Just a suggestion. Diagnostics by replacing parts is time consuming and expensive in time/cost. Tracing signals (with a multi-meter) is faster/easier. I am always astonished to see precision machines so poorly maintained. There is an old saying, if you don't schedule maintenance for a machine, it will schedule maintenance for you!
Depends on, if you have spares from another machine it is way easier, specially for computer parts. Do you want to chase a DDR ram with a multimeter or just swap it from another PC? If you have to order CNC parts just on suspicion you are doomed 🙂
@@timogross8191he's talking about a servo motor that has a couple of power and signal wires. Test to see if power is getting to the motor and also test to ensure you've got continuity to work out if the wiring is sound from end to end. Ram is a completely different type of part with hundreds of connections.
As somebody that worked in a welding shop that also had a machine shop. We put things on the machine to keep track of productivity parts etc etc. at the end of the day that is a tool for a job they are not show pieces. Your small shop doing small numbers it might be a showpiece. Big shops doing thousands and thousands of pieces they just needed to work and do its job.
I work with a similar machine on a day-to-day basis for serial production work. Writing on it with markers would be a no-no for me, however, we do have a whiteboard hanging on the machine, with whiteboard markers. Absolutely essential to keep your head on straight while doing setup changes.
EXCELLENT FREAKING VIDEO!!!! Thank you for reviving an oldie but a goodie. So many people today don't even attempt to fix broken machines. You stuck with it and figured out the problem.
Thanks for the support man! Yeah, I believe you can do modern machining with a lot of older machines if you just figure out how to communicate with them correctly
Man, so jealous of such a find. For the amount of time and money you've invested, you still came off with a very functional system that's worth many times what you invested in it. Hope it gives you many years of quality service!
The pulley is a taper-lock style. You separate the tapered center by removing both grub screws and then using one of the grub screws in the hole that was not previously filled. This should force the tapers apart. It should be a 2 minute job, very little force required. Great video, love your attention to detail. Nice to see old iron still working
Work smarter, not harder. I’m sure everyone’s aware having the right tools for the job makes all the difference. I commend you on all your efforts though. I hope it makes tons of chips for you. I was always so sad to see just how little my still working CNC machines were worth when we bought new ones to replace. Look how much a true Bridgeport holds its value. BTW what’s your secret sauce ? Or will you keep it a secrete 😂. One tip for you maybe you’ll find good. For really hard stuff to break loose. 50% of each, ATF and Acetone . Works!
I'm a lead machinist for a large company we machine ceramic for processors . Rip the controllers out and go with Mach3 /4 . I uses a fadal / hass post processor. Controlers are cheap and all over . I've personally done it and it's really easy . That would save you money in the long run. It's able to expand with your machine with as many axis as you need.
That secret sauce is basically caustic soda, aka lye or sodium hydroxide. Does a wonderful job! Good to see the machine worked out without needing to be ripped out and modernised. Glad you figured out the Taperlock fitting - the third hole is the key to getting it off!
FYI those are not servo motors. They are just Bodine AC gearmotors. Bodine uses those really nice aluminum frames that makes them look like servos but you don't control servos with relays and servos have feedback devices. Encoders, resolvers, tachometers, if none of that is present it's not a servo
The most difficult part of running these old machines is getting code into the controller. They have limited onboard memory, and drip feeding them code is slow.
Taper-Lock is one of the easiest system's to remove pulley's. Use the screws in the other holes to loosen the pulley and you may need to hammer a flathead screwdriver in the slot. Now you can just slide it off. Assembly in reverse, once you have it out, take a look at how it works. This system can even be used if the seat it rests on is evenly worn out.
Also , in the same box as the spindle drive is a transformer with multiple taps ,, the output voltage has to be set correctly because the control has a regulated power supply but the servos don't ... What can happen is that difference in voltage can cause random estop/errors ,,, the instructions for doing that are on the first few pages of the manual ....
@@prestigemanufacturingky It did it for months , even after we paid fadal techs to fly in from Cali ,,, they replaced the servo amplifiers ... still did it ,,,, turns out the 480 would sometimes creep up to 505 ...
The schmoo is just dried up coolant, hot water with a weak coolant mixture also works great at softening it up and removing it without the chance of rusting parts. And no danger to any aluminum parts.
If you want to get rid of that makeshift whiteboard soak up the taped area and removed edge of the whiteboard in goo-gone(that should remove all the adhesive from the tape and possibly some of the whiteboard without affecting the paint. After that a plastic wedge like used for taking apart iphones and tablets and a heatgun can remove the rest(then re-apply the goo-gone to remove the remaining adhesive) It looks like you got an amazing score on that machine even if you have to put a bit into it
Purple power will clean it right up especially with hot water, and pressure. Abouta gallon of evaporust setup to contentiously spray over all the bare metal. Will have it looking like it's atleast 1999, if not new.. the pressure from purple power being sprayed on the gunk will leave it clean. Just a fine spray to wet it, after it's wet, go over it again and re wet it and spray it off, WD-40 will work good for the metal bits it is a water displacer. A scotch Brite and WD will do wonders..
when the carousel wont move forward, its usually chips in the guidways or the bracket on the back is broken. Take the bracket off and see if you can push the whole assembly forward. Spend $100 and replace all the lube meters, Fadals are notorious for breaking the lube line to the rear X axis way. Make new way wipers, Turcite works well for this. Some one probably stepped on the Y axis way cover and bent the L shaped brackets that bolt to the saddle, bend them back. You got a deal, cnc machines are cheap if you have the skill to repair them.Most Fadal parts can be gotten from Mcmaster Carr..only thing proprietary are the castings and control board. Easy to run machines.
I moved it by hand off camera after and it moved really good. I’m down to it being a short in the wire harness because the motor will move then blow a fuse. It he’s to be a wire rubbing and grounding
Make sure the lube system is working before you go too far and that oil is getting to the ways. The metering units and tubes often clog up. The turcite will wear and the accuracy will be compromised. Be warned I used to service this machines.
We have a Fadal 4020 at my work and it's an absolute lemon. No one likes running that machine. It holds mediocre tolerances and is slow AF. In order for it to make an almost acceptable part you must, before hitting the start button, have at least 2 out of the 9 planets in the solar system aligned with the sun (yes Pluto is still a planet), say a prayer of dedication to Cthulhu promising your first born as a sacrifice, and only after that do you have a voodoo shaman perform a ceremonial dance around the machine. If all these things are acceptable to the 4020, it will hold plus or minus .005 tolerance and might interpolate a concentric hole but only if its feeling generous, for it is a resentful god....
See the mechanical type touch static sensitive electronics with stating generating gloves. And then he will expect his suppliers to honour their warranty.
The fadals are tanks. We still use an 3016 1989/90 daily. And for quick jobs and setup it’s great. They are slow in comparison so production with allot of tools we have better options.
When I worked at a CNC facility grabbed a spray bottle and got some of the parts washer concentrate. Stuff always took the grime off my machines and didn't have to sit. Just spray and the sit time is how long it takes you to grab a rag or aim (if the machine has it) a coolant hose for washing parts off. When I first started working there only the akumas were clean, all the muratec, wasinos, index, and doosans were caked as bad or worse then what that machine you got is.
That machine got lucky to get you as an owner. I'm the same way about nor marking up machines and treating them right but with electronic test equipment.
They are taper lock bushes in them pulley. Loosen the grub screws and take out then place one of them in the hole between where you pulled them from. That forces the taper bush out the pulley and allows you to pull them off by hand.
I know nothing about CNC myself. I bought one of them cheap desktop cnc just to learn. I honestly think with a little work and parts. This would be a great CNC system. Even at that price I saw them used for 10s of thousands. Even new they are costly. Congrats on the great Buy.
Liked and subscribed! Man what a pure joy to watch! You say you're not a CNC machine mechanic, but boy you know your stuff. I've always dreamed to find a machine center like this on the cheap because it doesn't run, so it was much fun and joyful to see you going through this process and your steps and thoughtprocess to fix it. Thoroughly loved the video, thanks!
Great video - I did something similar with a 30year old 850 machine with a Mitsubishi controller . Took a few new servo drives and a bit of TLC to get her running but it was a very interesting project indeed - my first CNC . Watching your video I can't help thinking the Z axis is not retracting high enough to allow the carousel to move in so maybe the tool change height (G30 on my machine ) needs to be checked . I envy the large dry space you have !
Nice job, buddy of mine just bought a 2008 VF3. It needed some love too. The spindle allegedly wouldn’t go into high gear. I found in the settings the low speed change gear was at like 5000rpm. Looking forward to seeing more of your videos.
Prolly a little late and you figured this out by now. But that pulley is called a " taper lock " You remove the bolts that force the two halfs together and then thread those bolts into the vaccant holes. This will then press it apart.
Once we had a neglected machine that sat for 2 years no one drained the coolant or anything. When we finally opened the door it smelled like a dead body🫨🤣
I paid $3500 for a Hyundai KH63G with twin pallet changers because there was a typo on the auction listing. Said the machine had 18,000 cutting hours instead of power on. Machine actually only had 938 cutting hours. Sold the machine for $95k. Rigging to my shop was 11k lol. My biggest financial win to date at once.
The tool turret shouldn't move or turn unless the z-axis has moved up to the tool change position. I got my Fadal 4020HT in 1989. Run it almost every day.
Ive done a lot of repairs on fadal 4020s when i worked at a machine shop about 4 yrs ago. Thats not a horrible machine, but they do break down quite often if you run then 24/7.
I like em but I'd have to agree Fadal and Haas's are not truly production machining centers. That said, I prefer much of their simpler systems and flexibility that are quite useful in job shop situations.
Put a laminate like 3m stone guard on the lexan to protect from scratches etc. the flexible layer makes it very difficult to scratch, and you just peel and replace if it does.
@@prestigemanufacturingky i used it for a counter top in a shop initially that every customer put their keys on. the polycarbonate survived so well it is my go to.
There's a great big lead counterweight in the back , inside the z axis ,,, if it wasn't pinned during transport it can get long enough to break one of the coolant fittings during a tool change .... we had to remove ours from the machine and drop it (the weight} on the ground several times with a forklift ....
The side comparison with the cleaners is hilarious. One side you stick the gun directly to the wall, then the side you did spray, you keep a foot off the wall
Took myself a gamble too on a Emco 300vmc couple of years back. It’s much nicer looking machine from University. Hardly used and just had one bad solder on spindle drive. Took two weeks to findit. Youcan get that grime off by spraying fresh coolant mix on it and letting it soak for a bit then just wiping it off. I really don’t understand the people who want to work with a messy machine, I always kept my machines clean, even when working in a machine shop.
Please clean the lube resivor and change the Bijur felt filter in the lube pump intake. Blow out all lube lines and Change all the Bijur metering orfices. Do this so you do not wear out a box way as there is no feedback that 1 piece of the machine is not lubed until there is damage. I have never drip fed a FADAL but at toolshows in the 90's the FADALS were always making lots of noise or were doing crazy profiling by drip feeding the program. Do a 45' test as the older DC motor machines were great but the Harlow resolvers had super small bearings would get worn out. Then the core of the resolver bounces arround making bad finishes. Resolvers just degrade Encoders FAIL.
I have the same machine and I am doing the same. Got it used and fixing it up. I tried a lot of different cleaners and found that engine degreaser worked great. I am going to try your special sauce that is mentioned in the description to this video! I would be very interested if you ever change the turcite on your machine. That is what I need to do to mine. I am getting the spindle rebuilt too. I want mine rebuit and not a imported off the shelf replacement.
Get some aviation paint stripper for the front of the cross-slide and the pan base, use a putty knife, mask it off and shoot it with some epoxy paint. Look forward to your next installment building new way covers (spot weld).
@@prestigemanufacturingky Here is a quick clip of Jason applying the stripper to aluminum ailerons. ruclips.net/video/c40_lnrXo2A/видео.htmlsi=6rVMFygEKJ_3U0rB&t=1274
Dayum, nice score! With a machine of this age and condition, I completely expect it to not be fully functional, but x y z and spindle working? That’s already plenty good! The rest are things that can be repaired and restored after the fact, or at least I would think, if I had other machines to make parts with.
I am building a full workshop here in South Africa on any old Machines ....you need to take time fixing the machine before you can assume the machine is ready , avoid repairing old electronics they will make you sick rather invest in new electronic control , remember steel doesn't rot only wears and can be easily be fixed and if fixed properly will last years and years .
The way cover is probably missing due to a cronic failure somewhere in that axis. Someeon got sick of removing it and putting it back on. Ball screw or end block bearings probably keep getting wiped out or possibly greese system fittings plugging up inside there. God Im glad I dont service machine tools anymore.
Did they make custom covers that go over the ways and ball screw?? Im wondering if that is why the stock covers are gone. They might of damaged them or they wore out and come up with those covers instead. Way covers are very expensive to have them made especially custom made one offs. But the stock covers I would imagine are still important as they are the barier from coolant leaking out of the machine. Unless this brand is sealed off under them somehow., I used to be feild service tech for Cambell Grinder Co.
I hope I will never ever have to use the secret sauce to clean a machine that way - but it's good to know it exists. I always wash down my machine at the end of the day and brush any excess chips out the next morning when it's all dry and I keep a clean cloth nearby during the day to keep the outside clean too. But I do draw on my machine using markers The windows are a kind of bullet proof glass and I write notes on there with chalk markers to remind me of things to do when running a job or where to continue the next day. Some windex will wipe the chalk off and clean the windows again.
I hope you never have to use it to clean your machine too. When it gets to that point they are pretty bad. Thanks for the support. I really appreciate it.
Looks like the Calmotion was stripped out of it. The original Fadal boards are a core charge on a Calmotion setup, which is why they were missing. Nice job resurrecting it.
Nice job on the machine. It is great when you can rescue something from the junker and give it new life. One quick suggestion though.... I think you might want to be more careful with the pressure washer, especially around the electrical areas. It seems like you pressure washed the front panel and that isn't waterproof. At best, you probably introduced water that could corrode/rust contacts. At worst, you introduced water that could be conductive (as a function of other contamination in the water), which could then change behavior. It probably would have been a better idea to cover those items, pressure wash, and then hand clean them. The same is true with all of the servo components/encoders/etc, although those are more likely to have watertight gaskets (but are those in good condition). Anyhow, best of luck with your new machine. I hope it gives years of service.
I hope for Part 2.. A classic and amazing company, owner/founder, machine and history akin to Tormach. I wish more people were doing this and with even older machines, I would if I had the [banked retirement fund]..
the fact that you said you don't understand how people let a machine get this filthy and why the write on tthem is why you deserve this steal of a buy :)
I'm so envious I could piss myself. Currently building a cnc myself, and honestly, if it was $500 to get a table and running spindle only, I would get 50 of them
Honestly the tool holders you got are probably worth the $500 you spent on the machine. I totally tooled up a single machine at a new location and the cost of tooling can add up to a LOT more money than some folks would think it would. Coming from Industrial Maintenance background I would suggest you get into the habit now of LOTO the disconnect seen on the machine, and verifying zero voltage before you get into things. It is a good habit to form early. I kinda get that your solo but if somebody turns on the breaker while you have a hold of some 480VAC it will literally kill you on the spot :-(. If the disconnect does not work you can buy a breaker LOTO.
If you really did pick it up for $500. Re-deck a couple pairs of heads and make your money back. About everything' on it is removable in like 15minutes. Preamps, etc. At least you aren't reloading binary line by line. Could swap out the motherboard and switch to a touch screen with a later Windows OS.. WD40 will remove the sharpie on the controller. They're all pretty much reverse compatible. If I got into it, I would buy a used Late 90's 3015LXP LASER rather than buy these "new" plasma tables everyone marvels on about and clean the electrodes. Easiest maintenance. Just swap out the copper magnets and the head cartridge.
Damn underrated channel for sure. It would be really cool to see a quick 2 min video of everything working, but I can understand the last 5% of the video isnt really worth if you're busy, which in sure you are. Haha
I had the exact same machine. We updated the electronics and the controls. That thing was pretty damn fast after that. Also programmed a touch probe for it to speed things up
Every time I see a video like this i think of a saying my father used to say when I was a kid “ son if a man tries to sell you a Lamborghini for $500 and he says all it needs is a wheel nut would you believe him and purchase that ? Think about that before you believe any one trying to sell you something “
I actually find the cheaper stuff is often better as it's being sold by individuals who aren't motivated by money and generally want to see the machine go to a good home and not get scrapped. These days the money in every machine shop is in the real estate and not the old equipment.
As long as it ain't grindin' or leaking magic smoke, you got a chance. I'd think you'd be able to pressure wash the machining bay. The way those things spew coolant, it shouldn't hurt, but you have inside. Speaking of which, nice effing work space; don't tell me it's heated, or massive hate's gonna come your way. I have damn near enough tools & equipment to make that place crowded, strategically organized in the sq footage of a 2½ car garage. As much as you'd think It would ve, crowdedness isn't the worst problem; it's trying to get heat into all that cast iron & steel. Plus, the previous owners had turned it into living space & insulated like crazy; it's great in the summer, it only gets hot inside, if I leave the garage door open. But, fall, winter & early spring are brutal. Good luck w/ the resto; gonna be interesting to watch your progress.
Is the ‘sauce’ AC cleaner? One of our techs used AC cleaner to remove setup coolant. The bottom pan in the back corner got dented in and would pool and after time, kind of set up. He cleaned it out, and flattened it back to original position.
My secret sauce is Spray9, diluted 60%. Full strength takes the paint off. Trigger spray, sit a minute, wipe off. Layout dye remover for Sharpie or glue and tape residue. Nice score!
I know, It's kinda your stick... but if somebody in the audience would ever be able to purchase something like this for $500 and boy is money strapped: part it out. Every Servo with the controller cashes roughly $700. The Spindle is the Filet: at least $1500. likely more, based on the run-out and features. And that's less than 15% MSRP. The hydraulics, the cooling, the oiling system. The table, the controller, the boards. This is a treasure trove of opportunities. If something like this is under 2k, buy it as fast as you can. There's no way you won't at least tripple your money.
Just a suggestion. Diagnostics by replacing parts is time consuming and expensive in time/cost. Tracing signals (with a multi-meter) is faster/easier. I am always astonished to see precision machines so poorly maintained. There is an old saying, if you don't schedule maintenance for a machine, it will schedule maintenance for you!
💯
Depends on, if you have spares from another machine it is way easier, specially for computer parts. Do you want to chase a DDR ram with a multimeter or just swap it from another PC? If you have to order CNC parts just on suspicion you are doomed 🙂
@@timogross8191he's talking about a servo motor that has a couple of power and signal wires.
Test to see if power is getting to the motor and also test to ensure you've got continuity to work out if the wiring is sound from end to end.
Ram is a completely different type of part with hundreds of connections.
and when it does
it'll make sure you feel it in your pockets
Totally agree. As a plant manager for an aerospace company, I ALWAYS gave over the machine for preventative maintenance. I control the downtime
As somebody that worked in a welding shop that also had a machine shop. We put things on the machine to keep track of productivity parts etc etc. at the end of the day that is a tool for a job they are not show pieces. Your small shop doing small numbers it might be a showpiece. Big shops doing thousands and thousands of pieces they just needed to work and do its job.
I work with a similar machine on a day-to-day basis for serial production work. Writing on it with markers would be a no-no for me, however, we do have a whiteboard hanging on the machine, with whiteboard markers. Absolutely essential to keep your head on straight while doing setup changes.
I can absolutely see the benefit of a white board but writing directly on a machine is crazy to me
EXCELLENT FREAKING VIDEO!!!! Thank you for reviving an oldie but a goodie. So many people today don't even attempt to fix broken machines. You stuck with it and figured out the problem.
Thanks for the support man! Yeah, I believe you can do modern machining with a lot of older machines if you just figure out how to communicate with them correctly
Man, so jealous of such a find. For the amount of time and money you've invested, you still came off with a very functional system that's worth many times what you invested in it. Hope it gives you many years of quality service!
I don’t always get so lucky with machine 😆 Thanks for the support, I really appreciate it!
Jotun House wash(with the anti fungus stuff) it doesn't destroy the paint and cleans new and old machines like nothing else. Its also cheap.
I’ve never heard of it. I’m going to check it out for sure!
The pulley is a taper-lock style. You separate the tapered center by removing both grub screws and then using one of the grub screws in the hole that was not previously filled. This should force the tapers apart. It should be a 2 minute job, very little force required.
Great video, love your attention to detail. Nice to see old iron still working
Thanks. I eventually tried the grub screws and it all came apart.
Work smarter, not harder. I’m sure everyone’s aware having the right tools for the job makes all the difference. I commend you on all your efforts though. I hope it makes tons of chips for you. I was always so sad to see just how little my still working CNC machines were worth when we bought new ones to replace. Look how much a true Bridgeport holds its value. BTW what’s your secret sauce ? Or will you keep it a secrete 😂. One tip for you maybe you’ll find good. For really hard stuff to break loose. 50% of each, ATF and Acetone . Works!
@@Lwimmermastermetalart thanks for the support I really appreciate it. The secret sauce is actually in the video description 😁
@@prestigemanufacturingky ooops I guess I missed that. Have to go back. Are you making chips now? Hope so!
@@Lwimmermastermetalart actually a viewer bought the machine shortly after the video came out. I’m on the hunt for another deal now.
I'm a lead machinist for a large company we machine ceramic for processors .
Rip the controllers out and go with Mach3 /4 . I uses a fadal / hass post processor. Controlers are cheap and all over . I've personally done it and it's really easy . That would save you money in the long run. It's able to expand with your machine with as many axis as you need.
Thanks for the idea and support. I appreciate it 😀
That secret sauce is basically caustic soda, aka lye or sodium hydroxide. Does a wonderful job! Good to see the machine worked out without needing to be ripped out and modernised. Glad you figured out the Taperlock fitting - the third hole is the key to getting it off!
Thanks for checking out the video and support. I really appreciate it.
FYI those are not servo motors. They are just Bodine AC gearmotors. Bodine uses those really nice aluminum frames that makes them look like servos but you don't control servos with relays and servos have feedback devices. Encoders, resolvers, tachometers, if none of that is present it's not a servo
The most difficult part of running these old machines is getting code into the controller. They have limited onboard memory, and drip feeding them code is slow.
Taper-Lock is one of the easiest system's to remove pulley's.
Use the screws in the other holes to loosen the pulley and you may need to hammer a flathead screwdriver in the slot. Now you can just slide it off.
Assembly in reverse, once you have it out, take a look at how it works.
This system can even be used if the seat it rests on is evenly worn out.
Thanks 🙏
Also , in the same box as the spindle drive is a transformer with multiple taps ,, the output voltage has to be set correctly because the control has a regulated power supply but the servos don't ... What can happen is that difference in voltage can cause random estop/errors ,,, the instructions for doing that are on the first few pages of the manual ....
The very first thing I always do on a Fadal is make sure the transformer jumpers are set at the correct voltage. I learned that the hard way 😂
@@prestigemanufacturingky It did it for months , even after we paid fadal techs to fly in from Cali ,,, they replaced the servo amplifiers ... still did it ,,,, turns out the 480 would sometimes creep up to 505 ...
@@theiaminu5375 wow
The schmoo is just dried up coolant, hot water with a weak coolant mixture also works great at softening it up and removing it without the chance of rusting parts. And no danger to any aluminum parts.
I have an industrial hot water, pressure washer and it does get the stuff off but not as good as the special sauce lol
@@prestigemanufacturingky But it won't rust parts that it splashes into under covers and areas that won't dry fast like water and cleaner will.
@@phillhuddleston9445 good point
@@prestigemanufacturingkywhat is that special sauce got an old haas with dried coolant
@@quickdiy8127 ZEP oven cleaner. I’ve tried other oven, cleaners, and every solution on the market and nothing works like that.
If you want to get rid of that makeshift whiteboard soak up the taped area and removed edge of the whiteboard in goo-gone(that should remove all the adhesive from the tape and possibly some of the whiteboard without affecting the paint. After that a plastic wedge like used for taking apart iphones and tablets and a heatgun can remove the rest(then re-apply the goo-gone to remove the remaining adhesive) It looks like you got an amazing score on that machine even if you have to put a bit into it
Thanks for the tip and the support. I really appreciate it
Purple power will clean it right up especially with hot water, and pressure. Abouta gallon of evaporust setup to contentiously spray over all the bare metal. Will have it looking like it's atleast 1999, if not new.. the pressure from purple power being sprayed on the gunk will leave it clean. Just a fine spray to wet it, after it's wet, go over it again and re wet it and spray it off, WD-40 will work good for the metal bits it is a water displacer. A scotch Brite and WD will do wonders..
I’ll try that for sure. I’ve used purple power before but it never got off the tough stains.
when the carousel wont move forward, its usually chips in the guidways or the bracket on the back is broken. Take the bracket off and see if you can push the whole assembly forward. Spend $100 and replace all the lube meters, Fadals are notorious for breaking the lube line to the rear X axis way. Make new way wipers, Turcite works well for this. Some one probably stepped on the Y axis way cover and bent the L shaped brackets that bolt to the saddle, bend them back. You got a deal, cnc machines are cheap if you have the skill to repair them.Most Fadal parts can be gotten from Mcmaster Carr..only thing proprietary are the castings and control board. Easy to run machines.
I moved it by hand off camera after and it moved really good. I’m down to it being a short in the wire harness because the motor will move then blow a fuse. It he’s to be a wire rubbing and grounding
Make sure the lube system is working before you go too far and that oil is getting to the ways. The metering units and tubes often clog up. The turcite will wear and the accuracy will be compromised. Be warned I used to service this machines.
Thanks I’ll definitely do that !
We have a Fadal 4020 at my work and it's an absolute lemon. No one likes running that machine. It holds mediocre tolerances and is slow AF. In order for it to make an almost acceptable part you must, before hitting the start button, have at least 2 out of the 9 planets in the solar system aligned with the sun (yes Pluto is still a planet), say a prayer of dedication to Cthulhu promising your first born as a sacrifice, and only after that do you have a voodoo shaman perform a ceremonial dance around the machine. If all these things are acceptable to the 4020, it will hold plus or minus .005 tolerance and might interpolate a concentric hole but only if its feeling generous, for it is a resentful god....
Dang. Sorry to hear that. The work I do of I’m holding around .001 it’s good for me. I’ve had pretty good luck with fadals thankfully.
I also have a couple beater fadals from the 90's. You might want to go try the gib adjustment procedure to help with accuracy
@@steve02slo I actually sold this one shortly after the video posted 😀
See the mechanical type touch static sensitive electronics with stating generating gloves.
And then he will expect his suppliers to honour their warranty.
The fadals are tanks. We still use an 3016 1989/90 daily. And for quick jobs and setup it’s great. They are slow in comparison so production with allot of tools we have better options.
I love them. It’s the only machining center I run. Thanks for the support, I appreciate it.
When I worked at a CNC facility grabbed a spray bottle and got some of the parts washer concentrate. Stuff always took the grime off my machines and didn't have to sit. Just spray and the sit time is how long it takes you to grab a rag or aim (if the machine has it) a coolant hose for washing parts off. When I first started working there only the akumas were clean, all the muratec, wasinos, index, and doosans were caked as bad or worse then what that machine you got is.
Nice
That machine got lucky to get you as an owner. I'm the same way about nor marking up machines and treating them right but with electronic test equipment.
Thanks for the support man. I really appreciate it!
I was going to say the spindle should move up to tool change position 1st if check parameters and make sure tool change position is set for z
They are taper lock bushes in them pulley. Loosen the grub screws and take out then place one of them in the hole between where you pulled them from. That forces the taper bush out the pulley and allows you to pull them off by hand.
for your information, grill cleaner is potatium or sodium hydroxyde that hydrolise the grease and convert it into soap ;)
Thanks for the insight
Love seeing machines come to life instead of going into debt big time! We dont always have to have the latest and greatest to make money!
Definitely!
Oven degreaser, almost positive that’s the secret sauce.
Your right lol
Score! - Thank you for sharing the process of getting this old machine up and running again.
Thanks for watching
I know nothing about CNC myself. I bought one of them cheap desktop cnc just to learn. I honestly think with a little work and parts. This would be a great CNC system. Even at that price I saw them used for 10s of thousands. Even new they are costly. Congrats on the great Buy.
Thanks for the support. I really appreciate it!
Liked and subscribed! Man what a pure joy to watch! You say you're not a CNC machine mechanic, but boy you know your stuff. I've always dreamed to find a machine center like this on the cheap because it doesn't run, so it was much fun and joyful to see you going through this process and your steps and thoughtprocess to fix it. Thoroughly loved the video, thanks!
Thanks for the support man! I’ve got a bunch of cool projects in the works. Keep a eye 👁️ out 🙏
Hey Mate, try enamel thinners on a rag on stained bits. It will clean it well. Don't use on plastic, it's fine on 2k paint and powder coat
I’ll definitely try that!
mannnnn you gave me a heart attack with that pressure washer near everything hahaha. awesome deal
lol thanks for the support
Steam pressure washer?
Great video - I did something similar with a 30year old 850 machine with a Mitsubishi controller . Took a few new servo drives and a bit of TLC to get her running but it was a very interesting project indeed - my first CNC .
Watching your video I can't help thinking the Z axis is not retracting high enough to allow the carousel to move in so maybe the tool change height (G30 on my machine ) needs to be checked . I envy the large dry space you have !
Thanks for the support man. I really appreciate it!
Nice job, buddy of mine just bought a 2008 VF3. It needed some love too. The spindle allegedly wouldn’t go into high gear. I found in the settings the low speed change gear was at like 5000rpm. Looking forward to seeing more of your videos.
Nice!! I should be dropping another video tonight with a Bridgeport Mill and a hydraulic press that I bought that I might give away be on the lookout
Prolly a little late and you figured this out by now. But that pulley is called a " taper lock " You remove the bolts that force the two halfs together and then thread those bolts into the vaccant holes. This will then press it apart.
Once we had a neglected machine that sat for 2 years no one drained the coolant or anything. When we finally opened the door it smelled like a dead body🫨🤣
I can imagine! That stuff starts to smell gross quick 🤮
Thanks for this video. Nice to see how you trouble shoot with these older machines.
Thanks for the support. I appreciate it!
I paid $3500 for a Hyundai KH63G with twin pallet changers because there was a typo on the auction listing. Said the machine had 18,000 cutting hours instead of power on. Machine actually only had 938 cutting hours. Sold the machine for $95k. Rigging to my shop was 11k lol. My biggest financial win to date at once.
Nice! That’s a mega win!! Congratulations
Nice! That’s a mega win!! Congratulations
The tool turret shouldn't move or turn unless the z-axis has moved up to the tool change position.
I got my Fadal 4020HT in 1989. Run it almost every day.
Nice! Fadals are great machines in my opinion. Thanks for the support
Ive done a lot of repairs on fadal 4020s when i worked at a machine shop about 4 yrs ago. Thats not a horrible machine, but they do break down quite often if you run then 24/7.
I like em but I'd have to agree Fadal and Haas's are not truly production machining centers. That said, I prefer much of their simpler systems and flexibility that are quite useful in job shop situations.
Put a laminate like 3m stone guard on the lexan to protect from scratches etc. the flexible layer makes it very difficult to scratch, and you just peel and replace if it does.
That’s a great tip
@@prestigemanufacturingky i used it for a counter top in a shop initially that every customer put their keys on. the polycarbonate survived so well it is my go to.
Thing will,pay for itself in a week. They make user interface replacements so you can use a wireless keyboard and have a GUI or graphic user interface
Definitely!
There's a great big lead counterweight in the back , inside the z axis ,,, if it wasn't pinned during transport it can get long enough to break one of the coolant fittings during a tool change .... we had to remove ours from the machine and drop it (the weight} on the ground several times with a forklift ....
Wow! I’m going to look inside there at mine tomorrow. Thanks for the tip!
@@prestigemanufacturingky It was the spindle coolant (glycol) , I think I saw a chiller on the back ...
@@theiaminu5375 ah.. ok
The side comparison with the cleaners is hilarious. One side you stick the gun directly to the wall, then the side you did spray, you keep a foot off the wall
So Happy for you. I crosed my fingers when you started it up,
Thanks I really appreciate it🙏
Honey, I scored a great deal on a used tool for my hobby shop. It was only $500.
Btw, you weren't using the garage for anything, were you?
😂
Took myself a gamble too on a Emco 300vmc couple of years back. It’s much nicer looking machine from University. Hardly used and just had one bad solder on spindle drive. Took two weeks to findit. Youcan get that grime off by spraying fresh coolant mix on it and letting it soak for a bit then just wiping it off.
I really don’t understand the people who want to work with a messy machine, I always kept my machines clean, even when working in a machine shop.
Thanks for the support 🙏
Would have replaced the servos, and added linux cnc to it. There are cheap leadshine ones they do even have ethercat.
Kudos sir. As soon as I saw the ways and board removed, I would have walked away
Thanks 🙏
Please clean the lube resivor and change the Bijur felt filter in the lube pump intake. Blow out all lube lines and Change all the Bijur metering orfices. Do this so you do not wear out a box way as there is no feedback that 1 piece of the machine is not lubed until there is damage. I have never drip fed a FADAL but at toolshows in the 90's the FADALS were always making lots of noise or were doing crazy profiling by drip feeding the program. Do a 45' test as the older DC motor machines were great but the Harlow resolvers had super small bearings would get worn out. Then the core of the resolver bounces arround making bad finishes. Resolvers just degrade Encoders FAIL.
Thanks for the advice 🙏
As long as everything is okay mechanically, an electronics conversion to a newer controller would be a cheap great upgrade.
For me time is always a factor, retrofitting it would probably take me a while. thanks for the support!
I have the same machine and I am doing the same. Got it used and fixing it up. I tried a lot of different cleaners and found that engine degreaser worked great. I am going to try your special sauce that is mentioned in the description to this video! I would be very interested if you ever change the turcite on your machine. That is what I need to do to mine. I am getting the spindle rebuilt too. I want mine rebuit and not a imported off the shelf replacement.
Get some aviation paint stripper for the front of the cross-slide and the pan base, use a putty knife, mask it off and shoot it with some epoxy paint. Look forward to your next installment building new way covers (spot weld).
Awesome! I’ll definitely try that. Thanks
@@prestigemanufacturingky Here is a quick clip of Jason applying the stripper to aluminum ailerons.
ruclips.net/video/c40_lnrXo2A/видео.htmlsi=6rVMFygEKJ_3U0rB&t=1274
so glad you were able to get this going. I want one bad to learn cnc. to make my own parts
Thanks 🙏
Dayum, nice score! With a machine of this age and condition, I completely expect it to not be fully functional, but x y z and spindle working? That’s already plenty good! The rest are things that can be repaired and restored after the fact, or at least I would think, if I had other machines to make parts with.
Thanks for the support 💯
I am building a full workshop here in South Africa on any old Machines ....you need to take time fixing the machine before you can assume the machine is ready , avoid repairing old electronics they will make you sick rather invest in new electronic control , remember steel doesn't rot only wears and can be easily be fixed and if fixed properly will last years and years .
Thanks for the insight and comment 🙏
that poor machine looks like its been run hard and put away wet.
good on you for trying to bring it back to life.
It does look like that lol. Thanks for the support
Dude, I really liked the Chappell Show clip. Very nice touch.
Thanks. I really appreciate the support 🙏
The way cover is probably missing due to a cronic failure somewhere in that axis. Someeon got sick of removing it and putting it back on. Ball screw or end block bearings probably keep getting wiped out or possibly greese system fittings plugging up inside there. God Im glad I dont service machine tools anymore.
😀
Did they make custom covers that go over the ways and ball screw?? Im wondering if that is why the stock covers are gone. They might of damaged them or they wore out and come up with those covers instead. Way covers are very expensive to have them made especially custom made one offs. But the stock covers I would imagine are still important as they are the barier from coolant leaking out of the machine. Unless this brand is sealed off under them somehow., I used to be feild service tech for Cambell Grinder Co.
I hope I will never ever have to use the secret sauce to clean a machine that way - but it's good to know it exists.
I always wash down my machine at the end of the day and brush any excess chips out the next morning when it's all dry and I keep a clean cloth nearby during the day to keep the outside clean too.
But I do draw on my machine using markers The windows are a kind of bullet proof glass and I write notes on there with chalk markers to remind me of things to do when running a job or where to continue the next day. Some windex will wipe the chalk off and clean the windows again.
I hope you never have to use it to clean your machine too. When it gets to that point they are pretty bad. Thanks for the support. I really appreciate it.
Best part was your get things done approach. I'm sure there was a lot of hard graft and head scratching off camera. Great effort.
Thanks I appreciate the support
Looks like the Calmotion was stripped out of it. The original Fadal boards are a core charge on a Calmotion setup, which is why they were missing. Nice job resurrecting it.
You’re probably right. I have installed a bunch of those on machines I’ve had and they always have a little board that looked like it was missing.
The secret sauce is just oven cleaner… people have been cleaning engines and engine bays or oil crusted parts with it for years.
Which is mostly lye conveniently packaged in a spray can.
Nice job on the machine. It is great when you can rescue something from the junker and give it new life. One quick suggestion though.... I think you might want to be more careful with the pressure washer, especially around the electrical areas. It seems like you pressure washed the front panel and that isn't waterproof. At best, you probably introduced water that could corrode/rust contacts. At worst, you introduced water that could be conductive (as a function of other contamination in the water), which could then change behavior. It probably would have been a better idea to cover those items, pressure wash, and then hand clean them. The same is true with all of the servo components/encoders/etc, although those are more likely to have watertight gaskets (but are those in good condition).
Anyhow, best of luck with your new machine. I hope it gives years of service.
Thanks for the support
don't run the spindle without a tool holder!!!!!!! You'll chew up the air collet ejector!!!
Surely that's not all waterproof in there? Especially the turret motor and control board??
I’ve never had a problem thankfully
I hope for Part 2..
A classic and amazing company, owner/founder, machine and history akin to Tormach.
I wish more people were doing this and with even older machines, I would if I had the [banked retirement fund]..
Thanks for the support!
the fact that you said you don't understand how people let a machine get this filthy and why the write on tthem is why you deserve this steal of a buy :)
Thanks man
I'm so envious I could piss myself. Currently building a cnc myself, and honestly, if it was $500 to get a table and running spindle only, I would get 50 of them
I’m not always this lucky on machines lol thanks for the support, I really appreciate it
Fadals of this age do have a X axis problem, but i do wish you the best and hope she works out for you
Thanks for the support. I appreciate it!
The place i work at still has 3 fadals that are used every day. They can still hold 0.001 after all these years. They will be fazed out here soon tho
Let me know when and I’ll try to buy them 😂
Nice score, congratulations!!
Thanks man 🙏
The Zep steel cleaner is great stuff
Definitely!
$500? - is a steal )))) Congratulations!
Thanks. I appreciate it!
I used one of these at my first job when I was still in high school. Very solid machine with those boxed Ways.
They definitely are
Looking at how much paint is still there, that isn’t that much used machine.
Honestly the tool holders you got are probably worth the $500 you spent on the machine. I totally tooled up a single machine at a new location and the cost of tooling can add up to a LOT more money than some folks would think it would. Coming from Industrial Maintenance background I would suggest you get into the habit now of LOTO the disconnect seen on the machine, and verifying zero voltage before you get into things. It is a good habit to form early. I kinda get that your solo but if somebody turns on the breaker while you have a hold of some 480VAC it will literally kill you on the spot :-(. If the disconnect does not work you can buy a breaker LOTO.
You definitely right. The shell mill alone is worth what I paid for the machine.
My VMC cost 1500 but it was fully working and not used much.
Thanks a great deal for a working machine!
@@prestigemanufacturingky auction with not too many bidders...
This is dope man. Talk about goals
Thanks man. I appreciate it
If you really did pick it up for $500. Re-deck a couple pairs of heads and make your money back. About everything' on it is removable in like 15minutes. Preamps, etc. At least you aren't reloading binary line by line. Could swap out the motherboard and switch to a touch screen with a later Windows OS.. WD40 will remove the sharpie on the controller. They're all pretty much reverse compatible. If I got into it, I would buy a used Late 90's 3015LXP LASER rather than buy these "new" plasma tables everyone marvels on about and clean the electrodes. Easiest maintenance. Just swap out the copper magnets and the head cartridge.
Thanks for the suggestion and support. I appreciate it
Damn underrated channel for sure. It would be really cool to see a quick 2 min video of everything working, but I can understand the last 5% of the video isnt really worth if you're busy, which in sure you are. Haha
Hey thanks man I really appreciate it!
I had the exact same machine.
We updated the electronics and the controls.
That thing was pretty damn fast after that. Also programmed a touch probe for it to speed things up
Nice!!! I love fadals they are great machines. Thanks for the support and comment. I really appreciate it.
I colud watch videos like this all day.all the best in furure Business
Thanks for the support man be on the lookout for tonight or tomorrow morning I will be dropping another one
Wish i had a 500 dollar machine! Nice work!!
Thanks for the support I really appreciate it!
Every time I see a video like this i think of a saying my father used to say when I was a kid “ son if a man tries to sell you a Lamborghini for $500 and he says all it needs is a wheel nut would you believe him and purchase that ? Think about that before you believe any one trying to sell you something “
I actually find the cheaper stuff is often better as it's being sold by individuals who aren't motivated by money and generally want to see the machine go to a good home and not get scrapped. These days the money in every machine shop is in the real estate and not the old equipment.
That’s awesome! Keep the videos coming
Thanks for watching it man. I really appreciate the support.
did you notice that dirty/un maintained machines dont work well?..
As long as it ain't grindin' or leaking magic smoke, you got a chance.
I'd think you'd be able to pressure wash the machining bay. The way those things spew coolant, it shouldn't hurt, but you have inside. Speaking of which, nice effing work space; don't tell me it's heated, or massive hate's gonna come your way. I have damn near enough tools & equipment to make that place crowded, strategically organized in the sq footage of a 2½ car garage.
As much as you'd think It would ve, crowdedness isn't the worst problem; it's trying to get heat into all that cast iron & steel. Plus, the previous owners had turned it into living space & insulated like crazy; it's great in the summer, it only gets hot inside, if I leave the garage door open.
But, fall, winter & early spring are brutal.
Good luck w/ the resto; gonna be interesting to watch your progress.
The price is on the thumbnail 😁
@@prestigemanufacturingky I missed it until I saw the thumbnail in my Watched Vids. Then I edited the comment...
Looks like you scored...
@@georgedennison3338 😆 thanks
Is the ‘sauce’ AC cleaner? One of our techs used AC cleaner to remove setup coolant. The bottom pan in the back corner got dented in and would pool and after time, kind of set up. He cleaned it out, and flattened it back to original position.
No it’s not. Good guess though lol check the video description it’s in there 😁
What's the secret sauce for removing leftover chip and rust stains
It’s ZEP oven cleaner. Thanks for the support
tool 1 is in the spindle, you have to remove tool via computer interface first even though it is already physically taken out?
Thanks for the advice. I appreciate it
You are a hero man! Thanks to exists!
Thanks man I appreciate it 🙏
My secret sauce is Spray9, diluted 60%. Full strength takes the paint off. Trigger spray, sit a minute, wipe off.
Layout dye remover for Sharpie or glue and tape residue.
Nice score!
Thanks man I’ll definitely try that!
Can't wait to see this series continue!!!
Thanks for the support🙏 I really appreciate it
The tool changer won't work without compressed air.
Thanks
I know, It's kinda your stick... but if somebody in the audience would ever be able to purchase something like this for $500 and boy is money strapped: part it out. Every Servo with the controller cashes roughly $700. The Spindle is the Filet: at least $1500. likely more, based on the run-out and features. And that's less than 15% MSRP. The hydraulics, the cooling, the oiling system. The table, the controller, the boards. This is a treasure trove of opportunities. If something like this is under 2k, buy it as fast as you can. There's no way you won't at least tripple your money.
Definitely
He was probably a guy that doesn't want to walk to the chip Hopper and just walks by and throws his chips in the machine
we need a follow up cutting parts !
A viewer actually purchased the machine after seeing the video or I would make one 😆
awesome , glad its getting a second life @@prestigemanufacturingky
Oven cleaner for painted surfaces I use that too ! Works great and dont eat the paint ..
💯