Jut an idea that just hit me=_= Djura has one eye covered. What if the eyeball is his? He is a retired Hunter - but we know that Hunters don't really retire... they either end up crazy or dead, or, indeed, are whisked away to the Nightmare. But he's managed to find his way out of that. Maybe, he did it by ripping his eye out as soon as it 'went bad' and leaving the Hunt altogether - he says that he's no longer dreaming, which may mean he no longer visits the Hunter's Dream, where we find the eye... Just a thought, though.
Jezack R yeah i had a very similar idea just recently (honestly have never seen your comment before so i dont know how i came to a similar conclusion without seeing this)
That actually does explain Father Gascoigne's eye coverings. I was wondering why he would have that. Well they say the eye is door to the soul, so an eye that is blood drunk shows a person is blood thirsty.
One thing that occurred to me as soon as I entered the Old Hunters Nightmare was that the sun in that place looks nearly identical to a collapsed hunter's eye. That makes me think that your character is peering into the eye of the hunter and thus enters the realm of their blood-drunk minds (even if an Amygdala is necessary for the transportation). And now that I think about that I understand more fully why an Amygdala is necessary for the transference given that the amygdala of the brain is linked to emotions & motivations. One another note: I've really jumped into Bloodborne w/ both feet over the past month or so (almost earned my platinum trophy) and your videos have been instrumental in my understanding of the lore. A couple weeks ago I posted an extended thought in the discussion section of your channel and am curious if you've had time to read through that. Interested to hear your response.
Something that I don't think is really backed up by any in-game lore, or can really be confirmed or denied in any meaningful way, but that I still find interesting nonetheless, is that when you look up at the sky in the hunter's nightmare, it looks like the collapsed pupil of a blood-drunk hunter, right? But rather than an eye peering down at the nightmare, the feeling I get is that we're looking at the pupil from inside the eye, and that the light glowing through the pupil is actually the light of the outside world shining in. When the ghost of the orphan is dispelled, the eye doesn't disappear, it simply closes, because the nightmare is over, and the hunters can now rest in peace. If I wanted to REALLY stretch, I'd say that the Hunter's Nightmare is the nightmare of a specific hunter, constructed of his own memories, and that other hunters are taken there when they die or when they've become intoxicated with blood. In the same way that the Hunter's Dream is the dream of Gerhman, and the Nightmare of Mensis is... well, you get it, the "Hunter's Nightmare" is a "hunter's", singular possessive. If I had to guess, I'd say that the Hunter's Nightmare is also Gerhman's, and that the nightmare itself exists within his eye. Gerhman doesn't cover his eyes, like other blood-drunk hunters do, and when I tried to angle the camera to look at his eyes, the results were inconclusive (I think they look partially collapsed, but that could easily just be the lighting making me see what I want to see) but in any case, with your idea that hunters covered their eyes to hide from amygdalae, then it makes sense that Gerhman wouldn't need to cover his eyes. There are no amygdalae in his dream, after all. The idea that the nightmare is Gerhman's would explain why we hear him sobbing when the orphan crawls out of Kos' corpse, and also why when the nightmare is slain and the eye closed, he is finally able to sleep peacefully. I think this kind of explains why the people in the nightmare don't exist as they do currently (i.e. old or sick or dead) but as Gerhman remembers them, either as hunters in their prime or as beasts that have succumbed to bloodlust. Dreams in Bloodborne are basically real places, so other people can enter the nightmare without being trapped by it if they have the right key, much like we can travel freely between the Nightmare of Mensis and the Nightmare Frontier. The memories of the first hunter would be rich with secrets, which is why I think Simon is there looking for them, and why the church itself may possibly have placed Brador there to kill any hunters that would search too deeply within the past. Like I said, I don't think there's any real lore that confirms any of this, and I'm coming at this months after most people have stopped caring about Bloodborne, but I find it very interesting to think about.
I'd really like to subscribe to this theory, if for no reason that there's a sense of romance in it, but that would be assuming that Gehrman is drunk with blood. For some reason, I can't attach that idea to his image.
The implication of Gerhman resting is due to finally putting an end to the DLC nightmare.. The reason? Could be anything! Could be as simple as Gerhman being restless because the orphan is still alive, that Maria's major regret coming to a close, etc. Also, Gerhman does have both eyes, so I'm not sure we are "inside his head" or anything. Nightmares seem to exist outside of reality.. or as we have seen, in layers. Just like the way we can see the shipwrecks in the Nightmare Frontier (above the DLC nightmare), I don't think they are within stuff in the "real world".
If I had to have one thing talked about, I'd want to learn more about the Brain of Mensis and the mummies that seem to be related to it (even the one mummy who gives us the Make Contact gesture).
Prillis! yeah ive tried theorising about the mensis brain and its relationship to its nightmare (it is named after it after all, dont know why mergo sleeps there) but to no evail
..through my eyes, you really are a great one redgrave! thank you for the upload! and thank you for your "paleblood hunt". mind-blowing analysis! your work really elevated my bloodborne experience to a cosmic level! and i just have to thank all of you guys who participated in all those incredibly interesting conversations on redgraves, aegons and jsf's channel. amazing stuff! shoutouts to all of you hunters & deep respect!
Just found your channel today thanks to a Reddit user and I wanted to say thanks.. this is great .. I know I'm a little late to the party but I just got bloodborne 2 weeks ago and I'm devouring every bit of lore and info I can find and your channel is amazing! Thanks again!
Interesting theory. I always associated covering eyes with master willems "eyes on the inside". But you get to see gascoine, amelia, blood starved beast, suspicious beggar, all of them blood drunk and hideous beasts. Perhaps it was in their best interest to avoid the nightmare. Moreover this could tie in to the fact that Lawrence was taken into the nightmare against his will (did not cover his eyes) supported by Gehrmans dialogue ""Oh, Laurence... what's taking you so long... I've grown too old for this, of little use now, I'm afraid..." I could never fully grasp this piece of dialogue. Did laurence know that gehrman was trapped in the dream ? and was gehrman waiting for laurence to accomplish something to end his dream, perhaps hunting the great ones ?
Love the picture of the blood drunk eye and how it fits with your Minamata theory! Such great content! Mercurialentis (brown discoloration-caused by mercury-of anterior capsule of eye lens) is documented in medical texts as the first sign of mercury toxicity; it is an indicator and early sign of further eye damage. They certainly do their homework at FROM!!
IDK if you'll see this, but I really wanna thank you for all these videos you did. They really inspired me so much back when they were released- as a bit of a teenage wallflower, I devoured all of these at a rapacious pace, as Bloodborne was (and still is) something of a special interest of mine. Your passion and intellect were inspiring, and spurred me deep into writing and media analysis. Now, over half a decade later, I'm on the cusp of completing my degree. I still refer back to not only these videos but also the Paleblood Hunt as foundational pillars of my kinda "intellectual library" if you wanna call it that, along with a bevy of information that I've absorbed in the years since. I'm actually writing my own TTRPG system inspired by Bloodborne as part of my degree, and I'm going to be putting you into the special thanks section at the very front of the book- I get the feeling you'd probably balk at that lol. I hope whatever you're up to nowadays is bringing you all the fulfilment and joy you deserve! And again, thank you Redgrave. For your writing, intellect, passion, and inspiration. Thank you.
Redgrave, thanks for posting so many great lore videos. I was wondering what your thoughts on all the water in Bloodborne is about. There are a lot of little things with water that I've noticed through playing the game (like the Deep Sea Rune inverted on the clock- wall of the clock tower before you fight Maria), Rom and Kos's relation to the sea, water runes and their relation to defense, and lots of other stuff. I know this probably doesn't really qualify as a "little" thing to talk about, but never the less I thought it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it.
Interesting theory about the Amygdala. And it would agree with the fact that we find Amygdala's arm in the Nightmare - some hunter must have put up a fight! :D
personally i think the eye is djuras. like this was a hunter who managed to keep out of the nightmare, even though its stated that blood drunkeness happens to all hunters (plus all the powder kegs went blood drunk except him ((i know it isnt fully stated he is one but i think he is)). his signature hat has a covering over one eye, meaning we have never him with both, PLUS the blood-drunk eye seems to have been cut clumsily out, perhaps indicating that he did it in a last ditch effort to remain in old yarnham. i didnt realise but theres actually another comment under this video also adding light to this idea, hope i might be adding something new to the table though so i might leave this comment up
In Lovecraft, a spider deity connected Earth Dreamlands to the waking world with her web and when it was completed, the waking world would end. Amygdala is an arachnid-like Great One and seeing as the Hunter is taken to the Lecture Hall with the Tonsil Stone....I think it's less that Amydala's looking for individuals with certain items and more like just sorting "items" out, using them as a stamp that says "I belong in this shit-my-pants crazy place instead of this shit-my-pants crazy place". Patches gave us the Tonsil Stone, throwing us into danger to offer us to his god (And potentially, future form), which made the Amygdala transport us to the Lecture Hall where we'd find out way to the Nightmare Frontier. Maybe it's something like sorting, as well as a self-benefiting service of sorts, as Amygdala doesn't appear to be only the body but is more of a conscious controlling multiple bodies. With that in mind, it seems like Amygdala sent us to the Hunter's Nightmare to "put us where we belong" and to potentially make the idiots inside pay for killing one of its bodies
hey man love your videos, the one on odeon in particular was unbelievable. just wanted to ask you something. the note that reads : "The Byrgenwerth spider hides all manner of rituals, and keeps our lost master from us. A terrible shame. It makes my head shudder uncontrollably." couldn't the lost master be Micolash as we can enter Yahargul after killing Rom? also: "It makes my head shudder uncontrollably." could have something to do with the seizures induced by mercury poisoning and the Mensis Cage was a way of dealing with that? i would love to hear your feedback man!
im 5 years late on this but i feel it needs to be said that there are dead hunters in the hunter's dream. its a hell for dead hunters as well as a prison for living, blooddrunk one's.
I was thinking maybe the hunters covered their eyes to hide the fact that they ARE blood drunk. so that the other hunters or hunter of hunters wouldn't attack or find them out so easy.
Brilliant, that literally makes perfect sense in anyway you look at it. The church hunters also covered their eyes in the end -signalling the curse of Kos to be the latest curse that afflicts all hunters no matter the class, the Amygdalas reason for being everywhere is to abduct blood drunk hunters and spirit them away to the nightmare. Before this we had no real reason for Amygdalas were hidden everywhere in plain sight
I just recently beat Bloodborne and have been binging your videos but this is the first time I feel like I could add something. What you described with hunters disappearing reminded me of the Japanese folklore idea of being spirited away, kamikakushi (literally hidden by god). But yeah, it’s the idea that the mysterious disappearance of someone is due to angering the gods. Thought people might find that interesting 😊
Can't help but to think that beasthood and insight combat each other as game-play mechanic and same goes for lore. To me eye of a blood-drunk hunter represents one who has lost his sanity, he doesn't have insight to absord madness so it's his own eyes which gets turned into mush -> and he devolves/evolves into beasthood. Like Yharnamites do. This is reason why player needs that particular item as he has tons of insight at this point already. For Amygdala the player seems to be hunter who was there when things went down and needs to be sent back into his nightmare, just like Tonsil Stone is mark for that another Amygdala to sent them into their particular nightmare. I don't think Yharnamites do need to wory about Hunter's nightmare (not saying that they wouldn't worry about it!), i think Amygdala will try to put everyone into nightmares fit for their phobias. For Yharnamites it might be Old Yharnam actually? Deeply sorry for all typos. too lazy to double check.
Interesting stuff to think about. One note I have is the Amygdala that can bring you to the Lecture Hall (and therefore Mensis' nightmare) is not the way that the School of Mensis were pulled into the nightmare. I think that it's possible that any Great One (in this case Kos or possibly the Orphan, or whomever we hear cursing the hunters) is responsible for the Blood-drunk Hunters being in the nightmare. The Amygdala is just a separate way of accessing it that we use due to the fact we are not drunk on blood, just like the Tonsil Stone.
I have once mentioned this in one of your streams and you off-handedly aproved of it, but I feel the need to expand on it, so here goes. Theory has it that Tonsil Stones are a sign of the scourge of the beast plague of Loran. The plague of the silverbeasts who were blood-drunk and sent to the Nightmare Frontiere by Amygdalae just like Yharnamites. Tonsil Stones function the same as the Eyes of Blood-Drunk Hunters because of this. There are other small little hints thrown to support this. For one, the Tonsil Stone (which most likely fell from the Nightmare Frontiere) mentions in its description that it's likely to be meteorite does not contradict what a real life tonsil stone would be (and that is.a stone). Tonsil Stones in real life are comparable to sand, and we know from the Ailing Loran dungeons that Loran was a country ravaged by sand storms or something of such sorts. There are other stronger hints though, the Loran silver beasts hold their mouth open at all times (which is common among those who have bigger-than-average tonsil stones to ease the pain from breathing iirc) and they seem to have swelling throats. It's especially noteworthy that the Silverbeasts in Nightmare of Mensis that excrete worms when dying have a, dare I say, intruiging throats. If you get really upcloes to them, you can see the worms within their throats! Whether or not you believe that those worms are Vermin, it still goes to show some sort of connection in my opinion.
FirstName LastName thats the thing, they are called Loran Silverbeasts because you find them in Loran! The ones is the Nightmare arent called Loran Silverbeasts, they are just Silverbeasts. Thats why the Darkbeast you find in Loran isnt called Paarl, its called Loran Darkbeast. I dont understand why people realize that about the Darkbeast, but not the Silverbeasts. Its like people love the idea of Frontier being the nightmare equivalent of Loran because it answers so many questions, albeit in a flimsy way. Thats fine, but I find that to be a very weak answer. People shouldnt fixate so much on this idea, because it really doesnt have any sort of evidence to support it. The way I see it, Frontier is just the extension of the Nightmare of Mensis, its closer to the water. You can even see the Mensis castle from it. The Nightmare dimension seems to be some kind of ocean with some land mass, where you can recreate stuff in it based on your memories and conscience. I have no idea why people associate it with Loran.
Hattori Hanzo Well, for the most part, nations that were before Yharnam had their own unique type of scourge. Cainhurst seems to have those Gargoyles. Pthumarians seem to have had various Beast Possessed Souls and such types, in addition to the (possibly) human tomb prospectors who turned into typical Ybarnamite Scourge Beasts in the Old Labyrinth. At any case, the clue that sells me on it is the fact that Amygdala (which we fight in Nightmare Frontiere) drops the Ailing Loran Chalice. I'm not that fixated on it but the fact that we get the Chalice from the area's boss is a pretty strong link in my opinion.
FirstName LastName i guess?....i forgot about the chalice, yeah. That might indeed be a clue. Still, its not enough for me. Damn, I really wish that we would get more DLC, stuff related to the Darkbeasts and Archibald.
I've managed to avoid spoilers for DS3 so far, mostly because I stick around on youtube and on reddit with a few select subreddits and channels. As for the actual video, nice interesting bit of world-building.
Great video. I still think you're right about the eye being Valtr's the one you find, when he's summoned as as an old Hunter I feel that he's being summoned in his ideal/original form like all the other hunters.
I need to say that, do you remember that in the game intro, a hunter put a infested Yarnamite down, put the gun to his(its) head and shoot him dead? That infested one has the very same eye of this blood-drunk hunter eye. And come to think about that, where ever that has an amygdala guards it, there are no infested people. That is true even in Yaha'Gul because there are no infested people, they are just "blood echos" called by the bell ringer; and they were called from the dead corpse there perhaps, because there were no such people before blood moon, and the unseen village was called unseen for a reason. That means, back in the times before Gascoigne blocks the Oedon tomb, that's probably one of the ways to keep cathedral ward "clean". And the unseen village, having an amygdala right upon its entrance, remains unseen in such certain way.
Hello Redgrave, have you ever heard or thought of this theory about covered eyes: maybe some faction of the healing church (the choir, working with Maria in the research hall) were developing master willem ideas of ascending trought eyes (and developing kins). Probably this faction turned against lawrence and micolash factions (more suported on blood and beasts). And convinced/forced part of the population to gave their eyes to their studies, and probably in doing so, the volunteers were candidates to being future subjects of study. All the ones covering their eyes, gave them willingly or were forced to by the witches.
I think what most people (like myself) get hung up on about people being taken to the Hunter's Nightmare on death is what the heck Maria is doing there, not to mention Ludwig, Laurence, Simon, or really anything that isn't a straight up hunter/huntsman. *If anyone has any insight as to how all this works, or a link to a video or a post that might help me understand this, I'd love it.* The Huntsmen and Hunters are likely all disappeared by Amygdalas, so that's easy. Interestingly, the blood drunk hunters all die and make the same noise we do on death. The beasts, I can accept they they used to be hunters or huntsman before turning, or that they're simply figments of the nightmare -- after all, what is a hunt without something TO hunt? Djura's Disciple seems anything but blood drunk. He's actively defending a little enclave of beasts from the hunters who would very much enjoy slaughtering them. I suppose if you're an addict to blood, living at the end of a literal river of blood would be enough to keep you from assaulting someone for your next fix. The Bloodlickers I can also accept as being simple figments of the nightmare, as well as transformed hunters. The Nightmare Executioners are another mystery to me. Between their cosmos related attacks, their church garb... I feel like they're simply present to imply that the church did not always have pthumerians guarding its interests. The bloodied and still moving corpses that fill the area, I can accept they are also figments of the nightmare to represent the church's many murders. If portions of the nightmare are made to resemble buddhist hell (Ludwig and his horse appearance in particular), why wouldn't these be the consciousnesses of Yharnamites? Ludwig is... He's something. His two forms seem to suggest something of a split personality to me, a special punishment for someone who may have had a special hand in Kos's wrath. The blood drunken beast that likely got him taken into the nightmare in the first place, and the still lucid healing church hunter that you see during his Holy Blade phase, and then while speaking to him after the fight. *Another case of someone being specially punished by Kos's curse.* Laurence is a can of worms and a half. I personally believe the Bloodletting Beast is simply Loran's historical equivalent to Laurence. He brought the beast blood to Loran, as Laurence brought the beast blood to Yharnam. But he is yet more evidence that the Nightmare exists to punish people in special ways, and that people can in fact be taken there after death. *After all, how could Church get his skull if he was physically transported to the Nightmare?* Maria, and the entire Research Hall, seems to be an area dedicated entirely to the torment of Maria. She is not Blood Drunk, and *if we do indeed get the Old Hunter Bone from the actual corpse of Maria, this again suggests that she wasn't spirited away by an Amygdala, but that she is in the nightmare and more importantly is there after death.* The whole Research Hall seems to be a "snapshot" of the place the moment of Maria's suicide. And it clearly was a suicide. The plip plop drip drop of her own blood from slit wrists or slit throat is more than audible. Simon is likely there the same way we are, given he isn't actively being tormented, nor is he cursed to come back after death like the blood drunk hunters. Brador is Brador. His consciousness was likely collateral when the entirety of the Research Hall was copied into the nightmare. One of the skeletons in the closet that tormented Lady Maria, so to speak, just like the many patients in the hall. *The entire Hunter's Nightmare seems to be a place intended entirely to punish and torment those indirectly responsible or profiting from the defilement of Kos, or even just tormenting all of Yharnam, with very special care taken to torment those who were more directly involved in it all.*
Well, there is no Amygdala taking Gerhman inside the Hunter's Dream, it is the Moon Presence. It just so happens that WE travel to these nightmares via the Amygdala, or by touching what might be Micolash's mummified body. Could easily be caused by the curses of the Fishing Hamlet people, or the Orphan of Kos itself. They could also be memory-versions of the real people.. We don't know if Maria is the real Maria! There seems to be a Vicar Amelia version of her in the church praying to Laurence's skull! Brador showing up as both old and young shows there are no rules tying space-time versions of them people to the game! If the nightmare's purpose is to torment.. why are the occupants of the Fishing Hamlet also there? Did they do something to Kos' body as well? Why is Simon, a seeker of Secrets?
I put my hand on my monitor trying to cover Dark Souls 3 thumbnails in RUclips, it's terrifying. I'll have to do that for the next 12 days... Great video as always RG.
I have only oune counter argument: You said that the Nightmare is not some kind of afterlife for blood drunk Hunters, and I totally agree. But I think that not only blood drunk Hunters that were alive were transported in the Hunter's Nightmare, but some dead Hunters too (their consciousness, actually). You just need to think about Lawrence (became Cleric Beast, killed by Brador and decapitated, you find him in the Nightmare) and Maria (cut her own throat after the Hamlet Massacre, you find her in the Nightmare and she has even another Rakuyo).
+FirstName LastName About the Blood-Letting Beast: I think Lawrence went full mad and became the first Cleric Beast, Brador killed him and chopped his head off, and the corpse (without the head) became the headless Bloodletting Beast, while his consciousness ended up in the Nightmare as the "Cleric Beast on fire"
Edsaurus01 Yeah, that's the theory I was talking about. It's a very popular theory. I think that the way his consciousness ended up in the Nightmare is pretty interesting though. You see, his beasthood ended up representing him in the Nightmare, and his conscious mind ended up trapped in his human skull within the Nightmare, which represents what he had lost and is forever doomed to seek it, unable to restore his memories.
The picture you painted bears a striking resemblance to the scene in Yahar'gul: - Amygdalae all around (one of them grabs you) - Many murdered people (possibly causing blood drunkenness in the killers) - Superstitious head coverings on the killers (the Mensis Cage keeps the eyes exposed instead of covering them) Maybe the School of Mensis attracted and activated the Amygdalae on purpose: - They sat themselves in the most prominent and visible areas - They killed the civilians somehow - The Amygdalae notice the ingredients to blood drunkenness - They got transported to the nightmare, as they intended I'm not sure why their bodies are mummified though.
I think the reason for covering their eyes is linked to insight, and the insanity that ensues from gazing upon the revelations of the cosmos. If you started seeing giant eldritch monstrosities perched upon buildings you'd probably want to cover your eyes as well. As someone pointed out (I think it was either Dave Control or Terra Mantis?) in the CGI trailer for Bloodborne, when the Hunter puts his gun against the head of one of the Yharnamites his eye swivels around in its socket as though the muscles controlling it had been severed. This is known as 'Oedipism' (connection with 'Oedon' right there), a form of self-mutilation of the eyes. Perhaps these people couldn't handle seeing the nightmarish realities of their culture and decided to blind themselves to the truth?
I figured people covered or even gouged their eyes out due to gaining insight and seeing things like Amygdala hanging over Cathedral Ward. It seems to me like Yharnamites are in a literal state of denial regarding such fantastic entities.
I think that a lot of hunters in the nightmare came there dying, as in the nightmare you can find Vicar Amelia (you can go in the nightmare only after having killed her). In the nightmare you can find also Maria who seems to have committed suicide. I think it's similar to what happens to us when se dye and we are sent to the dream. So you can go in the nightmare sent my an Amygdala or dying. What do you think?
I like this theory, but what about the tonsil stone patches gives us and why it allows an amygdala to take us to the nightmare, and could there be any significance to where it takes us in the nightmare?
I'm so late, but I don't care, lol. So, at first when I played Bloodborne, I just had some vague idea that the many instances of characters covering their eyes were simply some form or another of symbolism of the insight (eyes) vs. blood thing, and didn't ever really think about it as anything but symbolism. But, now when I think about it again, it seems very straight forward to me why a hunter like Gascoigne would cover his eyes. Since we know for sure that Gascoigne is, if not a blood drunk beast, at least "falling apart", it doesn't seem like a leap to assume his pupils are collapsed to some extent. Firstly, having such dilated pupils would make everything except very dim lighting blinding, and painful to look at. My step dad had emergency eye surgery a while back, and for a few days after, he had no control of his right pupil, it stayed fully dilated. He wore sunglasses to avoid the pain, but still got headaches because of this. The second reason that immediately sprang to mind is that since a collapsed pupil is a sign of the scourge, it would be something a turning hunter would choose to hide simply to avoid being shunned and hunted themselves. Gascoigne in particular, all the while he was slowly turning, had a family to go home to, and a watchful crow sizing him up for sky burial from the shadows, after all. (...Actually, do we know if Gascoigne knew of the existence of Eileen? Either way, tho.)
fivesilvercoins i thought about the whole covering-out-of-shame thing when i first started the game too. chances are gascoine was aware of eileen seeing as she refers to him as just gascoine rather then calling him a hunter gone mad like how she refers to henryk when we meet her
Hey Regrave, I was just wondering as to why you think he Amygdala would do this? Why transport people to the dreamlands, are they aligned with Kos and other great ones?
Ah! my ocd is compelling me to fix your friggen blinds lol Like the new apartment by the way, hope you could bring calvin, also good to talk about bloodborne again
I like the idea of Valtrs summon not being a rep of his current state. Easily understandable but covering the eyes works except where does the PC specifically carry the eye? In a jar, in his "back-pack" or wherever. If covering your eyes is that simple to "fool" amygdalae can it sense the eye being carried in a jar in a pouch (or however it is being carried by the PC). Side note: thank you for Paleblood Hunt...I can now feel complete enough to put the game down and start DSIII. I was, almost, literally stuck playing the game and looking for answers. I tried to play other games but just couldn't stop thinking about BB. There will always be some questions but the majority feels answered. Thank you.
I hate love the shit out of that beast of a game even tho I writer step everywhere its driving me crazy any one else having movement problems while moving with out running
Here is an idea about something you might look into. How about the garbs and tools throughout the game. There are so many details on every piece of garb you can find and I think many of them are interesting but not mentioned in their description. So I thought it might be interesting to give them a closer look. I'm sure we canf ind there a lot to talk about. Anyway, Great work man
Awesome video as always man. I have a request - could you talk about Parasites? You find them at Cainhurst, and in the poison cave below the Forbidden Woods, and in the Chalice Dungeons when you fight the headless Bloodletting Beast, and in the Nightmare of Mensis.
So do you have any theories on what the amygdalae are? I've been trying to wrap my head around them since the game's release. I first thought they were sort of pilot fish for the great ones, but the fact that they ferry you to the dreamlands seems to suggest that there is more to them. I've been playing with the idea that maybe they are physical manifestations of the dreamlands themselves, but I don't really like that theory. Would love to hear your thoughts.
This is a bad argument, probably.But... you know how when you get insight, you sorta start going insane?Brain Trusts singing?Witch summons popping up everywhere?Those weird guys in the Cathedral Ward getting fracking magic and fire scythes?The fact that at really high insight, you could see the amagydala?I thought they covered their eye was cause they were bat shit insane from the shit they saw.Gerhman (?) in the beginning.Gascoigne.Vicar Ameilia I could be wrong though. Probably am.
Is that why the Hunters on the Nightmare have glowing eyes? Their eyes show that they are drunk with blood? Simon's eyes are covered right? What about him, is he there for another reason?
+Marc Pons From what I've seen written, the glowing eyes of the hunters in the nightmare implies a degree of corruption or infestation with the bloodborne (as in its in the blood) scourge of beasts. The only other enemies I can think of with glowing eyes are the Scourge Beasts, and I'm unsure what connection there is to be made between the werewolves and nightmare hunters. Simon, meanwhile, I think he's there in the nightmare the same way you are, given how he talks about having an interest in secrets or whatnot. Otherwise, the only reason I can think of him being in the nightmare is that, like Brador, when the Research Hall is copy pasted into the nightmare, he was one of those that was copy pasted alongside all the patients within.
+Prillis! The beasts that have red eyes indicate they have consumed blood, therefore inflicting poison to the hunter (You). But the old hunters don't poison you per se. Maybe it has something to do with blood, it's always the blood LoL
Great video and I love your work RG. I know you said you would be back to bloodborne content which is awesome but do you have any plans to cover Dark Souls lore? Specifically Dark Souls 3 considering it's new.
Love this eye theory. What do you think about the idea that people's eyes were submitted to Byrgenwerth? You know how all the pots and things you smash in the lecture hall and Byrgenwerth have eyes in them? Or maybe the "eye collectors" are responsible for all the eye coverings?
Short but sweet. Really nice and i can't wait for more. Unrelated, do you have any speculation on what the watchdog of the old lords? I believe that it is a beast of a phumerian elder, but i really am not sure.
I trust that the thumbnails and titles of your videos will be remaining spoiler free once you start doing DSIII content. Either way, good video. Maybe look at nightmare architecture in one of these segments?
It is nigh impossible to avoid Dark Souls 3 spoilers these days! I really want to go into the game completely blind, but that's getting harder and harder.
So question, is it possible that the moon presence killed kos? Or maybe that kos was the former host of the moon? I mean its not much to go on, but the moon seems to be something the orphan of kos seems to look at during the begining of the boss fight. Not to mention we already know that great ones seem to hate each other enough to kill one another.
I look forward to more Bloodborne content in the future. I'm sure it'll be worth the wait. Dark Souls III actually makes me nervous, because I'm not a massive fan of the Dark Souls series. So with that on the horizon, I'm just waiting for all the Bloodborne people to leave it behind and move on.
Even though DS3 is out, I hope Redgrave might make some Bloodborne videos still, but I don't expect him to of course :) DS3 is awesome but Bloodborne is special I think.
+Symbicort Miyazaki confirmed for Daredevil fan. (A flippant response, but actually probably correct on some level--Gascoigne has his eyes covered in human form before he fights us, and anyone wearing the Blindfold Cap, including Yurie and, if we equip it, us the PC, shows no reduction in ability. On multiple occasions we're reminded of the Yharnamites' enhanced sense of smell, so it's not too big a stretch to imagine that hearing and touch (for movements of air currents and suchlike) might also be enhanced, particularly for one who is turning into a beast.)
Hold on a minute, what about that bit about Byrgenwerth and their descendent being cursed? You say the curse is to go to the Hunter's Nightmare(which I agree with) *through Amygdalae snatching those with blood-drunk eyes* , but if this is the case, then not all those cursed would go there. Surely scholars wouldn't have blood drunk eyes, and nor would any of their non-hunter descendants. I propose that there are two ways to get to the Hunter's Nightmare: through the method you describe *and* through death.
+ExistentialOcto Now that I think of it, the Hunter's Nightmare has one very specific similarity with the Catholic interpretation of Hell. Namely, that it exists outside of and independent of our world and what we perceive as time. Thus, all souls in Hell are there for eternity. It doesn't matter if you somehow went back in time to before someone died, their soul would be there anyway. This mirrors how it appears that characters like Valtr (who is alive and well in the real world) is available as a summon for Ludwig and how we can still summon Yamamura and Antal after killing them. Also, that one bloat headed patient who sounds like Eileen might actually be Eileen if you consider this interpretation.
not sure about the byrgenwerth scholars thing, but im pretty sure that you can enter the Hunters nightmare also by death as you said. amelia, who is most certainly the girl in the white church robe at the elevator before the research hall (as she s whispering the exact same things amelia whispered) , proves this.
I seriously don't understand why NamcoBandai would decide to have such a gaping release window discrepancy (they decide this as a publisher right?) between Japan and the rest of the world. Like, have it a few days early sure, but not so early as to the point that people outside of Japan have to actively duck and dodge to not have the game ruined for themselves (especially as someone who had everything from Demon's Souls to Bloodborne spoiled to some degree beforehand I am desperate to get into DS3 100% blind).
+BakedCookie Yeah, I agree. With Souls games being as big as they are and the VG market the way that it is, early regional release dates are dated. Also sucks for journalists and RUclipsrs who signed those pre-release contracts; now there are people who can upload unfettered gameplay by legally purchasing the Japanese version and not only spoil the game but also cash in on the ad revenue before anyone else can.
Hey! Nice video as always. i did the same aboit hiding far away fron the internet :p but damn... dark souls 3 lore is one of the best of all video games, but not even close to bloodborne's one. that's only my opinion, and i wonder if you share the same
I dont think thats why their eyes are covered. That would be stupid.They wouldnt be able to see anything. They cover they so they can use their "inner eyes" or something like said in the choir hat description.Its a makeshift version of that headpiece.Hmm but then again these blooddrunk hunters propably dont have enough insight for such a thing...
Man, when he says lockdown hits different now
Jut an idea that just hit me=_=
Djura has one eye covered. What if the eyeball is his? He is a retired Hunter - but we know that Hunters don't really retire... they either end up crazy or dead, or, indeed, are whisked away to the Nightmare. But he's managed to find his way out of that.
Maybe, he did it by ripping his eye out as soon as it 'went bad' and leaving the Hunt altogether - he says that he's no longer dreaming, which may mean he no longer visits the Hunter's Dream, where we find the eye... Just a thought, though.
Jezack R yeah i had a very similar idea just recently (honestly have never seen your comment before so i dont know how i came to a similar conclusion without seeing this)
Interestingly, I don't think there are Amygdala's in Old Yharnam now that I think about it.. I wonder if there is a reason..
That actually does explain Father Gascoigne's eye coverings. I was wondering why he would have that.
Well they say the eye is door to the soul, so an eye that is blood drunk shows a person is blood thirsty.
One thing that occurred to me as soon as I entered the Old Hunters Nightmare was that the sun in that place looks nearly identical to a collapsed hunter's eye. That makes me think that your character is peering into the eye of the hunter and thus enters the realm of their blood-drunk minds (even if an Amygdala is necessary for the transportation). And now that I think about that I understand more fully why an Amygdala is necessary for the transference given that the amygdala of the brain is linked to emotions & motivations.
One another note: I've really jumped into Bloodborne w/ both feet over the past month or so (almost earned my platinum trophy) and your videos have been instrumental in my understanding of the lore.
A couple weeks ago I posted an extended thought in the discussion section of your channel and am curious if you've had time to read through that. Interested to hear your response.
Come back :(
Bloodborne's community misses you
Just one more depressing end in the bloodborne's lore 💔
Something that I don't think is really backed up by any in-game lore, or can really be confirmed or denied in any meaningful way, but that I still find interesting nonetheless, is that when you look up at the sky in the hunter's nightmare, it looks like the collapsed pupil of a blood-drunk hunter, right? But rather than an eye peering down at the nightmare, the feeling I get is that we're looking at the pupil from inside the eye, and that the light glowing through the pupil is actually the light of the outside world shining in. When the ghost of the orphan is dispelled, the eye doesn't disappear, it simply closes, because the nightmare is over, and the hunters can now rest in peace.
If I wanted to REALLY stretch, I'd say that the Hunter's Nightmare is the nightmare of a specific hunter, constructed of his own memories, and that other hunters are taken there when they die or when they've become intoxicated with blood. In the same way that the Hunter's Dream is the dream of Gerhman, and the Nightmare of Mensis is... well, you get it, the "Hunter's Nightmare" is a "hunter's", singular possessive. If I had to guess, I'd say that the Hunter's Nightmare is also Gerhman's, and that the nightmare itself exists within his eye. Gerhman doesn't cover his eyes, like other blood-drunk hunters do, and when I tried to angle the camera to look at his eyes, the results were inconclusive (I think they look partially collapsed, but that could easily just be the lighting making me see what I want to see) but in any case, with your idea that hunters covered their eyes to hide from amygdalae, then it makes sense that Gerhman wouldn't need to cover his eyes. There are no amygdalae in his dream, after all.
The idea that the nightmare is Gerhman's would explain why we hear him sobbing when the orphan crawls out of Kos' corpse, and also why when the nightmare is slain and the eye closed, he is finally able to sleep peacefully. I think this kind of explains why the people in the nightmare don't exist as they do currently (i.e. old or sick or dead) but as Gerhman remembers them, either as hunters in their prime or as beasts that have succumbed to bloodlust. Dreams in Bloodborne are basically real places, so other people can enter the nightmare without being trapped by it if they have the right key, much like we can travel freely between the Nightmare of Mensis and the Nightmare Frontier. The memories of the first hunter would be rich with secrets, which is why I think Simon is there looking for them, and why the church itself may possibly have placed Brador there to kill any hunters that would search too deeply within the past.
Like I said, I don't think there's any real lore that confirms any of this, and I'm coming at this months after most people have stopped caring about Bloodborne, but I find it very interesting to think about.
I'd really like to subscribe to this theory, if for no reason that there's a sense of romance in it, but that would be assuming that Gehrman is drunk with blood. For some reason, I can't attach that idea to his image.
8thshade this is a really cool idea : ) thanks so much for sharing it, would never have thought of something like it on my own
The implication of Gerhman resting is due to finally putting an end to the DLC nightmare.. The reason? Could be anything! Could be as simple as Gerhman being restless because the orphan is still alive, that Maria's major regret coming to a close, etc.
Also, Gerhman does have both eyes, so I'm not sure we are "inside his head" or anything. Nightmares seem to exist outside of reality.. or as we have seen, in layers. Just like the way we can see the shipwrecks in the Nightmare Frontier (above the DLC nightmare), I don't think they are within stuff in the "real world".
Everyone here will never stop caring about Bloodborne.
I love how I'm not the only one coming back to these videos
Where's that Bloodborne content? We need more eyes.
:(
@@tl_nik0n353:(
If I had to have one thing talked about, I'd want to learn more about the Brain of Mensis and the mummies that seem to be related to it (even the one mummy who gives us the Make Contact gesture).
Prillis! yeah ive tried theorising about the mensis brain and its relationship to its nightmare (it is named after it after all, dont know why mergo sleeps there) but to no evail
..through my eyes, you really are a great one redgrave! thank you for the upload! and thank you for your "paleblood hunt". mind-blowing analysis! your work really elevated my bloodborne experience to a cosmic level! and i just have to thank all of you guys who participated in all those incredibly interesting conversations on redgraves, aegons and jsf's channel. amazing stuff! shoutouts to all of you hunters & deep respect!
Just found your channel today thanks to a Reddit user and I wanted to say thanks.. this is great .. I know I'm a little late to the party but I just got bloodborne 2 weeks ago and I'm devouring every bit of lore and info I can find and your channel is amazing! Thanks again!
they can't make an NPC with just one eye, but they could make an NPC with two different colored eyes to imply that one is glass
Or they have Heterochromia.
Interesting theory. I always associated covering eyes with master willems "eyes on the inside". But you get to see gascoine, amelia, blood starved beast, suspicious beggar, all of them blood drunk and hideous beasts. Perhaps it was in their best interest to avoid the nightmare. Moreover this could tie in to the fact that Lawrence was taken into the nightmare against his will (did not cover his eyes) supported by Gehrmans dialogue ""Oh, Laurence... what's taking you so long... I've grown too old for this, of little use now, I'm afraid..." I could never fully grasp this piece of dialogue. Did laurence know that gehrman was trapped in the dream ? and was gehrman waiting for laurence to accomplish something to end his dream, perhaps hunting the great ones ?
Love the picture of the blood drunk eye and how it fits with your Minamata theory! Such great content!
Mercurialentis (brown discoloration-caused by mercury-of anterior capsule of eye lens) is documented in medical texts as the first sign of mercury toxicity; it is an indicator and early sign of further eye damage.
They certainly do their homework at FROM!!
IDK if you'll see this, but I really wanna thank you for all these videos you did. They really inspired me so much back when they were released- as a bit of a teenage wallflower, I devoured all of these at a rapacious pace, as Bloodborne was (and still is) something of a special interest of mine. Your passion and intellect were inspiring, and spurred me deep into writing and media analysis.
Now, over half a decade later, I'm on the cusp of completing my degree. I still refer back to not only these videos but also the Paleblood Hunt as foundational pillars of my kinda "intellectual library" if you wanna call it that, along with a bevy of information that I've absorbed in the years since. I'm actually writing my own TTRPG system inspired by Bloodborne as part of my degree, and I'm going to be putting you into the special thanks section at the very front of the book- I get the feeling you'd probably balk at that lol.
I hope whatever you're up to nowadays is bringing you all the fulfilment and joy you deserve! And again, thank you Redgrave. For your writing, intellect, passion, and inspiration. Thank you.
Redgrave, thanks for posting so many great lore videos. I was wondering what your thoughts on all the water in Bloodborne is about. There are a lot of little things with water that I've noticed through playing the game (like the Deep Sea Rune inverted on the clock- wall of the clock tower before you fight Maria), Rom and Kos's relation to the sea, water runes and their relation to defense, and lots of other stuff. I know this probably doesn't really qualify as a "little" thing to talk about, but never the less I thought it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it.
perhaps something about the statues in the game?
Great idea, i have always wondered about their significance.
I'm so happy I found an app that reads you rtext for mr now I can listen to everything you've writen while I'm playing games.
Interesting theory about the Amygdala. And it would agree with the fact that we find Amygdala's arm in the Nightmare - some hunter must have put up a fight! :D
personally i think the eye is djuras. like this was a hunter who managed to keep out of the nightmare, even though its stated that blood drunkeness happens to all hunters (plus all the powder kegs went blood drunk except him ((i know it isnt fully stated he is one but i think he is)). his signature hat has a covering over one eye, meaning we have never him with both, PLUS the blood-drunk eye seems to have been cut clumsily out, perhaps indicating that he did it in a last ditch effort to remain in old yarnham.
i didnt realise but theres actually another comment under this video also adding light to this idea, hope i might be adding something new to the table though so i might leave this comment up
In Lovecraft, a spider deity connected Earth Dreamlands to the waking world with her web and when it was completed, the waking world would end. Amygdala is an arachnid-like Great One and seeing as the Hunter is taken to the Lecture Hall with the Tonsil Stone....I think it's less that Amydala's looking for individuals with certain items and more like just sorting "items" out, using them as a stamp that says "I belong in this shit-my-pants crazy place instead of this shit-my-pants crazy place". Patches gave us the Tonsil Stone, throwing us into danger to offer us to his god (And potentially, future form), which made the Amygdala transport us to the Lecture Hall where we'd find out way to the Nightmare Frontier.
Maybe it's something like sorting, as well as a self-benefiting service of sorts, as Amygdala doesn't appear to be only the body but is more of a conscious controlling multiple bodies. With that in mind, it seems like Amygdala sent us to the Hunter's Nightmare to "put us where we belong" and to potentially make the idiots inside pay for killing one of its bodies
hey man love your videos, the one on odeon in particular was unbelievable. just wanted to ask you something. the note that reads : "The Byrgenwerth spider hides all manner of rituals, and keeps our lost master from us. A terrible shame. It makes my head shudder uncontrollably."
couldn't the lost master be Micolash as we can enter Yahargul after killing Rom?
also: "It makes my head shudder uncontrollably." could have something to do with the seizures induced by mercury poisoning and the Mensis Cage was a way of dealing with that?
i would love to hear your feedback man!
You continue to blow my mind man thank you!
im 5 years late on this but i feel it needs to be said that there are dead hunters in the hunter's dream. its a hell for dead hunters as well as a prison for living, blooddrunk one's.
Yeah it's been a while...glad you're back, missed your content!
this's it man, you nailed it
you should do one on messengers!
I was thinking maybe the hunters covered their eyes to hide the fact that they ARE blood drunk. so that the other hunters or hunter of hunters wouldn't attack or find them out so easy.
Your hair is majestic.
Also I head-canon almost all of your theories. They're pretty good!
Valtr being the drunk-eye owner is needles speculation.
Brilliant, that literally makes perfect sense in anyway you look at it.
The church hunters also covered their eyes in the end -signalling the curse of Kos to be the latest curse that afflicts all hunters no matter the class, the Amygdalas reason for being everywhere is to abduct blood drunk hunters and spirit them away to the nightmare.
Before this we had no real reason for Amygdalas were hidden everywhere in plain sight
I just recently beat Bloodborne and have been binging your videos but this is the first time I feel like I could add something. What you described with hunters disappearing reminded me of the Japanese folklore idea of being spirited away, kamikakushi (literally hidden by god). But yeah, it’s the idea that the mysterious disappearance of someone is due to angering the gods. Thought people might find that interesting 😊
hey man, i really like your videos. i wish you could share something about each boss in the game. their background or the enemies. thanks
Can't help but to think that beasthood and insight combat each other as game-play mechanic and same goes for lore. To me eye of a blood-drunk hunter represents one who has lost his sanity, he doesn't have insight to absord madness so it's his own eyes which gets turned into mush -> and he devolves/evolves into beasthood. Like Yharnamites do.
This is reason why player needs that particular item as he has tons of insight at this point already. For Amygdala the player seems to be hunter who was there when things went down and needs to be sent back into his nightmare, just like Tonsil Stone is mark for that another Amygdala to sent them into their particular nightmare. I don't think Yharnamites do need to wory about Hunter's nightmare (not saying that they wouldn't worry about it!), i think Amygdala will try to put everyone into nightmares fit for their phobias. For Yharnamites it might be Old Yharnam actually?
Deeply sorry for all typos. too lazy to double check.
Interesting stuff to think about. One note I have is the Amygdala that can bring you to the Lecture Hall (and therefore Mensis' nightmare) is not the way that the School of Mensis were pulled into the nightmare. I think that it's possible that any Great One (in this case Kos or possibly the Orphan, or whomever we hear cursing the hunters) is responsible for the Blood-drunk Hunters being in the nightmare. The Amygdala is just a separate way of accessing it that we use due to the fact we are not drunk on blood, just like the Tonsil Stone.
I have once mentioned this in one of your streams and you off-handedly aproved of it, but I feel the need to expand on it, so here goes.
Theory has it that Tonsil Stones are a sign of the scourge of the beast plague of Loran. The plague of the silverbeasts who were blood-drunk and sent to the Nightmare Frontiere by Amygdalae just like Yharnamites. Tonsil Stones function the same as the Eyes of Blood-Drunk Hunters because of this.
There are other small little hints thrown to support this. For one, the Tonsil Stone (which most likely fell from the Nightmare Frontiere) mentions in its description that it's likely to be meteorite does not contradict what a real life tonsil stone would be (and that is.a stone). Tonsil Stones in real life are comparable to sand, and we know from the Ailing Loran dungeons that Loran was a country ravaged by sand storms or something of such sorts. There are other stronger hints though, the Loran silver beasts hold their mouth open at all times (which is common among those who have bigger-than-average tonsil stones to ease the pain from breathing iirc) and they seem to have swelling throats. It's especially noteworthy that the Silverbeasts in Nightmare of Mensis that excrete worms when dying have a, dare I say, intruiging throats. If you get really upcloes to them, you can see the worms within their throats! Whether or not you believe that those worms are Vermin, it still goes to show some sort of connection in my opinion.
+FirstName LastName I really dont understand why people continue to associate Loran with The Nightmare Frontier....
Hattori Hanzo Loran silverbeasts are plaguing the place. What woud you expect?
FirstName LastName thats the thing, they are called Loran Silverbeasts because you find them in Loran! The ones is the Nightmare arent called Loran Silverbeasts, they are just Silverbeasts. Thats why the Darkbeast you find in Loran isnt called Paarl, its called Loran Darkbeast. I dont understand why people realize that about the Darkbeast, but not the Silverbeasts.
Its like people love the idea of Frontier being the nightmare equivalent of Loran because it answers so many questions, albeit in a flimsy way. Thats fine, but I find that to be a very weak answer. People shouldnt fixate so much on this idea, because it really doesnt have any sort of evidence to support it.
The way I see it, Frontier is just the extension of the Nightmare of Mensis, its closer to the water. You can even see the Mensis castle from it. The Nightmare dimension seems to be some kind of ocean with some land mass, where you can recreate stuff in it based on your memories and conscience.
I have no idea why people associate it with Loran.
Hattori Hanzo Well, for the most part, nations that were before Yharnam had their own unique type of scourge. Cainhurst seems to have those Gargoyles. Pthumarians seem to have had various Beast Possessed Souls and such types, in addition to the (possibly) human tomb prospectors who turned into typical Ybarnamite Scourge Beasts in the Old Labyrinth. At any case, the clue that sells me on it is the fact that Amygdala (which we fight in Nightmare Frontiere) drops the Ailing Loran Chalice. I'm not that fixated on it but the fact that we get the Chalice from the area's boss is a pretty strong link in my opinion.
FirstName LastName i guess?....i forgot about the chalice, yeah. That might indeed be a clue. Still, its not enough for me. Damn, I really wish that we would get more DLC, stuff related to the Darkbeasts and Archibald.
I've managed to avoid spoilers for DS3 so far, mostly because I stick around on youtube and on reddit with a few select subreddits and channels. As for the actual video, nice interesting bit of world-building.
Great video. I still think you're right about the eye being Valtr's the one you find, when he's summoned as as an old Hunter I feel that he's being summoned in his ideal/original form like all the other hunters.
YOU AREN'T DEAD!!!
Hey Redgrave, can you make a video on the School of Mensis?
I need to say that, do you remember that in the game intro, a hunter put a infested Yarnamite down, put the gun to his(its) head and shoot him dead? That infested one has the very same eye of this blood-drunk hunter eye. And come to think about that, where ever that has an amygdala guards it, there are no infested people. That is true even in Yaha'Gul because there are no infested people, they are just "blood echos" called by the bell ringer; and they were called from the dead corpse there perhaps, because there were no such people before blood moon, and the unseen village was called unseen for a reason. That means, back in the times before Gascoigne blocks the Oedon tomb, that's probably one of the ways to keep cathedral ward "clean". And the unseen village, having an amygdala right upon its entrance, remains unseen in such certain way.
Hello Redgrave, have you ever heard or thought of this theory about covered eyes: maybe some faction of the healing church (the choir, working with Maria in the research hall) were developing master willem ideas of ascending trought eyes (and developing kins). Probably this faction turned against lawrence and micolash factions (more suported on blood and beasts). And convinced/forced part of the population to gave their eyes to their studies, and probably in doing so, the volunteers were candidates to being future subjects of study. All the ones covering their eyes, gave them willingly or were forced to by the witches.
eyebrows so fresh
I think what most people (like myself) get hung up on about people being taken to the Hunter's Nightmare on death is what the heck Maria is doing there, not to mention Ludwig, Laurence, Simon, or really anything that isn't a straight up hunter/huntsman. *If anyone has any insight as to how all this works, or a link to a video or a post that might help me understand this, I'd love it.*
The Huntsmen and Hunters are likely all disappeared by Amygdalas, so that's easy. Interestingly, the blood drunk hunters all die and make the same noise we do on death.
The beasts, I can accept they they used to be hunters or huntsman before turning, or that they're simply figments of the nightmare -- after all, what is a hunt without something TO hunt?
Djura's Disciple seems anything but blood drunk. He's actively defending a little enclave of beasts from the hunters who would very much enjoy slaughtering them. I suppose if you're an addict to blood, living at the end of a literal river of blood would be enough to keep you from assaulting someone for your next fix.
The Bloodlickers I can also accept as being simple figments of the nightmare, as well as transformed hunters.
The Nightmare Executioners are another mystery to me. Between their cosmos related attacks, their church garb... I feel like they're simply present to imply that the church did not always have pthumerians guarding its interests.
The bloodied and still moving corpses that fill the area, I can accept they are also figments of the nightmare to represent the church's many murders. If portions of the nightmare are made to resemble buddhist hell (Ludwig and his horse appearance in particular), why wouldn't these be the consciousnesses of Yharnamites?
Ludwig is... He's something. His two forms seem to suggest something of a split personality to me, a special punishment for someone who may have had a special hand in Kos's wrath. The blood drunken beast that likely got him taken into the nightmare in the first place, and the still lucid healing church hunter that you see during his Holy Blade phase, and then while speaking to him after the fight. *Another case of someone being specially punished by Kos's curse.*
Laurence is a can of worms and a half. I personally believe the Bloodletting Beast is simply Loran's historical equivalent to Laurence. He brought the beast blood to Loran, as Laurence brought the beast blood to Yharnam. But he is yet more evidence that the Nightmare exists to punish people in special ways, and that people can in fact be taken there after death. *After all, how could Church get his skull if he was physically transported to the Nightmare?*
Maria, and the entire Research Hall, seems to be an area dedicated entirely to the torment of Maria. She is not Blood Drunk, and *if we do indeed get the Old Hunter Bone from the actual corpse of Maria, this again suggests that she wasn't spirited away by an Amygdala, but that she is in the nightmare and more importantly is there after death.* The whole Research Hall seems to be a "snapshot" of the place the moment of Maria's suicide. And it clearly was a suicide. The plip plop drip drop of her own blood from slit wrists or slit throat is more than audible.
Simon is likely there the same way we are, given he isn't actively being tormented, nor is he cursed to come back after death like the blood drunk hunters.
Brador is Brador. His consciousness was likely collateral when the entirety of the Research Hall was copied into the nightmare. One of the skeletons in the closet that tormented Lady Maria, so to speak, just like the many patients in the hall.
*The entire Hunter's Nightmare seems to be a place intended entirely to punish and torment those indirectly responsible or profiting from the defilement of Kos, or even just tormenting all of Yharnam, with very special care taken to torment those who were more directly involved in it all.*
Well, there is no Amygdala taking Gerhman inside the Hunter's Dream, it is the Moon Presence. It just so happens that WE travel to these nightmares via the Amygdala, or by touching what might be Micolash's mummified body. Could easily be caused by the curses of the Fishing Hamlet people, or the Orphan of Kos itself. They could also be memory-versions of the real people.. We don't know if Maria is the real Maria! There seems to be a Vicar Amelia version of her in the church praying to Laurence's skull!
Brador showing up as both old and young shows there are no rules tying space-time versions of them people to the game!
If the nightmare's purpose is to torment.. why are the occupants of the Fishing Hamlet also there? Did they do something to Kos' body as well? Why is Simon, a seeker of Secrets?
missed u xx
I put my hand on my monitor trying to cover Dark Souls 3 thumbnails in RUclips, it's terrifying. I'll have to do that for the next 12 days...
Great video as always RG.
I have only oune counter argument: You said that the Nightmare is not some kind of afterlife for blood drunk Hunters, and I totally agree. But I think that not only blood drunk Hunters that were alive were transported in the Hunter's Nightmare, but some dead Hunters too (their consciousness, actually). You just need to think about Lawrence (became Cleric Beast, killed by Brador and decapitated, you find him in the Nightmare) and Maria (cut her own throat after the Hamlet Massacre, you find her in the Nightmare and she has even another Rakuyo).
+Edsaurus01 It's not technically an afterlife, but it's full of dead people anyway.
+Scion95 I think that sometimes a powerful consciousness can end up in the Dreamlands when the person dies, or something like that.
+Edsaurus01 Don't forget the whole Blood-Letting Beast theory, if it was true then Laurence is alive.
+FirstName LastName About the Blood-Letting Beast: I think Lawrence went full mad and became the first Cleric Beast, Brador killed him and chopped his head off, and the corpse (without the head) became the headless Bloodletting Beast, while his consciousness ended up in the Nightmare as the "Cleric Beast on fire"
Edsaurus01 Yeah, that's the theory I was talking about. It's a very popular theory. I think that the way his consciousness ended up in the Nightmare is pretty interesting though. You see, his beasthood ended up representing him in the Nightmare, and his conscious mind ended up trapped in his human skull within the Nightmare, which represents what he had lost and is forever doomed to seek it, unable to restore his memories.
The picture you painted bears a striking resemblance to the scene in Yahar'gul:
- Amygdalae all around (one of them grabs you)
- Many murdered people (possibly causing blood drunkenness in the killers)
- Superstitious head coverings on the killers (the Mensis Cage keeps the eyes exposed instead of covering them)
Maybe the School of Mensis attracted and activated the Amygdalae on purpose:
- They sat themselves in the most prominent and visible areas
- They killed the civilians somehow
- The Amygdalae notice the ingredients to blood drunkenness
- They got transported to the nightmare, as they intended
I'm not sure why their bodies are mummified though.
I think the reason for covering their eyes is linked to insight, and the insanity that ensues from gazing upon the revelations of the cosmos. If you started seeing giant eldritch monstrosities perched upon buildings you'd probably want to cover your eyes as well. As someone pointed out (I think it was either Dave Control or Terra Mantis?) in the CGI trailer for Bloodborne, when the Hunter puts his gun against the head of one of the Yharnamites his eye swivels around in its socket as though the muscles controlling it had been severed. This is known as 'Oedipism' (connection with 'Oedon' right there), a form of self-mutilation of the eyes. Perhaps these people couldn't handle seeing the nightmarish realities of their culture and decided to blind themselves to the truth?
I figured people covered or even gouged their eyes out due to gaining insight and seeing things like Amygdala hanging over Cathedral Ward. It seems to me like Yharnamites are in a literal state of denial regarding such fantastic entities.
I think that a lot of hunters in the nightmare came there dying, as in the nightmare you can find Vicar Amelia (you can go in the nightmare only after having killed her). In the nightmare you can find also Maria who seems to have committed suicide. I think it's similar to what happens to us when se dye and we are sent to the dream. So you can go in the nightmare sent my an Amygdala or dying. What do you think?
Is it possible ghermen made a pact with the moon ores ends to escape being taken away into the nightmare?
I like this theory, but what about the tonsil stone patches gives us and why it allows an amygdala to take us to the nightmare, and could there be any significance to where it takes us in the nightmare?
I'm so late, but I don't care, lol.
So, at first when I played Bloodborne, I just had some vague idea that the many instances of characters covering their eyes were simply some form or another of symbolism of the insight (eyes) vs. blood thing, and didn't ever really think about it as anything but symbolism. But, now when I think about it again, it seems very straight forward to me why a hunter like Gascoigne would cover his eyes. Since we know for sure that Gascoigne is, if not a blood drunk beast, at least "falling apart", it doesn't seem like a leap to assume his pupils are collapsed to some extent.
Firstly, having such dilated pupils would make everything except very dim lighting blinding, and painful to look at. My step dad had emergency eye surgery a while back, and for a few days after, he had no control of his right pupil, it stayed fully dilated. He wore sunglasses to avoid the pain, but still got headaches because of this.
The second reason that immediately sprang to mind is that since a collapsed pupil is a sign of the scourge, it would be something a turning hunter would choose to hide simply to avoid being shunned and hunted themselves. Gascoigne in particular, all the while he was slowly turning, had a family to go home to, and a watchful crow sizing him up for sky burial from the shadows, after all. (...Actually, do we know if Gascoigne knew of the existence of Eileen? Either way, tho.)
fivesilvercoins i thought about the whole covering-out-of-shame thing when i first started the game too. chances are gascoine was aware of eileen seeing as she refers to him as just gascoine rather then calling him a hunter gone mad like how she refers to henryk when we meet her
Hey Regrave, I was just wondering as to why you think he Amygdala would do this? Why transport people to the dreamlands, are they aligned with Kos and other great ones?
+Vicar Amelia Also,may I message you privately?
Blood drunken eye: Makes sense man
Ah! my ocd is compelling me to fix your friggen blinds lol Like the new apartment by the way, hope you could bring calvin, also good to talk about bloodborne again
I like the idea of Valtrs summon not being a rep of his current state. Easily understandable but covering the eyes works except where does the PC specifically carry the eye? In a jar, in his "back-pack" or wherever. If covering your eyes is that simple to "fool" amygdalae can it sense the eye being carried in a jar in a pouch (or however it is being carried by the PC). Side note: thank you for Paleblood Hunt...I can now feel complete enough to put the game down and start DSIII. I was, almost, literally stuck playing the game and looking for answers. I tried to play other games but just couldn't stop thinking about BB. There will always be some questions but the majority feels answered. Thank you.
I hate love the shit out of that beast of a game even tho I writer step everywhere its driving me crazy any one else having movement problems while moving with out running
Here is an idea about something you might look into.
How about the garbs and tools throughout the game. There are so many details on every piece of garb you can find and I think many of them are interesting but not mentioned in their description. So I thought it might be interesting to give them a closer look. I'm sure we canf ind there a lot to talk about.
Anyway, Great work man
I always assumed ppl with their eyes covered had rip them out. Can't see an eldrich truth if u can't see
Awesome video as always man. I have a request - could you talk about Parasites? You find them at Cainhurst, and in the poison cave below the Forbidden Woods, and in the Chalice Dungeons when you fight the headless Bloodletting Beast, and in the Nightmare of Mensis.
So do you have any theories on what the amygdalae are? I've been trying to wrap my head around them since the game's release. I first thought they were sort of pilot fish for the great ones, but the fact that they ferry you to the dreamlands seems to suggest that there is more to them. I've been playing with the idea that maybe they are physical manifestations of the dreamlands themselves, but I don't really like that theory. Would love to hear your thoughts.
Hey man. Loving the videos. Have high hopes to maybe see a "Little things in Lothric" series. But just an idea. Keep up the good work
interesting theory but i would argue that dark souls 3 final boss is john goodman
Along side Steve Buscemi and Jeff Bridges?
This is a bad argument, probably.But... you know how when you get insight, you sorta start going insane?Brain Trusts singing?Witch summons popping up everywhere?Those weird guys in the Cathedral Ward getting fracking magic and fire scythes?The fact that at really high insight, you could see the amagydala?I thought they covered their eye was cause they were bat shit insane from the shit they saw.Gerhman (?) in the beginning.Gascoigne.Vicar Ameilia I could be wrong though. Probably am.
You kinda look like AngryJoe. But with more hair :)
Is that why the Hunters on the Nightmare have glowing eyes? Their eyes show that they are drunk with blood?
Simon's eyes are covered right? What about him, is he there for another reason?
+Marc Pons From what I've seen written, the glowing eyes of the hunters in the nightmare implies a degree of corruption or infestation with the bloodborne (as in its in the blood) scourge of beasts. The only other enemies I can think of with glowing eyes are the Scourge Beasts, and I'm unsure what connection there is to be made between the werewolves and nightmare hunters.
Simon, meanwhile, I think he's there in the nightmare the same way you are, given how he talks about having an interest in secrets or whatnot. Otherwise, the only reason I can think of him being in the nightmare is that, like Brador, when the Research Hall is copy pasted into the nightmare, he was one of those that was copy pasted alongside all the patients within.
+Prillis! The beasts that have red eyes indicate they have consumed blood, therefore inflicting poison to the hunter (You).
But the old hunters don't poison you per se. Maybe it has something to do with blood, it's always the blood LoL
Great video and I love your work RG. I know you said you would be back to bloodborne content which is awesome but do you have any plans to cover Dark Souls lore? Specifically Dark Souls 3 considering it's new.
Love this eye theory.
What do you think about the idea that people's eyes were submitted to Byrgenwerth? You know how all the pots and things you smash in the lecture hall and Byrgenwerth have eyes in them? Or maybe the "eye collectors" are responsible for all the eye coverings?
why does djura only have one eye covered?
Short but sweet. Really nice and i can't wait for more. Unrelated, do you have any speculation on what the watchdog of the old lords? I believe that it is a beast of a phumerian elder, but i really am not sure.
+Autism is Unstoppable well obviously rom and watchdog are both failed amygdala creations
wat?
+Autism is Unstoppable It's the Red Hot Chilli Puppers
Alex Grey I'm sorry, wat?
I trust that the thumbnails and titles of your videos will be remaining spoiler free once you start doing DSIII content. Either way, good video. Maybe look at nightmare architecture in one of these segments?
It's not working for me
Aaaa dude, I am the same with Elden Ring right now:)))). Impossible to not get spoilers;(.
Redgrave, will you ever get around talking about the Executioners?
It is nigh impossible to avoid Dark Souls 3 spoilers these days! I really want to go into the game completely blind, but that's getting harder and harder.
So question, is it possible that the moon presence killed kos? Or maybe that kos was the former host of the moon? I mean its not much to go on, but the moon seems to be something the orphan of kos seems to look at during the begining of the boss fight. Not to mention we already know that great ones seem to hate each other enough to kill one another.
actually we are told that humans killed KOS if i'm correct
Really? I thought she just floated up on the shore already dead with the parasites appearing not long after.
Taco Nuke(Dapper Edition) been a while since i've played, i might be wrong
I look forward to more Bloodborne content in the future. I'm sure it'll be worth the wait. Dark Souls III actually makes me nervous, because I'm not a massive fan of the Dark Souls series. So with that on the horizon, I'm just waiting for all the Bloodborne people to leave it behind and move on.
I aswell try to avoid spoilers, it's impossible!!!
Even though DS3 is out, I hope Redgrave might make some Bloodborne videos still, but I don't expect him to of course :) DS3 is awesome but Bloodborne is special I think.
how could they hunt with covered eyes though?
+Symbicort Miyazaki confirmed for Daredevil fan. (A flippant response, but actually probably correct on some level--Gascoigne has his eyes covered in human form before he fights us, and anyone wearing the Blindfold Cap, including Yurie and, if we equip it, us the PC, shows no reduction in ability. On multiple occasions we're reminded of the Yharnamites' enhanced sense of smell, so it's not too big a stretch to imagine that hearing and touch (for movements of air currents and suchlike) might also be enhanced, particularly for one who is turning into a beast.)
It still hard to believe that every blindfolded hunter is a shaolin monk
+DezoPenguin You should also talk about these things on RUclips, you seem to know a lot too.
It's nice to learn Lore from different points of view.
Hold on a minute, what about that bit about Byrgenwerth and their descendent being cursed? You say the curse is to go to the Hunter's Nightmare(which I agree with) *through Amygdalae snatching those with blood-drunk eyes* , but if this is the case, then not all those cursed would go there. Surely scholars wouldn't have blood drunk eyes, and nor would any of their non-hunter descendants. I propose that there are two ways to get to the Hunter's Nightmare: through the method you describe *and* through death.
+ExistentialOcto Now that I think of it, the Hunter's Nightmare has one very specific similarity with the Catholic interpretation of Hell. Namely, that it exists outside of and independent of our world and what we perceive as time. Thus, all souls in Hell are there for eternity. It doesn't matter if you somehow went back in time to before someone died, their soul would be there anyway. This mirrors how it appears that characters like Valtr (who is alive and well in the real world) is available as a summon for Ludwig and how we can still summon Yamamura and Antal after killing them. Also, that one bloat headed patient who sounds like Eileen might actually be Eileen if you consider this interpretation.
not sure about the byrgenwerth scholars thing, but im pretty sure that you can enter the Hunters nightmare also by death as you said. amelia, who is most certainly the girl in the white church robe at the elevator before the research hall (as she s whispering the exact same things amelia whispered) , proves this.
also you can just enter the nightmare after killing vicar amelia
+D-Rabbit for You're right, I completely forgot that Vicar Amelia seems to appear in HN after dying
I seriously don't understand why NamcoBandai would decide to have such a gaping release window discrepancy (they decide this as a publisher right?) between Japan and the rest of the world. Like, have it a few days early sure, but not so early as to the point that people outside of Japan have to actively duck and dodge to not have the game ruined for themselves (especially as someone who had everything from Demon's Souls to Bloodborne spoiled to some degree beforehand I am desperate to get into DS3 100% blind).
+BakedCookie Yeah, I agree. With Souls games being as big as they are and the VG market the way that it is, early regional release dates are dated. Also sucks for journalists and RUclipsrs who signed those pre-release contracts; now there are people who can upload unfettered gameplay by legally purchasing the Japanese version and not only spoil the game but also cash in on the ad revenue before anyone else can.
Redgrave. Are you like me and can't grow facial hair except for a goatee? Response is appreciated.
+Roddy Actually I would have a very full, bushy beard if I didn't shave it regularly. I'm a very hairy guy.
+Redgrave Why don't you just unequip the Beast Embrace Oath Rune already?!
Hey! Nice video as always. i did the same aboit hiding far away fron the internet :p
but damn... dark souls 3 lore is one of the best of all video games, but not even close to bloodborne's one. that's only my opinion, and i wonder if you share the same
I dont think thats why their eyes are covered. That would be stupid.They wouldnt be able to see anything. They cover they so they can use their "inner eyes" or something like said in the choir hat description.Its a makeshift version of that headpiece.Hmm but then again these blooddrunk hunters propably dont have enough insight for such a thing...