Islam cannot be reformed, Jasser has at the most less than1% of Muslim support. This debate should begin and end with this: Name the Christian that is above 1 Muslim in any Islamic State government.
As an indian, this is the way islam operates in our society. Secularism when in minority Partition of the country when population equals And sharia when in majority.
Is christianty and their anti lgbqt preaching compatible with "liberal democracy"? Is judaism? Ssshtttt. Its easy to humiliate a liar. 50% of the uk is conservative not liberal. So 50% of the uk population is NOT COMPATIBLE with the UK??? 😂😂😂
Islam is incompatible with not just Western civilization but with any other civilization except Islamic civilization. Islam is also incompatible with Indian Civilization, Japanese Civilization, Thai Civilization, Chinese civilization etc.
Only proven his point - completely antidemocratic - trying to shut debate because the pro-islam guy got "offended" Now extrapolate to what they do in a muslim majority country where "Allah" gets offended 😂😂
The only way to reform Islam is by leaving that evil cult as it doesn't fit in this day and age in a pluralistic society. I am an exMuslim, David Haines, an aid worker beheaded by ISIS have to sacrifice himself for me to learn more about my faith in depth that led me to leave.
Interrupting on the basis of being offended is the same tactic used with the word "Islamophobia", it is designed to shut down legitimate discussion and criticism. This again proves his point that it is incompatible.
Moderate Islam is not a threat to Western democracy. There are many well educated Muslims who hold liberal views and have made great contributions to western societies. The challenge to general European culture, not just that of Western Europe, is the increasingly regressive, ultra conservative Islam which is at odds with European principles of enlightenment and secularism.
Please retain UK culture, not Islamic culture. Islamic law allowed child marriages. In Malaysia, there is a mid 30 year old teacher married a 10 year girl, allowed by the High Court
@ Anyone who wants to become a clever & evil kind of person should study Quran & Mohammad. That guy was very sharp. Look at us today. Whole world is suffering because of that one man.
In USwomen were allowed to vote .In islam allows women all rights which none of religion allows before.please read and study more about and compare .increase your knowledge before come for debate.
@steveygee1 There is something called as "Google Search" According to the 2021 census, 29.9% of Birmingham's population is Muslim and Christianity 30%.
It was thought that I..m would morph into a quaint version of the religion. Integration would mean the women becoming westernized and this would mean the religion would die.
Im sick of this "I'm offended nonsense." The entire future of the western world is on the line with the way this is all heading. It's already too late for Britain.
Asking Islam to change is like asking a leopard to change its spots or a zebra its stripes. God will judge Islam and the rest of us at the end of time. The West has become weak not because of Islam but because we have fallen away from our own faith in Christ which Jesus, His apostles, and countless believers gave their lives to establish. The judgment on those who have so turned away will be severe.
Here, here, if people can't see or hear the full debate then its censorship - plain and simple!! The whole point of a debate is to have both sides of the point in question presented to you in full.
Complete joke - a majority within earshot seemed intent only in wanting to shut down or censure the more salient points and examples that Ben sought to raise here. I'm by nature a liberal myself (my gt gpa, industrialist Frank Ash Yeo was integral to the reformation of the L Party at the turn of last century) but modern liberalism is merely an instrument for enforcing a highly subjective approach to censorship based upon hurt feelings rather than mal actions. For eg, whilst recently reading certain theological texts (neither historical nor unrevised!) it struck me that a certain Prophet of note might, to many be considered a *violator of young children* but anybody who adheres to this pov in writing, may indeed be censured into silence simply for expressing that pov. Equally, the fact that ppls of a darker skin tone are entitled to partake in the liberal use of certain *N-words* with zero ramifications, whilst a paleskin such as myself is not, seems in itself to be prejudicial by definition. Go figure...oh hang on, somebody just rang my doorbell..... 🚨🚔
(2:00) The answer is NO IT IS NOT as A) that is the whole purpose of the debate and B) you wouldn't be sitting at Oxford debating the issue, but instead be back in your middle eastern country of origin with no worries if that were the case. The person asking the question, is subtly insulting his opponent by insisting it's an "imperialist" mentality; how foolish.
He forgot about the cinema chain who pulled a film out of fear and that the parliamentary procedure was changed by the speaker for the same reason. But hey, let's just bury our heads in the sand. 🤦♂️
I'll just say this, every religion is welcome to me, as long as it accepts the stance of same respect, value and opportunity for every human being. If you think humanism is not one of the most important accomplishments of the generations before us and some book from way back is more important than that you are my enemy.
The Quran isn’t the word of God communicated to Muhammed it was written centuries after by a bunch of random muslims who needed some ideology to compete with the jews and Christians. I suggest everyone open a Quran, read it and see for yourself. Jesus is the only way to salvation. The Bible was written by people who had actual contact with Jesus.
True torah, jabur, ingil, quran all came from Allah at a timeline syllabus and quran valid till doomsday bcz torah, jabur, ingil timeline is over................ Allah made all people finger print for judgement day and rebirth purposes mention in quran sura kiyamat read it
30 different versions right now. Badly edited book plagiarised rabbiss and copy-pasted other apocryphal texts too. Then they couldn't be bothered to write a sira until 180 years later ( that didn't survive). No historicity to Makka either.
Absolutely and fully endorse the view. Muslim must change and cut its ties with outdated ideologies. Other belief systems and cultures moved on from such pre civilization methods! The education of kids at young age is the key. As in the meeting the persons asked, the people of this trust system don’t even understand what others are taking😱😱😱. It is so outdated😱😱😱
I thought that people who go to Oxford are the most educated people in the world, but it turns out to be the contrary including people in the comment section
They are educated that's why they know what are your intentions....western countries belong to Christians...who the hell are u to go there and demand for Sharia/Islamic law
I see there is no democracy in the comment section as replies to posts are not visable. The culture of Islam is not compatible. Marrying relatives, shutting down democracy, violence and death threats if others don't conform with the religion, 2 tier justice and policing etc etc Not all Muslims are in this category. These extremists are the ones I'm speaking of. Constantly offended and now the blasphemy laws so no one can criticise it... Insanity. If the extremists can't respect the culture of the country and it's laws and principles then they need to go 10s of thousands of crimi nalls and over 40 thousand tear or ists should be deported plus their families.
Islam never had democracy to begin with. This, however, doesn't mean that democracy is the only RIGHT path for governance. Let me clarify: Firstly, in Islam, the duty of guiding humanity was taken by the Prophets sent by Allah. Hence, there was no democracy or "people's decision" in choosing the Prophet from among themselves. Allah was the sole authority in deciding who would be made the Prophet among humanity. That Prophet was then entrusted with the word of God to guide the people towards the truth. When the last Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) was sent, Allah completed the "Teachings of Islam" upon humanity (Al-Maaidah : 3). Now the task was to spread the word of God throughout the world and protect this religion from corruption, and this is where the real problem arose: According to the Shia viewpoint: The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) chose his successor Ali (by the will of Allah and not from his own whims) as the first Imam and Khalifa (Leader) of the Islamic Ummah in his farewell sermon at Ghadir-e-Khum. This makes perfect sense as the appointment of a leader by Allah was the norm in Islam. The leadership was to be transferred within the progeny of Ali (as per Allah's wish and Prophet's instruction) till his 12th generation: to the person we know as the final Imam "Mehdi" (who will be sent by Allah to restore order and justice in the world along with Prophet Esa (Jesus)). Hence we can clearly see that the leadership and governance of the people in Islam is a totally divine process free from human interference. It is however, noteworthy that in the occultation period of the last or 12th Imam, it is democracy that can best represent the people's wishes and hence the best mode of government but not the liberal democracy of the West. Why? Because we all know that these same democracies have countless errors and flaws. For instance, the interference of lobbies in the democratic process never makes the leaders truly free to make decisions. The West's silence and inaction regarding the atrocities in Gaza are evidence that it represents not the people's wishes but the collective interests of the few powerful people behind the scenes. These governments fool the people into thinking that they represent their wishes while actually, they're so powerless that they can't even speak freely without the consent of the invisible hands (the deep state as Trump calls it). More on this later. According to the Sunni viewpoint: The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) didn't appoint anyone as the leader and left it in the hands of the Ummah to choose among themselves. This is such a flawed argument considering the fact that, according to them, the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) communicated every small aspect of one's life from how to eat, speak, talk, sleep, behave, and take care of hygiene but didn't bother to address the issue that would cause the most distress, chaos, and disintegration within the Islamic Ummah i.e. The question of Leadership? Sunnis believe that after the Prophet's demise, a Shura (cabinet) was formed which included important companions of the Prophet and they (hastily) made Abu Bakr the first caliph of the Ummah considering the turmoil that arose following the Prophet's demise. The question arises: If the leader was to be appointed (which was not required considering the Prophet's appointment of Ali) then why were Ali and his close companions not a part of the cabinet? Ali, who was the closest to the Prophet till his funeral (which also was not attended by the first three Sunni Caliphs), why was his input not taken or of any member of the Prophet's family in choosing the caliph? Secondly, if the appointment of the first caliph was made by the Shura (cabinet) i.e. Indirect democracy, then why was the second caliph appointed unilaterally without any consultation by Abu Bakr? This is such a great loophole in Sunni logic. If Islam has democracy, then all caliphs should be appointed democratically and if there's dictatorship/Kingship then that should be the norm. But this is the problem in Sunni Islam: THEY CHOOSE DEMOCRACY OR DICTATORSHIP ACCORDING TO THE SITUATION IN ORDER TO JUSTIFY THEIR CALIPHS. So what is the TRUTH? To reach it one must first understand that humanity's conquest to find the utopian form of government is not new. It started from the time of Plato and onto Islamic Philosophers like Farabi, and Ibn Khaldun and later onto Western Philosophers like Montesquieu, Machiavelli, Locke, Rousseau, Hegel, and then Marx. Everyone was trying to find an infallible system to govern the people and the quest continues even today. While liberal democracies might be the norm for now but with the rise of Populism and Protectionism, this process will continue to evolve and change. It should however be noted that the truly infallible system can only be achieved with an infallible authority to govern it. That authority is Allah (God) which is exercised by his appointed messengers (Prophet) or later the Imams (Starting from Ali till Mehdi, 12 in total). Apart from this infallible system humanity is left with only democracy as the most pragmatic form of government. But with all its flaws, the Western notion of democracy is not the solution. We need a democracy that is free from external influence and that is free to make its own decisions as per the wishes of its population. The theocracy in Iran may not be perfect but is the most pragmatic and effective mode so far (in my view) in countering the Western penetration into their political system. It has also upheld Islamic values better than most other Islamic countries. Some people from the West might disagree but that's how it is. Islam is a "way of life" and not just a set of principles (like other religions) you have the choice to ignore. As an Islamic state, it is the responsibility of the government to protect the Islamic values within its territories. It is different from the extremist-secular ideology of France or the liberal ideology of the US. While Islam has tolerance and acceptability for other religions, it does not allow for gross violation of its code of conduct within its territory. While there may still be judgement errors in the Iranian System, this is how a state can be best governed until Allah sends his last representative on Earth i.e Imam Mehdi (the Messiah and 12th Imam). Only then will the infallible governance of Allah be materialized on this Earth. For those who stuck till the end: Thank you for your time. Do let me know if you agree or disagree with me!
@websitemartian It seems that you were born a few days ago, so don't keep any news of the world.UN and human rights organizations read the article they say Israel is massacring the people of Palestine.The Jews came from Europe, occupying the land of Palestine, killing and expelling them from the country. Have you never read history?
What fruits of reforms? Ben is right though. Islam extremism is not compatible with western culture. If they want another culture they shud leave. It's not working.
Ben is courageous and brilliant.
Islam cannot be reformed, Jasser has at the most less than1% of Muslim support. This debate should begin and end with this: Name the Christian that is above 1 Muslim in any Islamic State government.
As an indian, this is the way islam operates in our society.
Secularism when in minority
Partition of the country when population equals
And sharia when in majority.
That's how it is everywhere and everyone knows it 😂
If you don’t like it leave
When the majority are Muslim why wouldn't they live by Sharia? Most Muslims dont live in India and are not jeets.
@@pookiepie5823leave what?
@@pookiepie5823leave where?
The principles of democracy is universal.
Islam is Not compatible not only in Britain but everywhere in the Western civilization.
Not just western civilization, any sane civilization in the east as well
Is christianty and their anti lgbqt preaching compatible with "liberal democracy"?
Is judaism?
Ssshtttt. Its easy to humiliate a liar.
50% of the uk is conservative not liberal. So 50% of the uk population is NOT COMPATIBLE with the UK??? 😂😂😂
Islam is incompatible with not just Western civilization but with any other civilization except Islamic civilization. Islam is also incompatible with Indian Civilization, Japanese Civilization, Thai Civilization, Chinese civilization etc.
Islam is the complete antithesis of civilization.
Not compatible with eastern civilizations also. India is the only democracy between Islamic Pakistan and Bangladesh
Imagine how little debating you would do if everyone stopped the debate by claiming they had been offended.
right, what a debate it would be, refusing to discuss and simply dismissing the subject just because ur offended
@@milly9645 You mean like talking about Israel and how naughty it's been? See how long that lasts.
That was crazy, I’m disappointed that he backed down.
@@WillScarlet1991 I wouldn’t stop you from talking about it, even though I’m pro-Israel.
@@kevinmcfarlane2752 Why are you pro-Israel? Is it because they're White?
This guy is brilliant. Clear, coherent courageous .
7:52 Ramakrishnan trying to control his laughter as someone got “OFFENDED”🤣💀
who is he?
😂😂😂👌
Only proven his point - completely antidemocratic - trying to shut debate because the pro-islam guy got "offended"
Now extrapolate to what they do in a muslim majority country where "Allah" gets offended 😂😂
But it can't. To reform would mean going against their book. That is the most dangerous thing about it. It can not change,
And that is exactly why ifs incompatible
Any ex muslim knows how out right dangerous it is to even suggest that we should alter and ammend the quran.
The only way to reform Islam is by leaving that evil cult as it doesn't fit in this day and age in a pluralistic society. I am an exMuslim, David Haines, an aid worker beheaded by ISIS have to sacrifice himself for me to learn more about my faith in depth that led me to leave.
Interrupting on the basis of being offended is the same tactic used with the word "Islamophobia", it is designed to shut down legitimate discussion and criticism. This again proves his point that it is incompatible.
There should be a ban on the use of mobile phones in these debates.
Yes, I noticed that guy. Absolutely disrespectful.
Ben should have told him he was offended then maybe he'd have to have put it away 😂
🇬🇧 Very courageous Ben to have this discussion. Absolutely agree with every word. This is a dangerous threat to our nation and to Christianity.
Moderate Islam is not a threat to Western democracy. There are many well educated Muslims who hold liberal views and have made great contributions to western societies. The challenge to general European culture, not just that of Western Europe, is the increasingly regressive, ultra conservative Islam which is at odds with European principles of enlightenment and secularism.
Does christianity really exist in the west?
@@zuthmani9955 What do YOU think 🤔 ✝️
Well said Ben, thank you for having the courage of your convictions, and speaking for the rest of us who remain voiceless.
Please retain UK culture, not Islamic culture. Islamic law allowed child marriages. In Malaysia, there is a mid 30 year old teacher married a 10 year girl, allowed by the High Court
Guy texting in the background is so rude. If you decided to attend at least show some courtesy.
He has plans -waiting for his folks for a go ahead
Agree with Ben Habib the interruptions done by those on the right just confirms this.
Seems like quite a hostile environment for a debate
Islam is still stuck in the 7th century, but they have evolved on winning the Oscar on the victim card
7:45 Oops🙊 offended😬!
Islam showing its effect right there at the debate.
7:52 Ramakrishnan trying to control his laughter as someone got “OFFENDED”🤣💀
💯 they keep demonstrating to us, while shamelessly lying to themselves and us.
@ Anyone who wants to become a clever & evil kind of person should study Quran & Mohammad. That guy was very sharp. Look at us today. Whole world is suffering because of that one man.
Ramakrishna is Hindu zainist
This guy is talking about islam what his democratic society complicity in geonocide.
In USwomen were allowed to vote .In islam allows women all rights which none of religion allows before.please read and study more about and compare .increase your knowledge before come for debate.
It’s funny how butthurt muslims get when you show them their real face
I am slowly dragging my liberal friends and family here. Well said!!!
Thank you Ben Islam is not compatible with Western British culture
Honest question, what exactly is British culture?
@@myworkrota1928 if you don't know you are not British.
@@fionagregory9147well said sweetheart 👏 ❤ these wierdos are crazy 😊
Not radical Islam@@myworkrota1928
@@myworkrota1928Ignorant troll.
Islam in action - im offended do not discuss that further. Why apologise and stop the debate? Weird woke mentality tbh
isn't it too late ?? Majority places to name a few Birmingham, Leicester, London....etc are already Islam majority.......Keep sleeping British
None of those cities are Muslim majority.
@steveygee1 There is something called as "Google Search" According to the 2021 census, 29.9% of Birmingham's population is Muslim and Christianity 30%.
@@steveygee1 :The stats mean that this will change.
@steveygee1 They are not. However some are minority majority.
Well done 👍🏻 Ben free speech
We are stoking our own funeral pyre by giving Islam a free reign.
It was thought that I..m would morph into a quaint version of the religion. Integration would mean the women becoming westernized and this would mean the religion would die.
Ben is able to present the problem this country faces in a very eloquent manner
Im sick of this "I'm offended nonsense." The entire future of the western world is on the line with the way this is all heading. It's already too late for Britain.
Ben makes an excellent point about cultural silos.
He is desperately needed in political office.
Yes Ben. That is a perfect comparison. Thank you.
Ben for PM !
"particularly vulnerable"
Gad Saad calls it suicidal empathy
Gad Saad is a marketing professor talking about how politically left orientated men are like cuttlefish - I would take a a spoonful of salt.
@@AriSuper0001 And you're an internet nobody tossing out ad hominem. Nobody cares what you do with salt.
It's not empathy, it's taught self-hatred
Asking Islam to change is like asking a leopard to change its spots or a zebra its stripes. God will judge Islam and the rest of us at the end of time. The West has become weak not because of Islam but because we have fallen away from our own faith in Christ which Jesus, His apostles, and countless believers gave their lives to establish. The judgment on those who have so turned away will be severe.
Why are they on their phones - very rude. And people offended by everything. These people are supposed to be the brightest and best in the world.
They probably award places based on diversity these days, instead of exam scores.
Not people in general, only musIims
In need a Christian culture in this country
It’s not possible the country is gone for the dogs
I LIKE BEN HABIB, AS HE TALKS WITH COMMON SENSE AND SHOULD BE PRIME MINISTER, HERE IN THE UK.
Why is Oxford Union not publishing the latest full debate regarding Israel?
The irony of ironies. The hypocrites of free speech won't allow it.
Here, here, if people can't see or hear the full debate then its censorship - plain and simple!! The whole point of a debate is to have both sides of the point in question presented to you in full.
3 words why: The Israeli Lobby
Very easily offended but very quick to offend others.
It is good to see debates happening in the UK, even now while Islamists are around, not sure how long this will be the atmosphere!
Try having this same debate in S.Arabia and see what happens
1:58 and 7:37 , why islamic always messes around .
Because islam is a cult
Complete joke - a majority within earshot seemed intent only in wanting to shut down or censure the more salient points and examples that Ben sought to raise here.
I'm by nature a liberal myself (my gt gpa, industrialist Frank Ash Yeo was integral to the reformation of the L Party at the turn of last century) but modern liberalism is merely an instrument for enforcing a highly subjective approach to censorship based upon hurt feelings rather than mal actions.
For eg, whilst recently reading certain theological texts (neither historical nor unrevised!) it struck me that a certain Prophet of note might, to many be considered a *violator of young children* but anybody who adheres to this pov in writing, may indeed be censured into silence simply for expressing that pov.
Equally, the fact that ppls of a darker skin tone are entitled to partake in the liberal use of certain *N-words* with zero ramifications, whilst a paleskin such as myself is not, seems in itself to be prejudicial by definition.
Go figure...oh hang on, somebody just rang my doorbell..... 🚨🚔
Amazing words that day from ben 👏
Very brave speech Ben. I fear for your safety
Very smart and wise and brave man🙏🙏
(2:00) The answer is NO IT IS NOT as A) that is the whole purpose of the debate and B) you wouldn't be sitting at Oxford debating the issue, but instead be back in your middle eastern country of origin with no worries if that were the case.
The person asking the question, is subtly insulting his opponent by insisting it's an "imperialist" mentality; how foolish.
Uk, France, Europa colonized by weak laws
Exactly, we’ve done it to ourselves.
Well said.
50 years down the line, islamisation of Britain will be complete. That would finish any such debate, any debates even.
Well said Ben! ❤
What is the undergraduate in the background doing at this debate? All he is
interested in texting on his phone.
Ben is right of course. Only a moral coward or narcissist would view things differently.
Ben Habib is a man of towering intellect and enormous integrity. Reform UK made a massive mistake getting rid of him.
Right on Ben 💥💥💥👌💪💪💪👍
Well done Ben Habib a great speech. 👏 I would have liked him to have spoken for a lot longer. A man with integrity.
He forgot about the cinema chain who pulled a film out of fear and that the parliamentary procedure was changed by the speaker for the same reason. But hey, let's just bury our heads in the sand. 🤦♂️
I'll just say this, every religion is welcome to me, as long as it accepts the stance of same respect, value and opportunity for every human being. If you think humanism is not one of the most important accomplishments of the generations before us and some book from way back is more important than that you are my enemy.
@@3brenmby adapting to the modern world and removing elements of the religion that go against it
This
well that ooosplm out then go read the hadths , quoran and the hidtory of it and the fact that pd mo is divin for all time
Islam is a political ideology, not a religion
"Where is the Mossab video?"
That guy just wanted to throw in imperialism as a buzzword.
so well said ben
The state of that lot especially the three stooges at the back. Ben is a great man
You must agree with Ben for he has integrity
Should be our PM please
Well spoken ben
The Quran isn’t the word of God communicated to Muhammed it was written centuries after by a bunch of random muslims who needed some ideology to compete with the jews and Christians. I suggest everyone open a Quran, read it and see for yourself. Jesus is the only way to salvation. The Bible was written by people who had actual contact with Jesus.
Keep saying that to yourself, till you believe it. Doesn’t change the facts.
True torah, jabur, ingil, quran all came from Allah at a timeline syllabus and quran valid till doomsday bcz torah, jabur, ingil timeline is over................
Allah made all people finger print for judgement day and rebirth purposes mention in quran sura kiyamat read it
I agree with your assessment
I am not wasting time reading any religious texts at all.
30 different versions right now. Badly edited book plagiarised rabbiss and copy-pasted other apocryphal texts too.
Then they couldn't be bothered to write a sira until 180 years later ( that didn't survive).
No historicity to Makka either.
Arabs and democracy!!!! You must be joking 😂😂😂😂
some things you only miss when they are gone
Well said Ben
Ben is spot on 👏
Middle East democracy 😂😂😂
😂
😂
UNITED KINGDOM IS A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY AND WILL ALWAYS REMAIN A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY.
PRAISE JESUS PRAISE JESUS PRAISE JESUS
Why is she NOT allowed to be offended, Ben
What a fantastic orator
8:53 whole debate can be summed up to this
The best one when it came to this topic
Absolutely and fully endorse the view. Muslim must change and cut its ties with outdated ideologies. Other belief systems and cultures moved on from such pre civilization methods! The education of kids at young age is the key. As in the meeting the persons asked, the people of this trust system don’t even understand what others are taking😱😱😱. It is so outdated😱😱😱
Oh wow a mooz got offended. How shocking
I thought that people who go to Oxford are the most educated people in the world, but it turns out to be the contrary including people in the comment section
Not including yourself of course
Go back to school
They are educated that's why they know what are your intentions....western countries belong to Christians...who the hell are u to go there and demand for Sharia/Islamic law
I see there is no democracy in the comment section as replies to posts are not visable.
The culture of Islam is not compatible. Marrying relatives, shutting down democracy, violence and death threats if others don't conform with the religion, 2 tier justice and policing etc etc
Not all Muslims are in this category. These extremists are the ones I'm speaking of. Constantly offended and now the blasphemy laws so no one can criticise it... Insanity. If the extremists can't respect the culture of the country and it's laws and principles then they need to go 10s of thousands of crimi nalls and over 40 thousand tear or ists should be deported plus their families.
@jamyDodger 👍
Islam never had democracy to begin with. This, however, doesn't mean that democracy is the only RIGHT path for governance. Let me clarify:
Firstly, in Islam, the duty of guiding humanity was taken by the Prophets sent by Allah. Hence, there was no democracy or "people's decision" in choosing the Prophet from among themselves. Allah was the sole authority in deciding who would be made the Prophet among humanity. That Prophet was then entrusted with the word of God to guide the people towards the truth.
When the last Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) was sent, Allah completed the "Teachings of Islam" upon humanity (Al-Maaidah : 3). Now the task was to spread the word of God throughout the world and protect this religion from corruption, and this is where the real problem arose:
According to the Shia viewpoint: The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) chose his successor Ali (by the will of Allah and not from his own whims) as the first Imam and Khalifa (Leader) of the Islamic Ummah in his farewell sermon at Ghadir-e-Khum. This makes perfect sense as the appointment of a leader by Allah was the norm in Islam. The leadership was to be transferred within the progeny of Ali (as per Allah's wish and Prophet's instruction) till his 12th generation: to the person we know as the final Imam "Mehdi" (who will be sent by Allah to restore order and justice in the world along with Prophet Esa (Jesus)). Hence we can clearly see that the leadership and governance of the people in Islam is a totally divine process free from human interference. It is however, noteworthy that in the occultation period of the last or 12th Imam, it is democracy that can best represent the people's wishes and hence the best mode of government but not the liberal democracy of the West.
Why? Because we all know that these same democracies have countless errors and flaws. For instance, the interference of lobbies in the democratic process never makes the leaders truly free to make decisions. The West's silence and inaction regarding the atrocities in Gaza are evidence that it represents not the people's wishes but the collective interests of the few powerful people behind the scenes. These governments fool the people into thinking that they represent their wishes while actually, they're so powerless that they can't even speak freely without the consent of the invisible hands (the deep state as Trump calls it). More on this later.
According to the Sunni viewpoint: The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) didn't appoint anyone as the leader and left it in the hands of the Ummah to choose among themselves. This is such a flawed argument considering the fact that, according to them, the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) communicated every small aspect of one's life from how to eat, speak, talk, sleep, behave, and take care of hygiene but didn't bother to address the issue that would cause the most distress, chaos, and disintegration within the Islamic Ummah i.e. The question of Leadership? Sunnis believe that after the Prophet's demise, a Shura (cabinet) was formed which included important companions of the Prophet and they (hastily) made Abu Bakr the first caliph of the Ummah considering the turmoil that arose following the Prophet's demise. The question arises: If the leader was to be appointed (which was not required considering the Prophet's appointment of Ali) then why were Ali and his close companions not a part of the cabinet? Ali, who was the closest to the Prophet till his funeral (which also was not attended by the first three Sunni Caliphs), why was his input not taken or of any member of the Prophet's family in choosing the caliph?
Secondly, if the appointment of the first caliph was made by the Shura (cabinet) i.e. Indirect democracy, then why was the second caliph appointed unilaterally without any consultation by Abu Bakr? This is such a great loophole in Sunni logic. If Islam has democracy, then all caliphs should be appointed democratically and if there's dictatorship/Kingship then that should be the norm. But this is the problem in Sunni Islam: THEY CHOOSE DEMOCRACY OR DICTATORSHIP ACCORDING TO THE SITUATION IN ORDER TO JUSTIFY THEIR CALIPHS.
So what is the TRUTH? To reach it one must first understand that humanity's conquest to find the utopian form of government is not new. It started from the time of Plato and onto Islamic Philosophers like Farabi, and Ibn Khaldun and later onto Western Philosophers like Montesquieu, Machiavelli, Locke, Rousseau, Hegel, and then Marx. Everyone was trying to find an infallible system to govern the people and the quest continues even today. While liberal democracies might be the norm for now but with the rise of Populism and Protectionism, this process will continue to evolve and change. It should however be noted that the truly infallible system can only be achieved with an infallible authority to govern it. That authority is Allah (God) which is exercised by his appointed messengers (Prophet) or later the Imams (Starting from Ali till Mehdi, 12 in total). Apart from this infallible system humanity is left with only democracy as the most pragmatic form of government. But with all its flaws, the Western notion of democracy is not the solution. We need a democracy that is free from external influence and that is free to make its own decisions as per the wishes of its population. The theocracy in Iran may not be perfect but is the most pragmatic and effective mode so far (in my view) in countering the Western penetration into their political system. It has also upheld Islamic values better than most other Islamic countries.
Some people from the West might disagree but that's how it is. Islam is a "way of life" and not just a set of principles (like other religions) you have the choice to ignore. As an Islamic state, it is the responsibility of the government to protect the Islamic values within its territories. It is different from the extremist-secular ideology of France or the liberal ideology of the US. While Islam has tolerance and acceptability for other religions, it does not allow for gross violation of its code of conduct within its territory. While there may still be judgement errors in the Iranian System, this is how a state can be best governed until Allah sends his last representative on Earth i.e Imam Mehdi (the Messiah and 12th Imam).
Only then will the infallible governance of Allah be materialized on this Earth.
For those who stuck till the end: Thank you for your time.
Do let me know if you agree or disagree with me!
It’s the false hadiths and culture that is the issue. True Islam has been lost because of this. Xxxxx
Always have an excuse.
I wouldn't even have gone there Ben you're taking to ignorance the next pack of civil servants and politicians
What he said was way over their heads no doubt
can democracies be responsible and complicit for the Gaza genocide?
your people are responsible for starting that conflict ... dumazz always blaming others
@@websitemartianHe is right. How can democracy ever stop the bombing of Gaza, Syria and other countries?
@@MunnaHossain-kh4zb you think Israel just started bombing gaza out of the blue??
@websitemartian It seems that you were born a few days ago, so don't keep any news of the world.UN and human rights organizations read the article they say Israel is massacring the people of Palestine.The Jews came from Europe, occupying the land of Palestine, killing and expelling them from the country. Have you never read history?
@@MunnaHossain-kh4zb stop kidnapping people!!!
Offended? No, purposefully interrupting.
It cannot reform because the laws are from the prophet, so you cannot mess with that
Go Ben never a truer word spoken
Word
isolation in the minority
division in equality
subjugation in the majority
You should read the original sources of Islam to know details about the notion of an state, society and governance in perspective of Islam.
Still not compatible with humanity or even democracy! Never have! Never been! Never will!.
He’s 100% right listen and learn people
There is no need to debate
That bell is just stupid and annoying. No stupid bell, no hammer... Perhaps play them out with a little music like at an award's show.
No thanks.
When u go to grave u will see that democracy when Anker munker Ask u mann Rabbu ka nd then u say democracy u will see urself
nice
ex muslim sahil, adama seeker, ex muslim zafar hertics zindabaad
👏
❤🎉
steve carrell in the corner???
BEN HABIB IS A KING
No, thank you, we see the fruits of what your suggested reforms lead to and I personally don’t want anything to do with it.
What fruits of reforms?
Ben is right though. Islam extremism is not compatible with western culture. If they want another culture they shud leave. It's not working.
2:56