I agree with the gist of what some others have said. I can’t fault pas for anything they do on an aesthetic level. My professional background is in this direction, so I appreciate their execution in this regard, a lot, to the extent it’s always my first choice for what to grab from the closet on the way out the door for a ride. My only reservation [though it is a humdinger], is in terms of durability, objectively, they are pretty poor as regards durability. I was surprised you had a bad experience with rapha on this count, as, as much as I want to criticise rapha, and, aesthetically, there’s a lot that could be said, durability-wise, they are head and shoulders and clear country mile ahead, in my experience. I have items from them multiple years old and still in good repair. The powerweave bibs, re compression, durability in use, standing up to my longest rides, with ~4000m climb, contorting on the saddle, not a dicky bird as far as wear / damage to the fabric or its construction. I don’t know about anyone else, but the same can’t be said for any of my pas bibs, mechanism, mechanism pro etc. I estimate, at best, per the laundry instructions, and using delicates bags…something in the region of a year, for anyone riding on a relatively frequent basis. Pas, aesthetically, but also, it has to be said, in terms of their tactile experience, are a pleasure to use. As above, they’re my preferred items to put on for a ride. But, like all cycling kit, I suppose, they are a consumable item. For the pro teams who wear the kit we wear as amateur enthusiasts, they get it for free, and we pay through the nose, [subsidising the pro teams?], and, to a degree, that’s unavoidable. Between brands, everyone’s mileage may vary, but pas kit, regards fabric robustness, stitching…it’s really not in any way commensurate with what you pay for it, more so if paying the rrp, that’s simply the fact of the matter. You’ll be familiar with the axiom in economics, that the appropriate pricing for any given item, is simply the price which the market will bear [will tolerate / accept]. On this point, pas have got this metric locked down. They know their market, and it :is: willing to pay prices that would be questionable had the product been made with any kind of longevity in use, as it is, it is arguably a kind of insanity, a mania or a mass hysteria. That’s the power of aesthetics vs physical entities however. Apple arguably being another case in point. Though, in fairness, at a stretch, ones iphone :can: serve long enough to justify the initial purchase, albeit, with some throttling / slowing down as the years pass. All that said, I’d be the first to congratulate you if find your experience is at odds with mine.
This is exactly my same experience. I have been wearing Rapha for 10+ years and I still proudly hold items from back in the day that are incredibly holding on without visible marks. You need to see them to find them (that includes socks). I am still amazed on how I found stuff from 2-3 years ago thinking I bough them just now because they are really good quality. If any complaint I would have would be for the zippers on the gillet, mate they break fair quickly. Fit as been questionable always, changing between seasons and categories but the quality is there and the innovation (not compared to a Castelli, Rule 28 or performance oriented stuff) is also there. I see MAAP and PNS bringing insulated stuff where Rapha had this 4 years ago. Nowadays I wear 1 day Rapha, 1 day PNS and 1 day MAAP and so on (I have tons of clothes from all of them) and a couple of things from ASSOS. PNS garmet feel so good to the skin, the fit is also questionnable because in winter Mechanism things are roomier than in summer stuff. The outer texture of the bibs with the grills pattern is also nice and looks nice. How the sleeves hold in the arms thanks to the grip is also really good and never had issues with the pockets in PNS or Maap. MAAP is also sweet feeling stuff but I am just jumping into that wagon but my overall impression is in terms of pricing PNS is the more expensive for the value, but is the nicer looking one, specially if you are into that demure shit. Rapha is less pricey (depending on what you look for because a Gore-Tex garmet is costly but once again, Gore-Tex is proven), so I would say you could see the technical input from the Pro peloton into the development from Rapha, something that both the other brands could appreciate. MAAP also feels nice, sizing is tighter than the previous two but the colours and style are also very cool for things that the previous brands normally won't do. I am also more keen to say that for challenging conditions rain, below 0, winter rides Rapha is my to go in terms of protection from the elements, but at cost of having a little bulkier, thicker, more compress material, where if you are willing to sacrifice a little of that protection for more comfort and next-to-the-skin feeling PNS is very very good. MAAP is in between both, you could clearly see in the Thermal Evade Jersey that is not there at pair of the Thermal Jersey from PNS or the Gore-Tex or Thermal Jackets from Rapha, its simple not there in terms of performance and also something you can notice as soon as you hold it in your hands. But in terms of APEX tights and Evade non-thermal jerseys (the LS with the mesh in the arms) it is *chefkiss. So any consumer should be able to choose depending on their conditions, calling them overpriced because is x2-3 times expensier than Biehler of Sirocco is stupid, because as soon as you try them you won't go back, either because you can realise the price gap or because of the faff. DEFINETELY not the entire price gap can be attributed to quality, probs. 40% goes into marketing, but it just can't be compared. Also, someone looking for performance oriented clothing, should be looking at any of these three but more a nice product like Rule 28, NoPinz, some Assos stuff, Castelli, but if you have to chose one that would be Rapha.
Hello. I have been using the mechanism pro, solitude and essential lines. The essential jersey does not keep at all and is not that good beyond a couple of washes. The mechanism pro is very comfortable and elegant. Much nicer than assos. As for the longevity of this line; the bib wares a bit in normal places and gets a bit saggy( looses the tight fit). Compared to map, rapha and assos, I love those the most especially the mechanism pro
how do you get to the back pockets? it is ridiculous where they placed them, quite uncomfortable for me reaching to those back pockets compared to other brands
Indeed, although Rapha isn’t that expensive anymore, but if you have to pay 400€ for a bibshort and jersey that’s totaly nuts, but hey i do ride the exact same bike as you do, and that is also overpriced, but it’s economics if there are fools like us who pay 14000€ for a bike why would the manufacturers lower there prices
Absolutely terrible customer service. I had two bibs have similar defects and they did not assist or seem to care at all. I will never purchase from them again after spending that much money.
I think it's really a matter of taste of the colours and style really, as they are all good quality, although I have had issues with Assos shorts splitting, (see later in video). Unfortunately, I don't have many easy days...😆
For jerseys I don't think you can beat Rapha Pro Team. The fabric, fit and finish is beautiful (it's a shame their bibs aren't as durable). RRP is high but you can almost always get them at highly discounted prices. Recently tried some Maap Pro Air jerseys, really like the fit, fabrics are good but not as good as Rapha. For a top end jersey I don't think I can look past those two.
The only thing that annoys me about the bibs is the cracking on the branding when after it's been a bit. The bibs are the comfiest I've owned and I've tried most brands
Out of all the kits I own, the PSN (mechanism) is by far the worst. I've worn the bibs only 4 times because it just tries to push my crotch inside of my body. It's like they made it for women. Also the straps are waaay too tight. I've got normal body proportions, but i'm very athletic. 178cm, 72kg, 8,5% bodyfat, and I bought a bib size M, jersey size S. I have to wrestle myself into their kit. And 1 of the seems has already got loose at a point where there's no preal pressure point. Even the socks suck. I've never had any sock in my life slipping down, but somehow PSN manages to do so. I'd say there's many many brands that are doing better quality wise, price wise, fit wise. PSN is mostly just hype, and I fell for it too 2 years ago.
@@CyclespeedTours But if you have a long torso, doesn't that make the straps extra tight on your body? I felt cramped into it, and it pulled my bibs into my crotch even more. And the legs reached my knees too..
Good video, but it's insta fashion kit with an off the shelf Cytech EIT chamois sewn in. There is no fabric innovation or new construction methods. If you think PNS is top of the line price wise you should look into Q36.5. Dottore Pro bibs are 320.00 but have real technological advances.
This brand is more expensive, and far less technological advanced than Swiss x-bionic, which is at least 30-50% cheaper, and offers proven advantages for cyclists, and athletes. Actually to cool, and to regulate body temperature you need to sweat, this natural mechanism is regulated by our body, but in extreme situation, you need to balance of cooling and sweating while exercising. A regular Lycra doesn't do much about it. X-bionic scientifically designed and patented knitted fabric, which allows channeled out sweat in specific areas to speed up sweating.
Italian brands are higher quality, better fabrics, but do not have that aura. can't put a price tag on aura... if you are after performance though, PNS shouldn't be your choice
Exposing your tummy like that looks ridiculous. Too small and way over priced. All the big brands use the same manufacturer who has different factories around the world.
while the kit looks pretty good, i think the tops are to short for you, looks horrible. man this looks so bad :D the pockets on the long sleeve are between your shoulderblades :D:D:
Standing up, yeah it looks a bit weird, but let's not forget this is made for cycling, so when on the bike and bent over, it kinda works. The long sleeve pockets are much easier to get to than the short sleeve.
@@CyclespeedTours what i personally found (having a similar physique) it is hard to get the sizing right on the fashion brands, because to have it properly tight around the waist, you have to size down and get the problem you have (the belly button showing and the pockets between shoulder blades). and you are even leaner than i am. you should consider skin suits, they are more catered towards people as lean as you.
I agree with the gist of what some others have said.
I can’t fault pas for anything they do on an aesthetic level.
My professional background is in this direction, so I appreciate their execution in this regard, a lot, to the extent it’s always my first choice for what to grab from the closet on the way out the door for a ride.
My only reservation [though it is a humdinger], is in terms of durability, objectively, they are pretty poor as regards durability.
I was surprised you had a bad experience with rapha on this count, as, as much as I want to criticise rapha, and, aesthetically, there’s a lot that could be said, durability-wise, they are head and shoulders and clear country mile ahead, in my experience. I have items from them multiple years old and still in good repair.
The powerweave bibs, re compression, durability in use, standing up to my longest rides, with ~4000m climb, contorting on the saddle, not a dicky bird as far as wear / damage to the fabric or its construction.
I don’t know about anyone else, but the same can’t be said for any of my pas bibs, mechanism, mechanism pro etc. I estimate, at best, per the laundry instructions, and using delicates bags…something in the region of a year, for anyone riding on a relatively frequent basis.
Pas, aesthetically, but also, it has to be said, in terms of their tactile experience, are a pleasure to use.
As above, they’re my preferred items to put on for a ride.
But, like all cycling kit, I suppose, they are a consumable item.
For the pro teams who wear the kit we wear as amateur enthusiasts, they get it for free, and we pay through the nose, [subsidising the pro teams?], and, to a degree, that’s unavoidable.
Between brands, everyone’s mileage may vary, but pas kit, regards fabric robustness, stitching…it’s really not in any way commensurate with what you pay for it, more so if paying the rrp, that’s simply the fact of the matter.
You’ll be familiar with the axiom in economics, that the appropriate pricing for any given item, is simply the price which the market will bear [will tolerate / accept].
On this point, pas have got this metric locked down. They know their market, and it :is: willing to pay prices that would be questionable had the product been made with any kind of longevity in use, as it is, it is arguably a kind of insanity, a mania or a mass hysteria.
That’s the power of aesthetics vs physical entities however. Apple arguably being another case in point. Though, in fairness, at a stretch, ones iphone :can: serve long enough to justify the initial purchase, albeit, with some throttling / slowing down as the years pass.
All that said, I’d be the first to congratulate you if find your experience is at odds with mine.
Excellent comment, thanks.
This is exactly my same experience. I have been wearing Rapha for 10+ years and I still proudly hold items from back in the day that are incredibly holding on without visible marks. You need to see them to find them (that includes socks). I am still amazed on how I found stuff from 2-3 years ago thinking I bough them just now because they are really good quality. If any complaint I would have would be for the zippers on the gillet, mate they break fair quickly. Fit as been questionable always, changing between seasons and categories but the quality is there and the innovation (not compared to a Castelli, Rule 28 or performance oriented stuff) is also there. I see MAAP and PNS bringing insulated stuff where Rapha had this 4 years ago. Nowadays I wear 1 day Rapha, 1 day PNS and 1 day MAAP and so on (I have tons of clothes from all of them) and a couple of things from ASSOS. PNS garmet feel so good to the skin, the fit is also questionnable because in winter Mechanism things are roomier than in summer stuff. The outer texture of the bibs with the grills pattern is also nice and looks nice. How the sleeves hold in the arms thanks to the grip is also really good and never had issues with the pockets in PNS or Maap. MAAP is also sweet feeling stuff but I am just jumping into that wagon but my overall impression is in terms of pricing PNS is the more expensive for the value, but is the nicer looking one, specially if you are into that demure shit. Rapha is less pricey (depending on what you look for because a Gore-Tex garmet is costly but once again, Gore-Tex is proven), so I would say you could see the technical input from the Pro peloton into the development from Rapha, something that both the other brands could appreciate. MAAP also feels nice, sizing is tighter than the previous two but the colours and style are also very cool for things that the previous brands normally won't do. I am also more keen to say that for challenging conditions rain, below 0, winter rides Rapha is my to go in terms of protection from the elements, but at cost of having a little bulkier, thicker, more compress material, where if you are willing to sacrifice a little of that protection for more comfort and next-to-the-skin feeling PNS is very very good. MAAP is in between both, you could clearly see in the Thermal Evade Jersey that is not there at pair of the Thermal Jersey from PNS or the Gore-Tex or Thermal Jackets from Rapha, its simple not there in terms of performance and also something you can notice as soon as you hold it in your hands. But in terms of APEX tights and Evade non-thermal jerseys (the LS with the mesh in the arms) it is *chefkiss. So any consumer should be able to choose depending on their conditions, calling them overpriced because is x2-3 times expensier than Biehler of Sirocco is stupid, because as soon as you try them you won't go back, either because you can realise the price gap or because of the faff. DEFINETELY not the entire price gap can be attributed to quality, probs. 40% goes into marketing, but it just can't be compared. Also, someone looking for performance oriented clothing, should be looking at any of these three but more a nice product like Rule 28, NoPinz, some Assos stuff, Castelli, but if you have to chose one that would be Rapha.
nothing like a PeNiS suit to give you that fully fledged Fred look
Nice video !!!
Thanks!
Hello. I have been using the mechanism pro, solitude and essential lines. The essential jersey does not keep at all and is not that good beyond a couple of washes. The mechanism pro is very comfortable and elegant. Much nicer than assos. As for the longevity of this line; the bib wares a bit in normal places and gets a bit saggy( looses the tight fit). Compared to map, rapha and assos, I love those the most especially the mechanism pro
Useful info, thanks.
@ also, you can’t use pas normal if you have a couple of extra kilos :))). And we have the same bike, I ride the RTP tarmac
@@mohamadjamil3164 yeah, if I hit the all you can eat buffet, I'm definitely out! And yeah it's a great bike.
Pas Normal Studios reminds me of slow riders and instagram influencers who come out on bike to take pictures and talk with other npcs lol
Well you can call them many things, but in Mallorca at least, slow is not one of them....
how do you get to the back pockets? it is ridiculous where they placed them, quite uncomfortable for me reaching to those back pockets compared to other brands
It's doable, but not great. Maap is just as bad.
nice bike
thanks, I like it!
nice kit, but totaly overpriced
Aren't Maap, Rapha, CdC, Assos also totally overpriced though?
Indeed, although Rapha isn’t that expensive anymore, but if you have to pay 400€ for a bibshort and jersey that’s totaly nuts, but hey i do ride the exact same bike as you do, and that is also overpriced, but it’s economics if there are fools like us who pay 14000€ for a bike why would the manufacturers lower there prices
Absolutely terrible customer service. I had two bibs have similar defects and they did not assist or seem to care at all. I will never purchase from them again after spending that much money.
At this price level it is ESSENTIAL (see what I did there?!) that they stand by their product and repair / replace in case of failure.
@@CyclespeedToursthat's where Rapha cannot be faulted, their customer service is amazing.
@@kpizzle1985 it's definitely a strong point for them
This olive jersey with blue lettering would work best for someone like me with short torso and longer legs.
lol same
Don’t you think at thosse prices, you’re better off with an Assos or Q36.5? Cafe du Cycliste for easy days
I think it's really a matter of taste of the colours and style really, as they are all good quality, although I have had issues with Assos shorts splitting, (see later in video). Unfortunately, I don't have many easy days...😆
Looks nice. But the high and small pockets would be a deal breaker for me.
Yeah, I would only wear this for racey rides, where i don't need to carry much
All cycling MAAP apparel is made in Europe (Italy, Lithuania, Romania), not Vietnam
PNS. Put in the vowels 😂
PaNeS?
For jerseys I don't think you can beat Rapha Pro Team. The fabric, fit and finish is beautiful (it's a shame their bibs aren't as durable). RRP is high but you can almost always get them at highly discounted prices.
Recently tried some Maap Pro Air jerseys, really like the fit, fabrics are good but not as good as Rapha.
For a top end jersey I don't think I can look past those two.
I recently bought a Rapha Pro Team aero in cream colour and it's very nice. As you say, Rapha often discounts, PNS never seems to .
The only thing that annoys me about the bibs is the cracking on the branding when after it's been a bit. The bibs are the comfiest I've owned and I've tried most brands
kit looks good but the font on the rear of the bib is a bit boring tbh...
I absolutely HATE brown kit
Out of all the kits I own, the PSN (mechanism) is by far the worst. I've worn the bibs only 4 times because it just tries to push my crotch inside of my body. It's like they made it for women. Also the straps are waaay too tight. I've got normal body proportions, but i'm very athletic. 178cm, 72kg, 8,5% bodyfat, and I bought a bib size M, jersey size S. I have to wrestle myself into their kit. And 1 of the seems has already got loose at a point where there's no preal pressure point. Even the socks suck. I've never had any sock in my life slipping down, but somehow PSN manages to do so. I'd say there's many many brands that are doing better quality wise, price wise, fit wise. PSN is mostly just hype, and I fell for it too 2 years ago.
We are all shaped different....I have a long torso and shorter legs for example, so I think it's a question of finding what works for you.
@@CyclespeedTours But if you have a long torso, doesn't that make the straps extra tight on your body? I felt cramped into it, and it pulled my bibs into my crotch even more. And the legs reached my knees too..
@@YannickLB Yes, the straps are quite tight, but I don't find it pulls into my crotch though....
Rapha all the way
They make some nice stuff, bought a Pro Team Aero top recently, but I have had quality issues with them.
I have a lot of rapha stuff 6 year old that i still wear.
Rapha is the best cycling kit that money can buy
To much money for the price ! For me nothing like Castelli bibs
Ps great bike
Thanks. Yep, Castelli are probably the best quality value out there.
Naw mate, PAS don't last. Look great though but fashion brands like this don't need to last.
Good video, but it's insta fashion kit with an off the shelf Cytech EIT chamois sewn in. There is no fabric innovation or new construction methods. If you think PNS is top of the line price wise you should look into Q36.5. Dottore Pro bibs are 320.00 but have real technological advances.
This brand is more expensive, and far less technological advanced than Swiss x-bionic, which is at least 30-50% cheaper, and offers proven advantages for cyclists, and athletes. Actually to cool, and to regulate body temperature you need to sweat, this natural mechanism is regulated by our body, but in extreme situation, you need to balance of cooling and sweating while exercising. A regular Lycra doesn't do much about it. X-bionic scientifically designed and patented knitted fabric, which allows channeled out sweat in specific areas to speed up sweating.
Expensive kit but the exposed material above your waist on the bib looks like your underwear
that oakley one is just sad
Italian brands are higher quality, better fabrics, but do not have that aura. can't put a price tag on aura... if you are after performance though, PNS shouldn't be your choice
How do you define 'performance'? For me, if looking to do fast rides, aero is key, and in that respect the PNS stuff pulls it off well.
hey too small for you
Exposing your tummy like that looks ridiculous. Too small and way over priced. All the big brands use the same manufacturer who has different factories around the world.
Those tops look terrible.
those jerseys are way too short for you
aero jerseys are all going this way.....
Robbennnnnn
while the kit looks pretty good, i think the tops are to short for you, looks horrible. man this looks so bad :D the pockets on the long sleeve are between your shoulderblades :D:D:
Standing up, yeah it looks a bit weird, but let's not forget this is made for cycling, so when on the bike and bent over, it kinda works. The long sleeve pockets are much easier to get to than the short sleeve.
@@CyclespeedTours what i personally found (having a similar physique) it is hard to get the sizing right on the fashion brands, because to have it properly tight around the waist, you have to size down and get the problem you have (the belly button showing and the pockets between shoulder blades). and you are even leaner than i am.
you should consider skin suits, they are more catered towards people as lean as you.
More money than sense 😢
Overpriced, compared to Siroko and Ekoi.
Siroko is excellent value yes, but you need to choose carefully.
Velocio is better
no
overpriced marketing hype 😂😂