lug nuts? Suncoast?
Got them from a seller on eBay! They were around $100 for the set.
Finishing the front ... and Bob’s your Uncle.
Gold wheels mate 😎😎😛😛😛🤟🤟
🤣🔥🔥🔥 Soooooo not cool enough to pull those off. 😟
@@AutoAmateur ok , get black wheels then 🤟😛😎🔥🤪😜
mario montanez you don’t like my boring grey wheels on my boring grey car?? I’m shocked.
@@AutoAmateur hahahahaha i love your wheels but with the new wrap color u will need dif color wheels
James.. looks awesome, think I well do the same on the 997. It boggles the mind how you keep that car so clean even winter driven. Kudos to you bro, will we be seeing Ruthie anytime soon.. cheers mate.
Thanks Roy!! Ruthie has been in Florida for a week running a half marathon at Disney (!) but she and another girl friend are hopefully going to be making a new video soon...! :-) Watch this space!
You like the clear rear lights? Duckbill?
Not a big fan of the clear tail lights on the 991s but I love the duck tail spoilers.
This video appears twice on my AppleTV so I thought I was having another episode of deja vu
Ha! Keep drinking. 🙃
Question, do the spacers effect your alignment ? 15 mil back and 7 mil front, right?
Good question! Not on my 997. I haven't checked out the 991 yet. I'm due to for an alignment shortly so I'll find out soon.
Thinking I need spacers now...
Ha! Go get them! 🤩
Those spacers look lug centric and not hub centric.
Yes you're right actually. You can find hub centric spacers, but generally they're the former I believe. Particularly for after-market products.
Captain James....why modify a perfect car.............................
Because it's SOOOOOOO much fun! :)
Right side spacer is on backwards..
Bah!! Good spot. I’ll flip it tomorrow. 👍
@@AutoAmateur Looking great, spacers are a must on a 911..
Whats your payment on this? What you put down? Talk about this stuff to. We wont beat you down.
No payment. I own it.
@@AutoAmateur Wow thats different. Congrats.
Why working on cars with flip flops...?🤨🤨🤨
Because I’m cool like that. 🤩🤣
Still very unprofessional though🤷♂️
@@Mckorzi haha. Well this is the AutoAmateur channel not the AutoPro channel. 🙃