How to Raise the Stakes in Comics Again - Elseworlds Exchange
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- Опубликовано: 19 окт 2024
- Sal and Joel discuss the idea of stakes in comics; recalling pivotal moments, and see if we can return to those days again. #comicbooks #comicpop #ElseworldsExchange
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Sal said stakes are dead but we all know nothing stays dead in comic books
Yeah I was really surprised when it turned out that this chubby neckbeard smuglorde is a le intellectual authority on cooked meat compared to the 'places he orders them from' ha ha subhuman fucking asswipe manbaby
@@misombra huh?
@@misombra you talk like on of em virgin redditors
I really felt the stakes were high towards the end of Geoff John's Green Lantern run. When Hal essentially killed himself to become a black lantern and raised Nekron?!!! I was at the edge of my seat and couldn't believe how big he went out in his finale.
I think that Cap Hydra thing was so impactful because it destroyed his archetype in a mythological sense. He was always an aspirational hero, the type other motivational heroes look towards for guidance in a moral sense. They were close to breaking it before, but the Hydra thing literally broke something in the character. Until that Hydra thing becomes a silly side note almost no one remembers, it'll be hard to get Cap back to what he was. Some would argue it's impossible. It's like a paladin that betrayed his oaths in fantasy fiction. There's rarely going back from that.
That's likely why Superman (actually) going bad is always in alternate universes or in fiction inspired by the Superman character. It would fundamentally break something in the character.
Also to distinguish the terms to the best of my ability: Motivational character need an inciting incident to become heroes (standard example Spiderman). Aspirational heroes are simply what they are, it is an innate thing and they are a possible moral foundation for others to look towards. Note this doesn't mean aspirational heroes are always good guys, I know Conan is considered aspirational and he's not exactly... virtuous.
This is my favorite podcast with Joel on it on ComicPop.
11:04 Wally West, Rebirth, Dick Grayson, Superman....the list goes on. I wouldn't be surprised when Roy comes back to life, he'll start doing drugs again. Or they bring back his daughter and they kill her off even worse than before.
The way Marvel handled Secret Wars still disappoints me. First time Marvel does anything resembling a crisis and the outcome is that everything stays the same. I still consider the story perfect, I just wish Marvel writers/editorial actually used it as an opportunity to do a reboot or make some drastic changes.
DM0M0 I agree secret wars could have worked and personally in my opinion I wished Marvel comics pulled the trigger and actually did there actual reboot and didn’t chicken out.
Gotta say, my favorite moment in recent memory is Living Lightning's Poker Bluff. If only because it is the most not-intentional Jojo reference that has ever Jojo referenced.
The deep, deep interview with Scoot Snyder seems to have really impacted Sal. Probably for the better. ;) Got me thinking about my own behaviour.
I feel like to have stakes you need to know where your story is going and how it ends. Geoff Johns had a great bulid towards Blackest Night all through his GL run, but the ending for me at least doesn't quite stick the landing.
Wait, Samuel L. Jackson is 70? Damn! I knew he's been around for a long time but I didn't think he was that old...
Speaking of “too much stakes cuz everyone dies”, Terra Formars.
Personally I think stakes in comics can comeback if they are actually done right
I would love for a story to kill off a character and everyone just expects that character to come back in a few years. Cut to like 7 years later and they're still gone.
that's actually not a bad idea
I'm sure fans of whichever character would hate but I feel like idea of stakes returning would slowly set in. Minor character dies this year and is never brought back. The outcome of Doomsday Clock or whatever Snyder is cooking up changes the DC universe . . for the last time. Stuff like that.
DM0M0 personally if they do kill off a minor character it has to feel earned not forced like killing off Wally west flash for no damn reason just for bullshit now killing off a minor character that’s fine if it’s done right and like you said if the outcome of doomsday clock or whatever Snyder is cooking up changes for the dc universe does work out great then awesome for the last time.
Oh, I agree. I like seeing well-written "heroic" sacrifices. Or deaths that affect the story and isn't just used for shock value. I just want things to stick in comics. When Marvel says, "The Marvel universe will never be the same again," I want to actually feel that. I haven't even been reading that long and I'm already annoyed of comics being cyclical, repetitive tropes and status quos.
Audio sounds really good
The most comic stake that I thought would last because I just got started was superior Spider-Man and cyclops becoming most wanted cause of AVX. And new 52s Throne of Atlantis
I think some problem has to do with fans as well. No one really like it when someone messes with their favorite but not everyone is willing to go and see how it works with said change. Which is werid cause we have seen popular books like Black mirror and superior Spiderman do well with their cast being "dead". But I think it's always to be finite as people want their favorites come back eventually.
the mind fuck of seeing this after the Synder interview.
Always been with you on the Fuck Tom King Train, Sal! (minus The Vision)
Yooo Tron Legacy is dope super underrated
I started this out at 0.75x speed and it sounded like you guys were stoned af lol
Though I wasn't a fan of the movie and haven't read the source material, the recent success of Alita, Battle Angel provides one route out of the darkness: Heroic fantasies featuring characters bearing superhuman abilities who aren't also nigh invulnerable(Wolverine, Superman, if rumor is to be believed, Captain Marvel), aren't plaster saints who've forsaken any semblance of a regular life for the sake of saving the world are not only possible but lucrative. And yes, do more than avoid dragging story arcs out for decades; fucking end series themselves from time to time, or at the very least give them breaks from time to time
5:34
That moment when Sal offically becomes the comic book nerd from The Simpsons.
Hey! I was the fourth tshirt superman fan. I saw him go. Still don't know if i felt any way about it
The real stakes in comics are the likelihood of the comic being canceled if it doesn't do well. You have a really good book that is intriguing and cool? Well you better hope thousands of others agree and continue to buy that book or else it's dead.
Sal you watch the Orville too!?! Sweet
Their relationship may be what's clickbaiting the headlines, but really Halston Sage (Alara Kitan) is off doing a movie. Jessica Szohr (Talla Keyali) is a placeholder until she's done and comes back.
Secret Wars 2015 should have ended with a Crisis-like reboot for Marvel IMO, since their continuity is such a vast mess right now lol
Random question
Where is warpath? The X men OP Native American
I always wanted professor X to walk again
Mmmm steaks 😂
Doomsday clock
I'll always prefer my steak well done, medium rare/rare is too chewy for my tastes.
Then you don't like steak.
@@comicpop That's what you think.
I’m so sick of Joel talking about Ms Marvel. I feel like he brings her up every week.
The Protector should come back as a Titans villain.