Realistic scenario with realistic outcome. We used to practice this annually working our way up to a saturation raid. Every thing went well until the saturation raid. Numerous missiles ALWAYS got through. This was from the early to mid 80s.
@@SgtTechCom with 140 missiles, 50% would be realistic. Considering the speed of the AShCM and the range of the SAMs, there would be no time to engage many of them. AAW in the 80s was much different than it is today. Shorter range missiles, most of which needed CWI guidance from launch to intercept, thereby trying up the fire control channels, launcher load times, more buttons to push to engage, no CEC. The proliferation of the Aegis system changed all that.
@@lohrtom with five Ticonderoga class Cruisers defending I do not think that 50% would be even remotely realistic. This scenario had five aegis Cruisers defending the fleet. For NTU ships I agree. With CEC it's an entirely different ball game.
@@RubyRidgeWaco Early versions of SMs and Aegis also some 1st gen launchers, and deconfliction software, means this strike will be more successful than DCS shows. In DCS they have modern systems vs 80s.
One of my favorite books, and in all honesty, I don't think any combat simulator can do this scenario justice. My favorite chapter is "The Frisbees of Dreamland"
It's a great book and this chapter is so incredibly hard to pull off. I applaud Cap trying for it even if the results were clearly influenced by latency, AI issues and early release balance challenges.
The only program that can really do that book Justice is command modern operations, although it's not as visually appealing ( not rendered in 3D) it is incredibly detailed and can handle massive scenarios on a global scale
After datamining Sea Power's files, it shows that the SPY-1A radar on the Tico's has only 12 targeting channels, and track 24 missiles simultaneously. It has a range resolution of 93m, whereby if targets are within 93m of each other, they are recognised as a single target, this could explain why several missiles were not targeted as they were considered to be a single target, as the missiles are overlapping. The MK26 twin armed launchers, takes 30s to ready up, then after it's "Readied" it takes 9 seconds to reload the arms. KP for the SM-1MR -> SM-2ERB1 is set at 80%
Downloaded today. Read manual which I rarely do. Spent the last 6 hours in the editor creating a couple of scenarios off of Ireland with carriers, cruisers and frigates on both sides and to be honest, playing around with this and the camera, learning how to launch aircraft and so on, I have had a blast. I have not even added triggers yet but must admit the option and info boxes are so easy to understand. I spent the first hour just looking at the detail of the units in the Encyclopedia. That alone is almost worth the cost. I can see this is going to be big. I actually downloaded Cold Waters 4 months ago but have never even started it up on Steam as yet.
Cold Waters is fun! Different from this, much more focused on submarines of course but very much more polished. Try the DOT mod as well in case you are going to play Cold Waters.
@@IR0CZ2857 That's not Cap's fault. HE took on a big hard thing and did it, learned from it and will give us more content in the future. Whether or not Sea Power is balanced or perfectly accurate yet really doesn't matter as far as the compliment goes.
Very nice. One thing that is hard to replicate is electronic warfare. Tom Clancy got a few bit right and more than a few wrong, but he made an outstanding story of what if the Cold War went hot.
@@boredatsea I was teaching EW for a bit for my division and new officers on ship. It never failed to amaze me how little people actually know about EW and are experts at the same time.
@@Echowhiskeyone An officer onboard a warship main job is to sign off on every bodies leave, they live in the Wardroom drinking tea and coffee whilst the enlisted men did all the shitty jobs operating the equipment.
There is a mod that puts in VLS Tico's with 100 target channels. Makes this scenario alot better but for red storm rising you did great. I had the same results. Would be interesting to see if the F-14's stayed on station. I had decent luck getting the phoneix Anti air missiles thinning the herd on the missiles.
Cap broke the AI it's the only explanation for how that many missile ships only shot down a couple dozen incoming vampires. I noticed the carriers didn't even shoot back at all. 😂
Lived in Philly until seven years ago. We had so many of the SpruCans there along with plenty of Figs. Ended up as a visitor on Moosbrugger twice. I always thought the Sprucans had more life and were great as Strike Destroyers with the VLS and the two 5inch guns.
Interestingly, the missile interception rate seems rather low for 5 "AEGIS cruisers" even with the Mk. 26 launchers. Tico in the book managed to intercept around 65% of the missiles (which according to some is quite low in itself). Also, within the Dance of the Vampires chapter, it states that there are "French ships" in the fleet. Not that you can add them because they're currently not in-game, but I felt like you should know. Edit: There also aren't 3 LHAs in the fleet, there's one Tarawa LHA (USS Saipan), one Newport LST (USS Newport), and one Austin LPD (USS Ponce).
I can say that AEGIS and SLQ-32 of the time were capable of much better than shown here today. With all the upgrades, AEGIS and the SLQ-32 are still among the best in the world and have been for near 40 years.
Indeed French ships are often forgot when talking about this masterpiece that “Dance of the vampires” is ! Clancy clearly mentionned the Foch, a carrier quite comparable to an Essex-class if we’re looking at something similar in the USN, but not quite a lot regarding other ships. But we can speculate that at the time in the mid-80s, the french part of the Task Force would include a few T-47s ( both ASW and AAW variants ), a Suffren-Class DDG, a Georges Leygues class ASW DD and if they were lucky the Colbert AAW cruiser. I’m really looking forward for that potential French/European DLC the devs mentioned, first for this scenario but also because the Marine National does have quite a lot of interesting designs, not even close to US ships in terms of capabilities, but still a respectable size able to engage its own task force
I would say that this video was laughable. It might have been the lag but my Lord, did they even shoot down 30 missiles between them? This game is basically in a early beta state
That was great to sea cap, currently going through the Seapower scenarios, running a groupo is hard and has a lot to learn to optimise the attack and defense. This was impressive to watch!
In the book The Fleet's Aegis cruiser opened up at almost 100 miles, Tico had time to empty its entire magazine. In this scenario it looked like the ticos fired at about 20 miles.
I'm wondering if Clancy knew somethings the game designers did not. I seem to recall hearing that Clancy war gamed the situation. But the question is how.
Ticos should have also emptied their magazines in 2 and a half minutes (each type 26 launcher could fire 2 missiles ever 9 seconds, and with AEGIS the terminal guidance bottleneck was eliminated)
It seemed there were a lot more misses than I'd expect as well. Something in the way the AI is handling the Aegis just feels a bit off unfortunately. Hopefully future patches improve that.
Please consider releasing your marvellous work of this scenario for Sea Power for us to also admire the genius of Tom Clancy and your effort to bring this to life, thanks for such a great video 10/10
Interesting how many you could have sunk if you'd only fired salvos of 4 missiles at each target and spread 'em around to more targets. Great sim as always Cap and GR team.
I like the book's description of the Crusaders: Good birds, short legs. Range for this kind of battle was very important. Clancy dispelled any "Good old WW2 naval battle" from modern warfare with this book.
@@BrettonianKnightit is a completely new code base. The developer at Triassic who worked for Killerfish was not the lead programmer, he was lead designer. Completely different coding engine.
Well done, interesting how you compare and contrast two similar but different simulators with markedly different outcomes. Seemed to me like the PK for the anti-ship missiles was very high! Hard to tell why the air defenses weren't as effective.
Is there a way in Sea Power to draw a circle or other shape around a group of targets to declare all of them hostile (or not) rather than tediously selecting each of them individually?
awww , i feel like i need to join in with the bots ... the message is so positive and wholesome "Your channel is a place where I can always relax and enjoy great humor. Keep up your hilarious videos!🐈🎯🥀" I agree with the bots , thanks Cap and GR
@@lolmao500 I would tell you that the Aegis cruiser scored a significantly higher % than what we saw in this scenario in testing vs large un-maneuvering supersonic drones. In Red Storm rising Ticonderoga scored a 65% hit rate in this exact scenario, and opened fire at such a range as to be able to empty it's entire magazine of 96 missiles before the first vampire reached the fleet. Aegis was specifically designed for this scenario.
@@SgtTechComIf there existed enough SM2MRs to arm the entire CBG, and the other CBGs. There are also targeting radar limitations. If you use less capable missiles the engagement range shrinks.
Yeah that really wouldn't work either because you would be bringing the bombers within range of the F-14 which would just get slaughtered. There's a reason they fired standoff decoys. Hopefully they get put into the game soon but yeah😂
I remember hearing Clancy and a friend did most of the battles in the book on a game called Harpoon to make sure they were realistic. I can only imagine what kind of field day he'd have with Sea Power. Especially once we get modernized equipment options. Wouldn't be hard to see a modern setting version of "Red Storm Rising" except for it being a China/Taiwan and the Asiatic area in play.
Good recreation of the story. The thing the author did not know at the time, a dummy warhead takes up almost the same room and weight as a live warhead. Most nations have since stopped making them for this reason and just make more live warheads. Dummy warheads are now primarily used in target shooting, gunnary practice, exercises, etc.
Well, one thing I like is that Sea Power provides a chance for payback, and as we all know Payback is a MFer! ;-) Unlike in the book, the Soviet planes really took it on the chin in revenge. However I don't recall the entire task force getting wiped out in the book, just a good chunk of it. Nonetheless, excellent recreation Cap! Well done!
If I remember correctly, in the book a Sqn or so of F15s armed with AIM9s and tanks were deploying to Europe and stumbled into one of the Soviet Raids after the Soviets fired their anti ship missles?
One thing isn't modeled very well in this game. The Soviet tactical use of nukes. Missile saturation attack? Nuke'em with nuclear SAM's. Don't know where the sub is exactly? Lob a nuke in the general direction. The N in the SS-N-22, etc? Nuclear. I expect that to be included once it gets closer to done (in particular appropriate explosions). This is not as relevant to this episode as some of the previous ones, but I did notice Mr. Grim replacing non-nuclear missiles with nuclear ones and assumign they're 'roughly the same'. :)
F-YES!!!! It also seems the Nimitz's CWIS also went into reset mode and did not engage any targets. Was this the chapter that Buns Nakamura and her AF ferry flight splashed the bears?
The radar planes weren’t AWACS but were carrier-launched E-3A Hawkeyes. The Kelt missiles were configured to look like bombers on radar. The Tomcats thought they were shooting at planes, not missiles.
The Navy AWACS is the E-2 Hawkeye, and it is a slightly less capable version of the ground based E-3 Sentry. It is most definitely an Airborne Warning And Control plane, and has been since 1964, when it replaced the E-1 Tracer.
@@structured_anarchist AWACS is a specific thing, the E-3 Sentry IS AWACS, nothing else is. The general term is AEW&C. But, everyone is familiar with AWACS and calls every plane in that class AWACS just like all tissues are Kleenex.
For both sides in this battle, the primary targets are the carriers, LHAs and support ships. Sinking escorts is okay if you're mounting a follow-up raid. As this game gets patched more and more it will really start to be monster sim, as even in pre-release it advanced in huge strides in a short time. Sadly I can't run it on my cruddy old PC lol, so I'll have to keep watching Cap and Co slugging it out with the bad guys.
5 Aegis Cruisers and they shot down what, 20 Missiles combined? I don't know if it's the lag or what, but this was just awful. Not only that, but the unit selection process is terrible
Looks like most of the units didn't even fire their phalanx, I didn't see any of the sea sparrows fire. Look like the first ship that was hit never even fired chaff. I wonder if it's from the absolutely horrible lag or if the AI is just that bad.
@@adamtruong1759 it would be interesting to see this video run again without all the auxiliary and non-combatant ships and without the ships that don't have any significant air defense. I have a feeling that the processor being so overwhelmed completely tanked the performance of the defending Fleet
@grimreapers Yes! With the end of the Cold War, this became irrelevant to film movie wise, but with what's happening in Europe nowadays, I think it's high time they make one. If it becomes a box office hit and i know it will given the right screen writer, director, and cast, then they can make another movie for The Bear and the Dragon.
You’d think people would have learned from DCS with plunking down cash for an early release product. Some modules in DCS have been waiting for YEARS to go full release and it STILL hasn’t happened.
Well first of all cap didn't put any money down this was a pre-release that he was given to test out and such. Don't believe it's even for sale yet on steam or anything else. EDIT okay my mistake it was released yesterday. Either way cap didn't pay for this. But then again if you don't like it so much why are you watching? LOL
I find it absolutely hilarious all the absolute negative acting soy boys in the comment section complaining about the simulation, and or the way it was carried out.. I must not be as bad as people think because they keep watching😂😂
The Crusader didn't have medium range missiles like the Phantom. Probably wouldn't have caught the Tu-22's. It's a surprising omission from the game given how long it was in service with the USN and much it was used in the Vietnam war? Wonder if there's a big load of assets to come in an update?
The Corsair is a subsonic fighter with Sidewinders and guns, so using a Supersonic F4 with Sparrows and Sidewinders instead really wasn't all that accurate. In the book the Corsairs intercepted inbound missiles but were unable to catch up to the supersonic Backfires because they didn't have the range to do that. The Backfires were detected by a ferry flight of F15s, not by AWACS, and the F15s took down a few of the Backfires with their sidewinders, but were unable to do much more than that due to it being a Ferry flight not a combat patrol. The F14s didn't catch any of the Badgers because they immediately turned north as soon as they had dropped their Kelts. The F14s used all their missiles on the Kelts and didn't realize that the Kelts were decoys until just before Raid 2 (Backfires) were detected by the F15s. At that point they were too far out of position to do anything about the Backfires.
I suspect Sea Power is a little generous with the power of the ASM's, given how hard it was to sink the USS America in 2005. It took four weeks of pounding and they ended up sending a team aboard to scuttle her.
@@connorwgtn well that is true, America also did not have any fuel or Ordnance aboard. I don't think the any ship missiles are overpowered I think the fleet defense is completely broken. Or it was the lag... either way it was pathetic
I like to read Tom Clancy as i'm a bit of a geek, but I do get annoyed at the bias in his work. But he obviously knows his market and should cater for that, can't blame him.
At the time period Red Storm Rising was written he was relatively (yeah, it does some heavy lifting here) even handed. After the Soviet Union went away he went completely bonkers and his books became somewhat boring, given that the US just rolled over everyone who dared to look at it in the wrong way. And lest we forget that Larry Bond co-wrote much of RSR.
I can see a few major issues with that game; in real life you can obviously classify incoming flights as hostile no matter where they come in from, forcing the commander to do that job as well seems like an oversight in my book.
If this video was meant to Showcase this game I am afraid it had the exact opposite effect. I am a solid no on sea power. The unit selection is completely tedious, and the lag was terrible
it`s early access. DCS has gotten a lot better performance over time. There is hope. After all, without the DCS`s fps simulation and multiplayer aspect in there it should have less to do. Sea Power in theory should be more meant to run battles like this than dcs.
Clancy gave the Soviets credit for being able to come up with good, deceptive tactics. This built on their coupe' at Iceland --- the LHA was there because the Russians beat them to Iceland, NOT because they were going to invade. Caught flat-footed, the Task Force was loitering around while people thousands of miles away dithered about what to do next.... always a bad idea.
Sounds good. I hope the "game" gets its bugs worked out and more types of units and weapons are modeled. It will be cool to have something that we could actually use to visualize all these iconic battles from fiction as well as the recreation of real world events.
ok, how about a modern version of this scenario please?
@carroll-w7wxv I think the game stops at 80s or mid 90s. I don't think they have anything more modern than that.
Original DCS version ruclips.net/video/pu9A4tjsvNM/видео.html
Modernized 2020's version: ruclips.net/video/4nREdYN06ts/видео.html
Realistic scenario with realistic outcome. We used to practice this annually working our way up to a saturation raid. Every thing went well until the saturation raid. Numerous missiles ALWAYS got through. This was from the early to mid 80s.
Numerous is one thing. In this video about 70% of the missiles got through. That's not realistic at all.
In the book, the first vampire that hit the Nimitz would have hit directly over my berthing space on the Lincoln. The one that hit Fly 3.
@@SgtTechCom with 140 missiles, 50% would be realistic. Considering the speed of the AShCM and the range of the SAMs, there would be no time to engage many of them. AAW in the 80s was much different than it is today. Shorter range missiles, most of which needed CWI guidance from launch to intercept, thereby trying up the fire control channels, launcher load times, more buttons to push to engage, no CEC. The proliferation of the Aegis system changed all that.
@@lohrtom with five Ticonderoga class Cruisers defending I do not think that 50% would be even remotely realistic.
This scenario had five aegis Cruisers defending the fleet.
For NTU ships I agree.
With CEC it's an entirely different ball game.
@@RubyRidgeWaco Early versions of SMs and Aegis also some 1st gen launchers, and deconfliction software, means this strike will be more successful than DCS shows. In DCS they have modern systems vs 80s.
Yes!!!! One of my favorite fictional battles from my number 1 favorite book.
Same here😂
Yep. The Gold standard in WW3 fiction.
That is a great battle and a great book but this was just a lag filled mess of bugs
should have been sued by the AWACS industry though. Seriously undersold.
@@ldkellandshaw Check out Team yankee. WWIII through the eyes of the 11th ACR in the fulda gap.
One of my favorite books, and in all honesty, I don't think any combat simulator can do this scenario justice. My favorite chapter is "The Frisbees of Dreamland"
It's a great book and this chapter is so incredibly hard to pull off. I applaud Cap trying for it even if the results were clearly influenced by latency, AI issues and early release balance challenges.
The only program that can really do that book Justice is command modern operations, although it's not as visually appealing ( not rendered in 3D) it is incredibly detailed and can handle massive scenarios on a global scale
After datamining Sea Power's files, it shows that the SPY-1A radar on the Tico's has only 12 targeting channels, and track 24 missiles simultaneously. It has a range resolution of 93m, whereby if targets are within 93m of each other, they are recognised as a single target, this could explain why several missiles were not targeted as they were considered to be a single target, as the missiles are overlapping. The MK26 twin armed launchers, takes 30s to ready up, then after it's "Readied" it takes 9 seconds to reload the arms. KP for the SM-1MR -> SM-2ERB1 is set at 80%
Downloaded today. Read manual which I rarely do. Spent the last 6 hours in the editor creating a couple of scenarios off of Ireland with carriers, cruisers and frigates on both sides and to be honest, playing around with this and the camera, learning how to launch aircraft and so on, I have had a blast. I have not even added triggers yet but must admit the option and info boxes are so easy to understand. I spent the first hour just looking at the detail of the units in the Encyclopedia. That alone is almost worth the cost. I can see this is going to be big. I actually downloaded Cold Waters 4 months ago but have never even started it up on Steam as yet.
Can you drag a box to select multiple units?
Cold Waters is fun! Different from this, much more focused on submarines of course but very much more polished. Try the DOT mod as well in case you are going to play Cold Waters.
I'm impressed you took this on so soon in your Sea Power career. Dance of the Vampires is a huge scenario and a massive classic. Well done, Cap!
What was well done about this? I mean it was basically a slideshow I doubt if any of the units at all performed like they're supposed to
@@IR0CZ2857 That's not Cap's fault. HE took on a big hard thing and did it, learned from it and will give us more content in the future. Whether or not Sea Power is balanced or perfectly accurate yet really doesn't matter as far as the compliment goes.
Very nice. One thing that is hard to replicate is electronic warfare. Tom Clancy got a few bit right and more than a few wrong, but he made an outstanding story of what if the Cold War went hot.
Unless you have worked with EW not many people understand how it works or what effect it has.
@@boredatsea I was teaching EW for a bit for my division and new officers on ship. It never failed to amaze me how little people actually know about EW and are experts at the same time.
tbf in there was probably the most top secret stuff that he could get no real info on. Amazing he got as much as he did.
@@Echowhiskeyone An officer onboard a warship main job is to sign off on every bodies leave, they live in the Wardroom drinking tea and coffee whilst the enlisted men did all the shitty jobs operating the equipment.
There is a mod that puts in VLS Tico's with 100 target channels. Makes this scenario alot better but for red storm rising you did great. I had the same results. Would be interesting to see if the F-14's stayed on station. I had decent luck getting the phoneix Anti air missiles thinning the herd on the missiles.
Great work Cap, my favourite part of one of my favourite books!
I think this would be a scenario that only an advanced player should really be trying to take on.
That might be the worst lag I ever saw. I am afraid that it was so bad the defending Fleet was incapable of even defending itself
Cap, I am enjoying these early explorations of the game. I love that you jump in at the deep end! Everybody learns faster that way.
YES! I've been waiting for this since you started playing Sea Power!
Hey Cap, really enjoying these Sea Powers videos. More please.
What did you enjoy about that? The lag?
A Fistful of Vampires. I was hoping for a Sea Power version of this!
Awesome video Cap! Thanks for putting it together for us.
Cap broke the AI it's the only explanation for how that many missile ships only shot down a couple dozen incoming vampires.
I noticed the carriers didn't even shoot back at all. 😂
The carriers very much did shoot back if you actually paid attention.
@@adamtruong1759 bro this was like a 1970s slideshow he probably had a seizure and can be forgiven for not "paying attention"
Nice to see a
Spruance. I served on DD-971.
Lived in Philly until seven years ago. We had so many of the SpruCans there along with plenty of Figs. Ended up as a visitor on Moosbrugger twice. I always thought the Sprucans had more life and were great as Strike Destroyers with the VLS and the two 5inch guns.
Interestingly, the missile interception rate seems rather low for 5 "AEGIS cruisers" even with the Mk. 26 launchers. Tico in the book managed to intercept around 65% of the missiles (which according to some is quite low in itself).
Also, within the Dance of the Vampires chapter, it states that there are "French ships" in the fleet. Not that you can add them because they're currently not in-game, but I felt like you should know.
Edit: There also aren't 3 LHAs in the fleet, there's one Tarawa LHA (USS Saipan), one Newport LST (USS Newport), and one Austin LPD (USS Ponce).
I can say that AEGIS and SLQ-32 of the time were capable of much better than shown here today. With all the upgrades, AEGIS and the SLQ-32 are still among the best in the world and have been for near 40 years.
Indeed French ships are often forgot when talking about this masterpiece that “Dance of the vampires” is ! Clancy clearly mentionned the Foch, a carrier quite comparable to an Essex-class if we’re looking at something similar in the USN, but not quite a lot regarding other ships.
But we can speculate that at the time in the mid-80s, the french part of the Task Force would include a few T-47s ( both ASW and AAW variants ), a Suffren-Class DDG, a Georges Leygues class ASW DD and if they were lucky the Colbert AAW cruiser.
I’m really looking forward for that potential French/European DLC the devs mentioned, first for this scenario but also because the Marine National does have quite a lot of interesting designs, not even close to US ships in terms of capabilities, but still a respectable size able to engage its own task force
I would say that this video was laughable. It might have been the lag but my Lord, did they even shoot down 30 missiles between them?
This game is basically in a early beta state
@@IR0CZ2857 it is and says it pretty clearly on the steam page.
@@SpaceShipDee they just launched the game for 47 dollars and you're telling me it's a beta?
Does it come with a free Sig? 🤣
That lag was totally overwhelming
That was great to sea cap, currently going through the Seapower scenarios, running a groupo is hard and has a lot to learn to optimise the attack and defense. This was impressive to watch!
Another classic scenario I ran in Harpoon on my Amiga with dos emulator. Yep...I am old 😅
In the book The Fleet's Aegis cruiser opened up at almost 100 miles, Tico had time to empty its entire magazine. In this scenario it looked like the ticos fired at about 20 miles.
I think it was 90 Mi but you're right, in this scenario they opened up at 1/3 that range.
I'm wondering if Clancy knew somethings the game designers did not. I seem to recall hearing that Clancy war gamed the situation. But the question is how.
Ticos should have also emptied their magazines in 2 and a half minutes (each type 26 launcher could fire 2 missiles ever 9 seconds, and with AEGIS the terminal guidance bottleneck was eliminated)
It seemed there were a lot more misses than I'd expect as well. Something in the way the AI is handling the Aegis just feels a bit off unfortunately. Hopefully future patches improve that.
@@nathand.9969 in this game these are apparently block 1 sm2, in the book Clancy was probably modeling block ll which had much longer range
I enjoyed this, SC! Thanks!
Thanks
Please consider releasing your marvellous work of this scenario for Sea Power for us to also admire the genius of Tom Clancy and your effort to bring this to life, thanks for such a great video 10/10
Interesting how many you could have sunk if you'd only fired salvos of 4 missiles at each target and spread 'em around to more targets. Great sim as always Cap and GR team.
Spectacular. Well done, Cao!
Great video, thanks for your time and huge effort 👍👍
I just started re-reading this book on Monday.
I think I might join you.
this seems like the USN didn't fire anything to counter, seems busted but thanks for putting it together
I like the book's description of the Crusaders: Good birds, short legs. Range for this kind of battle was very important. Clancy dispelled any "Good old WW2 naval battle" from modern warfare with this book.
Great video. Thanks you for all the time and effort put into the videos
Well, that was a suitably large amount of boom-boom. Thanks, Cap.
I sure hope they add F-8's to both US and French roster!
Awesome choice! I’d watch a whole Tom Clancy series
Lack of crusader seems like a big gaping hole in sea power.
Agreed
a lot of the code is lifted from other killerfish games, which are famous for being buggy unfinished pieces of shit
@@BrettonianKnightit is a completely new code base. The developer at Triassic who worked for Killerfish was not the lead programmer, he was lead designer. Completely different coding engine.
that spot near africa is geo location 0,0 (greenwich/equator) which means an item has no or unknown geo coordinates
God-amu cap.....found this for 25 quid and bought it...its a good fill in while I'm moving my dcs room about
Damm cap, that was a Huge amount of boom splashy boom boom!
Always important.
I love this channel, keep it up!
Well done, interesting how you compare and contrast two similar but different simulators with markedly different outcomes. Seemed to me like the PK for the anti-ship missiles was very high! Hard to tell why the air defenses weren't as effective.
Is there a way in Sea Power to draw a circle or other shape around a group of targets to declare all of them hostile (or not) rather than tediously selecting each of them individually?
Not than I know of but I'm happy to be corrected.
awww , i feel like i need to join in with the bots ... the message is so positive and wholesome
"Your channel is a place where I can always relax and enjoy great humor. Keep up your hilarious videos!🐈🎯🥀"
I agree with the bots , thanks Cap and GR
What a book this was! Those Backfires should be on afterburner when launching! You can't be a Backfire without having some fire out the back!
Non maneuvering missiles the size of a semi tractor-trailer and the fleet managed what, a 15% intercept rate?
Lol, my money is staying in my pocket
What if i told you intercepting missiles in the 80s isnt what it is today
@@lolmao500he’s not even wrong
@@lolmao500 I would tell you that the Aegis cruiser scored a significantly higher % than what we saw in this scenario in testing vs large un-maneuvering supersonic drones.
In Red Storm rising Ticonderoga scored a 65% hit rate in this exact scenario, and opened fire at such a range as to be able to empty it's entire magazine of 96 missiles before the first vampire reached the fleet.
Aegis was specifically designed for this scenario.
@@lolmao500 so you think five Ticonderogas would only shoot down a couple dozen missiles?
@@SgtTechComIf there existed enough SM2MRs to arm the entire CBG, and the other CBGs. There are also targeting radar limitations. If you use less capable missiles the engagement range shrinks.
The way to simulate the decoy Kelts would be to have actual Badgers armed with very short range ASMs attempt to attack the convoy.
Yeah that really wouldn't work either because you would be bringing the bombers within range of the F-14 which would just get slaughtered. There's a reason they fired standoff decoys. Hopefully they get put into the game soon but yeah😂
@Wyomingchief the f14s would think they're real Badgers (which they are!), as per the book
You can't draw a box around all the units at once? whose idea was that?
27:50 Look at that! Someone put a missile launcher on Null Island! 😂
Red Storm Rising was SUCH a great book!
I remember hearing Clancy and a friend did most of the battles in the book on a game called Harpoon to make sure they were realistic. I can only imagine what kind of field day he'd have with Sea Power. Especially once we get modernized equipment options.
Wouldn't be hard to see a modern setting version of "Red Storm Rising" except for it being a China/Taiwan and the Asiatic area in play.
Good recreation of the story. The thing the author did not know at the time, a dummy warhead takes up almost the same room and weight as a live warhead. Most nations have since stopped making them for this reason and just make more live warheads. Dummy warheads are now primarily used in target shooting, gunnary practice, exercises, etc.
Well, one thing I like is that Sea Power provides a chance for payback, and as we all know Payback is a MFer! ;-) Unlike in the book, the Soviet planes really took it on the chin in revenge. However I don't recall the entire task force getting wiped out in the book, just a good chunk of it. Nonetheless, excellent recreation Cap! Well done!
If I remember correctly, in the book a Sqn or so of F15s armed with AIM9s and tanks were deploying to Europe and stumbled into one of the Soviet Raids after the Soviets fired their anti ship missles?
Yeah, and Bunz did real good.
1 Sidewinder and 3 ferry tanks.
Much like in wolf packs version of the scenario, AI for the defending Fleet is terrible
Nicely done cap
One thing isn't modeled very well in this game. The Soviet tactical use of nukes. Missile saturation attack? Nuke'em with nuclear SAM's. Don't know where the sub is exactly? Lob a nuke in the general direction. The N in the SS-N-22, etc? Nuclear. I expect that to be included once it gets closer to done (in particular appropriate explosions). This is not as relevant to this episode as some of the previous ones, but I did notice Mr. Grim replacing non-nuclear missiles with nuclear ones and assumign they're 'roughly the same'. :)
Well done Cap
F-YES!!!! It also seems the Nimitz's CWIS also went into reset mode and did not engage any targets. Was this the chapter that Buns Nakamura and her AF ferry flight splashed the bears?
The Badgers yes that's the chapter.
The CIWS had two vampires inbound and reset, causing the Carrier to get hit.
The radar planes weren’t AWACS but were carrier-launched E-3A Hawkeyes. The Kelt missiles were configured to look like bombers on radar. The Tomcats thought they were shooting at planes, not missiles.
The Navy AWACS is the E-2 Hawkeye, and it is a slightly less capable version of the ground based E-3 Sentry. It is most definitely an Airborne Warning And Control plane, and has been since 1964, when it replaced the E-1 Tracer.
@@structured_anarchist AWACS is a specific thing, the E-3 Sentry IS AWACS, nothing else is. The general term is AEW&C. But, everyone is familiar with AWACS and calls every plane in that class AWACS just like all tissues are Kleenex.
Thanks
Thanks
That was a really impressive slideshow
Gonna need a 9800X3D + RTX5090 and 96gb of ddr5-9600!
@@lolmao500or a cray supercomputer
Awesome, more sea power please!!!
41:55 RIP the friendly F4
oof
Wow! Thank you!
Good luck, fair skies, and God bless you! Romans 10:9-10
For both sides in this battle, the primary targets are the carriers, LHAs and support ships. Sinking escorts is okay if you're mounting a follow-up raid.
As this game gets patched more and more it will really start to be monster sim, as even in pre-release it advanced in huge strides in a short time. Sadly I can't run it on my cruddy old PC lol, so I'll have to keep watching Cap and Co slugging it out with the bad guys.
Sea power seems like the old HARPOON game
Not the same without the Michael Prichard narration.
"My god, the lag," griped Toland.
@@M7A1bayonet 😁
@@M7A1bayonet 😀
@@M7A1bayonetlol
5 Aegis Cruisers and they shot down what, 20 Missiles combined?
I don't know if it's the lag or what, but this was just awful. Not only that, but the unit selection process is terrible
Yeah, it does help when you write the script.
Forgot to turn on chaff?
Looks like most of the units didn't even fire their phalanx, I didn't see any of the sea sparrows fire. Look like the first ship that was hit never even fired chaff.
I wonder if it's from the absolutely horrible lag or if the AI is just that bad.
The first ship very much fired chaff, Sea Sparrows were fired, 2 of the ships didn't fire CIWS.
@@adamtruong1759 I didn't see any of what you're saying either, do you know which slides depicted that?
@@RubyRidgeWaco Should be the first ship seen about to be hot by missiles.
@@adamtruong1759 it would be interesting to see this video run again without all the auxiliary and non-combatant ships and without the ships that don't have any significant air defense. I have a feeling that the processor being so overwhelmed completely tanked the performance of the defending Fleet
I'm still waiting for a movie adaptation.
With modern CGI I think they can finally do this.
@grimreapers Yes! With the end of the Cold War, this became irrelevant to film movie wise, but with what's happening in Europe nowadays, I think it's high time they make one. If it becomes a box office hit and i know it will given the right screen writer, director, and cast, then they can make another movie for The Bear and the Dragon.
1 min ago is crazy
I hope they give the option for the nuke version of the Kitchen missile
Loved that PC game back in the late 80
You’d think people would have learned from DCS with plunking down cash for an early release product. Some modules in DCS have been waiting for YEARS to go full release and it STILL hasn’t happened.
I agree this game is so far from ready I can't believe anyone would buy it right now
Well first of all cap didn't put any money down this was a pre-release that he was given to test out and such. Don't believe it's even for sale yet on steam or anything else.
EDIT okay my mistake it was released yesterday. Either way cap didn't pay for this. But then again if you don't like it so much why are you watching? LOL
I find it absolutely hilarious all the absolute negative acting soy boys in the comment section complaining about the simulation, and or the way it was carried out.. I must not be as bad as people think because they keep watching😂😂
You can't draw a box around all your units with your mouse?
Not that I know of.
The USN thought the northern Kelts launched by the Badgers were Badgers
Sea power eats VRAM like an anxious chubby teenager with a eating disorder eats chocolate 😂
badgers and backfires and kelts oh my...
Great book!
The Crusader didn't have medium range missiles like the Phantom. Probably wouldn't have caught the Tu-22's. It's a surprising omission from the game given how long it was in service with the USN and much it was used in the Vietnam war? Wonder if there's a big load of assets to come in an update?
The Corsair is a subsonic fighter with Sidewinders and guns, so using a Supersonic F4 with Sparrows and Sidewinders instead really wasn't all that accurate. In the book the Corsairs intercepted inbound missiles but were unable to catch up to the supersonic Backfires because they didn't have the range to do that. The Backfires were detected by a ferry flight of F15s, not by AWACS, and the F15s took down a few of the Backfires with their sidewinders, but were unable to do much more than that due to it being a Ferry flight not a combat patrol. The F14s didn't catch any of the Badgers because they immediately turned north as soon as they had dropped their Kelts. The F14s used all their missiles on the Kelts and didn't realize that the Kelts were decoys until just before Raid 2 (Backfires) were detected by the F15s. At that point they were too far out of position to do anything about the Backfires.
I suspect Sea Power is a little generous with the power of the ASM's, given how hard it was to sink the USS America in 2005. It took four weeks of pounding and they ended up sending a team aboard to scuttle her.
@@connorwgtn well that is true, America also did not have any fuel or Ordnance aboard.
I don't think the any ship missiles are overpowered I think the fleet defense is completely broken.
Or it was the lag... either way it was pathetic
The video looked all washed out!
Scared the crap out of me! I thought my monitor was on its way out...
Massive battleship guns only deathmatch!!!!
Its almost like wolfpack345 already created this scenario, hmmmm 🤔
Honestly, Wolfpack's scenario was the "budget" version with only 5 ships
Much of the naval action in the book was war gamed using Larry Bonds Harpoon Rules Set.
Can you do and save scenarios in the game that you can share?? It would be great for the community.
Can try but I'm on a different version so doubt it will load.
I like to read Tom Clancy as i'm a bit of a geek, but I do get annoyed at the bias in his work. But he obviously knows his market and should cater for that, can't blame him.
At the time period Red Storm Rising was written he was relatively (yeah, it does some heavy lifting here) even handed. After the Soviet Union went away he went completely bonkers and his books became somewhat boring, given that the US just rolled over everyone who dared to look at it in the wrong way. And lest we forget that Larry Bond co-wrote much of RSR.
Could you imagine the controllers on the ships seeing That many missiles coming at them?😬
I can see a few major issues with that game; in real life you can obviously classify incoming flights as hostile no matter where they come in from, forcing the commander to do that job as well seems like an oversight in my book.
If this video was meant to Showcase this game I am afraid it had the exact opposite effect. I am a solid no on sea power. The unit selection is completely tedious, and the lag was terrible
Wolfpack345 has also done this video, and it shows seapower off very well.
@@nicolivoldkif9096 the AI in that video was terrible as well
it`s early access. DCS has gotten a lot better performance over time. There is hope. After all, without the DCS`s fps simulation and multiplayer aspect in there it should have less to do.
Sea Power in theory should be more meant to run battles like this than dcs.
@@andreasmeier-v4k I hope and agree that it will probably get better but I'm not paying retail price for an early beta game.
@@RubyRidgeWaco fair enough. It`s quite pricey. But i`d say Cap level of battles are also probably a edge case.
Clancy gave the Soviets credit for being able to come up with good, deceptive tactics. This built on their coupe' at Iceland --- the LHA was there because the Russians beat them to Iceland, NOT because they were going to invade. Caught flat-footed, the Task Force was loitering around while people thousands of miles away dithered about what to do next.... always a bad idea.
The simple fact that you cannot draw a box around your units makes this game a hard no for me
Does Sea Power have an equivalent to DCS Tacview so we can see the final results (in places we were not watching)?
Can we expect to see some of the submarine battles from the book as well?
Will do later.
Sounds good. I hope the "game" gets its bugs worked out and more types of units and weapons are modeled. It will be cool to have something that we could actually use to visualize all these iconic battles from fiction as well as the recreation of real world events.