Glad that people are willing to call out nonconsensual behavior, but like... Considering how out of the way you need to go for this to happen, and within the context of your relationship, I'm just so confused. Also, dating is awkward, and your character has the chance to say no to the whole thing and then express how you're feeling in the moment! Mature people who have navigated relationships know not everything is clear and scripted!
@@evie2411 100%, let's call out boundary crossing and such. It makes me feel like the people that are "calling out Elliott" have no idea what they're talking about and they're just regurgitating what someone else said 😐
@@sodorartRight, I can't take this fake outrage seriously. It also takes away from genuinely bad writing elsewhere that really could perpetuate bad behavior! He's never been on my radar. You nailed it here, 100%
Agreed! Also, what if your farmer had a communication about boundaries in advance “off screen?” It’s already clear ingame that sometimes the farmer says things that we aren’t aware of (giving a one-sided, rhetorical conversation feeling where characters respond to things you don’t visibly reply to). Though to be fair, my farmer married Elliot in my first save and I was also surprised about the sudden kiss and literally had that thought process. “That was a little sudden. Oh, right, we’re dating.“ After playing different save files where I purposely avoided Elliot bc I wanted my other farmers NOT to marry him, I realized that he sticks out as so cheesy and dramatic sometimes. So I get why people wouldn’t like him, but then again, Shane, Haley, and Sebastian might stick out as well as either rude for the first two or dramatically ruminating in negativity, according to their personalities. Also Emily really sticks out as well lol. They’re just all using more mainstream language and delivery than Elliot and therefore stick out less imo lol. Also the mean girl, emo boy, and brooding, “I can fix him” character types are all much more mainstream than a poet/writer/artist type. Even a crystal girl is a much more common trope.
So far I romanced only two characters, but I had read Wiki on all of them. And Elliot is my favorite romancable character. But, to be honest, farmer, stalking characters to become close to them, knowing their entire daily schedules (even I have been there, running early to the house and just waiting for it to be unlocked), is far more creepy than Elliott
OMG YES MA’AM!!!! Thank you! I never understood why people say Elliott is creepy! Like, you need to go out of your way to get to that cutscene, which I think is kinda cute, considering he is already you partner!! This cutscene fits his personality! Also, people saying his 14 heart event is also creepy are out of their minds! I won’t spoil it if you haven’t seen it, but considering the game world… its sooo romantic! ❤
I think ConcernedApe tried to make Eliott like the awkward nerdy bookworm who is kinda cute if you get to know him. I'm autistic so i can relate quite a bit with him (meaning that i mean well but non autistic people see it as rude or completely inappropriate), not saying he is autistic. But it's a bit of a stereotype that people who are a bit of a loner and spent their time reading/writing books are less likely to pick up on social hints.
I’m thankful that someone understands how awkward Elliot is. I have always been like him in my younger age since I was reading a lot, so it really made me feel bad that everyone saw him as a horrible person for that. Stardew Valley is a fun, peaceful game with good vibes, and it’s always sad to see the fandom make overdramatic theories that destroy some characters
Like he can be my awkward husband all he wants, my autistic butt will listen hours to the books he will write. As long he also loves to listen to me rambeling about my hyperfixations.
I think a lot of people need the clear reason to hate the character so they come up with theories to make said character look bad. It is ok to dislike a character for no particular reason. This character just doesn't match your vibes and it's not a crime, we all have our likes and dislikes and sometimes they are not really based on anything specific.
omg THANK YOU. Elliott is my favorite, he's such a drama queen and kind of awkward but so romantic and sweet. i was an english lit major in college, and i can confirm that if you read enough dramatic literature it's gonna bleed into your personality a little lmao. and to add to the four-heart event thing with Gus, i'm like 90% sure that he's just used to Elliott's antics. they hang out together at multiple of the festivals I think. so his reaction really is just like "wow hes back at it again" and not him being genuinely upset that Elliott's being disrespectful or something (just like you said)! i think they probably have a level of familiarity with each other that Elliott feels comfortable being like that because they're fairly close. as ted lasso said about trent crimm (who is also a writer and reminds me a lot of elliott lmao), he's a dork but he's our dork lol
Thank you! I think all Concerned Ape´s characters are written very lovingly, and some of them embody the skills he had to develop for his game: Sam-music, Sebastian-computer science, Leah-design and art, Elliott-writing. In my opinion, the fandom just looks for flaws and demonizes those characters whose vibe they dislike.
Shane and Harvey both dive in for a kiss without verbal consent. And for Harvey, you're also in a dangerous situation where you're all alone with him. So why, I wonder, is Elliot the only one catching heat for this? Especially since he's the only one who hears you out and apologizes if you're uncomfortable. By all accounts, it makes no sense. I just feel that it's people who don't like his personality type, and are seeking a "correct reason" to hate him. (And btw, I don't think any of those characters were wrong for kissing their long-term romantic partner. I'm just saying, be consistent.)
I think that if the player rejects his kiss on the boat, he should send a letter returning the bouquet and drop back to 8 hearts. If there's a clear signal to the actual player "you did this, you sent him these signals and then acted contrary to that" it might be a way to clear the "he's creepy for kissing you" mentality
That would be pretty good actually for every monster that shove gifts to a marriage candidates, ask them out just to reject them after they gather their courage and put effort to be romantic with you. They just send you a withered bouquet and drop to 8 heart. That would be even better if it could be more difficult to get them at 10 heart again
@@inatasannamei8441 i don’t think she’s wrong at all for it, i think the game should punish the player more for something like that in the form of a break up because that’s the reasoning behind the line
I never understood the hate Elliot gets. I always married him in game. I find it odd how people can see a fault with a character but will twist themselves in knots to defend their favorite who others might have issues with.
People will say what ellitot did was wrong but what about all the other characters who you cant reject their kisses? Like I love sebastian, hes my favorite bachelor, but he kisses you without permission, at night on a dark cliff. What about shane who kisses you without permission at a gridball game? What about the mc farmer themselves who can choose to kiss haley in her dark room without asking first? Im sure there are more examples but those times are accepted while elliots isnt? Its confusing.. On the note of how fannon becomes considered cannon, its ridiculous how many youtube shorts, tiktoks etc ill see with the EXACT word for word information or interpretation ill see. It feels like alot of people content farming without looking into the topic further or coming to their own conclusion. Im not saying that you cant come to the same conclusion as someone else, but when everyone is saying it word for word id say its suspicious.
100% agreed. I think people see this phenomenon a lot (fannon = canon, with exact same verbiage) and then spout "dead internet theory", which is very dark and dramatic, but I think the most believable reality is that a LOT of people content farm because you can make an income from making content so it's easy. No need to do any research or write a script, just parrot what you've heard others say!
Ok, but I think it's interesting to ask why people might be objecting more to this particular cutscene with Elliott, and not to all the other examples you've listed. Thinking about it, I believe the difference might be how the farmer is shown trembling right after the kiss, which I don't think (?) happens in any of the other scenes. There's a few cutscenes where the farmer's reaction gives the player a clue as to how to read the situation, for example when Penny prepares food for you and the farmer turns green and gags, it's obvious that it's revolting. Of course with the kiss, it's up to the player to decide how they feel about Elliott and whether to pursue the relationship further, but I could well imagine that with the lack of any other body language clues, "trembling" is easier for many people to associate with a bad reaction instead of an excited reaction. Especially with how the "body trembling" is used as a sign for crying/fear in other cutscenes in SV. If CA didn't have reaction in there and the farmer was just a bit stunned or surprised, it might not have caused such a big debate.
Like the Eliott hate train is so weird "omg he kissed me without my consent 😡😡😡😡😡" but like nobody says something when Harvey kiss you in the hot air balloon. I'm fine with people calling out bad behaviour but be consistent. Like in my opinion Eliott is the best stardew husband, he doesn't play games, is ready to settle down and he definitely smells good with his pomegranate conditioner.
I’m surprised you didn’t mention another reason why people don’t like Elliot is for his six heart scene. Context [From the Wiki]: Elliott talks about how difficult it's been to finish his novel and says "Sometimes I wish I could just throw it all away and become a farmer like you." The player can respond with: "It's just as hard to be a farmer, you know" (No effect on friendship.) - Elliott apologizes for being insensitive and clarifies that what he really wants is to experience "real life". "Come live on the farm, I could use the extra help" (No effect on friendship.) - Elliott is surprised but declines the offer, saying he needs to finish his novel. I’ve heard people read it as “Oh he thinks he’s so much better than you,” and stuff like that. While I’m not really an Elliot fan, I can totally just see him being awkward and phrasing things poorly (something I do A LOT). It’s pretty evident considering if you choose the first option he didn’t mean it like that
@@jasmine1327 great insight! I also think our farmer was given an opportunity that not many people have: a one way ticket away from our old life. We were given farm with fertile soil and a house that's paid off. Elliott had to save up funds to move away and buy his beach shack, then needs to focus on his novel so he has more money coming in. It's a lot of pressure on himself
I gasped when this came up, thank you so much for making this! I'm so tired of seeing the same criticisms that don't make sense. Another criticism of the ten heart scene I see all the time is "why do you start trembling? That's creepy" like, have you never finally been kissed by someone you've had a crush on for a long, long time? I've definitely gotten the shakes in that situation irl.
Literally like damn, okay cupids! I've always been nervous on a first kiss with someone new, I don't wanna mess up! That's normal!!! "Butterflies in your stomach" is also just anxiety! Also normal!
honestly i never thought elliot as a creepy or forcing himself on you, but the first time i seen this was from a youtuber/ streamer that did a series of going thru all the eligible bachelors / bachelorette and i saw a short about how they called elliot out for forcing himself on them and i think that MUST have started the controversy! because i never saw anything bad about elliot for this scene, UNTIL i saw that video / short
This type of "omg he kissed me when I purposefully chose all the 'he should kiss me' options" is an old complaint. Reminds me of Dragon Age 2 dudebro wank where dudes would play a male Hawke and then flirt with the male mage for a solid two thirds of the game and act surprised when the mage jumps into Hawke's arms. Like, my dude, my guy, you have to WORK to get to that scene by clicking all the labeled-with-a-big-pink-heart flirty dialogue options. There are so many signs before you get there. You cannot tell me you did not see any of them. Just let me have my suit kink man in peace. In 3-piece >:3
A 15 minute linguistics and fandom analysis tangent seems oddly and comfortingly fitting in an episode about Elliott, a writer. Thank you for this, I was getting really tired of seeing the nonstop slander of him - yeah, he's a bit goofy, but I really like Elliott's passion in every aspect of him
I just want to say I love your video and im so happy it exists 😭 thank you for having such a thoughtful and insightful and unbiased dive into my favorite character ❤ it saddens me whenever i come across the big sdv content creators on tiktok and they all collectively hate elliott and their large following just get influenced to do the same. Its ridiculous that hating a character seems more like a personality trait to them than relating to the character they love. Im so happy i found this video, it gives me hope that these haters are just the "quantity" Fans and people who actually understand elliott as a character are the "quality" Fans
@@mochirin8645 thanks for listening and commenting!!! It gets really tiring hearing the same "ummmm.... he's POMPOUS 🤣😝" since 2016 and ConcernedApe put in so much love into this game. I think the least we can do is not write off an entire character with 1-3 traits and call it a day
The bar larping made me want to tell this story . . . When I was born, my dad and his brother went bar hopping to celebrate. They came across this cowboy themed one and decided to go in dramatically ask for a whiskey. When dad said the words, the barkeep gave him a look and asked, "what kind?" haha Adding to the fail, his brother basically asked for a chaser. I cannot do the story justice through written word, but it's always funny. As a side note, my dad is not awkward or easily embarrassed. He is quite charismatic. Just failed to consider the fact that he would need to pick a specific type of whiskey. haha His brother has always been a bit of a goof though. In an adorable way.
LOL ty for sharing! I think my partner is very charismatic but there's been times where a social situation is brand new and he's left dumbfounded and says the "wrong" answer. I find it cute and funny but I think others would get put off or cringe, especially in a video game where it's a fork of escapism and everything is very romanticized
Great video! I have been thinking about watching this video since it released, but since its about Elliott, I did wait until I was more mentally ready, hes my favorite bachelor and I am kinda wary about videos about him sometimes (the fiona sangster deepdive was fun but it felt way more judgy than on the others but I'm not sure if its because Elliott is my favorite and that I know not many people like him so I might have been a bit defensive from the start). Worth the wait though! The "accepted fanon as canon" part actually was what happened to me with Elliott before I started even befriending him on my first save. I kept seeing people saying he was bad, annoying, a stalker, a yandere (doesn't help that the yandere mods were really popular in early 2023 and still are. i dont see the appeal tbh). So I thought I would befriend him out of spite from all those people, and I had such a pleasant surprise that he was such a charming dork! He makes me so happy, hes such a goof and I'm very corny so I love how poetic and corny he is. And I dont know, seeing as hes one of the most hated bachelors while hes the most "feminine" looking and acting (i disagree but yknow how some people act about a man with long hair and who is such a romantic), plus that I've seen more than one person saying that his social awkwardnes could also be read as neurodivergent coded, intentionally or not, i don't know, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth but i might be overthinking
Thanks for commenting! When Stardew Valley came out, Shane wasn't added in yet, and when he was, I immediately went for him and spent a lot of time on tumblr (He is very beloved there). It wasn't until I looked at Reddit, RUclips and Twitter where I saw a lot of really nasty comments that very specifically tackled those that struggled with addiction, substance abuse, mental illness, etc. It was really horrible seeing some statements online and videos with giant thumbnails and titles like "What's the point in dating Shane if he's still depressed". It's pretty icky. So I completely understand where you're coming from w/ Elliott. I've seen some nasty words tossed around towards Elliott because of his long hair/"feminine" side and his socially awkward self. I don't think you're overthinking anything. I don't believe our opinions on art (video games are art, imo) can exist in a vacuum. It can be telling of how someone actually feels about certain people in real life :/ Also yeah, can NOT stand the yandere shit LMFAO
It's funny how they problematize Elliott's 10-heart event but not Shane's 10-heart event, because Shane is a much more hated character, and they don't see anything wrong with him kissing you (at least I've never found any complaints about it), even though both of them only do it because you gave them permission.
@@kahalmeida8528 it is shocking how much bias there is. I think people will bend over backwards defending their fave characters but simultaneously criticize another for the same issues :/
@@sodorart I think this is a lack of empathy with the characters and little consideration for their stories. I would even say hypocrisy, because sometimes people express their opinions without even having really delved into the game...
@@kahalmeida8528 100%! No nuance, no research, NONE. "I've formed an opinion in this character based on 2 lines and will now repeat what I've seen on Twitter" 😐
i’m an elliott hater tbh (i just don’t like his personality, it’s a me thing) but even i will defend his 10 heart scene. i’m a sam lover and in his 10 heart scene he asks if the player thinks of him as “just a friend” and then we have the option to stay in his bed and kiss him. in my opinion that would be worse than elliott’s 10 heart scene because there’s no “do you feel the same” it’s pretty established that you could be at the very start of your relationship. that’s just the first kiss of the relationship and he wanted to make it cute
@@lilaott6495 valid! No problem if this dork isnt your type LOL but yeah, I have never seen anyone complain about Sam's heart event (in regards to boundaries or consent) but tons when it comes to Elliott. It makes me wonder if grace and benefit of the doubt is given to those deemed "inexperienced" (because Sam feels younger than Elliott) but not to those deemed "mature". Hmm...
I love your videos, always a good analysis on the lore of the game, and I really needed someone to talk about Elliott because he is my favorite character and the hate he receives is VERY unjustified, he is not perfect, none character is, but he is a GOOD and lovely person and unfortunately, because of the fandom, many have the wrong idea about him. 💔
The only reason I dislike Elliot is because my ex was a lot like him so now it just leaves a bad taste. I really don’t understand why other people dislike him so much though
I dunno if you've already talked about him but I'd like to see you dissecting or examining Clint the Blacksmith. I'm still a Stardew Noob (still in my first year) and I've seen various Stardew Valley creators hate on Clint for reasons I don't really understand? Like Clint isn't my favorite NPC or anything, I think he's an alright dude yet everyone acts like he's a weirdo creep for having a crush on Emily apparently? If anybody can explain why people hate Clint so much I'd be happy to listen.
@@sodorart thanks for the reply! I honestly don't really see what's so hateable about Clint, could be because I'm a noob and haven't seen a specific heart event or something but to me, I just see him as a socially awkward big guy who makes a fool of himself sometimes. Not really a R/Niceguy Stalker guy that I've heard a few people call him.
@@myth-gal3477 totally agree with you. people don't even know what incel means anymore. he's just a lonely insecure guy with a crush. i wish there was a path that let him focus more on himself so people would stop hating on him constantly.
@@loveforkuja yeah definitely. I had assumed the community was being so hard on him because he's ugly (ugly as in just not traditionally attractive compared to the characters who have a lot of fans and simps, he's a big fella with a beard and a visible gut, he kinda reminds me of Barold from ACNH who is also similarly hated by the fandom), it just kinda makes me feel sad for the poor guy.
Clint goes further than just having a shy crush. He definitely spies on Emily from the bushes, and he tells the player "congrats" as if Emily is a prize to be won over and not a human being capable of making her own informed decisions because he misreads a non-romantic situation as being romantic. He also assumes hanging out as friends is a date when he finally does ask her to hang out. It's not just that he's shy, it's also the words he uses, their situational meaning, and what they represent as minimalist text-story drops to the player to summarize their characters. Clint wouldnt say 'congrats' if he wasn't incel-coded ('coded' as a writing term). It is unfortunate he never has any character development to become more than just an incel, but as it is that is the entirety of his written character. Hope that helps to explain why people read him as creepy rather than just shy 😀
What a fantastic, well-reasoned (and reasonable) take. I’m new to SDV fandom (though devouring at a frightening pace) and have heard what I consider to be a surprising number of these kind of takes. I read the Haley one on your video at the time and just brushed it off, but I’ve heard some unnecessarily harsh ones about Demetrius and this one about Elliott and thought, what? The content creators get confused in my mind, though, without faces. But, like, where is the evidence that Demetrius locks Seb in a dungeon, like the evil step-mother, so his own child can inherit the kingdom? It’s just bizarre. But I’ve only spent a few hundred hours in the game. Maybe I’ll feel differently after a thousand. 😅 Still, nice to hear a reasonable voice occasionally.
@@nikifallen93 LOLOLOL The dungeon master Demetrius 💀 Yes, I also need to make an episode about him as well. I'm glad you're enjoying Stardew Valley!! With all of that said, the nonsense hot takes definitely aren't unique to Stardew Valley at all, happens in every single fandom. The power of the internet allows us to read anyone and everyone's "thinkpiece" (implying there was any thought put into half of them 😔) and I also think it's a vocal minority kinda thing. I ran a poll on Tumblr asking who was everyone's fave spouses and Shane and Haley won by a landslide. 2nd place? Elliott and Sebastian tied, and Leah. Yet the amount of hot takes concerning Shane, Haley and Elliott would leave you surprised at the results!
When I saw the title of this video, I thought “wha??? What does Elliot need defense from?” Elliot is my favorite husband. Hearing about this, I just imagine a bunch of 18 year olds who have never dated, and whose activism begins and ends at being a “keyboard sjw” all parroting the same line. It’s not only annoying, but it undermines real issues.
LITERALLY. I wanted to get a bit more spicy in the podcast but I was like "hmm I dont want it to sound too soapboxy... " but I seriously think it's a lot of people that just havent had many life experiences (which is fine) and they seriously don't know what they're talking about, so they just parrot very serious criticisms. And these things don't exist in a vaccum, it's a small window into their other thoughts about real life problems.
Just… this. Also! it’s always the most annoying men ever who will hate Elliot. I think they’re kinda jealous and uncanny for seeing a really romantic character who knows how to treat woman right. With love and respect. They will call it unrealistic and call Elliott dumb and creepy- i will say Elliott reminds me of my boyfriend. And I love my boyfriend. There’s literally nothing wrong about being cute.
THANK YOUUUU!! I don’t mind when people don’t seem to click with Elliott like I do, but why do people always feel like they have to make up a criminal record for him in order to dislike him? All the “gotcha” moments people call out on his behavior most other dating candidates do, some ever WORSE? It just serves to mischaracterize him and I’m glad people are starting to give him a second chance 🎉
@@sodorartYESSS it was SOOO annoying hearing the same sentiment over and over a couple years ago. Back then people didn’t really want to change their mind about Elliott and made fun of people in the comment sections of Elliott videos trying to defend him. Im glad nowadays I see more people starting to reevaluate his characterization and start to realize that they were maybe too hard on him when they made these stupid “gotcha” points
@@verandabeach9340 I think a lot of Tiktok creators have started roasting people for having zero media literacy and saying "critical thinking is at an all time low" and "everyone has brainrot and smooth brains" so maybe it's been helping LOL
I've never romanced him before. I meant to once, but then I just ended up married to Shane again. He's just so far out of the way on the beach. I feel like Shane it's just easier to run into. I mean, I ran into him on his way to work all the time without meaning to, but if I want to see Elliott I have to go out of my way to see him. I definitely heard about that controversy though, but again I'm a shane fan xD so I was already pretty sure it was just overblown hyperbole without looking into it any deeper. The internet can be such a mess sometimes. I agree with everything you said by the way, I'm happy to hear someone putting it so clearly into words xD
I just married him and he's a pain in the ass to find everyday LOL he's all over the place and sometimes doesn't leave his cabin until like noon. I'm def more used to Shane's schedule lololol
@@sodorart It makes me wonder if there's a good mod out there that lets you knock on their doors. Maybe once you get to like one or two hearts, you can knock on your door and they can answer. Maybe there's like a thing where you can lose hearts if you go knocking on their door at 1:00 a.m. xD I feel like that could be kind of fun.
@@sodorart Spoilers warning here but basically firewatch is a game in which the protagonist and his coworker (the only other character you get to interact with) get into the fire lookout job because they are running away from their problems, and when weird/bizarre stuff starts happening to them, they start theorizing about this grand government surveillance conspiracy. By the end of the game they realise the answer to that mystery is not grandiose/glamourous at all, and its quite grim and realistic in a sense. I'd recommend at least watching a playthrough of it!
I personally saw this statement in Leapalot's marriage candidates video that shown Elliott being the most hated by the younger players and popular with the older players. And probably there I also saw a discussion about how the 10-heart cutacene is designed. With the given context shaking from the joy is adorable but there's also an option that pairs "uncomfortable" with the shaking. It's a creppy vibe if taken out of context. But yes, I agree that it's mostly a technical formality for the scene since you've already touched all romance bases and agreed to be "trapped" in a boat with him in the first place 👍
I agree that the "creepy" label seems unwarranted. Like, there's enough space to possibly interpret the kiss as a bad/awkward move - IRL a person should probably ask or watch out for body language cues (that we're not getting cos it's a pixel art game). But that doesn't make a person into a creep. Personally, he's really not my cup of tea. Your reasoning that he's socially awkward makes a lot of sense, I hadn't really thought that much about it before and taken it more at face value as him being pompous and kinda arrogant. Most of what he does is so off-key in the beginning, like talking about himself, then saying "let's talk about you instead" and then proceeds to ask you for help with a houseplant :D It seems like most of the bachelors are standoffish, straight up rude or weird in the beginning, apart from maybe Harvey. The bachelorettes seem a lot more welcoming overall, except for Haley of course. I liked how you expanded on and explained the cultural stuff. With something like SV, it's difficult to come up with something entirely new, so listening to this episode felt like there were some new thoughts that aren't just rehashing all of the usual arguments over again.
Thank you for your comment !! I've been around the block in the SV community so I'm beyond sick of the same talking points and thinkpieces, I'm glad my yapping podcast isn't contributing to that. Yeah I agree, the bachelors seem so awkward and socially inept compared to the bachelorettes LOL This might be an interesting topic for a podcast episode. Maybe ConcernedApe poured a little bit of himself into the bachelors, and then poured a little of his wife into the bachelorettes (He probs views her as perfect LOL)
I like Elliot - the florid language makes me chuckle, but he's alright. I've married all the possibilities except Abigail - haven't gotten to her yet because I've seen too many other people romance her, and I know everything that happens, so I almost feel like I've done it. When I romanced Elliot, I thought he was a little over-the-top sometimes, but he was sweet and a little romantic. I agree that he's a tad awkward in the boat, but he doesn't completely know where he stands in the relationship yet - and he's nervous and doesn't want to mess up - so, of course, he almost messes up. I found it endearing - because, after all - you have to WORK to get there! You literally set the whole thing up - but then find it "creepy" when he wants to kiss you? Strange. Maybe the folks who think this way are uncomfortable with intimacy? I dunno. ALL the male characters in the game are awkward when I think about it - especially the closer you get to the Mermaid's Pendant - they at least have their awkward moments: like Sam having to hide you in his bed because he's worried about what his mom will think; or to the other extreme, Clint, who is awkwardness personified, poor slob - though, since you can't marry him, it's not the same thing. I'm interested to hear your take on Clint, though. Reactions to Clint serve to illustrate one of the phenomena you discuss in your video - there's a lot of received wisdom from people with similar "fanon" storylines (great word, by the way) that have become very close to "canon" regarding Clint. Is Clint really an Incel? Many think he is. I think it depends on your definition of Incel for starters. I don't think Clint is that far gone. Incels, at least as I perceive them, are arrogant, egotistical barnyard roosters who think they should be worshiped because they're "Male". Clint doesn't have the ego or self-regard to be a proper Incel. Clint is a schlub and he knows it. Anyway, I'm really enjoying this series. I look forward to the next one. Sorry for the novella.
@@neiltheblaze ty for the novella :)) And yes, with Clint, it's a lot of regurgitation, and someone will point out something about Clint and the response is "Oh I didn't know he said that" and it's.... a major dialogue 😐 so it's like... are there people even talking to this character that they hate or just repeating yt videos they listened to...
I never hated Elliott or anything like that, but before I played the game, I heard he was really pretentious and such, and I went with a little bit of that assumption. But then I talked to Elliott a couple of times at the beginning of my playthrough, and I thought he isn’t really like people say. Like, I wasn’t super interested in the character, but he isn’t that bad. Now I think you’ve sold me on how Elliott really is (or probably is). I still wouldn’t romance him as I prefer Sam or Seb, but I started seeing Elliott differently, and that’s nice. I’m a little more interested in the character and I have a better perspective of him.
Yet another interessting episode :) I would like to hear your thoughts on Clint. Is he really such a sad gamma male or is there more behind him? Because it feels like, he recieves a lot of hate for his self pityness to the point, where people build a geode breaker in his shop just to do it for free in front of his face. That turns me off a lot, so i am hoping, there is more to him, than what we get through the regular gameplay.
Elliott isn't my cup of tea (I'm lesbian so no men are lol) but I did seriously consider marrying him if his marriage room came with his piano cuz I can't get those naturally in the game
I totally agree! There's just one thing. While the player may be totally romantically attracted to Elliot, they might not be sexually attracted to him, and I think that should go for any spouse
Hiii 👋🏻👋🏻👋🏻 This is good stuff. Agree 100 percent about Elliot ( and love all of that research you did) . I was going to romance Elliot; he is just never really in my " I'm going this way" world. In the end it worked because Sebastian 🥰 Ps. Sorry I've been MIA , stupid Helene. We still don't have internet, had to upgrade my data plan to be able to access RUclips 😑 Anyway, hope everyone is having a great weekend 💫
Thanks for watching and commenting !! I'm so sorry about Helene :( But thank goodness you're safe and okay!! I hope this weekend is a little better for you!
"Be my boyfriend"
*goes for a kiss*
"How dare!"
Meanwhile in Leahs like 4 heart event...
Glad that people are willing to call out nonconsensual behavior, but like... Considering how out of the way you need to go for this to happen, and within the context of your relationship, I'm just so confused. Also, dating is awkward, and your character has the chance to say no to the whole thing and then express how you're feeling in the moment! Mature people who have navigated relationships know not everything is clear and scripted!
@@evie2411 100%, let's call out boundary crossing and such. It makes me feel like the people that are "calling out Elliott" have no idea what they're talking about and they're just regurgitating what someone else said 😐
@@sodorartRight, I can't take this fake outrage seriously. It also takes away from genuinely bad writing elsewhere that really could perpetuate bad behavior! He's never been on my radar. You nailed it here, 100%
Agreed! Also, what if your farmer had a communication about boundaries in advance “off screen?”
It’s already clear ingame that sometimes the farmer says things that we aren’t aware of (giving a one-sided, rhetorical conversation feeling where characters respond to things you don’t visibly reply to). Though to be fair, my farmer married Elliot in my first save and I was also surprised about the sudden kiss and literally had that thought process. “That was a little sudden. Oh, right, we’re dating.“ After playing different save files where I purposely avoided Elliot bc I wanted my other farmers NOT to marry him, I realized that he sticks out as so cheesy and dramatic sometimes. So I get why people wouldn’t like him, but then again, Shane, Haley, and Sebastian might stick out as well as either rude for the first two or dramatically ruminating in negativity, according to their personalities. Also Emily really sticks out as well lol. They’re just all using more mainstream language and delivery than Elliot and therefore stick out less imo lol. Also the mean girl, emo boy, and brooding, “I can fix him” character types are all much more mainstream than a poet/writer/artist type. Even a crystal girl is a much more common trope.
@@KcKc13 Great insight, thank you for sharing!!!
So far I romanced only two characters, but I had read Wiki on all of them. And Elliot is my favorite romancable character. But, to be honest, farmer, stalking characters to become close to them, knowing their entire daily schedules (even I have been there, running early to the house and just waiting for it to be unlocked), is far more creepy than Elliott
LOL agreed
For real 😂
OMG YES MA’AM!!!! Thank you!
I never understood why people say Elliott is creepy! Like, you need to go out of your way to get to that cutscene, which I think is kinda cute, considering he is already you partner!! This cutscene fits his personality! Also, people saying his 14 heart event is also creepy are out of their minds! I won’t spoil it if you haven’t seen it, but considering the game world… its sooo romantic! ❤
@@AmandaC. I adore his 14 heart event. I really wanna know what people define as romantic cuz if that's not romantic then... 🤨
@@sodorart Same here 🤣 Its like modern day texting. Dont we want our SO to contact us everyday if they are away??
@@AmandaC. Literally, it makes me wonder what in tarnation these people are doing irl 😐
Elliot is my favourite Vanilla :D I don't let the haters bother me >_> i just play how i want too :3
I think ConcernedApe tried to make Eliott like the awkward nerdy bookworm who is kinda cute if you get to know him.
I'm autistic so i can relate quite a bit with him (meaning that i mean well but non autistic people see it as rude or completely inappropriate), not saying he is autistic. But it's a bit of a stereotype that people who are a bit of a loner and spent their time reading/writing books are less likely to pick up on social hints.
I’m thankful that someone understands how awkward Elliot is. I have always been like him in my younger age since I was reading a lot, so it really made me feel bad that everyone saw him as a horrible person for that. Stardew Valley is a fun, peaceful game with good vibes, and it’s always sad to see the fandom make overdramatic theories that destroy some characters
@@inatasannamei8441 I agree 100%. It's like... yall know there IS good in the world and some people ARE good people right...?
Like he can be my awkward husband all he wants, my autistic butt will listen hours to the books he will write. As long he also loves to listen to me rambeling about my hyperfixations.
Elliott is my Favourite character.
I think a lot of people need the clear reason to hate the character so they come up with theories to make said character look bad. It is ok to dislike a character for no particular reason. This character just doesn't match your vibes and it's not a crime, we all have our likes and dislikes and sometimes they are not really based on anything specific.
omg THANK YOU. Elliott is my favorite, he's such a drama queen and kind of awkward but so romantic and sweet. i was an english lit major in college, and i can confirm that if you read enough dramatic literature it's gonna bleed into your personality a little lmao. and to add to the four-heart event thing with Gus, i'm like 90% sure that he's just used to Elliott's antics. they hang out together at multiple of the festivals I think. so his reaction really is just like "wow hes back at it again" and not him being genuinely upset that Elliott's being disrespectful or something (just like you said)! i think they probably have a level of familiarity with each other that Elliott feels comfortable being like that because they're fairly close.
as ted lasso said about trent crimm (who is also a writer and reminds me a lot of elliott lmao), he's a dork but he's our dork lol
LOLLL agreed 100%!!
Thank you! I think all Concerned Ape´s characters are written very lovingly, and some of them embody the skills he had to develop for his game: Sam-music, Sebastian-computer science, Leah-design and art, Elliott-writing. In my opinion, the fandom just looks for flaws and demonizes those characters whose vibe they dislike.
Shane and Harvey both dive in for a kiss without verbal consent. And for Harvey, you're also in a dangerous situation where you're all alone with him.
So why, I wonder, is Elliot the only one catching heat for this? Especially since he's the only one who hears you out and apologizes if you're uncomfortable.
By all accounts, it makes no sense. I just feel that it's people who don't like his personality type, and are seeking a "correct reason" to hate him.
(And btw, I don't think any of those characters were wrong for kissing their long-term romantic partner. I'm just saying, be consistent.)
@@WonderousSmiles Agreed 100% ! Those characters don't get the same criticism at all!
I think that if the player rejects his kiss on the boat, he should send a letter returning the bouquet and drop back to 8 hearts. If there's a clear signal to the actual player "you did this, you sent him these signals and then acted contrary to that" it might be a way to clear the "he's creepy for kissing you" mentality
That would be pretty good actually for every monster that shove gifts to a marriage candidates, ask them out just to reject them after they gather their courage and put effort to be romantic with you. They just send you a withered bouquet and drop to 8 heart. That would be even better if it could be more difficult to get them at 10 heart again
i think that would be great for everyone that has that option. penny is the first person i think of because her 10 heart rejection is such a big deal
@@MarkBonneaux I think this is a great idea, it would give the characters more autonomy
@@lilaott6495 it's sad to see that people are angry at Penny for losing hearts on this scene when it should just be a normal reaction 😕
@@inatasannamei8441 i don’t think she’s wrong at all for it, i think the game should punish the player more for something like that in the form of a break up because that’s the reasoning behind the line
I never understood the hate Elliot gets. I always married him in game.
I find it odd how people can see a fault with a character but will twist themselves in knots to defend their favorite who others might have issues with.
Elliot is amazing! My fave marriage candidate. Glad you defended him. People are so annoying about him.
This reminds me of a certain Stardew Valley youtuber who seems to have a problem with all the romanceable NPCs aside from Haley
.
People will say what ellitot did was wrong but what about all the other characters who you cant reject their kisses?
Like I love sebastian, hes my favorite bachelor, but he kisses you without permission, at night on a dark cliff. What about shane who kisses you without permission at a gridball game? What about the mc farmer themselves who can choose to kiss haley in her dark room without asking first? Im sure there are more examples but those times are accepted while elliots isnt?
Its confusing..
On the note of how fannon becomes considered cannon, its ridiculous how many youtube shorts, tiktoks etc ill see with the EXACT word for word information or interpretation ill see.
It feels like alot of people content farming without looking into the topic further or coming to their own conclusion. Im not saying that you cant come to the same conclusion as someone else, but when everyone is saying it word for word id say its suspicious.
100% agreed. I think people see this phenomenon a lot (fannon = canon, with exact same verbiage) and then spout "dead internet theory", which is very dark and dramatic, but I think the most believable reality is that a LOT of people content farm because you can make an income from making content so it's easy. No need to do any research or write a script, just parrot what you've heard others say!
Ok, but I think it's interesting to ask why people might be objecting more to this particular cutscene with Elliott, and not to all the other examples you've listed. Thinking about it, I believe the difference might be how the farmer is shown trembling right after the kiss, which I don't think (?) happens in any of the other scenes.
There's a few cutscenes where the farmer's reaction gives the player a clue as to how to read the situation, for example when Penny prepares food for you and the farmer turns green and gags, it's obvious that it's revolting. Of course with the kiss, it's up to the player to decide how they feel about Elliott and whether to pursue the relationship further, but I could well imagine that with the lack of any other body language clues, "trembling" is easier for many people to associate with a bad reaction instead of an excited reaction. Especially with how the "body trembling" is used as a sign for crying/fear in other cutscenes in SV. If CA didn't have reaction in there and the farmer was just a bit stunned or surprised, it might not have caused such a big debate.
Like the Eliott hate train is so weird "omg he kissed me without my consent 😡😡😡😡😡" but like nobody says something when Harvey kiss you in the hot air balloon. I'm fine with people calling out bad behaviour but be consistent.
Like in my opinion Eliott is the best stardew husband, he doesn't play games, is ready to settle down and he definitely smells good with his pomegranate conditioner.
I’m surprised you didn’t mention another reason why people don’t like Elliot is for his six heart scene.
Context [From the Wiki]:
Elliott talks about how difficult it's been to finish his novel and says "Sometimes I wish I could just throw it all away and become a farmer like you." The player can respond with:
"It's just as hard to be a farmer, you know" (No effect on friendship.)
- Elliott apologizes for being insensitive and clarifies that what he really wants is to experience "real life".
"Come live on the farm, I could use the extra help" (No effect on friendship.)
- Elliott is surprised but declines the offer, saying he needs to finish his novel.
I’ve heard people read it as “Oh he thinks he’s so much better than you,” and stuff like that. While I’m not really an Elliot fan, I can totally just see him being awkward and phrasing things poorly (something I do A LOT). It’s pretty evident considering if you choose the first option he didn’t mean it like that
@@jasmine1327 great insight! I also think our farmer was given an opportunity that not many people have: a one way ticket away from our old life. We were given farm with fertile soil and a house that's paid off. Elliott had to save up funds to move away and buy his beach shack, then needs to focus on his novel so he has more money coming in. It's a lot of pressure on himself
I gasped when this came up, thank you so much for making this! I'm so tired of seeing the same criticisms that don't make sense. Another criticism of the ten heart scene I see all the time is "why do you start trembling? That's creepy" like, have you never finally been kissed by someone you've had a crush on for a long, long time? I've definitely gotten the shakes in that situation irl.
Literally like damn, okay cupids! I've always been nervous on a first kiss with someone new, I don't wanna mess up! That's normal!!! "Butterflies in your stomach" is also just anxiety! Also normal!
honestly i never thought elliot as a creepy or forcing himself on you, but the first time i seen this was from a youtuber/ streamer that did a series of going thru all the eligible bachelors / bachelorette and i saw a short about how they called elliot out for forcing himself on them and i think that MUST have started the controversy! because i never saw anything bad about elliot for this scene, UNTIL i saw that video / short
This type of "omg he kissed me when I purposefully chose all the 'he should kiss me' options" is an old complaint.
Reminds me of Dragon Age 2 dudebro wank where dudes would play a male Hawke and then flirt with the male mage for a solid two thirds of the game and act surprised when the mage jumps into Hawke's arms. Like, my dude, my guy, you have to WORK to get to that scene by clicking all the labeled-with-a-big-pink-heart flirty dialogue options. There are so many signs before you get there. You cannot tell me you did not see any of them.
Just let me have my suit kink man in peace. In 3-piece >:3
OH BROTHER literally, this is recycled "hot takes" that we see time and time again 😔😔😔😔
A 15 minute linguistics and fandom analysis tangent seems oddly and comfortingly fitting in an episode about Elliott, a writer. Thank you for this, I was getting really tired of seeing the nonstop slander of him - yeah, he's a bit goofy, but I really like Elliott's passion in every aspect of him
It feels like a lot of characters gets taken with such bad faith :/ I'm glad you liked the video!
I just want to say I love your video and im so happy it exists 😭 thank you for having such a thoughtful and insightful and unbiased dive into my favorite character ❤ it saddens me whenever i come across the big sdv content creators on tiktok and they all collectively hate elliott and their large following just get influenced to do the same. Its ridiculous that hating a character seems more like a personality trait to them than relating to the character they love. Im so happy i found this video, it gives me hope that these haters are just the "quantity" Fans and people who actually understand elliott as a character are the "quality" Fans
@@mochirin8645 thanks for listening and commenting!!! It gets really tiring hearing the same "ummmm.... he's POMPOUS 🤣😝" since 2016 and ConcernedApe put in so much love into this game. I think the least we can do is not write off an entire character with 1-3 traits and call it a day
The bar larping made me want to tell this story . . .
When I was born, my dad and his brother went bar hopping to celebrate. They came across this cowboy themed one and decided to go in dramatically ask for a whiskey. When dad said the words, the barkeep gave him a look and asked, "what kind?" haha Adding to the fail, his brother basically asked for a chaser. I cannot do the story justice through written word, but it's always funny.
As a side note, my dad is not awkward or easily embarrassed. He is quite charismatic. Just failed to consider the fact that he would need to pick a specific type of whiskey. haha His brother has always been a bit of a goof though. In an adorable way.
LOL ty for sharing! I think my partner is very charismatic but there's been times where a social situation is brand new and he's left dumbfounded and says the "wrong" answer. I find it cute and funny but I think others would get put off or cringe, especially in a video game where it's a fork of escapism and everything is very romanticized
Great video! I have been thinking about watching this video since it released, but since its about Elliott, I did wait until I was more mentally ready, hes my favorite bachelor and I am kinda wary about videos about him sometimes (the fiona sangster deepdive was fun but it felt way more judgy than on the others but I'm not sure if its because Elliott is my favorite and that I know not many people like him so I might have been a bit defensive from the start). Worth the wait though!
The "accepted fanon as canon" part actually was what happened to me with Elliott before I started even befriending him on my first save. I kept seeing people saying he was bad, annoying, a stalker, a yandere (doesn't help that the yandere mods were really popular in early 2023 and still are. i dont see the appeal tbh). So I thought I would befriend him out of spite from all those people, and I had such a pleasant surprise that he was such a charming dork! He makes me so happy, hes such a goof and I'm very corny so I love how poetic and corny he is.
And I dont know, seeing as hes one of the most hated bachelors while hes the most "feminine" looking and acting (i disagree but yknow how some people act about a man with long hair and who is such a romantic), plus that I've seen more than one person saying that his social awkwardnes could also be read as neurodivergent coded, intentionally or not, i don't know, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth but i might be overthinking
Thanks for commenting! When Stardew Valley came out, Shane wasn't added in yet, and when he was, I immediately went for him and spent a lot of time on tumblr (He is very beloved there). It wasn't until I looked at Reddit, RUclips and Twitter where I saw a lot of really nasty comments that very specifically tackled those that struggled with addiction, substance abuse, mental illness, etc. It was really horrible seeing some statements online and videos with giant thumbnails and titles like "What's the point in dating Shane if he's still depressed". It's pretty icky.
So I completely understand where you're coming from w/ Elliott. I've seen some nasty words tossed around towards Elliott because of his long hair/"feminine" side and his socially awkward self. I don't think you're overthinking anything. I don't believe our opinions on art (video games are art, imo) can exist in a vacuum. It can be telling of how someone actually feels about certain people in real life :/
Also yeah, can NOT stand the yandere shit LMFAO
It's funny how they problematize Elliott's 10-heart event but not Shane's 10-heart event, because Shane is a much more hated character, and they don't see anything wrong with him kissing you (at least I've never found any complaints about it), even though both of them only do it because you gave them permission.
@@kahalmeida8528 it is shocking how much bias there is. I think people will bend over backwards defending their fave characters but simultaneously criticize another for the same issues :/
@@sodorart I think this is a lack of empathy with the characters and little consideration for their stories. I would even say hypocrisy, because sometimes people express their opinions without even having really delved into the game...
@@kahalmeida8528 100%! No nuance, no research, NONE. "I've formed an opinion in this character based on 2 lines and will now repeat what I've seen on Twitter" 😐
i’m an elliott hater tbh (i just don’t like his personality, it’s a me thing) but even i will defend his 10 heart scene. i’m a sam lover and in his 10 heart scene he asks if the player thinks of him as “just a friend” and then we have the option to stay in his bed and kiss him. in my opinion that would be worse than elliott’s 10 heart scene because there’s no “do you feel the same” it’s pretty established that you could be at the very start of your relationship. that’s just the first kiss of the relationship and he wanted to make it cute
@@lilaott6495 valid! No problem if this dork isnt your type LOL but yeah, I have never seen anyone complain about Sam's heart event (in regards to boundaries or consent) but tons when it comes to Elliott.
It makes me wonder if grace and benefit of the doubt is given to those deemed "inexperienced" (because Sam feels younger than Elliott) but not to those deemed "mature". Hmm...
I love your videos, always a good analysis on the lore of the game, and I really needed someone to talk about Elliott because he is my favorite character and the hate he receives is VERY unjustified, he is not perfect, none character is, but he is a GOOD and lovely person and unfortunately, because of the fandom, many have the wrong idea about him. 💔
The only reason I dislike Elliot is because my ex was a lot like him so now it just leaves a bad taste. I really don’t understand why other people dislike him so much though
I dunno if you've already talked about him but I'd like to see you dissecting or examining Clint the Blacksmith. I'm still a Stardew Noob (still in my first year) and I've seen various Stardew Valley creators hate on Clint for reasons I don't really understand? Like Clint isn't my favorite NPC or anything, I think he's an alright dude yet everyone acts like he's a weirdo creep for having a crush on Emily apparently? If anybody can explain why people hate Clint so much I'd be happy to listen.
@@myth-gal3477 he's on my list!
@@sodorart thanks for the reply! I honestly don't really see what's so hateable about Clint, could be because I'm a noob and haven't seen a specific heart event or something but to me, I just see him as a socially awkward big guy who makes a fool of himself sometimes. Not really a R/Niceguy Stalker guy that I've heard a few people call him.
@@myth-gal3477 totally agree with you. people don't even know what incel means anymore. he's just a lonely insecure guy with a crush. i wish there was a path that let him focus more on himself so people would stop hating on him constantly.
@@loveforkuja yeah definitely. I had assumed the community was being so hard on him because he's ugly (ugly as in just not traditionally attractive compared to the characters who have a lot of fans and simps, he's a big fella with a beard and a visible gut, he kinda reminds me of Barold from ACNH who is also similarly hated by the fandom), it just kinda makes me feel sad for the poor guy.
Clint goes further than just having a shy crush. He definitely spies on Emily from the bushes, and he tells the player "congrats" as if Emily is a prize to be won over and not a human being capable of making her own informed decisions because he misreads a non-romantic situation as being romantic. He also assumes hanging out as friends is a date when he finally does ask her to hang out. It's not just that he's shy, it's also the words he uses, their situational meaning, and what they represent as minimalist text-story drops to the player to summarize their characters. Clint wouldnt say 'congrats' if he wasn't incel-coded ('coded' as a writing term). It is unfortunate he never has any character development to become more than just an incel, but as it is that is the entirety of his written character.
Hope that helps to explain why people read him as creepy rather than just shy 😀
You posted this at the perfect time 😂😂 i just got to work and need something to listen too lol
@@sidneywashington7108 LOL yeah I wanted to schedule this for early morning and see how it is, I'm glad it was at a good time!!
What a fantastic, well-reasoned (and reasonable) take. I’m new to SDV fandom (though devouring at a frightening pace) and have heard what I consider to be a surprising number of these kind of takes. I read the Haley one on your video at the time and just brushed it off, but I’ve heard some unnecessarily harsh ones about Demetrius and this one about Elliott and thought, what? The content creators get confused in my mind, though, without faces. But, like, where is the evidence that Demetrius locks Seb in a dungeon, like the evil step-mother, so his own child can inherit the kingdom? It’s just bizarre. But I’ve only spent a few hundred hours in the game. Maybe I’ll feel differently after a thousand. 😅
Still, nice to hear a reasonable voice occasionally.
@@nikifallen93 LOLOLOL The dungeon master Demetrius 💀 Yes, I also need to make an episode about him as well.
I'm glad you're enjoying Stardew Valley!! With all of that said, the nonsense hot takes definitely aren't unique to Stardew Valley at all, happens in every single fandom. The power of the internet allows us to read anyone and everyone's "thinkpiece" (implying there was any thought put into half of them 😔) and I also think it's a vocal minority kinda thing.
I ran a poll on Tumblr asking who was everyone's fave spouses and Shane and Haley won by a landslide. 2nd place? Elliott and Sebastian tied, and Leah. Yet the amount of hot takes concerning Shane, Haley and Elliott would leave you surprised at the results!
When I saw the title of this video, I thought “wha??? What does Elliot need defense from?” Elliot is my favorite husband. Hearing about this, I just imagine a bunch of 18 year olds who have never dated, and whose activism begins and ends at being a “keyboard sjw” all parroting the same line. It’s not only annoying, but it undermines real issues.
LITERALLY. I wanted to get a bit more spicy in the podcast but I was like "hmm I dont want it to sound too soapboxy... " but I seriously think it's a lot of people that just havent had many life experiences (which is fine) and they seriously don't know what they're talking about, so they just parrot very serious criticisms. And these things don't exist in a vaccum, it's a small window into their other thoughts about real life problems.
Just… this. Also! it’s always the most annoying men ever who will hate Elliot. I think they’re kinda jealous and uncanny for seeing a really romantic character who knows how to treat woman right. With love and respect. They will call it unrealistic and call Elliott dumb and creepy- i will say Elliott reminds me of my boyfriend. And I love my boyfriend. There’s literally nothing wrong about being cute.
THANK YOUUUU!! I don’t mind when people don’t seem to click with Elliott like I do, but why do people always feel like they have to make up a criminal record for him in order to dislike him? All the “gotcha” moments people call out on his behavior most other dating candidates do, some ever WORSE? It just serves to mischaracterize him and I’m glad people are starting to give him a second chance 🎉
The incessant "gotcha" moments, good lord. It's like being the funniest person in the room is top top priority or something
@@sodorartYESSS it was SOOO annoying hearing the same sentiment over and over a couple years ago. Back then people didn’t really want to change their mind about Elliott and made fun of people in the comment sections of Elliott videos trying to defend him. Im glad nowadays I see more people starting to reevaluate his characterization and start to realize that they were maybe too hard on him when they made these stupid “gotcha” points
@@verandabeach9340 I think a lot of Tiktok creators have started roasting people for having zero media literacy and saying "critical thinking is at an all time low" and "everyone has brainrot and smooth brains" so maybe it's been helping LOL
@@sodorartLOL TikTok evaluations can be a bit crass but I’ll take what I can get 🫡
I've never romanced him before. I meant to once, but then I just ended up married to Shane again.
He's just so far out of the way on the beach. I feel like Shane it's just easier to run into. I mean, I ran into him on his way to work all the time without meaning to, but if I want to see Elliott I have to go out of my way to see him.
I definitely heard about that controversy though, but again I'm a shane fan xD so I was already pretty sure it was just overblown hyperbole without looking into it any deeper.
The internet can be such a mess sometimes.
I agree with everything you said by the way, I'm happy to hear someone putting it so clearly into words xD
I just married him and he's a pain in the ass to find everyday LOL he's all over the place and sometimes doesn't leave his cabin until like noon. I'm def more used to Shane's schedule lololol
@@sodorart It makes me wonder if there's a good mod out there that lets you knock on their doors. Maybe once you get to like one or two hearts, you can knock on your door and they can answer. Maybe there's like a thing where you can lose hearts if you go knocking on their door at 1:00 a.m. xD I feel like that could be kind of fun.
The whole thing with always wanting reality to be more dramatic rather than mundane reminds me a lot of Firewatch
Oh? I havent played it, what do you mean? :O
@@sodorart Spoilers warning here but basically firewatch is a game in which the protagonist and his coworker (the only other character you get to interact with) get into the fire lookout job because they are running away from their problems, and when weird/bizarre stuff starts happening to them, they start theorizing about this grand government surveillance conspiracy. By the end of the game they realise the answer to that mystery is not grandiose/glamourous at all, and its quite grim and realistic in a sense. I'd recommend at least watching a playthrough of it!
@@spookyskelebros9342 awesome, ty!!!!
I personally saw this statement in Leapalot's marriage candidates video that shown Elliott being the most hated by the younger players and popular with the older players. And probably there I also saw a discussion about how the 10-heart cutacene is designed. With the given context shaking from the joy is adorable but there's also an option that pairs "uncomfortable" with the shaking. It's a creppy vibe if taken out of context.
But yes, I agree that it's mostly a technical formality for the scene since you've already touched all romance bases and agreed to be "trapped" in a boat with him in the first place 👍
I agree that the "creepy" label seems unwarranted. Like, there's enough space to possibly interpret the kiss as a bad/awkward move - IRL a person should probably ask or watch out for body language cues (that we're not getting cos it's a pixel art game). But that doesn't make a person into a creep.
Personally, he's really not my cup of tea. Your reasoning that he's socially awkward makes a lot of sense, I hadn't really thought that much about it before and taken it more at face value as him being pompous and kinda arrogant. Most of what he does is so off-key in the beginning, like talking about himself, then saying "let's talk about you instead" and then proceeds to ask you for help with a houseplant :D
It seems like most of the bachelors are standoffish, straight up rude or weird in the beginning, apart from maybe Harvey. The bachelorettes seem a lot more welcoming overall, except for Haley of course.
I liked how you expanded on and explained the cultural stuff. With something like SV, it's difficult to come up with something entirely new, so listening to this episode felt like there were some new thoughts that aren't just rehashing all of the usual arguments over again.
Thank you for your comment !! I've been around the block in the SV community so I'm beyond sick of the same talking points and thinkpieces, I'm glad my yapping podcast isn't contributing to that.
Yeah I agree, the bachelors seem so awkward and socially inept compared to the bachelorettes LOL This might be an interesting topic for a podcast episode. Maybe ConcernedApe poured a little bit of himself into the bachelors, and then poured a little of his wife into the bachelorettes (He probs views her as perfect LOL)
I like Elliot - the florid language makes me chuckle, but he's alright.
I've married all the possibilities except Abigail - haven't gotten to her yet because I've seen too many other people romance her, and I know everything that happens, so I almost feel like I've done it.
When I romanced Elliot, I thought he was a little over-the-top sometimes, but he was sweet and a little romantic.
I agree that he's a tad awkward in the boat, but he doesn't completely know where he stands in the relationship yet - and he's nervous and doesn't want to mess up - so, of course, he almost messes up. I found it endearing - because, after all - you have to WORK to get there! You literally set the whole thing up - but then find it "creepy" when he wants to kiss you? Strange. Maybe the folks who think this way are uncomfortable with intimacy? I dunno.
ALL the male characters in the game are awkward when I think about it - especially the closer you get to the Mermaid's Pendant - they at least have their awkward moments: like Sam having to hide you in his bed because he's worried about what his mom will think; or to the other extreme, Clint, who is awkwardness personified, poor slob - though, since you can't marry him, it's not the same thing.
I'm interested to hear your take on Clint, though. Reactions to Clint serve to illustrate one of the phenomena you discuss in your video - there's a lot of received wisdom from people with similar "fanon" storylines (great word, by the way) that have become very close to "canon" regarding Clint. Is Clint really an Incel? Many think he is. I think it depends on your definition of Incel for starters. I don't think Clint is that far gone. Incels, at least as I perceive them, are arrogant, egotistical barnyard roosters who think they should be worshiped because they're "Male". Clint doesn't have the ego or self-regard to be a proper Incel. Clint is a schlub and he knows it.
Anyway, I'm really enjoying this series. I look forward to the next one. Sorry for the novella.
@@neiltheblaze ty for the novella :))
And yes, with Clint, it's a lot of regurgitation, and someone will point out something about Clint and the response is "Oh I didn't know he said that" and it's.... a major dialogue 😐 so it's like... are there people even talking to this character that they hate or just repeating yt videos they listened to...
That’s a hidden gem, bro
I never hated Elliott or anything like that, but before I played the game, I heard he was really pretentious and such, and I went with a little bit of that assumption. But then I talked to Elliott a couple of times at the beginning of my playthrough, and I thought he isn’t really like people say. Like, I wasn’t super interested in the character, but he isn’t that bad. Now I think you’ve sold me on how Elliott really is (or probably is). I still wouldn’t romance him as I prefer Sam or Seb, but I started seeing Elliott differently, and that’s nice. I’m a little more interested in the character and I have a better perspective of him.
Yet another interessting episode :) I would like to hear your thoughts on Clint. Is he really such a sad gamma male or is there more behind him? Because it feels like, he recieves a lot of hate for his self pityness to the point, where people build a geode breaker in his shop just to do it for free in front of his face. That turns me off a lot, so i am hoping, there is more to him, than what we get through the regular gameplay.
Ty!! I have Clint on the list!
Can you make a video about Penny's father's fate and what happened to him
I completely blame the Yandere Elliot mod and its popularity
Nice break down🥰💐
Thank you for watching and commenting!!! :D
Elliott isn't my cup of tea (I'm lesbian so no men are lol) but I did seriously consider marrying him if his marriage room came with his piano cuz I can't get those naturally in the game
I mean Elliott is basically Manny from Modern Family
Do you think I should divorce Abigail. If I do I will either marry Elliot or Emily
I totally agree! There's just one thing. While the player may be totally romantically attracted to Elliot, they might not be sexually attracted to him, and I think that should go for any spouse
Hiii 👋🏻👋🏻👋🏻
This is good stuff.
Agree 100 percent about Elliot ( and love all of that research you did) .
I was going to romance Elliot; he is just never really in my " I'm going this way" world.
In the end it worked because Sebastian 🥰
Ps. Sorry I've been MIA , stupid Helene. We still don't have internet, had to upgrade my data plan to be able to access RUclips 😑 Anyway, hope everyone is having a great weekend 💫
Thanks for watching and commenting !!
I'm so sorry about Helene :( But thank goodness you're safe and okay!! I hope this weekend is a little better for you!
Tysm ! 😀