I think this is an unrealistic expectation that everyone has. People want to believe that they can learn all these technologies in a couple of months but in reality there’s no way for instructors to fit so much content in such a short period of time so they had to rush through the material. In the end people can not grasp the concepts to get a solid sense of understanding and mastery.
Your expectations might be well aligned with the money you put up for the Bootcamp. Sorry if I misheard, but you gave ~30K USD for 6 months of Bootcamp. Is going to college and learning basics more expensive than that? Or is it that college requires a much higher time commitment than bootcamp? I understand that colleges don't guarantee good instructors as well. But more often than not, colleges focus on basics which goes much further than bootcamps.
@@TarunMall Literally depends on what "college" you're referring to. There are a few community colleges and trade schools that are getting into software development. As for actually colleges/universities, you pretty much have to take an entire computer science degree to get knowledge on that stuff.
Sorry, I have to add one more thing that you touched on a few times. I also wrote this constantly in those daily reports, but there is a looming fear of speaking out against a/A--during the program you are afraid to speak out bc they could possibly kick you out and hit you with the full $31K bill, and then when you graduate, you're still afraid to speak out...pretty much for fear of getting hit with the bill too. I know a couple people who were dismissed bc of speaking up and out. If they don't like you, you're out. They hang that high and waaaay overpriced bill over your head forever
100% people are afraid to speak out because they are concerned about the consequences. I was one of those people, I did not want to run the risk of putting my family financial situation in stress.
I was kicked out of App Academy back in 2016 after three weeks for writing in one of my blog entries (we were supposed to keep a blog at the time, I don't know if that has changed) that I felt bait-and-switched by the high pressure exams that were causing people to fail out, and that I wouldn't have signed up for the program if I'd known that was how it was going to be run. I was yanked out of class and expelled the next day. Getting kicked out of a/A was one of the lowest points in my life because I'd left my life behind to move from the Midwest out to San Francisco to gamble on this program. It also caused the breakup of a five-year relationship with my girlfriend at the time. After getting kicked out I was left living in a tiny hotel room in San Francisco (which I was sharing with a roommate) for the next six months with no source of income and quickly dwindling savings. I did my best to self-study for a few months, and at the eleventh hour after sending out 400+ applications and only getting two interviews, with virtually no money left, I got a job offer in NYC, which was how I started my software career. Needless to say I don't recommend a/A.
I am so sorry this happened to you in 2016. I wish I had known how many times it's probably happened to others throughout the years. There were similar things that happened in App Academy cohorts during 2020-2022, had similar happen to me as well so I really empathize for you here. Thanks for sharing this. I hope others become more informed.
@@SYDsyd444 hey late reply, I'd say it's good to spend time on online research before deciding. Many have tried warning ppl on App Academy throughout the years, have seen concerning ones in 2015 to 2022. There's both good and bad reviews but some websites have mostly good whereas others have way more mixed reviews. For a/A specifically and probably other bootcamps, it seems Reddit, RUclips, TeamBlind, InHerSight, Better Business Bureau, and BPPE citations/fines (a/A has 2 big ones for alarming reasons) should be considered. Also good to know that a/A has been bribing for reviews (giving jackets/hoodies in exchange for reviews, referral links encouraged in some, contacting those who left public negative ones to get them to make it positive, etc.) like on Yelp. Websites that focus on reviews only tend to have automatic display orders so it can take some time to see the low-rated ones or ppl's warnings depending on website.
@@SYDsyd444 forgot to add, they've also been sued several times in past few years at least if you look into their parent company Hash Map Labs Inc, it's not under App Academy online. And there's 400+ not recommended Yelp mixed reviews on them not in default shown ones.
I went to aA too. I'd call it an outright scam. If somebody had played video games all through the covid apocalypse during the same time I spent there, they'd be better off than me financially and also in terms of mental health. Probably the worst decision I've ever made.
As someone who played video games all through the covid apocalypse I appreciate that comment, I had been kicking myself for passing on an in-person bootcamp right when it hit. I'm broke, but at least I'm not in debt to a scam artist :P
@Lavenderrose I am sorry that you are in this situation. I do not know what are the rules now but whe I was in the bootcamp camp if you failed 3 times and it was after 4 weeks in the program you get expelled and had to pay for every hour you where in the program. I do not remember the cost per hour but it think it was a couple of hundred dollars per hour. My advice is to read the contract you signed with them it should have the latest and greatest rules. Best of luck
Autumn Wiggins , a cohort lead, was literally at a fucking cafe trying to have a zoom session. I couldnt even focus. The cohort lecturer Jeff Granof there said " i didnt prepare anything for today" in regards to a Wednesday morning lecture. Everyone is really like cult like. Its strange almost like you cant be yourself or something very odd. Oh and on the second day someone hacked into the zoom lecture and was trolling etc. Im in it now and am considering just going to university where people are regulated to be real educators.
trust your instincts, intuition, empirical evidence and read on the situation. I felt the same way in the program very early on. I stayed in, and regret having done so even post-graduation.
Im sorry for your bad experience, everything you said seems all valid.. my experience so far(week 15) has been better than I expected.. I think it comes down to 'lucking out' on a cohort instructor who has a niche for teaching. My original cohort instructor seemed knowledgable but bad teaching style(monotone, no emphasizing or deeper explanation) I was then deferred and now Im with an instructor who seems passionate about what he does and its great. Btw my cohort has 50 people in it, about 6 TAs but only takes a few minutes at the most to get someone in your room.. I have though, met 1 or 2 TAs that were brand new and seemed less helpful and introverted
Hi! I want to thank you for creating this video, and speaking out. 2021 cohorts is a fucking dumpster fire and a lot of us (students and instructors) are angry, and scared.
I hope that AppAcademy opens its eyes and see what is going on and do what is right. Elizabeth I am sorry to hear that you and other people (including the instructors) are experiencing issues with the program.
Is it a dumpster fire right now? As in too many students, not enough instructors, instructors not knowledgeable about the curriculum? All of those things?
A teacher can make or break someone's career. Sorry you had a bad experience. Well done for having courage to share it. I have had good and bad experiences from different bootcamps too.
Wow, so the instructors don't teach live...we watch a video and the TAs don't know anything? I was close to signing up with them and now definitely having second thoughts.
I was thinking about doing it but not going to. I wouldn't want to be taught by a new graduate of the same place especially for that price. Were there many women in your cohort and how do you feel you were treated fairly?
For my cohort, we had ~10% female to 90% male ratio (similar for student-facing educational staff). I personally did not feel like I was treated fairly. A few women in my cohort and 1-2 cohorts behind mine hadn't either. There's been a few incidents in a/A cohorts but idk if mainly just in their online cohorts/programs due to lack of supervision, accountability, full awareness, etc. There's a 3/5 aA Yelp review by someone ~6-8 pages back on 7/20/2020 J.B. initials mentioning how "The program lacks representation of womxn, POC, and other minority groups. Also in my cohort, these marginalized groups left the program at a higher rate." They have a low rating on InHerSight too (2.3 via 49 votes currently).
Thank you for your videos, I was thinking about enrolling in the same 6 month online program -starting in July-, but after your videos I'm starting to reconsider. You're right about the fact that for $31k the instruction HAS to be top notch, I wonder if the situation is the same right now, or if maybe after reviews like yours they have tried to improve the quality of the instruction. As a seasoned developer, what would you recommend instead of a bootcamp? Thank you!
My intention is to bring clarity in the situation, because if i new that the lessons will be lead by a student who just graduated, and graduated with a different tech stack I would not have signed up. I just want you to know what is going on and be prepared for things like this. As I said there were other cohorts that had really capable instructors and things were good. I know that there were changes at AppAcademy, they shifted to having dedication people teaching specific modules, so in theory it should be better but I don't know how it is in practice. There are good things done by bootcamp however they are way overpriced. When it comes to learning to code, there are a lot of excellent courses, tutorials and books that will help anyone to become a software engineer. One of the challenges is to come up with a good curriculum. The key in learning to code is to apply it into practice, code, code, break things, fix then and code again, experiment. And continue to progress and try to become better every time. It takes a lot of grit and discipline because there will be days that will suck and you will want to give up, but it is important to know that it is ok and not all days are going to be easy.
@@HolisticDeveloper Thank you very much for the answer, you're right, the key is practice, practice, practice, and of course a good curriculum, if you have time in the future, it would be very helpful if you could share with us a useful curriculum. Sadly most people in RUclips have been bought by a school/bootcamp, so it's almost impossible to find trustworthy and unbiased opinions, so thank you for the honesty of your videos/reviews/opinions. Keep uploading good content!
Everything you have said about your experience is SPOT.ON. A few of us had really considered writing up a formal letter to express our dissatisfaction with the experience. They are constantly working on and updating the curriculum WHILE we are going through it. Students shouldnt feel that kind of growing pain. a/A very much is a predator. You mentioned that they reach out/announce job openings for TA positions pretty much going into capstone weeks knowing that there are students who are running low on funds (since we aren't allowed to work during the program) and there is this fear going into job search bc nobody feels adequately prepared. Definitely some pyramid scheme vibes. The career coaches are one hundred percent stretched thin. They have way too many students to "watch" over. you're lucky if you get 45 minutes a week with them. I, too, could go on and on and on about my experience and opinions. But again, you're spot on. In every week's required survey, when asking to rate from 1-10 on whether or not I'd recommend a/A, my response was always 1. I landed a job bc I worked my butt off, not because of a/A's help. I will say that I did learn a basic foundation in fundamentals, but hindsight is always 20/20. Could have learned more on my own. Thank you for your transparency!
Hi Lauren 👋. I am sad to hear that your cohort went thru similar issues. I was hoping it was only our March cohort. And I agree with you about the fixes and changes to the curriculum, if the curriculum is not complete then they should not charge the full price on a product that is not 100% developed. In regards to the recruitment process, yeah it feels like a pyramid scheme: Charge a high price of $31k per student, then hire them really cheep (no offense to the students because they need finance for a living).
Did I have to high expectations for a coding bootcamp?
I think this is an unrealistic expectation that everyone has. People want to believe that they can learn all these technologies in a couple of months but in reality there’s no way for instructors to fit so much content in such a short period of time so they had to rush through the material. In the end people can not grasp the concepts to get a solid sense of understanding and mastery.
Your expectations might be well aligned with the money you put up for the Bootcamp. Sorry if I misheard, but you gave ~30K USD for 6 months of Bootcamp. Is going to college and learning basics more expensive than that? Or is it that college requires a much higher time commitment than bootcamp? I understand that colleges don't guarantee good instructors as well. But more often than not, colleges focus on basics which goes much further than bootcamps.
@@TarunMall Literally depends on what "college" you're referring to. There are a few community colleges and trade schools that are getting into software development. As for actually colleges/universities, you pretty much have to take an entire computer science degree to get knowledge on that stuff.
@@jonathansun396 It wasn't a couple months though. It was like 6 months (a lot of universities only run for like 30 weeks of the year)
Sorry, I have to add one more thing that you touched on a few times. I also wrote this constantly in those daily reports, but there is a looming fear of speaking out against a/A--during the program you are afraid to speak out bc they could possibly kick you out and hit you with the full $31K bill, and then when you graduate, you're still afraid to speak out...pretty much for fear of getting hit with the bill too. I know a couple people who were dismissed bc of speaking up and out. If they don't like you, you're out. They hang that high and waaaay overpriced bill over your head forever
100% people are afraid to speak out because they are concerned about the consequences. I was one of those people, I did not want to run the risk of putting my family financial situation in stress.
I was kicked out of App Academy back in 2016 after three weeks for writing in one of my blog entries (we were supposed to keep a blog at the time, I don't know if that has changed) that I felt bait-and-switched by the high pressure exams that were causing people to fail out, and that I wouldn't have signed up for the program if I'd known that was how it was going to be run. I was yanked out of class and expelled the next day.
Getting kicked out of a/A was one of the lowest points in my life because I'd left my life behind to move from the Midwest out to San Francisco to gamble on this program. It also caused the breakup of a five-year relationship with my girlfriend at the time. After getting kicked out I was left living in a tiny hotel room in San Francisco (which I was sharing with a roommate) for the next six months with no source of income and quickly dwindling savings. I did my best to self-study for a few months, and at the eleventh hour after sending out 400+ applications and only getting two interviews, with virtually no money left, I got a job offer in NYC, which was how I started my software career.
Needless to say I don't recommend a/A.
I am so sorry this happened to you in 2016. I wish I had known how many times it's probably happened to others throughout the years. There were similar things that happened in App Academy cohorts during 2020-2022, had similar happen to me as well so I really empathize for you here. Thanks for sharing this. I hope others become more informed.
@@na-ch8es hey my cohort starts on Monday could I talk to you ?
@@SYDsyd444 hey late reply, I'd say it's good to spend time on online research before deciding. Many have tried warning ppl on App Academy throughout the years, have seen concerning ones in 2015 to 2022. There's both good and bad reviews but some websites have mostly good whereas others have way more mixed reviews. For a/A specifically and probably other bootcamps, it seems Reddit, RUclips, TeamBlind, InHerSight, Better Business Bureau, and BPPE citations/fines (a/A has 2 big ones for alarming reasons) should be considered. Also good to know that a/A has been bribing for reviews (giving jackets/hoodies in exchange for reviews, referral links encouraged in some, contacting those who left public negative ones to get them to make it positive, etc.) like on Yelp. Websites that focus on reviews only tend to have automatic display orders so it can take some time to see the low-rated ones or ppl's warnings depending on website.
@@SYDsyd444 forgot to add, they've also been sued several times in past few years at least if you look into their parent company Hash Map Labs Inc, it's not under App Academy online. And there's 400+ not recommended Yelp mixed reviews on them not in default shown ones.
I went to aA too. I'd call it an outright scam. If somebody had played video games all through the covid apocalypse during the same time I spent there, they'd be better off than me financially and also in terms of mental health. Probably the worst decision I've ever made.
As someone who played video games all through the covid apocalypse I appreciate that comment, I had been kicking myself for passing on an in-person bootcamp right when it hit. I'm broke, but at least I'm not in debt to a scam artist :P
I’m in this bootcamp it’s actually hell I hate it but I was told if you fail 3 times they forgive your debt is this true ?
@Lavenderrose I am sorry that you are in this situation. I do not know what are the rules now but whe I was in the bootcamp camp if you failed 3 times and it was after 4 weeks in the program you get expelled and had to pay for every hour you where in the program. I do not remember the cost per hour but it think it was a couple of hundred dollars per hour. My advice is to read the contract you signed with them it should have the latest and greatest rules. Best of luck
I was seriously considering aA as a bootcamp to join. Now i am perplexed 😕 thank you for sharing your experience
Autumn Wiggins , a cohort lead, was literally at a fucking cafe trying to have a zoom session. I couldnt even focus. The cohort lecturer Jeff Granof there said " i didnt prepare anything for today" in regards to a Wednesday morning lecture. Everyone is really like cult like. Its strange almost like you cant be yourself or something very odd. Oh and on the second day someone hacked into the zoom lecture and was trolling etc. Im in it now and am considering just going to university where people are regulated to be real educators.
trust your instincts, intuition, empirical evidence and read on the situation. I felt the same way in the program very early on. I stayed in, and regret having done so even post-graduation.
@@na-ch8es absolutely couldnt agree more. very lame experience
@@cloudstudios7408 definitely not worth $31k
so scary, i was considering this bootcamp at some point glad i passed
Im sorry for your bad experience, everything you said seems all valid.. my experience so far(week 15) has been better than I expected.. I think it comes down to 'lucking out' on a cohort instructor who has a niche for teaching. My original cohort instructor seemed knowledgable but bad teaching style(monotone, no emphasizing or deeper explanation) I was then deferred and now Im with an instructor who seems passionate about what he does and its great. Btw my cohort has 50 people in it, about 6 TAs but only takes a few minutes at the most to get someone in your room.. I have though, met 1 or 2 TAs that were brand new and seemed less helpful and introverted
What coding bootcamp are you attending. Are you doing app academy?
Yes, attend that online curriculum
I recently did the program and had a very similar experience to everything mentioned in her video. Were you in the part-time, 16week, or 24week one?
$31k would set off warning bells to my mind.
Seems to be best to just stay away from bootcamps and just go the self taught route.
Hi! I want to thank you for creating this video, and speaking out. 2021 cohorts is a fucking dumpster fire and a lot of us (students and instructors) are angry, and scared.
I hope that AppAcademy opens its eyes and see what is going on and do what is right.
Elizabeth I am sorry to hear that you and other people (including the instructors) are experiencing issues with the program.
Is it a dumpster fire right now? As in too many students, not enough instructors, instructors not knowledgeable about the curriculum? All of those things?
@@Zeegoner All of those things, even in 2022. At BBB (Better Business Bureau) they aren't accredited and have been reported twice recently.
you are indeed Brave. Thanks for your apportation
A teacher can make or break someone's career. Sorry you had a bad experience. Well done for having courage to share it. I have had good and bad experiences from different bootcamps too.
Wow, so the instructors don't teach live...we watch a video and the TAs don't know anything? I was close to signing up with them and now definitely having second thoughts.
Yes, that was the case last year, we were watching pre-recorded videos.
Really? I have been away for a while. Now, I come back & see this shocking title. I thought it went well. Okay, I am listening.
Good to see you back. I hope you are doing well.
Thanks so much for such an honest review
I was thinking about doing it but not going to. I wouldn't want to be taught by a new graduate of the same place especially for that price. Were there many women in your cohort and how do you feel you were treated fairly?
For my cohort, we had ~10% female to 90% male ratio (similar for student-facing educational staff). I personally did not feel like I was treated fairly. A few women in my cohort and 1-2 cohorts behind mine hadn't either. There's been a few incidents in a/A cohorts but idk if mainly just in their online cohorts/programs due to lack of supervision, accountability, full awareness, etc. There's a 3/5 aA Yelp review by someone ~6-8 pages back on 7/20/2020 J.B. initials mentioning how "The program lacks representation of womxn, POC, and other minority groups. Also in my cohort, these marginalized groups left the program at a higher rate." They have a low rating on InHerSight too (2.3 via 49 votes currently).
I subbed because of this video. 👏
Why didn't you go to rithm instead?
Thank you for your videos, I was thinking about enrolling in the same 6 month online program -starting in July-, but after your videos I'm starting to reconsider. You're right about the fact that for $31k the instruction HAS to be top notch, I wonder if the situation is the same right now, or if maybe after reviews like yours they have tried to improve the quality of the instruction. As a seasoned developer, what would you recommend instead of a bootcamp? Thank you!
My intention is to bring clarity in the situation, because if i new that the lessons will be lead by a student who just graduated, and graduated with a different tech stack I would not have signed up. I just want you to know what is going on and be prepared for things like this. As I said there were other cohorts that had really capable instructors and things were good.
I know that there were changes at AppAcademy, they shifted to having dedication people teaching specific modules, so in theory it should be better but I don't know how it is in practice.
There are good things done by bootcamp however they are way overpriced.
When it comes to learning to code, there are a lot of excellent courses, tutorials and books that will help anyone to become a software engineer. One of the challenges is to come up with a good curriculum. The key in learning to code is to apply it into practice, code, code, break things, fix then and code again, experiment. And continue to progress and try to become better every time. It takes a lot of grit and discipline because there will be days that will suck and you will want to give up, but it is important to know that it is ok and not all days are going to be easy.
@@HolisticDeveloper Thank you very much for the answer, you're right, the key is practice, practice, practice, and of course a good curriculum, if you have time in the future, it would be very helpful if you could share with us a useful curriculum. Sadly most people in RUclips have been bought by a school/bootcamp, so it's almost impossible to find trustworthy and unbiased opinions, so thank you for the honesty of your videos/reviews/opinions. Keep uploading good content!
Everything you have said about your experience is SPOT.ON. A few of us had really considered writing up a formal letter to express our dissatisfaction with the experience. They are constantly working on and updating the curriculum WHILE we are going through it. Students shouldnt feel that kind of growing pain. a/A very much is a predator. You mentioned that they reach out/announce job openings for TA positions pretty much going into capstone weeks knowing that there are students who are running low on funds (since we aren't allowed to work during the program) and there is this fear going into job search bc nobody feels adequately prepared. Definitely some pyramid scheme vibes. The career coaches are one hundred percent stretched thin. They have way too many students to "watch" over. you're lucky if you get 45 minutes a week with them. I, too, could go on and on and on about my experience and opinions. But again, you're spot on. In every week's required survey, when asking to rate from 1-10 on whether or not I'd recommend a/A, my response was always 1. I landed a job bc I worked my butt off, not because of a/A's help. I will say that I did learn a basic foundation in fundamentals, but hindsight is always 20/20. Could have learned more on my own. Thank you for your transparency!
Hi Lauren 👋. I am sad to hear that your cohort went thru similar issues. I was hoping it was only our March cohort. And I agree with you about the fixes and changes to the curriculum, if the curriculum is not complete then they should not charge the full price on a product that is not 100% developed.
In regards to the recruitment process, yeah it feels like a pyramid scheme: Charge a high price of $31k per student, then hire them really cheep (no offense to the students because they need finance for a living).
Nailed it on the head Lauren
@@HolisticDeveloper Cheap** line 5
Trilogy boot camp was also disappointing
thank you for the advice, I am totally sure that I won't buy a Bootcamp of AppAcademy
Pretty lady.. I'm sorry about app academy
Im doing the challenges right now lol let me withdraw my application 🥴
What a scam 🤭🤭🤭
I would recommend CS50, it is really good to start in when you are interested to learn to code and is absolutely free
TLDR? It's almost an hour long.
I tried to make it shorter, but I can talk for days about everything that was not ok
you have to speak louder and clearly. It's hard to understand what you are saying.
It's not, maybe get your ears and speakers checked.